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(Mirror.co.uk)   Defiant father marches to Downing Street to shake up PM David Cameron over the "bullying" of his son for not being able to work: "He can't even play a mean pinball"   (mirror.co.uk) divider line 27
    More: Asinine, Downing Street, DWP  
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1470 clicks; posted to Politics » on 09 Nov 2013 at 10:13 AM (36 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



27 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-11-09 10:20:52 AM
Not exactly a fat guy in a diaper with a baby/momma fetish threatening to off himself if his disability is taken away.
 
2013-11-09 10:22:49 AM
Nonsense.  Even blind, deaf and dumb kids have been known to play a mean pinball.
 
2013-11-09 10:30:05 AM
FTA, Spsounds like he didn't submit the right form.

Seriously, people, just submit the right form to govt agencies because that's the only way they'll send you down the right channels.
 
2013-11-09 10:31:26 AM
userserve-ak.last.fm
 
2013-11-09 10:38:52 AM

DO NOT WANT Poster Girl: FTA, Spsounds like he didn't submit the right form.

Seriously, people, just submit the right form to govt agencies because that's the only way they'll send you down the right channels.


I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office?  The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.
 
2013-11-09 10:41:36 AM

The Briny Derp: DO NOT WANT Poster Girl: FTA, Spsounds like he didn't submit the right form.

Seriously, people, just submit the right form to govt agencies because that's the only way they'll send you down the right channels.

I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office?  The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.


Common sense would seem to say that but the point is to remove ambiguity and individual judgement calls as much as possible. Hence the 6 forms filled out in triplicate
 
2013-11-09 10:47:24 AM

The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.


Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.
 
2013-11-09 10:57:37 AM

Satanic_Hamster: The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.

Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.


I can't agree more. And newspapers love drama, so why not leave out part of the truth?  It's not a lie if your still technically telling the truth.

And for all we know he could be the British Tea Party or something... That's a weird comparison.
 
2013-11-09 11:02:33 AM
If the head office is in Glasgow, why would you head into London to make a personal appeal? Oh, it's just a publicity stunt. I'm sure that's going to move things right along for you.
 
2013-11-09 11:08:31 AM

The Briny Derp: Satanic_Hamster: The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.

Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.

I can't agree more. And newspapers love drama, so why not leave out part of the truth?  It's not a lie if your still technically telling the truth.

And for all we know he could be the British Tea Party or something... That's a weird comparison.


The British Tea Party are probably UKIP (although UKIP are, amazingly, much more sane). And they'd be very much against this guy's son getting any sort of disability benefit. Or anyone getting any sort of disability benefit. They're more or less minarchists.

The government are arseholes, they're set on finding spurious reasons to kick disabled people off of disability benefits in order to drive down the benefits bill, supposedly to get rid of fraud or get people who can actually work into work. The issue is that the disability benefits bill and the bill for fraudulently claimed benefits is chickenfeed in comparison to the bill for state pensions, but given the political overrepresentation of the elderly that particular nettle will never (and in fairness should never) be grasped. Moreover, they're going about it in the most idiotic way imaginable, getting some private company to assess peoples' fitness for work and often making severely questionable judgments about it.
 
2013-11-09 11:11:00 AM
So, in comparison, he drove with his son up Pennsylvania Ave and told the guards he wanted to speak to Obama, then went down the road to the Capitol to try to talk with a high-ranking Senator not of his state.

/right?
 
2013-11-09 11:11:27 AM

DO NOT WANT Poster Girl: FTA, Spsounds like he didn't submit the right form.

Seriously, people, just submit the right form to govt agencies because that's the only way they'll send you down the right channels.


It's not the "wrong form". It's that the DWP are making active efforts to stop people claiming unemployment or disability benefits in the name of preventing fraud. Unfortunately the baby is very much out with the bathwater, although it's not so much "the baby going out with the bathwater" as "an entire nursery ward full of congenitally ill infants being thrown out with a few drops of bathwater".
 
