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(Fox Business)   Greek citizens are infecting themselves with HIV in order to get an additional 700 Euros in government handouts   (foxbusiness.com) divider line 131
    More: Scary, HIV, Greece, Europeans, Greek, World Health Organization, press releases  
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6175 clicks; posted to Main » on 25 Nov 2013 at 10:11 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



131 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-11-26 01:11:15 AM  
It's a greek tragedy up in the land of Olympus, y'all!
 
2013-11-26 01:36:39 AM  

leadmetal: Guess everything is just going to have to go to hell before people figure out central planning doesn't work.


That didn't happen in most of the places where it's already failed, why would it happen here? And by that, I mean that even when everything goes to hell, people still can't figure out why. See: Detroit.
 
2013-11-26 01:36:48 AM  

kerrigand: fusillade762: kerrigand: Sure I do. You attempted to(poorly) make this something of a right wing issue.

I didn't make it a right-wing issue. The websites that are flogging it made it a right-wing issue. If I'm wrong and we never hear about this again from them I'll readily admit my mistake.

fusillade762: kerrigand: fusillade762: This story has the ingredients for a perfect storm of derp:

Homosexuals
Drug users
Welfare/Socialism
Europeans

Expect to be hearing about this A LOT from the right-wing Usual Suspects.

I guess that wasn't you that stated that, right? Sorry. Maybe it was someone else?


Let's cut to the chase here. If you have a point please make it.
 
2013-11-26 01:38:00 AM  

evil saltine: fusillade762: Riiiight.

Limbaugh Promotes A New Myth: Greeks Gave Themselves HIV For Welfare Money

However, the WHO report is incorrect. The WHO's source for this figure is a 2011 study in the British medical journal The Lancet. Here is what the Lancet study actually says:

An authoritative report described accounts of deliberate self-infection by a few individuals to obtain access to benefits of €700 per month and faster admission onto drug substitution programmes. These programmes offer access to synthetic opioids and can have waiting lists of 3 years or more in urban areas. [emphasis added]

Somehow, the "few individuals" mentioned by The Lancet became "half of new HIV infections" in the WHO report.
Fark keeps kicking out the link, "no content-type header"

http://mediamatters.org/blog/2013/11/25/limbaugh-promotes-a-new-myth- g reeks-gave-themse/197046

I don't see how that's relevant.


The fact that the story Fox and Limbaugh are pushing is bullshiat isn't relevant?
 
2013-11-26 01:43:53 AM  

cc_rider: So, "austerity" really don't work after all? Huh. Who woulda thunk it?


It does work. It's just that the mainstream media (along with most politicians [even those who support austerity]) is not honest about what the effects of austerity are or what the effects of continued stimulus are. Granted, most politicians and journalists aren't very smart, and almost none of them understand economics. Our only two choices (and it's been like this since Nixon was in office) are crash now or crash harder later. Stimulus just pushes the problem into the future, and guarantees that the inevitable crash will be worse. If debt-based spending could fix the economy, it would already be fixed. Just look at all the stimulus since 1980, and it hasn't accomplished anything other than burden our kids with debt that they will not be able to pay.

psychicinsights.files.wordpress.com

Look at all that stimulus.
 
2013-11-26 01:53:27 AM  

kerrigand: fusillade762: kerrigand: fusillade762: This story has the ingredients for a perfect storm of derp:

Homosexuals
Drug users
Welfare/Socialism
Europeans

Expect to be hearing about this A LOT from the right-wing Usual Suspects.

Seeing as how you are the one that brought that up. How exactly does it make right wingers the ones to suspect it?

Rush Limbaugh, The Daily Caller, The Blaze, and Fox News are all hitting it hard with the "HALF OF ALL AID INFECTIONS IN GREECE ARE INTENTIONAL". Legitimate news agencies... not so much.

That's fine and all. I don't follow those people.  But, that's not what I asked.

I asked YOU, as to seeing as to how YOU brought those up, how do they become a right-wing issue, when you're the one bringing those up in this thread?

I'll reiterate, who exactly brought this up in this thread?


Uhh, who brought this up in this thread? The article, on this very subject that the entire thread is about. Common knowledge of both the foundations that donate to fox, and the news agency them selves are known to be conservative leaning.

That is what you consider "right wing", no? Unless you're simply acting this way to feed your bruised ego, because you do not wish to accept that this is in fact the topic of discussion, in a thread, about a news article provided by a right wing entertainment agency.
 
2013-11-26 02:11:25 AM  

DrPainMD: cc_rider: So, "austerity" really don't work after all? Huh. Who woulda thunk it?

