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(MSNBC)   In VA, just because you won the election doesn't mean you won the office. The state legislature can overturn election results. But, surely, the modern GOP would never do such a thing?   (msnbc.com) divider line 88
    More: Asinine, GOP, Virginia Law, state legislative, Virginia General Assembly, state board of elections, Mark Obenshain  
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7036 clicks; posted to Politics » on 16 Nov 2013 at 2:23 PM (35 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-11-16 11:13:36 AM
But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.
 
2013-11-16 11:14:16 AM
Even the GOP wouldn't stoop that lo- hahahaha sorry, I tried.
 
2013-11-16 11:33:10 AM

Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.


It's not about what it WILL do, it's about what Republicans THINK it will do.
 
2013-11-16 11:46:46 AM

Lionel Mandrake: I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.


chibatron.com

Oh Hai!
 
2013-11-16 12:19:53 PM

Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.


Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.
 
2013-11-16 12:26:07 PM

Mentat: Even the GOP wouldn't stoop that lo- hahahaha sorry, I tried.



You made it farther than I would have.
 
2013-11-16 12:47:06 PM

Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.


It's not like I said they didn't...and it's not like I'm surprised.

I may prefer one party over another, but I'm not exactly thrilled with either
 
2013-11-16 12:56:55 PM

Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.


And it's scummy when they do it, too.
 
2013-11-16 01:00:21 PM
Go ahead, do a recount in Fairfax County.  It's not like this can backfire and blast you in the face or anything.
 
2013-11-16 01:16:17 PM

Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.


And I'm perfectly fine with dragging each of those folks out in the town square and beating 'em with a sock full of nickels. Democratic process means you don't always get what you want.
 
2013-11-16 02:13:41 PM

Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.


So vote Republican
 
2013-11-16 02:31:53 PM
We gonna do dis again until dese unAmerican voters get it right an' vote da way they were redistricted ta do!
 
2013-11-16 02:41:50 PM

Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.


They did that in a Presidential election and nobody really gave a shiat.
 
2013-11-16 02:47:57 PM
The state legislature can overturn election results.

That shouldn't even be Constitutional.

And yeah I mean the big "C" not whatever stupid state charter they're going by.
 
2013-11-16 02:48:06 PM

kregh99: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

They did that in a Presidential election and nobody really gave a shiat.


Plenty of people gave a shiat.

Plenty still do.
 
2013-11-16 02:48:51 PM

netringer: We gonna do dis again until dese unAmerican voters get it right an' vote da way they were redistricted ta do!


Pretty much, the Republicans fixed the race and still got wiped off the map, they're going to keep the AG office by any means since from there whatever the next wave of voter suppression efforts the rethugs are dreaming up could likely be halted.
 
2013-11-16 02:53:39 PM
 
2013-11-16 02:54:40 PM

sendtodave: kregh99: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

They did that in a Presidential election and nobody really gave a shiat.

Plenty of people gave a shiat.

Plenty still do.


Not enough that anything was done about it. Which is why the GOP could do it. It's not so much doing something questionable, it's about making sure you do something questionable enough as to be effective, but not too questionable as to get in trouble over it.
 
2013-11-16 02:58:58 PM

Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.


Last year, the VA Senate had a 8 GOP and 8 Dem split, until one of the Dems went to Obama inauguration.  While he was there, there were 8 GOPs and 7 Dems with a GOP governor.  They used that majority to redistrict the absent Democrat's seat out of existence.

So, there's "considering" and there's "have a history of doing".
 
2013-11-16 03:00:21 PM

The Lone Gunman: Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.

Last year, the VA Senate had a 8 GOP and 8 Dem split, until one of the Dems went to Obama inauguration.  While he was there, there were 8 GOPs and 7 Dems with a GOP governor.  They used that majority to redistrict the absent Democrat's seat out of existence.

So, there's "considering" and there's "have a history of doing".


Actually, I thought that while that was floated, that didn't wind up going through/happening? (I think the leuitenant governor and governor, at least, went "NO.", despite being republicans.)
 
2013-11-16 03:01:11 PM

kregh99: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

They did that in a Presidential election and nobody really gave a shiat.


lots didn't like it but in 2000 we still were trying to believe the SCOTUS wasn't political. now we know better.
 
2013-11-16 03:05:56 PM

Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.


