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(NBC News)   U.S. officials are going to destroy their massive six-ton stockpile of illegal ivory this week, hoping to send a zero-tolerance message to elephant poachers   (nbcnews.com) divider line 146
    More: Spiffy, United States, stockpiles, National Wildlife Refuge, Association of Zoos  
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3820 clicks; posted to Main » on 11 Nov 2013 at 11:40 PM (41 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-11-11 08:01:22 PM
One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.
 
2013-11-11 08:08:58 PM

cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.


It's actually pretty easy once you get past the initial difficulty of making a synthetic elephant.
 
2013-11-11 08:11:30 PM

SmackLT: cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.

It's actually pretty easy once you get past the initial difficulty of making a synthetic elephant.


True

But I am pretty sure that this can be solved. Just hop in Obama's time machine and bring back all the elephants from the past to the present. That should surely solve it.
 
2013-11-11 08:12:35 PM
The farking poachers have moved to poisoning watering holes to kill the elephants.

I say you turn the ivory into bullets and shoot the assholes.
 
2013-11-11 08:24:55 PM

SmackLT: cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.

It's actually pretty easy once you get past the initial difficulty of making a synthetic elephant.


You can make a synthetic elephant  after you smoke some synthetic cannabis.

/or so the kids have told me
 
2013-11-11 08:33:46 PM
I think we should just flood the market with the ivory and drive the price down. Take the profit away from the poachers.
 
2013-11-11 08:34:49 PM

cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phytelephas

Tagua nut.
 
2013-11-11 08:35:21 PM

scottydoesntknow: The farking poachers have moved to poisoning watering holes to kill the elephants.

I say you turn the ivory into bullets and shoot the assholes.



I like the way you think.
 
2013-11-11 08:36:18 PM

simplicimus: I think we should just flood the market with the ivory and drive the price down. Take the profit away from the poachers.


Came to say this.
And all the profit from the sales of said ivory should go to conservation efforts.
 
2013-11-11 09:00:06 PM
the poachers or the middle-men they sold that ivory to?
 
2013-11-11 09:21:53 PM
This is just another ploy to kill the elephants and reduce all wildlife by the US government. Both Democrats and Republicans do it. By destroying the ivory instead of selling it and donating the funds to wildlife groups we have a situation where funds are being diverted and wasted, and demand is not being slacked off. Why not satisfy the demand and transfer the money to conservation efforts? It tackles the problem from both sides. Its not like destroying the ivory releases the elephant soul and allows it to be reborn. But no, this anti-future cabal that exists in first world countries is the problem. They will do anything to destroy the environment, from burying the electric car and related technology 10 years ago to dragging their heels on alternative energy implementation. You see their real goal is to drive our environment to the ground and create a scarcity of ecology. Charging people more to go to zoos to see the only animals still alive, long after their noble cousins have been slaughtered in the wild or left to die when their forests and meadows were destroyed. There is nothing these people will not do in order to make a profit, nothing is sacred and nothing will stop them unless we pull together and take action.
First it starts with ivory and elephants, and then we let them poison the great lakes with Asian Carp.
The senators claim they are raising the alarm to fix these problems but only when it affects profits from another region. In this case tourism:  http://www.csmonitor.com/Environment/2013/1107/Senators-raise-alarm-o v er-Asian-carp-invasion-in-Great-Lakes-video. $7 billion has to be on the line before someone takes notice, otherwise its okay to left them play god and destroy the environment. But even when money is on the line no real action is taken. The army corp of Engineers? Really? The same one that built the levees in New Orleans before Katrina? They are corrupt to the core. New Orleans was allowed to drown not because Bush hates black people, or Republicans don't care, but because Republicans and Democrats both were trying to destroy the ecology and future of the region so they could profit off scarcity. It became even more obvious when they let the BP spill go on for so long. Obama claims to be an environmentalist but he has bought into the ecological-scarcity-energy sector complex that is driving this conspiracy to destroy our world. He is probably a ranking member of the cabal. It took 87 days to close the oil spill. 87 days. It doesn't take that long to form an implement a plan on satellite adjustment, or save astronauts out of air, but we can't plug a hole here on Earth? We need to educate ourselves on the facts of the situation:  http://www.dosomething.org/tipsandtools/11-facts-about-bp-oil-spill. Its the wildlife and the wildlands that are being purged systematically by our politicians, progressives and conservatives, everything else they fight on is just show. When they control all the resources and the last pieces of livable and arable land their domination will be complete. Then what will we do? We will be forced to pay exorbitant prices to go to private zoos that don't even take care of the animals. Not only that they actively hurt them!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/25/meghan-mogensen-reston-zoo_ n_ 1625560.html
It's not a tragedy of the commons, they are fencing off their own little portion and burning the rest. Creating artificial demand to secure their profits for the future. How many people died from Katrina for this, or in the Philippines as from that massive Typhoon. They want global warming to keep happening to destroy these communities, these ecologies. It's not just the wild areas that are threat either. They are systematically buying up land 3-4 miles inland so as communities get washed away by erosion and storms they will soon have beachfront property. The most valuable of all property. Then and only then will they take action to restore the environment and status quo. Just enough so massive storms don't destroy their new ill-begotten gains, but not enough to restore the national parks that are being shutdown and logged right under our noses. That's the real reason for the government shutdown last month so that loggers could go in and destroy trees that take THOUSANDS of years to grow. Ancient and priceless forests are being destroyed and there were no witnesses to cry foul. They will destroy our wild life, our lands, our parks, take our beachfront property, and force us to their private zoos of animal cruelty to even enjoy a little bit of nature. And they will charge us through the nose while we live in our concrete cages slaving a way under them.

