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(Talking Points Memo)   Senate GOP: Simmer down, we found a way out of this mess. House GOP: Well, then we'll just issue another counter offer with attacks on Obamacare then. HA   (talkingpointsmemo.com) divider line 644
    More: News, GOP, White House, obamacare, Senate, Boehner, Charlie Dent, David Vitter  
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10688 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Oct 2013 at 10:53 AM (40 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-15 11:29:08 AM

namegoeshere: those with preexisting conditions, etc.?


This is why I tentatively support the ACA.  No other plan put forward by anybody to compete with the ACA addresses this issue, and until something surfaces which does address this problem, I will continue to support the ACA.  Having a preexisting condition should not be a death sentence for somebody outside of the ability to get into an employer group plan.
 
2013-10-15 11:29:35 AM

Infernalist: You do realize that under ACA rules, insurance companies are required to issue refunds at the end of the year if you don't use that insurance in that year's time?


That doesn't sound true at all.
 
2013-10-15 11:29:39 AM

HammerMill: Please give me one example of a function that government has taken over and made it better, faster, or cheaper.

There are none.  While in principal the ACA is full of rainbows and sunshine for everyone, in practice it will be is a mess.


None, besides every other industrial country on the planet.

newshour.s3.amazonaws.com
 
2013-10-15 11:29:39 AM

Notabunny: HammerMill: Please give me one example of a function that government has taken over and made it better, faster, or cheaper.

[img.photobucket.com image 800x531]


Yes, wonderful job with that Government takeover - we're only losing $10 Billion on that deal.  That's like an A+ for the goverment.  The ACA will lose us a healthy few trillion, which is more like it.
http://articles.latimes.com/2013/jun/07/autos/la-fi-hy-taxpayers-los s- gm-bailout-20130607

And compare GM to Ford, who took no money in bailouts and is doing fine.  Nope, not a realistic example.
 
2013-10-15 11:29:55 AM
Nancy Pelosi is up to bat next
 
2013-10-15 11:29:57 AM

kidgenius: It would mean more to me if I got a return on my investment when I didn't use it, as I rarely do, as in I haven't had the need for a physician's care for almost two years and that was a phone call to tell them to send in a steroid scrip to my pharmacy for a case of poison ivy, which costs me $4 without insurance.

You want a return on your investment huh? How about you not being bankrupt and penniless if, god forbid, you had a major medical event occur. THAT'S THE POINT OF INSURANCE!

If you want a slight return on your investment, get an HSA compatible plan and put some money into it. You get a tax break on the money you put into the HSA and once you've got enough to in there to make you feel comfortable, you'll have lower rates.


I was merely stating that the scrip only costs $4 without insurance, not that I don't have any. Geez.
 
2013-10-15 11:29:58 AM

George Babbitt: maniacbastard: George Babbitt: Did the NSA give you access to their network and now you know what I can afford and what I spend my money on?

I know that I do not want to spend my money for your lazy cheap ass to have emergency only care when you take your busted stupid ass into the ER.

Act like an adult and farking pay your fair share asshole.

I do have insurance. For how long, IDK, with my employer looking at leaving us to fend for ourselves in the ACA marketplaces. Your assumptions of what I do and what I have are way off base.


So get your tax credit and let the free market take care of you!

Quit being a taker and depending your boss to pay yor premium with your pre-tax income using a group rate he was able to negotiate.
 
2013-10-15 11:30:22 AM

George Babbitt: Infernalist: You do realize that under ACA rules, insurance companies are required to issue refunds at the end of the year if you don't use that insurance in that year's time?

That is the first time in history I have ever heard of insurance doing that and if true would be awesome, citation needed though, if you please.


No, it's not true.

The insurance companies are required to send you a check, refunding part of your premiums, if THEY don't spend >=80% on medical care. I received a check last year from Aetna because they hadn't met this. It's averaged across ALL of their plans though, not just an individual.
 
2013-10-15 11:30:41 AM
Looks like I have to write to Mr. Cantor... AGAIN.
 
