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(CNBC)   More and more Americans are opting for an early retirement rather than hold out hope their 401Ks and pensions will be there in ten years   ( cnbc.com) divider line
    More: Scary, public sector workers  
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5744 clicks; posted to Main » on 15 Oct 2013 at 5:36 AM (3 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-15 07:57:22 AM  

WhyteRaven74: PunGent: all those jobs are NOT coming back, and we need to figure out what to do with all the people who used to do them

Tell corporations to get off their asses and start doing R&D again to find new stuff to do.


Problem is, we in the U.S. have trained a full generation of MBAs who can't look past the next quarterly statement.
They won't even fund NON-speculative stuff, like employee training, let alone anything "speculative" like R&D.

So, anyone who can look further than three months down the road will eventually eat our lunch, in any given industry.

Oh, well...we had a good run the last sixty years or so.  Fun while it lasted.
Sorry, but you younger Farkers are probably, well, farked.
 
2013-10-15 07:57:52 AM  

AirForceVet: Why are Americans opting for early retirement? Let's see. Oh, we're talking about California public employees.

Well, that pretty much covers the whole USA then.

As for the 401k, save more, invest wisely and max out employer contributions. Remember that the markets are never a sure thing, but history shows long-term investing pays off.


I don't know if you've noticed, but California's huge. It's a pretty good petri dish for the US.
 
2013-10-15 08:00:15 AM  

ThrobblefootSpectre: Subby, older workers locking in extremely generous lifetime benefits starting at age 55 is not "scary".  It is a jackpot sweetheart of a deal for them.  The only scary part is for young taxpayers who have to finance it.


"Shires said it is possible that the time will come when the high costs of these commitments exceed both the public's willingness and ability to pay."

Hopefully that time comes very soon.


Well, I wouldn't say "hopefully", but otherwise I agree.  Look to more cities, towns, counties, states, all defaulting on or severly modifying their pension plans.  Worst case, they do bankruptcy, like Detroit.

Generous pensions are nice in theory, but eventually the math stops working out.
 
2013-10-15 08:02:26 AM  

AngryDragon: AirForceVet: As for the 401k, save more, invest wisely and max out employer contributions. Remember that the markets are never a sure thing, but history shows long-term investing pays off.

THIS THIS THIS.

Save early, save consistently.  If you are 25 making the median wage and save 15% of your incomeat the historical return average, you will have over $1.5M in the bank by 55.

Why aren't kids taught this?


Kids won't listen. They think they are all special and unique and exceptional and above average and and and. I know. I was a kid once. Movies and fiction made me think that hard work and luck would get me somewhere.

Hah!

The truth, of course, is that hard work and luck MAY get you somewhere... or it may not.

So, the first problem is that the kids have a couple of decades of programming that need to be overcome first before they could understand the problem at anything more than an abstract level.

Another issue is... what is the average age of the person making the median income? I suspect it's considerably older than 25. i was 35 before I ever got a real good job. (25 to 35 was spent as a ronin database programmer, it was feast or famine, and that is no way to live or plan for the future). I've seen helpful articles online that talk about how a young person can retire wealthy... and their starting conditions are always a ridiculously high paying job compared to reality.

When you run those scenarios with realistic McJobs, the outlook isn't nearly so rosy. :(
 
2013-10-15 08:03:09 AM  

PunGent: Generous pensions are nice in theory, but eventually the math stops working out.


I still have co-workers that are expecting a pension. It's a weird thought, because no job I have ever held has discussed a "pension". Us youngins get a "deferred contribution", which is basically the company saying, "look, instead of putting money into a pension fund, we'll just give you the money to invest how you see fit." I think I like that better.
 
2013-10-15 08:07:25 AM  

Kibbler: robohobo: Kibbler: My concern is that all of the money I have carefully saved up over the years will disappear the next time the sharks move in, and I will be told, "Oops, nobody's fault, you knew those were investments, you knew there were risks, everybody suffered, pay no attention to that guy upgrading his 200-foot yacht to a 500-foot yacht.  It's all Jimmy Carter's fault."

Well...they are investments, and they are risks. If you've enough to invest, you have enough to move that money out of the country. I would suggest you do so.

What would be the outcome if every middle class savings account was moved "out of the country"?

