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(CBS Sports)   Best kicker tackle of the week   (cbssports.com) divider line 34
    More: Amusing, Pat McAfee, Trindon Holliday, tackles, YouTube videos, Ndamukong Suh  
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2306 clicks; posted to Sports » on 21 Oct 2013 at 9:22 AM (39 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



34 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-10-21 09:01:22 AM
No helmet-to-helmet.  He lead with his arms.  You can clearly see them extend out at the end of the tackle.  The kicker showed some impressive speed cutting the angle against Holliday.
 
2013-10-21 09:26:23 AM
Nothing like getting blown up by the kicker.
 
2013-10-21 09:27:44 AM
#BOOM!
 
2013-10-21 09:27:48 AM
When I saw it live I thought it was certainly a personal foul of some sort. But looks perfectly legit on replay
 
2013-10-21 09:33:39 AM
McAfee is a nut. He blew guys up in college too, so this isn't surprising.
 
2013-10-21 09:36:11 AM

SlothB77: No helmet-to-helmet.  He lead with his arms.  You can clearly see them extend out at the end of the tackle.  The kicker showed some impressive speed cutting the angle against Holliday.


Yeah no, he lowered his head then extended his arms.

I would almost get the NFL will fine him just because nobody expects a kicker to get fined for a hit. And if he was even remotely able he would have inflicted pain or hurt himself.
 
2013-10-21 09:50:22 AM

Adjective Bird Whiskey: Nothing like getting blown up by the kicker.


The flip side of this was the botched onside kick attempt (kicking team was offsides) where the kicker tried to recover the ball and got crushed by someone with a number in the 50s.  Forgot which game.
 
2013-10-21 09:51:57 AM

Adjective Bird Whiskey: Nothing like getting blown up by the kicker.


Not really.  I'd bet kickers who can hit are more the exception, but there is nothing out there that requires a specialist to downright suck at everything else.

I'd more question why the returner was able to blow by everyone else.  Not that it doesn't happen a few times a season, but the punter is the last guy so someone probably busted an assignment.
 
2013-10-21 09:54:47 AM

steamingpile: Yeah no, he lowered his head then extended his arms.


He didn't lower his head, though.  It's just a straight facemask-to-facemask hit and not the sort that's usually penalized.
 
2013-10-21 09:59:12 AM

lemurs: steamingpile: Yeah no, he lowered his head then extended his arms.

He didn't lower his head, though.  It's just a straight facemask-to-facemask hit and not the sort that's usually penalized.


Penalized? No but does draw a fine.
 
2013-10-21 10:08:29 AM

steamingpile: lemurs: steamingpile: Yeah no, he lowered his head then extended his arms.

He didn't lower his head, though.  It's just a straight facemask-to-facemask hit and not the sort that's usually penalized.

Penalized? No but does draw a fine.


Not on a runner, unless the tackler leads with the crown of the helmet, grabs the facemask, or the like.  Tackler had his arms up, too.

Hit a "defenseless" player like that?  Probably a fine.  But a runner who is braced for the impact?  He won't get fined.
 
2013-10-21 10:10:15 AM

chimp_ninja: Adjective Bird Whiskey: Nothing like getting blown up by the kicker.

The flip side of this was the botched onside kick attempt (kicking team was offsides) where the kicker tried to recover the ball and got crushed by someone with a number in the 50s.  Forgot which game.


Ravens/Steelers
 
2013-10-21 10:33:38 AM

chimp_ninja: steamingpile: lemurs: steamingpile: Yeah no, he lowered his head then extended his arms.

He didn't lower his head, though.  It's just a straight facemask-to-facemask hit and not the sort that's usually penalized.

Penalized? No but does draw a fine.

Not on a runner, unless the tackler leads with the crown of the helmet, grabs the facemask, or the like.  Tackler had his arms up, too.

Hit a "defenseless" player like that?  Probably a fine.  But a runner who is braced for the impact?  He won't get fined.


This.

Holliday was not a defenseless player. He was a runner. Legal hit. No fine.
 
2013-10-21 10:35:53 AM
 The low point came on the ensuring kickoff when he got leveled by ... punter Pat McCafee.

ensure.com

/15-yard penalty for relying too much on spellcheck when writing your crappy blog
 
2013-10-21 10:43:12 AM
To be fair the guy that got hit is almost off the chart. (lower, lower left)

cdn.bleacherreport.net

/Kinda funny that shortest & tallest players are Donkeys. 6'8" QB is Osweiler
 
2013-10-21 10:55:48 AM

HideAndGoFarkYourself: chimp_ninja: steamingpile: lemurs: steamingpile: Yeah no, he lowered his head then extended his arms.

