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(Think Progress)   Republicans cannot pass an Immigration Reform Bill because of all the technical difficulties Healthcare.gov is experiencing. Ya rly   (thinkprogress.org) divider line 75
    More: Obvious, YA RLY, Reform Act, Republicans, immigration reform, Eric Cantor  
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1205 clicks; posted to Politics » on 16 Nov 2013 at 10:19 AM (40 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-11-16 08:25:53 AM
Party of personal responsibility.
 
2013-11-16 08:40:26 AM
It's a pretty serious technical issue - the Republicans can't find a workaround for their "president=#000000" error.
 
2013-11-16 09:04:08 AM

UNC_Samurai: It's a pretty serious technical issue - the Republicans can't find a workaround for their "president=#000000" error.


I think it's related to this code I found:

if (President = "black") {
    governing mode = "obstruct everything";
 
2013-11-16 09:34:11 AM
I should Photoshop a "Big Wheel of Legislative Excuses" for them to spin but it's Saturday.
 
2013-11-16 09:35:25 AM
i.imgur.com
 
2013-11-16 10:19:24 AM
Is there no end to the destruction this evil, job-killing, freedom-stealing, coverage-denying, immorality-promoting, website-farking "law" will do to the America the GOP loves so much?
 
2013-11-16 10:23:09 AM
Republicans can't walk and chew gum at the same time. Democrats want to outlaw/regulate gum.

No, they are not equal, just all retarded.

Like that Elizabeth Warren seems to be increasing her support on the national level. We need someone to speak truth to power. She may be it. It would freak all the right people out.

We just have to realize that this particular Congress will accomplish absolutely nothing.
 
2013-11-16 10:24:00 AM
I ran on a platform of government is bad and can do nothing for you. You elected me to do nothing and to make sure no one else did. You're welcome.
 
2013-11-16 10:28:54 AM
If they fail to pass it, they will doom themselves for the medium to long term future. If they pass it, they will be destroyed in the short term by their base.

Pushing Immigration Reform is the greatest "wedge" issue the left can push right now
 
2013-11-16 10:31:04 AM

MrBallou: Is there no end to the destruction this evil, job-killing, freedom-stealing, coverage-denying, immorality-promoting, website-farking "law" will do to the America the GOP loves so much?


lh5.googleusercontent.com
And the fifth reason the ACA kills is for the sheer fun of it.
 
2013-11-16 10:40:26 AM
The website is getting better. It's not up to initial specifications yet, but it is still much improved in many aspects. Two nights ago, I went from zero to ready to pay a premium in half an hour. That's a pretty good result I think.
 
2013-11-16 10:47:06 AM
WHAR SENATE INVESTIGATION ON BENGHAZI AND BIRF CIRTIFICETE WHAR

LASER LIKE FOCUS ON JERBS
 
2013-11-16 10:49:24 AM
Passing immigration reform is one of the most important solutions to keep America competitive. Like lots of nations our population is having less kids, and thus less productive members of society to replace the aging population that will live far longer than the previous generations. Immigration is helping us deal with that issue a little better than other countries, but its more than that. Illegal immigrants deflate wages, and cost the economy money. Yet the only solution the far right Republicans have is to deport everyone, and build a fence. Despite the fact that big businesses are perfectly happy with hiring illegal immigrants, especially the agricultural industry.
 
2013-11-16 10:52:23 AM
This is unnecessary, the amnesty of 1986 fixed the problem. It didn't? So how long after this amnesty will we have millions more clamoring for the next one?
 
2013-11-16 10:56:02 AM
Easy Solution: Inform House Republicans that immigration reform will likely bring misery on thousands of brown folks. It will be like giving a crying toddler a toy or candy.
 
2013-11-16 10:58:19 AM
Boehner is a weak incompetent, but Cantor is actively malicious.  An article trying to paint him as merely congenitally retarded does a disservice to the many lovely and productive members of the US's mentally retarded community.
 
2013-11-16 11:00:05 AM

jim32rr: This is unnecessary, the amnesty of 1986 fixed the problem. It didn't? So how long after this amnesty will we have millions more clamoring for the next one?


