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(The New York Times)   DeBlasio begins the reshiattification of NYC schools, with aggressive-panhandler, corruption-enhancement, squeegee-man, public-defecation and sidewalk three-card-monte restoration programs to follow   (nytimes.com) divider line 32
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1945 clicks; posted to Politics » on 14 Nov 2013 at 7:53 AM (48 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-11-14 07:55:44 AM  
4 votes:
Yeah it's a real shame that Bloomberg can't clear out public schools to give his buddies free real estate to run their scam charter schools from.
2013-11-14 09:23:33 AM  
3 votes:

skullkrusher: HotWingConspiracy: Yeah it's a real shame that Bloomberg can't clear out public schools to give his buddies free real estate to run their scam charter schools from.

NYC charter schools are all non-profits


Ahahahahahahahahah holy shiat you continue to be an idiot. Only the formal corporation of the school must be nonprofit, and any schools employing a for-profit management company can keep it. The management companies have gone around that rather toothless rule quite easily. They hand out huge paychecks and bonuses to often nominal CEOs. The *only* requirement is that the charter school's base corporation make no profit and that new management contracts must be piecemeal. That's all.
2013-11-14 08:17:27 AM  
3 votes:

TofuTheAlmighty: Some charter schools are good, most are middling, and some are genuine scams. But the good charters rely on a labor model which is impossible to sustain - young, motivated teachers who work for peanuts.


Yep. And the "reformers" mostly just focus on the good ones and ignore all the shiatty ones when making their arguments.

It's also the case that many of the "good" charter schools pick and choose their students. Public schools can't (and shouldn't) do that.
2013-11-14 11:08:31 AM  
2 votes:
FTFA
Mr. de Blasio has denounced the letter grades, which were introduced in 2007, as blunt instruments that do not convey a nuanced portrait of a school's strengths and weaknesses.
Lis Smith, a spokeswoman for Mr. de Blasio, said on Wednesday that letter grades offered "little real insight to parents and are not a reliable indicator of how schools are actually performing."

Funny how this actually points out the complete uselessness of the current education system in general  which applies those same grading systems that offer little real insight and are blunt instruments that do not convey a nuanced portrait of a school's studentsstrengths and weaknesses
2013-11-14 10:48:13 AM  
2 votes:
Bloomberg, taken as a whole, is a massive ass. He's far too lenient to business interests, he's let new housing developments that no one making under six figures can even think about affording run amok, and his approach to education seems absolutely draconian.

I do like his environmental initiatives, though. But deBlasio's a pretty blue Democrat, so I don't think those are going anywhere.


/ The election was a landslide for a reason
// Virtually everyone is farking tired of Bloomberg and anyone associated with him and his policies
/// It never felt so good to fill out that (D) column on an election ballot
2013-11-14 09:52:24 AM  
2 votes:
Okay, here's how the school situation in NYC goes, as I understand it:

Bloomberg issues letter grades to schools on how they're doing. Invariably, for some unfathomable reason, all of the failing schools happen to be in minority heavy neighborhoods which don't have enough funding to deal with all the special needs and ESL students. The schools in the wealthy neighborhoods are just fine.

Bloomberg cuts funding to the minority-heavy neighborhood schools with low funding and bad letter grades. These schools get worse from budget shortfalls. Bloomberg gives them more failing grades. Then, Bloomberg will, pretty much unilaterally, close down the schools because they were failing. Now minority-heavy neighborhoods are losing their schools.

Bloomberg give charter schools favorable leases in the old school buildings so the old public school buildings now hold 3 or 4 different charter schools. The charter schools all have to share the same limited resources in the building (auditoriums, for instance, or computer labs). Also, since charter school admissions are done by lottery when there are more students than available seats, poor minority students might be forced to travel across town because no local charter school will take them.

Fark Bloomberg. He is a terrible mayor.
2013-11-14 09:43:34 AM  
2 votes:

PC LOAD LETTER: They can't see that it's incredibly hard to "slide back" to bad days


You're looking in the wrong direction. New York City has slid from prosperity into the shiatter before, most recently about 50 years ago under Lindsay and straight on through Dinkins. There's no reason the same mistakes can't be made again.