2013-10-15 11:31:00 AM

Having spent two hours talking to House Republicans, my expert investment advice is: Short everything

- daveweigel (@daveweigel) October 15, 2013


Sell, Mortimer! Sell!
 
2013-10-15 11:31:01 AM

Gunther: Isn't the deadline to avoid a default today? WTF are they doing rejecting bipartisan deals at this stage?

Do they farking understand what happens if they overplay their (incredibly weak) hand?


It's Thursday. But they still need to hurry. It's still gotta get through the Senate (including a likely Cruz filibuster, which could easily take 24 hours) and the House, where it will see a lot of opposition, before it can be signed into law.
 
2013-10-15 11:31:17 AM

HammerMill: Please give me one example of a function that government has taken over and made it better, faster, or cheaper.

There are none.  While in principal the ACA is full of rainbows and sunshine for everyone, in practice it will be is a mess.


The public school system.

/Yes, really, go look it up.
//Same with mail service.
///And yes, you need to compare it to what was in place before those existed, not compared to what you wish you had in utopia.
 
2013-10-15 11:31:20 AM

Prophet of Loss: How about we start a no Democrats, no GOP movement next election season? Its time to give some other political parties a try.


I voted Lemon Party once, but I got vetoed.
 
2013-10-15 11:31:22 AM

QueenMamaBee: impaler: Ok, to everybody that thinks this is NOT the Republicans fault.

What do the Democrats want? What political item are the asking for in order to hold up the continuing resolution and debt ceiling?

I want it to be required by law to pimp slap one's elected officials at least once a year... but I don't think that's on the table right now.

/Rand Paul, Mitch McConnell and Thomas Massie have slappable faces


I'd have to be wearing a thick metal glove to touch McConnell's face.
 
2013-10-15 11:31:28 AM

chevyguy68: Just found out that my health care is going from $300 a month to $550, great health care reform you got there, Obama.


Look.  It's a noob.  Point and laugh at the noob.
 
2013-10-15 11:31:47 AM

George Babbitt: Infernalist: You do realize that under ACA rules, insurance companies are required to issue refunds at the end of the year if you don't use that insurance in that year's time?

That is the first time in history I have ever heard of insurance doing that and if true would be awesome, citation needed though, if you please.


5 seconds with google

Here
 
2013-10-15 11:31:48 AM

silo123j: Looks like I have to write to Mr. Cantor... AGAIN.


I've got the form open on another tab to write my teabagger house-troll, but the right words elude me.
 
2013-10-15 11:31:59 AM

Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: QueenMamaBee: impaler: Ok, to everybody that thinks this is NOT the Republicans fault.

What do the Democrats want? What political item are the asking for in order to hold up the continuing resolution and debt ceiling?

I want it to be required by law to pimp slap one's elected officials at least once a year... but I don't think that's on the table right now.

/Rand Paul, Mitch McConnell and Thomas Massie have slappable faces

I'd have to be wearing a thick metal glove to touch McConnell's face.


It's called a gauntlet. Hellooo?
 
2013-10-15 11:32:08 AM

George Babbitt: Your assumptions of what I do and what I have are way off base.


All I see is a whiner, whining about being an adult and whining about being forced to pay for your own damn healthcare.

Or are you not whining about being an adult and having to pay your fair share?

Regardless of how healthy you are, you are still subject to a random accident that can cost ME and others a shiatton of money to fix your busted cheap whiny ass, loser.
 
2013-10-15 11:32:11 AM

George Babbitt: kidgenius: It would mean more to me if I got a return on my investment when I didn't use it, as I rarely do, as in I haven't had the need for a physician's care for almost two years and that was a phone call to tell them to send in a steroid scrip to my pharmacy for a case of poison ivy, which costs me $4 without insurance.

You want a return on your investment huh? How about you not being bankrupt and penniless if, god forbid, you had a major medical event occur. THAT'S THE POINT OF INSURANCE!

