If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(The Raw Story)   Texas hunting club is concerned about conservation, so it decides that auctioning a safari to bag a black rhino would be an excellent idea   (rawstory.com) divider line 27
    More: Fail, Texas, Dallas Observer, conservations, Texas hunting, Namibian, Wildlife Services  
•       •       •

2725 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Oct 2013 at 12:11 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2013-10-24 12:50:37 AM  
4 votes:
I cringe at the idea of trophy hunting, but let's try not to equate a safari club that has gotten permission/permits from the Namibian government and U.S. Fish and Wildlife to hunt one black rhino with poachers who have rusted to shiat AK-47s and beat-up Toyota Land Cruisers gunning down whatever they see and filing off the horns.  There's a reason that the Namibian government auctions off hunting permits.  Money.  And if it was that bad for the population, they wouldn't do it.  That money helps sustain the population in a ton of ways, and if the cost is they let some rich white people shoot one or two a year, then so be it.

That money that comes into the economy via these permit auctions and the travel and tourism surrounding such ventures is competition against money from poaching.
2013-10-24 07:12:40 AM  
3 votes:
There are more problems than just too few black rhinos:

1. There are isolated pockets of too many black rhinos and not enough habitat. Contrary to what you see on TV, it's not practical to just pick them up with helicopters and put them somewhere else.

2. The governments of the countries with black rhino populations are corrupt beyond your ability to understand corruption.

3. Some conservation organizations, "Save the Rhino", for example, are corrupt beyond your ability to understand corruption.

4. Suitable habitat is scarce and getting scarcer as sub-Saharan Africa's population explodes.

5. While it's easy to appreciate rhinos for their own sake from a safe distance, the people who actually live with them tend to hate them. Americans might romanticize them somewhat less if they were roaming through, say, their kid's school bus stops.

6. Naive anti's don't understand (and don't want to understand) that sport hunting is what funds most conservation and anti-poaching efforts. If you enjoy seeing whitetail deer, turkeys and wood ducks here in the US, for example, thank hunters, because that's who brought them back from geographical extinction.
2013-10-24 01:09:33 AM  
3 votes:

Fark It: I cringe at the idea of trophy hunting, but let's try not to equate a safari club that has gotten permission/permits from the Namibian government and U.S. Fish and Wildlife to hunt one black rhino with poachers who have rusted to shiat AK-47s and beat-up Toyota Land Cruisers gunning down whatever they see and filing off the horns.  There's a reason that the Namibian government auctions off hunting permits.  Money.  And if it was that bad for the population, they wouldn't do it.  That money helps sustain the population in a ton of ways, and if the cost is they let some rich white people shoot one or two a year, then so be it.

That money that comes into the economy via these permit auctions and the travel and tourism surrounding such ventures is competition against money from poaching.


THIS.

Its a lot less farked up to auction off a couple of permits if it pays for security and care of the herds as a whole, than it is to ignore them and leave them to disease and poachers.  In a perfect world they wouldn't have to*

*a perfect world being one where the libsoutraged by this had actually donated enough money for the preserves to be funded without being forced to auction permits.

/Ironic that the mouthbreathing tards are, even if unintentionally, doing more for eco protection and endangered species survival than the tree-huggers ever would.
2013-10-24 01:02:51 AM  
3 votes:
Compare the game management practices in Namibia where big-game hunting is permitted (not cheap) with neighboring countries that do not allow hunting. The neighboring countries do not have any money for game management, and the few rangers they do have are so poorly paid that poachers are able to easily bribe them, those are the countries where most of the illegal trade in animal parts originate. The perpetrators are usually tied to radical Islam, who see this as a source of funds for the world jihad.

Namibia, OTOH, does a brisk business in international big-game hunting, and uses that money to fund its conservation practices, as a result, Namibia has healthy, sustainable herds of all the cute and ugly animals that the evil Western Capitalist-Imperialist-Exceptionalists are all getting big 'ol boners to shoot.

Last night I shot an elephant in my pajamas.
2013-10-24 09:14:34 AM  
2 votes:
Actually, any photo safari guide in Africa will tell you that hunters are the ones who keep all those animals from going extinct because if the huge amounts if money they pour into the system. Ironic? Sure. But it's just reality.
2013-10-24 08:25:58 AM  
2 votes:

DownDaRiver: Fark It: I cringe at the idea of trophy hunting, but let's try not to equate a safari club that has gotten permission/permits from the Namibian government and U.S. Fish and Wildlife to hunt one black rhino with poachers who have rusted to shiat AK-47s and beat-up Toyota Land Cruisers gunning down whatever they see and filing off the horns.  There's a reason that the Namibian government auctions off hunting permits.  Money.  And if it was that bad for the population, they wouldn't do it.  That money helps sustain the population in a ton of ways, and if the cost is they let some rich white people shoot one or two a year, then so be it.

