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(The American Prospect)   In 1960, the three biggest private-sector employers in the US were Ford, GM and AT&T. Today, the three biggest private-sector employers in the US are Walmart, Yum Brands and McDonalds. USA USA USA   (prospect.org) divider line 63
    More: Sad, Henry Ford, United States, Federal Reserve Chairman Paul Volcker, private-sector employers, barrel of oil, labor relations, Economic egalitarianism, United Steelworkers  
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806 clicks; posted to Business » on 13 Nov 2013 at 2:21 AM (41 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-11-12 10:11:26 PM
Honestly, that headline succinctly sums up today's economy.

Our entire economy is fueled by consumer spending. If you have most people earning less than $20/per hr, we ain't going to grow any better than 3% per year, and that's with the Fed propping it up.

The more you pay more people, the faster we grow. If you take half your bonus and half of your stock options across the board... you'll earn more. Trickle-UP economics DOES work. At least in our economy.

Look at the macro numbers. It's true.
 
2013-11-12 10:53:59 PM
So, the labor force is less unionized today than in 1960?
 
2013-11-13 12:09:34 AM
Convincing people to vote against their own economic interests has paid dividends beyond what the architects even imagined.
 You'd hope they'd look at their creation in horror, but all they would say is that it's still not enough.
 
2013-11-13 12:15:55 AM
U Sound fAt
U Sound fAt
U Sound fAt
 
2013-11-13 12:16:32 AM
i.imgur.com

U Sound fAt
U Sound fAt
U Sound fAt

/now with pic
 
2013-11-13 12:44:32 AM
Pointing this out is, like, communism or something.  CLASS WARFARE!!
 
2013-11-13 01:03:46 AM
yes, but taxes...
 
2013-11-13 01:56:52 AM
Well the Unions got theirs, so what's your point?
 
2013-11-13 02:40:43 AM
Give a poor man $100 and he can eat for a week.

Give a rich man $100 and he can wipe his ass.
 
2013-11-13 02:52:14 AM
the people of the USA do not do enough to discourage business and government from offshoring; we need trust busting and import tariffs.
 
2013-11-13 03:07:27 AM

soakitincider: the people of the USA do not do enough to discourage business and government from offshoring; we need trust busting and import tariffs.


In other words, you want a big fat black market.

Then, there will be more laws and more police enforcement and then more jails and so on. More "illegal" things.

Capitalism works for a reason.
 
2013-11-13 03:13:42 AM

mr0x: soakitincider: the people of the USA do not do enough to discourage business and government from offshoring; we need trust busting and import tariffs.

In other words, you want a big fat black market.

Then, there will be more laws and more police enforcement and then more jails and so on. More "illegal" things.

Capitalism works for a reason.


due to exploitation, capitalism requires Christianity; Christianity's great contribution is that it provides capitalism with a moral dimension that capitalism could not provide for itself. Its teachings about the necessity for moral restraint in the marketplace were rooted in biblical concerns for social justice, fair wages, and care for the poor. It incorporated the consistent biblical teaching about human dignity, including the dignity of honest labor. Exploitation is a terrible crime and is a factor in declining civilizations.
 
2013-11-13 03:14:02 AM
Welfare is Corporate Welfare. Corporations get away with not paying a living wage because the government steps in and essentially subsidizes big business through food stamps, welfare, and other programs for their underpaid workers. But the Wal-Mart family needs another $50 billion, so too bad on that whole raising the minimum wage thing.
 
2013-11-13 03:22:14 AM
And in 1960, 1/3rd of the private sector was unionized. I wonder how many of those McDonalds and Wal Mart workers were raised believing that "union" is a dirty word.

Our shiat from China is made by slaves. Either we're cool with slavery or we aren't.
 
2013-11-13 03:46:16 AM

soakitincider: the people of the USA do not do enough to discourage business and government from offshoring; we need trust busting and import tariffs.


Just tax the shiat out of any company that outsources its workforce. And hand out a tax break for every American worker they hire. Easy.
 
2013-11-13 03:59:50 AM
Great Article.

Got my pitchfork ready.
 
2013-11-13 04:27:16 AM
freedomoutpost.com

Something something GIANT SUCKING SOUND something something
,
 
2013-11-13 04:35:28 AM
Well, with everyone working minimum wage and living in poverty, at least your country doesn't have to worry about the next generation producing a glut of scientists and engineers.
 
2013-11-13 05:07:25 AM
This is the service economy that Ronald Reagan dreamed of.  You get what you vote for.
 
