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(Salon)   Well I guess that means that the Duggars have 19 Porsches   (salon.com ) divider line
    More: Strange, Don't Hold Your Breath, Mankiw, insurance policy, Affordable Care Act  
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3987 clicks; posted to Politics » on 11 Nov 2013 at 4:00 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-11-11 07:52:51 PM  

Ringshadow: /And in spite of being thirty god damn years old, coworkers still endlessly harass me that I need to have kids


Now that I'm 41 - old and washed up in some people's eyes - people have stopped asking me "When are you going to have kids?  You'll regret not having any when you're old and alone..."  What a goddamned relief getting older is.
 
2013-11-11 07:55:13 PM  

jigger: Can we at least all agree that forcing men to buy insurance that covers pregnancy is stupid?


Women's insurance has to cover your Viagra and meds for prostate issues, testicle cancer and prostate surgery--so why shouldn't yours cover female conditions?
 
2013-11-11 07:58:40 PM  

Urbn: Benevolent Misanthrope: rynthetyn: I saw someone arguing the other day that having a uterus was a choice. I'm still not sure how I understand that logic, but yes, it was a male arguing it.

I chose to have a hysterectomy, but it took me years to get insurance to pay for it.  Even though I had 3 gynos who said I needed one and I was in so much pain I needed Vicodin as a daily prescription.

I am in my late thirties and I have three times been refused a tubal ligation even though I do not want any more kids, and even though if I were to get pregnant I would 100% certain have a premature baby (just like my one and only child was, and it was a scary scary thing) due to a...dun dun duuunnnn - pre-existing condition. The best I got was an IUD that I had to pay for mostly out of pocket. Maybe when I'm 40 I'll be able to find a doctor and insurance that will treat me like a grown woman able to make her own reproductive decisions. Sigh.


They have a formula of number of kids plus age. I had to threaten physical harm on my ob doc to get him to give an exception for tubal at 28 with two kids.
 
2013-11-11 08:02:52 PM  
img.fark.net
 
2013-11-11 08:29:06 PM  

Deedeemarz: jigger: Can we at least all agree that forcing men to buy insurance that covers pregnancy is stupid?

Women's insurance has to cover your Viagra and meds for prostate issues, testicle cancer and prostate surgery


And you don't think that's stupid?
 
2013-11-11 09:22:48 PM  
Ohgod, I think we finally found the target audience of one for that weird Nationwide commercial with the Giant Car Baby O_o  (And here I thought the ad execs had just been force-fed peyote smoothies like the usual Nationwide advert design sessions...)

(And I see that BabyquariumTM references have already been made...save for the obvious question of "how the hell does one fit a BabyquariumTM AND its mandatory baby grand piano accessory in a Porsche, anyways?")

In all seriousness, though...hell, le's just say I've known gynos (at a pelvic pain center, no less!) damn near go through forms in quadruplicate, two years of hormonal therapy, and three months of evaluation just to do an ablation because Tying Of The Tubes is involved...and then said doctor has to perform the procedure outside of his usual practice center because the hospital chain his clinic is affiliated with got borged by a Catholic hospital chain and thus no longer performs surgical sterilisation. :P  I can only imagine what an unholy biatch getting a hysterectomy must be...

And apparently these same folks seem to not realise that not only do a number of women use hormonal birth control for things not related to Not Having Babby (like, oh, "running into iron deficiency issues because of Aunt Flo bringing ALL her friends to ride the Red River" levels of Biatchmas) but in some cases hormonal birth control is actually fertility-PRESERVING (PCOS often requires hormonal birth control for some time...to get the hormones in rhythm enough where one CAN conceive and keep a pregnancy to term; also, long-term hormonal birth control like Depo-Provera and Seasonale can keep adhesions down in endometriosis).

They also seem to forget that there ARE a percentage of women for whom Biology Has Said No and attempts to have babby can lead to heartbreak for all concerned.  Incompetent cervix being one (pretty much almost any attempt at pregnancy will--WILL--end in either miscarriage or a very preemie birth); untreated endometriosis (ironically, often able to be kept to a dull roar via hormonal birth control) can lead to adhesions that make pregnancy either impossible or extremely dangerous (ectopic pregnancy, which can never be carried to term and for which surgical abortion is required to save the life of the mother); infections of the uterus or fallopian tubes can cause adhesions too; some women just have the mommy parts Not Entirely Built Correctly from birth.

/fortunately, do not want nor care for babby
//would much rather have the Porsche
///would legitimately argue that Babby is far more expensive than Porsche
 
2013-11-11 09:27:41 PM  

quizzical: How's that Republican outreach to women going, guys?


Right!? I don't see how any woman can continue to vote Republican.

I love how people try to say there's no "war on women" and yet every week it's some fresh asshattery from the GOP.
 
