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(Guardian)   The Swedes have run out of garbage to fuel their power plants, were recently criticized for speaking English better than any English-speaking country, and are now closing prisons due to lack of criminals. WTF, Sweden?   (theguardian.com) divider line 49
    More: Spiffy, English language, crimes, convicts, public-benefit corporation, refuses, fuels, prison populations, speeches  
•       •       •

5372 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Nov 2013 at 8:28 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



49 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2013-11-12 08:04:17 AM  
Lagom.
 
2013-11-12 08:32:22 AM  
well it sounds like arrest quotas work. god, sweden, do I have to do everything?
 
2013-11-12 08:33:59 AM  
A clear endorsement of conservative social policies.
 
2013-11-12 08:34:22 AM  
Just make a joint punishable by 10 years in prison like here in the States.  Their prisons will be overflowing in no time.
 
2013-11-12 08:35:05 AM  
Clean, English-speaking, low crime, AND Swedish chicks?

i140.photobucket.com

Count me in.
 
2013-11-12 08:39:10 AM  
Seriously we have twice as many people in prison as China? Does anyone see anything wrong here.
 
2013-11-12 08:39:20 AM  
Id move there if it weren't so damn cold
 
2013-11-12 08:42:29 AM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail: Seriously we have twice as many people in prison as China? Does anyone see anything wrong here.


yup. big business have got their hand on the tiller though. and someone said on here yesterday that high rates of violent crime in the states are due to the large numbers of people living on low incomes, and the rich/poor divide
 
2013-11-12 08:42:33 AM  

Random Anonymous Blackmail: Seriously we have twice as many people in prison as China? Does anyone see anything wrong here.


Not the for-profit prison industry, that's for sure.
 
2013-11-12 08:44:10 AM  
Time to go looking for a job there
 
2013-11-12 08:48:09 AM  
I like the idea of being more lenient for minor offenses.  I also wish our system was more rehabilitative than punitive.  Also, if we would spend money on mental health care and provide hospitals and facilities for severely mentally ill, that could also help reduce prison populations.
 
2013-11-12 08:48:17 AM  
Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, and although there are loads of social democrats, they do not hold the majority in parliament at the moment.

The misunderstanding regarding Sweden's progressiveness stems from early sex-ed movies that used legal loopholes to show live sex in "mainstream" movies. These were all gobbled up by an even more sexually repressed world and 40 years later people still believe Sweden is a forward thinking country.

The facts are that Sweden is nowadays the country where the government knows what's best for you. First, about alcohol. The gov. rarely issue liquor licenses for new bars, which leads to a skewed supply and demand situation. This leads to loads of aggravation among the bar-goers, so almost every bar has bouncers. These muscular broilers can beat you to a pulp and with the aided assistance of equally muscular pals within the police forces you can get beaten up by both bouncers and cops, as well as prosecuted for assault in one evening. Don't try to start a claim against the cops. You are more likely to become an astronaut in your lifetime than win in court against the Swedish police. There are known cases of cops killing civilians (google Osmo Vallo ) by standing on his back, in front of multiple witnesses, without any other repercussions other than a minor fine (for letting their police-dog join in the killing).

Regarding other drugs. Sweden moved from narcotics being supplied to heavy users in pharmacies, to one of the most drug-repressive societies in the world. If a cop thinks that you might be stoned, you can be dragged away to a police station for a blood sample or urine sample. This is sometimes put into system at certain clubs, where large parts of the clientele could find themselves being brutalized by cops before the evening is over. This method is (afaik) only used in one other place, the dictatorship of Thailand.

Regarding search and seizure. Cops do not need warrants to search your person or your premises. Cops can use any kind of evidence against you , even though it has been illegally obtained. (google fri bevisprovning).

Regarding the tapping of electronic communications. A recent law makes it mandatory for all electronic communications providers to give out access points to an organization called FRA (similar to NSA). This enables the FRA to roam around all electronic traffic at will.

Prostitution. In a radical turn from the tolerant attitude of the sixties, hookers are now seen as ignorant children in need of the society's protection, whether they like it or not. Their customers are now breaking the law and could get sent to jail.

