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(Omaha World Herald)   Parents of three students expelled for bringing BB guns into school are appealing the punishment, as they feel that their precious snowflakes should be allowed to break the rules   (omaha.com) divider line 117
    More: Asinine, Sandy Hook Elementary, bb guns, eye protection, Omaha Public Schools, punishments, elementary schools, BBs  
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5438 clicks; posted to Main » on 26 Oct 2013 at 8:40 PM (46 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-26 06:26:47 PM
Its pretty damn obvious this day in age that bringing anything to school that resembles a gun is gonna get your ass expelled

This isn't a zero tolerance problem. These boys knowingly broke the damn rules.
 
2013-10-26 06:46:18 PM
Eastlack said Brandon got the toy gun for his birthday. Three days later, he and his friends were shooting in the backyard. They decided to move their game to the open grounds of Grace Abbott Elementary School about a block from the Eastlacks' home in the Pepperwood subdivision. It was after school hours, she said.

I could see me doing that as a kid and not thinking that I was "bringing a gun to school".
 
2013-10-26 06:47:52 PM

Barfmaker: Eastlack said Brandon got the toy gun for his birthday. Three days later, he and his friends were shooting in the backyard. They decided to move their game to the open grounds of Grace Abbott Elementary School about a block from the Eastlacks' home in the Pepperwood subdivision. It was after school hours, she said.

I could see me doing that as a kid and not thinking that I was "bringing a gun to school".


Its still a No Gun Zone
 
2013-10-26 07:25:38 PM
On the fence here. I'm just going to pop some corn.
 
2013-10-26 07:30:00 PM
Damn kids broke the broke the damn rules, damn it.
 
2013-10-26 07:41:09 PM
I'd support the decision if they were shooting the BB guns on school grounds when school was in session, but it seems a bit extreme if they were on school grounds after school had let out and there weren't students or teachers around.
 
2013-10-26 08:02:44 PM

TuteTibiImperes: I'd support the decision if they were shooting the BB guns on school grounds when school was in session, but it seems a bit extreme if they were on school grounds after school had let out and there weren't students or teachers around.


Hell, it wasn't even like they just stayed after school. They just decided to go down to the school and play. The school wouldn't have even had to know about. It's unclear as to how they found out.
 
2013-10-26 08:10:19 PM

cman: This isn't a zero tolerance problem. These boys knowingly broke the damn rules.


And all rules require expulsion? I'm not saying not to punish the kids but expulsion should be pretty rare.
 
2013-10-26 08:36:36 PM
And the parents who bought the children the airsoft guns neglected to have a discussion with the children about safe and appropriate places to use them? Like, nowhere near the school?

These sound like the kind of parents who would have called the lawyers from inside the ER as soon as one of the kids took a shot to the eye.
 
2013-10-26 08:42:45 PM
So are we going with the "rules are rules" angle or are we relying on "common sense"?

It's arbitrary sometimes.
 
2013-10-26 08:45:44 PM

cman: Its pretty damn obvious this day in age that bringing anything to school that resembles a gun is gonna get your ass expelled

This isn't a zero tolerance problem. These boys knowingly broke the damn rules.


Except this is a zero tolerance problem.  Not every infraction needs to be punished with the maximum possible punishment.  Perhaps a suspension is more warranted.  If they Had brought in actual guns I might be more willing to agree with expulsion.
 
2013-10-26 08:48:07 PM
Main thing that irks me is that later that year, they were playing laser tag on school grounds for a school carnival. I think the kids ought to go back just from this.
 
2013-10-26 08:49:22 PM
That so-called 'kid' looks like he should be playing drums for Ween or something, not playing with his little zombie bratz pretend rifle.
Seriously, he looks about 35 years old.
 
2013-10-26 08:50:20 PM
What the fark is wrong with these retarded kids and their idiot parents? Getting them BB guns and letting them play with them outside? They should be indoors playing XBox and eating tater nuggets like their peers.
 
2013-10-26 08:50:36 PM
I was ready to actually agree that brining BB guns to school should be punishable, but then seeing that these were airsoft guns, not dangerous to each other if they were wearing proper goggles (hopefully) and they just went down to an open area to shoot at things and each other.  It's fun and they did nothing wrong they were just looking for a open area to run around in and have some fun.
 
2013-10-26 08:50:51 PM
They tried to expel my son a few years back because I live less than a block from the school and someone saw him loading guns into the car one Friday afternoon while they were walking home from school and my son and I were leaving on a hunting trip. Took 4 weeks and a lawyer to get him back into school all because they said that the kids coming home where still in 'school' until they got home and 'school hours where not over' and he was 'to close to the school so he should have known better'. A kid with a gun that fires little plastic pellets (Honestly you are far more likely to be hurt with paintball and paintball causes fewer hospital requiring injures than bowling and golf, let alone soccer, baseball, basketball or football that they would be welcome to play on school grounds), playing with his friends should not have to suffer the rest of his life because of the mistake. Those saying otherwise never had children, have no empathy, and forgot what it's like to be a child themselves.
 