Detroit slid forward into the bad days and has stayed there for almost 50 years now.

Wall Street is to NYC what the auto industry was to Detroit, and if DeBlasio actually gets anywhere with his when-in-doubt-piss-on-rich-people strategy, the financial-sector golden goose that's been paying for New York's enormous public sector (and the sweet pensions that come with public-sector employment) will figure out that it doesn't have to live out its days being chased around the City Hall barnyard and can fly away to friendlier climates anywhere in the world.

And that'll bring the city the worst of both worlds - all the rich assholes still boutiquifying the city, while the businesses they run move to whatever location is friendliest to capital.

London in particular will be psyched.
2013-11-14 08:50:06 AM  
2 votes:

oryx: Ah, nostalgia for the Dinkins era by DeBlasio.


I love seeing Conservatives have a freaking fit over DeBlasio. It's like the whole Obama=Carter thing: living in the farking past IS THE PROBLEM WITH CONSERVATIVES. They can't see that it's incredibly hard to "slide back" to bad days, which is funny because they want to "slide back" to good days, particularly the ones that never existed.
2013-11-14 06:26:48 PM  
1 votes:

PC LOAD LETTER: Gulper Eel: Wall Street is to NYC what the auto industry was to Detroit,

No, it's not. Wall St. has been moving out for a few decades. And NYC has far more variety of businesses in play. This is a very simplistic view of NYC.


Of course that was completely wrong, but what he really meant to say is that public policy must always put the interests of the rich ahead of everything else, or else they'll go away to some place where they won't be taxed, like England!!!

Oh God I just laughed so hard I almost got a hernia.
2013-11-14 06:09:05 PM  
1 votes:

Gulper Eel: Wall Street is to NYC what the auto industry was to Detroit,


No, it's not. Wall St. has been moving out for a few decades. And NYC has far more variety of businesses in play. This is a very simplistic view of NYC.
2013-11-14 01:34:23 PM  
1 votes:

Gulper Eel: xsarien: The election was a landslide for a reason

Yeah, there are five Democrats for every one Republican in New York City. It's hard for even NYC Democrats to screw up with a head start like that but damned if they don't pull it off once in a while.


Welcome to NYC, where there's no law requiring a Democrat to vote for a Democrat or a Republican to vote for a Republican.

/ How's life in 'Murica?
2013-11-14 11:46:19 AM  
1 votes:

skullkrusher: HotWingConspiracy: skullkrusher: flynn80: FTFA
Mr. de Blasio has denounced the letter grades, which were introduced in 2007, as blunt instruments that do not convey a nuanced portrait of a school's strengths and weaknesses.
Lis Smith, a spokeswoman for Mr. de Blasio, said on Wednesday that letter grades offered "little real insight to parents and are not a reliable indicator of how schools are actually performing."

Funny how this actually points out the complete uselessness of the current education system in general  which applies those same grading systems that offer little real insight and are blunt instruments that do not convey a nuanced portrait of a school's studentsstrengths and weaknesses

IIRC, the letter grades are accompanied by a specific breakdown of what went into them. DeBlasio is going to keep that aspect but eliminate the letters. Presumably because the school's feelings get hurt they do not convey a nuanced portrait of a school's strengths and weaknesses . They will be replaced by participation ribbons that all schools will be permitted to wear on their front doors

Why would you need to presume something when you already had the answer from the source?

Well, first off it was a joke and secondly, the "nuanced" part comes with the breakdown which he is keeping. Why the hate for letter grades which summarize the content of that breakdown.


Because a lot of people won't look past the letter grade and make a lot of assumptions based on them.

 Does a star rating system on consumer reports reviews generate such ire? Of course not.

They also don't review schools, and a bad grade won't result in the shuttering of a company. At worst, this will merely lead to people actually reading the breakdown.
2013-11-14 11:24:51 AM  
1 votes:

TofuTheAlmighty: Some charter schools are good, most are middling, and some are genuine scams. But the good charters rely on a labor model which is impossible to sustain - young, motivated teachers who work for peanuts.