Also, what does that even mean?  And put it where?  Under a rock in Portugal?


Bwahaha savings...what does that word mean?
 
2013-10-15 08:09:26 AM  

verbaltoxin: AirForceVet: Why are Americans opting for early retirement? Let's see. Oh, we're talking about California public employees.

Well, that pretty much covers the whole USA then.

As for the 401k, save more, invest wisely and max out employer contributions. Remember that the markets are never a sure thing, but history shows long-term investing pays off.

I don't know if you've noticed, but California's huge. It's a pretty good petri dish for the US.


Yeah, but it's filled with icky liberals and stuff, not Real Americans.  Not to worry though.  God fearing Christians in America's Heartland will trust in Jesus just like they've been taught all their lives and all will be well.  You'll see.
 
2013-10-15 08:13:17 AM  

PunGent: We're eventually moving into a world where one guy can harvest all of Nebraska, mine an entire mountain range, or produce 10,000 cars, just by pushing a couple of buttons.  This is a good thing, since surplus food and goods are what civilization is built on, all the way back to the Neolithic.

However, all those jobs are NOT coming back, and we need to figure out what to do with all the people who used to do them.  Starting now would be a good move, but we'll probably wait until it's a real crisis..probably take another global depression, or something.


We don't need to figure out anything. 200 years ago, 95% of American workers were involved in food production/distribution; today it's only 5% (at most). We don't have a 90% unemployment rate because food (in real terms) costs much less, giving people more money to spend on other things, which creates jobs.
 
KIA
2013-10-15 08:13:56 AM  

AngryDragon: at the historical return average


Can *anyone* get a decent rate of return today on any relatively safe investments?
 
2013-10-15 08:19:43 AM  

DrPainMD: PunGent: We're eventually moving into a world where one guy can harvest all of Nebraska, mine an entire mountain range, or produce 10,000 cars, just by pushing a couple of buttons.  This is a good thing, since surplus food and goods are what civilization is built on, all the way back to the Neolithic.

However, all those jobs are NOT coming back, and we need to figure out what to do with all the people who used to do them.  Starting now would be a good move, but we'll probably wait until it's a real crisis..probably take another global depression, or something.

We don't need to figure out anything. 200 years ago, 95% of American workers were involved in food production/distribution; today it's only 5% (at most). We don't have a 90% unemployment rate because food (in real terms) costs much less, giving people more money to spend on other things, which creates jobs.


Sure, things will settle out, one way or another.  By "figure out", I don't mean serious governmental social engineering...that usually ends in tears and tyranny.  I mean more like "adjust our expectations and perceptions."

The old "get a job at the plant, work there until I get my pension" days are LONG gone, but lots of folks don't seem to realize that yet.
 
2013-10-15 08:20:52 AM  

KIA: AngryDragon: at the historical return average

Can *anyone* get a decent rate of return today on any relatively safe investments?


I've been running an energy-heavy stock portfolio since the Gulf War, it's been doing OK.
 
2013-10-15 08:21:30 AM  
www.upl.co
 
2013-10-15 08:21:30 AM  

AirForceVet: Why are Americans opting for early retirement? Let's see. Oh, we're talking about California public employees.

Well, that pretty much covers the whole USA then.

As for the 401k, save more, invest wisely and max out employer contributions. Remember that the markets are never a sure thing, but history shows long-term investing pays off.


This.  Even with the ups and downs we've averaged 15% return each year since 1998 on long stocks.  Even if you only can scrape together $50 or $100/month it is worth it.  We have a dude down in S.C. who is a financial superman and he shifts stuff in and out ahead of bad stuff happening.  Before that we were with Edward Jones and it was like throwing money into the fire.  They were taking payola and shifting our investments into dying companies they were shorting.

I also play with some limited stocks that I started with $1000 in an online trading account and when the balance goes over 5K I take 4K and put it in the IRA if my picks flatten out or start dropping.  If I have more left over I do some new picks.  I recently sold 2 stocks.  One gained 51%, another 69% since May, and the one I'm still holding has gained 392% over the last 12 years.  Went from $18 to $88.67.  I do have one that lost money though, but it is only $9 down in total value.  I took $1200 of the dough from the 2 that flattened and put it in to three new climbers (at least I hope they climb).  They've gained 1.5%, 3.45%, and 2.92% since Wed of last week.  All three have secured new business deals and broken new ground.  Electronic devices, pharma, and paper products.