2013-10-26 08:51:33 PM
Did they care about this rule before their kids were expelled?
 
2013-10-26 08:51:56 PM
You know who else had a Zero Tolerance policy...
 
2013-10-26 08:53:54 PM
After school hours and no school official/employee was involved in the original incident SHOULD result in no school based repercussions.  But that would require thought on the part of the school board, something they're not particularly known for.
 
2013-10-26 08:54:22 PM

cenobyte40k: They tried to expel my son a few years back because I live less than a block from the school and someone saw him loading guns into the car one Friday afternoon while they were walking home from school and my son and I were leaving on a hunting trip. Took 4 weeks and a lawyer to get him back into school all because they said that the kids coming home where still in 'school' until they got home and 'school hours where not over' and he was 'to close to the school so he should have known better'. A kid with a gun that fires little plastic pellets (Honestly you are far more likely to be hurt with paintball and paintball causes fewer hospital requiring injures than bowling and golf, let alone soccer, baseball, basketball or football that they would be welcome to play on school grounds), playing with his friends should not have to suffer the rest of his life because of the mistake. Those saying otherwise never had children, have no empathy, and forgot what it's like to be a child themselves.


I pictured you saying that while getting increasingly upset until in the last two lines you break down crying and it ends with you sobbing, head down, and fades.
 
2013-10-26 08:56:27 PM
So subby doesn't know the difference between "into" school and on the playground after the school was closed, huh?  Sounds like you should be on the school board.
 
2013-10-26 09:00:20 PM
Somewhere in the dust of punishment fitting the crime is the new and shiney all the punishment fear and loathing can generate.
Zero Tolerance is Zero Intelligence.
 
2013-10-26 09:03:35 PM
Amateurs.
 
2013-10-26 09:03:57 PM
Ignorance is no excuse.  They would have had to have known about the rules. I'm sure it was drilled into them.

/sorry parents- you knew, too.
 
2013-10-26 09:06:13 PM

Warlordtrooper: Not every infraction needs to be punished with the maximum possible punishment.


You don't live in today's America, apparently.

The worst case scenario should always be treated as if it is the most likely thing to occur.
Every infraction needs to be punished with the maximum possible punishment.
Anyone who points anything (pencils, molded clay, their fingers) at someone else is to be treated as if it they wielded a gun.
Drawings of guns count as guns.
 
2013-10-26 09:07:50 PM
Kids should know better than to bring the airsoft guns to campus.  Parents should know better than to allow it to happen.  Yes, the rules suck, but change them through proper channels instead of means like this.  Otherwise you encourage those kids with crazy parents to break the rules for fear of potential lawsuits.  If I were in the position of the school board I might to for a one month suspension, make the kids test over the material they should have had in the meantime, and make it abundantly clear that anyone else caught with similar shenanigans gets the full sentence.
 
2013-10-26 09:10:30 PM
Hell, in this day and age, the idiot kids are lucky they didn't get their asses shot by a jittery cop. Parents should have known enough to set some ground rules for them.
 
2013-10-26 09:13:30 PM
kids blew it, in This case i feel punishment is warranted.   Airsoft guns are clearly marked in the rules and they brought them on to school property.
That said if i was kid i would be afraid to take an action figure and its gun any where near a school.

A years seems a bit much though.

Also an airsoft gun does not equal a BB gun a BB is a metal sphere and in the better bb guns can do real damage if shot in the right places on a person's body.
 
2013-10-26 09:14:00 PM
You know, people talk a lot about holding people accountable to the rules. I concur with this.

But, we rarely ask about holding the rule makers accountable for making the damn things. If a society criminalizes and penalizes so much damn behavior, it makes it real hard to "hold people accountable" and maintain credibility.

If this happened off hours, it is an absolute travesty they are suspended for a year. If it happened during hours, i would say the kids are trolling and barring any other reasons (they are regular discipline problems and present a growing threat) it should be handled with a saturday of mopping floors.

call me farking old, but a day of hard work really makes the offense you committed come to life and reinforces the rule.
 
2013-10-26 09:14:36 PM

ArcadianRefugee: You don't live in today's America, apparently.

The worst case scenario should always be treated as if it is the most likely thing to occur.
Every infraction needs to be punished with the maximum possible punishment.
Anyone who points anything (pencils, molded clay, their fingers) at someone else is to be treated as if it they wielded a gun.
Drawings of guns count as guns.