Even PETA is a front for them. Designed and formed to distract from the real issues and to make the environmental movement looks nuts. Well its not gonna work forever, soon you and everyone else will have to realize that this cabal is completing a heinous conspiracy to destroy ivory and other goods and deprive our world of the resources it needs to combat sprawl and ecological-degradation. Action needs to be taken soon, like occupy wall street, but instead of occupying the few parks and natural spaces in our cities we need to occupy the skyscrapers and turn them into urban gardens so that we can root out the corruption and begin renewing our cities simultaneously.  PEOPLE WHO DESTROY IVORY ARE WORSE THAN THE DEVIL!
 
433 [TotalFark]
2013-11-11 09:34:05 PM

Alunan: This is just another ploy to kill the elephants and reduce all wildlife by the US government.


You lost me at hello.
 
2013-11-11 09:35:32 PM

Asa Phelps: the poachers or the middle-men they sold that ivory to?


Why not chip the ivory and track down everyone involved?
 
2013-11-11 09:39:31 PM

cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.


That's how movies were invented.

The first synthetic ivory was used in billard balls, but sounded like gunshots when they hit, so they were unpopular. The company making the balls discovered you could make long, thin strips of the stuff and this technology of photography was getting more advanced at just the right time.
 
2013-11-11 09:48:20 PM
I don't know why poachers aren't hunted on safari and ground into aphrodisiacs.
 
2013-11-11 10:01:30 PM
Hey it's not like we're in troubling financial times, let's just destroy everything of value to "teach a lesson" to the bad guys.
 
2013-11-11 10:04:16 PM
It's a nice gesture, but doesn't this just drive up the price of ivory? Seems like an idea cooked up by the folks fighting the "drug war."

/poachers a scum
 
2013-11-11 10:23:35 PM

violentsalvation: I don't know why poachers aren't hunted on safari and ground into aphrodisiacs.


This. We need to convince the so-called "Traditional Chinese Medicine" idiots that poacher parts are the panacea they have been looking for, and not rhino horn as they so believe. Then the problem will take care of itself and we can hopefully save a few woefully endangered species.

/yeah, I realize this thread is about ivory, which is not AFAIK used in TCM
//but still, they are poachers, so convince the TCMers that they need to be... harvested.
 
2013-11-11 10:28:26 PM

cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.


We have. It's called "plastic."
 
2013-11-11 10:29:21 PM

simplicimus: I think we should just flood the market with the ivory and drive the price down. Take the profit away from the poachers.


Or keep selling it and arresting/fining everyone that buys it. Rinse repeat. Use those proceeds for conservation.
 
2013-11-11 11:01:20 PM

violentsalvation: I don't know why poachers aren't hunted on safari and ground into aphrodisiacs.


A ranger makes $200 a month or less. A tusk brings in $20,000 or more.

You really want to save elephants? Employ the Africans.
 
2013-11-11 11:37:45 PM

Alunan: This is just another ploy to kill the elephants and reduce all wildlife by the US government. Both Democrats and Republicans do it. By destroying the ivory instead of selling it and donating the funds to wildlife groups we have a situation where funds are being diverted and wasted, and demand is not being slacked off. Why not satisfy the demand and transfer the money to conservation efforts? It tackles the problem from both sides. Its not like destroying the ivory releases the elephant soul and allows it to be reborn. But no, this anti-future cabal that exists in first world countries is the problem. They will do anything to destroy the environment, from burying the electric car and related technology 10 years ago to dragging their heels on alternative energy implementation. You see their real goal is to drive our environment to the ground and create a scarcity of ecology. Charging people more to go to zoos to see the only animals still alive, long after their noble cousins have been slaughtered in the wild or left to die when their forests and meadows were destroyed. There is nothing these people will not do in order to make a profit, nothing is sacred and nothing will stop them unless we pull together and take action.
First it starts with ivory and elephants, and then we let them poison the great lakes with Asian Carp.
The senators claim they are raising the alarm to fix these problems but only when it affects profits from another region. In this case tourism:  http://www.csmonitor.com/Environment/2013/1107/Senators-raise-alarm-o v er-Asian-carp-invasion-in-Great-Lakes-video. $7 billion has to be on the line before someone takes notice, otherwise its okay to left them play god and destroy the environment. But even when money is on the line no real action is taken. The army corp of Engineers? Really? The same one that built the levees in New Orleans before Katrina? They are corrupt to the core. New Orleans was allowed to drown not because Bush hates black people, o ...


