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(610 WTVN)   When selling your guns out of your trunk, a bank parking lot is not the best place to do that (Some ads Not safe for work)   (610wtvn.com) divider line 104
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3635 clicks; posted to Main » on 01 Nov 2013 at 1:58 PM (51 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-11-01 03:33:23 PM  

topcon: cretinbob: Why is it even legal to sell guns out of the trunk of your car?


Oh yeah "zombies" are going to take over.....

It's called a "face to face transaction" and it's completely legal in almost every state.  The headline was misleading, it was a pre-arranged sale, just not some dude randomly selling guns out of his car to passerbys.  Regularly selling guns out of your car would, in fact, run afoul of having no FFL license, but there is not set "limit" on what this might be, you're simply not supposed to routinely profit from the sale of firearms without a license.  Even though people do this and get away with it, technically, you're not supposed to, but again, the laws are very ambiguous.

Long story short:  Guy who wanted to (very legally, it must be stated) sell a gun to another person met in a dumb place to do it.


It probably wasn't even a dumb place, a lot of times banks are in strip malls and the like.  So the meet could have been "hey let's meet in the Target parking lot on x street" (which has a bank on the corner).

The person(s) in the bank should be charged with misuse of 911 should be the story here.
 
2013-11-01 03:34:55 PM  
Also I love the insinuation that them doing it in plain sight was the stupid thing.  Yea at midnight in a dark alley would be a much smarter choice.

Visibility is the whole point numbnuts.
 
2013-11-01 03:35:12 PM  

meanmutton: cretinbob: Why is it even legal to sell guns out of the trunk of your car?


Oh yeah "zombies" are going to take over.....

Why shouldn't it be?


Because people with serious mental health issues or prior criminal history shouldn't be allowed to buy guns willy-nilly and you probably aren't doing a background check from the trunk of your car.

We need to stop equating guns with freedom.  There's other aspects to freedom and there are definitely other aspects to guns.
 
2013-11-01 03:35:46 PM  
Actually, every transaction I do with "internet people" has been at my bank, including gun sales.

Usually people are smart enough to keep it low key though. And I'm on a first name basis with everyone at the bank.
 
2013-11-01 03:37:27 PM  

IRQ12: Also I love the insinuation that them doing it in plain sight was the stupid thing.  Yea at midnight in a dark alley would be a much smarter choice.

Visibility is the whole point numbnuts.


What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.
 
2013-11-01 03:38:22 PM  
disagree
27.media.tumblr.com
 
2013-11-01 03:38:23 PM  

Alonjar: Actually, every transaction I do with "internet people" has been at my bank, including gun sales.

Usually people are smart enough to keep it low key though. And I'm on a first name basis with everyone at the bank.


This implies you didn't trust the guy(s) you sold the gun(s) to.

I'm not sure this is a compelling argument.
 
2013-11-01 03:39:45 PM  

BeesNuts: What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.


What's wrong with a parking lot, assuming we don't really care about hurt feelings over *gasp* seeing a gun?
 
2013-11-01 03:40:29 PM  
BeesNuts: meanmutton: cretinbob: Why is it even legal to sell guns out of the trunk of your car?


Oh yeah "zombies" are going to take over.....

Why shouldn't it be?

Because people with serious mental health issues or prior criminal history shouldn't be allowed to buy guns willy-nilly and you probably aren't doing a background check from the trunk of your car.


And you think that making it illegal for people to sell a gun in a public place will somehow make it MORE likely that background checks are going to occur?  How would forcing people to do this in a private place, away from cameras and the public, increase the chances of someone running a background check?
 
2013-11-01 03:41:43 PM  
..., one of the men is a former deputy who left the department several years ago....

Must be one of those heroic police officers we keep being told exist.

// at least it's clear why no charges are/will be filed.
 
2013-11-01 03:43:00 PM  

BeesNuts: IRQ12: Also I love the insinuation that them doing it in plain sight was the stupid thing.  Yea at midnight in a dark alley would be a much smarter choice.

Visibility is the whole point numbnuts.

What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.