As do lego "guns" (the little tiny thing the figures can hold), pastries eaten into the shape of guns, etc.

Zero tolerance is farking retarded. In this case, consider what might happen to these kids assuming they are otherwise "normal", even in a worse case scenario. They're never going to get back into a normal school schedule, so they can likely forget about whatever plans they had for college. They're also going to have vastly more opportunities at their "mall school" (? I think I read that right?) to associate with kids who have done far worse things, which could lead to them getting into a drug, gang, or crime culture.

In the end, the punishment itself could end up pushing these kids down the wrong path. This isn't an opportunity to "learn from a mistake". Should they have been more circumspect of the rules? Sure, but it's not like they were threatening anyone, or hurting themselves or others. How is a minimum 1 year suspension at all justified?
 
2013-10-26 09:15:43 PM
It's interesting to see that Zero tolerance policy is all the rage until it impacts you or someone you care about, perhaps removing discretion from people of authority is a bad thing who'd thunk it...
 
2013-10-26 09:16:29 PM

YoOjo: cenobyte40k: They tried to expel my son a few years back because I live less than a block from the school and someone saw him loading guns into the car one Friday afternoon while they were walking home from school and my son and I were leaving on a hunting trip. Took 4 weeks and a lawyer to get him back into school all because they said that the kids coming home where still in 'school' until they got home and 'school hours where not over' and he was 'to close to the school so he should have known better'. A kid with a gun that fires little plastic pellets (Honestly you are far more likely to be hurt with paintball and paintball causes fewer hospital requiring injures than bowling and golf, let alone soccer, baseball, basketball or football that they would be welcome to play on school grounds), playing with his friends should not have to suffer the rest of his life because of the mistake. Those saying otherwise never had children, have no empathy, and forgot what it's like to be a child themselves.

I pictured you saying that while getting increasingly upset until in the last two lines you break down crying and it ends with you sobbing, head down, and fades.


YoOjo, that was both the meanest and funniest thing I've heard all day. Bravo.
 
2013-10-26 09:19:53 PM
Also, since when is a quarter-inch plastic pellet a "BB"?
 
2013-10-26 09:23:20 PM

Man On Pink Corner: Also, since when is a quarter-inch plastic pellet a "BB"?


BB's can be metal or plastic. "Airsoft" refers to the firing mechanism of the gun, not the projectile. Airsoft guns use a series of battery powered miniature fans that blow the plastic BB's out of the barrel hole, whereas BB guns use either a spring or compressed air (Carbon Monoxide) to propel the projectile out of the hole.
 
2013-10-26 09:33:14 PM
cman [TotalFark]
2013-10-26 06:26:47 PM


Its pretty damn obvious this day in age that bringing anything to school that resembles a gun is gonna get your ass expelled

This isn't a zero tolerance problem.

Yes, it is.
 
2013-10-26 09:33:47 PM
Also an airsoft gun does not equal a BB gun a BB is a metal sphere and in the better bb guns can do real damage if shot in the right places on a person's body.

*THIS*

Airsoft = crappy toy that doesn't harm anyone
BB gun = Can do damage and should be considered a weapon

Sounds like the schools are getting all puss these days
 
2013-10-26 09:39:33 PM

Barfmaker: Eastlack said Brandon got the toy gun for his birthday. Three days later, he and his friends were shooting in the backyard. They decided to move their game to the open grounds of Grace Abbott Elementary School about a block from the Eastlacks' home in the Pepperwood subdivision. It was after school hours, she said.

I could see me doing that as a kid and not thinking that I was "bringing a gun to school".


If you read the article, you would know that air soft guns were on the list of things that they would get a year expulsion for. Would you knowingly bring an air soft gun if you knew it was forbidden?

These jackasses did, and they should pay the consequences.

Yes, I do think zero tolerance policies are ridiculous as a matter of fact.
 
2013-10-26 09:41:46 PM
the authoritarian nuts of fark.com have spoken, it is perfectly reasonable to expel kids from school for playing with a toy gun that shoots plastic pellets.
 
2013-10-26 09:44:27 PM

Nina_Hartley's_Ass: Did they care about this rule before their kids were expelled?


Why do you people like you care about what few rights they have before they feel the boot on their neck?
 
2013-10-26 09:47:24 PM
I've never understood the purpose of expulsion or out-of-school suspension. These kids are rule-breakers and need education and your guy instinct is to kick them out and leave them unsupervised while their parents (presumably) are at work?
 