It does work. It's just that the mainstream media (along with most politicians [even those who support austerity]) is not honest about what the effects of austerity are or what the effects of continued stimulus are. Granted, most politicians and journalists aren't very smart, and almost none of them understand economics. Our only two choices (and it's been like this since Nixon was in office) are crash now or crash harder later. Stimulus just pushes the problem into the future, and guarantees that the inevitable crash will be worse. If debt-based spending could fix the economy, it would already be fixed. Just look at all the stimulus since 1980, and it hasn't accomplished anything other than burden our kids with debt that they will not be able to pay.

[psychicinsights.files.wordpress.com image 400x309]

Look at all that stimulus.


Dude, even the IMF has given up on austerity.

IMF: Austerity is much worse for the economy than we thought
 
2013-11-26 02:51:55 AM  
All we get here is a T-shirt saying:  "Don't fark me, I have HIV".
 
2013-11-26 03:14:02 AM  
Wow, I think my bullshiat detector just exploded.

Shame on you, subby, for treating Fox Business like a source of real information.
 
2013-11-26 03:17:52 AM  

Cthulhu_is_my_homeboy: Wow, I think my bullshiat detector just exploded.

Shame on you, subby, for treating Fox Business like a source of real information.


You might not have noticed, but this isn't a news site. It's Fark.com.
 
2013-11-26 03:25:24 AM  
 
2013-11-26 04:12:14 AM  
This is of course based on the well-founded suspicion that convincing sovereign nations to take on more debt than they can handle is good for their economy.
 
2013-11-26 04:15:50 AM  

DrPainMD: cc_rider: So, "austerity" really don't work after all? Huh. Who woulda thunk it?

It does work. It's just that the mainstream media (along with most politicians [even those who support austerity]) is not honest about what the effects of austerity are or what the effects of continued stimulus are. Granted, most politicians and journalists aren't very smart, and almost none of them understand economics. Our only two choices (and it's been like this since Nixon was in office) are crash now or crash harder later. Stimulus just pushes the problem into the future, and guarantees that the inevitable crash will be worse. If debt-based spending could fix the economy, it would already be fixed. Just look at all the stimulus since 1980, and it hasn't accomplished anything other than burden our kids with debt that they will not be able to pay.

[psychicinsights.files.wordpress.com image 400x309]

Look at all that stimulus.


Do your kids live in Greece? Just wondering.
 
2013-11-26 05:11:21 AM  
Does anyone actually believe this? Anyone?
 
2013-11-26 05:31:56 AM  
This here is why I work hard and make sure that I'm always doing a job that makes other people richer or happier. You do a coasting government non-job or live on welfare, when the government falls apart, you are screwed. Not just because you lost your job, but because you don't have a CV will skills that someone will pay you for.
 
2013-11-26 06:46:14 AM  

Lsherm: How the fark would the WHO even find that out?  Who in their right mind would confess to it?

Also, how farking desperate do you have to be to give yourself HIV for $950 a month?



1.  Statistics.
2.  Who in their right mind would infect themselves with HIV deliberately?  Plus, once it's done if there's no negatives to admitting it...
3.  Drug users - it says that HIV infection enables them to move to the head of the line for treatment.

wildsnowllama: Mugato: Aren't most HIV cases "self inflicted"?

Blood transfusions, rape, perinatal transmission...



Do those add up to 'most'?  Still, I'd even add in 'infected by partner who was sleeping around w/o your knowledge'.  At that point I think that most infections today are NOT what I'd consider 'self inflicted' in the sense that just because I go driving tomorrow doesn't mean that it's self-inflicted if I get into an accident.  If I go out drunk in a blizzard, then said accident could be considered self-inflicted, so I wouldn't say that even just 'sleeping around' is enough to self-inflict unless you're having sex with somebody that you know is HIV positive.
 
2013-11-26 08:10:01 AM  
This is a self limiting problem.
 
2013-11-26 08:16:07 AM  

Lsherm: Then why in the hell is WHO citing it in the first place?  I'm not outraged, I was just pointing out (accurately, I might add) that this was a W.H.O. report.

The ball is in your court.  If it's bullshiat, which it sounds like, then why is WHO using it in a report?


The WHO is not reporting that half of all new aids cases are intentional.

They WHO is reporting from a wide array of agencies of the general health situation.  One of the reports they use are consolidated from The Lancet.  The Lancet report does show an increase of HIV among drug users, causing about 50% of the increase.  That report says, I had quoted above, that A FEW people deliberately infected themselves for benefits.  NOTHING factual says that 50% of all new HIV cases in greece are intentionally done in order to get benefits.  That flat out lie comes from the right wing noise machine and nothing else.

Just like the 'knockout' game.  Take a few actual incidents, and then lie to make it a large issue in order to scare your core market so they keep watching you.  It pure and simple bullshiat.

The WHO report is linked TFA.  The Lancet article is linked in the WHO report.  I've already linked the pertinent information, so the ball is still in your court, so to speak.
 