Torture. Sweden has handed over asylum seekers to U.S. authorities, who in turn flew them down to Egypt where they were tortured.
 
2013-11-12 09:09:38 AM  

alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, and although there are loads of social democrats, they do not hold the majority in parliament at the moment.

The misunderstanding regarding Sweden's progressiveness stems from early sex-ed movies that used legal loopholes to show live sex in "mainstream" movies. These were all gobbled up by an even more sexually repressed world and 40 years later people still believe Sweden is a forward thinking country.

The facts are that Sweden is nowadays the country where the government knows what's best for you. First, about alcohol. The gov. rarely issue liquor licenses for new bars, which leads to a skewed supply and demand situation. This leads to loads of aggravation among the bar-goers, so almost every bar has bouncers. These muscular broilers can beat you to a pulp and with the aided assistance of equally muscular pals within the police forces you can get beaten up by both bouncers and cops, as well as prosecuted for assault in one evening. Don't try to start a claim against the cops. You are more likely to become an astronaut in your lifetime than win in court against the Swedish police. There are known cases of cops killing civilians (google Osmo Vallo ) by standing on his back, in front of multiple witnesses, without any other repercussions other than a minor fine (for letting their police-dog join in the killing).

Regarding other drugs. Sweden moved from narcotics being supplied to heavy users in pharmacies, to one of the most drug-repressive societies in the world. If a cop thinks that you might be stoned, you can be dragged away to a police station for a blood sample or urine sample. This is sometimes put into system at certain clubs, where large parts of the clientele could find themselves being brutalized by cops before the evening is over. This method is (afaik) only used in one other place, the dictatorship of Thailand.

Regarding search and seizure. Cops do not need warrants to search your pers ...


ALICE_600: CRUSHER OF DREAMS.
 
2013-11-12 09:10:49 AM  

alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, and although there are loads of social democrats, they do not hold the majority in parliament at the moment.

The misunderstanding regarding Sweden's progressiveness stems from early sex-ed movies that used legal loopholes to show live sex in "mainstream" movies. These were all gobbled up by an even more sexually repressed world and 40 years later people still believe Sweden is a forward thinking country.

The facts are that Sweden is nowadays the country where the government knows what's best for you. First, about alcohol. The gov. rarely issue liquor licenses for new bars, which leads to a skewed supply and demand situation. This leads to loads of aggravation among the bar-goers, so almost every bar has bouncers. These muscular broilers can beat you to a pulp and with the aided assistance of equally muscular pals within the police forces you can get beaten up by both bouncers and cops, as well as prosecuted for assault in one evening. Don't try to start a claim against the cops. You are more likely to become an astronaut in your lifetime than win in court against the Swedish police. There are known cases of cops killing civilians (google Osmo Vallo ) by standing on his back, in front of multiple witnesses, without any other repercussions other than a minor fine (for letting their police-dog join in the killing).

Regarding other drugs. Sweden moved from narcotics being supplied to heavy users in pharmacies, to one of the most drug-repressive societies in the world. If a cop thinks that you might be stoned, you can be dragged away to a police station for a blood sample or urine sample. This is sometimes put into system at certain clubs, where large parts of the clientele could find themselves being brutalized by cops before the evening is over. This method is (afaik) only used in one other place, the dictatorship of Thailand.

Regarding search and seizure. Cops do not need warrants to search your pers ...


Show us on the doll where Sweden touched you.
 
2013-11-12 09:25:49 AM  

alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, and although there are loads of social democrats, they do not hold the majority in parliament at the moment.

Regarding search and seizure. Cops do not need warrants to search your pers ...


Ever been there? Or just find a nice copy-paste to use from Yahoo! Answers (yes, there's a slim chance you're the original author, but I doubt it, probably just a troll)?

I thought Sweden's reputation for progressiveness stemmed more from the Nordic Welfare model coexisting with thriving capitalism, not some sex in movies.
The characterization of the alcohol scene is utterly ridiculous (at least in Stockholm).
Cops still need probably cause.
Drugs & surveillance, don't know.
Prostitution, they aren't progressive because they don't allow prostitution? What?
Torture...it was decided 5 years later that the given "diplomatic assurances" that there would be no torture or use of the death penalty weren't strict enough, but in those two isolated cases, it is Sweden that is the bad guy? Not the US or Egypt? Yes, perhaps they could have been more stringent in their requirements...