He didn't lower his head, though.  It's just a straight facemask-to-facemask hit and not the sort that's usually penalized.

Penalized? No but does draw a fine.

Not on a runner, unless the tackler leads with the crown of the helmet, grabs the facemask, or the like.  Tackler had his arms up, too.

Hit a "defenseless" player like that?  Probably a fine.  But a runner who is braced for the impact?  He won't get fined.

This.

Holliday was not a defenseless player. He was a runner. Legal hit. No fine.


Just ask James Harrison about 'legal' hits, quite a few of hits were legal but he still got fined. Not saying whether the hit is legal or illegal but there is helmet to helmet contact and he did lower his head at the last minute. The thing is two guys this small do very little damage, its when you have guys 50-100 lbs heavier slamming into each other when massive injuries happen.

Just for the record I think he's kind of a dick but did think he was unfairly singled out most of the time.
 
2013-10-21 11:15:25 AM

steamingpile: Not saying whether the hit is legal or illegal but there is helmet to helmet contact and he did lower his head at the last minute.


This is true, yet not relevant.  Unlike most other situations (pocket QBs, WRs catching the ball, players in the act of kicking, KR/PRs in the act of catching, etc.), runners in the NFL (including this returner) run with their heads low and leaning forward.  It's extremely difficult to tackle a runner like this (if you're also running/upright) and not contact their helmet.  The NFL distinguishes based on not only how you're tackling, but what that person was doing.  "Running with the ball" is the least protected position.

If this kind of tackle was illegal, bowling-ball RBs like Maurice Jones-Drew in his prime would just waltz into the endzone in between collecting personal fouls on the defense.  Heck, if I were MJD in that universe, I'd invest in a comically large helmet so you couldn't even get near my shoulders.

It's kind of like why you're allowed to tackle players by their hair.  It's not that tackling people by their hair is particularly safe, it's that otherwise it would be impossible to take down Troy Polamalu from the back, so we don't blame the tackler for going through the hair.
 
2013-10-21 11:38:01 AM

chimp_ninja: It's kind of like why you're allowed to tackle players by their hair.  It's not that tackling people by their hair is particularly safe, it's that otherwise it would be impossible to take down Troy Polamalu from the back, so we don't blame the tackler for going through the hair.


I was under the impression that tackling by the hair is not illegal, but that's not a problem for Polamalu who works on defense.
 
2013-10-21 12:24:31 PM

bionicjoe: To be fair the guy that got hit is almost off the chart. (lower, lower left)

[cdn.bleacherreport.net image 536x290]

/Kinda funny that shortest & tallest players are Donkeys. 6'8" QB is Osweiler


That's an awesome graph. Seriously.
 
2013-10-21 12:34:06 PM
Yes, he "blew up" a guy who is roughly the size of my 9 year old son.  Sign him as middle linebacker immediately!
 
2013-10-21 01:34:09 PM
raised his arms my ass. that was a deliberate helmet to helmet hit and if you are still confused, maybe this slower version will help you see it. i really think he should be fined.
 
2013-10-21 01:37:34 PM

lemurs: chimp_ninja: It's kind of like why you're allowed to tackle players by their hair.  It's not that tackling people by their hair is particularly safe, it's that otherwise it would be impossible to take down Troy Polamalu from the back, so we don't blame the tackler for going through the hair.

I was under the impression that tackling by the hair is not illegal, but that's not a problem for Polamalu who works on defense.


35 career INTs and fumble recoveries.  Less dangerous as a defender, but players have been pulled down by their hair in the NFL before.
 
2013-10-21 02:26:51 PM

divgradcurl: raised his arms my ass. that was a deliberate helmet to helmet hit and if you are still confused, maybe this slower version will help you see it. i really think he should be fined.


Facemask to helmet or facemask to facemask isn't generally called for exactly this reason. If he'd have hit with the top of his cap, you might have a point.

But he didn't, and you don't. There was no real danger and no harm, thus no flag and likely no fine.
 
2013-10-21 02:31:46 PM
Not from this week, but the Packers' Tim Masthay gets nasty quite regularly.