2013-11-09 11:13:31 AM

OtherLittleGuy: So, in comparison, he drove with his son up Pennsylvania Ave and told the guards he wanted to speak to Obama, then went down the road to the Capitol to try to talk with a high-ranking Senator not of his state.

/right?


Not especially. The "high ranking senator", Iain Duncan Smith, is the government minister for work and pensions, and as such responsible for the current benefits regime.

It's a publicity stunt, to be sure, but given the excessive bureaucracy in place at the DWP I wouldn't be at all surprised if a publicity stunt isn't the only way to get someone to go "hang on a second, our assessment is farked up".
 
2013-11-09 11:18:44 AM
It sounds like the family sent them proof from their doctor showing that the boy couldn't work and his condition would never improve.

The issue is he filled out all of the forms, jumped threw all of the hoops, and is still receiving threatening letters.
 
2013-11-09 11:19:57 AM

PortsmouthFarker: The Briny Derp: Satanic_Hamster: The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.

Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.

I can't agree more. And newspapers love drama, so why not leave out part of the truth?  It's not a lie if your still technically telling the truth.

And for all we know he could be the British Tea Party or something... That's a weird comparison.

The British Tea Party are probably UKIP (although UKIP are, amazingly, much more sane). And they'd be very much against this guy's son getting any sort of disability benefit. Or anyone getting any sort of disability benefit. They're more or less minarchists.

The government are arseholes, they're set on finding spurious reasons to kick disabled people off of disability benefits in order to drive down the benefits bill, supposedly to get rid of fraud or get people who can actually work into work. The issue is that the disability benefits bill and the bill for fraudulently claimed benefits is chickenfeed in comparison to the bill for state pensions, but given the political overrepresentation of the elderly that particular nettle will never (and in fairness should never) be grasped. Moreover, they're going about it in the most idiotic way imaginable, getting some private company to assess peoples' fitness for work and often making severely questionable judgments about it.


that sounds rather American in scope. Privatization is arguably why we have a bloated prison population and sub-nutritious lunch food for kids at school.

Private health insurance companies were notorious for kicking people off their plans for hangnails and poorly crossed ts. The ACA finally put a stop to that, but who's to say there won't be another loophole to exploit somewhere.
 
2013-11-09 11:22:40 AM

The Briny Derp: PortsmouthFarker: The Briny Derp: Satanic_Hamster: The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.

Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.

I can't agree more. And newspapers love drama, so why not leave out part of the truth?  It's not a lie if your still technically telling the truth.

And for all we know he could be the British Tea Party or something... That's a weird comparison.

The British Tea Party are probably UKIP (although UKIP are, amazingly, much more sane). And they'd be very much against this guy's son getting any sort of disability benefit. Or anyone getting any sort of disability benefit. They're more or less minarchists.

The government are arseholes, they're set on finding spurious reasons to kick disabled people off of disability benefits in order to drive down the benefits bill, supposedly to get rid of fraud or get people who can actually work into work. The issue is that the disability benefits bill and the bill for fraudulently claimed benefits is chickenfeed in comparison to the bill for state pensions, but given the political overrepresentation of the elderly that particular nettle will never (and in fairness should never) be grasped. Moreover, they're going about it in the most idiotic way imaginable, getting some private company to assess peoples' fitness for work and often making severely questionable judgments about it.

that sounds rather American in scope. Privatization is arguably why we have a bloated prison population and sub-nutritious lunch food for kids at school.

Private health insurance companies were notorious for ...


The British government are pretty much in awe of what the Americans do about their welfare (i.e avoid providing it). Our workfare programme is pretty much exactly the same as the US'.

If they could find a way to kick people who don't work off the NHS (and luckily they legally can't) they'd do so.
 
2013-11-09 11:33:09 AM

PortsmouthFarker: DO NOT WANT Poster Girl: FTA, Spsounds like he didn't submit the right form.
Seriously, people, just submit the right form to govt agencies because that's the only way they'll send you down the right channels.

