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(Salon)   It turns out most of the 11 herbs and spices are antibiotics and pathogens   (salon.com) divider line 103
    More: Sick, pet foods, pigments, melamine, food poisoning, antibiotics  
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12919 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Oct 2013 at 3:22 PM (40 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-21 02:20:55 PM
"Why are birds fed arsenic? It has been approved in poultry feed for years to control parasites, promote weight gain and improve feed efficiency and "pigmentation." A 2013 study in the journal Environmental Health Perspectivesfound detectable levels of arsenic in chicken from grocery stores in 10 American cities, including organic chickens."

I remember arguing with someone on an internet discussion site (probably Yelp Talk, not Fark) about the fact that I buy organic meats and poultry. They said that there was no benefit to paying a little more for a bird fed only organic grains and raised in free-range conditions.
 
2013-10-21 02:30:07 PM
I probably could have done with reading that half an hour ago, before I had chicken for dinner. Ah who cares, I'm in England, it was probably horse.
 
2013-10-21 03:15:33 PM
Where do antibiotic-resistant salmonella and E. coli in chicken come from? Is that a trick question? More than 70 percent of US antibiotics go to livestock-more than 29 million pounds of antibiotics a year-which of course creates antibiotic resistance.

At first I was like, "isn't all chicken antibiotic free? Is the author deliberately trying to conflate antibiotics used in other livestock with chicken?"

Then I read (elsewhere), "All chicken is "antibiotic-free" in the sense that no antibiotic residues are present in the meat due to the withdrawal periods and other precautions required by the government and observed by the chicken companies"

So antibiotic-free chicken may have used antibiotics at one point. Good to know.
 
2013-10-21 03:25:42 PM

lostcat: I remember arguing with someone on an internet discussion site (probably Yelp Talk, not Fark) about the fact that I buy organic meats and poultry. They said that there was no benefit to paying a little more for a bird fed only organic grains and raised in free-range conditions.


And as it turns out, the chicken you buy still has the same pesticides and poisons present in it?
 
2013-10-21 03:25:58 PM
www.spackler.ca
 
2013-10-21 03:26:07 PM
1) Salon article
2) Headline begins in the form "[Number] [Adjective] [Noun]"

So, no.
 
2013-10-21 03:26:25 PM
Won't the anti-biotics kill the pathogens?
 
2013-10-21 03:26:59 PM
It's chicken from China
A Chinese chicken
Have a little taste
And your lifespan's tickin'
 
2013-10-21 03:28:15 PM
Pathogenic-lickin' good!
 
2013-10-21 03:28:41 PM
Meh..
 
2013-10-21 03:29:03 PM
EVERYBODY PANIC !
 
2013-10-21 03:29:09 PM

lostcat: "Why are birds fed arsenic? It has been approved in poultry feed for years to control parasites, promote weight gain and improve feed efficiency and "pigmentation." A 2013 study in the journal Environmental Health Perspectivesfound detectable levels of arsenic in chicken from grocery stores in 10 American cities, including organic chickens."

I remember arguing with someone on an internet discussion site (probably Yelp Talk, not Fark) about the fact that I buy organic meats and poultry. They said that there was no benefit to paying a little more for a bird fed only organic grains and raised in free-range conditions.


Yeah, you're really fooling yourself into thinking it's better, and paying more money at the same time.

/BTW there is arsenic in your drinking water
//somehow you're not dead from it
 
2013-10-21 03:30:39 PM
Do people actually think that foods labeled "organic" are any different? My line of thinking is that if I don't empirically observe the chicken get slaughtered, processed, and prepared, an "organic" chicken probably comes from a similar factory/farm than any other. Like how store-brand bottled water is often bottled in the same facility as Arrowhread/Crystal Geyser/Calistoga/etc.
 
2013-10-21 03:31:31 PM
Do you know what they do to those chickens?

No, but it's delicious.

-Jim Gaffigan
 
2013-10-21 03:32:10 PM
And that's reason #1 to buy a shotgun and learn to hunt your own.  I've gotten my 3 pheasant limit every day I've been out this year, and not one of them has ever been injected with an antibiotic.  Neither have the grouse, partridge, quail, ducks or geese....  I'm running out of room in my freezer and deer opener isn't for another 2 weeks.
 
2013-10-21 03:32:21 PM
And yet everyone is still alive.
 