//Apologize in advance for the crappy video, but it was the only one I could find in 10 seconds of searching.
 
2013-10-21 02:39:07 PM
It was an awesome hit, but if you've watched the Colts regularly you know McAfee doesn't shy away from contact. I remember thinking during their 2-14 season a couple years ago when their STs were terrible as ever that he seemed to be in on a lot of tackles. This notion was confirmed by Football Outsiders, who found that for 2011-12 he led the team in return tackles and the entire league in return saves.
 
2013-10-21 02:51:45 PM
As a Broncos fan, that WAS probably the best play of the game. :-)
 
2013-10-21 02:57:24 PM
I hope he is on Bob and Tom this week. The last time he was on they razzed him about a blocked punt.
 
2013-10-21 05:13:04 PM

steamingpile: HideAndGoFarkYourself: chimp_ninja: steamingpile: lemurs: steamingpile: Yeah no, he lowered his head then extended his arms.

He didn't lower his head, though.  It's just a straight facemask-to-facemask hit and not the sort that's usually penalized.

Penalized? No but does draw a fine.

Not on a runner, unless the tackler leads with the crown of the helmet, grabs the facemask, or the like.  Tackler had his arms up, too.

Hit a "defenseless" player like that?  Probably a fine.  But a runner who is braced for the impact?  He won't get fined.

This.

Holliday was not a defenseless player. He was a runner. Legal hit. No fine.

Just ask James Harrison about 'legal' hits, quite a few of hits were legal but he still got fined. Not saying whether the hit is legal or illegal but there is helmet to helmet contact and he did lower his head at the last minute. The thing is two guys this small do very little damage, its when you have guys 50-100 lbs heavier slamming into each other when massive injuries happen.

Just for the record I think he's kind of a dick but did think he was unfairly singled out most of the time.


He didn't lower his head...his facemask hit the side of Holliday's helmet.  The only time you get a fine for an illegal helmet-to-helmet hit on a runner (NOT a defenseless player) is if you lead with the crown of your helmet.  That did not happen here.  Legal hit, no fine.
 
2013-10-21 07:43:15 PM
HAH - McAfee got to take a drug test today.  Randomly.

http://www.indystar.com/viewint/article/20131021/SPORTS/310210021/Ju st -Bit-Outside-Pat-McAfee-tweets-photo-NFL-drug-test-notice-day-after-hi s-big-hit

See also the Pat McAfee Show link at the top of the page; he's a media kind of guy.
 
2013-10-21 10:54:27 PM

bionicjoe: To be fair the guy that got hit is almost off the chart. (lower, lower left)

[cdn.bleacherreport.net image 536x290]

/Kinda funny that shortest & tallest players are Donkeys. 6'8" QB is Osweiler


What am I looking at?  Kesha's herpe rash?
 
2013-10-22 12:39:06 AM

HideAndGoFarkYourself: steamingpile: HideAndGoFarkYourself: chimp_ninja: steamingpile: lemurs: steamingpile: Yeah no, he lowered his head then extended his arms.

He didn't lower his head, though.  It's just a straight facemask-to-facemask hit and not the sort that's usually penalized.

Penalized? No but does draw a fine.

Not on a runner, unless the tackler leads with the crown of the helmet, grabs the facemask, or the like.  Tackler had his arms up, too.

Hit a "defenseless" player like that?  Probably a fine.  But a runner who is braced for the impact?  He won't get fined.

This.

Holliday was not a defenseless player. He was a runner. Legal hit. No fine.

Just ask James Harrison about 'legal' hits, quite a few of hits were legal but he still got fined. Not saying whether the hit is legal or illegal but there is helmet to helmet contact and he did lower his head at the last minute. The thing is two guys this small do very little damage, its when you have guys 50-100 lbs heavier slamming into each other when massive injuries happen.

Just for the record I think he's kind of a dick but did think he was unfairly singled out most of the time.

He didn't lower his head...his facemask hit the side of Holliday's helmet.  The only time you get a fine for an illegal helmet-to-helmet hit on a runner (NOT a defenseless player) is if you lead with the crown of your helmet.  That did not happen here.  Legal hit, no fine.


Thats your opinion, I see him lean his head into him just as he gets close but then if it was my team I would defend him irrationally as well.

