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(Sun Sentinel)   Guy gets stranded at the beach naked after his friend steals all his clothes, so he decides to run home nude. This being Florida, naturally a stranger shoots him dead   (sun-sentinel.com) divider line 327
    More: Florida, Hollywood, Hollywood Boulevard, beaches, clothing, nude, friend, Pembroke Pines  
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14606 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Oct 2013 at 6:00 AM (44 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-15 06:45:29 AM
"He was running naked, yes, but he had no choice. And knowing my son he would have forgiven the man who shot him."

Don't be so sure , he did kill me Dad.
 
2013-10-15 06:47:04 AM

fusillade762: He told detectives he was driving west on Hollywood Boulevard between 5 and 5:30 a.m. Oct. 6 when he spotted the nude man. He passed by him, then turned around and went back, he told police.

Oh for f*ck's sake. Call the goddamn cops and let them deal with it. Did no one learn anything from the Martin shooting?


This. Let the cops shoot him... then it's in and out of the news cycle in one day, two tops.
 
2013-10-15 06:47:52 AM
Sure Australians get arrested for streaking in public if caught, but we've never claimed to be the land of the free. Our constitution doesn't provide for particular rights or freedoms very much, and it's just sort of left that if there isn't a law against it you're possibly free to do it.

Just what are Americans free to do in the land of the free that is special? Running home naked would be normal behaviour in Germany.
 
2013-10-15 06:48:47 AM

Gunther: Bungles: I'm always baffled how in America somebody can shoot somebody and that person is not arrested just as a matter of course, regardless of the "circumstances", because it's a crime being investigated.

Stand Your Ground laws make it very easy to get away with murder if there aren't any witnesses to contradict the shooter's statement (and considering it was 5am, there probably were no witnesses). As long as you say "afraid for my life", you're good. It's essentially a magic phrase that makes you immune to a murder charge.

This shiat is gonna keep happening in states that pass SYG laws. Honestly, I'm surprised there's not more of it.


Works for cops.
 
2013-10-15 06:51:38 AM

Aussie_As: Sure Australians get arrested for streaking in public if caught, but we've never claimed to be the land of the free. Our constitution doesn't provide for particular rights or freedoms very much, and it's just sort of left that if there isn't a law against it you're possibly free to do it.

Just what are Americans free to do in the land of the free that is special? Running home naked would be normal behaviour in Germany.


We are free to rob the poors.
 
2013-10-15 06:52:35 AM
Common fark he was black and naked. The passing motorist was feeling threatened. He had to stand his ground.
 
2013-10-15 06:54:17 AM

TuteTibiImperes: Confabulat: This About That: Confabulat: But it's cool for white kids?

This About That: I'm not saying it's right, I'm saying that self preservation is also an important consideration.

I still don't get it. You're saying people are more likely to shoot a naked black guy running down the street than a naked white one?

To be fair, in Florida, you're 6x more likely to get shot if you're black than if you're white in general.

Still, I do think in this case 'naked' overrules race.


Being naked just makes it more obvious you're black.
 
2013-10-15 06:55:55 AM
I'm sure the guy's penis moved toward him in a threatening manner. It being large and black the only thing left to do was to obviously shoot him.
 
2013-10-15 06:58:26 AM

EvilEgg: Well the shooter did exclaim "I can clearly see your nuts!"


Nice opening, +1.  Now, on to the rest of the thread.
 
2013-10-15 06:59:05 AM

GregoryD: I'm sure the guy's penis moved toward him in a threatening manner. It being large and black the only thing left to do was to obviously shoot him.



If there's one type of person who you should be terrified of carrying a concealed weapon - and reason enough to draw your own arms - it's a butt-naked man jogging.
 
2013-10-15 06:59:28 AM

namatad: Time to kill everyone in floriduh.
Nuke it from Orbit.
It is the only way to be sure.


um that is what they are doing and you still compain
 
2013-10-15 06:59:39 AM

JohnCarter: So...why was he naked in the first place?  I get going to the beach after work, even getting your skateboard and cell phone taken by friends, not sure about all the clothes.


He and his buddy get off of work, have a few drinks, maybe some other stuff, get out to the beach, meet some ladies, go skinny dipping, they get mad at each other over something which chases the girls off (maybe over a girl). Punches are thrown, clothes are stolen.

Or he and his buddy had a lovers quarrel with each other?

I dunno. I'm generalizing and assuming.
 