As long as people still want to come here. They are the cord wood that fuels our economy and their future generations build us stronger as they integrate.
 
2013-11-16 11:03:56 AM

NewportBarGuy: jim32rr: This is unnecessary, the amnesty of 1986 fixed the problem. It didn't? So how long after this amnesty will we have millions more clamoring for the next one?

As long as people still want to come here. They are the cord wood that fuels our economy and their future generations build us stronger as they integrate.


So America is thriving right now?

I saw on MSNBC that due to the FED pumping 85 billion a month to prop up the Stock and Bond markets... that Wall Street is thriving.

But is Main Street ?


Seems more like the top 5% are doing ok.
 
2013-11-16 11:05:48 AM
If you want to reduce the deficit and increase growth, make this bill law.
 
2013-11-16 11:10:39 AM

jim32rr: This is unnecessary, the amnesty of 1986 fixed the problem. It didn't? So how long after this amnesty will we have millions more clamoring for the next one?


30 years.
 
2013-11-16 11:11:39 AM

netcentric: NewportBarGuy: jim32rr: This is unnecessary, the amnesty of 1986 fixed the problem. It didn't? So how long after this amnesty will we have millions more clamoring for the next one?

As long as people still want to come here. They are the cord wood that fuels our economy and their future generations build us stronger as they integrate.

So America is thriving right now?

I saw on MSNBC that due to the FED pumping 85 billion a month to prop up the Stock and Bond markets... that Wall Street is thriving.

But is Main Street ?


Seems more like the top 5% are doing ok.


And you're going to blame immigrants for that? They can't even vote most of the time. . .
 
2013-11-16 11:15:31 AM
I was just talking about immigration reform with a coworker yesterday.  He thinks that illegal immigrants (specifically Mexicans, because he thinks they are by far the largest group of illegal aliens) are ruining the nation.  Between the extremely high proportion of prison populations, emergency room costs, driving without insurance (and causing accidents which we have to pay for), taking our jobs, general increase in crime, and bringing up our welfare and education costs, they provide no benefits.

I said that here in California, we have at least one of those covered; we recently passed a bill that would allow illegal immigrants to get a license and insurance.  He said that was bullshiat; illegal immigrants shouldn't be allowed to get a drivers license and insurance.

I also mentioned that increases in education tend to bring down crime, and that California's prison rate is so high because we have strict enforcement rules and we have several laws which lead to increased prison populations, such as the 3 strikes law (which was recently removed) and lots of drug laws; eliminating those will help reduce the prison population.  My corker ignored those points and went back to work.

I suspect I will have to talk to him about it more, so any farkers want to jump in and give some actual good arguments against his points?
 
2013-11-16 11:18:28 AM

mgshamster: I was just talking about immigration reform with a coworker yesterday.  He thinks that illegal immigrants (specifically Mexicans, because he thinks they are by far the largest group of illegal aliens) are ruining the nation.  Between the extremely high proportion of prison populations, emergency room costs, driving without insurance (and causing accidents which we have to pay for), taking our jobs, general increase in crime, and bringing up our welfare and education costs, they provide no benefits.

I said that here in California, we have at least one of those covered; we recently passed a bill that would allow illegal immigrants to get a license and insurance.  He said that was bullshiat; illegal immigrants shouldn't be allowed to get a drivers license and insurance.

I also mentioned that increases in education tend to bring down crime, and that California's prison rate is so high because we have strict enforcement rules and we have several laws which lead to increased prison populations, such as the 3 strikes law (which was recently removed) and lots of drug laws; eliminating those will help reduce the prison population.  My corker ignored those points and went back to work.

I suspect I will have to talk to him about it more, so any farkers want to jump in and give some actual good arguments against his points?


Point 4) don't be an the douchebag that argues politics at work
 
2013-11-16 11:23:30 AM

mgshamster: I was just talking about immigration reform with a coworker yesterday.  He thinks that illegal immigrants (specifically Mexicans, because he thinks they are by far the largest group of illegal aliens) are ruining the nation.  Between the extremely high proportion of prison populations, emergency room costs, driving without insurance (and causing accidents which we have to pay for), taking our jobs, general increase in crime, and bringing up our welfare and education costs, they provide no benefits.

