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(LA Times)   L.A. may have built a new $200 million residential and commercial complex atop an earthquake fault because officials didn't bother to do a seismic study. In Los Angeles   (latimes.com) divider line 50
    More: Stupid, Los Angeles, mistakes, Hollywood, direct effect, California Public Records Act, engineering management, city managers, earthquakes  
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5510 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Nov 2013 at 3:21 AM (21 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



50 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-11-23 03:24:31 AM
So, let the fault finding begin.
 
2013-11-23 03:29:17 AM
This puts me in the mood for pancakes.
 
2013-11-23 03:30:10 AM
Uh huh.  Cuz nothing else in Cali is built anywhere near a fault right? So lets crap ourselves over this new development so the lawyers can troll everyone.
 
2013-11-23 03:32:05 AM
"Geogists generally consider uneven groundwater levels in California a strong indicator of an earthquake fault."

I'm calling BS. Geologists consider previous seismic activity to be an indicator. Groundwater or frogs mating or cats missing... not so much.
 
2013-11-23 03:34:17 AM
Good luck folks.  Chuck Heston ain't around to save ya!
 
2013-11-23 03:49:32 AM
IIRC, won't California eventually be pulled away from the US in a few hundred years?
 
2013-11-23 03:59:43 AM
Learn to swim.
 
2013-11-23 04:00:36 AM
If someone is willing to insure it, then go for it.
 
2013-11-23 04:01:51 AM

cman: IIRC, won't California eventually be pulled away from the US in a few hundred years?


Who told you that? Someone who doesn't know jack squat. Don't you believe it.
Yeah people in California live near and even on seismic faults. Nothing new about it. The most populous state in the country too. If you build right you don't have that much to worry about. Is there anywhere 100% safe?
That whole thing about California "breaking away" came from a calypso song that reached #47 in the top 100 back in 1969. NOT based on science, based on POP music.
 
2013-11-23 04:03:23 AM
The highschool I went to in Anchorage had a slip fault running right through the building. Geology classes kept track of the movement. It moved about a centimeter during the years I was there.
 
2013-11-23 04:07:50 AM

cman: IIRC, won't California eventually be pulled away from the US in a few hundred years?


Snark answer: In as much as Arizona is now.

Serious answer: In 20 million years, Los Angeles will meet up with San Francisco.

IOW, no.

/San Andreas is a strike-slip fault, cuts just west of SF and east of the Baja Peninsula.
//Super-snark: Los Angeles gets more liberal with each earthquake.
 
2013-11-23 04:13:58 AM
It's okay. Everyone knows nothing bad ever happens in LA.
 
2013-11-23 04:19:00 AM

Wake Up Sheeple: cman: IIRC, won't California eventually be pulled away from the US in a few hundred years?

Snark answer: In as much as Arizona is now.

Serious answer: In 20 million years, Los Angeles will meet up with San Francisco.

IOW, no.

/San Andreas is a strike-slip fault, cuts just west of SF and east of the Baja Peninsula.
//Super-snark: Los Angeles gets more liberal with each earthquake.


Can we go south to the better tacos?
 
2013-11-23 04:23:10 AM
Don't go to the beach and complain you got wet. If you build in so. Cal. You're on, near or between faults, it's like finding a book in a library.

The real shock is, not paying for a study of the obvious, may actually have been common sense.....I didn't know it still existed in the wild anymore. ..
 
2013-11-23 05:10:58 AM
Hey, as long as they can sell all the units before the first quake hits, it's someone else's problem.
 
2013-11-23 05:16:17 AM
anyone so terrified by an earthquake in LA should probably not be in LA. really, i'd rather have the potential threat of an earthquake than the reliable hurricane season of the east coast where i grew up.

my old place here was built in 1914. it's still there. even after the hell we put it through.
 
2013-11-23 05:25:01 AM

Magnanimous_Spirit: Don't go to the beach and complain you got wet. If you build in so. Cal. You're on, near or between faults, it's like finding a book in a library.

The real shock is, not paying for a study of the obvious, may actually have been common sense.....I didn't know it still existed in the wild anymore. ..



There's a huge difference between building NEAR a fault and building ON a fault. It's a lot easier to design a building to resist shock waves than to resist its foundation being ripped apart.
 
2013-11-23 05:37:56 AM
It's more likely that they knew about the risk and avoided doing the study so they could turn a buck.  The only reason to not look is if you know  that you will see something which will prevent you from filling that offshore account.
 
2013-11-23 05:47:55 AM
Well, I see everyone who has no knowledge of how earthquakes and seismic studies and California work is here to assure us it doesn't matter.

I'd correct everyone, but it's late and I'm tired, so continue telling Californians how a) CA is going to fall into the Pacific; b) "everything in So Cal is on a fault so what difference does it make" and c) "all buildings in CA are built to code anyway so what difference does it make"

Blah blah blah.
 