2013-10-15 07:00:06 AM
The guy goes to the beach late at night with a male friend, ends up naked. Hmmm. Then they get in a fight, the naked guy punches his "friend" in the face, and friend steals his clothes. Then he runs home naked, and when someone stops to help him, he fights him too. Doesn't really sound like the angel the family makes him out to be. Not saying he needed to die, but not enough details.
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-10-15 07:00:17 AM
In all fairness, the naked guy was "pointing" at him.

If it's not "stand your ground" then it's "gay rage".
 
d23 [TotalFark]
2013-10-15 07:01:04 AM

Bit'O'Gristle: The guy goes to the beach late at night with a male friend, ends up naked. Hmmm. Then they get in a fight, the naked guy punches his "friend" in the face, and friend steals his clothes. Then he runs home naked, and when someone stops to help him, he fights him too. Doesn't really sound like the angel the family makes him out to be. Not saying he needed to die, but not enough details.


Clearly he deserved to die.
 
2013-10-15 07:02:54 AM

Bit'O'Gristle: The guy goes to the beach late at night with a male friend, ends up naked. Hmmm. Then they get in a fight, the naked guy punches his "friend" in the face, and friend steals his clothes. Then he runs home naked, and when someone stops to help him, he fights him too. Doesn't really sound like the angel the family makes him out to be. Not saying he needed to die, but not enough details.


so with more details there may be a reason he needed to die? 'some guy in a car' acting as judge, jury and executioner?

you should do away with the justice system, this is so much cheaper!
 
2013-10-15 07:03:25 AM

d23: In all fairness, the naked guy was "pointing" at him.

If it's not "stand your ground" then it's "gay rage".


I would presume that an obvious route to investigate - even by the batty US state police - would be "Saw naked man, crudely tried to pick him up, naked man freaked out".

You know, like in a real country, where they'd swab his vehicle for the victim's DNA, to see if this was a hitchhike gone wrong.
 
2013-10-15 07:03:57 AM

Bungles: GregoryD: I'm sure the guy's penis moved toward him in a threatening manner. It being large and black the only thing left to do was to obviously shoot him.


If there's one type of person who you should be terrified of carrying a concealed weapon - and reason enough to draw your own arms - it's a butt-naked man jogging.


But the large penis was coming right for him!  I'm sure he was wielding it like a billy club.

If he didn't shoot the guy he might have been labeled homosexual. What is a guy to do?
 
2013-10-15 07:07:15 AM

Ghastly: Is there anything that won't shoot you for in Florida?


Voting for a Bush, as long as you're not black or latino when you do it.
 
2013-10-15 07:08:19 AM

Lady J: Bungles: I'm always baffled how in America somebody can shoot somebody and that person is not arrested just as a matter of course, regardless of the "circumstances", because it's a crime being investigated.

ditto. also that seemingly intelligent people seem completely fine with that lack of investigation, and the shooting in the first place

there are certain conclusions one could draw but they're significant, so I hesitate


The cops COULD be completely incompetent, or just not give a f*ck.
I'd like to know if 1) they confiscated the firearm, and 2) there was any backup testimony as to what went on.

It's not completely unreasonable to let a shooting suspect go, if he had a reasonable story, and the cops take his gun; the cops know where he lives, and if he subsequently flees...suddenly, he's a MUCH better suspect, because he's acting guilty.  (Bonus for cynical cops, odds are, he's in another jurisdiction)

No idea yet what went on in this case; prior punching of friend by naked guy indicates either 1) he's not completely in control of his temper, or 2) his friend is even more of a jerk than just taking his clothes indicates.

Option 1 helps the shooter here, for better or worse.
 
2013-10-15 07:08:49 AM

TuteTibiImperes: Tarkus: fusillade762: He told detectives he was driving west on Hollywood Boulevard between 5 and 5:30 a.m. Oct. 6 when he spotted the nude man. He passed by him, then turned around and went back, he told police.

Oh for f*ck's sake. Call the goddamn cops and let them deal with it. Did no one learn anything from the Martin shooting?

Besides, "You can get away with murder in Florida"?

And apparently that 'proud' tradition continues.

FTFA: Laguerre has not been charged in the shooting.


The guy should be charged.
 
2013-10-15 07:10:05 AM

JohnCarter: So...why was he naked in the first place?  I get going to the beach after work, even getting your skateboard and cell phone taken by friends, not sure about all the clothes.


I'm betting skinny-dipping.

With a side bet on getting high.

Neither of which is a good reason to get shot, of course.
 
2013-10-15 07:11:25 AM
Ok.... help a foreigner out here.


Surely "stand your ground" is a defense to present in court, or a reason for charges not to be brought because the prosecution services don't believe there's a chance of a conviction.