And for anyone that thinks that if you invest that you must have money to burn they are wrong.  We invest instead of going out to eat or buying new cars.  Small percentage in high risk and most in long term winners.  Slow and steady wins the race.
 
2013-10-15 08:25:13 AM  

sethen320: WhyteRaven74: PunGent: all those jobs are NOT coming back, and we need to figure out what to do with all the people who used to do them

Tell corporations to get off their asses and start doing R&D again to find new stuff to do.

Only corporations can come up with new and original ideas? Huh...


Certainly not.  But look at ferrofluids...invented in a US university, first commercial applications came out of...China.

Richest woman in China?  Self-made, no business degree, made her billion dollars shipping recycled American cardboard across the Pacific...in a field our own MBAs thought was "unprofitable" WITHOUT trans-Pac shipping costs.
 
2013-10-15 08:32:03 AM  

Mcavity: Public Savant: Ummm.... what is the retirement age in the states?
Here it's 67.

It depends..
http://www.ssa.gov/retire2/retirechart.htm


Thanks - it's pretty much like what I'm used to. Just got confused by all the dreamers who plan to basically skip working in their 50'es.
 
2013-10-15 08:32:40 AM  

ImmaHoopyFrood: AirForceVet: Why are Americans opting for early retirement? Let's see. Oh, we're talking about California public employees.

Well, that pretty much covers the whole USA then.

As for the 401k, save more, invest wisely and max out employer contributions. Remember that the markets are never a sure thing, but history shows long-term investing pays off.

This.  Even with the ups and downs we've averaged 15% return each year since 1998 on long stocks.  Even if you only can scrape together $50 or $100/month it is worth it.  We have a dude down in S.C. who is a financial superman and he shifts stuff in and out ahead of bad stuff happening.  Before that we were with Edward Jones and it was like throwing money into the fire.  They were taking payola and shifting our investments into dying companies they were shorting.

I also play with some limited stocks that I started with $1000 in an online trading account and when the balance goes over 5K I take 4K and put it in the IRA if my picks flatten out or start dropping.  If I have more left over I do some new picks.  I recently sold 2 stocks.  One gained 51%, another 69% since May, and the one I'm still holding has gained 392% over the last 12 years.  Went from $18 to $88.67.  I do have one that lost money though, but it is only $9 down in total value.  I took $1200 of the dough from the 2 that flattened and put it in to three new climbers (at least I hope they climb).  They've gained 1.5%, 3.45%, and 2.92% since Wed of last week.  All three have secured new business deals and broken new ground.  Electronic devices, pharma, and paper products.

And for anyone that thinks that if you invest that you must have money to burn they are wrong.  We invest instead of going out to eat or buying new cars.  Small percentage in high risk and most in long term winners.  Slow and steady wins the race.


I eat out a lot, it's one of my main indulgences, but I buy my cars used.
Thank god for frugal parents...you don't need all the bling, save your cash for what's important.

Besides, driving a nice car in Boston is like taking a Monet to a soccer riot...
 
2013-10-15 08:33:01 AM  

t3knomanser: PunGent: Generous pensions are nice in theory, but eventually the math stops working out.

I still have co-workers that are expecting a pension. It's a weird thought, because no job I have ever held has discussed a "pension". Us youngins get a "deferred contribution", which is basically the company saying, "look, instead of putting money into a pension fund, we'll just give you the money to invest how you see fit." I think I like that better.


I have mixed feelings on it.  On paper it seems like a smart idea in that it eliminates massive amounts of red ink from company balance sheets.  Theoretically this should free up tons of capital for investment but in practice it's just getting funneled to wealthy stockholders for short term gains.  In addition, the whole point of pension plans, including Social Security, and also things like weekly withholding taxes is that people in general are really lousy at planning for the future, even short term.  "Well, that's their own fault.  Screw 'em!" sounds fair but what do you think will happen if tens of millions of Americans suddenly find themselves at or near retirement with nothing to live on?  You really think they'll just sit back quietly, take all the blame themselves and accept their fate?