If you want a slight return on your investment, get an HSA compatible plan and put some money into it. You get a tax break on the money you put into the HSA and once you've got enough to in there to make you feel comfortable, you'll have lower rates.

I was merely stating that the scrip only costs $4 without insurance, not that I don't have any. Geez.


I didn't say you don't have it, I was saying that the return on your investment will come if you got sick. Want to get an immediate return? Go do something that will get you sick and require hospitalization. Your insurance will pay out WAY more than you put in and you will benefit by not being bankrupt.
 
2013-10-15 11:32:22 AM
I think it's time for me to join a political party, and I think I am going to register as a Republican. I need to do my part in a swing district in California during primary season, and help elect a moderate like myself.
 
2013-10-15 11:32:37 AM

GoldSpider: Infernalist: You do realize that under ACA rules, insurance companies are required to issue refunds at the end of the year if you don't use that insurance in that year's time?

That doesn't sound true at all.


It's not my fault you don't know how to google.

Here
 
2013-10-15 11:32:48 AM

GoldSpider: chevyguy68: Just found out that my health care is going from $300 a month to $550, great health care reform you got there, Obama.

I'm sure that's Obama's fault and not your employer or the group insurer they deal with.


Every $250 is an extra abortion at the provider of your choice.
 
2013-10-15 11:32:54 AM
Voters to Republicans next election:

We hate to say we told you so...

So, we won't; we'll just vote your party into unemployment.

The GOP seems to be afflicted with a severe case of mass stupidity.
 
2013-10-15 11:33:01 AM

Serious Black: Section 1: If, by April 1st, Congress has not approved a common budget between the two chambers, it shall be a privileged motion to call for a vote on any budget resolution that has the support of ten percent of the chamber.

Section 2: If, by October 1st, Congress has not approved and the President has not signed into law all common appropriations bills, all previous appropriations shall be continued, and the Supreme Court shall call an election for all federally elected officials to be held on the first Tuesday of December.

Section 3: Consistent with the intent of Section 4 of the 14th Amendment, Congress shall not have the power to limit the borrowing authority of the federal government.


I like it!!

The big concern would be that in this case, the House would refuse to compromise, to force another chance to unseat Obama. I think you would have to add that all sitting members of the House would be ineligible to run again, or possibly all Federal elected officials permanently ineligible for any future elected office.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-10-15 11:33:08 AM

silo123j: Looks like I have to write to Mr. Cantor... AGAIN.


Do you have corporate money to give him?  If not don't bother.
 
2013-10-15 11:33:43 AM

Infernalist: George Babbitt: Infernalist: You do realize that under ACA rules, insurance companies are required to issue refunds at the end of the year if you don't use that insurance in that year's time?

That is the first time in history I have ever heard of insurance doing that and if true would be awesome, citation needed though, if you please.

5 seconds with google

Here


That's different from what you stated. The insurance companies only send you a check if they, as a company, spent less than 80% on medical care. If you don't use any of your insurance, that doesn't mean you get a refund for the difference.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-10-15 11:33:54 AM

GoodyearPimp: GoldSpider: chevyguy68: Just found out that my health care is going from $300 a month to $550, great health care reform you got there, Obama.

I'm sure that's Obama's fault and not your employer or the group insurer they deal with.

Every $250 is an extra abortion at the provider of your choice.


Attacks at that level aren't worth anything more than a big fark you.
 
2013-10-15 11:34:03 AM

Mike Chewbacca: George Babbitt: Mike Chewbacca: George Babbitt: nekom: I want poor people to have better access to health insurance.  I was told that this makes me worse than Hitler.

I can't afford $60 copay to my primary physician and $5000/year deductible all for the cost of $175/month in premiums for Bronze level coverage.

If you can't afford $175 a month for health insurance, then you're living outside your means and you should reevaluate what you're wasting your money on. Health insurance should be a priority over things like that brand new car or the upgraded car with the bells and whistles. You don't need 1000 channels on your TV. You don't need a smart phone. Health insurance should be one of the things you buy no matter what.