They considered that, it pissed people off, and they backed down. That sounds real similar to what Lionel Mandrake predicted would happen in VA if the GOP tried similar. That would require people in VA to get pissed off instead of pointing fingers elsewhere, though, so I hope they don't act like you just did.
 
2013-11-16 03:06:40 PM

Heliovdrake: Can we get a list going like the big list of people against the GOP, but a list of the ways Republicans win elections.

LOHTGOPWE List of How the GOP Wins Elections.

Loht (like lot) GOP (Rhymes with stop) We


1. Change the Laws on how votes are counter after you lose.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/11/09/virginia-attorney-general-r ac e_n_4247571.html

2. Lie about endorsements and Race (Watch the video on this one to see just how much of a
shiat bag this guy is)
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/11/09/texas-anti-lgbt-crusader-won-l oc al-election-by-pretending-to-be-black/

3. If you lose, just have your party controlled state legislature overturn the results and declare you the winner.
http://www.msnbc.com/msnbc/virginia-attorney-general-recount


4: Gerrymander US Hose of Reps districts so they still retain a significant majority of seats despite losing the aggregate popular vote by 1.5 million.
 
2013-11-16 03:06:44 PM
The people of VA asked for it when they elected the GOP to the legislature in the first place.
 
2013-11-16 03:09:10 PM

Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.


Yeah if they did that... it would be guillotine time.
 
2013-11-16 03:10:49 PM

Felgraf: The Lone Gunman: Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.

Last year, the VA Senate had a 8 GOP and 8 Dem split, until one of the Dems went to Obama inauguration.  While he was there, there were 8 GOPs and 7 Dems with a GOP governor.  They used that majority to redistrict the absent Democrat's seat out of existence.

So, there's "considering" and there's "have a history of doing".

Actually, I thought that while that was floated, that didn't wind up going through/happening? (I think the leuitenant governor and governor, at least, went "NO.", despite being republicans.)


IIRC the legislature actually went through with it but McDonnell, who had national aspirations, told them to GTFO, STFU and GBTW. I wonder what he would have done if he knew his term would end soaked in sleaze, severely hammering his chances at ever making a Presidental run.
 
2013-11-16 03:18:57 PM
Are there any volunteers to design the new VIRGINIA tag?
 
2013-11-16 03:19:50 PM

minuslars: Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Yeah if they did that... it would be guillotine time.


I think you underestimate the power of American apathy. America has a track record for having a very large tolerance to political bullshiat like this. I'm not saying noone would be pissed, but it's not going to inspire anyone to take any signifigant action to drastically change the political scene. People simply don't care as long as it doesn't directly affect them. And even then? If it directly affects them, if it isn't signifigant, noone cares.
 
2013-11-16 03:25:51 PM
so now that their post election rules change to make the provisional ballot voters appear in person didn't play to their advantage they're going to take it to the legislature?  Wow they really are playing Calvinball.
 
2013-11-16 03:28:39 PM

Hobodeluxe: so now that their post election rules change to make the provisional ballot voters appear in person didn't play to their advantage they're going to take it to the legislature?  Wow they really are playing Calvinball.


Yep, and I think this accurately summarizes why:

Weatherkiss: I think you underestimate the power of American apathy. America has a track record for having a very large tolerance to political bullshiat like this. I'm not saying noone would be pissed, but it's not going to inspire anyone to take any signifigant action to drastically change the political scene. People simply don't care as long as it doesn't directly affect them. And even then? If it directly affects them, if it isn't signifigant, noone cares.


Until these politicians are taken into the street and executed for treason, this shiat will continue.
 
2013-11-16 03:29:42 PM

cashman: Are there any volunteers to design the new VIRGINIA tag?


Sure.
 
2013-11-16 03:31:27 PM
Remember during the 2012 election the Right Wing, I would call them nut jobs but what should be considered a nut job are welcomed as mainstream party members by the Right, kept screaming that Obama was going to do this.
 
2013-11-16 03:33:15 PM

cashman: Are there any volunteers to design the new VIRGINIA tag?


Well get in line behind Texas, Arizona, Arkansas, and North Carolina.
 
2013-11-16 03:35:05 PM

born_yesterday: Until people stop voting Republican these politicians are taken into the street and executed for treason, this shiat will continue.


Seriously, it isn't that hard.  It's not like Republicans are getting elected and then pulling this shiat right out of the blue.  They run on some of this shiat.  They've done this shiat before.  At times they even brag openly about pulling this shiat.