You should probably take your pills now.
 
2013-11-11 11:41:53 PM

impaler: cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.

We have. It's called "plastic."


I dunno...the keys on my Yamaha DJX keyboard don't have the same weighted feel as my 1897 Ivers and Pond Upright.
 
2013-11-11 11:44:11 PM
So they created a new market? Brilliant.
 
2013-11-11 11:44:13 PM
teensleuth.com
ok...
 
2013-11-11 11:44:37 PM
I think the message is, "Illegal ivory is now more expensive since there is now a sudden drop in supply. Who wants to get paid?"
 
2013-11-11 11:45:10 PM
And all you people suggesting Alunan is a crock...I dunno...that's not totally impossible. Or maybe it's the next Hollywood hit.
 
2013-11-11 11:45:47 PM

scottydoesntknow: I say you turn the ivory into bullets and shoot the assholes.


The problem is large areas that are difficult to patrol from the ground.

Luckily, we now have flying robots of death that can autonomously patrol large areas looking for possible poachers.

An ivory hellfire missile for every one of them.
 
2013-11-11 11:46:10 PM
I dunno. I mean, it is art, even if poaching is really shiatty. We aren't throwing away extant books bound in human skin even though anthropodermic bibliopegy isn't legal anymore.
 
2013-11-11 11:46:17 PM
Alunan:

I... um. Wat?
 
2013-11-11 11:47:26 PM
Is posting a wall of text a new Fark meme? Too long to read. This ain't Slashdot, link that stuff!
 
2013-11-11 11:47:27 PM
Oh I didn't realize every museum was full.
 
2013-11-11 11:47:39 PM

Sudo_Make_Me_A_Sandwich: scottydoesntknow: I say you turn the ivory into bullets and shoot the assholes.

The problem is large areas that are difficult to patrol from the ground.

Luckily, we now have flying robots of death that can autonomously patrol large areas looking for possible poachers.

An ivory hellfire missile for every one of them.


I'm also pretty sure that ivory wouldn't make for good ammunition, except for maybe arrow points or spear tips. The material is too soft to withstand such things, I would think. But I'd be perfectly fine with shooting poachers with poisoned darts made of ivory. Maybe one of those really farked up poisons that torture you to death before you die.
 
2013-11-11 11:47:50 PM
This is one of those solutions that feels good when you do it, but has the opposite effect of what you are aiming for.  But, it's OK because it made you feel better about yourself when you did it.
 
2013-11-11 11:49:37 PM
In related news.  Ivory price has just gone up, driving more poachers to find the risk worthwhile.
 
2013-11-11 11:49:49 PM
I'd rather they destroy six tons worth of poachers instead. That'll send the correct message.
 
2013-11-11 11:50:57 PM

jaylectricity: impaler: cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.

We have. It's called "plastic."

I dunno...the keys on my Yamaha DJX keyboard don't have the same weighted feel as my 1897 Ivers and Pond Upright.


.....wut?

You think the ivory is the reason for that?
 
2013-11-11 11:53:11 PM

Don't Troll Me Bro!: In related news.  Ivory price has just gone up, driving more poachers to find the risk worthwhile.


That's kind of the impression I got. This is a knee-jerk feel-good reaction to a highly complicated issue that does little more than destroy extremely expensive works of art, that while illegal, is still art.

I'm also sure that no mistakes were made whatsoever and that none of the ivory works of art are actually mammoth ivory from Siberia which is 100% legal, considering just how impeccable the governments record is.
 
2013-11-11 11:54:36 PM

simplicimus: I think we should just flood the market with the ivory and drive the price down. Take the profit away from the poachers.


I think that will just drive the poachers to find new markets, which will ultimately increase demand, and then once the short-term supply of ivory flooding the market dries up, that new demand will have to be satisfied somehow, and that will have a longer term impact on the remaining elephants.

That is, if the flood of supply starts people thinking that it's ok to buy/sell/own ivory, what happens when that short-term supply dries up?

(that's how I understand it at least)
 
2013-11-11 11:58:59 PM

pdieten: jaylectricity: impaler: cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.

We have. It's called "plastic."