2013-10-21 03:32:39 PM

ArcadianRefugee: 1) Salon article
2) Headline begins in the form "[Number] [Adjective] [Noun]"

So, no.


It's ok go have some chicken.
 
2013-10-21 03:32:55 PM
Meh - KFC flies through a digestive system as such a blinding speed that I doubt there's any time for the body to absorb toxins from it.
 
2013-10-21 03:32:56 PM

Heamer: Do people actually think that foods labeled "organic" are any different? My line of thinking is that if I don't empirically observe the chicken get slaughtered, processed, and prepared, an "organic" chicken probably comes from a similar factory/farm than any other. Like how store-brand bottled water is often bottled in the same facility as Arrowhread/Crystal Geyser/Calistoga/etc.


Obligatory
 
2013-10-21 03:33:03 PM

BAMFinator: Do you know what they do to those chickens?

No, but it's delicious.

-Jim Gaffigan


my thought on the matter. jim is a friggin guru! ok, not really guru, but i don't care what occured to the chicken before it got to me breaded and fried...all i care about is that it's delicious! i do prefer popeyes to kfc, though.
 
2013-10-21 03:33:50 PM
Perfect for the lunchbox of death.
 
2013-10-21 03:35:50 PM
You know......


a wild chicken (there MUST be such a thing...) might not have antibiotics in it, but it would most likely have a variety of "pathogens"......

This is one of the reasons we COOK our food.
 
2013-10-21 03:37:11 PM
You should see how they make the gravy.
 
2013-10-21 03:37:37 PM

CipollinaFan: And yet everyone is still alive.


Almost half of all Americans will develop a cancer in their lifetime, doesn't that seem weird to you?
 
2013-10-21 03:38:29 PM

Heamer: Do people actually think that foods labeled "organic" are any different? My line of thinking is that if I don't empirically observe the chicken get slaughtered, processed, and prepared, an "organic" chicken probably comes from a similar factory/farm than any other. Like how store-brand bottled water is often bottled in the same facility as Arrowhread/Crystal Geyser/Calistoga/etc.


What you're saying is, you don't trust anything from the USDA, certification trade groups, or the manufacturers themselves... so eat chicken nuggets?

I'm not following this line of thinking.
 
2013-10-21 03:39:17 PM
Dunno about you, but I tend to cook my chicken,
 
2013-10-21 03:39:52 PM
pavementrunner.com

/Chipotle sighs heavily, goes and pets its freerange pigs
 
2013-10-21 03:40:13 PM
I hate this crap.

The dangers of importing food from China are far to serious to allow it. We keep cutting money to food safety and inspections because we're too worried about "Big Government" and not worried enough about the consequences of our actions.
We can't seem to get any kind of regulation on the use of hormones and antibiotics in industrial farming, probably because of huge contributions and expensive lobbying, so our water is full of this stuff from farm runoff and our bacteria is becoming resistant to essential antibiotics though constant exposure.
 
2013-10-21 03:41:17 PM

Heamer: Do people actually think that foods labeled "organic" are any different? My line of thinking is that if I don't empirically observe the chicken get slaughtered, processed, and prepared, an "organic" chicken probably comes from a similar factory/farm than any other. Like how store-brand bottled water is often bottled in the same facility as Arrowhread/Crystal Geyser/Calistoga/etc.


Makes a lot of sense.
/not
 
2013-10-21 03:41:23 PM

FilmBELOH20: And that's reason #1 to buy a shotgun and learn to hunt your own.  I've gotten my 3 pheasant limit every day I've been out this year, and not one of them has ever been injected with an antibiotic.  Neither have the grouse, partridge, quail, ducks or geese....  I'm running out of room in my freezer and deer opener isn't for another 2 weeks.


If everyone did that, you'd stop finding them so easily pretty quickly.
 
2013-10-21 03:41:33 PM

Strik3r: You know......


a wild chicken (there MUST be such a thing...) might not have antibiotics in it, but it would most likely have a variety of "pathogens"......

This is one of the reasons we COOK our food.


There is also wild stuff that is better tasting than chicken (and I've never once gotten sick eating it.)  Exhibit A:

www.davisquailhunts.com
 
2013-10-21 03:42:43 PM

lostcat: "Why are birds fed arsenic? It has been approved in poultry feed for years to control parasites, promote weight gain and improve feed efficiency and "pigmentation." A 2013 study in the journal Environmental Health Perspectivesfound detectable levels of arsenic in chicken from grocery stores in 10 American cities, including organic chickens."