It's not the "wrong form". It's that the DWP are making active efforts to stop people claiming unemployment or disability benefits in the name of preventing fraud. Unfortunately the baby is very much out with the bathwater, although it's not so much "the baby going out with the bathwater" as "an entire nursery ward full of congenitally ill infants being thrown out with a few drops of bathwater".



It's left me wondering what the heck they're requiring, these days.  Under American guidelines he'd have already long since met the evidence requirement.  (And no, that wouldn't also require "the right form," especially for a claimant who's already in the system.)

From the description, they've basically told them that it's all well and good that their licensed, treating physician has confirmed that the kid was born without optic nerves; but we're going to send him down for a government-contracted eye exam anyway, just to make sure he hasn't magically gained the ability to see at some point in the last couple of years.

This won't last.  If that's the sort of policy they're pushing across the board, the cost to the public is going to be absolutely staggering.
 
2013-11-09 11:35:09 AM

Satanic_Hamster: The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.

Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.


Honestly I suspect that is the bulk of hatred for the dmv and sos.

I have never once had a problem with service at any of them.

A few waits longer than I would have liked, but that's it.
 
2013-11-09 11:41:57 AM

PortsmouthFarker: The Briny Derp: PortsmouthFarker: The Briny Derp: Satanic_Hamster: The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.

Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.

I can't agree more. And newspapers love drama, so why not leave out part of the truth?  It's not a lie if your still technically telling the truth.

And for all we know he could be the British Tea Party or something... That's a weird comparison.

The British Tea Party are probably UKIP (although UKIP are, amazingly, much more sane). And they'd be very much against this guy's son getting any sort of disability benefit. Or anyone getting any sort of disability benefit. They're more or less minarchists.

The government are arseholes, they're set on finding spurious reasons to kick disabled people off of disability benefits in order to drive down the benefits bill, supposedly to get rid of fraud or get people who can actually work into work. The issue is that the disability benefits bill and the bill for fraudulently claimed benefits is chickenfeed in comparison to the bill for state pensions, but given the political overrepresentation of the elderly that particular nettle will never (and in fairness should never) be grasped. Moreover, they're going about it in the most idiotic way imaginable, getting some private company to assess peoples' fitness for work and often making severely questionable judgments about it.

that sounds rather American in scope. Privatization is arguably why we have a bloated prison population and sub-nutritious lunch food for kids at school.

Private health insurance companies wer ...


I'm happy to know that other first-world countries think that our take on healthcare is nuts.
 
2013-11-09 11:43:04 AM

Wasteland: PortsmouthFarker: DO NOT WANT Poster Girl: FTA, Spsounds like he didn't submit the right form.
Seriously, people, just submit the right form to govt agencies because that's the only way they'll send you down the right channels.

It's not the "wrong form". It's that the DWP are making active efforts to stop people claiming unemployment or disability benefits in the name of preventing fraud. Unfortunately the baby is very much out with the bathwater, although it's not so much "the baby going out with the bathwater" as "an entire nursery ward full of congenitally ill infants being thrown out with a few drops of bathwater".


It's left me wondering what the heck they're requiring, these days.  Under American guidelines he'd have already long since met the evidence requirement.  (And no, that wouldn't also require "the right form," especially for a claimant who's already in the system.)

From the description, they've basically told them that it's all well and good that their licensed, treating physician has confirmed that the kid was born without optic nerves; but we're going to send him down for a government-contracted eye exam anyway, just to make sure he hasn't magically gained the ability to see at some point in the last couple of years.

This won't last.  If that's the sort of policy they're pushing across the board, the cost to the public is going to be absolutely staggering.


It's been going on for years now. There's widespread public revulsion at it but it isn't going to change as long as we have the idiots in power we have now.