2013-11-11 09:33:20 PM  

Urbn: Benevolent Misanthrope: rynthetyn: I saw someone arguing the other day that having a uterus was a choice. I'm still not sure how I understand that logic, but yes, it was a male arguing it.

I chose to have a hysterectomy, but it took me years to get insurance to pay for it.  Even though I had 3 gynos who said I needed one and I was in so much pain I needed Vicodin as a daily prescription.

I am in my late thirties and I have three times been refused a tubal ligation even though I do not want any more kids, and even though if I were to get pregnant I would 100% certain have a premature baby (just like my one and only child was, and it was a scary scary thing) due to a...dun dun duuunnnn - pre-existing condition. The best I got was an IUD that I had to pay for mostly out of pocket. Maybe when I'm 40 I'll be able to find a doctor and insurance that will treat me like a grown woman able to make her own reproductive decisions. Sigh.


And yet they don't bat an eye if a man in his 20's wants a vasectomy.

"Poor silly woman, you just don't know yet that you want kids."

Ugh
 
2013-11-11 09:34:54 PM  

jigger: Deedeemarz: jigger: Can we at least all agree that forcing men to buy insurance that covers pregnancy is stupid?

Women's insurance has to cover your Viagra and meds for prostate issues, testicle cancer and prostate surgery

And you don't think that's stupid?


That people aren't self centered farks and will pay to cover things that may not specifically impact them because in a society we help everybody out?
 
2013-11-11 10:18:47 PM  

o5iiawah: Fart_Machine: Birth control and abortion bad. Maternity care coverage also bad. Make up your mind already.

No, they just feel as though each of those things are individual responsibilities associated with the freedom to exercise your own sexual freedom.
Part of this whole "with rights come responsibilities" thing I keep hearing you guys talk about.


You mean like paying for insurance coverage?  That kind of thing?  And legislating over a woman's reproductive system is totally an example of sexual freedom.
 
2013-11-12 12:10:55 AM  

CreamFilling: Marcus Aurelius: CreamFilling: Who's trying to ban birth control? Even the Pope has more or less turned a blind eye to that one

Not sure if serious.

Nothing at all to do with banning it, just whether employers should have to pay for it.


Newsflash: They already are, even if they think they aren't.
 
2013-11-12 02:13:40 AM  

Fart_Machine: Birth control and abortion bad. Maternity care coverage also bad. Make up your mind already.


They have. Military and prisons good. Where is the confusion here?

/the less-than-rich in America are just more meat for the grinder
 
2013-11-12 02:41:09 AM  

jigger: Deedeemarz: jigger: Can we at least all agree that forcing men to buy insurance that covers pregnancy is stupid?

Women's insurance has to cover your Viagra and meds for prostate issues, testicle cancer and prostate surgery

And you don't think that's stupid?


It is the actual thing we call insurance. It works by spreading risk.
And only stupid people think it is stupid.
 
2013-11-12 03:40:17 AM  

jigger: Genevieve Marie: jigger: Genevieve Marie: jigger: Can we at least all agree that forcing men to buy insurance that covers pregnancy is stupid?

Nope.

Just like I don't think it's stupid that my insurance covers prostate cancer.

Insurance doesn't work by letting people pick and choose what conditions might affect them personally.

Um, yes it does? Or at least it used to.

Which was massively inefficient and cost a fortune.

I don't know if you've been paying attention but the average cost of an insurance plan has increased because it has to cover more, even if the chances of a man getting pregnant is nil.


No, indigent care has been the primary upward pressure on healthcare costs since Reagan. It has fark all to do with what insurance covers or doesn't cover, the entire spectrum of healthcare was seeing prices raise because of lack of affordable preventative care and an astounding rate of indigent emergency care recidivism.

Come back to the conversation when you have a secondary education. Hell come back when you have a High School Diploma or a GED. Because you clearly don't have either.
 
2013-11-12 03:45:34 AM  

Cataholic: Urbn: Genevieve Marie: jigger: Can we at least all agree that forcing men to buy insurance that covers pregnancy is stupid?

Nope.

Just like I don't think it's stupid that my insurance covers prostate cancer.

Insurance doesn't work by letting people pick and choose what conditions might affect them personally.

No shiat, right? I hate that talking point. Health insurance is not an ala cart thing, and it shouldn't be an ala cart thing. The whole idea of a risk pool is that some people may have more health issues and others less but we keep it affordable by increasing the pool so that people with preventable and treatable conditions can get care and remain productive, healthy members of that society. Having thousands of different policies covering gender specific or other specific basic healthcare needs is a stupid, stupid idea.

If you want everyone to pay for routine medical costs of Delivery and Birth of children, then go right ahead and advocate that position.  Just stop calling it insurance.


