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(Guardian)   Gallant spent his $27 in 2009 on an investment of 5,000 bitcoins that grew to be worth over $886,000 in four years. Goofus spent his $27 in 2009 on a case of beer and drugs that was worth the destruction of several million brain cells   (theguardian.com) divider line 187
    More: Spiffy, investments, private keys, digital currency, Silk Road  
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7201 clicks; posted to Main » on 29 Oct 2013 at 3:51 PM (48 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



187 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-10-29 03:54:38 PM
Sell, Mortimer, sell!
 
2013-10-29 03:56:20 PM
$27 for a case of beer and drugs? I think it would be either/or.
 
2013-10-29 03:57:50 PM
.......and I call complete and total bullshiat.
 
2013-10-29 03:58:30 PM

GanjSmokr: $27 for a case of beer and drugs? I think it would be either/or.


Seriously. This Goofus person obviously has amazing people/bargaining skills. He's probably a CEO and makes $886,000 when he poops.
 
2013-10-29 03:59:06 PM
/poop thread
 
2013-10-29 03:59:55 PM
Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.
 
2013-10-29 04:00:06 PM
i poo bitcoins
 
2013-10-29 04:00:23 PM
Beer's not a drug?
 
GBB
2013-10-29 04:00:41 PM

megarian: /poop thread


cdn.raamdev.com
 
2013-10-29 04:01:18 PM
www.thebubblebubble.com
 
2013-10-29 04:01:42 PM

Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.


That's what I was going to ask. Also, for something to increase in value so dramatically you'd think you'd've heard a lot more about them over the years.
 
2013-10-29 04:01:43 PM

GBB: megarian: /poop thread


HORRAY!
 
2013-10-29 04:03:16 PM

Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.


@$27, demand was low (not many people knew about them, and fewer thought it was more than an idea that was going to die, and production was easy.

@$866, demand is high (far more people know about them, more places take them), and they become harder and harder to produce each time one is made.
 
2013-10-29 04:04:29 PM

MelGoesOnTour: Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.

That's what I was going to ask. Also, for something to increase in value so dramatically you'd think you'd've heard a lot more about them over the years.


What? Bit coins have been all over the news.

I agree the rise in value has been inexplicable, but they've been in the news a ton.
 
2013-10-29 04:05:47 PM

megarian: /poop thread


if you do indeed poop thread then you might be able to darn my socks with your pooper?
They are brown socks...
 
2013-10-29 04:05:48 PM
Good luck exchanging them for that amount - I'm not sure any of the exchanges will make a transaction that large.

That said, I wish I had bought some back when I was looking at them, when they were trading at parity with the dollar.
 
2013-10-29 04:06:03 PM
An alarming number of bitcoins have never been spent and are owned by very few individuals.

One of those people can individually tank the entire market.
 
2013-10-29 04:06:39 PM
And drunken penny stock purchases 30 years ago turned a friend's father into the majority shareholder of a small tool and die company.

If you threw $27 at every long-shot out there, you'd go broke.
 
2013-10-29 04:06:41 PM
Gallant still can't transfer the bitcoins into a useable currency, so for anything but being on paper, they both ended up with the same amount of money, but Goofus at least got beer out of it.
 
2013-10-29 04:07:08 PM

LemSkroob: @$27, demand was low (not many people knew about them, and fewer thought it was more than an idea that was going to die, and production was easy.

@$866, demand is high (far more people know about them, more places take them), and they become harder and harder to produce each time one is made.


That really doesn't explain anything. It tells me why the price jumped, not why a bitcoin would be assigned value in the first place.
 
2013-10-29 04:07:14 PM

Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.


Probably money laundering in some way, and/or a way to get money from the US out to offshore accounts without leaving an audit trail.
 
2013-10-29 04:07:21 PM

Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.


The exact same thing that gives everything value, perception. If enough other people perceive something to have value and there's a market for it, it exists.

bitcoin is unique in that it's verifiable and non recourse. There's no way to do a charge back or claim fraud. There's also no safety net so if you loose the coins/wallet file, forget the password or they are stolen, you can't get them back. Likewise if you know enough to makeup a public private key you can memorize it and it is as inherently secure as you are until the drugs and wrenchs come into play.

/oblig
//likes bitcoin a lot
 
2013-10-29 04:07:30 PM
I really don't get why anyone would pay that much for a bitcoin, but I wish to hell I had some to sell.
 
2013-10-29 04:08:30 PM
Whenever I hear the term "bitcoins", this image comes to mind:

sickr.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-10-29 04:09:23 PM

YoOjo: megarian: /poop thread

if you do indeed poop thread then you might be able to darn my socks with your pooper?
They are brown socks...


