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(Independent)   Owner of Oklahoma zoo where employee was mauled by a tiger and lost her arm: "She pulled her own arm out. The tiger didn't maul her"   (independent.co.uk) divider line 131
    More: Asinine  
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12120 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Oct 2013 at 12:03 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



131 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-10-13 10:00:58 PM  
She pulled her own arm out. The tiger didn't maul her

The Garvin County Sheriff's Office confirmed that the woman was mauled


Mauled or not mauled?
 
2013-10-13 10:25:28 PM  
He's not wrong. She put her arm in the cage, she might as well have taken a chainsaw to it.

Wild animals, especially carnivores, should not be trifled with.
 
2013-10-13 10:59:40 PM  
And this is why you don't dance the Hokey Pokey at zoos.
 
2013-10-14 12:07:33 AM  
Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.
 
2013-10-14 12:12:47 AM  
She didn't lose her arm, subby...
 
2013-10-14 12:13:36 AM  
So the employee is congress, the tiger is the shutdown, and the zoo owner is Obama? Or are the voters the tiger? I'm sorry, I just don't understand the analogy.
 
2013-10-14 12:16:48 AM  
So she's one of those lizard people that can just drop a limb when attacked. I knew it, they're here!!
/runs for the tin foil...
 
2013-10-14 12:17:24 AM  

bank7883: She didn't lose her arm, subby...


Don't blame Subby, the stupid headline says her arm was bitten off.
 
2013-10-14 12:19:47 AM  
Amused

media2.s-nbcnews.com
 
2013-10-14 12:21:00 AM  
OK.

For those who missed it the FIRST 10,000 TIMES:

Don't - that is to say, DO NOT - EVER. Stick. Your. Arm. In the Tiger Cage.

In fact, if you were to avoid caging tigers in the first place, you wouldn't have a cage containing a caged tiger to feed your damned arm to, would you?
 
2013-10-14 12:21:20 AM  
Don'y you hate it when people pull off their own limbs then try to blame the wildlife? Pisses me right off every damn time.
 
2013-10-14 12:21:31 AM  
The tiger bit onto her arm, and in her struggles to get away, she pulled her arm off! Duh! If she'd just stayed calm and not struggled, her arm would still be attached! Of course, she'd be dead, but the arm wouldn't be gone! Why are you all so dense?
 
2013-10-14 12:21:47 AM  

Unknown_Poltroon: Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.


It's a TIGER! They're all dangerous. Their mouth is specifically designed to take meat off living mammals instantly. They can kill you by accident, too, with a misplaced paw swipe.
 
2013-10-14 12:22:11 AM  

CoysOdie: bank7883: She didn't lose her arm, subby...

Don't blame Subby, the stupid headline says her arm was bitten off.


It grew back.
i1.ytimg.com
 
2013-10-14 12:24:20 AM  
Ha! Twas merely a fleshwound!
 
2013-10-14 12:28:21 AM  
It's time the government did something about arms control.
 
2013-10-14 12:28:29 AM  
And yet, Harrison Ford is the main suspect.
 
2013-10-14 12:34:02 AM  
The victim's a supervisor. She should've known NOT to put any body part there. Anything that gets into a wild animal's territory is considered food or a threat. The owner is correct, it's the victim's fault and not the tiger...unless that tiger is super smart that it can say "It's GRRRRRRRRREEEEAAAT!" while trying to get kids to buy a certain brand of cereal.
 
2013-10-14 12:34:05 AM  
"That tiger didn't go crazy... That tiger went tiger!"
076dd0a50e0c1255009e-bd4b8aabaca29897bc751dfaf75b290c.r40.cf1.rackcdn.com
 
2013-10-14 12:39:01 AM  
In some very convoluted way that makes no sense, this is Obama's fault!

/got nuthin
 
2013-10-14 12:39:26 AM  

BuckTurgidson: OK.

For those who missed it the FIRST 10,000 TIMES:

Don't - that is to say, DO NOT - EVER. Stick. Your. Arm. In the Tiger Cage.

In fact, if you were to avoid caging tigers in the first place, you wouldn't have a cage containing a caged tiger to feed your damned arm to, would you?


WTF?
 
2013-10-14 12:44:49 AM  
Since this happened in Oklahoma, one can assume that everyone cited in the article has the reasoning skills of a 13 year old. Only dipshiats reside in OK.
 