I said that here in California, we have at least one of those covered; we recently passed a bill that would allow illegal immigrants to get a license and insurance.  He said that was bullshiat; illegal immigrants shouldn't be allowed to get a drivers license and insurance.

I also mentioned that increases in education tend to bring down crime, and that California's prison rate is so high because we have strict enforcement rules and we have several laws which lead to increased prison populations, such as the 3 strikes law (which was recently removed) and lots of drug laws; eliminating those will help reduce the prison population.  My corker ignored those points and went back to work.

I suspect I will have to talk to him about it more, so any farkers want to jump in and give some actual good arguments against his points?


I prescribe a "Clockwork Orange"-like regimen of reality.
 
2013-11-16 11:24:04 AM
Can anyone name a political stance (besides a wide one) that the GOP has that is not a direct opposition of an existing stance that the President currently holds?
 
2013-11-16 11:26:39 AM

Heliovdrake: Can anyone name a political stance (besides a wide one) that the GOP has that is not a direct opposition of an existing stance that the President currently holds?


logically, that would mean that the every position the President holds is in direct opposition to the GOP. Maybe he's the problem?

/nope
 
2013-11-16 11:27:29 AM

Heliovdrake: Can anyone name a political stance (besides a wide one) that the GOP has that is not a direct opposition of an existing stance that the President currently holds?


Fellating the rich.
 
2013-11-16 11:27:35 AM

bulldg4life: Point 4) don't be an the douchebag that argues politics at work


Eh. Most of the conversation was over our lunch break. Plus, he brought it up, I suspect he'll bring it up again.
 
2013-11-16 11:28:20 AM
 
2013-11-16 11:30:04 AM

jake_lex: UNC_Samurai: It's a pretty serious technical issue - the Republicans can't find a workaround for their "president=#000000" error.

I think it's related to this code I found:

if (President == "black") {
    governing mode = "obstruct everything";


I found your bug.
 
2013-11-16 11:31:18 AM

Serious Black: The website is getting better. It's not up to initial specifications yet, but it is still much improved in many aspects. Two nights ago, I went from zero to ready to pay a premium in half an hour. That's a pretty good result I think.


This isn't directed at you SB - just your post made me think of something.

I'm starting to think the screwed up website was actually PART OF THE PLAN.

Sounds crazy, but let me walk through the admittedly tin-foilish idea.

Repubs are trying to cock-block the ACA really hard.  Advertising is limited, Red states are doing everything they can to make it be unsuccessful, as in nobody can do anything with it.

Solution?  Make it fail in a grotesque horrible fashion.

Now the problem is front and center.  Uncomfortable details like "Red state such and such decided not to participate so now you must use cluster fark of federal website" get plastered all over the place.  Night after night of free "You must get health insurance!" screaming from Fox News, reaching those people that won't look at anything else.

Website gets better over time.  It is just a damn web site.  Various people now are working 2.5x as hard to fix the problems, because nobody wants to become the target of a congressional hearing.  Ins. companies like to be kind of quiet and in the background.  So cooperation problems that might have been plaguing the program suddenly gets better.

Now we have the administration getting lots and lots of attention on the ACA.  Remember, there is no such thing as bad publicity.

I'm starting to wonder if the Trollmaster in chief is at it again, just with a longer game.  The other piece of evidence I have about this is that as far as I can tell, every state level exchange seems to be working just fine... and they have to report back into the HHS backend, plus interface with, in many cases, the same insurance companies... And that is working just fine.  Usually when a big project like this is a mess, it's a mess everywhere.  How come that isn't the case here?

I'm starting to suspect we've all been had.
 
2013-11-16 11:35:45 AM

mgshamster: I suspect I will have to talk to him about it more, so any farkers want to jump in and give some actual good arguments against his points?