2013-11-23 05:51:13 AM

Harry_Seldon: This puts me in the mood for pancakes.


Pancakes? Pffft...break out the waffles!
 
2013-11-23 05:53:15 AM

Gyrfalcon: Blah blah blah.


You get grumpy when you get tired :(
 
2013-11-23 06:17:15 AM

skinink: Learn to swim.


See you in Arizona Bay,
 
2013-11-23 06:18:16 AM
 

red5ish: That whole thing about California "breaking away" came from a Tool song from an album that reached #1 in the Billboard 200 back in 1999. NOT based on science, based on POP music.


Cause I'm praying for rain
And I'm praying for tidal waves
I wanna see the ground give way.
I wanna watch it all go down.
Mom, please flush it all away.
I wanna see it go right in and down.
I wanna watch it go right in.
Watch you flush it all away.

I'll see ya all down in Arizona Bay
Learn to swim, learn to swim
 
2013-11-23 07:09:41 AM

Klom Dark:  red5ish: That whole thing about California "breaking away" came from a Tool song from an album that reached #1 in the Billboard 200 back in 1999. NOT based on science, based on POP music.

Cause I'm praying for rain
And I'm praying for tidal waves
I wanna see the ground give way.
I wanna watch it all go down.
Mom, please flush it all away.
I wanna see it go right in and down.
I wanna watch it go right in.
Watch you flush it all away.

I'll see ya all down in Arizona Bay
Learn to swim, learn to swim


and when California slides into the ocean
like the mystics and statistics say it will
I predict this hotel will be standing
until I pay my bill
 
2013-11-23 07:28:50 AM
Test
 
2013-11-23 07:30:38 AM
Test from haye fark
 
2013-11-23 07:31:22 AM

hervatski: Wake Up Sheeple: cman: IIRC, won't California eventually be pulled away from the US in a few hundred years?

Snark answer: In as much as Arizona is now.

Serious answer: In 20 million years, Los Angeles will meet up with San Francisco.

IOW, no.

/San Andreas is a strike-slip fault, cuts just west of SF and east of the Baja Peninsula.
//Super-snark: Los Angeles gets more liberal with each earthquake.

Can we go south to the better tacos?


It sounds like the south will come to you.
 
2013-11-23 07:47:49 AM
I wish I had a gif from two stupid dogs where they fall asleep next to the San Andreas fault during an earthquake and everything -except- California falls into the ocean.
 
2013-11-23 08:06:45 AM
As long as the developer gets paid, all is well.
 
2013-11-23 08:44:53 AM
White people problems.
 
2013-11-23 08:54:47 AM
Define "on top of." Aren't those things everywhere out there?
 
2013-11-23 08:56:40 AM

Gyrfalcon: b) "everything in So Cal is on a fault so what difference does it make"


Well, here in Riverside, where we're on a hugely fractured fault line, when things slip everything else slips with it, and the energy tends to dissipate versus the more solid fault lines (like New Madrid which I lived directly atop.)

When the MexiCali quake hit a few years back, areas north of Riverside had stronger quakes/aftershocks, despite Riverside being closer to the epicenter.
 
2013-11-23 09:21:04 AM
Another success of the Socialist state of CA.
 
2013-11-23 09:24:24 AM

DirtyDeadGhostofEbenezerCooke: It's more likely that they knew about the risk and avoided doing the study so they could turn a buck.  The only reason to not look is if you know  that you will see something which will prevent you from filling that offshore account.


I'm pretty sure this is what happened. People's palms got greased and they just plum 'forgot'. In reality if you're developing in California you do not forget about what earthquake codes and studies mean for your business. However, someone still got paid to build it, so....yeah as long as no one goes to jail for it people will do things like this.
 
2013-11-23 10:23:46 AM
"...Assuming we don't blow ourselves up, us Californians just have to worry about California breaking off from the United States to go hang with Hawaii.  Alaska can come, too."
 
2013-11-23 10:30:37 AM
California law generally requires seismic studies for any new building proposed within roughly 500 feet of a fault in a state-designated earthquake fault zone.

Notice how they never mention it being illegal to build there if it's on a fault zone because it's not.  All it means is whoever lives there has to be notified of the potential hazzards.  Much like people who live in a flood zone must be notified of that as well.  Or, should we just not build anything where there could possibly be hurricanes, tornadoes, floods?
 
2013-11-23 10:35:57 AM

hervatski: Wake Up Sheeple: cman: IIRC, won't California eventually be pulled away from the US in a few hundred years?

Snark answer: In as much as Arizona is now.

Serious answer: In 20 million years, Los Angeles will meet up with San Francisco.

IOW, no.

/San Andreas is a strike-slip fault, cuts just west of SF and east of the Baja Peninsula.
//Super-snark: Los Angeles gets more liberal with each earthquake.

Can we go south to the better tacos?


Since Baja is moving north with it, just stay on the east side of the fault. The tacos will come to you .
 
