If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Washington Times)   Chinese media publishes maps of radioactive fallout from a hypothetical nuclear sub attack off the US west coast. Sucks to be you, Milwaukee...well, sucks to be you even more than usual   (washingtontimes.com) divider line 160
    More: Scary, Milwaukee, Chinese, United States, nuclear submarines, fallout, Beijing Youth Daily, nuclear deterrent, nuclear force  
•       •       •

10903 clicks; posted to Main » on 02 Nov 2013 at 7:29 AM (24 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



160 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | » | Last | Show all
 
2013-11-01 11:51:01 PM
Man they have been using that pic of the Zumwalt for 30 years
 
2013-11-01 11:55:59 PM
Would you like to play a game?
 
2013-11-02 12:59:39 AM
Moonie Times
 
2013-11-02 02:46:54 AM
Yeah, good luck with that. Just keep producing cheap plastic crap to keep Wal Mart's shelves full and we'll all be happy. And try not to build any more empty cities, or empty threats.
 
2013-11-02 06:21:05 AM
their subs are as quiet as a snowblower running in a running in a tin shed.
 
2013-11-02 07:33:08 AM
Yeah, the thing about the Midwest is, that's where we keep all our nukes.  We're not exactly new to the whole MAD doctrine.  Go home China, you're drunk.
 
2013-11-02 07:33:27 AM
Sounds like the defense contractors need more money.
 
2013-11-02 07:34:26 AM
What the hell is in southwest Vermont that it merits a dot?
 
2013-11-02 07:37:05 AM
Haha! Once again, there is nothing of value inside Indiana! Suck on THAT, rest of America!
 
2013-11-02 07:40:51 AM

Creoena: What the hell is in southwest Vermont that it merits a dot?


Good question. I can't figure out what the dots represent at all. There's one for NYC, but they missed other major cities like DC and Chicago. Maybe they're military bases?

I'm also annoyed that all their links look like sources, but just go back to the washington times.
 
2013-11-02 07:41:01 AM
Thus begins Cold War II.
 
2013-11-02 07:41:40 AM
The great thing about radiation is that it stays in the places you bomb and never goes anywhere else.
 
2013-11-02 07:46:20 AM
Obliterated Terminator 2 style on the West coast or slightly irradiated in Milwaukee?  That's a tough choice.
 
2013-11-02 07:49:32 AM

log_jammin: their subs are as quiet as a snowblower running in a running in a tin shed.


They smell like fish and pee too.
 
2013-11-02 07:49:54 AM
Any jarheads want to war game this for me?
Let's say the US pisses off China.
China parks it's nuke subs just off in international waters. The US sends, what? Warships? It's own subs? To face off.
Finally China says "fark it" and hits the launch code.
Then what?
 
2013-11-02 07:50:31 AM
Hey China , you do indeed know that when it comes to nuclear fallout it does indeed work both ways!
 
2013-11-02 07:51:02 AM
Montana and North Dakota? seriously?
 
2013-11-02 07:53:06 AM
Another False Flag operation from the Obummer administration to distract us as UN troops prepare for the take over. If you refuse the option of being relocated to a FEMA camp after declining Obamascare, that's when the Muslim Death Panel shows up with flamethrowers. We need to remove this corrupt government and establish the Christian Republic of America. One nation, under GOD. Kick all the atheists and anyone else who doesn't love Jesus Christ then the Lord will protect us!

Jesus Christ for president in 2016!
 
2013-11-02 07:53:43 AM
Hooray, Lansing, Michigan, it looks like you finally made the map!
 
2013-11-02 07:55:06 AM

Creoena: What the hell is in southwest Vermont that it merits a dot?


Maybe the guy who created the graphic was just guessing where Ben & Jerry's was.
 
2013-11-02 07:57:10 AM

RalphW: Any jarheads want to war game this for me?
Let's say the US pisses off China.
China parks it's nuke subs just off in international waters. The US sends, what? Warships? It's own subs? To face off.
Finally China says "fark it" and hits the launch code.
Then what?


My guess, and I am just guessing mind you, that those  not so quiet Chinese nuke subs will have a US attack sub sitting right behind them and when they hear the Chinese start to open the missile silo  hatches they will launch a torpedo good bye Chinese nuke sub.
 
2013-11-02 07:57:41 AM

Cereal Fetish: Creoena: What the hell is in southwest Vermont that it merits a dot?

Maybe the guy who created the graphic was just guessing where Ben & Jerry's was.