I...I might have to quote this for future use.
 
2013-10-29 04:09:59 PM

limeyfellow: Gallant still can't transfer the bitcoins into a useable currency, so for anything but being on paper, they both ended up with the same amount of money, but Goofus at least got beer out of it.


I would assume in a case like this you'd have to start cashing out small chunks at a time, and then pay capital gains taxes on it. Some lawyering would probably have to be involved.
 
2013-10-29 04:10:13 PM

limeyfellow: Gallant still can't transfer the bitcoins into a useable currency, so for anything but being on paper, they both ended up with the same amount of money, but Goofus at least got beer out of it.


that
 
2013-10-29 04:10:27 PM

aseras: Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.

The exact same thing that gives everything value, perception. If enough other people perceive something to have value and there's a market for it, it exists.

bitcoin is unique in that it's verifiable and non recourse. There's no way to do a charge back or claim fraud. There's also no safety net so if you loose the coins/wallet file, forget the password or they are stolen, you can't get them back. Likewise if you know enough to makeup a public private key you can memorize it and it is as inherently secure as you are until the drugs and wrenchs come into play.

/oblig
//likes bitcoin a lot


But an increase of over 32,000 (i.e., 27 x 32K = approx. 866K)? I don't believe it.
 
2013-10-29 04:10:58 PM

megarian: YoOjo: megarian: /poop thread

if you do indeed poop thread then you might be able to darn my socks with your pooper?
They are brown socks...

I...I might have to quote this for future use.


Quote?
There's a fee?
 
2013-10-29 04:12:18 PM

aseras: The exact same thing that gives everything value, perception.


But that's just it. There's nothing to perceive. Your explanation of bitcoin's unique features does nothing to lead me to believe it has any benefits not already available by other means, with considerable drawbacks that make it useless in many situations.
 
2013-10-29 04:13:07 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2013-10-29 04:13:37 PM
Yeah, and that investment in the Ascot Partners fund in 1996 was worth 25x as much in 2006...unless you kept it in until 2008, when the Feds arrested Bernie Madoff.
 
2013-10-29 04:13:58 PM
It's easy to tell what good investments are years after the fact

/Details at 11
 
2013-10-29 04:14:07 PM

Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?.


RTFFaq:

Why do bitcoins have value?

Bitcoins have value because they are useful as a form of money. Bitcoin has the characteristics of money (durability, portability, fungibility, scarcity, divisibility, and recognizability) based on the properties of mathematics rather than relying on physical properties (like gold and silver) or trust in central authorities (like fiat currencies). In short, Bitcoin is backed by mathematics. With these attributes, all that is required for a form of money to hold value is trust and adoption. In the case of Bitcoin, this can be measured by its growing base of users, merchants, and startups. As with all currency, bitcoin's value comes only and directly from people willing to accept them as payment.
- http://bitcoin.org/en/faq#why-do-bitcoins-have-value
 
2013-10-29 04:14:26 PM

YoOjo: megarian: YoOjo: megarian: /poop thread

if you do indeed poop thread then you might be able to darn my socks with your pooper?
They are brown socks...

I...I might have to quote this for future use.

Quote?
There's a fee?


Absolutely.

That will be $122.50 and BIE*.

*I don't really care who the owner of the Bs are.
 
2013-10-29 04:14:28 PM

Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.


Why were tulip bulbs worth the equivalent of around $40000 each in early February 1636?
 
2013-10-29 04:15:42 PM

tricycleracer: And drunken penny stock purchases 30 years ago turned a friend's father into the majority shareholder of a small tool and die company.

If you threw $27 at every long-shot out there, you'd go broke.



That's one 'wierd trick' that 'they' don't want you to know!!
 
2013-10-29 04:17:15 PM

MelGoesOnTour: aseras: Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.

The exact same thing that gives everything value, perception. If enough other people perceive something to have value and there's a market for it, it exists.

bitcoin is unique in that it's verifiable and non recourse. There's no way to do a charge back or claim fraud. There's also no safety net so if you loose the coins/wallet file, forget the password or they are stolen, you can't get them back. Likewise if you know enough to makeup a public private key you can memorize it and it is as inherently secure as you are until the drugs and wrenchs come into play.

/oblig
//likes bitcoin a lot

But an increase of over 32,000 (i.e., 27 x 32K = approx. 866K)? I don't believe it.


Reality doesn't rely on your believing it.
 
2013-10-29 04:17:50 PM

megarian: YoOjo: megarian: YoOjo: megarian: /poop thread

if you do indeed poop thread then you might be able to darn my socks with your pooper?
They are brown socks...

I...I might have to quote this for future use.

Quote?
There's a fee?

Absolutely.