2013-10-14 12:47:04 AM  

tuna fingers: Since this happened in Oklahoma, one can assume that everyone cited in the article has the reasoning skills of a 13 year old. Only dipshiats reside in OK.


That's kind of harsh.
 
2013-10-14 12:47:38 AM  
www.travelonline.com
 
2013-10-14 12:50:29 AM  

emersonbiggins: "That tiger didn't go crazy... That tiger went tiger!"
[076dd0a50e0c1255009e-bd4b8aabaca29897bc751dfaf75b290c.r40.cf1.rackcd n .com image 468x400]


This.  Why are people every surprised when large wild animals hurt people?
 
2013-10-14 12:53:02 AM  

emersonbiggins: "That tiger didn't go crazy... That tiger went tiger!"
[076dd0a50e0c1255009e-bd4b8aabaca29897bc751dfaf75b290c.r40.cf1.rackcd n .com image 468x400]


It's also possible that this was a tame tiger who thought it was playing. Not the tiger's fault that it's 300 pounds of muscle, claws and teeth.
 
2013-10-14 12:56:19 AM  

Ready-set: WTF


I'll be happy to help with your inquiry.

What part of the original post may I clarify for you?

/Para espanol, oprima dos
 
2013-10-14 01:02:03 AM  

Big_Doofus: tuna fingers: Since this happened in Oklahoma, one can assume that everyone cited in the article has the reasoning skills of a 13 year old. Only dipshiats reside in OK.

That's kind of harsh.


Yeah, I'm pretty sure most 13-year-olds have more common sense than that.
 
2013-10-14 01:03:11 AM  

Unknown_Poltroon: Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.


Even if someone said it was ok to pet Tigger's belly, I would have to think hard about it....but at any rate, no one should ever stick his arm into any animal cage. It is their safe place and they are likely to bite on general principle.
 
2013-10-14 01:04:27 AM  

BuckTurgidson: OK.

For those who missed it the FIRST 10,000 TIMES:

Don't - that is to say, DO NOT - EVER. Stick. Your. Arm. In the Tiger Cage.

In fact, if you were to avoid caging tigers in the first place, you wouldn't have a cage containing a caged tiger to feed your damned arm to, would you?


Indeed...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCMPzZXNjUQ
 
2013-10-14 01:04:43 AM  
I suppose some of the trouble is that if the tiger is accused of mauling an employee, the tiger could be killed.   That seems unreasonable, because it is pretty natural for any caged animal to grab something that enters a cage.

So, this is clearly an accident caused by the caught coat, the employee's fault for disobeying procedure, or the owner's fault for establishing unsafe procedures and/or conditions.

Considering the owner's defensiveness and rush to blame the employee, I wonder if this is something unsafe due to either conditions or procedures he'd established, or forgotten to establish..
 
2013-10-14 01:07:59 AM  
Can't say I disagree with him. She knew better. Animals of any sort should always be treated with caution...especially farking tigers.
 
2013-10-14 01:09:03 AM  
You put you left hand in.
You put your left hand out.
You put your left hand in....
www.instructables.com

And then you twist and shout.
 
2013-10-14 01:10:29 AM  

wingedkat: I suppose some of the trouble is that if the tiger is accused of mauling an employee, the tiger could be killed.   That seems unreasonable, because it is pretty natural for any caged animal to grab something that enters a cage.

So, this is clearly an accident caused by the caught coat, the employee's fault for disobeying procedure, or the owner's fault for establishing unsafe procedures and/or conditions.

Considering the owner's defensiveness and rush to blame the employee, I wonder if this is something unsafe due to either conditions or procedures he'd established, or forgotten to establish..


If the tiger gets put down, I will be seriously pissed. The only reason I can in good conscious support the existence of zoos is that we are preserving the genetics of endangered species.
 
2013-10-14 01:10:32 AM  
Wouldn't it be awesome if a rogue tornado ripped this place to shreds, freeing the tigers to gorge themselves on the slow and squishy Oklahoma populace?

I need to go get the tornado machine warmed up...
 
2013-10-14 01:12:29 AM  

wingedkat: I suppose some of the trouble is that if the tiger is accused of mauling an employee, the tiger could be killed.   That seems unreasonable, because it is pretty natural for any caged animal to grab something that enters a cage.