How on earth is it a defense to essentially not to do an investigation?
 
2013-10-15 07:11:49 AM
The shooting may have been justified or it may have not been. The real question is why aren't the police saying what happened if they're  not charging the shooter?
 
2013-10-15 07:18:15 AM
a.images.blip.tv

Now he has to do the challenge over.
 
2013-10-15 07:18:44 AM

Bungles: How on earth is it a defense to essentially not to do an investigation?


Naked black man at 5 AM clause.
 
2013-10-15 07:21:38 AM
Murder is legal in Florida, this is what the gun nuts wanted.

He learned from George and did it right, killed the only person that could tell a different story.
 
2013-10-15 07:21:45 AM
Ever since that naked black cannibal zombie ate that other guy's face down there, I guess it's understandable they are a little defensive about that sort of thing though.
 
2013-10-15 07:22:58 AM
RACE WAR!

Seriously.
 
2013-10-15 07:23:08 AM

Bungles: Ok.... help a foreigner out here.


Surely "stand your ground" is a defense to present in court, or a reason for charges not to be brought because the prosecution services don't believe there's a chance of a conviction.

How on earth is it a defense to essentially not to do an investigation?


It doesn't say there is no investigation, just that he hasn't been charged...yet.
 
2013-10-15 07:23:54 AM

Bungles: How on earth is it a defense to essentially not to do an investigation?


It's not that they can't do an investigation, it's that there's probably nothing they can investigate. There's a dead naked body with a gunshot hole in it, presumably no witnesses at 5am, and a shooter with a smoking gun who, if he has half a brain, will say no more than "He threatened me. I feared for my life".

With normal self-defense laws, that obviously wouldn't be enough to avoid jail - you'd have to prove you had a reason to fear for your life. With the way SYG laws are being interpreted, you don't; your word is good enough. Why we don't question the words of people who know they'd go to jail for murder... I don't know. You'll need to ask the gun nuts who get these laws passed.
 
2013-10-15 07:25:43 AM

Bungles: Ok.... help a foreigner out here.


Surely "stand your ground" is a defense to present in court, or a reason for charges not to be brought because the prosecution services don't believe there's a chance of a conviction.

How on earth is it a defense to essentially not to do an investigation?


Investigation might be ongoing, the cops usually don't tell reporters everything.  Shooter starts bragging on Facebook about how he killed a guy?  Yeah, he's getting arrested.
 
2013-10-15 07:26:52 AM

Bungles: Ok.... help a foreigner out here.


Surely "stand your ground" is a defense to present in court, or a reason for charges not to be brought because the prosecution services don't believe there's a chance of a conviction.

How on earth is it a defense to essentially not to do an investigation?




It isn't. But it's up to the state to bring charges.
Sometimes they consider it a cut and dry matter and spare themselves the expense of losing at trial.
 
2013-10-15 07:27:11 AM

I-baLL: The shooting may have been justified or it may have not been. The real question is why aren't the police saying what happened if they're  not charging the shooter?


Hopefully, they're still looking into things, looking for other eyewitnesses, traffic cam footage, etc.

Or, just eating donuts and hoping something breaks.  Could be either one.
 
2013-10-15 07:30:03 AM

Gunther: Bungles: How on earth is it a defense to essentially not to do an investigation?

It's not that they can't do an investigation, it's that there's probably nothing they can investigate. There's a dead naked body with a gunshot hole in it, presumably no witnesses at 5am, and a shooter with a smoking gun who, if he has half a brain, will say no more than "He threatened me. I feared for my life".

With normal self-defense laws, that obviously wouldn't be enough to avoid jail - you'd have to prove you had a reason to fear for your life. With the way SYG laws are being interpreted, you don't; your word is good enough. Why we don't question the words of people who know they'd go to jail for murder... I don't know. You'll need to ask the gun nuts who get these laws passed.


Sadly, there's a good chance this is accurate.

And Florida has already had several cases where gang-bangers basically walk up to their rivals, who they KNOW are packing, and shoot them...they say they "felt threatened", and basically walk, maybe with a minor gun charge.
 
2013-10-15 07:31:25 AM
Police: Was the man armed?
Shooter: Yep. Had one hanging from each shoulder.
Police: Okay. I'll rule it self-defense.
 
2013-10-15 07:32:18 AM

Gunther: Bungles: How on earth is it a defense to essentially not to do an investigation?

It's not that they can't do an investigation, it's that there's probably nothing they can investigate. There's a dead naked body with a gunshot hole in it, presumably no witnesses at 5am, and a shooter with a smoking gun who, if he has half a brain, will say no more than "He threatened me. I feared for my life".