I dunno...the keys on my Yamaha DJX keyboard don't have the same weighted feel as my 1897 Ivers and Pond Upright.

.....wut?

You think the ivory is the reason for that?


No...but it makes me happy that you are smart enough to know that there was something wrong with my post. I was actually hoping for somebody to notice the brand of piano I brought up. Mostly because it was tougher than expected to google the name of a piano that used actual ivory for their keys.
 
2013-11-12 12:00:33 AM
i.imgur.com
 
2013-11-12 12:02:29 AM
A few things:

First, we're not above exploitation to make a buck so calling out other people for doing so is a bit hypocritical.

Second: Destroying ivory that has already been collected will have zero impact on the poachers. They've already gotten their money. The only result will be to increase scarcity, thereby driving prices up. The poachers themselves will probably just shake their heads at our stupidity and have a laugh about their good fortune as market prices go up.

Third: If you want to stop the poaching there are several things that could be tried. For instance, perfect cloning technology, clone some elephants, and harvest the ivory for sale. Long term if you want to stop the poaching you have to provide the poachers with an alternative means of making a living but this takes time and money. Or we send in sniper teams to track the poachers down and shoot them.
 
2013-11-12 12:02:46 AM

simplicimus: I think we should just flood the market with the ivory and drive the price down. Take the profit away from the poachers.


You think anyone in the government knows how supply and demand works?!

I like the idea of making bullets out of them and shooting the poachers! We could sell hunting licenses!

I wonder how well the bullets would fragment on impact.
 
2013-11-12 12:03:42 AM

impaler: simplicimus: I think we should just flood the market with the ivory and drive the price down. Take the profit away from the poachers.

Or keep selling it and arresting/fining everyone that buys it. Rinse repeat. Use those proceeds for conservation.


This is the best idea ever.
 
2013-11-12 12:05:04 AM
I imagine there are people who feel about this the way we feel about the Taliban blowing up the Buddahs of Bamiyan.
 
2013-11-12 12:07:35 AM

HighZoolander: simplicimus: I think we should just flood the market with the ivory and drive the price down. Take the profit away from the poachers.

I think that will just drive the poachers to find new markets, which will ultimately increase demand, and then once the short-term supply of ivory flooding the market dries up, that new demand will have to be satisfied somehow, and that will have a longer term impact on the remaining elephants.

That is, if the flood of supply starts people thinking that it's ok to buy/sell/own ivory, what happens when that short-term supply dries up?

(that's how I understand it at least)


Pretty much. Government animal control programs in the US are required to dispose of the pelts rather than selling them for profits to prevent corruption, which would cause the main objective to be getting pelts (bobcat) rather than predator control (coyote but this is BS).

Same thing with wild boar hunts. National and state parks have a wild boar infestation. Hunters tell the parks they have a way of solving this and everyone wins. Problem is the bureaucrats know that the hunters know it is not in their best interest to kill all of the pigs (if the hunting gets slow you go to greener pastures) and it encourages hunters to introduce pigs into places they otherwise would not be able to hunt.

The government does a lot of things the general public does not understand. That does mean they do not know what they are doing.
 
2013-11-12 12:08:55 AM
I thought they needed it  for DNA to see where are the poachers hotspots are.
 
2013-11-12 12:09:21 AM

Don't Troll Me Bro!: In related news.  Ivory price has just gone up, driving more poachers to find the risk worthwhile.


Why would the price go up? These items have already been removed from the market. They have been sitting in a warehouse for up to 25 years.

Besides, 6 tons is unlikely to affect the market. In 2011 40 tons of ivory was seized. Maybe you decrease the price slightly in the U.S. but that is a small portion of the market (85 percent goes to China and Taiwan alone). And if it is enough to affect prices if sold it is also likely enough to obfuscate illegitimate transactions.
 
2013-11-12 12:09:46 AM

MechaPyx: A few things:

First, we're not above exploitation to make a buck so calling out other people for doing so is a bit hypocritical.

Second: Destroying ivory that has already been collected will have zero impact on the poachers. They've already gotten their money. The only result will be to increase scarcity, thereby driving prices up. The poachers themselves will probably just shake their heads at our stupidity and have a laugh about their good fortune as market prices go up.

Third: If you want to stop the poaching there are several things that could be tried. For instance, perfect cloning technology, clone some elephants, and harvest the ivory for sale. Long term if you want to stop the poaching you have to provide the poachers with an alternative means of making a living but this takes time and money. Or we send in sniper teams to track the poachers down and shoot them.


I'm gonna go with the last idea of your post.
 
2013-11-12 12:12:37 AM

SmackLT: cman: One would think someone would be researching how to make synthetic ivory.

It's actually pretty easy once you get past the initial difficulty of making a synthetic elephant.


Artificial insemination?
 
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