I've said it before and I'll say it again.  The reason we have welfare and social safety nets is to protect the assets of rich.  A poor person with no prospects for a better life is far more likely to resort to thievery, not because they are bad but just in order to survive.  When you have millions of poor people in a dire straights, you get France in 1789 or Russia in 1917.  All your philosophical arguments about natural rights, capitalism, socialism, property and whatnot mean nothing to a starving desperate man.
 
2013-10-15 08:37:18 AM  

PunGent: KIA: AngryDragon: at the historical return average

Can *anyone* get a decent rate of return today on any relatively safe investments?

I've been running an energy-heavy stock portfolio since the Gulf War, it's been doing OK.


This.  Always get what people must have to survive, medicine/food/utilities and you will do O.K.  Look at the holdings of the companies your 401k "advisor" wants you to invest in, and choose these.  Or ignore your advisor and choose these anyway.
 
2013-10-15 08:39:41 AM  

Persnickety: The reason we have welfare and social safety nets is to protect the assets of rich. A poor person with no prospects for a better life is far more likely to resort to thievery, not because they are bad but just in order to survive. When you have millions of poor people in a dire straights, you get France in 1789 or Russia in 1917.


I'm having a hard time deciding whether or not you're advocating here.
 
2013-10-15 08:47:34 AM  

Persnickety: Theoretically this should free up tons of capital for investment but in practice it's just getting funneled to wealthy stockholders for short term gains


It doesn't really save the corporation any money in the short term- they're still putting money aside for you, they're just not responsible for managing the investment. That frees them of the legacy costs- if the market tanks, they're not on the hook. I'm perfectly comfortable accepting that kind of risk, in part because I'm  not relying on my DC or my 401(K) for retirement. Those are "bonus money". I'm investing a lot of post-tax dollars into accounts where I can withdraw the money without penalty. I'll be hitting my "fark you" money target in 2020, even accepting some market downs between then and now.
 
2013-10-15 08:47:57 AM  
More workers retiring later - conservatives' fault because they can't afford to retire.
More workers retiring earlier - conservatives' fault because they are unsure of future returns on investments.

But no matter what, Obama is a complete boss on the economy.  Just fantastic.
 
2013-10-15 08:50:52 AM  

Goodluckfox: Another issue is... what is the average age of the person making the median income? I suspect it's considerably older than 25. i was 35 before I ever got a real good job. (25 to 35 was spent as a ronin database programmer, it was feast or famine, and that is no way to live or plan for the future). I've seen helpful articles online that talk about how a young person can retire wealthy... and their starting conditions are always a ridiculously high paying job compared to reality.

When you run those scenarios with realistic McJobs, the outlook isn't nearly so rosy. :(


Time is the secret not the amount.

Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25.  By 65 you will have amassed over $750,000.  You don't have to be socking away thousands, you just have to start early and do it consistently.  It's the miracle of compound interest.
 
2013-10-15 08:51:11 AM  
Why do we need social security again? companies obviously are taking good care of their employees, amirite?
 
2013-10-15 08:54:21 AM  

KIA: AngryDragon: at the historical return average

Can *anyone* get a decent rate of return today on any relatively safe investments?


Index funds.  Low cost, decent return.  I have a straight index fund portfolio and do nothing but add money to it  For this year it's up 16%.  Brokers and bankers just like to make the process sound intimidating so you give them your money.

Investing should be core curriculum in high schools.
 
2013-10-15 08:56:19 AM  
once the boomers die off, who will vote republican???
 
2013-10-15 08:57:09 AM  

AngryDragon: Investing should be core curriculum in high schools.


Let's start small, like personal budgeting and how not to fark up your life with credit cards.
 
2013-10-15 08:58:33 AM  

Persnickety: t3knomanser: PunGent: Generous pensions are nice in theory, but eventually the math stops working out.

I still have co-workers that are expecting a pension. It's a weird thought, because no job I have ever held has discussed a "pension". Us youngins get a "deferred contribution", which is basically the company saying, "look, instead of putting money into a pension fund, we'll just give you the money to invest how you see fit." I think I like that better.