2013-11-26 08:50:35 AM  

spawn73: A lot of countries have realised this, and now offer drug addicts access to the hardcore stuff. That way you get them away from the associated crime, cut out the drug dealers and ensure the drugaddicts get something that won't kill them.


Why would you want to keep them alive?
 
2013-11-26 08:59:58 AM  

tripleseven: dookdookdook: Lsherm: Also, how farking desperate do you have to be to give yourself HIV for $950 a month?

Addicted to drugs, probably homeless, 3 year wait for rehab otherwise, almost normal life expectancy for HIV patients, national government determined to (or forced to by the EU) make life for its citizens as miserable as possible... I could possibly see myself doing it under the circumstances.

Plan B is to try to swim to Italy.

Why would you need to swim to Italy?

As an EU member citizen, you can travel freely.  This isn't Cuba and the US FFS.


Why the hell would they go to Italy anyways? Isn't that just "out of the frying pan and into the fire? "Hey! Let's go from one political scandal- ridden, economically failing country with a corrupt government to another! Things will SURELY improve for us then!"
 
2013-11-26 09:18:34 AM  

DrPainMD: Granted, most politicians and journalists aren't very smart, and almost none of them understand economics. Our only two choices (and it's been like this since Nixon was in office) are crash now or crash harder later. Stimulus just pushes the problem into the future, and guarantees that the inevitable crash will be worse.


Even smart economists can't predict what the economy will do in the future... they can only develop models and theories about why it did whatever it did in the past.  Predicting a crash sometime in the future is like predicting an solar eclipse will happen sometime in the future.  Of course it will crash.  Every economy ever invented eventually crashed.  The "good" ones recover and crash again and again. That "inevitable crash" bullshiat is meaningless.

With regard to the idea that we can crash now or crash harder later, I submit to you that for the vast majority of Americans there is no difference between those two scenarios.  The people who lose the most in the "crash harder later" scenario are the extremely wealthy... in other words, they are already the ones controlling policy and siphoning value out of the economy into their personal fiefdoms. For the little guys, hyperinflation means you pay off your 30-year note in 6 months and for the destitute there is always the option to eat the rich.

The problem of national debt goes away once you realize that in a card crash the debt would be repudiated and the US dollar simply dissolved.  Wealth will be redistributed and the currency and basically the whole society gets a reboot.
 
2013-11-26 09:35:02 AM  
 Since it's coming from Fox Business I'm inclined to think this is just another "ERMEGERD!! AREN'T POOR PEOPLE WEIRD!!" bullshiat story that they're known for rolling out every once in awhile.

/ I hear they have toilets, and refrigerators too.
 
2013-11-26 10:28:52 AM  

kazikian: Does anyone actually believe this? Anyone?


Well, Rush Limbaugh does.

It's actually an editing error.  The report actually meant to say that half of HIV cases are heroin users.
 
2013-11-26 10:37:11 AM  
Fox Business?

Story completely made up. Probably pulled out of the random words hat.
 
2013-11-26 10:44:51 AM  
Sounds like an e-mail chain from my Aunt.
 
2013-11-26 10:55:11 AM  
Where do you get AIDS from?
A whore , 8 times.
l1.yimg.com
 
2013-11-26 11:15:41 AM  
 
2013-11-26 11:54:12 AM  
 
2013-11-26 12:47:11 PM  

Bondith: Reported by Fox News?  Wait, Fox Business News?  I feel confident in declaring this never happened.


It may have but I won't find out by clicking that link.
 
2013-11-26 02:33:08 PM  

fusillade762: DrPainMD: cc_rider: So, "austerity" really don't work after all? Huh. Who woulda thunk it?

It does work. It's just that the mainstream media (along with most politicians [even those who support austerity]) is not honest about what the effects of austerity are or what the effects of continued stimulus are. Granted, most politicians and journalists aren't very smart, and almost none of them understand economics. Our only two choices (and it's been like this since Nixon was in office) are crash now or crash harder later. Stimulus just pushes the problem into the future, and guarantees that the inevitable crash will be worse. If debt-based spending could fix the economy, it would already be fixed. Just look at all the stimulus since 1980, and it hasn't accomplished anything other than burden our kids with debt that they will not be able to pay.

[psychicinsights.files.wordpress.com image 400x309]

Look at all that stimulus.

Dude, even the IMF has given up on austerity.

IMF: Austerity is much worse for the economy than we thought


You clearly don't understand what the goal of the austerity in Greece is.

Let me make it clear: Do stop the government deficit.


That's it, and it's doing it. There's no other goal.
 
2013-11-27 12:12:09 AM  
Seriously, when are people going to learn not to get their information from Fox. Might as well have quoted WND.

If you track the story back to the source, it's an article by someone who's concerned that people *might* do it.
 
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