2013-11-13 05:12:11 AM
I was listening to our FOX radio station on the way home from work today.  They mentioned that in January Missouri's minimum wage will go from $7.35 to $7.50 an hour.  They were joking that "Oh boy!  That extra $.15 is really going to help these poor people!" 

Scum, pure scum.  I hope these two DJ's lose their jobs and have to go to work flipping burgers.  Instead, they will probably be promoted for sounding out about the poor and how liberals are ruining this great country of theirs.
 
2013-11-13 05:18:44 AM

Bigdogdaddy: I was listening to our FOX radio station on the way home from work today.  They mentioned that in January Missouri's minimum wage will go from $7.35 to $7.50 an hour.  They were joking that "Oh boy!  That extra $.15 is really going to help these poor people!" 

Scum, pure scum.  I hope these two DJ's lose their jobs and have to go to work flipping burgers.  Instead, they will probably be promoted for sounding out about the poor and how liberals are ruining this great country of theirs.


secretly they were excited about the raise they were getting.
 
2013-11-13 05:30:55 AM

Old enough to know better: soakitincider: the people of the USA do not do enough to discourage business and government from offshoring; we need trust busting and import tariffs.

Just tax the shiat out of any company that outsources its workforce. And hand out a tax break for every American worker they hire. Easy.


I would also consider that if you want to do business in the USA, a certain percentage of your workforce has to be in the USA. (like 20-50%)
 
2013-11-13 06:48:52 AM

Bigdogdaddy: I was listening to our FOX radio station on the way home from work today.  They mentioned that in January Missouri's minimum wage will go from $7.35 to $7.50 an hour.  They were joking that "Oh boy!  That extra $.15 is really going to help these poor people!" 

Scum, pure scum.  I hope these two DJ's lose their jobs and have to go to work flipping burgers.  Instead, they will probably be promoted for sounding out about the poor and how liberals are ruining this great country of theirs.


I agree with the DJs completely. $15.70 sounds a lot better.
// Okay we could probably start with like $9.50 in Missouri but still
 
2013-11-13 06:51:50 AM

soakitincider: Old enough to know better: soakitincider: the people of the USA do not do enough to discourage business and government from offshoring; we need trust busting and import tariffs.

Just tax the shiat out of any company that outsources its workforce. And hand out a tax break for every American worker they hire. Easy.

I would also consider that if you want to do business in the USA, a certain percentage of your workforce has to be in the USA. (like 20-50%)


No. That won't work. You think Apple owns the factories that the iCrap is produced in?

/not that Samesung is better, but they don't try to claim to be American
 
2013-11-13 07:04:17 AM

chiett: Well the Unions got theirs, so what's your point?


Modern conservative:"Hey, them Union guys actually get paid a living wage while I don't! Well, I ain't gonna join no union! I'll work my ass off to be sure they don't get paid a dime more than I do! That way the big boys at the top can have more stuff!"
 
2013-11-13 07:09:32 AM

Goimir: soakitincider: Old enough to know better: soakitincider: the people of the USA do not do enough to discourage business and government from offshoring; we need trust busting and import tariffs.

Just tax the shiat out of any company that outsources its workforce. And hand out a tax break for every American worker they hire. Easy.

I would also consider that if you want to do business in the USA, a certain percentage of your workforce has to be in the USA. (like 20-50%)

No. That won't work. You think Apple owns the factories that the iCrap is produced in?

/not that Samesung is better, but they don't try to claim to be American


it would work if people make it a requirement.
 
2013-11-13 07:32:39 AM

Goimir: You think Apple owns the factories that the iCrap is produced in?


Heh, I'm a fan of Apple stuff, but I find their little "Designed by Apple in California" stamped on everything insufferably patronizing.
 
2013-11-13 07:35:26 AM

KeatingFive: chiett: Well the Unions got theirs, so what's your point?

Modern conservative:"Hey, them Union guys actually get paid a living wage while I don't! Well, I ain't gonna join no union! I'll work my ass off to be sure they don't get paid a dime more than I do! That way the big boys at the top can have more stuff!"

This is something that never made sense - 'Those Union guys get good stuff and better treatment than me! Why do we allow those union thugs to exist?'

Shouldn't it be - 'Those Union guys get good stuff and better treatment than me! Why am I not fighting for better treatment?'
 
2013-11-13 07:44:34 AM

shower_in_my_socks: Welfare is Corporate Welfare. Corporations get away with not paying a living wage because the government steps in and essentially subsidizes big business through food stamps, welfare, and other programs for their underpaid workers. But the Wal-Mart family needs another $50 billion, so too bad on that whole raising the minimum wage thing.