He missed horribly then.

/If the Chinese are targeting Ben and Jerry's, then THIS MEANS WAR
 
2013-11-02 08:00:43 AM
Those crafty Chinese can not only irradiate Milwaukee, they'll pee in your coke.

THEY MUST BE STOPPED!
 
2013-11-02 08:03:22 AM

phrawgh: Another False Flag operation from the Obummer administration to distract us as UN troops prepare for the take over. If you refuse the option of being relocated to a FEMA camp after declining Obamascare, that's when the Muslim Death Panel shows up with flamethrowers. We need to remove this corrupt government and establish the Christian Republic of America. One nation, under GOD. Kick all the atheists and anyone else who doesn't love Jesus Christ then the Lord will protect us!

Jesus Christ for president in 2016!


That just about sums up the comments FTA.

/I don't agree with the President all the time, but he's not some Machiavellian monster
 
2013-11-02 08:06:17 AM
Why the fark does it seem that all the Chinese are good at is reverse-engineering somebody else's idea???  Have they ever had an original idea?
 
2013-11-02 08:09:18 AM

RalphW: Any jarheads want to war game this for me?
Let's say the US pisses off China.
China parks it's nuke subs just off in international waters. The US sends, what? Warships? It's own subs? To face off.
Finally China says "fark it" and hits the launch code.
Then what?


US, Canada, and even Mexico have sophisticated anti-submarine programs in place. The fact that the Germans had subs on our borders in WW2 scared the shiat out of all of these countries. Nobody is capable of sneaking up on either the Atlantic of the Pacific. The US in particular has the technology to counter whatever threat can come from the waters. This is of course assuming that China or anyone has that level of technology and assuming again that they would be stupid enough to pull such a dick move.

This appears to be a ploy mostly to cajole Chinese citizens into complacency, but also to solidify China's efforts to pull threat. They are trying to strengthen their role in the region, so putting on a display about how much they could hurt the USA is the simplest way to go about it. The problem with that strategy is USA is very close to nations in the region like Japan, South Korea, Thailand, Cambodia, etc. Instead of being seen as a friendly gesture, this will likely be viewed as the boasting of a drunken braggart which basically means that China is the egg on the face of the Earth at this point.
 
2013-11-02 08:11:07 AM
May have a thing or two to say about this:
i.imgur.com
 
2013-11-02 08:12:59 AM
www.lgdb.org

Hope you brought some destroyers to protect those subs...
 
SH
2013-11-02 08:14:08 AM
So, I finally have irrefutable evidence that there is something positive about living in Ohio.
 
2013-11-02 08:16:47 AM
China attacking us would be like a Walmart calling in an airstrike on the closest trailer park
 
2013-11-02 08:18:06 AM

Creoena: What the hell is in southwest Vermont that it merits a dot?


Maybe a missile site?
 
2013-11-02 08:29:39 AM

Theory Of Null: Montana and North Dakota? seriously?


I'll take "Where are the ICBM silos for $400", Alex.
 
2013-11-02 08:31:04 AM
wow, the comments on that article are a microcosm of paranoid schizophrenic ranting. People who obviously spent their entire lives licking lead paint off their windowsills and drinking sugar-flavored water substitutes.

Those people need to be heavily medicated and segregated from normal society.
 
2013-11-02 08:31:06 AM
And, as a response.. a quicky target list for the Pacific fleet SSBNs:
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_in_China_by_population


Given that there are 10 active SSBNs in the Pacific fleet, each with 24 Trident II tubes, with 8 MIRVd W88 (475KT each) warheads (START limits 8, but if the balloon went up, you could jam 12 of those in each Trident).

The list of primary population centers is 207 cities, so you're looking at a saturation of about 9 MIRVs per city, with some slop. That's putting about 4.3 Megatons (Hiroshima was 16kt); call it a little more than 265 "Hiroshimas" per city. If you consider city centers of population as aiming points (for 100% casualties), with 60% casualty rates in urban populations, and 40% in the surrounding environs, you're looking at just about 1,073,415,036 casualties. 1.07 Gigadeaths.

This is from SSBNs alone.

The Chinese report calls for 5-12 million US casualties. Some one said this earlier, but the US is very well versed in the mathematics of MAD.
 
2013-11-02 08:31:23 AM

Mattbastard: Why the fark does it seem that all the Chinese are good at is reverse-engineering somebody else's idea???  Have they ever had an original idea?