When you're buying or selling any item of value, doing it in public generally is a good way to keep from getting robbed.
 
2013-11-01 03:43:16 PM  

BeesNuts: What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.


You go to the homes of random people you've met on the internet?  There's some ads on Craigslist I'd like you to answer...
 
2013-11-01 03:43:36 PM  

OnlyM3: ..., one of the men is a former deputy who left the department several years ago....
Must be one of those heroic police officers we keep being told exist.

// at least it's clear why no charges are/will be filed.


Yes, it is -- because no crimes were committed.
 
2013-11-01 03:43:56 PM  

Digitalstrange: Sin_City_Superhero: When selling your guns out of your trunk, a bank parking lot is not the best place to do that

So.......police sub-station? Elementary school parking lot? What's the call, here?

back part of Wal-Mart parking lot. No one flinches about guns there. Banks get funny about guns for obvious reasons.


when i was younger, i worked as a bank teller... and i would have called the cops without a second thought.  bank robberies are pretty common, so when you see a gun, you call the cops.  it's not a moment to be curious.  either, it is a robbery, and the cops show up and maybe foil the robbery, or it isn't a robbery, and the cops show up and nothing happens
 
2013-11-01 03:44:24 PM  

BeesNuts: This implies you didn't trust the guy(s) you sold the gun(s) to.

I'm not sure this is a compelling argument.


It's just insurance. Trust doesn't even enter into the equation that way. I do the same thing with electronics from Craig's List.

Also, it's just about impossible for one of the homes to be halfway between both homes. That's just how geography works.
 
2013-11-01 03:46:10 PM  

OnlyM3: ..., one of the men is a former deputy who left the department several years ago....
Must be one of those heroic police officers we keep being told exist.

// at least it's clear why no charges are/will be filed.


No charges are being filed because what they did wasn't illegal.  I once sold a gun in the parking lot of my bank, because the guy I was selling it to wanted to get his cash from there.  Of course, it was Alaska, where you could probably sell a gun in the parking lot of the police station and the only thing that would be said was "nice gun".  The point is, you don't have to be a cop to avoid charges.  It's no more illegal to sell a gun privately in a parking lot than it would be to sell a car there.
 
2013-11-01 03:46:21 PM  

BeesNuts: IRQ12: Also I love the insinuation that them doing it in plain sight was the stupid thing.  Yea at midnight in a dark alley would be a much smarter choice.

Visibility is the whole point numbnuts.

What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.


Maybe in my bedroom?  Or how about my work?  Maybe I can just leave a "honor system" drop box full of weapons on my porch?


It's kind of stupid to advertise "I have stuff to steal" then giving complete strangers your address so they can no show then come rob you.
 
2013-11-01 03:47:41 PM  

BeesNuts: Alonjar: Actually, every transaction I do with "internet people" has been at my bank, including gun sales.

Usually people are smart enough to keep it low key though. And I'm on a first name basis with everyone at the bank.

This implies you didn't trust the guy(s) you sold the gun(s) to.

I'm not sure this is a compelling argument.


More likely, you don't trust the person selling the gun.  The person doing the buying is the one with the wad of cash, after all.
 
2013-11-01 03:48:10 PM  

BeesNuts: What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.


You want strangers you met on the internet coming to your home for high value transactions?

Alternately, do you want to go to some internet stranger's home with a bunch of cash or a valuable firearm?

I've got a few rules for any such transaction:
1. Do the transaction in a public place that is not your home.
2. Maintain situational awareness.
3. Have at least friend with you.
4. Never get into the other party's vehicle.
 
Generally I also recommend that you and your friend be discreetly armed if that's legal in your area.
 
2013-11-01 03:48:41 PM  

meanmutton: BeesNuts: meanmutton: cretinbob: Why is it even legal to sell guns out of the trunk of your car?


Oh yeah "zombies" are going to take over.....

Why shouldn't it be?

Because people with serious mental health issues or prior criminal history shouldn't be allowed to buy guns willy-nilly and you probably aren't doing a background check from the trunk of your car.