I have mixed feelings on it.  On paper it seems like a smart idea in that it eliminates massive amounts of red ink from company balance sheets.  Theoretically this should free up tons of capital for investment but in practice it's just getting funneled to wealthy stockholders for short term gains.  In addition, the whole point of pension plans, including Social Security, and also things like weekly withholding taxes is that people in general are really lousy at planning for the future, even short term.  "Well, that's their own fault.  Screw 'em!" sounds fair but what do you think will happen if tens of millions of Americans suddenly find themselves at or near retirement with nothing to live on?  You really think they'll just sit back quietly, take all the blame themselves and accept their fate?

I've said it before and I'll say it again.  The reason we have welfare and social safety nets is to protect the assets of rich.  A poor person with no prospects for a better life is far more likely to resort to thievery, not because they are bad but just in order to survive.  When you have millions of poor people in a dire straights, you get France in 1789 or Russia in 1917.  All your philosophical arguments about natural rights, capitalism, socialism, property and whatnot mean nothing to a starving desperate man.


Oh, yes...I'm a firm believer in "guillotine insurance" myself.  My only point there was about municipal pensions that eventually bankrupt the town...I look at Central Falls, Rhode Island.  Yes, you want to treat people fairly, but you can't screw your future tax base while doing so.

And, ya, we need things like Social Security.  Sure, I'm OK managing my own investments, but I've got relatives who'd sink everything into Beanie Babies and emu farms if they could...and I'm not alone in that.

I don't want to see them starving in the streets, and I'm willing to take a small hit of my own in kicking in to Social Security to help that not happen.
 
2013-10-15 09:00:05 AM  
As long as we're sort of straying off the article topic, I like this guy's ideas a lot:
http://www.coffeehouseinvestor.com/">http://www.coffeehouseinvestor. com/

My investments aren't even as complicated as the coffeehouse portfolio, I now stick with mostly S&P ETF, equal weight S&P ETF, BND (and BOND since it came out last year), VTI and VEU.  And I think I'm only about 10% in VEU total, which is probably a little low, but maybe my tolerance for risk is not as great as it should be given that I'm still pretty young.

And my external rate of return is like 11% since I started investing in '05 (maybe high 10s).  And that's net rate, after expenses.

I don't keep much in cash.  I hate losing money to inflation, but I've got a CD ladder to cover about 6 months of living expenses.
 
2013-10-15 09:00:14 AM  

AngryDragon: KIA: AngryDragon: at the historical return average

Can *anyone* get a decent rate of return today on any relatively safe investments?

Index funds. Low cost, decent return.  I have a straight index fund portfolio and do nothing but add money to it  For this year it's up 16%.  Brokers and bankers just like to make the process sound intimidating so you give them your money.


Investing should be core curriculum in high schools.

This, times two.  Both solid points.
 
2013-10-15 09:00:28 AM  

AngryDragon: Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25. By 65 you will have amassed over $750,000. You don't have to be socking away thousands, you just have to start early and do it consistently. It's the miracle of compound interest.


Man, I wish I was making enough when I was 25 to have $200 to invest a month
 
2013-10-15 09:01:30 AM  

baufan2005: Bwahaha savings...what does that word mean?


It means robohobo married a surgeon.  Let the poor people eat cake.
 
2013-10-15 09:03:31 AM  

PunGent: Besides, driving a nice car in Boston is like taking a Monet to a soccer riot...


The only times I've actually felt uncomfortable driving was in Boston and Chicago.  Kind of like there was a new set of rules and I missed the memo.  I've done D.C. and L.A. and they weren't that bad in comparison, just slow.
 
2013-10-15 09:03:46 AM  

FLMountainMan: More workers retiring later - conservatives' fault because they can't afford to retire.
More workers retiring earlier - conservatives' fault because they are unsure of future returns on investments.

But no matter what, Obama is a complete boss on the economy.  Just fantastic.


Any President has a very limited degree of control over the economy, and has a much greater ability to screw things up, rather than make them better.

Given the bag of shiat Bush handed him, Obama is doing OK.  Not great, but OK.  We're lucky we're not in a full-bore depression right now.
 
2013-10-15 09:04:56 AM  
There's also other calculous involved - far simpler too.

I remember back when my mother retired and they said something in the order of "You can retire now and get X a month as part of your pension (something they'd save money on the short run with). Or stay on another (I think it was 3-4 years) and Get X + whatever a month."