So, this is clearly an accident caused by the caught coat, the employee's fault for disobeying procedure, or the owner's fault for establishing unsafe procedures and/or conditions.

Considering the owner's defensiveness and rush to blame the employee, I wonder if this is something unsafe due to either conditions or procedures he'd established, or forgotten to establish..


Or maybe we live in a ridiculously litigious country with 24 hour news channels just looking for someone to blame the instant something bad happens. He's trying to get out his side before the media starts pouncing on him, and he's right to do so.
 
2013-10-14 01:13:46 AM  

wingedkat: I suppose some of the trouble is that if the tiger is accused of mauling an employee, the tiger could be killed.   That seems unreasonable, because it is pretty natural for any caged animal to grab something that enters a cage.

So, this is clearly an accident caused by the caught coat, the employee's fault for disobeying procedure, or the owner's fault for establishing unsafe procedures and/or conditions.

Considering the owner's defensiveness and rush to blame the employee, I wonder if this is something unsafe due to either conditions or procedures he'd established, or forgotten to establish..



It seems to be okay when he does it.

www.ndjglobalnews.com

kwtv.images.worldnow.com
 
2013-10-14 01:15:42 AM  

wingedkat: the owner's fault for establishing unsafe procedures and/or conditions.


It's a large, flesh-eating, cat. Precisely how dense to you have to be in order to shove your arm down its gullet and claim it wasn't your fault because you weren't *specifically* instructed you not to?
 
2013-10-14 01:15:53 AM  
NEVER put any part of your body into a cage, even if said cage is empty.
 
2013-10-14 01:17:16 AM  

wingedkat: I suppose some of the trouble is that if the tiger is accused of mauling an employee, the tiger could be killed.   That seems unreasonable, because it is pretty natural for any caged animal to grab something that enters a cage.

So, this is clearly an accident caused by the caught coat, the employee's fault for disobeying procedure, or the owner's fault for establishing unsafe procedures and/or conditions.

Considering the owner's defensiveness and rush to blame the employee, I wonder if this is something unsafe due to either conditions or procedures he'd established, or forgotten to establish..


The tiger is carrying his baby.    I guess that would be a higer?  Human tiger hybrid, ohh great now I can't sleep.

Ten bucks says this guy has done the same damn thing a bunch of times.  And everyone else has done the same thing, just that she got her arm stuck in the cage when she was doing something that everyone else was doing as well.

I don't know the whole story here, but I am certainly aware that people at work always follow each other's example... I don't care what you do or where you work, it happens everywhere I have worked.
 
2013-10-14 01:20:00 AM  
Tigers are all cute and cuddly and awesome until one day, your arm gets mauled to bits. You really couldn't pay me enough to put any part of me into a cage with an animal that could kill you as easily as look at you.
 
2013-10-14 01:20:12 AM  
"Garold Wayne Interactive Zoological Park"

False advertising.
 
2013-10-14 01:22:27 AM  

common sense is an oxymoron: wingedkat: I suppose some of the trouble is that if the tiger is accused of mauling an employee, the tiger could be killed.   That seems unreasonable, because it is pretty natural for any caged animal to grab something that enters a cage.

So, this is clearly an accident caused by the caught coat, the employee's fault for disobeying procedure, or the owner's fault for establishing unsafe procedures and/or conditions.

Considering the owner's defensiveness and rush to blame the employee, I wonder if this is something unsafe due to either conditions or procedures he'd established, or forgotten to establish..


It seems to be okay when he does it.

[www.ndjglobalnews.com image 560x425]

[kwtv.images.worldnow.com image 633x360]


Wow does MC Hammer know that he stole his wardrobe?  This guy looks like a weapons grade douche.  How does one wear stupid shiny shirts around a big cat like that and not get mauled.  I am sure he would put the cat down if that happened...
 
2013-10-14 01:25:42 AM  
i.my.afterdawn.com
 
2013-10-14 01:26:04 AM  
Well obviously she should have grabbed the tongue! She must be new at this...pppfft, amateur!
 
2013-10-14 01:26:46 AM  

Big_Doofus: tuna fingers: Since this happened in Oklahoma, one can assume that everyone cited in the article has the reasoning skills of a 13 year old. Only dipshiats reside in OK.