/first generation Swedish-American
//got trolled
///don't care because fark you, that's why
 
2013-11-12 09:26:00 AM  
Another fine example of failed socialism.  Are you listening, Obama?
 
2013-11-12 09:43:02 AM  

socoloco: If a cop thinks that you might be stoned, you can be dragged away to a police station for a blood sample or urine sample.


=================

A few years ago a Croatian guy in Sweden was hauled in by a female Swedish cop because she was convinced that his big muscles were the result of illegal steroid use.  After testing the guy, it was determined that he was not using steroids.....just another beefy east European dude.  No word on if the female Swedish cop stripped searched the guy.
 
2013-11-12 09:43:30 AM  
But wait, there's more...ABBA is thinking of a reunion next year.  Wacky Sweden.
 
2013-11-12 09:48:16 AM  
Why are there no countries this awesome that DON'T have sub-zero weather more often than not?  What is it about decent weather that turns people into douchebags?
 
2013-11-12 09:52:14 AM  
Cops still need probably cause.

Damn fingers on autopilot. Hehe. Probably cause.
 
2013-11-12 10:09:13 AM  

alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, derp, derp


Do you know how I know you do not know crap about Sweden?
 
2013-11-12 10:31:55 AM  
nuke sweden .
 
2013-11-12 10:34:00 AM  

alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, and although there are loads of social democrats, they do not hold the majority in parliament at the moment.


Wouldn't exactly rate social democrats as progressive, ever since Palme they have rather been turning left and left the middle/progressiveness to the Swedish conservatives.

The misunderstanding regarding Sweden's progressiveness stems from early sex-ed movies that used legal loopholes to show live sex in "mainstream" movies. These were all gobbled up by an even more sexually repressed world and 40 years later people still believe Sweden is a forward thinking country.

This is absolutely not true, Nyfiken Gul started a Swedish sexual revolution but it was rather Erlander and social democrats in late 60's through multiple social reforms that started the progressiveness.

The facts are that Sweden is nowadays the country where the government knows what's best for you. First, about alcohol. The gov. rarely issue liquor licenses for new bars, which leads to a skewed supply and demand situation. This leads to loads of aggravation among the bar-goers, so almost every bar has bouncers. These muscular broilers can beat you to a pulp and with the aided assistance of equally muscular pals within the police forces you can get beaten up by both bouncers and cops, as well as prosecuted for assault in one evening. Don't try to start a claim against the cops. You are more likely to become an astronaut in your lifetime than win in court against the Swedish police. There are known cases of cops killing civilians (google Osmo Vallo ) by standing on his back, in front of multiple witnesses, without any other repercussions other than a minor fine (for letting their police-dog join in the killing).

Bouncers are hardly unique to Sweden, nor is police brutality but that aside I fail to see how this would further your point. Regarding alcohol politics, the politics have eased up a lot with deregulation and less bureaucracy, when I grew up the alcohol politics were far more draconian.

Regarding other drugs. Sweden moved from narcotics being supplied to heavy users in pharmacies, to one of the most drug-repressive societies in the world. If a cop thinks that you might be stoned, you can be dragged away to a police station for a blood sample or urine sample. This is sometimes put into system at certain clubs, where large parts of the clientele could find themselves being brutalized by cops before the evening is over. This method is (afaik) only used in one other place, the dictatorship of Thailand.

Ehh... no, this is just blatantly false heavy drugs were never supplied by pharmacies with intent for abuse. Drug tests have been done since early 70's so hardly new, but police are not really interested in small amounts of "recreational drugs". Even so, drug consumers are almost never seen as criminals, rather victims that need help, dealers will have a different story in their interaction though.

Regarding search and seizure. Cops do not need warrants to search your person or your premises. Cops can use any kind of evidence against you , even though it has been illegally obtained. (google fri bevisprovning).