And you think that making it illegal for people to sell a gun in a public place will somehow make it MORE likely that background checks are going to occur?  How would forcing people to do this in a private place, away from cameras and the public, increase the chances of someone running a background check?


I think requiring a license to sell your guns isn't unreasonable, but I'm sure you'll all compare guns to tomatoes and ask why that would be ok when farmers markets don't have to have licenses.

I'd argue that by not forcing any sort of regulations on where/how guns can be bought and sold we diffuse the market and make it harder to enforce any kind of rules at all.  Which I suspect is the point.

Now bring on the gun-grabber accusations.  I'm tired of defending myself by saying I like guns, like shooting, and like the gun owners I've spent any amount of time with.  I know, I know, any and all changes to existing gun law, apart from a law striking all other laws from the books of course, is an unacceptable violation of the 2nd amendment.
 
2013-11-01 03:49:27 PM  

meanmutton: BeesNuts: IRQ12: Also I love the insinuation that them doing it in plain sight was the stupid thing.  Yea at midnight in a dark alley would be a much smarter choice.

Visibility is the whole point numbnuts.

What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.

When you're buying or selling any item of value, doing it in public generally is a good way to keep from getting robbed.


So you think the guy you want to sell your gun to might be a robber?

That's not very responsible.
 
2013-11-01 03:50:24 PM  
Our ac/dc electronics teacher tried to sell us Tec-9's out of the back of his car, behind the school durring class.  Even had bags of ammo for sale at a inflated price.

Had like 5 of em in his trunk.  $350 each.

Very interesting teacher.
 
2013-11-01 03:51:11 PM  

BeesNuts: meanmutton: BeesNuts: meanmutton: cretinbob: Why is it even legal to sell guns out of the trunk of your car?


Oh yeah "zombies" are going to take over.....

Why shouldn't it be?

Because people with serious mental health issues or prior criminal history shouldn't be allowed to buy guns willy-nilly and you probably aren't doing a background check from the trunk of your car.

And you think that making it illegal for people to sell a gun in a public place will somehow make it MORE likely that background checks are going to occur?  How would forcing people to do this in a private place, away from cameras and the public, increase the chances of someone running a background check?

I think requiring a license to sell your guns isn't unreasonable, but I'm sure you'll all compare guns to tomatoes and ask why that would be ok when farmers markets don't have to have licenses.


Requiring a licensed individual to process firearm transactions is something which could reasonably be argued to reduce the chance of someone with serious mental health issues being able to buy a firearm willy-nilly.  Prohibiting the transaction from occurring in the sight of the public, however, can not.
 
2013-11-01 03:54:31 PM  

BeesNuts: meanmutton: BeesNuts: IRQ12: Also I love the insinuation that them doing it in plain sight was the stupid thing.  Yea at midnight in a dark alley would be a much smarter choice.

Visibility is the whole point numbnuts.

What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.

When you're buying or selling any item of value, doing it in public generally is a good way to keep from getting robbed.

So you think the guy you want to sell your gun to might be a robber?

That's not very responsible.


Yes, it is.

PS: you're making a really pitiful argument.
 
2013-11-01 03:55:12 PM  

BeesNuts: meanmutton: BeesNuts: IRQ12: Also I love the insinuation that them doing it in plain sight was the stupid thing.  Yea at midnight in a dark alley would be a much smarter choice.

Visibility is the whole point numbnuts.

What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.

When you're buying or selling any item of value, doing it in public generally is a good way to keep from getting robbed.

So you think the guy you want to sell your gun to might be a robber?

That's not very responsible.


It goes for any high value transaction. You could be selling an expensive toaster and someone might decide they want your toaster but they'd rather not pay for it.

Conversely, claiming you've got something expensive to sell (whether you really do or not) is an easy way to get an unsuspecting mark to bring you a nice pile of cash.

The best bet is to handle everything in a public place where nobody is going to feel like they can get away with anything hinky and to give the buyer and seller a chance to feel each other out, and to safely abort if anything doesn't seem right.
 