That will be $122.50 and BIE*.

*I don't really care who the owner of the Bs are.


I ain't got no stinking dollars, stuck in England again with them there Quids.
Plus, I'm going to assume just this once the Bs are Bitcoins.

/pretty proud of myself for never having tried to flirt with any Farketterers.
//No BIE cos no EIP
///smiley face go here
 
2013-10-29 04:19:12 PM

YoOjo: megarian: YoOjo: megarian: YoOjo: megarian: /poop thread

if you do indeed poop thread then you might be able to darn my socks with your pooper?
They are brown socks...

I...I might have to quote this for future use.

Quote?
There's a fee?

Absolutely.

That will be $122.50 and BIE*.

*I don't really care who the owner of the Bs are.

I ain't got no stinking dollars, stuck in England again with them there Quids.
Plus, I'm going to assume just this once the Bs are Bitcoins.

/pretty proud of myself for never having tried to flirt with any Farketterers.
//No BIE cos no EIP
///smiley face go here


Heheeeee
 
2013-10-29 04:20:07 PM

Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.


Nothing is backing bitcoins. They have value because people perceive them as having value, nothing more.

And turning bitcoins into cash right now is a huge challenge. This is a very fragile market, and any appreciable amount of people cashing out will crash it. A handful of folks own like 90% of all the coins, though they've at least been smart enough to sell slowly. But sooner or later we will have "The Great Bitcoin Panic of 20XX."
 
2013-10-29 04:21:00 PM

xria: Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.

Why were tulip bulbs worth the equivalent of around $40000 each in early February 1636?


And like everything of worth, the answer is "because they were."

Worth is its own tautology.
 
2013-10-29 04:21:24 PM
Since bit coins are mostly used on Silk Roads and other "private" purchasing sites to buy illegal or black market items I say....someone's probably watching ya buddy. Very closely. Say, weren't those things designed to only have so many "issued" then by a certain year become obsolete? Fark it. One more thing that happens in the world that doesn't involve me. Ignorance is bliss.
 
2013-10-29 04:23:52 PM
no banks needed!! thanks obama
 
2013-10-29 04:24:33 PM

Supes: Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.

Nothing is backing bitcoins. They have value because people perceive them as having value, nothing more.

And turning bitcoins into cash right now is a huge challenge. This is a very fragile market, and any appreciable amount of people cashing out will crash it. A handful of folks own like 90% of all the coins, though they've at least been smart enough to sell slowly. But sooner or later we will have "The Great Bitcoin Panic of 20XX."


So they should use their bitcoins to buy pieces of paper that say they own gold?
 
2013-10-29 04:27:06 PM

fredklein: Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?.

RTFFaq:

Why do bitcoins have value?

Bitcoins have value because they are useful as a form of money. Bitcoin has the characteristics of money (durability, portability, fungibility, scarcity, divisibility, and recognizability) based on the properties of mathematics rather than relying on physical properties (like gold and silver) or trust in central authorities (like fiat currencies). In short, Bitcoin is backed by mathematics. With these attributes, all that is required for a form of money to hold value is trust and adoption. In the case of Bitcoin, this can be measured by its growing base of users, merchants, and startups. As with all currency, bitcoin's value comes only and directly from people willing to accept them as payment.
- http://bitcoin.org/en/faq#why-do-bitcoins-have-value



Yeah, that's a bunch of information-free BS.  What value did the first bitcoin produced have?  Riddle me that?

I would say the inherent value of a bitcoin is related to the time and computing power required to generate it, and on top of that is the speculative value related to the market economics that have grown up around them.

That is, for the first bitcoin generated - if it took a week of running ten computers to "mine" it, I'd say it has a value of around $1000, since you could conceivably generate that much income using them in "standard" ways to make money.  I.E. - the opportunity cost of using the computers to generate the bitcoin was $1000.
 
2013-10-29 04:27:59 PM
But now that Silk Road is gone, all the fun of using your bitcoins to hire hitmen and buy vicodin on the black market is gone with it.
 
2013-10-29 04:28:31 PM
So, who else wants to poop on my socks?

/for free this time
 
2013-10-29 04:29:15 PM

Sergeant Grumbles: Can someone explain to me why bitcoins have any value whatsoever?
I understand that with a fiat currency, any given thing, like paper dollars, can have value, I just don't get what the backing for bitcoins is that could turn $27 in $886K.



Please reread what you posted, and get back to us.
 
2013-10-29 04:29:24 PM

teenytinycornteeth: But now that Silk Road is gone, all the fun of using your bitcoins to hire hitmen and buy vicodin on the black market is gone with it.


Other illegal trading sites may exist.

/not that I know anything about anything like that, oh no
 
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