She did the math, considering and I think rightly so, that retirement was good at that point and that the money made from it for the gap was the issue. So she compared how many years it would take her to make that with the difference. In her words, while she'd love to live to 108 years old, she was dubious of the actual chance. So she just retired early.

For many though, they just don't see it that way. And in certain professions "pensions" and "retirement" are just not part of the culture. I know in legal circles you work until you die at work, or until you lose your faculties. Some lawyers I know have "retired" in the sense they became ALJs or something like that. Something, that for anyone else looking at that as a career goal would consider a job and not retirement. But there it is.

I'm just saying that... when discussing some of these really major economic things - for whatever reason, economics, political spin, or the yearning for genuine comprehension - it generally doesn't boil down to 1 or 2 simple axioms. It's not like older Americans are en mass in a mass fugue screaming "Ehermergerd, Erbamaz killin sercial sercurity!"

/except the general understanding that the population is getting older, so yes, more Americans will be retiring..... boomers, etc.
 
2013-10-15 09:06:42 AM  

Headso: Why do we need social security again? companies obviously are taking good care of their employees, amirite?


Both of those points are why everyone should be saving for themselves.
 
2013-10-15 09:12:37 AM  

ltdanman44: once the boomers die off, who will vote republican???


Poor, white folks south of the mason-dixon line?
 
2013-10-15 09:12:43 AM  

PhDemented: AngryDragon: Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25. By 65 you will have amassed over $750,000. You don't have to be socking away thousands, you just have to start early and do it consistently. It's the miracle of compound interest.

Man, I wish I was making enough when I was 25 to have $200 to invest a month


The term is invest, but it's really saving for your future.

Again, time is the key not the amount.  Even $100 a month, $25 a week, nets you over a quarter million dollars in retirement.  Even at minimum wage, never getting a promotion, raise, and staying at the same job for 40 years that's something.

You won't be weekending in Paris, but you won't be eating cat food either.  Bonus is that as you do get into a career it just goes up.  This is how people get wealthy, even those of modest means.
 
2013-10-15 09:16:23 AM  

AngryDragon: Headso: Why do we need social security again? companies obviously are taking good care of their employees, amirite?

Both of those points are why everyone should be saving for themselves.


That's nice to say but obviously it's not a realistic possibility.
 
2013-10-15 09:16:23 AM  

AngryDragon: Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25.


Aaaaaand that's how I know you haven't been 25 in quite  while.
 
2013-10-15 09:19:43 AM  

ThatGuyFromTheInternet: AngryDragon: Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25.

Aaaaaand that's how I know you haven't been 25 in quite  while.


My step-son is not even 23, goes to school, works two jobs, and saves at least that much.  It's not impossible.
 
2013-10-15 09:21:14 AM  
Too many retirees from the public sector putting a drain on your society?  Stop letting them retire after 20 years.  Several people I know put in their 20 years working for the government, retired in their early forties to collect that sweet pension, and went on to get another well-paying job so they get two full incomes while working just one job until they retire.  Many live on the pension and invest everything from the other job so when they DO fully retire, they're sitting mighty pretty.  I want to be mad at them but when the system is set up like that, I can't blame them.  But if you want to reduce the burden of all these retirees' pensions, either make them work until retirement age like most of us in the private workforce, or withhold their pension until "normal" retirement age.  It's ridiculous that they can work 20 years and get a pension for 40.
 
2013-10-15 09:43:01 AM  

UberDave: what_now: ...and now that they can get affordable health care without staying in a job they hate, they can spend their middle years doing something they may enjoy.

Terrible.

My best friend's in-laws (who I know quite well) did this.  They are a few years away from collecting SS.  Not too long ago, the mother in-law had a serious illness which she overcame.  Their insurance dropped them like a blue-hot nuclear potato.  Now they can get insurance again.  They're both rabid teabaggers.  I'm anxious to see how it plays out with them..



This is an easy one.  They will gladly take the insurance because they "earned it" through all their years of hard work.  It's all the people now getting insurance for free that they abhor and will keep them solidly in the teabagger camp.  Cognitive dissonance, it really works!
 
2013-10-15 09:45:37 AM  

AngryDragon: ThatGuyFromTheInternet: AngryDragon: Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25.

Aaaaaand that's how I know you haven't been 25 in quite  while.