2013-11-01 03:55:34 PM  

BeesNuts: meanmutton: BeesNuts: IRQ12: Also I love the insinuation that them doing it in plain sight was the stupid thing.  Yea at midnight in a dark alley would be a much smarter choice.

Visibility is the whole point numbnuts.

What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.

When you're buying or selling any item of value, doing it in public generally is a good way to keep from getting robbed.

So you think the guy you want to sell your gun to might be a robber?

That's not very responsible.


Like I said upthread, I'd be more concerned if I was the buyer than the seller.  If I was the seller, I'd be concerned with making the potential buyer as comfortable as possible.

Either way, it's academic -- first, I live in a state where it's illegal.  Second, the answer to your question of "What's wrong with one or the other participants homes" is, in part, "to avoid people getting robbed".
 
2013-11-01 03:55:59 PM  

BeesNuts: This implies you didn't trust the guy(s) you sold the gun(s) to.

I'm not sure this is a compelling argument.


*shrug* Its a decent test for people I picked up years ago from doing craigslist sales.  Sketchy people  never want to meet at a bank...  and if they commit a crime like robbery on the bank property, it elevates the crime to actual bank robbery.
 
2013-11-01 03:57:44 PM  

meanmutton: BeesNuts: meanmutton: BeesNuts: meanmutton: cretinbob: Why is it even legal to sell guns out of the trunk of your car?


Oh yeah "zombies" are going to take over.....

Why shouldn't it be?

Because people with serious mental health issues or prior criminal history shouldn't be allowed to buy guns willy-nilly and you probably aren't doing a background check from the trunk of your car.

And you think that making it illegal for people to sell a gun in a public place will somehow make it MORE likely that background checks are going to occur?  How would forcing people to do this in a private place, away from cameras and the public, increase the chances of someone running a background check?

I think requiring a license to sell your guns isn't unreasonable, but I'm sure you'll all compare guns to tomatoes and ask why that would be ok when farmers markets don't have to have licenses.

Requiring a licensed individual to process firearm transactions is something which could reasonably be argued to reduce the chance of someone with serious mental health issues being able to buy a firearm willy-nilly.  Prohibiting the transaction from occurring in the sight of the public, however, can not.


Once you have a list of licensed firearm dealers you can handle things a bit better.  But it gets even easier to manage if there are specific places where gun sales are expected to occur, with the added bonus of people might expect to see guns there.

The license is only as good as the issuers ability to enforce their licensing regulations on the licensees.
 
2013-11-01 03:58:50 PM  

BeesNuts: I think requiring a license to sell your guns isn't unreasonable


So, I need a license to sell one gun? I'm sure Dems won't try and make it super expensive and difficult to get said license.

//An 800 number to the US DOJ and give them buyers name, dob, and ssn, they say yes or no. That's it. That is all that is needed to run a background, not enough for ya? Then you want way more than just background checks.
 
2013-11-01 04:01:32 PM  

JesseL: It goes for any high value transaction. You could be selling an expensive toaster and someone might decide they want your toaster but they'd rather not pay for it.


If only there were a way to vet the potential future owner of your weapon.

Oh well, wild west it is then.
 
2013-11-01 04:01:37 PM  

BeesNuts: meanmutton: BeesNuts: meanmutton: cretinbob: Why is it even legal to sell guns out of the trunk of your car?


Oh yeah "zombies" are going to take over.....

Why shouldn't it be?

Because people with serious mental health issues or prior criminal history shouldn't be allowed to buy guns willy-nilly and you probably aren't doing a background check from the trunk of your car.

And you think that making it illegal for people to sell a gun in a public place will somehow make it MORE likely that background checks are going to occur?  How would forcing people to do this in a private place, away from cameras and the public, increase the chances of someone running a background check?

I think requiring a license to sell your guns isn't unreasonable, but I'm sure you'll all compare guns to tomatoes and ask why that would be ok when farmers markets don't have to have licenses.

I'd argue that by not forcing any sort of regulations on where/how guns can be bought and sold we diffuse the market and make it harder to enforce any kind of rules at all.  Which I suspect is the point.