That's also the labor model that is screwing up the mediocre and bad charter schools. It takes a while for teachers to get a handle on managing a classroom. It's even harder when classes are larger. The average tenure of these young, idealistic teachers is three years most of them will just not be effective during those three years, especially since most of them have no training in teaching and classroom management.

Charter schools that are effective tend to follow the model used by the more effective private schools. Starting teachers are paid less, but pay equalizes as teachers gain experience. Teachers stick around because class sizes are much, much smaller. There is significantly less red tape in the better private schools. Teachers have more autonomy, and they have more control to actually teach.

Now, I am not suggesting that all private schools are great. There are certainly issues with a number of schools, but the better charter schools model themselves after the better private schools. And that is something that will never happen in public schools while thousands of different boards of eds are doing things thousands of different ways, and the one thing they all seem to agree on is that teachers are bad.
2013-11-14 10:40:34 AM  
1 votes:

skullkrusher: Again, he either for a company in an industry which works with 9% of NYC charter schools. Your attempt to smear a very popular program and relying on anecdotal information which applies to 9% of that program isn't terribly effective


I have access to the same information as everyone else, I've just arrived at a different conclusion than you. I'm hardly alone.
2013-11-14 10:25:15 AM  
1 votes:

sendtodave: If you think that your employer is engaging in fraud, you might want to report that.

Or not, whatever.


Had these conversations already. Picking your battles is hard. Getting rid of Joe Klein was a necessary precondition. The problem with Moskowitz is that what she does is horrible but legal, and that's why we had to replace the administration so other people could stop getting stonewalled. Bloomberg, Quinn, and a lot of the City Council that was just replaced were huge enablers. We are actually getting action on the special ed thing.

As for Sternberg, no further comment.

sendtodave: Does it work out to more than $20 grand per kid?


Yes, actually, not accounting for special ed. Remember, costs per student are driven up across the system because of the need to subsidize the charter schools - you have to cover land and maintenance and everything else for them, while the charter school covers nothing of that sort (which is why DeBlasio proposed charging rents). Charter schools get to socialize the special ed students out; if you have anything worse than ADHD, verbal processing disorders, or comparatively mild autism the charter schools effectively don't need to cover that.

Harlem Children's Academy is one of the rare cases where total spending is higher but it's for a good cause, and they're the only non-SUNY charter school that's ever demanded teachers' notes or bothered to check in on progress. They're pretty much the only charter school that helps out with students' lives, too. It's one of the rare examples of a successful charter school, although it really only works because outside donors have made it so well-funded as part of a propaganda operation. Teachers work for peanuts, though, and while turnover is less than at other charter schools there are enough starry-eyed TFA types (though few actual TFA alumni) that they don't have the churn that a lot of these places do.
2013-11-14 10:11:40 AM  
1 votes:

skullkrusher: glmorrs1: skullkrusher: My voting form was farked up so the machine wasn't scanning it. The lady at the machine checked to make sure all my circles were filled in properly and had a genuine look of surprise seeing I was voting for Blow a Lhota instead of Deblahsio. So easy to surprise people on the UWS.
Secret ballots though, not so much

Given your track record if being dishonest and full of shiat, I'm just gonna go ahead and say no, that didn't happen.

Yeah? Which track record is that? You have an example or 2? What about my little story is so unbelievable? Have you ever voted in NYC? There are election volunteers helping people at the
machines. If the machine isn't taking the ballot, they try to determine why. I live on the UWS where I am probably the only one who didn't vote for DeBlasio. Really stings when you're trying to nail someone and just come out looking the fool, doesn't it?


Dude, I've been around here for a while. I know your game, you're a contrarian. I've had you farkied as "Thinks trolling is playing devil's advocate" for a couple years at least.
2013-11-14 10:06:17 AM  
1 votes:

FLMountainMan: EyeballKid: Wanna bet the murders in NYC start getting more attention among right-wingers now?