Unemployment Insurance? Car Insurance? Health Insurance? It's all insurance, just because you're a misogynist doesn't change its definition.
 
2013-11-12 03:49:59 AM  
 

Genevieve Marie: Benevolent Misanthrope: .

Capital Women's Health, 1998-99. 2 separate guys told me (well, leaned back in their chairs and did a great Lumbergh impersonation) they wouldn't do it because they had to be really careful about these procedures that were considered over-performed. Unless it was threatening my life, they weren't comfortable with doing a surgery until they tried everything else. One of them admitted to me that he agreed with me but wanted to go through every possible other alternative first, even if I didn't. Including ablative therapy, which, if you've never heard of it, should be the goddamn Poster Procedure for hating women and their reproductive organs, IMHO.
...
You mentioned feminist protests and picket lines outside these clinics as a reason these doctors wouldn't do a hysterectomy. I've been googling since you posted it and I cannot find ONE documented instance of feminist picketers intimidating doctors into not doing hysterectomies, and I'd imagine that for two separate doctors to have that reaction, it would have to be prolonged and intense.

I know surgical protocols changed for hysterectomies (partially because for a long time, they WERE over-performed) but those guidelines were medical, not the ...


It was kind of a thing back then:
http://www.nytimes.com/1997/02/17/us/in-a-culture-of-hysterectomies- ma ny-question-their-necessity.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm

There was a national picketing campaign a bit later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nora_W._Coffey

So I guess you weren't looking very hard?
 
2013-11-12 06:28:40 AM  

Ringshadow: Speaking as someone who has no children and will not be having any, I can safely tell you the harassment comes from the other side as well. A rather alarming amount of people seem to take it very personal that I don't have kids and will rather arrogantly tell me I'll change my own mind.

/I am sterile
//and if they find that out they start insulting my doctor


I don't want kids too. I suffer from very serious depression and somedays i can't even look after myself much less handle the responsibilty of a kid. People tell me i am selfish. Plus, i don't like kids.
 
2013-11-12 07:43:54 AM  

Natsumi: Ringshadow: Speaking as someone who has no children and will not be having any, I can safely tell you the harassment comes from the other side as well. A rather alarming amount of people seem to take it very personal that I don't have kids and will rather arrogantly tell me I'll change my own mind.

/I am sterile
//and if they find that out they start insulting my doctor

I don't want kids too. I suffer from very serious depression and somedays i can't even look after myself much less handle the responsibilty of a kid. People tell me i am selfish. Plus, i don't like kids.


I don't have a vagina but I also have never wanted kids and to the best of my recollection nobody has ever told me that I should have them or want them or anything like that.

Never really felt any societal pressure to do so.

I think it's probably way easier being a guy on that front.
 
2013-11-12 11:03:24 AM  

Genevieve Marie: CreamFilling: Marcus Aurelius: CreamFilling: Who's trying to ban birth control? Even the Pope has more or less turned a blind eye to that one

Not sure if serious.

Nothing at all to do with banning it, just whether employers should have to pay for it.

No, whether it should be covered by insurance. Insurance that employees pay for as well.

If I'm paying premiums for insurance, I don't believe my employer's religious beliefs should dictate what medical benefits my health plan pays for. Kind of think those should maybe be dictated by what medical science thinks I might need.


I don't know why you are in the work place taking a job away from a man in the first place!

/jk
 
2013-11-12 03:59:53 PM  

Genevieve Marie: CreamFilling: Marcus Aurelius: CreamFilling: Who's trying to ban birth control? Even the Pope has more or less turned a blind eye to that one

Not sure if serious.

Nothing at all to do with banning it, just whether employers should have to pay for it.

No, whether it should be covered by insurance. Insurance that employees pay for as well.

If I'm paying premiums for insurance, I don't believe my employer's religious beliefs should dictate what medical benefits my health plan pays for. Kind of think those should maybe be dictated by what medical science thinks I might need.


I think its more like the premiums you pay are dictated by the amount of coverage / what you are covered FOR... so if I drive a porsche but I only want liability insurance it will cost less that full coverage.

THAT part of the analogy I can get.  Why would a dude want coverage that will never apply to him?  As a woman, I don't need insurance that covers a prostate exam either.  That is, IF THESE SERVICES DRIVE UP THE OVERALL COST OF THE PREMIUMS.

Because honestly, what health insurance has EVER let you pick and choose every little option?  My work plan for me and my 5 kids (whom I chose, btw) is over $400 a month... however it covers both my sons' hernia 'turn your head and cough' exams and my daughters' HPV vaccines.  And it always freaking has.  This is how insurance works.

Do these people honestly, seriously not know this?  Or are they just spewing crap they heard second hand from Fox News and their old insurance broker?
 
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