2013-10-26 09:49:15 PM

cenobyte40k: They tried to expel my son a few years back because I live less than a block from the school and someone saw him loading guns into the car one Friday afternoon while they were walking home from school and my son and I were leaving on a hunting trip. Took 4 weeks and a lawyer to get him back into school all because they said that the kids coming home where still in 'school' until they got home and 'school hours where not over' and he was 'to close to the school so he should have known better'. A kid with a gun that fires little plastic pellets (Honestly you are far more likely to be hurt with paintball and paintball causes fewer hospital requiring injures than bowling and golf, let alone soccer, baseball, basketball or football that they would be welcome to play on school grounds), playing with his friends should not have to suffer the rest of his life because of the mistake. Those saying otherwise never had children, have no empathy, and forgot what it's like to be a child themselves.


I have children, and I would have put a boot up their ass on top of the expulsion. They willingly broke the rules, how stupid the rules are is a whole different realm. Your CSB has nothing to do with this case. Your case has to do with how the rules were interpreted by some dumbass, overpaid school administrator. There was no gray area with these dolts. They took a forbidden toy to the school grounds and knew it. The dumbass, overpaid school administrator wrote the dumbass rules, and the dumbass boys willingly broke them full well knowing the consequences.

/dumbass
 
2013-10-26 09:50:40 PM
casinoskunk.files.wordpress.com
You'll shoot your eye out kid!
 
2013-10-26 09:51:26 PM

itsdan: cman: This isn't a zero tolerance problem. These boys knowingly broke the damn rules.

And all rules require expulsion? I'm not saying not to punish the kids but expulsion should be pretty rare.


Simple - They just want the kids to not get an education, then not get a job, turn to crime to survive and then feed the for-profit prison system.

Of course, a LOGICAL solution would be a year's community service doing some really dirty work. Probably end up with a better citizen at the end. But that makes too much sense.  It's more popular with voters that lack critical thinking skills to AVENGE the indiscretion.
 
B A [TotalFark]
2013-10-26 09:59:41 PM
Actually they, as I, feel the rule should not exist.
 
2013-10-26 10:03:33 PM
Zero tolerance policies suck but these kids still knowingly brought some sort of guns onto school property.  Send them to military school at the parents expense.  Next time they might think twice about breaking the rules.

/Yes, I am old enough to remember when my classmates could bring their long guns to school during hunting season.
 
2013-10-26 10:08:52 PM
Good work libs. Your pants-shiatting, shrieking, irrational fear of anything gun related is leading us to these retarded, unthinking, knee-jerk over-reactions. Some of you probably piddled in your footy pajama just from reading the word "gun". Yes, the kids broke the rules. However, we're talking about a school that expelled these kids for a goddamn YEAR because they brought a TOY to school. If you honestly believe that that is an appropriate reaction or that the kids or their parents are in the wrong for fighting the school over this, then you REALLY need to get a farking grip. FFS, people. Are you really so "comply, citizen!!" that you can't even bring yourselves to question public officials when they do something as pants-on-head retarded as expelling students for a year for having a toy? It's a good thing it wasn't a vaguely-gun-shaped breakfast pastry, or they probably would have been executed on the spot. Then again, some of you probably think that would be a reasonable response as well, as long as it was spelled out in the school's zero-thought policy. Anything at all is acceptable to save us from the scourge of gun-like objects that are ravaging our schools, right?
 
2013-10-26 10:09:58 PM
If had been during school, I'd say the school was in the right. But not during school hours? Detention maybe. What really irritates me is this is in Nebraska, and those parents and school council members have to be around my age. And when I went to school in that general part of the country (80 miles away in Iowa) a lot of us would bring real guns and real ammunition to school during hunting season. We'd leave them in the vehicle, but everybody knew that a bunch of us would be doing some road hunting for pheasants on the way home from school. Hell, kids would leave them in plain sight in the rack in the back window of a pickup truck. Nobody ever got shot. In my senior year, we took a field trip for PE class to the National Guard armory and shot REAL MILITARY M16's (albeit with .22 adapters, because that's all the indoor range was rated for). Why are these people, many of whom grew up in the same circumstances as I did, so farking off the deep end with rules and control?
 
2013-10-26 10:10:03 PM

cman: This isn't a zero tolerance problem.


Yes it is. Ooga booga guns.

Maybe a week or two of suspension, a fine, or a spanking with a 2x4 lovingly carved into an ass crushing paddle by a sadistic carpenter in Ohio. Whatever. But one year for AIRSOFT guns? That's in-farking-sane.
 
2013-10-26 10:18:00 PM

doglover: Maybe a week or two of suspension, a fine, or a spanking with a 2x4 lovingly carved into an ass crushing paddle by a sadistic carpenter in Ohio.


NOT A FETISH.
 
2013-10-26 10:18:34 PM
Not sure about a 1 year suspension, but even in the early 90s, I would have been arrested for running around a residential neighborhood or school with a pellet gun. That's what the woods were for.
 
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