Legal or illegal is irrelevant, I have seen numerous hits draw a fine even though a penalty wasnt called so I dont know why you are arguing, and watching the replays you can clearly see him lower his head the second before he makes the hit, if it were James Harrison, Suh, etc.... They would be fined and you cant even argue that fact.
 
2013-10-22 01:59:20 PM

steveGswine: HAH - McAfee got to take a drug test today.  Randomly.

http://www.indystar.com/viewint/article/20131021/SPORTS/310210021/Ju st -Bit-Outside-Pat-McAfee-tweets-photo-NFL-drug-test-notice-day-after-hi s-big-hit

See also the Pat McAfee Show link at the top of the page; he's a media kind of guy.


That's an understatement. He's on Bob and Tom more than Bob is.
 
2013-10-22 04:06:57 PM

steamingpile: HideAndGoFarkYourself: steamingpile: HideAndGoFarkYourself: chimp_ninja: steamingpile: lemurs: steamingpile: Yeah no, he lowered his head then extended his arms.

He didn't lower his head, though.  It's just a straight facemask-to-facemask hit and not the sort that's usually penalized.

Penalized? No but does draw a fine.

Not on a runner, unless the tackler leads with the crown of the helmet, grabs the facemask, or the like.  Tackler had his arms up, too.

Hit a "defenseless" player like that?  Probably a fine.  But a runner who is braced for the impact?  He won't get fined.

This.

Holliday was not a defenseless player. He was a runner. Legal hit. No fine.

Just ask James Harrison about 'legal' hits, quite a few of hits were legal but he still got fined. Not saying whether the hit is legal or illegal but there is helmet to helmet contact and he did lower his head at the last minute. The thing is two guys this small do very little damage, its when you have guys 50-100 lbs heavier slamming into each other when massive injuries happen.

Just for the record I think he's kind of a dick but did think he was unfairly singled out most of the time.

He didn't lower his head...his facemask hit the side of Holliday's helmet.  The only time you get a fine for an illegal helmet-to-helmet hit on a runner (NOT a defenseless player) is if you lead with the crown of your helmet.  That did not happen here.  Legal hit, no fine.

Thats your opinion, I see him lean his head into him just as he gets close but then if it was my team I would defend him irrationally as well.

Legal or illegal is irrelevant, I have seen numerous hits draw a fine even though a penalty wasnt called so I dont know why you are arguing, and watching the replays you can clearly see him lower his head the second before he makes the hit, if it were James Harrison, Suh, etc.... They would be fined and you cant even argue that fact.


It's not opinion, it's fact.  He did not lead with the crown of his helmet, his facemask makes contact with the side of Holliday's helmet.  That is not an illegal hit.  It is ONLY illegal if he lowers his head and leads with the top of his helmet, which did not happen, and there's no way any person looking at the video can say that he hit Holliday with the top of his helmet.  Simply making helmet to helmet contact is not a penalty, especially not when the player is not a defenseless player, but is a runner by definition.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2013/10/20/mcafees-big-hit-on-h ol liday-was-legal/

Yes, I can argue that fact, because it's not rooted in reality.  Show me a similar hit, on a RUNNER, not a defenseless player, that has drawn a fine...THIS SEASON, when the "crown of the helmet" rule was enacted.  You cannot do it.

The NFL has already assessed numerous fines for actions in games this week, and has made not one single peep about McAfee'shiat.

You are dead wrong.  100% wrong.
 
2013-10-22 04:12:42 PM

steamingpile: I have seen numerous hits draw a fine even though a penalty wasnt called so I dont know why you are arguing, and watching the replays you can clearly see him lower his head the second before he makes the hit, if it were James Harrison, Suh, etc.... They would be fined and you cant even argue that fact.


If they fined everyone in the NFL who tackled a runner and made any mask-to-mask contact, the players would be on food stamps.  See my comments above about RBs who run like Maurice Jones-Drew or Ray Rice.  If you're in front of them, they're a helmet four feet off the ground with a pile of muscle behind it.  You can't get lower than them and still move laterally with any speed.  You're going to hit their helmet as part of the initial impact.

I have no idea what league you watch.  In the NFL, the fines are for leading with the crown of the helmet ("spearing"), or for helmet-to-helmet on "defenseless" players, including QBs in the act of throwing, Ps/Ks in the act of kicking, WRs/KRs/PRs in the act of catching, etc.  Runners are the least protected players on the field.

Everyone above can and has been arguing this "fact" with you because you don't know the rules or history of enforcement.
 
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