That's kind of harsh.


Yeah, the tiger lives there.
 
2013-10-14 01:28:59 AM  
O-O-Oklahoma! Where the cat comes leaping down with pain.
Where the wavin' meat can sure taste sweet
And your boss comes right behind with blame.

Oklahoma, Otay!

3.bp.blogspot.com

Glad she kept her arm, because she could have been....
wookin pa nub.
 
2013-10-14 01:29:37 AM  

Jument: Tigers are all cute and cuddly and awesome until one day, your arm gets mauled to bits. You really couldn't pay me enough to put any part of me into a cage with an animal that could kill you as easily as look at you.


It's not something they pay you do. In fact, zoos have elaborate systems of redundant fencing and pulleys so just such an event doesn't occur.
 
2013-10-14 01:33:45 AM  
I believe that tiger framed her fearful symmetry.
 
2013-10-14 01:34:04 AM  

DrZiffle: "Garold Wayne *Interactive* Zoological Park"

False advertising.


I dunno. That seems about as interactive as you can get, without having to use helicopters to wrangle the animals up at the end of each day...
 
2013-10-14 01:35:49 AM  

doglover: Jument: Tigers are all cute and cuddly and awesome until one day, your arm gets mauled to bits. You really couldn't pay me enough to put any part of me into a cage with an animal that could kill you as easily as look at you.

It's not something they pay you do. In fact, zoos have elaborate systems of redundant fencing and pulleys so just such an event doesn't occur.


Not all of them. I heard one time in Oklahoma a lady got her arm bitten off.
 
2013-10-14 01:36:30 AM  
Stop mauling yourself!

(hysterical screaming)


Stop mauling yourself!

(hysterical screaming)


Stop mauling yourself!

(hysterical screaming)


Stop mauling yourself!

(hysterical screaming)
 
2013-10-14 01:39:43 AM  

Unknown_Poltroon: Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.


I know it's been said multiple times but if it's a known living tiger, it's a known dangerous animal.
 
2013-10-14 01:43:40 AM  

tillerman35: I believe that tiger framed her fearful symmetry.


The article doesn't mention the tiger glowing bright, and I don't think this happened in the night.
 
2013-10-14 01:47:29 AM  

Smackledorfer: doglover: Jument: Tigers are all cute and cuddly and awesome until one day, your arm gets mauled to bits. You really couldn't pay me enough to put any part of me into a cage with an animal that could kill you as easily as look at you.

It's not something they pay you do. In fact, zoos have elaborate systems of redundant fencing and pulleys so just such an event doesn't occur.

Not all of them. I heard one time in Oklahoma a lady got her arm bitten off.


Break protocol in a machine shop and you'll lose your arm. Break protocol at a camp fire and you'll get horribly burned. Break protocol at a tiger cage and you'll be et in whole or in part.
 
2013-10-14 01:51:07 AM  

picturescrazy: Unknown_Poltroon: Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.

I know it's been said multiple times but if it's a known living tiger, it's a known dangerous animal.


Didn't we recently have a clip posted here showing a tiger taking down a crocodile?
 
2013-10-14 01:51:30 AM  

doglover: Smackledorfer: doglover: Jument: Tigers are all cute and cuddly and awesome until one day, your arm gets mauled to bits. You really couldn't pay me enough to put any part of me into a cage with an animal that could kill you as easily as look at you.

It's not something they pay you do. In fact, zoos have elaborate systems of redundant fencing and pulleys so just such an event doesn't occur.

Not all of them. I heard one time in Oklahoma a lady got her arm bitten off.

Break protocol in a machine shop and you'll lose your arm. Break protocol at a camp fire and you'll get horribly burned. Break protocol at a tiger cage and you'll be et in whole or in part.


This.

I have a hard time seeing this as assinine, as the tag claims. If you stick your arm in a tiger cage, you should be prepared to lose it. It's that simple. It doesn't matter if "everyone else does it." Who the fark cares? If I worked at a zoo and everyone else stuck their arm in the tiger cage, I'd call them all farking nuts, and then laugh when one eventually gets bit and say "I told you say."

Harsh, maybe, but oh well. Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons(or tigers), for you are crunchy and taste good with (condiment of choice).
 