2013-11-23 10:52:07 AM
St. Louisans laugh at your "fault" line. It's cute. Most of LA/SF stays standing when yours hit. We're sitting on a ticking 8.9+ over here.
 
2013-11-23 11:06:38 AM
California loves building on fault lines.  One of their nucular panner plants is built on one.  It's tradition!
 
2013-11-23 11:06:56 AM

khyberkitsune: Gyrfalcon: b) "everything in So Cal is on a fault so what difference does it make"

Well, here in Riverside, where we're on a hugely fractured fault line, when things slip everything else slips with it, and the energy tends to dissipate versus the more solid fault lines (like New Madrid which I lived directly atop.)

When the MexiCali quake hit a few years back, areas north of Riverside had stronger quakes/aftershocks, despite Riverside being closer to the epicenter.


Yep, I live in riverside county and worked in the city. People not from ca think any earthquake will destroy everything. If they'd look at a fault map, most everything is on a fault here.
 
2013-11-23 11:29:53 AM

DirtyDeadGhostofEbenezerCooke: It's more likely that they knew about the risk and avoided doing the study so they could turn a buck.  The only reason to not look is if you know  that you will see something which will prevent you from filling that offshore account.


Yep, this is political from both ends. The developers looking the other way at what may or may not be a problem, and the anti-development people using it to poke them with a stick.

I miss old, trashy Hollywood.
 
2013-11-23 11:31:11 AM

OnlyM3: Another success of the Socialist state of CA.


Pure capitalism, trollboy.
 
2013-11-23 12:00:32 PM
I wonder who's the lender on that project because they're a bit farked also.

johnny queso: OnlyM3: Another success of the Socialist state of CA.

Pure capitalism, trollboy.


Yes, because corruption & cronyism never happens in your socialist utopias.
 
2013-11-23 12:07:35 PM

HeliumAddict: Uh huh.  Cuz nothing else in Cali is built anywhere near a fault right? So lets crap ourselves over this new development so the lawyers can troll everyone.


Well, I found the lawyer for getting the permits...
http://www.jmbm.com/sheri-l-bonstelle.html

Damn... looks like the project has changed hands at least once, with DLJ Real Estate Capital Partners buying it from Clarett Group.  This should be lawsuitlarity for a while, I think.
 
2013-11-23 12:26:03 PM

legion_of_doo: I wonder who's the lender on that project because they're a bit farked also.

johnny queso: OnlyM3: Another success of the Socialist state of CA.

Pure capitalism, trollboy.

Yes, because corruption & cronyism never happens in your socialist utopias.


It's mid to high-rent condos and shopping, not housing for the field workers. They may be required to provide a token affordable unit and one that meets ADA, so that is kind of lefty.
 
2013-11-23 01:22:38 PM

exatron: hervatski: Wake Up Sheeple: cman: IIRC, won't California eventually be pulled away from the US in a few hundred years?

Snark answer: In as much as Arizona is now.

Serious answer: In 20 million years, Los Angeles will meet up with San Francisco.

IOW, no.

/San Andreas is a strike-slip fault, cuts just west of SF and east of the Baja Peninsula.
//Super-snark: Los Angeles gets more liberal with each earthquake.

Can we go south to the better tacos?

It sounds like the south will come to you.


So....Youre saying the south....will rise again?
 
2013-11-23 01:57:08 PM
To be fair, in the LA area there are thousands of faults when you get right down to it. Not all of them are big or major ones, but it's hard to find any area without a nearby fault.

In other words, don't panic.
 
2013-11-23 02:35:27 PM

Magnanimous_Spirit: khyberkitsune: Gyrfalcon: b) "everything in So Cal is on a fault so what difference does it make"

Well, here in Riverside, where we're on a hugely fractured fault line, when things slip everything else slips with it, and the energy tends to dissipate versus the more solid fault lines (like New Madrid which I lived directly atop.)

When the MexiCali quake hit a few years back, areas north of Riverside had stronger quakes/aftershocks, despite Riverside being closer to the epicenter.

Yep, I live in riverside county and worked in the city. People not from ca think any earthquake will destroy everything. If they'd look at a fault map, most everything is on a fault here.


When MexiCali hit that Easter, I was in the Mission Inn having the Sunday Brunch. ONE group of people, obviously not from CA, started panicking. The rest of us just kinda stopped for a second, looked at the nearest hanging heavy object to make sure it wasn't going to fall, and as soon as the quake stopped, we all started clapping and went back to eating, while the group that freaked out kinda left, looking very sheepish
 
2013-11-23 02:39:51 PM
'The soil report filed by the developer's consultant to the city cited an even earlier fault map produced in 1991 showing the Blvd6200 project was 1,000 feet away from the Hollywood fault.'

Honest mistake. Honestly.
 
2013-11-23 07:28:31 PM
Even if the city or state didn't require it, I'm surprised the insurance underwriter doesn't require a study of how likely the building is to be damaged in an earthquake.
 
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