THIS IS WHAT ALL REPUBLICANS DO.  THIS IS WHAT THEY ARE.

Like the scorpion and the frog.  You don't need to inquire any further as to why or how they do these things.  They're Republicans.  It's what they do.
 
2013-11-16 03:39:01 PM

Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.


If they declare the office vacant and order a new election, what if their guy loses again? Do they just declare the office vacant again and order a new election? Can they just keep doing that until they get their desired result?
 
2013-11-16 03:39:06 PM

Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.


So, are you really arguing that makes it okay? Really?
 
2013-11-16 03:43:30 PM
How is it that the average republican voter is always yapping about "freedom" this and "freedom" that, yet they really are the most totalitarian pack of assholes ever to goosestep across the Earth?
 
2013-11-16 03:49:34 PM

TV's Vinnie: How is it that the average republican voter is always yapping about "freedom" this and "freedom" that, yet they really are the most totalitarian pack of assholes ever to goosestep across the Earth?


The freedom that they are talking about is the freedom to oppress minorities and non Christians. The freedom for the rich to squeeze every last bit of life out of the poor. The freedom to make women second class citizens. That is the freedom that they are talking about. That is their America.
 
2013-11-16 03:50:51 PM

Lsherm: Lionel Mandrake: But even if after the dust clears Herring remains in the lead, under Virginia law, Obenshain could contest the result in the Republican dominated Virginia legislature, which could declare Obenshain the winner or declare the office vacant and order a new election.

I can see them taking the latter course, but declaring the loser the winner would piss people off to no end.

Well, it's not like Democrats consider ridiculous positions when their guy loses.


Oh right go with that argument, please proceed.
 
2013-11-16 03:53:48 PM

ongbok: TV's Vinnie: How is it that the average republican voter is always yapping about "freedom" this and "freedom" that, yet they really are the most totalitarian pack of assholes ever to goosestep across the Earth?

The freedom that they are talking about is the freedom to oppress minorities and non Christians. The freedom for the rich to squeeze every last bit of life out of the poor. The freedom to make women second class citizens. That is the freedom that they are talking about. That is their America.


I'm not going to say I remember the good old days, when Americans had their politicians by the reigns, and the system worked, and kept corruption and opportunistic partisanship at bay.

I do, however, remember when they at least hide to hide the corruption, and when being a shiat-eatingly ignorant moran was considered a character flaw.
 
2013-11-16 03:58:27 PM
24.media.tumblr.com
 
2013-11-16 04:00:59 PM
If Obama hadn't taken their freedom they wouldn't have to resort to such extreme measures
 
2013-11-16 04:02:27 PM

cretinbob: [24.media.tumblr.com image 500x315]


- Rand Paul
 
2013-11-16 04:02:36 PM
It's not a question of whether or not the GOP has the scruples to avoid unethical behaviors like overturning the will of the electorate because the answer to that one is a flat out No.

The only real question for them is "can they get away with it if/when they do it?"
 
2013-11-16 04:23:02 PM
There's a big difference between SCOTUS declaring a winner vs the state legislature: the people in the legislature have to run for reelection. I imagine that there are enough GOP house members who are in tight districts, who depend on votes from independents, and this is the last thing they want to be a campaign issue. And besides throwing out election results, it just doesn't look good to keep the post vacant for months. Ultimately, self preservation trumps insanity.
 
2013-11-16 04:46:07 PM

toomuchwhargarbl: Pretty much, the Republicans fixed the race and still got wiped off the map,


i205.photobucket.com
 
2013-11-16 04:49:58 PM

TV's Vinnie: How is it that the average republican voter is always yapping about "freedom" this and "freedom" that, yet they really are the most totalitarian pack of assholes ever to goosestep across the Earth?


imageshack.us
 
2013-11-16 04:52:06 PM
So, is anyone actually planning to do this or is everyone getting worked up over a hypothetical?
 
2013-11-16 04:52:58 PM
Said it before and I'll say it again,

Swallow's Law: "There is Nothing the Republican Party fears more than an honest count."
 
2013-11-16 04:59:00 PM

foo monkey: cashman: Are there any volunteers to design the new VIRGINIA tag?

Well get in line behind Texas, Arizona, Arkansas, and North Carolina.


... you left out Brownbackistan - er, I mean 'Kansas'.
 
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