2013-10-14 01:52:45 AM  

grumpfuff: doglover: Smackledorfer: doglover: Jument: Tigers are all cute and cuddly and awesome until one day, your arm gets mauled to bits. You really couldn't pay me enough to put any part of me into a cage with an animal that could kill you as easily as look at you.

It's not something they pay you do. In fact, zoos have elaborate systems of redundant fencing and pulleys so just such an event doesn't occur.

Not all of them. I heard one time in Oklahoma a lady got her arm bitten off.

Break protocol in a machine shop and you'll lose your arm. Break protocol at a camp fire and you'll get horribly burned. Break protocol at a tiger cage and you'll be et in whole or in part.

This.

I have a hard time seeing this as assinine, as the tag claims. If you stick your arm in a tiger cage, you should be prepared to lose it. It's that simple. It doesn't matter if "everyone else does it." Who the fark cares? If I worked at a zoo and everyone else stuck their arm in the tiger cage, I'd call them all farking nuts, and then laugh when one eventually gets bit and say "I told you so."

Harsh, maybe, but oh well. Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons(or tigers), for you are crunchy and taste good with (condiment of choice).


FTFM. Bed time soon.
 
2013-10-14 01:54:21 AM  
Approves.

lasercola.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-10-14 02:02:32 AM  

Dahnkster: O-O-Oklahoma! Where the cat comes leaping down with pain.
Where the wavin' meat can sure taste sweet
And your boss comes right behind with blame.

Oklahoma, Otay!

[3.bp.blogspot.com image 560x400]

Glad she kept her arm, because she could have been....
wookin pa nub.



She was wookin in all da wong paces.
 
2013-10-14 02:05:31 AM  
www.freakingnews.com
 
2013-10-14 02:42:27 AM  

Ambivalence: He's not wrong. She put her arm in the cage, she might as well have taken a chainsaw to it.

Wild animals, especially carnivores, should not be trifled with.


Except the facility in question has a long, extensive history of facilities violations, so it's more likely that the boss just never bothered to train her, or the cages are set up where you have to stick your arms in to feed the damn things, or something.
 
2013-10-14 02:54:08 AM  

Jim_Callahan: Except the facility in question has a long, extensive history of facilities violations


You can back this claim up? Because, somewhere between your ears, one citation has magically transformed into an "extensive history" of violations.

If this dimbulb went out of her way to hurl herself into speeding traffic, would that be a training issue as well? Because we can't hold her responsible for her own idiocy?

When did this attitude become so prolific?
 
2013-10-14 03:14:38 AM  

simplicimus: picturescrazy: Unknown_Poltroon: Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.

I know it's been said multiple times but if it's a known living tiger, it's a known dangerous animal.

Didn't we recently have a clip posted here showing a tiger taking down a crocodile?


Jaguar.
 
2013-10-14 03:16:31 AM  

GreenSun: The victim's a supervisor. She should've known NOT to put any body part there. Anything that gets into a wild animal's territory is considered food or a threat. The owner is correct, it's the victim's fault and not the tiger...unless that tiger is super smart that it can say "It's GRRRRRRRRREEEEAAAT!" while trying to get kids to buy a certain brand of cereal.


The "victim" has said repeatedly it was her own fault she was injured and repeatedly, publicly made it known that the tiger should not be held responsible and campaigned against the tiger being put down for her mistake. The article is sensationalistic and ridiculous, not to mention completely unnecessary... just like most articles these days. Why let actual facts get in the way of a good headline, right subby?
 
2013-10-14 03:19:55 AM  
One of my cats will attack you if you try to pet her and she doesn't want you too, or if she just feels like it.  If it's a bigger cat, say 400 lbs or so, it should be obvious why you might want to be a little more careful.

/Cats like to bite and scratch things
 
2013-10-14 03:45:27 AM  

fusillade762: She pulled her own arm out. The tiger didn't maul her

The Garvin County Sheriff's Office confirmed that the woman was mauled

Mauled or not mauled?


Hmmm, cat in a box? Obviously the "Schrödinger's Tiger" paradox applies here so she was both mauled and not mauled at the same time.
 
2013-10-14 03:46:47 AM  

linuxpyro: One of my cats will attack you if you try to pet her and she doesn't want you too, or if she just feels like it.  If it's a bigger cat, say 400 lbs or so, it should be obvious why you might want to be a little more careful.