Here's one: Most illegal immigrants will never access the services you list (driver's license, ER) because they are too afraid they will be reported to authorities and then deported. Where I live in SoCal, we regularly have issues trying to get people help because they are so afraid. The sexual predators that have been found in schools recently? Yeah, they preyed on kids they thought were from illegal immigrant homes, because they knew the families wouldn't go to the police. This is also why domestic violence is so bad, because the women can't go to the cops and report. I think this was one of the expansions to the Violence Against Women Act that the Republicans disagreed with.

/trying to convince her church to let her start a free ESL program for the neighborhood. If you don't want people to be exploited, you need to educate them
 
2013-11-16 11:39:06 AM
Boehner a year ago 'send us a comprehensive immigration bill, we will look at it'

Boehner now, 'we won't look at one, we want lots of little bills'.

Republicans will do or say anything to avoid doing their jobs.
 
2013-11-16 11:40:18 AM
Republicans can't pass gas. Democrats can't pass a turd.
 
2013-11-16 11:42:08 AM

MadHatter500: Serious Black: The website is getting better. It's not up to initial specifications yet, but it is still much improved in many aspects. Two nights ago, I went from zero to ready to pay a premium in half an hour. That's a pretty good result I think.

This isn't directed at you SB - just your post made me think of something.

I'm starting to think the screwed up website was actually PART OF THE PLAN.

Sounds crazy, but let me walk through the admittedly tin-foilish idea.

Repubs are trying to cock-block the ACA really hard.  Advertising is limited, Red states are doing everything they can to make it be unsuccessful, as in nobody can do anything with it.

Solution?  Make it fail in a grotesque horrible fashion.

Now the problem is front and center.  Uncomfortable details like "Red state such and such decided not to participate so now you must use cluster fark of federal website" get plastered all over the place.  Night after night of free "You must get health insurance!" screaming from Fox News, reaching those people that won't look at anything else.

Website gets better over time.  It is just a damn web site.  Various people now are working 2.5x as hard to fix the problems, because nobody wants to become the target of a congressional hearing.  Ins. companies like to be kind of quiet and in the background.  So cooperation problems that might have been plaguing the program suddenly gets better.

Now we have the administration getting lots and lots of attention on the ACA.  Remember, there is no such thing as bad publicity.

I'm starting to wonder if the Trollmaster in chief is at it again, just with a longer game.  The other piece of evidence I have about this is that as far as I can tell, every state level exchange seems to be working just fine... and they have to report back into the HHS backend, plus interface with, in many cases, the same insurance companies... And that is working just fine.  Usually when a big project like this is a mess, it's a mess everywhere.  How come that isn't the case here?

I'm starting to suspect we've all been had.


I don't know. I do think Obama has recently shown an ability to take advantage of opportunities of escape from possible disaster over and over again. He got Syria to sign the Chemical Weapons Convention and disarm without pulling the trigger. He held firm in the government funding and debt ceiling debacles and only gave up inconsequential things on ObamaCare. He put Zients in charge of rescuing healthcare.gov and they have made a lot of progress. I'm still happy to have him in office.
 
2013-11-16 11:43:02 AM

netcentric: NewportBarGuy: jim32rr: This is unnecessary, the amnesty of 1986 fixed the problem. It didn't? So how long after this amnesty will we have millions more clamoring for the next one?

As long as people still want to come here. They are the cord wood that fuels our economy and their future generations build us stronger as they integrate.

So America is thriving right now?

I saw on MSNBC that due to the FED pumping 85 billion a month to prop up the Stock and Bond markets... that Wall Street is thriving.

But is Main Street ?


Seems more like the top 5% are doing ok.


So what you're saying, then, is that Trickle-Down Economics doesn't work?
 
2013-11-16 11:48:36 AM

mgshamster: any farkers want to jump in and give some actual good arguments


Good arguments aren't going to change this guy's mind. He's arguing for the sake of arguing.
 
2013-11-16 11:51:30 AM

netcentric: So America is thriving right now?

I saw on MSNBC that due to the FED pumping 85 billion a month to prop up the Stock and Bond markets... that Wall Street is thriving.

But is Main Street ?


Seems more like the top 5% are doing ok.