That money that comes into the economy via these permit auctions and the travel and tourism surrounding such ventures is competition against money from poaching.

Thank you for posting a reasonable and rational comment
Wanted to say pretty much the same thing
You said it better than I could have


Same here, except that I don't cringe at trophy hunting.

I *USED* to do so, and think myself all the more smug and superior because I wasn't a trophy hunter, until I thought about it.

[INSERT HUNTING SPIEL HERE]

There are 3 basic forms of hunting, based on the motivation of the hunter:

1. Subsistence hunting.  This is hunting purely for food, to feed yourself or your family.

2. Market hunting.  This is hunting for economic reasons, to sell the animal or parts thereof for a profit.  This can also include collecting a bounty on them.  It also includes things like poaching rhinos for horns and elephants for their ivory to sell them on the black market.

3. Sport hunting.   This is hunting because you enjoy the challenge of it.  This is mainly the motivation of trophy hunters.

Of the 3 main types of hunting, regulated sport hunting is the only one that has never, as near as I can find, resulted in the extinction or near extinction of a species.  All of the cases you can probably dig up were almost always either due to subsistence hunting, or more likely, market hunting.

So why the seeming paradox?

People who hunt primarily for the enjoyment of it want to keep on doing it.  They want bigger and better trophies.  So they will spend large amounts of money and political capital in order to assure a thriving, healthy population of the species they like to hunt.

Someone just concerned with preventing starvation, or with making a fast buck, isn't really going to care.  They aren't looking ahead to the future.  Sport hunters do that, in a collective sense.  They spend money to preserve habitat, which benefits not just the prey species, but all species that share that habitat.  They ask for and get things like bag limits and restrictions on methods to preserve "fair chase" and to make sure that a sustainable number of animals are taken, and they fund the conservation police (through Pittman/Robertson taxes in the US, trophy fees in Africa, etc.) to ensure that the laws are enforced.

In all the years I've been hunting, the only trophy I have, such as it is, is the handle of a knife my father made for me from the antler of a deer I shot.

That doesn't mean, though, that I'm against trophy hunting.  In fact, I'm *FOR* it, emphatically.  Because I've seen people pass up a nice 8 point buck because they already had several, and they wanted a 10 point or higher.

I do something similar, by ratcheting up the difficulty by only using primitive methods, either a wooden longbow for archery season, or a flintlock longrifle for firearm season.  And no tree-stands, I only hunt with my feet on the ground.  Because of that, I'll take a doe and be happy.

But that's really no different than passing up a nice buck because you want something bigger, like a trophy hunter would:  I just made it more difficult for myself in a different way.  Instead of restricting myself to bucks a certain size or bigger while using every ethical modern advantage possible, I made it harder for myself to get *ANY* deer, but the motivation is largely the same:  To make hunting a challenge.

I used to consider myself superior to the "trophy hunters", and to be honest, I think a few of them have on occasion looked in awe at what I use to hunt with and say to themselves "He's really hard-core".  But the truth is that they are just as hard-core as I am, but in different ways, and we all care about the environment because we enjoy hunting and wish to keep on hunting.

*THAT* is what makes sport hunting different than the guy who shoots a gorilla for "bush meat" or the one who shoots a rhino so he can sell the horn to some literal snake-oil salesman, er, "Traditional medicine practitioner" to peddle to limp-dicked Chinamen.
2013-10-24 07:56:43 AM  
2 votes:

Fark It: That money that comes into the economy via these permit auctions and the travel and tourism surrounding such ventures is competition against money from poaching.



The rhinos benefit (well, except the one that got shot), the locals benefit, it funds conservation, and lets the PETA crowd get outraged, with a side order of class warfare for the Occupy folks.

Sounds like a win all around to me.
2013-10-24 04:36:32 AM  
2 votes:

Ivan the Tolerable: /Ironic that the mouthbreathing tards hunters are, even if unintentionally, doing more for eco protection and endangered species survival than the tree-huggers ever would.


Fixed that for you, and it's historically been very accurate.  Between various fees, funds, and donations, the hunting crowd has historically provided the lion's share of the conservation monies in the USA.

Oddly enough, one proposal for Rhino preservation is to legalize the sale of commercially raised rhino horn.  You can harvest the horn without harming the animal multiple times, and selling it legally would both create motivation to raise and protect the animals by ranchers and drop the price of horn to the point that it's not nearly as profitable for poachers.

Oh, and most of them know it.
2013-10-24 03:52:49 AM  
2 votes:
Preserve trees you get out of control wildfires
Preserve wildlife you get disease ridden herds on land that cannot support them.