If they go up because stop-and-frisk ends, then yeah, you probably will here from some of the more fascist right-wingers.  Neither you nor anyone else will care (and neocons won't genuinely care) because those shot will be 95% poor and black.


They just mentioned on NPR today how stop and frisk had a 1/10th of 1% success rate in catching "violent offenders" That number is probably mostly made up of people resisting arrest or assaulting a police officer who is trying to frisk your junk because you are black.
2013-11-14 10:03:11 AM  
1 votes:

RexTalionis: Okay, here's how the school situation in NYC goes, as I understand it:

Bloomberg issues letter grades to schools on how they're doing. Invariably, for some unfathomable reason, all of the failing schools happen to be in minority heavy neighborhoods which don't have enough funding to deal with all the special needs and ESL students. The schools in the wealthy neighborhoods are just fine.

Bloomberg cuts funding to the minority-heavy neighborhood schools with low funding and bad letter grades. These schools get worse from budget shortfalls. Bloomberg gives them more failing grades. Then, Bloomberg will, pretty much unilaterally, close down the schools because they were failing. Now minority-heavy neighborhoods are losing their schools.

Bloomberg give charter schools favorable leases in the old school buildings so the old public school buildings now hold 3 or 4 different charter schools. The charter schools all have to share the same limited resources in the building (auditoriums, for instance, or computer labs). Also, since charter school admissions are done by lottery when there are more students than available seats, poor minority students might be forced to travel across town because no local charter school will take them.

Fark Bloomberg. He is a terrible mayor.


You have the right of it, except that the lottery is itself a scam. You're strongly "encouraged" not to apply if your child has any special needs whatsover, and they can and will drive out the sped kids. One of my friends got blacklisted for complaining about that abuse, and his teaching cert has been unusable in the city since. We couldn't find a lawyer willing to take on Klein; the public advocate heard about it but we couldn't prove it to his satisfaction. DeBlasio can be kind of a coward, although I don't blame him too much on this one.

So you allude to him not knowing what he's talking about, then shiat on him as a hypocrite when it turns out that he does?

It's pretty classic.
2013-11-14 09:47:33 AM  
1 votes:

TofuTheAlmighty: Some charter schools are good, most are middling, and some are genuine scams. But the good charters rely on a labor model which is impossible to sustain - young, motivated teachers who work for peanuts.


As opposed to the old, indifferent, expensive teachers that work in public schools?
2013-11-14 09:45:36 AM  
1 votes:

skullkrusher: captainktainer: FLMountainMan: captainktainer: Also, charter schools are horrible. You have a couple of good ones, but lots of them are absolute scams and an absolute blight on the nation.

So they're public schools, but cheaper?

More expensive. Pretty universally.

Lemme guess... Public school teacher? Certainly not a parent of a good student in NYC


No, I work in and for charter schools. I'm one of the people making money off of the system. I know damned well how it works - how the SUNY-managed charter schools are the only ones who demand accountability and actually work fairly, while the others pay people like me outrageous rates on the taxpayers' dime.
2013-11-14 09:41:12 AM  
1 votes:
skullkrusher:

As for me "continuing to be an idiot" I don't recognize your name. I bet you really raked me over the coals one time in your mind though didn't have the nerve to speak up

You have been a blight on Fark for years. There's a reason why in every thread you show your face you are either ignored or roundly called out as an idiot. You have a talent for bullshiat, I'll give you that, but in every possible way you are a threadshiatter of the most annoying kind.
2013-11-14 09:33:55 AM  
1 votes:

glmorrs1: Given your track record if being dishonest and full of shiat, I'm just gonna go ahead and say no, that didn't happen.