I remember arguing with someone on an internet discussion site (probably Yelp Talk, not Fark) about the fact that I buy organic meats and poultry. They said that there was no benefit to paying a little more for a bird fed only organic grains and raised in free-range conditions.


Um... So you admit to being wrong then? Considering the very last sentence of the article you quoted...
 
2013-10-21 03:44:11 PM

Rapmaster2000: What you're saying is, you don't trust anything from the USDA, certification trade groups, or the manufacturers themselves... so eat chicken nuggets?

I'm not following this line of thinking.


I'm not saying don't eat those things, I'm just saying that they're probably not different from the ones labeled otherwise. I still eat both, and haven't eaten a chicken nugget since 2007.
 
2013-10-21 03:44:16 PM

FilmBELOH20: And that's reason #1 to buy a shotgun and learn to hunt your own.  I've gotten my 3 pheasant limit every day I've been out this year, and not one of them has ever been injected with an antibiotic.  Neither have the grouse, partridge, quail, ducks or geese....  I'm running out of room in my freezer and deer opener isn't for another 2 weeks.


What are the likely health risks to humans from the levels of antibiotics present in commercially raised chicken?
 
2013-10-21 03:45:33 PM

Heamer: Rapmaster2000: What you're saying is, you don't trust anything from the USDA, certification trade groups, or the manufacturers themselves... so eat chicken nuggets?

I'm not following this line of thinking.

I'm not saying don't eat those things, I'm just saying that they're probably not different from the ones labeled otherwise. I still eat both, and haven't eaten a chicken nugget since 2007.


Why are they probably not different?
 
2013-10-21 03:45:35 PM
Butter and hot sauce will kill all those tics and gens.
 
2013-10-21 03:48:09 PM

Magnanimous_J: CipollinaFan: And yet everyone is still alive.

Almost half of all Americans will develop a cancer in their lifetime, doesn't that seem weird to you?


99.999874355311% of post on fark are uncited bullshiat though, so at least we have that going for us
 
2013-10-21 03:48:49 PM

ladyfortuna: FilmBELOH20: And that's reason #1 to buy a shotgun and learn to hunt your own.  I've gotten my 3 pheasant limit every day I've been out this year, and not one of them has ever been injected with an antibiotic.  Neither have the grouse, partridge, quail, ducks or geese....  I'm running out of room in my freezer and deer opener isn't for another 2 weeks.

If everyone did that, you'd stop finding them so easily pretty quickly.


Not really.  You can choose to believe what you read about hunters on Fark most of the time, but the truth is, the best wildlife managers on the planet are hunters.  The deer population in North Dakota is down considerably, and not nearly as many tags have been issued as a result.  Same with the pheasant limits.  3 per day - 12 in possession.  If pheasant populations were at all endangered, they would cut the limits down just like they did with deer this year. And you know what?  I would welcome that any day of the week.  Most of us that hunt want to continue to be able to hunt in the future, so we believe fully in sensible wildlife management.
 
2013-10-21 03:49:00 PM

Rapmaster2000: Heamer: Rapmaster2000: What you're saying is, you don't trust anything from the USDA, certification trade groups, or the manufacturers themselves... so eat chicken nuggets?

I'm not following this line of thinking.

I'm not saying don't eat those things, I'm just saying that they're probably not different from the ones labeled otherwise. I still eat both, and haven't eaten a chicken nugget since 2007.

Why are they probably not different?


because he said it, that's why! don't you pay attention?

/doesn't pay for organic either
//believes there IS a difference, but the stuff just costs too much
///organic milk lasts about 3 times longer than the regular stuff...and it's tasty...but costs twice as much or more
 
2013-10-21 03:50:08 PM

Rapmaster2000: Heamer: Rapmaster2000: What you're saying is, you don't trust anything from the USDA, certification trade groups, or the manufacturers themselves... so eat chicken nuggets?

I'm not following this line of thinking.

I'm not saying don't eat those things, I'm just saying that they're probably not different from the ones labeled otherwise. I still eat both, and haven't eaten a chicken nugget since 2007.

Why are they probably not different?