The non-partisan Congressional Research Service has estimated the 10-year revenue loss from extending the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts beyond 2010 at $2.9 trillion, with an additional $606 billion in debt service costs (interest), for a combined total of $3.5 trillion.[31]

Keep inside the range fans, son. You are WAYYYYYYYY off target.
 
2013-11-16 11:53:21 AM
Can we just start calling the Tea Party by the more appropriate Modern Know Nothings?
 
2013-11-16 11:53:28 AM
House is not about to allow a distraction like Immigration Reform take the spotlight off of Obamacare. I haven't looked at the proposal too deeply, but is there anything in there that is a win for Republicans? They aren't about to hand the President another resume accomplishment because they're nice. (They're not nice.)
 
2013-11-16 11:56:31 AM

Krieghund: mgshamster: any farkers want to jump in and give some actual good arguments

Good arguments aren't going to change this guy's mind. He's arguing for the sake of arguing.


No, he isn't arguing at all. He is clinging to a scapegoating belief with no supporting facts and while people like him are very vocal they will go out of their way to avoid being forcedto make an argument.

At best you get a string of talking points. At worse I had a guy spend fifteen minutes telling me I supported Obama's lie 'you can keep it'. I had tried to cut things short by saying, from the beginning, "his statement was false" and ten minutes later was still being talked to as though I claimed it was true.

Honestly I was embarassed for the guy. His ignorance astounds.
 
2013-11-16 11:57:12 AM

WorldCitizen: Modern Know Nothings


They're more post-modern derp
 
2013-11-16 12:01:42 PM

mgshamster: I suspect I will have to talk to him about it more, so any farkers want to jump in and give some actual good arguments against his points?


Well, the 2013 immigration reform bill addresses all of that except the job-taking part... it will actually allow immigrants a potential path to citizenship, at which point they could presumably take his job (they couldn't before unless you're working a job where your employer is afraid of government oversight for some reason and doesn't bother to ping your identities at all... unlikely).

You might point out to him that the act only makes immigration  easier for two classes of people: kids brought here under the age of 14 who are not discovered until they're adults (DREAM Act), who will have to go to college and get a real job or join the army first to even apply for citizenship, and old people, who can in some cases get the english language requirement waived if they're moving here to join their families.

For everyone else... well, the bill has a massive beef-up of border security, legal penalties for both illegal immigrants and employers, and HUGE increases in the monitoring/enforcement systems that will put migrant workers continually under the eye of the cops while they're here (the new 'blue card' program).  Basically, the form the reform will take is mostly going to be a massive increase in deportations followed by a lot of funding to make sure the farkers stay gone.

In short, immigration reform is pretty much giving him what he wants in the case of this particular bill.  It's not even slightly an amnesty.
 
2013-11-16 12:07:13 PM
jake_lex: I think it's related to this code I found:

if (President = "black") {
    governing mode = "obstruct everything";



LOL Wut?

i651.photobucket.com

Let me help you out with a real language:

try {

  doing_er_jurbs( @legislation );

} catch BlackPresidentException with {

  hold_press_conference( $lameExcuse );
  fillibuster( $greenEggsAndHam );
  throw GovernmentShutdownException( "Is someone else's fault!" );

} finally {

  bless $bengaziConspiracy;
  $teabaggerCharisma++;

}
 
2013-11-16 12:07:21 PM

Smackledorfer: At best you get a string of talking points. At worse I had a guy spend fifteen minutes telling me I supported Obama's lie 'you can keep it'. I had tried to cut things short by saying, from the beginning, "his statement was false" and ten minutes later was still being talked to as though I claimed it was true.


What's his Fark handle?
 
2013-11-16 12:17:26 PM

jake_lex: UNC_Samurai: It's a pretty serious technical issue - the Republicans can't find a workaround for their "president=#000000" error.

I think it's related to this code I found:

if (President = "black") {
    governing mode = "obstruct everything";


looks like you might've been the lead developer on healthcare.gov
 
2013-11-16 12:18:37 PM
The GOP's postmortem following the 2012 election stated that passing immigration reform was absolutely necessary for the future of the Republican party. The Tea Baggers are not going to let that happen and are threatening to primary any Republican who signs on to this Senate bill.