With normal self-defense laws, that obviously wouldn't be enough to avoid jail - you'd have to prove you had a reason to fear for your life. With the way SYG laws are being interpreted, you don't; your word is good enough. Why we don't question the words of people who know they'd go to jail for murder... I don't know. You'll need to ask the gun nuts who get these laws passed.


Well there's a whole host of forensics that could illuminate the story:

1) Had the victim driven a distance in the car?
2) How close was the victim to the shooter?
3) Signs of struggle on the body?
4) Had the victim been in the car at all?
5) Has the car stopped and started more than once, leaving tracks?
6) Get the accused's exact breakdown of the escalation of the conversation. It'll have to be something pretty remarkable to not include some sort of catalyst (ie a spurned sexual motive)
7) What was accused claimed intent in stopping? Offering aid? Offering a lift? Offering clothes? Or looking for a fight?


And there's overarching one - what possible circumstances can a man in a car with a gun fear for his life when facing a naked man on the street,
 
2013-10-15 07:33:49 AM
I'm guessing it wasn't that innocent. Maybe he was off his mind on drugs and tied to eat the driver's face off when he offered help.
 
2013-10-15 07:35:46 AM
His head was in his stomach?
 
2013-10-15 07:38:23 AM
At least he doesn't live to get slapped with a S#x Off#nder tag.
 
2013-10-15 07:38:52 AM

FullMetalPanda: So is the family of the victim going to hire some mercenaries to torture his "friends" several months before letting they die of exposure?  I'm assuming they'll use one of the deli slicers on their fingers and toes first.  And a hot iron on standby to cauterize the wounds each time they slice.  Once the fingers and toes are gone, they'll move to the limbs.


They should reach out to Matthew Barnett, rapist (or so I've heard). I hear he has experience in these matters.
 
2013-10-15 07:38:55 AM

Tarkus: fusillade762: He told detectives he was driving west on Hollywood Boulevard between 5 and 5:30 a.m. Oct. 6 when he spotted the nude man. He passed by him, then turned around and went back, he told police.

Oh for f*ck's sake. Call the goddamn cops and let them deal with it. Did no one learn anything from the Martin shooting?

Besides, "You can get away with murder in Florida"?


This.  I mean really, what else was anyone supposed to learn from that crap?
 
2013-10-15 07:39:10 AM

Bungles: Well there's a whole host of forensics that could illuminate the story:


That CSI stuff rarely pans out in the real world, unfortunately.

Bungles: Get the accused's exact breakdown of the escalation of the conversation


It's America, he can literally just say "He threatened me. I feared for my life" and refuse to answer any more questions.
 
2013-10-15 07:39:25 AM
FullMetalPanda: (creepy torture porn).


images.wikia.com
 
2013-10-15 07:41:24 AM

Gunther: Bungles: Well there's a whole host of forensics that could illuminate the story:

That CSI stuff rarely pans out in the real world, unfortunately.


Car track analysis and swabbing for the car for DNA isn't exactly CSI.


I'm not asking for an interface in Visual Basic or anything.
 
2013-10-15 07:41:39 AM
They shot Chaucer ! Those Bastards!
 
2013-10-15 07:42:42 AM

way south: It isn't. But it's up to the state to bring charges.
Sometimes they consider it a cut and dry matter and spare themselves the expense of losing at trial.


exactly - they know how much the Travon bit cost, why would they do that to themselves again?  Budgets be tight, yo.   Don't like it?  Get the law changed - it's not the poh-poh's fault.
 
2013-10-15 07:43:10 AM

Typhoid: I'm guessing it wasn't that innocent. Maybe he was off his mind on drugs and tied to eat the driver's face off when he offered help.


Well, it IS Florida...it could just as easily have been "the driver was off his mind on drugs, tried to eat the naked guy's face, and shot him for resisting..."

Maybe he likes dark meat?

/so very, very, sorry...
 
2013-10-15 07:43:36 AM
 Aaaannd since he's black the shooter will get away Scott free.
 
2013-10-15 07:44:53 AM

Bungles: How on earth is it a defense to essentially not to do an investigation?


They are investigating.

Not immediately arresting someone within hours of the reported shooting is not the same thing as an investigation, it almost always takes a week or two to bring charges when no one involved is a flight risk (people that claim self-defense generally are not).  Same as with the Trayvon Martin shooting, investigating self-defense claims can take a little time before someone is brought in over it.  They won't hold people under bond if they can get them to interview willingly.
 
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