Hmmm. Interesting. I guess we should get rid of food stamps, welfare, and other programs then.

If your economic theory is correct, without that subsidy, "big business" will have to pay higher wages. Plus we'll save tons of tax money through lower social spending and can use that for debt reduction. Win win. It's worth a shot. Sign me up for your newsletter.
 
2013-11-13 07:56:48 AM

Aar1012: Shouldn't it be - 'Those Union guys get good stuff and better treatment than me! Why am I not fighting for better treatment?'


It should, but I work with some of the "poors" ( eg rednecks & hicks) ; and most of them are pretty brainwashed, IMHO.  Mass media such as talk radio & FOX News has done an outstanding job in molding public opinion.

/ Kudos to my boss for getting Limbaugh & Savage perma-banned from my workplace...
 
2013-11-13 07:59:14 AM

Taima: [freedomoutpost.com image 600x404]

Something something GIANT SUCKING SOUND something something
,


NAFTA probably would have been fine and it would have benefited far more people in the US and Mexico had we not also given China Favored Nation status as well.
 
2013-11-13 08:00:32 AM
There is no law preventing companies from paying their employees more than the farking lowest amount possible by law...

Also, unions hold no power in this kind of economy..look at Detroit..look at recently that whole hostess Twinkie thing, they could not do shiat for no body..


The cwa keeps funding occupy movement in hopes to bring life back to their dying breed
 
2013-11-13 08:43:27 AM

shower_in_my_socks: And in 1960, 1/3rd of the private sector was unionized. I wonder how many of those McDonalds and Wal Mart workers were raised believing that "union" is a dirty word.

Our shiat from China is made by slaves. Either we're cool with slavery or we aren't.


Like the man said, Capitalism works for a reason.
 
2013-11-13 08:46:20 AM

GoldSpider: Goimir: You think Apple owns the factories that the iCrap is produced in?

Heh, I'm a fan of Apple stuff, but I find their little "Designed by Apple in California" stamped on everything insufferably patronizing.


You can even get away with saying made in Europe, or the USA, if you move your made in China products around the right way.
 
2013-11-13 08:58:21 AM

Aar1012: KeatingFive: chiett: Well the Unions got theirs, so what's your point?

Modern conservative:"Hey, them Union guys actually get paid a living wage while I don't! Well, I ain't gonna join no union! I'll work my ass off to be sure they don't get paid a dime more than I do! That way the big boys at the top can have more stuff!"
This is something that never made sense - 'Those Union guys get good stuff and better treatment than me! Why do we allow those union thugs to exist?'

Shouldn't it be - 'Those Union guys get good stuff and better treatment than me! Why am I not fighting for better treatment?'


of course it should be, but who wants to be on the wrong side of a game of corporate whack-a-mole?

/"I've got a line 30 deep of people who I can get by tomorrow to do your job cheaper"
// quoting my former employer
 
2013-11-13 09:09:09 AM
I told you how much better our lives would be once we got rid of those stifling unions.
 
2013-11-13 09:14:42 AM

shower_in_my_socks: And in 1960, 1/3rd of the private sector was unionized. I wonder how many of those McDonalds and Wal Mart workers were raised believing that "union" is a dirty word.

Our shiat from China is made by slaves. Either we're cool with slavery or we aren't.


Well, couldn't the argument be made that the unionization of ford and GM are the reasons they don't employ as many people now? I'm not going to argue against the right to organize, but unions generally demand higher wages for employees, and high wage disparity is why so many auto jobs were moved elsewhere. Just saying.

Also, Chinese factory workers FLOCKED to the factories because it was better than being a subsistence farmer in the countryside. The working conditions might look awful to you, but they are apparently appealing enough to the Chinese that they actively seek factory employment.
 
2013-11-13 09:17:15 AM

Bigdogdaddy: I was listening to our FOX radio station on the way home from work today.  They mentioned that in January Missouri's minimum wage will go from $7.35 to $7.50 an hour.  They were joking that "Oh boy!  That extra $.15 is really going to help these poor people!" 

Scum, pure scum.  I hope these two DJ's lose their jobs and have to go to work flipping burgers.  Instead, they will probably be promoted for sounding out about the poor and how liberals are ruining this great country of theirs.


Take it for what you will, but more than enough people in minimum wage occupations who have said that a fifteen cent increase is a slap in the face because it won't result in any change of their standard of living.
 