I just love it when nature gives you libtard fernsniffers the fist up the ass.
2013-10-24 01:14:24 AM  
2 votes:

Ivan the Tolerable: Fark It: I cringe at the idea of trophy hunting, but let's try not to equate a safari club that has gotten permission/permits from the Namibian government and U.S. Fish and Wildlife to hunt one black rhino with poachers who have rusted to shiat AK-47s and beat-up Toyota Land Cruisers gunning down whatever they see and filing off the horns.  There's a reason that the Namibian government auctions off hunting permits.  Money.  And if it was that bad for the population, they wouldn't do it.  That money helps sustain the population in a ton of ways, and if the cost is they let some rich white people shoot one or two a year, then so be it.

That money that comes into the economy via these permit auctions and the travel and tourism surrounding such ventures is competition against money from poaching.

THIS.

Its a lot less farked up to auction off a couple of permits if it pays for security and care of the herds as a whole, than it is to ignore them and leave them to disease and poachers.  In a perfect world they wouldn't have to*

*a perfect world being one where the libsoutraged by this had actually donated enough money for the preserves to be funded without being forced to auction permits.

/Ironic that the mouthbreathing tards are, even if unintentionally, doing more for eco protection and endangered species survival than the tree-huggers ever would.


Exactly.  If you're that torn up about the poor rhinos, then put up some money instead of biatching about it on the internet.

/it's not the rhino
//it's the notion that a Texas oil millionaire (or billionaire) who probably votes Republican and owns dozens of firearms is going to do more for the rhinos and other endangered species at this preserve in one safari trip than any of the whiners will ever do in their lifetime, that's what bothers some people
2013-10-24 12:52:45 AM  
2 votes:
Well of course they care about conservation.  They have taken it upon themselves to conserve valuable hunting grounds that most people can't access, in order to conserve animal stocks that they can prey upon for sport.  What kind of liberal bunny hugger can't get behind that?
2013-10-24 11:43:43 AM  
1 votes:

MolsonCanadian: karmaceutical: Well of course they care about conservation.  They have taken it upon themselves to conserve valuable hunting grounds that most people can't access, in order to conserve animal stocks that they can prey upon for sport.  What kind of liberal bunny hugger can't get behind that?

Of course that is exactly where modern environmentalism started, with 19th-century aristocrats wanting to preserve their "private" playgrounds.


Why should you really care about their motivations, if the end result is that wild habitat is preserved?

I mean, wouldn't that be like MADD refusing a huge grant from Budweiser to help fund anti-drunk driving laws simply because of the source?
2013-10-24 11:39:50 AM  
1 votes:

Fish in a Barrel: dittybopper: The Dog Ate My Homework: Actually, any photo safari guide in Africa will tell you that hunters are the ones who keep all those animals from going extinct because if the huge amounts if money they pour into the system. Ironic? Sure. But it's just reality.

It's not ironic.

People won't pay a $35,000 trophy fee to take a picture of an elephant.   Even if you could figure out a way to charge each person who takes a picture of a wild elephant a $10 fee for the privilege, it would take 3,500 of them to make up what one hunter pays to shoot one elephant.   And in all likelihood, 3,500 people, and the necessary staff and amenities to support them, are likely to have a greater detrimental effect on the habitat than a single hunter and the staff needed to support a safari.

I may be mistaken, but I believe the fee for rhino and elephant are much, much more than $35,000.  They expect to raise $750,000 in this auction, for instance.  I've heard $500,000 for rhino and $1 million for an elephant.  My search skills are failing me at the moment.  I can't see to find any recent official figures.


Any safari site will break out the trophy fees.   I found this one for South Africa, which is where I got the $35,000 fee for elephants for 2013 and 2014.

Some nations apparently have a sliding scale trophy fee based upon the weight of the tusks, and tuskless elephants are much cheaper than trophy-sized (ie., 70+ lbs) elephants.

For Black Rhino, the trophy fees are astronomical, somewhere north of a quarter million dollars.
2013-10-24 11:14:08 AM  
1 votes:

The Gentleman Caller: Why Can't these big tough hunters hunt the poachers? I thought they were experts at tracking game.


The money they make on this auction will likely pay the wages of 50 or so local wardens whose primary purpose will be to stop the poachers.
2013-10-24 10:41:52 AM  
1 votes:

karmaceutical: Well of course they care about conservation.  They have taken it upon themselves to conserve valuable hunting grounds that most people can't access, in order to conserve animal stocks that they can prey upon for sport.  What kind of liberal bunny hugger can't get behind that?


Of course that is exactly where modern environmentalism started, with 19th-century aristocrats wanting to preserve their "private" playgrounds.
2013-10-24 09:57:19 AM  
1 votes:

The Dog Ate My Homework: Actually, any photo safari guide in Africa will tell you that hunters are the ones who keep all those animals from going extinct because if the huge amounts if money they pour into the system. Ironic? Sure. But it's just reality.


It's not ironic.