Did the NSA give you access to their network and now you know what I can afford and what I spend my money on?

Nope. I just know that if you're TRULY too broke to buy health insurance (especially for only $175/month) then you'd qualify for subsidies. And if that $175 factors in subsidies, then I know you're wasting your money on unimportant shiat. Like I said, you don't need expanded cable. You don't need a smart phone.  You don't need to connect your iPad to ATT's 4g network. Health insurance should be prioritized as Can't Live Without, like rent and food. Everything else is a want that you CAN do without. If you pared back your cable, your cell phone bill (by getting a dumb phone), and your dining out at restaurants bill, you could afford health insurance.

Be a grown up and make the hard choices we're all facing. Like I said, we downgraded our housing to pay for our health insurance last year. It sucks, but we nutted up and did it because we're goddamn grown ups.


Don't have cable, have a great-grandfathered plan with mobile carrier going back 25 years and it's cheaper than any contract you've ever heard of, don't have an iPad/tablet, and we never eat out as we abstain from all artificial food additives. As I said elsewhere, we have insurance, don't know for how long with employer's mindset on the current healthcare laws, but if they left us to fend for ourselves in the marketplaces, it would not be good.
 
2013-10-15 11:34:08 AM

Obama's Reptiloid Master: Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: QueenMamaBee: impaler: Ok, to everybody that thinks this is NOT the Republicans fault.

What do the Democrats want? What political item are the asking for in order to hold up the continuing resolution and debt ceiling?

I want it to be required by law to pimp slap one's elected officials at least once a year... but I don't think that's on the table right now.

/Rand Paul, Mitch McConnell and Thomas Massie have slappable faces

I'd have to be wearing a thick metal glove to touch McConnell's face.

It's called a gauntlet. Hellooo?


You can't mention gauntlet without slashie-ing:

/elf needs food, badly!
 
2013-10-15 11:34:13 AM

stovepipe: karmaceutical: James!: Finally their true goal of delaying the medical device tax reveals itself.  So glad they shut the government down over that shiat.

It is crazy.  This whole damn time, they were fighting for the medical device lobby.

Are these considered medical devices?

[i.imgur.com image 494x743]

If so, it's all starting to make sense to me.


No.
theredshtick.com
It's only a GOP-approved medical device if it includes at least one machine gun.
 
2013-10-15 11:34:32 AM

HammerMill: Kornchex: HammerMill: Please give me one example of a function that government has taken over and made it better, faster, or cheaper.

There are none.  While in principal the ACA is full of rainbows and sunshine for everyone, in practice it will be is a mess.

It is apparent that a lot more happens in this country than you are aware of.

2/10

Oh, please wise and sagacious sir, educate me with your wisdom.


So you can ignore it just to make your next talking point?  Child please...
 
2013-10-15 11:34:36 AM

Nadie_AZ: Jan. 15, 2014 and raise the debt limit until Feb. 7 or 8 of next year.

So we do this all over again in 3 months?

How about NO.


All part of the extinction behavior, right now we are seeing an extinction burst. See when attempting to extinguish a behavior you get more of the bad behavior as the subject attempts to get rewarded. For these poor dumb Republican beasts the extinction burst has been extreme, but reorganization is starting to occur and in three months the Republican animals behavior will be less then it is today as the reward has proven to have been taken away.

Hence the fight in three months will be less then it is today, unless of course the Senate and President does reward the Republican beast with something, like stopping the medical device tax. This is all about training the irrational dumb Republican beast like any good behavioral psychologist should.
 
2013-10-15 11:34:40 AM

Infernalist: 5 seconds with google

Here


"An estimated 8.5 million Americans will receive rebates from their health insurers this summer thanks to the Affordable Care Act, which says companies that fail to spend at least 80 percent of premiums on health care must refund the difference to consumers."

Which is nothing at all like "insurance companies are required to issue refunds at the end of the year if you don't use that insurance in that year's time"
 
2013-10-15 11:35:20 AM

Infernalist: GoldSpider: Infernalist: You do realize that under ACA rules, insurance companies are required to issue refunds at the end of the year if you don't use that insurance in that year's time?