Because the term "organic" has different meanings to the USDA, trade groups, and manufacturers. Also, in general, "organic" doesn't mean pesticide or antibiotic-free, it just means that the pesticides and antibiotics used are created through much less efficient (but more "natural") means. The molecules are identical.
 
2013-10-21 03:52:41 PM

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: Because the term "organic" has different meanings to the USDA, trade groups, and manufacturers. Also, in general, "organic" doesn't mean pesticide or antibiotic-free, it just means that the pesticides and antibiotics used are created through much less efficient (but more "natural") means. The molecules are identical.


Pretty much this. The term "organic" has lost all meaning to me. In fact, being able to identify different kinds of "organic" food is being introduced into health/physical education curriculum at the school I work for. Anyone who takes a food labeled "organic" at face value very likely isn't getting what they think they are.
 
2013-10-21 03:53:03 PM

bungle_jr: Rapmaster2000: Heamer: Rapmaster2000: What you're saying is, you don't trust anything from the USDA, certification trade groups, or the manufacturers themselves... so eat chicken nuggets?

I'm not following this line of thinking.

I'm not saying don't eat those things, I'm just saying that they're probably not different from the ones labeled otherwise. I still eat both, and haven't eaten a chicken nugget since 2007.

Why are they probably not different?

because he said it, that's why! don't you pay attention?

/doesn't pay for organic either
//believes there IS a difference, but the stuff just costs too much
///organic milk lasts about 3 times longer than the regular stuff...and it's tasty...but costs twice as much or more


You believe there is a difference, so what is the difference (in terms of benefit(s) to humans)?
 
2013-10-21 03:53:05 PM

FilmBELOH20: ladyfortuna: FilmBELOH20: And that's reason #1 to buy a shotgun and learn to hunt your own.  I've gotten my 3 pheasant limit every day I've been out this year, and not one of them has ever been injected with an antibiotic.  Neither have the grouse, partridge, quail, ducks or geese....  I'm running out of room in my freezer and deer opener isn't for another 2 weeks.

If everyone did that, you'd stop finding them so easily pretty quickly.

Not really.  You can choose to believe what you read about hunters on Fark most of the time, but the truth is, the best wildlife managers on the planet are hunters.  The deer population in North Dakota is down considerably, and not nearly as many tags have been issued as a result.  Same with the pheasant limits.  3 per day - 12 in possession.  If pheasant populations were at all endangered, they would cut the limits down just like they did with deer this year. And you know what?  I would welcome that any day of the week.  Most of us that hunt want to continue to be able to hunt in the future, so we believe fully in sensible wildlife management.


Dude, white-tailed deer used to be far more scarce precisely because of human hunting. I complain about them around my area because there are tons, but what I'm saying is if EVERYONE was hunting them... it would happen again.
 
2013-10-21 03:53:33 PM

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: FilmBELOH20: And that's reason #1 to buy a shotgun and learn to hunt your own.  I've gotten my 3 pheasant limit every day I've been out this year, and not one of them has ever been injected with an antibiotic.  Neither have the grouse, partridge, quail, ducks or geese....  I'm running out of room in my freezer and deer opener isn't for another 2 weeks.

What are the likely health risks to humans from the levels of antibiotics present in commercially raised chicken?


I don't know, and I don't pretend to.  But as a layperson, I would guess that the reasons "superbugs" are becoming more and more prevalent is because of a) overprescribing of antibiotics, and b) rampant antibiotic use in food animals.  Honestly, it's not the antibiotics that turn me off of commercially produced meat so much as the growth hormones and stuff to make them slaughter-ready in half the time.
 
2013-10-21 03:54:12 PM

ArcadianRefugee: 1) Salon article
2) Headline begins in the form "[Number] [Adjective] [Noun]"

So, no.


Yeah, Salon seems to lost their shiat, recently.  I subscribe, so I get the full brunt of the derp. Everything is gonna kill us, and every farking email headline of theirs has some rant about the latest incident of Rethuglican baby-eating.  I have this mental image of their writing bullpen filled with screaming, hysterically weeping progrrrrrressive retards.
 
2013-10-21 03:54:44 PM

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: Rapmaster2000: Heamer: Rapmaster2000: What you're saying is, you don't trust anything from the USDA, certification trade groups, or the manufacturers themselves... so eat chicken nuggets?

I'm not following this line of thinking.