2013-11-13 09:24:07 AM

Debeo Summa Credo: shower_in_my_socks: And in 1960, 1/3rd of the private sector was unionized. I wonder how many of those McDonalds and Wal Mart workers were raised believing that "union" is a dirty word.

Our shiat from China is made by slaves. Either we're cool with slavery or we aren't.

Well, couldn't the argument be made that the unionization of ford and GM are the reasons they don't employ as many people now? I'm not going to argue against the right to organize, but unions generally demand higher wages for employees, and high wage disparity is why so many auto jobs were moved elsewhere. Just saying.

Also, Chinese factory workers FLOCKED to the factories because it was better than being a subsistence farmer in the countryside. The working conditions might look awful to you, but they are apparently appealing enough to the Chinese that they actively seek factory employment.


In some ways high wage costs lead to the increased the rate of the mechinization of the manufacturing and assembly lines but we would be where we are currently with or without the unions.

If we can have a process where an illiterate chinese ex farmer turned urbanite to be trained to assemble/manufacutre to a high enough quality in a matter of days.... what actually does a union offer?
 
2013-11-13 09:25:50 AM

Suckmaster Burstingfoam: Well, with everyone working minimum wage and living in poverty, at least your country doesn't have to worry about the next generation producing a glut of scientists and engineers.


Yeah, the US still produces the most college educated populace per capita in the world. Besides would you really trust a Chinese engineer? Hell their farking buildings fall over before they have finished building them.

Chinese science students like Indian science students score very high on standardized tests that reward them for regurgitating facts and figures. Unfortunately put some scientific reasoning in front of them, like what you see on the ACT and they fail miserably. They don't know how to take fact A and fact B to get to C, it is just not part of what they were taught.

So, you can spew that whole American decline bullshiat all you want, but it is not true. While China is rising, they have a very long way to go and by mid-century might be equivalent to a European country like England, France or Germany, but it is not guaranteed they will ever surpass the US.
 
2013-11-13 09:32:37 AM

Aar1012: KeatingFive: chiett: Well the Unions got theirs, so what's your point?

Modern conservative:"Hey, them Union guys actually get paid a living wage while I don't! Well, I ain't gonna join no union! I'll work my ass off to be sure they don't get paid a dime more than I do! That way the big boys at the top can have more stuff!"
This is something that never made sense - 'Those Union guys get good stuff and better treatment than me! Why do we allow those union thugs to exist?'

Shouldn't it be - 'Those Union guys get good stuff and better treatment than me! Why am I not fighting for better treatment?'


Maybe it has something to do with the recent performance of those industries which have tended to be heavily unionized in the past.  They've been shedding the fark out of jobs and the new contracts are only marginally better than the previous ones -- and sometimes worse.  Companies have declared bankruptcy and/or folded completely, leaving union retirees with a pittance of their negotiated retirement benefits, if any at all.

There has to be an assessment made of the long-term value of belonging to a union in these times.  I don't have any idea what that value is, but people need to stop reading from the pamphlets passed out in 1962 outlining the benefits they can get.  That train left the station long ago and it's not coming back.
 
2013-11-13 09:43:49 AM

Saiga410: Debeo Summa Credo: shower_in_my_socks: And in 1960, 1/3rd of the private sector was unionized. I wonder how many of those McDonalds and Wal Mart workers were raised believing that "union" is a dirty word.

Our shiat from China is made by slaves. Either we're cool with slavery or we aren't.

Well, couldn't the argument be made that the unionization of ford and GM are the reasons they don't employ as many people now? I'm not going to argue against the right to organize, but unions generally demand higher wages for employees, and high wage disparity is why so many auto jobs were moved elsewhere. Just saying.

Also, Chinese factory workers FLOCKED to the factories because it was better than being a subsistence farmer in the countryside. The working conditions might look awful to you, but they are apparently appealing enough to the Chinese that they actively seek factory employment.

In some ways high wage costs lead to the increased the rate of the mechinization of the manufacturing and assembly lines but we would be where we are currently with or without the unions.

If we can have a process where an illiterate chinese ex farmer turned urbanite to be trained to assemble/manufacutre to a high enough quality in a matter of days.... what actually does a union offer?


Very few young Chinese are illiterate. Farmers son's or no.
 
2013-11-13 09:46:42 AM
What many people don't acknowledge is that the golden age from 1947 to the mid-seventies was the result of WWII.  Japan and Europe suffered such incredible amounts of damage in terms of human capital and manufacturing infrastructure and the rest of the world was so backwards that the US had barely any competition.  That created loads of money and secure jobs for most people.