Now bring on the gun-grabber accusations.  I'm tired of defending myself by saying I like guns, like shooting, and like the gun owners I've spent any amount of time with.  I know, I know, any and all changes to existing gun law, apart from a law striking all other laws from the books of course, is an unacceptable violation of the 2nd amendment.


If someone regularly sells guns then, yes, it is not unreasonable to require a license. It's not reasonable to require a license if someone just wants to sell a gun they own.
 
2013-11-01 04:06:59 PM  

Ow! That was my feelings!: BeesNuts: I think requiring a license to sell your guns isn't unreasonable

So, I need a license to sell one gun? I'm sure Dems won't try and make it super expensive and difficult to get said license.

//An 800 number to the US DOJ and give them buyers name, dob, and ssn, they say yes or no. That's it. That is all that is needed to run a background, not enough for ya? Then you want way more than just background checks.


No, I just want some reasonable guarantee that they are being conducted.  If you're asking *me* I think the license should cost between 35 and 50 dollars and require registration, perhaps some kind of exam to show you understand your state's laws, and very little, if anything else.  Failures to conduct background checks for a sale are obviously difficult to spot until someone uses the gun in question to commit a crime, but in that event, the license should be revoked, the owner's status as a dealer reviewed and some kind of scaled suspension can be put into place.

Like a driver's license.

If you assume that the dems want to take your guns away forever and ever, then you're incapable of debate on the topic.  It's a battle, and the lines are drawn for you if you think that way.
 
2013-11-01 04:09:13 PM  

BeesNuts: Once you have a list of licensed firearm dealers you can handle things a bit better.


http://www.atf.gov/content/contact-us/FOIA/listing-of-FFLs

BeesNuts: But it gets even easier to manage if there are specific places where gun sales are expected to occur, with the added bonus of people might expect to see guns there.


Like the gunshows that certain people like to lose their shiat over?

BeesNuts: The license is only as good as the issuers ability to enforce their licensing regulations on the licensees.


The BATFE is pretty hardcore about their regulation of licensees. What gets completely ignored though is the people who try to buy guns from licensed dealers and fail their background checks. Those people are committing felonies by attempting to purchase firearms as prohibited possessors,  they're perjuring themselves on the 4473 form, and they're provoding all the evidence needed for a slam dunk prosecution. All that happens though, is that those people have to leave the shop without the gun they wanted to buy. Almost zero of them (over 1 million since the inception of the NICS program) are ever prosecuted.

So why in the hell is that elephant in the room so ignored?
 
2013-11-01 04:09:29 PM  

IRQ12: The person(s) in the bank should be charged with misuse of 911 should be the story here.


Yes, its entirely unreasonable for a bank teller observing unmarked cars pulling up into the bank's private parking lot and individuals who are neither obviously police nor military pulling weapons out of said cars to be concerned in any way, especially given that no one in the history of the world has ever robbed a bank with a gun.
 
2013-11-01 04:10:01 PM  

stevetherobot: BeesNuts: meanmutton: BeesNuts: meanmutton: cretinbob: Why is it even legal to sell guns out of the trunk of your car?


Oh yeah "zombies" are going to take over.....

Why shouldn't it be?

Because people with serious mental health issues or prior criminal history shouldn't be allowed to buy guns willy-nilly and you probably aren't doing a background check from the trunk of your car.

And you think that making it illegal for people to sell a gun in a public place will somehow make it MORE likely that background checks are going to occur?  How would forcing people to do this in a private place, away from cameras and the public, increase the chances of someone running a background check?

I think requiring a license to sell your guns isn't unreasonable, but I'm sure you'll all compare guns to tomatoes and ask why that would be ok when farmers markets don't have to have licenses.

I'd argue that by not forcing any sort of regulations on where/how guns can be bought and sold we diffuse the market and make it harder to enforce any kind of rules at all.  Which I suspect is the point.

Now bring on the gun-grabber accusations.  I'm tired of defending myself by saying I like guns, like shooting, and like the gun owners I've spent any amount of time with.  I know, I know, any and all changes to existing gun law, apart from a law striking all other laws from the books of course, is an unacceptable violation of the 2nd amendment.