My step-son is not even 23, goes to school, works two jobs, and saves at least that much.  It's not impossible.


My friend does to but he has never had a gf and lives at home with parents with all bills paid.
 
2013-10-15 09:51:07 AM  

baufan2005: AngryDragon: ThatGuyFromTheInternet: AngryDragon: Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25.

Aaaaaand that's how I know you haven't been 25 in quite  while.

My step-son is not even 23, goes to school, works two jobs, and saves at least that much.  It's not impossible.

My friend does to but he has never had a gf and lives at home with parents with all bills paid.


I know a guy who is 18 has 37 jobs goes to medical school full time is a classical musician who plays in the BSO and dates 4 super models depending on what city he happens to be in at the time. If he can do it anyone can.
 
2013-10-15 09:53:35 AM  
I don't know why no one is addressing the true blight on this society, and sure sign of the coming apocalypse: autoplay videos on websites.
 
2013-10-15 09:57:29 AM  

Headso: baufan2005: AngryDragon: ThatGuyFromTheInternet: AngryDragon: Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25.

Aaaaaand that's how I know you haven't been 25 in quite  while.

My step-son is not even 23, goes to school, works two jobs, and saves at least that much.  It's not impossible.

My friend does to but he has never had a gf and lives at home with parents with all bills paid.

I know a guy who is 18 has 37 jobs goes to medical school full time is a classical musician who plays in the BSO and dates 4 super models depending on what city he happens to be in at the time. If he can do it anyone can.


I didn't say anyone could, I said it's not impossible.  It all comes down to you being confident in a pension/social security and having faith that the government is going to take care of you in 40 years.  If the cost of one night at the bar a weekend insures that you won't be living in a box when you're older, you may want to consider it.

Your choice.
 
2013-10-15 10:03:02 AM  

PhDemented: AngryDragon: Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25. By 65 you will have amassed over $750,000. You don't have to be socking away thousands, you just have to start early and do it consistently. It's the miracle of compound interest.

Man, I wish I was making enough when I was 25 to have $200 to invest a month


Were you making below minimum wage or wasting too much?
 
2013-10-15 10:14:07 AM  

AngryDragon: Headso: baufan2005: AngryDragon: ThatGuyFromTheInternet: AngryDragon: Even if you save $200 a month starting at 25.

Aaaaaand that's how I know you haven't been 25 in quite  while.

My step-son is not even 23, goes to school, works two jobs, and saves at least that much.  It's not impossible.

My friend does to but he has never had a gf and lives at home with parents with all bills paid.

I know a guy who is 18 has 37 jobs goes to medical school full time is a classical musician who plays in the BSO and dates 4 super models depending on what city he happens to be in at the time. If he can do it anyone can.

I didn't say anyone could, I said it's not impossible.  It all comes down to you being confident in a pension/social security and having faith that the government is going to take care of you in 40 years.  If the cost of one night at the bar a weekend insures that you won't be living in a box when you're older, you may want to consider it.

Your choice.


When you're young in this day and age in America your money could be easily taken at any time if you suffer a medical problem, so you have to weigh that short term fun not just with your future as an old person but the decent chance you are just saving to pay a small portion of medical costs before you file for bankruptcy. Not even mentioning the people who really have no capacity to save even those that do have some calculations to make that we as young people never did, the idea of saving money for the future is not really as attractive as it once was.

Bankruptcies resulting from unpaid medical bills will affect nearly 2 million people this year-making health care the No. 1 cause of such filings

...

Even outside of bankruptcy, about 56 million adults-more than 20 percent of the population between the ages of 19 and 64-will still struggle with health-care-related bills this year, according to NerdWallet Health.
 
2013-10-15 10:19:43 AM  

badhatharry: Too bad their jobs are going with them. It used to be when the old man retired everybody moved up the ladder.


Is the U.S. ready for an economy where there is simply no traditional employment for over half the population? Profoundly no.

People work more hours, for less money, and take less vacation. There are fewer jobs out there; fewer workers are needed. We're approaching the golden age of automation that the futurists talked about in the first half of the 20th century.

The economic disruption is just starting.
 
2013-10-15 10:21:26 AM  

OnlyM3: [www.upl.co image 660x513]


Do Republicans ever create any humor that are not derivative of the work of liberals?
 
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