Lots of people grew up and worked in that environment and it shaped their views of how things should be.  Guys, let go.  That model was sustainable because of a lack of competition.  There's some pretty aggressive competition from all over the world now.  The glory days are over.
 
2013-11-13 10:03:22 AM

Lance Russell's Nose: What many people don't acknowledge is that the golden age from 1947 to the mid-seventies was the result of WWII.  Japan and Europe suffered such incredible amounts of damage in terms of human capital and manufacturing infrastructure and the rest of the world was so backwards that the US had barely any competition.  That created loads of money and secure jobs for most people.

Lots of people grew up and worked in that environment and it shaped their views of how things should be.  Guys, let go.  That model was sustainable because of a lack of competition.  There's some pretty aggressive competition from all over the world now.  The glory days are over.



Hmmm....the irony there is that all those bombed out factories in Germany and Japan were rebuilt with post-war dollars....and end up being better and more efficient than our non-bobmbed out factories.
 
2013-11-13 10:09:12 AM

Lance Russell's Nose: What many people don't acknowledge is that the golden age from 1947 to the mid-seventies was the result of WWII.  Japan and Europe suffered such incredible amounts of damage in terms of human capital and manufacturing infrastructure and the rest of the world was so backwards that the US had barely any competition.  That created loads of money and secure jobs for most people.

Lots of people grew up and worked in that environment and it shaped their views of how things should be.  Guys, let go.  That model was sustainable because of a lack of competition.  There's some pretty aggressive competition from all over the world now.  The glory days are over.


yup.

Hitler did more for the quality of life in the USA than any union ever did.
/still a major asshole
 
2013-11-13 10:49:17 AM

Lance Russell's Nose: What many people don't acknowledge is that the golden age from 1947 to the mid-seventies was the result of WWII. Japan and Europe suffered such incredible amounts of damage in terms of human capital and manufacturing infrastructure and the rest of the world was so backwards that the US had barely any competition. That created loads of money and secure jobs for most people.

Lots of people grew up and worked in that environment and it shaped their views of how things should be. Guys, let go.



I would say the same thing to the Federal Government. They still spend money and institute laws and programs like we are on the gravy train.
 
2013-11-13 11:03:31 AM

soakitincider: Old enough to know better: soakitincider: the people of the USA do not do enough to discourage business and government from offshoring; we need trust busting and import tariffs.

Just tax the shiat out of any company that outsources its workforce. And hand out a tax break for every American worker they hire. Easy.

I would also consider that if you want to do business in the USA, a certain percentage of your workforce has to be in the USA. (like 20-50%)


And with either of those ideas, the company just divides into two different companies: Megacorp America and Megacorp International. Megacorp International has all the outsourced parts of the business and "sells" to Megacorp America.
 
2013-11-13 11:09:42 AM

Lance Russell's Nose: What many people don't acknowledge is that the golden age from 1947 to the mid-seventies was the result of WWII.  Japan and Europe suffered such incredible amounts of damage in terms of human capital and manufacturing infrastructure and the rest of the world was so backwards that the US had barely any competition.  That created loads of money and secure jobs for most people.

Lots of people grew up and worked in that environment and it shaped their views of how things should be.  Guys, let go.  That model was sustainable because of a lack of competition.  There's some pretty aggressive competition from all over the world now.  The glory days are over.


Yeah.

...

Yeah.

Well, I think we'll be pretty well equipped to compete with the emerging markets. We already have wealth inequality similar to them, and we don't seem to care for big social safety nets.

Maybe all this "we should be more like Europe," socially and economically, is wrong. Maybe we really to be more like China, India, and Brazil to compete globally.
 
2013-11-13 11:13:39 AM
We are slowly being returned to slavery. Little, by little. You hardly notice it, don't you? Now get back to work.
 
2013-11-13 11:22:36 AM

Vectron: Lance Russell's Nose: What many people don't acknowledge is that the golden age from 1947 to the mid-seventies was the result of WWII. Japan and Europe suffered such incredible amounts of damage in terms of human capital and manufacturing infrastructure and the rest of the world was so backwards that the US had barely any competition. That created loads of money and secure jobs for most people.

Lots of people grew up and worked in that environment and it shaped their views of how things should be. Guys, let go.


I would say the same thing to the Federal Government. They still spend money and institute laws and programs like we are on the gravy train.


Like the sequester?
 
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