If someone regularly sells guns then, yes, it is not unreasonable to require a license. It's not reasonable to require a license if someone just wants to sell a gun they own.


It's reasonable to require a license to own and operate a car.  In fact, it's reasonable to require different classes of licenses for different types of vehicles and modes of operation.  Is it not reasonable to require a license if you just want to drive a rental car once?  What if you have a class C license, but want to deliver a big rig for your company without that license?  Kosher?
 
2013-11-01 04:11:14 PM  

stevetherobot: It's not reasonable to require a license if someone just wants to sell a gun they own.


Just do a title and and transfer, like states do with vehicles.
 
2013-11-01 04:13:45 PM  
CSB:
Banked with Wellfargo. They had a 'no guns' sign on the door. (which I am sure prevented all robberies). When Wellsfargo bought them out, they took the 'no guns' sign off the door. I figured they were cool with lawful carry. I mean who is gonna rob a bank with a lobby full of people with guns? I had been carrying concealed there for about a year or so. One day I guess I didn't put my holster in right, and the slide was digging into my hip in the car, so I tucked my shirt between the slide and me. I forgot to cover the gun back up when I got out. (Open carry is lawful in VA). I am standing at the stationary desk, filling out a deposit slip when the branch manager gingerly approaches me.
Lady: Sir....are you law enforcement?
Me: Huh? No. Why?
Lady: (Suddenly much more forceful) Sir. You are NOT allowed to have a gun in here!
Me: Oh, you don't have anything on your door saying so.
Lady: (condescendingly) Sir, we dont *have* to have something on the door for you to not be allowed to have a gun in here.
Me: You're absolutely right. You, as a representitive of the bank can inform me of your policy, and that counts as legal notice. But if you don't want people to have guns in here, maybe you should post something.
Lady: Sir, we don't have to post something, because NO ONE brings guns in here. Ever.
Me: No one that you know of, because they have all been concealed. I've been bringing a gun in here for well over a year.
Lady: Well you need to take it outside. You can go ahead and give the teller your deposit slip, and complete your transaction when you return without the gun.
Me: Can I swipe my ATM card, so she'll have my info?
Lady: Sure. Then you need to leave.
Me: *swipes card*. Let me ask you this. You have this policy, but you don't have it posted. if you don't want guns in here, how exactly are people supposed to know?
Lady: (perplexed) Well....I don't know.
Me: The bank used to have a sign. You all took it down.  You should really put one back up if you feel that strongly about it.
Lady: I will talk to the general manager about doing it.
Me: But let me ask you this. What do you think that will do for you, other than keeping people from having guns in here that wouldn't do anything bad with them anyway?
Lady: Well...if someone is going to rob the place, and see that they can't have a gun, it will make him think twice, because he would get in even more trouble.
Me: I see. So a person getting ready to commit a felony might be stopped if there is a chance he can also be charged with a class 4 misdemeanor?
Lady: Exactly.
Me: Wow.
Teller: Sir, your deposit slip
Me: Oh, looks like I am done here. I guess I don't have to take my gun to my car after all, since my transaction is complete and I'm leaving. Have a nice day.
Lady: (suddenly *somewhat* friendly) You too sir. have a good day!

(A year and a half later, still no sign on the door)
 
2013-11-01 04:14:09 PM  

BeesNuts: JesseL: It goes for any high value transaction. You could be selling an expensive toaster and someone might decide they want your toaster but they'd rather not pay for it.

If only there were a way to vet the potential future owner of your weapon.

Oh well, wild west it is then.


As a matter of fact I hold two Federal Firearms Licenses; one a personal license as a collector of curios and relics, the other as a manufacturer and dealer of firearms. I'm registered with the FBI to run background checks through their NICS system. Any sale I make these days is as licensed and checked as you could wish for.

I know how the system works, and if you'll read my previous post you'll see what's wrong with it (aside from all the nutty freedom talk you'd dismiss).
 