/Cats like to bite and scratch things


Sadly, if some snot-nose little kid runs up to your cat and gets scratched or bitten....regardless of the situation, you'll be blamed.  Lawsuits and, potentially, the death of your cat.  Animal laws are pretty screwed up.
 
2013-10-14 03:55:30 AM  

SpdrJay: Stop mauling yourself!

(hysterical screaming)


Stop mauling yourself!

(hysterical screaming)


Stop mauling yourself!

(hysterical screaming)


Stop mauling yourself!

(hysterical screaming)


hilarious!
 
2013-10-14 04:08:42 AM  
Seriously? In Russia Soviet.
In Soveit Russia
In Soveit Rissua
Ni Vosiet Aussir
 
2013-10-14 04:10:45 AM  

bighairyguy: fusillade762: She pulled her own arm out. The tiger didn't maul her

The Garvin County Sheriff's Office confirmed that the woman was mauled

Mauled or not mauled?

Hmmm, cat in a box? Obviously the "Schrödinger's Tiger" paradox applies here so she was both mauled and not mauled at the same time.


FINE, I'll do it your damn way, Drew:

In Soveit Russia; you open box, cat kills you!
 
2013-10-14 04:51:15 AM  

Jim_Callahan: Ambivalence: He's not wrong. She put her arm in the cage, she might as well have taken a chainsaw to it.

Wild animals, especially carnivores, should not be trifled with.

Except the facility in question has a long, extensive history of facilities violations, so it's more likely that the boss just never bothered to train her, or the cages are set up where you have to stick your arms in to feed the damn things, or something.


If you're the sort of person who needs training to know not to feed yourself to the tigers, well, perhaps working with dangerous animals is not the career for you.
 
2013-10-14 04:55:22 AM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: linuxpyro: One of my cats will attack you if you try to pet her and she doesn't want you too, or if she just feels like it.  If it's a bigger cat, say 400 lbs or so, it should be obvious why you might want to be a little more careful.

/Cats like to bite and scratch things

Sadly, if some snot-nose little kid runs up to your cat and gets scratched or bitten....regardless of the situation, you'll be blamed.  Lawsuits and, potentially, the death of your cat.  Animal laws are pretty screwed up.


I've heard of that happening with dogs, but not cats. Is there a precedent of that happening?

To be fair, dog owners are generally required to not let their pets attack people, why is there a double standard that cats are allowed to be right little shiats? Does smacking a cat and disciplining it when it is violent teach it that certain behaviours are just not acceptable, or not?
 
2013-10-14 05:15:32 AM  

Nidiot: Fark_Guy_Rob: linuxpyro: One of my cats will attack you if you try to pet her and she doesn't want you too, or if she just feels like it.  If it's a bigger cat, say 400 lbs or so, it should be obvious why you might want to be a little more careful.

/Cats like to bite and scratch things

Sadly, if some snot-nose little kid runs up to your cat and gets scratched or bitten....regardless of the situation, you'll be blamed.  Lawsuits and, potentially, the death of your cat.  Animal laws are pretty screwed up.

I've heard of that happening with dogs, but not cats. Is there a precedent of that happening?

To be fair, dog owners are generally required to not let their pets attack people, why is there a double standard that cats are allowed to be right little shiats? Does smacking a cat and disciplining it when it is violent teach it that certain behaviours are just not acceptable, or not?


Not usually, because cats are pretty much considered to be awful nasty creatures and any fool who messes with a cat, regardless of age, deserves it. Also, it's pretty well established that, unlike dogs, cats can't be trained not to scratch & bite. So whereas a dog owner with a known vicious dog can be sued, it's hard to prove an owner has a "known vicious cat" that's MORE vicious than any other cat in the neighborhood--and nobody has ever heard of an attack cat to the best of my knowledge.

You mess with teh kitteh, you get teh clawz, is the prevailing attitude.
 
2013-10-14 05:18:11 AM  

HindiDiscoMonster: Nidiot: Fark_Guy_Rob: linuxpyro: One of my cats will attack you if you try to pet her and she doesn't want you too, or if she just feels like it.  If it's a bigger cat, say 400 lbs or so, it should be obvious why you might want to be a little more careful.