This is blatantly false, Swedish police absolutely need warrants to search your person or property, however you are correct in the sense that the courts are free to consider all evidence presented without regards to how this evidence was obtained, but this is more to do with the fact that the Swedish justice system does not have a jury. Also a fact to remember is that paired with this is the freedom for judges to decide legal weight of the presented evidence in their deliberation.

Regarding the tapping of electronic communications. A recent law makes it mandatory for all electronic communications providers to give out access points to an organization called FRA (similar to NSA). This enables the FRA to roam around all electronic traffic at will.

No difference from anywhere else, however Swedish people have voiced extreme concern leading to public hearings and calls for limitations in FRA powers.

Prostitution. In a radical turn from the tolerant attitude of the sixties, hookers are now seen as ignorant children in need of the society's protection, whether they like it or not. Their customers are now breaking the law and could get sent to jail.

This is one area I do agree with you, it is a bit absurd with the present law.

Torture. Sweden has handed over asylum seekers to U.S. authorities, who in turn flew them down to Egypt where they were tortured.

Two Egyptians, this happened in 2001 when US exerted enormous pressure and 9/11 was a current event, the two men have since then been released, got €400,000 and permanent residency in Sweden. The events also led to Sweden not doing this again.

Sorry for long reply
 
2013-11-12 11:25:45 AM  
Socialism bad!  Moar Guns!  Creationism!  Deregulate everything!  Lock up ALL the black people!  Drill baby, drill!

I hate this country.
 
2013-11-12 11:26:26 AM  
Sweden. Yes.

i66.servimg.com

I like snow more and more every day.
 
2013-11-12 11:31:05 AM  
Her name is Inga, and she's from Sweden  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4DgO6Ttn7rU
 
2013-11-12 11:42:09 AM  
Excuse me while I pack my bags.
dakiniland.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-11-12 12:08:59 PM  
Article fails to mention rampant Muslim gang rapes.
 
2013-11-12 12:40:58 PM  

Clemkadidlefark: Article fails to mention rampant Muslim gang rapes.


Wow, someone's blog from 2005. How can they ignore that?!
 
2013-11-12 01:00:05 PM  

Fissile: A few years ago a Croatian guy in Sweden was hauled in by a female Swedish cop because she was convinced that his big muscles were the result of illegal steroid use.


Professional competitive bodybuilders use steroids and don't even pretend not to.  The top-level competitions are international.  Are Swedes excluded from professional bodybuilding?
 
2013-11-12 01:03:07 PM  

H31N0US: Random Anonymous Blackmail: Seriously we have twice as many people in prison as China? Does anyone see anything wrong here.

Not the for-profit prison industry, that's for sure.


The for-profit prison industry is small potatoes compared to the prison guards' union. The more you arrest, the more guards you need - especially in overcrowded complexes.
 
2013-11-12 01:05:09 PM  

alice_600: Regarding the tapping of electronic communications. A recent law makes it mandatory for all electronic communications providers to give out access points to an organization called FRA (similar to NSA). This enables the FRA to roam around all electronic traffic at will.


Well at least it's legal under their laws. You have to give them some credit for matching their laws to their practices.
 
2013-11-12 01:41:13 PM  

alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, and although there are loads of social democrats, they do not hold the majority in parliament at the moment.

The misunderstanding regarding Sweden's progressiveness stems from early sex-ed movies that used legal loopholes to show live sex in "mainstream" movies. These were all gobbled up by an even more sexually repressed world and 40 years later people still believe Sweden is a forward thinking country.

The facts are that Sweden is nowadays the country where the government knows what's best for you. First, about alcohol. The gov. rarely issue liquor licenses for new bars, which leads to a skewed supply and demand situation. This leads to loads of aggravation among the bar-goers, so almost every bar has bouncers. These muscular broilers can beat you to a pulp and with the aided assistance of equally muscular pals within the police forces you can get beaten up by both bouncers and cops, as well as prosecuted for assault in one evening. Don't try to start a claim against the cops. You are more likely to become an astronaut in your lifetime than win in court against the Swedish police. There are known cases of cops killing civilians (google Osmo Vallo ) by standing on his back, in front of multiple witnesses, without any other repercussions other than a minor fine (for letting their police-dog join in the killing).