2013-11-01 04:14:55 PM  

BeesNuts: Ow! That was my feelings!: BeesNuts: I think requiring a license to sell your guns isn't unreasonable

So, I need a license to sell one gun? I'm sure Dems won't try and make it super expensive and difficult to get said license.

//An 800 number to the US DOJ and give them buyers name, dob, and ssn, they say yes or no. That's it. That is all that is needed to run a background, not enough for ya? Then you want way more than just background checks.

No, I just want some reasonable guarantee that they are being conducted.  If you're asking *me* I think the license should cost between 35 and 50 dollars and require registration, perhaps some kind of exam to show you understand your state's laws, and very little, if anything else.  Failures to conduct background checks for a sale are obviously difficult to spot until someone uses the gun in question to commit a crime, but in that event, the license should be revoked, the owner's status as a dealer reviewed and some kind of scaled suspension can be put into place.

Like a driver's license.

If you assume that the dems want to take your guns away forever and ever, then you're incapable of debate on the topic.  It's a battle, and the lines are drawn for you if you think that way.


I don't assume ALL Dems want gun prohibition, but every gun prohibitionist I've debated/known for the last 20 years has been a Dem.
 
2013-11-01 04:28:25 PM  

JesseL: BeesNuts: What's wrong with one or the other participants homes, assuming we really don't care who's buying or selling because tyranny or whatever.

You want strangers you met on the internet coming to your home for high value transactions?

Alternately, do you want to go to some internet stranger's home with a bunch of cash or a valuable firearm?

I've got a few rules for any such transaction:
1. Do the transaction in a public place that is not your home.
2. Maintain situational awareness.
3. Have at least friend with you.
4. Never get into the other party's vehicle.
 
Generally I also recommend that you and your friend be discreetly armed if that's legal in your area.


That's the exact MO I've used for the two private sales I've conducted.  Oh, and both buyers were CHL holders for the "mentally ill people will get their hands on your guns" posters in this thread.

/Will probably have a third transaction like this once I list my Noveske
//CSB
 
2013-11-01 04:31:04 PM  
I sold a Kel Tec Sub 2000 to some donkey a few years ago.
We'd met in a public place, as dictated by me for our mutual safety, in this case it was the car park of a local Stop'n'Rob.
Anyway, donkey decides he likes it, likes the price, but needs to know if it works ok. For a moment I thought he meant the folding capacity (the Sub 2000 is a folding rifle), but no, he meant does it fire straight.
Quicker than I could stop him he'd inserted the mag from his carry weapon, a Glock in the same caliber and using the same mags, and was shooting up the store, the sidewalk, he even took three shots at the moon.
I let him have his fun and then politely informed him that  by doing this it now constituted a completed sale, any further uncertainty or even haggling would not be considered.
I was not at all surprised that he paid up there and then, I was open carrying a Gold Desert Eagle in .50cal and he knew all it would take is one shot and his brains would be spread over 16 city blocks. Plus the store owner looked pretty pissed so the donkey wanted to relocate I imagine.
That's how I do business, I assume the ass-clowns in the article are new to all this.
 
2013-11-01 04:31:20 PM  

Jae0o0: Bought a gun out of a trunk in a walmart parking lot once. No arrest or charges. Good times


I've sold an SKS, AK47, 18" police type 12 gauge, handgun, bolt action rifle and they were ALL either out of a McDonalds parking lot or Jack in the Box parking lot.

Good times!  I think I even have the receipt from the AK47!
 
2013-11-01 04:31:27 PM  

MythDragon: CSB:

[CS elided]

(A year and a half later, still no sign on the door)

Have the guards stopped looking at you funny and fingering their holsters when they see you walk in?
 
2013-11-01 04:37:32 PM  

Somacandra: IRQ12: The person(s) in the bank should be charged with misuse of 911 should be the story here.

Yes, its entirely unreasonable for a bank teller observing unmarked cars pulling up into the bank's private parking lot and individuals who are neither obviously police nor military pulling weapons out of said cars to be concerned in any way, especially given that no one in the history of the world has ever robbed a bank with a gun.