Oh, come on! When have you ever seen an advocate for charter schools blatantly and unapologetically deceive people for their own sake?

www.washingtonpost.com
Okay, okay, aside from her...
2013-11-14 09:32:44 AM  
1 votes:
I'd just like to say that I hope the trend of electing people like this guy continues.
i255.photobucket.com
2013-11-14 09:28:22 AM  
1 votes:

skullkrusher: My voting form was farked up so the machine wasn't scanning it. The lady at the machine checked to make sure all my circles were filled in properly and had a genuine look of surprise seeing I was voting for Blow a Lhota instead of Deblahsio. So easy to surprise people on the UWS.
Secret ballots though, not so much


Given your track record if being dishonest and full of shiat, I'm just gonna go ahead and say no, that didn't happen.
2013-11-14 09:27:43 AM  
1 votes:

skullkrusher: HotWingConspiracy: Yeah it's a real shame that Bloomberg can't clear out public schools to give his buddies free real estate to run their scam charter schools from.

NYC charter schools are all non-profits


The administrators (excuse me, "CEOs") are paid ridiculous salaries for, in many cases, unproven or disappointing results.  As with much of Bloomberg's initiatives, the coddling of charters in public school buildings is easy to read as an attempt to "boil the frog" towards privatization of public services.
2013-11-14 08:55:53 AM  
1 votes:

BSABSVR: Is every DeBlasio thread going to involve the sky falling? It's amazing how Michael Bloomberg, gun-hatin' moral scold who wanted to take muh sody pops turned into the man who single-handedly kept New York from the abyss overnight.


Reminds me of all the Republicans in 2008 who had so many nice things to say about Hillary Clinton...once Barack Obama was the Democratic nominee. Wonder what they're saying about her now?


But, don't you DARE call them disingenuous!

/Because, honestly, most of them won't know what that word means.
2013-11-14 08:54:44 AM  
1 votes:

inglixthemad: TofuTheAlmighty: Some charter schools are good, most are middling, and some are genuine scams. But the good charters rely on a labor model which is impossible to sustain - young, motivated teachers who work for peanuts.

This. My cousin almost put her kids in a charter school, but went for a district run TAG school instead. This turned out to be a good thing as the charter school started dropping in the ranks, quickly.

Turns out they started losing good teachers who figured out they'd make more at UPS or the local office of whatever business. At those places they also didn't have to deal with snotty brats. Win / win for them.


Your cousin is smart.

On a related note, I know that our local teachers union is working on unionizing charter schools one school at a time out here in sunny So-Cal.  I wish them the best of luck.
2013-11-14 08:50:20 AM  
1 votes:
Lis Smith, a spokeswoman for Mr. de Blasio, said on Wednesday that letter grades offered "little real insight to parents and are not a reliable indicator of how schools are actually performing."
Mr. de Blasio has said he would continue to make available the detailed report cards that accompany the letter grades given to schools each year,



So, they are going to continue Bloombergs program but not give the letter grade that gives no real insight but publish the accompanying documentation that provieds the insight?  Sounds like butthurt to me.
2013-11-14 08:47:07 AM  
1 votes:
Is every DeBlasio thread going to involve the sky falling? It's amazing how Michael Bloomberg, gun-hatin' moral scold who wanted to take muh sody pops turned into the man who single-handedly kept New York from the abyss overnight.
2013-11-14 08:13:21 AM  
1 votes:

Dhusk: TRANSLATION OF HEADLINE:

Waaaaahhhhh, my guy lost!  I'm going to pout and biatch and post mean things about the winner online!  That will show them!


It;s not that this sort of thing is intrinsic to any point of view - but it is intrinsic ti human personalities who have become spoiled by too much success.
We stand at the end of the Reagan years. The Right had it's way with the nation for more than a quarter century, making huge progress toward their agenda on all but a few fronts.
Now, that political tide has been reversed, and is starting to flow backward. And a spoiled, complacent Right isn't taking it well.
In another couple of cycles, they'll become accustomed to getting their asses kicked, and quit whining so loud.
At that point, they will hopefully engage in some reflection, and move toward the center.
2013-11-14 08:02:47 AM  
1 votes:
TRANSLATION OF HEADLINE:

Waaaaahhhhh, my guy lost!  I'm going to pout and biatch and post mean things about the winner online!  That will show them!
2013-11-14 08:02:41 AM  
1 votes:
Some charter schools are good, most are middling, and some are genuine scams. But the good charters rely on a labor model which is impossible to sustain - young, motivated teachers who work for peanuts.
 
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