That doesn't sound true at all.

It's not my fault you don't know how to google.

Here



Reading comprehension.  You don't have it.
 
2013-10-15 11:35:33 AM

GoldSpider: silo123j: Looks like I have to write to Mr. Cantor... AGAIN.

I've got the form open on another tab to write my teabagger house-troll, but the right words elude me.


For mine I sent that I wasn't sure if he was just an opportunist or just ignorant.  I finished with that if the Republicans crash the economy I hoped that God would have mercy on his soul because most of the voters sure as hell won't.
 
2013-10-15 11:35:49 AM

HammerMill: Please give me one example of a function that government has taken over and made it better, faster, or cheaper.


Environment
Roads
Schools
... and I really have no more time for your idiocy.  Besides, I'm not sure you would be able to count past 3.
 
2013-10-15 11:35:50 AM

kidgenius: Your insurance will pay out WAY more than you put in and you will benefit by not being bankrupt.


Only beacause healthcare costs too much. There are stories coming out now about some doctors are not taking insurance anymore and are able to offer cheaper services.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-10-15 11:36:13 AM

2wolves: chevyguy68: Just found out that my health care is going from $300 a month to $550, great health care reform you got there, Obama.

Look.  It's a noob.  Point and laugh at the noob.


It's a hard argument to make to someone that is infected with today's common strain of mass selfishness, but there are a lot of people going from $800 or more a month down to the low hundreds or less.  There is massive re-balancing of the system going on...
 
2013-10-15 11:36:21 AM

GoodyearPimp: Reading comprehension. You don't have it.


In all fairness, nobody ever claimed that Republicans have a monopoly on lying about the ACA.
 
2013-10-15 11:36:24 AM

derpy: dwrash: Delaying the individual mandate for a year is in the best interests of the democratic party.. its a shame that they cannot see this.  It avoids the favoritism that the unions are other deep pocket lobbiests are getting and it will allow them to get HealthCare.gov ironed out (which from all reports is a 6-9 month all hands on deck project since it's design is fundamentally flawed.. which will push it past the open enrollment deadline).. if they don't push it out, the democrats are going to catch hell when people have to pay their IRS fines.  Right now the shut down is obscuring most of the healthcare.gov issues... once the shutdown goes away, and media focuses full time on healthcare.gov.. the shiat is going to hit the fan.

As far as the medical devices tax... the entire idea of taxing a single industry to pay for associated ACA costs was stupid from the get-go... whoever got this included in the ACA should be run out of town... it's causing medical device manufacturers to ship their manufacturing overseas so that laber costs are lowered.

Common sense.. both parties need to find some.

[i43.tinypic.com image 500x500]


And this is why most people on this site are farking morons.
 
2013-10-15 11:36:26 AM

Infernalist: George Babbitt: Mike Chewbacca: George Babbitt: nekom: I want poor people to have better access to health insurance.  I was told that this makes me worse than Hitler.

I can't afford $60 copay to my primary physician and $5000/year deductible all for the cost of $175/month in premiums for Bronze level coverage.

If you can't afford $175 a month for health insurance, then you're living outside your means and you should reevaluate what you're wasting your money on. Health insurance should be a priority over things like that brand new car or the upgraded car with the bells and whistles. You don't need 1000 channels on your TV. You don't need a smart phone. Health insurance should be one of the things you buy no matter what.

Did the NSA give you access to their network and now you know what I can afford and what I spend my money on?

Yep, and you need to stop buying so much midget porn.



Hey lets not trash midget porn, it costs half as much as regular porn and I'm on a budget.


\I took you off <green> and Troll. Welcome back
 
2013-10-15 11:36:37 AM

RDixon: Voters to Republicans next election:

We hate to say we told you so...

So, we won't; we'll just vote your party into unemployment.

The GOP seems to be afflicted with a severe case of mass stupidity.