No one said they were in the bank parking lot.  Yes it is absolutely unreasonable to simply see people with weapons and call police.  Just as much as if I called because someone with a black shirt was outside.

If you look at the town the entire fricking town is visible from the bank and most likely they were on the PUBLIC street in front of the bank, which is located at the only public place in the town, with parking.
 
2013-11-01 04:51:02 PM  

White_Scarf_Syndrome: Jae0o0: Bought a gun out of a trunk in a walmart parking lot once. No arrest or charges. Good times

I've sold an SKS, AK47, 18" police type 12 gauge, handgun, bolt action rifle and they were ALL either out of a McDonalds parking lot or Jack in the Box parking lot.

Good times!  I think I even have the receipt from the AK47!


I've met outside a Home Depot to buy a shotgun.  While I was buying my Ruger semiautomatic outside the Bass Pro Shop at Discover Mills Mall in Georgia, there were 3-4 other gun sales going on around us.  Buy your gun, go into Bass Pro for ammo -- very convenient.
 
2013-11-01 04:57:21 PM  

BeesNuts: stevetherobot: BeesNuts: meanmutton: BeesNuts: meanmutton: cretinbob: Why is it even legal to sell guns out of the trunk of your car?


Oh yeah "zombies" are going to take over.....

Why shouldn't it be?

Because people with serious mental health issues or prior criminal history shouldn't be allowed to buy guns willy-nilly and you probably aren't doing a background check from the trunk of your car.

And you think that making it illegal for people to sell a gun in a public place will somehow make it MORE likely that background checks are going to occur?  How would forcing people to do this in a private place, away from cameras and the public, increase the chances of someone running a background check?

I think requiring a license to sell your guns isn't unreasonable, but I'm sure you'll all compare guns to tomatoes and ask why that would be ok when farmers markets don't have to have licenses.

I'd argue that by not forcing any sort of regulations on where/how guns can be bought and sold we diffuse the market and make it harder to enforce any kind of rules at all.  Which I suspect is the point.

Now bring on the gun-grabber accusations.  I'm tired of defending myself by saying I like guns, like shooting, and like the gun owners I've spent any amount of time with.  I know, I know, any and all changes to existing gun law, apart from a law striking all other laws from the books of course, is an unacceptable violation of the 2nd amendment.

If someone regularly sells guns then, yes, it is not unreasonable to require a license. It's not reasonable to require a license if someone just wants to sell a gun they own.

It's reasonable to require a license to own and operate a car.  In fact, it's reasonable to require different classes of licenses for different types of vehicles and modes of operation.  Is it not reasonable to require a license if you just want to drive a rental car once?  What if you have a class C license, but want to deliver a big rig for your company without ...


But you don't need a license to sell your car.
 
2013-11-01 05:09:56 PM  
stevetherobot:It's reasonable to require a license to own and operate a car.  In fact, it's reasonable to require different classes of licenses for different types of vehicles and modes of operation.  Is it not reasonable to require a license if you just want to drive a rental car once?  What if you have a class C license, but want to deliver a big rig for your company without ...

But you don't need a license to sell your car.
 


Or buy one for that matter.
 
2013-11-01 05:11:25 PM  
Why not do it at a gun dealer with a shooting range? Test the merch before you purch!
 
2013-11-01 05:21:04 PM  
A bank parking lot can be a good place to make a transaction with people you don't trust.

Lots of surveillance, nothing exceptional takes place the surveillance of your transaction is meaningless, if someone decides to be stupid they choose the wrong place to do it.
 
2013-11-01 05:22:09 PM  

drongozone: Everyone knows the best place to buy a gun in a trunk is at the Denny's on Central Ave. in Albuquerque.


CSB: My brother works as a server at that Denny's and is also a huge Breaking Bad fan. Since the conclusion of the series he's had dozens of customer asking which seat Walter sat at, what he ordered. He's had people take photos of them with their 52 Grand Slam. None of the other servers are fans of the show, so he makes great tips off of fans and loves waiting on them.

/still has to deal with legions Central Ave vagrants
 
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