Nope. There are probably cultural factors as to why that might be, though.
 
2013-11-02 08:32:01 AM
casual disregard:
US, Canada, and even Mexico have sophisticated anti-submarine programs in place.

That's nice. They also wouldn't do a damned thing if the Chinese decided to do a no-notice attack.

What could we do? Suddenly announce that we were going to sink any and all Chinese subs that came within six or seven thousand miles of the US coast? That's pretty much the whole planet.

Under current doctrine, we pretty much have to let them go wherever they want - and if the Chinese government suddenly went completely insane and decided to launch, our high-tech sub tracking systems would just give us a couple of minutes of warning, and let us sink the now-empty Chinese missile subs. Whee.

The interesting thing is how the Chinese are playing this. It almost sounds like they're prepping for something else, and want the nuclear threat to be a deterrent against the US interfering. Keep an eye on the South China Sea for a few weeks - they've been screwing around there in recent months, and really want the supposed oil and gas reserved under the Spratly Islands...
 
2013-11-02 08:37:33 AM
media.townhall.com
 
2013-11-02 08:39:21 AM
I don't know about you guys but I just shiat my pants. Time to donate my savings to our tiny and underfunded military.

Deathfrogg: wow, the comments on that article are a microcosm of paranoid schizophrenic ranting. People who obviously spent their entire lives licking lead paint off their windowsills and drinking sugar-flavored water substitutes.

Those people need to be heavily medicated and segregated from normal society.


Don't read the comments on the Washington Times or you are likely to end up crazy as well. Just for different reasons.
 
2013-11-02 08:41:50 AM

agent00pi: <strong><a href="http://www.fark.com/comments/8001185/87392606#c87392606" target="_blank">Theory Of Null</a>:</strong> <em>Montana and North Dakota? seriously?</em>

I'll take "Where are the ICBM silos for $400", Alex.


Yeah, but they will be empty by time those suckers reach it.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-11-02 08:42:07 AM
They have a dot over Springfield, Mass. If they propose to nuke the city, I hope they give enough advance warning to relocate the Seuss Memorial. Nothing else worth saving.  We can live with an I-91 detour for a few years.
 
2013-11-02 08:42:44 AM
Correction:

The article indicates that 5-12M casualties per Type 94, of which there are 5 in active service. So, 4 MIRVs per JL2 at 90kt each, in 16 tubes per sub, puts them right at 320 MIRVs to put down on the west coast cities (some of this is speculation, as it is indeterminate as to the numbers of MIRVs per JL-2 (3-4), and the numbers of launch tubes (12 or 16) on the Type 94, or even the numbers of deployed Type 94s).

Call it 25-60M America casualties. Still, a bargain when compared to 1.07GigaChinese.
 
2013-11-02 08:42:48 AM

Mattbastard: Why the fark does it seem that all the Chinese are good at is reverse-engineering somebody else's idea???  Have they ever had an original idea?


That's not "all China is good at" by a long shot. There are a metric shiat-ton of smart people in China and they are doing great things.

What your comment stems from is the idea of the China Copy. Send any item to China and they will reverse engineer it, study the parts to the point of absurdity, and build a version better than yours. It has been a part of their history for hundreds of years. You can thank imperialism for making it worse.
 
2013-11-02 08:44:50 AM
Eh, war with China would work like this:

"Hey, China, can we bum a few bucks so we can declare war on you? We're kinda strapped"
"Nah, but can you keep buying our shoddy products so we can declare war on our own people and grab a couple more territories along the way? And when do you plan on paying us back?"
"Sure, baby, sure! Check's in the mail!"
 
2013-11-02 08:45:28 AM
The US should release a fallout map of China should we decide to nuke them back in retaliation.
 
2013-11-02 08:45:40 AM
I think they dont know how this MAD game is played just yet.   Apparently the Chinese think its a good idea to kill as many Americans as possible while largely leaving our ability to respond completely intact...
 
2013-11-02 08:49:00 AM
iirightii:
Given that there are 10 active SSBNs in the Pacific fleet, each with 24 Trident II tubes, with 8 MIRVd W88 (475KT each) warheads (START limits 8, but if the balloon went up, you could jam 12 of those in each Trident).

If a nuclear war starts, there's approximately zero chance of that happening. There's no way in hell we'd pull the SSBN fleet out of action in order to change the warhead package on the existing missiles, and after things went bad, re-arming the sub fleet would be pretty much a moot point. The first wave would probably be a one-warhead-per-city target package for their top twenty or thirty metro areas, until we figured out what was going on.