People won't pay a $35,000 trophy fee to take a picture of an elephant.   Even if you could figure out a way to charge each person who takes a picture of a wild elephant a $10 fee for the privilege, it would take 3,500 of them to make up what one hunter pays to shoot one elephant.   And in all likelihood, 3,500 people, and the necessary staff and amenities to support them, are likely to have a greater detrimental effect on the habitat than a single hunter and the staff needed to support a safari.
2013-10-24 05:25:54 AM  
1 votes:

Gyrfalcon: Liam Burns: Compare the game management practices in Namibia where big-game hunting is permitted (not cheap) with neighboring countries that do not allow hunting. The neighboring countries do not have any money for game management, and the few rangers they do have are so poorly paid that poachers are able to easily bribe them, those are the countries where most of the illegal trade in animal parts originate. The perpetrators are usually tied to radical Islam, who see this as a source of funds for the world jihad.

Namibia, OTOH, does a brisk business in international big-game hunting, and uses that money to fund its conservation practices, as a result, Namibia has healthy, sustainable herds of all the cute and ugly animals that the evil Western Capitalist-Imperialist-Exceptionalists are all getting big 'ol boners to shoot.

Last night I shot an elephant in my pajamas.

Sadly, this is true. In fact, it's because they allow trophy hunting that Namibia HAS herds of black rhino that are large enough to need culling...which they can then sell licenses for to wealthy Texans at probably six times the actual value so fat white meatheads can get their Great White Hunter boners, and provide the Namibian government with some much-needed US dollars.

That said, it doesn't even begin to excuse the hard-on these hunters are no doubt getting at the thought of going on a canned hunt to kill a "wild" rhino in a staged safari in a Namibian wildlife preserve.


They bought their rhino credits. What's the probe?
2013-10-24 02:15:07 AM  
1 votes:
Time for a Texas tag.
2013-10-24 01:45:50 AM  
1 votes:

Fark It: I cringe at the idea of trophy hunting, but let's try not to equate a safari club that has gotten permission/permits from the Namibian government and U.S. Fish and Wildlife to hunt one black rhino with poachers who have rusted to shiat AK-47s and beat-up Toyota Land Cruisers gunning down whatever they see and filing off the horns.  There's a reason that the Namibian government auctions off hunting permits.  Money.  And if it was that bad for the population, they wouldn't do it.  That money helps sustain the population in a ton of ways, and if the cost is they let some rich white people shoot one or two a year, then so be it.

That money that comes into the economy via these permit auctions and the travel and tourism surrounding such ventures is competition against money from poaching.


I get that, but I thought it was illegal throughout the continent to hunt black rhino, due to extremely low numbers. White rhinos have a more stable population, so I can see a raffle for bagging one of those (or the $20-40k license to do so normally).

I'd totally be on board to bust my shoulder firing a .600 NE into a poacher though.
2013-10-24 01:26:55 AM  
1 votes:
This hunt cannot be described as anything other than blood lust.
2013-10-24 01:02:02 AM  
1 votes:

Fark It: I cringe at the idea of trophy hunting, but let's try not to equate a safari club that has gotten permission/permits from the Namibian government and U.S. Fish and Wildlife to hunt one black rhino with poachers who have rusted to shiat AK-47s and beat-up Toyota Land Cruisers gunning down whatever they see and filing off the horns.  There's a reason that the Namibian government auctions off hunting permits.  Money.  And if it was that bad for the population, they wouldn't do it.  That money helps sustain the population in a ton of ways, and if the cost is they let some rich white people shoot one or two a year, then so be it.

That money that comes into the economy via these permit auctions and the travel and tourism surrounding such ventures is competition against money from poaching.


Thank you for posting a reasonable and rational comment
Wanted to say pretty much the same thing
You said it better than I could have
2013-10-24 12:49:27 AM  
1 votes:
Texas hunting club is concerned about conservation, so it decides that auctioning a safari to bag a black

Most Texans stopped reading there because they already blew their load.
2013-10-24 12:32:41 AM  
1 votes:
Hunters do a lot for conservation, beyond just their license and tag fees and their use in balancing the predators and prey from drought years to years of record rain.

But still, I wince every time I see Craig Boddington kneeling next to some African beast he's shot.
2013-10-24 12:24:17 AM  
1 votes:
We don't deserve this planet. Time to rewind a million years and give it to the elephants
2013-10-24 12:19:37 AM  
1 votes:
I had to read that several times before it stopped saying "auctioning a safari bag to a black rhino."

I had to read that several times, but it never stopped saying "U.S. ish and Wildlife Service."
2013-10-24 12:15:58 AM  
1 votes:
You are not helping.
2013-10-24 12:14:59 AM  
1 votes:

scm-l3.technorati.com


SCARED.

 
Displayed 27 of 27 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report