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(Abc.net.au)   Good news everyone: We're not the only ones pissing off countries for revelations that we've been spying on them this whole time   (abc.net.au) divider line 67
    More: Interesting, Mr Yudhoyono, Indonesia, Australians, Australian Government, secret documents, foreign ministers, ambassadors  
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6399 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Nov 2013 at 10:51 AM (39 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-11-18 09:47:12 AM
I would have gone with the obvious tag here. Everyone is spying on everyone else. Enemy, ally, whatever. That's the way it's always been and that's the way it always will be.

We just broke rules one and two of Spy Club by allowing ourselves to be outed in a spectacularly public burst of fail.
 
2013-11-18 09:50:09 AM
The Indonesian prime minister became suspicious when he saw this outside his office window.

www.redorbit.com
 
2013-11-18 09:52:43 AM

namegoeshere: I would have gone with the obvious tag here. Everyone is spying on everyone else. Enemy, ally, whatever. That's the way it's always been and that's the way it always will be.

We just broke rules one and two of Spy Club by allowing ourselves to be outed in a spectacularly public burst of fail.


Well, *WE* didn't break them.  They were broken for us.
 
2013-11-18 10:53:25 AM
I spy, you spy, we all spy.
 
2013-11-18 10:54:50 AM
Are these really revelations?
Governments have been spying on each other forever. Why is everyone so shocked by this?
 
2013-11-18 10:55:45 AM
I read the headline with a Scottish accent.
 
2013-11-18 10:57:22 AM
Everyone does it. The only embarrassing part is getting caught.
 
2013-11-18 10:57:24 AM
Oz is one of the Five Eyes, so duh!
 
2013-11-18 10:57:36 AM

namegoeshere: I would have gone with the obvious tag here. Everyone is spying on everyone else. Enemy, ally, whatever. That's the way it's always been and that's the way it always will be.

We just broke rules one and two of Spy Club by allowing ourselves to be outed in a spectacularly public burst of fail.


This, basically.  The outrage you see coming from those nations being spied upon is manufactured and purely for the benefit of the audience.  That being their citizens.

Governments understand the rules: Spying happens.  If we catch yours, sucks to be them.
 
2013-11-18 10:58:36 AM

Snazzy1: I read the headline with a Scottish accent.


The Stealth Hippopotamus: Everyone does it. The only embarrassing part is getting caught.


I think these two comments go great together.
 
2013-11-18 10:58:47 AM
no?
 
2013-11-18 10:59:32 AM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Everyone does it. The only embarrassing part is getting caught.


Sucking dick?

/snark

I know you meant riding a fat girl mopehead.
 
2013-11-18 11:01:03 AM

abhorrent1: Are these really revelations?
Governments have been spying on each other forever. Why is everyone so shocked by this?


I think in some weird bubble, we're all supposed to be shocked the "governments we trust" would do something like this.
I mean, the other guy, sure, but US?!
What government doesn't think it's smarter than its citizens?
 
2013-11-18 11:02:25 AM
We're no?
 
2013-11-18 11:02:30 AM
Indonesia recalls ambassador after leaked documents reveal Australia spied on president Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono.

They were attempting to steal vital Scrabble technology.
 
2013-11-18 11:02:41 AM
I think that subby accidently the whole thing.
 
2013-11-18 11:02:46 AM

namegoeshere: I would have gone with the obvious tag here. Everyone is spying on everyone else. Enemy, ally, whatever. That's the way it's always been and that's the way it always will be.

We just broke rules one and two of Spy Club by allowing ourselves to be outed in a spectacularly public burst of fail.


Bingo.  It sucks we got caught, but all those countries acting indignant are simultaneously spying on us.
 
2013-11-18 11:02:47 AM
Knows how these spied-on governments feel:

www.enterstageright.com
 
2013-11-18 11:02:48 AM

Zombie DJ: abhorrent1: Are these really revelations?
Governments have been spying on each other forever. Why is everyone so shocked by this?

I think in some weird bubble, we're all supposed to be shocked the "governments we trust" would do something like this.
I mean, the other guy, sure, but US?!
What government doesn't think it's smarter than its citizens?


I'd like to see proof of a nation where its citizens are smarter than its government.
 