Regarding other drugs. Sweden moved from narcotics being supplied to heavy users in pharmacies, to one of the most drug-repressive societies in the world. If a cop thinks that you might be stoned, you can be dragged away to a police station for a blood sample or urine sample. This is sometimes put into system at certain clubs, where large parts of the clientele could find themselves being brutalized by cops before the evening is over. This method is (afaik) only used in one other place, the dictatorship of Thailand.

Regarding search and seizure. Cops do not need warrants to search your pers ...


So same as USA then?
 
2013-11-12 01:48:08 PM  
Times are tough all over.

I hear that every year, dozens of pretty Swedish girls have to cut their long-flowing blonde hair because they get wax in their hair while wearing crowns of candles to celebrate the Solstice.
 
2013-11-12 01:54:56 PM  

Enigmamf: alice_600: Regarding the tapping of electronic communications. A recent law makes it mandatory for all electronic communications providers to give out access points to an organization called FRA (similar to NSA). This enables the FRA to roam around all electronic traffic at will.

Well at least it's legal under their laws. You have to give them some credit for matching their laws to their practices.


Being legal somehow makes it ok?

What a farked up thing to say.
 
2013-11-12 01:57:05 PM  

Enigmamf: H31N0US: Random Anonymous Blackmail: Seriously we have twice as many people in prison as China? Does anyone see anything wrong here.

Not the for-profit prison industry, that's for sure.

The for-profit prison industry is small potatoes compared to the prison guards' union. The more you arrest, the more guards you need - especially in overcrowded complexes.


Seriously?  You right wing nutjobs are going to try to blame this on unions?

Bullshiat and shenanigans.
 
2013-11-12 02:46:00 PM  
Sounds like the same number of criminals, they just aren't being sent to prison.
 
2013-11-12 03:05:46 PM  
Number of people in...

New York City area:           23 million
Los Angeles area:             12 million
Chicago area:                    9 million
entire country of Sweden:  9 million

What Sweden has done is admirable but it's hard to match the achievements of other countries when your population is 35 times greater than theirs is, covers multiple time zones and has a wide variety of cultures.
 
2013-11-12 03:24:18 PM  
So the US is exactly like Sweden.

if superman was flying around the earth against the rotation really really fast
 
2013-11-12 04:34:41 PM  

Pharque-it: alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, derp, derp

Do you know how I know you do not know crap about Sweden?


I work with four other people from Europe two of them is from the Netherlands one immigrated from Sweden.
 
2013-11-12 04:44:04 PM  

sten: alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, and although there are loads of social democrats, they do not hold the majority in parliament at the moment.

Regarding search and seizure. Cops do not need warrants to search your pers ...

Ever been there? Or just find a nice copy-paste to use from Yahoo! Answers (yes, there's a slim chance you're the original author, but I doubt it, probably just a troll)?

I thought Sweden's reputation for progressiveness stemmed more from the Nordic Welfare model coexisting with thriving capitalism, not some sex in movies.
The characterization of the alcohol scene is utterly ridiculous (at least in Stockholm).
Cops still need probably cause.
Drugs & surveillance, don't know.
Prostitution, they aren't progressive because they don't allow prostitution? What?
Torture...it was decided 5 years later that the given "diplomatic assurances" that there would be no torture or use of the death penalty weren't strict enough, but in those two isolated cases, it is Sweden that is the bad guy? Not the US or Egypt? Yes, perhaps they could have been more stringent in their requirements...

/first generation Swedish-American
//got trolled
///don't care because fark you, that's why


sten: alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

Sweden is not really progressive, and although there are loads of social democrats, they do not hold the majority in parliament at the moment.

Regarding search and seizure. Cops do not need warrants to search your pers ...

Ever been there? Or just find a nice copy-paste to use from Yahoo! Answers (yes, there's a slim chance you're the original author, but I doubt it, probably just a troll)?