I'm not saying don't eat those things, I'm just saying that they're probably not different from the ones labeled otherwise. I still eat both, and haven't eaten a chicken nugget since 2007.

Why are they probably not different?

Because the term "organic" has different meanings to the USDA, trade groups, and manufacturers. Also, in general, "organic" doesn't mean pesticide or antibiotic-free, it just means that the pesticides and antibiotics used are created through much less efficient (but more "natural") means.
The molecules are identical.

 

That doesn't make them not different.  If a product is certified USDA organic then it meets the standards to be considered USDA organic.  That makes it different form a product that does not.

You can argue that this isn't "organic enough" for you or that organic is stupid, lame, and loved by pretentious dickwads, but you cannot say it's "probably not different."  It is demonstrably different.

 
2013-10-21 03:54:53 PM

Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: bungle_jr: Rapmaster2000: Heamer: Rapmaster2000: What you're saying is, you don't trust anything from the USDA, certification trade groups, or the manufacturers themselves... so eat chicken nuggets?

I'm not following this line of thinking.

I'm not saying don't eat those things, I'm just saying that they're probably not different from the ones labeled otherwise. I still eat both, and haven't eaten a chicken nugget since 2007.

Why are they probably not different?

because he said it, that's why! don't you pay attention?

/doesn't pay for organic either
//believes there IS a difference, but the stuff just costs too much
///organic milk lasts about 3 times longer than the regular stuff...and it's tasty...but costs twice as much or more

You believe there is a difference, so what is the difference (in terms of benefit(s) to humans)?


i didn't say the difference meant any benefit to humans. i just believe there is a difference in the methods used to produce these things. if i really thought the differences were vastly beneficial, i'd pinch pennies elsewhere to afford the higher grocery bills
 
2013-10-21 03:56:30 PM

pedobearapproved: Magnanimous_J: CipollinaFan: And yet everyone is still alive.

Almost half of all Americans will develop a cancer in their lifetime, doesn't that seem weird to you?

99.999874355311% of post on fark are uncited bullshiat though, so at least we have that going for us


http://www.cancer.org/cancer/cancerbasics/lifetime-probability-of-de ve loping-or-dying-from-cancer

That's 43% for men, 38% for women. Satisfied?
 
2013-10-21 03:56:35 PM

FilmBELOH20: Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: FilmBELOH20: And that's reason #1 to buy a shotgun and learn to hunt your own.  I've gotten my 3 pheasant limit every day I've been out this year, and not one of them has ever been injected with an antibiotic.  Neither have the grouse, partridge, quail, ducks or geese....  I'm running out of room in my freezer and deer opener isn't for another 2 weeks.

What are the likely health risks to humans from the levels of antibiotics present in commercially raised chicken?

I don't know, and I don't pretend to.  But as a layperson, I would guess that the reasons "superbugs" are becoming more and more prevalent is because of a) overprescribing of antibiotics, and b) rampant antibiotic use in food animals.  Honestly, it's not the antibiotics that turn me off of commercially produced meat so much as the growth hormones and stuff to make them slaughter-ready in half the time.


I'm not trying to be insulting, but your reasoning seems very "folky" and not at all grounded in the science.
 
2013-10-21 03:58:29 PM

Rapmaster2000: Dow Jones and the Temple of Doom: Rapmaster2000: Heamer: Rapmaster2000: What you're saying is, you don't trust anything from the USDA, certification trade groups, or the manufacturers themselves... so eat chicken nuggets?

I'm not following this line of thinking.

I'm not saying don't eat those things, I'm just saying that they're probably not different from the ones labeled otherwise. I still eat both, and haven't eaten a chicken nugget since 2007.

Why are they probably not different?

Because the term "organic" has different meanings to the USDA, trade groups, and manufacturers. Also, in general, "organic" doesn't mean pesticide or antibiotic-free, it just means that the pesticides and antibiotics used are created through much less efficient (but more "natural") means.
The molecules are identical.  

That doesn't make them not different.  If a product is certified USDA organic then it meets the standards to be considered USDA organic.  That makes it different form a product that does not.

You can argue that this isn't "organic enough" for you or that organic is stupid, lame, and loved by pretentious dickwads, but you cannot say it's "probably not different."  It is demonstrably different.


I concede that it's different in the most superficial way possible, that one has an "organic" sticker and the other doesn't. I guess my point is that in terms of a meaningful difference to humans, there really isn't one.
 
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