2013-11-18 11:03:54 AM
On the right: top of cone with spy gear out for repair and upgrades. Large, elephant ears on other man old school listening post. Processor in tie does simultaneous translation and recording.

www.abc.net.au
 
2013-11-18 11:06:09 AM
This just in! Everyone spies on everyone. More news once I'm done digging through your trash.
 
2013-11-18 11:06:31 AM

Snazzy1: I read the headline with a Scottish accent.


I went with the Farnsworth.
 
2013-11-18 11:06:31 AM

Head_Shot: We're no?


Indeed we are no. Profound is it not?
 
2013-11-18 11:11:49 AM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Everyone does it. The only embarrassing part is getting caught.


I see what you did there.

But the camera is well hidden.
 
2013-11-18 11:13:45 AM

The Stealth Hippopotamus: Everyone does it. The only embarrassing part is getting caught.


That's right up there in argumentative excellence as the famed "if you don't like it, don't watch it" retort and the "it's how we've always done things" rejoinder.

Not that I'm saying you're wrong, mind you. Just saying you probably should have gone with the "what did Indonesia expect would happen with all of those human rights violations" thinker than that old chestnut.
 
2013-11-18 11:14:40 AM
The trick is to hide your smirk when expressing your "outrage."
 
2013-11-18 11:14:41 AM

abhorrent1: Governments have been spying on each other forever. Why is everyone so shocked by this?


Modern communications make it much easier to catch the efforts, though.  Governments' efforts to adjust to this new reality are a source of our amusement.
 
2013-11-18 11:16:37 AM

namegoeshere: I would have gone with the obvious tag here. Everyone is spying on everyone else. Enemy, ally, whatever. That's the way it's always been and that's the way it always will be.

We just broke rules one and two of Spy Club by allowing ourselves to be outed in a spectacularly public burst of fail.


www.xtimeline.com
 
2013-11-18 11:16:59 AM
cineclap.free.fr
 
2013-11-18 11:18:34 AM
Everyone does it...

Well, first, sure, i guess so, but I'd doubt that Indonesia spies on Australia to the same extent. They can't.

So the first problem is information asymmetry, and resentment over that. Which means "everyone does it" an excuse to say that it is fine that certain nations do it more.

Just about every country has one sort of army. But the US is still seen as a bully, due to the size and scope of its military program. Same logic applies to our espionage.

And, second, well, no one likes being spied on.
 
2013-11-18 11:18:37 AM
What I find surprising is that people are surprised.

One nice thing that may come out of all of this though is an enlightenment of the people that will lead to increased privacy... or at least repercussions for those getting caught being nosy Gus's.

Doubt it though. Some poptart slore will SHOCK the world by wiggling her barely clothed posterior in a new and unchristian fashion and all the dullard rage will be refocused on the mundane and inconsequential... where it belongs... citizen.
 
2013-11-18 11:21:06 AM
You ALWAYS want to keep an eye on an aggressive neighbour.


/looking in your direction USA...
 
2013-11-18 11:24:04 AM
Also, I'd assume that spying breaks national or international laws?

Anyway, I'm not sure that "everyone does it" is a very good argument.
 
2013-11-18 11:24:47 AM

gopher321: You ALWAYS want to keep an eye on an aggressive neighbour.


/looking in your direction USA...


Actually, I would prefer to spy on a sexy neighbor.

/Looking in your direction, Swedish bikini team.
 
2013-11-18 11:25:37 AM
Brazil is upset that caught Canada spying on them...
 
2013-11-18 11:34:04 AM

WippitGuud: Brazil is upset that caught Canada spying on them...


Your pr0n site belong on Fobbies
 
2013-11-18 11:35:09 AM
It's almost as though all of the other countries are doing it.

Don't give into peer pressure CIA.  Just say no.
 
2013-11-18 11:38:42 AM
Countries will always spy on each other because they have to, and since spying will always be illegal they will always be breaking the law.

That said, I do laud what Snowden did.  The government must be made accountable to the will of the people.  It has let down the American public so much this past decade.
 
2013-11-18 11:39:43 AM

mike_d85: It's almost as though all of the other countries are doing it.

Don't give into peer pressure CIA.  Just say no.


Ok, I'll simplify what I said earlier: when all countries can conduct espionage at the same level as first world powers, and, really, to our level, then we can say "everyone does it."
 