The story doesn't surprise me. It's not an unusual thing at all:  http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-22546036
 
2013-11-09 11:46:17 AM

PortsmouthFarker: The Briny Derp: Satanic_Hamster: The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.

Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.

I can't agree more. And newspapers love drama, so why not leave out part of the truth?  It's not a lie if your still technically telling the truth.

And for all we know he could be the British Tea Party or something... That's a weird comparison.

The British Tea Party are probably UKIP (although UKIP are, amazingly, much more sane). And they'd be very much against this guy's son getting any sort of disability benefit. Or anyone getting any sort of disability benefit. They're more or less minarchists.

The government are arseholes, they're set on finding spurious reasons to kick disabled people off of disability benefits in order to drive down the benefits bill, supposedly to get rid of fraud or get people who can actually work into work. The issue is that the disability benefits bill and the bill for fraudulently claimed benefits is chickenfeed in comparison to the bill for state pensions, but given the political overrepresentation of the elderly that particular nettle will never (and in fairness should never) be grasped. Moreover, they're going about it in the most idiotic way imaginable, getting some private company to assess peoples' fitness for work and often making severely questionable judgments about it.


The company involved - ATOS - admitted that they deliberately hold the assessments for disability benefit claimants in buildings without disabled access.

If you're disabled and you can't get in, no assessment = no benefit.
If you're disabled and you can get in, you're not disabled = no benefit.

I can't help admiring the evil behind that.
 
2013-11-09 11:55:22 AM

Rueened: PortsmouthFarker: The Briny Derp: Satanic_Hamster: The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.

Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.

I can't agree more. And newspapers love drama, so why not leave out part of the truth?  It's not a lie if your still technically telling the truth.

And for all we know he could be the British Tea Party or something... That's a weird comparison.

The British Tea Party are probably UKIP (although UKIP are, amazingly, much more sane). And they'd be very much against this guy's son getting any sort of disability benefit. Or anyone getting any sort of disability benefit. They're more or less minarchists.

The government are arseholes, they're set on finding spurious reasons to kick disabled people off of disability benefits in order to drive down the benefits bill, supposedly to get rid of fraud or get people who can actually work into work. The issue is that the disability benefits bill and the bill for fraudulently claimed benefits is chickenfeed in comparison to the bill for state pensions, but given the political overrepresentation of the elderly that particular nettle will never (and in fairness should never) be grasped. Moreover, they're going about it in the most idiotic way imaginable, getting some private company to assess peoples' fitness for work and often making severely questionable judgments about it.

The company involved - ATOS - admitted that they deliberately hold the assessments for disability benefit claimants in buildings without disabled access.

If you're disabled and you can't get in, no assessment ...


That is such a brilliant Catch 22 Joseph Heller is kicking himself in the afterlife.
 
2013-11-09 12:01:26 PM
What this story needs is Elton John tripping balls on camera.
 
2013-11-09 12:25:27 PM
Plebe peoblems.
 
2013-11-09 12:26:02 PM
WTF? problems
 
2013-11-09 01:33:51 PM

The Briny Derp: Satanic_Hamster: The Briny Derp: I suppose that's where the cold, unintuitive systems need reform. Where was the understanding when he showed up to the local office? The lady could cry and call her boss but they couldn't tell him to fill out the right form?

It comes off as bureaucratic apathy to me.

Of course, you're only hearing one side.  For all you know he went in there cursing and just walked out when they said he needed to fill out a different form.  I've seem people behave like that on more then one occasion.

I can't agree more. And newspapers love drama, so why not leave out part of the truth?  It's not a lie if your still technically telling the truth.

And for all we know he could be the British Tea Party or something... That's a weird comparison.


Yes. The American Tea Party is all for making people jump through hoops to prove they deserve help.
 
2013-11-09 02:05:56 PM
IIRC this is the same agency that demanded an amputee prove that his condition hadn't improved. He had to go there and point out that no his legs hadn't magically regrown.
 
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