We also wouldn't do a spasm, all-or-nothing attack. About half would launch, we'd hold the rest in reserve (for Russian deterrence, along with our ground based ICBM fleet), our bombers would load up and go hunting, and a helluva lot of people would die either way.

That's probably not what's happening here, though. The Chinese are saber-rattling in order to warn us off of something or other they want to do, like take over the South China Sea (mentioned above) or whatever. It's a "we're going to do something bad or stupid, don't interfere because we're crazy" message.
 
2013-11-02 08:49:03 AM

iirightii: And, as a response.. a quicky target list for the Pacific fleet SSBNs:
 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_in_China_by_population


Given that there are 10 active SSBNs in the Pacific fleet, each with 24 Trident II tubes, with 8 MIRVd W88 (475KT each) warheads (START limits 8, but if the balloon went up, you could jam 12 of those in each Trident).

The list of primary population centers is 207 cities, so you're looking at a saturation of about 9 MIRVs per city, with some slop. That's putting about 4.3 Megatons (Hiroshima was 16kt); call it a little more than 265 "Hiroshimas" per city. If you consider city centers of population as aiming points (for 100% casualties), with 60% casualty rates in urban populations, and 40% in the surrounding environs, you're looking at just about 1,073,415,036 casualties. 1.07 Gigadeaths.

This is from SSBNs alone.

The Chinese report calls for 5-12 million US casualties. Some one said this earlier, but the US is very well versed in the mathematics of MAD.


We are also the only power to launch a missile from a sub and detonate a live warhead over a target. Can't do that sort of all up test anymore, international treaties ban above ground tests. But our stuff works.
 
2013-11-02 08:50:03 AM

iirightii: Call it 25-60M America casualties. Still, a bargain when compared to 1.07GigaChines



You sound like some senile old general to call a Minimum of 10s of Millions of casualties a bargain.
 
2013-11-02 08:50:12 AM

cirby: That's nice. They also wouldn't do a damned thing if the Chinese decided to do a no-notice attack.

What could we do? Suddenly announce that we were going to sink any and all Chinese subs that came within six or seven thousand miles of the US coast? That's pretty much the whole planet.


RalphW: Any jarheads want to war game this for me?
Let's say the US pisses off China.
China parks it's nuke subs just off in international waters. The US sends, what? Warships? It's own subs? To face off.
Finally China says "fark it" and hits the launch code.
Then what?


Why would China launch a no-notice attack? No state has ever done this, no matter how shiate-for-brains crazy they've been. China's stated nuclear policy is second-strike only and their focus on SSBNs and SLBMs is compatible with that stated policy: deter other states from using nuclear weapons against it first. The size of their arsenal is also consistent.

There is absolutely no indication that the Chinese would be looking to deter a conventional force with nuclear weapons, as Pakistan does. It would be much worse off in a nuclear exchange than the United States or Russia (maybe a little better against India), so it doesn't make sense for them. Really, there's nothing about their nuclear posture that is more dangerous than the UK's or France's.
 
2013-11-02 08:51:32 AM

cirby: casual disregard:
US, Canada, and even Mexico have sophisticated anti-submarine programs in place.

That's nice. They also wouldn't do a damned thing if the Chinese decided to do a no-notice attack.

What could we do? Suddenly announce that we were going to sink any and all Chinese subs that came within six or seven thousand miles of the US coast? That's pretty much the whole planet.

Under current doctrine, we pretty much have to let them go wherever they want - and if the Chinese government suddenly went completely insane and decided to launch, our high-tech sub tracking systems would just give us a couple of minutes of warning, and let us sink the now-empty Chinese missile subs. Whee.

The interesting thing is how the Chinese are playing this. It almost sounds like they're prepping for something else, and want the nuclear threat to be a deterrent against the US interfering. Keep an eye on the South China Sea for a few weeks - they've been screwing around there in recent months, and really want the supposed oil and gas reserved under the Spratly Islands...


Here's a list of all the subs currently in the US Pac fleet:  http://www.csp.navy.mil/content/comsubpac_subsquadrons.shtml

How much you want to bet that each time one of these Chinese SSBNs leaves port, there's an SSN or SSGN tailing it within torpedo range?  They might get one ICBM off -- and it would ruin the days of more than a couple left-coasters -- but do you really think they could get more shots than that off?
 
Displayed 50 of 160 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report