2013-11-18 11:40:43 AM
The spy game is like a flamingo. It looks all impressive, but it's just being held up by a pair of spindly legs that reek of its own excrement.

We've just decided to look at it enough that we get to see the flamingo fall, and it's funny.
 
2013-11-18 11:41:09 AM

sendtodave: Everyone does it...

Well, first, sure, i guess so, but I'd doubt that Indonesia spies on Australia to the same extent. They can't.

So the first problem is information asymmetry, and resentment over that. Which means "everyone does it" an excuse to say that it is fine that certain nations do it more.

Just about every country has one sort of army. But the US is still seen as a bully, due to the size and scope of its military program. Same logic applies to our espionage.

And, second, well, no one likes being spied on.


If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear.
 
rka
2013-11-18 11:41:24 AM

sendtodave: So the first problem is information asymmetry, and resentment over that. Which means "everyone does it" an excuse to say that it is fine that certain nations do it more.


Are rich nations supposed to operate in the world with one hand tied behind their back in some sort of nod to fairness? Vonnegut's short storyHarrison Bergeron was satire, not a guide book.
 
2013-11-18 11:41:56 AM
www.boston.com

Now all of a sudden you jokers look pretty silly complaining about me, right?
 
2013-11-18 11:45:46 AM

rka: sendtodave: So the first problem is information asymmetry, and resentment over that. Which means "everyone does it" an excuse to say that it is fine that certain nations do it more.

Are rich nations supposed to operate in the world with one hand tied behind their back in some sort of nod to fairness? Vonnegut's short storyHarrison Bergeron was satire, not a guide book.


They don't have to.

They'll just continue to be despised, envied.
 
2013-11-18 11:52:14 AM

rka: sendtodave: So the first problem is information asymmetry, and resentment over that. Which means "everyone does it" an excuse to say that it is fine that certain nations do it more.

Are rich nations supposed to operate in the world with one hand tied behind their back in some sort of nod to fairness? Vonnegut's short storyHarrison Bergeron was satire, not a guide book.


To be fair, the poor nations have fewer useful things to know about them.
 
2013-11-18 12:02:37 PM

Fano: rka: sendtodave: So the first problem is information asymmetry, and resentment over that. Which means "everyone does it" an excuse to say that it is fine that certain nations do it more.

Are rich nations supposed to operate in the world with one hand tied behind their back in some sort of nod to fairness? Vonnegut's short storyHarrison Bergeron was satire, not a guide book.

To be fair, the poor nations have fewer useful things to know about them.


Except for resources.
 
2013-11-18 12:09:24 PM

Infernalist: Fano: rka: sendtodave: So the first problem is information asymmetry, and resentment over that. Which means "everyone does it" an excuse to say that it is fine that certain nations do it more.

Are rich nations supposed to operate in the world with one hand tied behind their back in some sort of nod to fairness? Vonnegut's short storyHarrison Bergeron was satire, not a guide book.

To be fair, the poor nations have fewer useful things to know about them.

Except for resources.


And we will use them to make their lives richer.

(but we still not let them in our clubs ;)
 
2013-11-18 12:09:25 PM

sendtodave: rka: sendtodave: So the first problem is information asymmetry, and resentment over that. Which means "everyone does it" an excuse to say that it is fine that certain nations do it more.

Are rich nations supposed to operate in the world with one hand tied behind their back in some sort of nod to fairness? Vonnegut's short storyHarrison Bergeron was satire, not a guide book.

They don't have to.

They'll just continue to be despised, envied.


Oh no! We'll be envied? Well, shiat, which country's abilities do we have to limit ourselves to stop that? Can we stop at Burma or do we have to go full on Somalia? You think China will be on board?
 
2013-11-18 12:12:28 PM
Simply stated, until we're all living under one government with equal representation in that government, nations will continue to struggle with other nations on the behalf of their respective citizens.

Spying is simply part of that.

If you don't like spying, then work hard to bring about a one-world-government where the citizens of the world are treated as the same as Americans in the eyes of the law.
 
2013-11-18 12:13:20 PM
Well, if I were a spy I'd be just a little curios about someone with a name like Bambang.

I mean did you see the pictures of these guys ITFA?  They look like a bunch of little Pol Pots getting all ramped-up for something.
 
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