I thought Sweden's reputation for progressiveness stemmed more from the Nordic Welfare model coexisting with thriving capitalism, not some sex in movies.
The characterization of the alcohol scene is utterly ridiculous (at least in Stockholm).
Cops still need probably cause.
Drugs & surveillance, don't know.
Prostitution, they aren't progressive because they don't allow prostitution? What?
Torture...it was decided 5 years later that the given "diplomatic assurances" that there would be no torture or use of the death penalty weren't strict enough, but in those two isolated cases, it is Sweden that is the bad guy? Not the US or Egypt? Yes, perhaps they could have been more stringent in their requirements...

/first generation Swedish-American
//got trolled
///don't care because fark you, that's why


The grass is always greener on the side of the fence. Sweden looks pretty but if you ask your parents why they came here you would see why they changed yards.
 
2013-11-12 04:58:51 PM  

alice_600: sten: alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden

The grass is always greener on the side of the fence. Sweden looks pretty but if you ask your parents why they came here you would see why they changed yards.


Except I've spent a significant amount of time there...and post-WW2 Europe was just a little bit different than the past couple decades. Our grass may have been greener then, but now it's infested with crabgrass and is otherwise yellow and diseased.

So did you just find that old and horribly incorrect anti-Swedish tirade or write it yourself several years ago and dust it off for today's thread?
 
2013-11-12 05:39:08 PM  
Yeah, Sweden, you think you're great, but what's your record for the most citizens anally violated by peace officers in one month?

Check and mate, you tight-rectumed liberty queens.
 
2013-11-12 09:53:12 PM  

DarkVader: Enigmamf: H31N0US: Random Anonymous Blackmail: Seriously we have twice as many people in prison as China? Does anyone see anything wrong here.

Not the for-profit prison industry, that's for sure.

The for-profit prison industry is small potatoes compared to the prison guards' union. The more you arrest, the more guards you need - especially in overcrowded complexes.

Seriously?  You right wing nutjobs are going to try to blame this on unions?

Bullshiat and shenanigans.


You're not from California, so I excuse your ignorance. The prison guard union is not a strictly Democratic Party aligned union - they spend 2:1 for Democrats (not unusual in a state that elects Democrats 2:1), but do not support the kinds of issues and politicians supported by other unions. They lobby exclusively in-state, routinely lobby for priorities that are in direct contradiction with the Democratic Party in California - for example, in 2008, they spent $1 million to try to defeat a proposition that replaced prison for certain nonviolent drug offenders with treatment and rehabilitation.

So opposing the prison guards' union would not be the province of "right-wing nutjobs"
 
2013-11-12 11:22:28 PM  

dbrunker: Number of people in...

New York City area:           23 million
Los Angeles area:             12 million
Chicago area:                    9 million
entire country of Sweden:  9 million

What Sweden has done is admirable but it's hard to match the achievements of other countries when your population is 35 times greater than theirs is, covers multiple time zones and has a wide variety of cultures.


I never understood these type of arguments, we can't do this because there are too many of us, or we set clocks one hour ahead of the guys over there...
You don't do it because you don't want to, it's that easy.
 
2013-11-12 11:51:51 PM  
Well, duh. They are Swedes.
 
2013-11-13 03:06:32 AM  

Clemkadidlefark: Article fails to mention rampant Muslim gang rapes.


So you follow Brevik's blog then?

Bet you knit him scarfs too.
 
2013-11-13 10:06:45 AM  

eurotrash: dbrunker: Number of people in...

New York City area:           23 million
Los Angeles area:             12 million
Chicago area:                    9 million
entire country of Sweden:  9 million

What Sweden has done is admirable but it's hard to match the achievements of other countries when your population is 35 times greater than theirs is, covers multiple time zones and has a wide variety of cultures.

I never understood these type of arguments, we can't do this because there are too many of us, or we set clocks one hour ahead of the guys over there...
You don't do it because you don't want to, it's that easy.


To continue the point, Germany has a population of ~82M, Japan ~127M, France and the UK are around 60M or so I think... Does it matter if the factor isn't 35x, but 5x or 2.5x?

You're right on, such reforms and ways of life can be achieved at larger scales.
 
2013-11-13 11:04:59 AM  

alice_600: Before you all go Yeah Sweden


Yeah, but....

SWEDISH CHICKS!
 
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