Cantor's statement is a dog's breakfast of deflection and dis-ingenuity. He favored the Dream Act until recently when the Tea Baggers pointed out that children who became citizens would turn around and OMG!!1! sponsor their parent's citizenship. Even the most popular and least controversial of immigration reform ideas has been rejected by the Tea Baggers.

The House Republicans are on a leash and being led by the minority Tea Baggers in their party, a radical minority protected by gerrymandered districts, who are actively paralyzing the functioning of the US government. They have already cost the economy $24 billion with their totally unnecessary government shutdown, their attempt to overthrow the US democracy, and now they are holding all bills and appointments hostage, refusing to vote on popular bills and generally doing nothing productive.

Speaker John Boehner and the other spineless House Republican leaders show no signs of standing up to the radical Tea Baggers, or of any intention to do so in the foreseeable future, even though their own postmortem dictated that they pass immigration reform, even though the future of the GOP is at stake.
 
2013-11-16 12:19:04 PM
mgshamster: taking our jobs

As previously stated, the United States isn't producing enough babies by non-immigrants to prop up an aging population. See Japan if you want to see how bad things can be when you have a closed society that isn't producing enough babies and has more old people than children. So we need immigrants to take our jobs, because there just aren't enough Americans to fill some of these jobs. That's just the reality.

Of course you have to balance that with the fact that an increase in a supply of workers means a decrease in wages, but doing nothing is the most dangerous thing we can do and even though we've known about this problem for ages immigration reform is still unlikely to pass anytime soon. Mainly because of the far right.

What is clear is that to stay productive as a nation/competitive as a nation we need more sensible immigration laws to cope with reality. Especially when it comes to the agriculture business in the United States, you like to eat. I like to eat, and I'd rather not eat food produced by workers that were mistreated/raped/etc if we absolutely don't have to.

Immigration reform means growth to our economy ultimately, and while it isn't an easy issue to tackle we must do something and something soon. We are facing some of the most daunting problems in our history as a nation, we need to get past this inability to solve these critical problems. Which I suspect will only happen when the American people can come to agree on anything again. Or at least our political system.
 
2013-11-16 12:39:34 PM
You all laugh at the tea party but when you are replaced by a gay abortionista Mexican working for minimum wage who will be laughing then?
 
2013-11-16 12:48:50 PM

MadHatter500: Serious Black: The website is getting better. It's not up to initial specifications yet, but it is still much improved in many aspects. Two nights ago, I went from zero to ready to pay a premium in half an hour. That's a pretty good result I think.

This isn't directed at you SB - just your post made me think of something.

I'm starting to think the screwed up website was actually PART OF THE PLAN.

Sounds crazy, but let me walk through the admittedly tin-foilish idea.

Repubs are trying to cock-block the ACA really hard.  Advertising is limited, Red states are doing everything they can to make it be unsuccessful, as in nobody can do anything with it.

Solution?  Make it fail in a grotesque horrible fashion.

Now the problem is front and center.  Uncomfortable details like "Red state such and such decided not to participate so now you must use cluster fark of federal website" get plastered all over the place.  Night after night of free "You must get health insurance!" screaming from Fox News, reaching those people that won't look at anything else.

Website gets better over time.  It is just a damn web site.  Various people now are working 2.5x as hard to fix the problems, because nobody wants to become the target of a congressional hearing.  Ins. companies like to be kind of quiet and in the background.  So cooperation problems that might have been plaguing the program suddenly gets better.

Now we have the administration getting lots and lots of attention on the ACA.  Remember, there is no such thing as bad publicity.

I'm starting to wonder if the Trollmaster in chief is at it again, just with a longer game.  The other piece of evidence I have about this is that as far as I can tell, every state level exchange seems to be working just fine... and they have to report back into the HHS backend, plus interface with, in many cases, the same insurance companies... And that is working just fine.  Usually when a big project like this is a mess, it's a mess everywhere.  H ...


So basically, get the GOP to hang their criticism of the ACA on the fact that the website isn't working, then cut their legs out from under them by making the website work? Possible. Extremely high risk, though.
 
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