You're putting a lot of stock into thinking that places like Texas can learn from its mistakes. A state that was run by George W Bush and then elected him to presidency.
 
2013-10-15 11:36:58 AM

maniacbastard: George Babbitt: Your assumptions of what I do and what I have are way off base.

All I see is a whiner, whining about being an adult and whining about being forced to pay for your own damn healthcare.

Or are you not whining about being an adult and having to pay your fair share?

Regardless of how healthy you are, you are still subject to a random accident that can cost ME and others a shiatton of money to fix your busted cheap whiny ass, loser.


I have insurance, read the other comments and don't just jump down my throat with the first low hanging fruit you see.
 
2013-10-15 11:37:12 AM

d23: 2wolves: chevyguy68: Just found out that my health care is going from $300 a month to $550, great health care reform you got there, Obama.

Look.  It's a noob.  Point and laugh at the noob.

It's a hard argument to make to someone that is infected with today's common strain of mass selfishness, but there are a lot of people going from $800 or more a month down to the low hundreds or less.  There is massive re-balancing of the system going on...


Yep, I'm saving over $200 a month, it just makes sense:  millions of people who used to pay nothing now have to pay.  If you were paying before, now you're going to pay less.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-10-15 11:37:27 AM

George Babbitt: kidgenius: Your insurance will pay out WAY more than you put in and you will benefit by not being bankrupt.

Only beacause healthcare costs too much. There are stories coming out now about some doctors are not taking insurance anymore and are able to offer cheaper services.


From the other direction there are also plenty of hospitals that are charging $300 for a $5 bag of saline drip.
 
2013-10-15 11:37:45 AM

Muta: Krymson Tyde: Goddammit Boehner, just shut the fark up already.

No shiat.  The Constitution says spending bills need to originate in the House.  Boner doesn't want to commit to anything so he make the Senate submit their proposals first.  Once the Senate makes the proposal with a concession he pushes it just a little more.


I'm sick to death of these GOP assholes. And I'm stuck here in the fricken south surrounded by them.
 
2013-10-15 11:38:33 AM

maniacbastard: George Babbitt: Your assumptions of what I do and what I have are way off base.

All I see is a whiner, whining about being an adult and whining about being forced to pay for your own damn healthcare.

Or are you not whining about being an adult and having to pay your fair share?

Regardless of how healthy you are, you are still subject to a random accident that can cost ME and others a shiatton of money to fix your busted cheap whiny ass, loser.


I have insurance you derp, read the other comments and don't just jump at the first low hanging fruit you see.

/repeating myself now
 
2013-10-15 11:38:58 AM

HammerMill: Notabunny: HammerMill: Please give me one example of a function that government has taken over and made it better, faster, or cheaper.

[img.photobucket.com image 800x531]

Yes, wonderful job with that Government takeover - we're only losing $10 Billion on that deal.  That's like an A+ for the goverment.  The ACA will lose us a healthy few trillion, which is more like it.
http://articles.latimes.com/2013/jun/07/autos/la-fi-hy-taxpayers-los s- gm-bailout-20130607

And compare GM to Ford, who took no money in bailouts and is doing fine.  Nope, not a realistic example.


I was just trolling. Nobody believes the government took over GM. Just like nobody believes Obamacare is a government takeover of healthcare.
 
2013-10-15 11:39:11 AM

GoldSpider: Infernalist: 5 seconds with google

Here

"An estimated 8.5 million Americans will receive rebates from their health insurers this summer thanks to the Affordable Care Act, which says companies that fail to spend at least 80 percent of premiums on health care must refund the difference to consumers."

Which is nothing at all like "insurance companies are required to issue refunds at the end of the year if you don't use that insurance in that year's time"


Unfortunately, this is true, and it makes a lot more sense than refunding premiums not used by individuals. Then pooling would be pointless. My insurance company didn't meet the 80/20 rule, so I expected that my premium would just be lowered slightly. Instead I got a check. For $2.43. Still, better than a higher premium, and my insurance still covers just about everything.
 
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