/Cats like to bite and scratch things

Sadly, if some snot-nose little kid runs up to your cat and gets scratched or bitten....regardless of the situation, you'll be blamed.  Lawsuits and, potentially, the death of your cat.  Animal laws are pretty screwed up.

I've heard of that happening with dogs, but not cats. Is there a precedent of that happening?

To be fair, dog owners are generally required to not let their pets attack people, why is there a double standard that cats are allowed to be right little shiats? Does smacking a cat and disciplining it when it is violent teach it that certain behaviours are just not acceptable, or not?

fun fact: cats are not dogs.
if you want to make a comparison say: wolves and cats... domestic dogs are far too removed from their wild roots.


So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?
 
2013-10-14 05:19:12 AM  
Most pussies do not like other pussies,
 
2013-10-14 05:34:31 AM  
HindiDiscoMonster: .....Cats are much more difficult to train because they all have an independent streak within them. No matter their size, 8oz to 900lb... they all have moments of cute and cuddly, and moments of the worst PMS you have ever seen.

Gah, I'm sticking to my nice, even tempered, PMS free, non-bitey pets. They are just as cute and cuddly IMHO.
 
2013-10-14 05:35:46 AM  
Thanks for the prayers everyone
 
2013-10-14 05:36:27 AM  

Nidiot: So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?


It will scratch you and run away.

Cats mostly don't bite, though. I've never seen or heard of anyone BITTEN by a cat unless the cat was badly hurt or fighting with another cat and the person foolishly tried to pick it up. A cat's primary defense is to scratch, and no, you can't train a cat not to scratch. Cats method of aggression is usually (in rough order):
1. Hiss/growl
2. Flee
3. Scratch
4. Bite only when cornered or grabbed.

Anyone foolish enough to ignore the first three, or to pick up a cat that is hissing, is going to get bitten; but no cat is ever going to just bite someone right off the bat unless it (the cat) is ill or hurt. It's not because they're still too close to their wild ancestors, I suspect; but because unlike dogs, they're not social (group) animals and so have no signals for maintaining order. Dogs do--nipping is a way to teach puppies how to behave and snapping is a way to maintain social distance; so you CAN teach a dog not to nip or snap. Since cats use scratching and biting as defensive mechanisms, there's really no way to train them out of it--any more than you can train a dog not to bite when it's cornered or hurt.
 
2013-10-14 05:37:58 AM  

Gyrfalcon: you can't train a cat


I just saved you a lot of words.
 
2013-10-14 05:58:58 AM  

khyberkitsune: simplicimus: picturescrazy: Unknown_Poltroon: Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.

I know it's been said multiple times but if it's a known living tiger, it's a known dangerous animal.

Didn't we recently have a clip posted here showing a tiger taking down a crocodile?

Jaguar.


Tigers and jaguars don't live together
 
2013-10-14 06:00:48 AM  

Nidiot: HindiDiscoMonster: Nidiot: Fark_Guy_Rob: linuxpyro: One of my cats will attack you if you try to pet her and she doesn't want you too, or if she just feels like it.  If it's a bigger cat, say 400 lbs or so, it should be obvious why you might want to be a little more careful.

/Cats like to bite and scratch things

Sadly, if some snot-nose little kid runs up to your cat and gets scratched or bitten....regardless of the situation, you'll be blamed.  Lawsuits and, potentially, the death of your cat.  Animal laws are pretty screwed up.

I've heard of that happening with dogs, but not cats. Is there a precedent of that happening?

To be fair, dog owners are generally required to not let their pets attack people, why is there a double standard that cats are allowed to be right little shiats? Does smacking a cat and disciplining it when it is violent teach it that certain behaviours are just not acceptable, or not?

fun fact: cats are not dogs.
if you want to make a comparison say: wolves and cats... domestic dogs are far too removed from their wild roots.

So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?


You get scratched. Have you ever met a cat?
 
2013-10-14 06:03:13 AM  

bborchar: Can't say I disagree with him. She knew better. Animals of any sort should always be treated with caution...especially farking tigers.


Bet she was wearing a short skirt too and just asking for it. Blame the victim much?
 
2013-10-14 06:05:37 AM  

Gyrfalcon: Nidiot: So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?

It will scratch you and run away.

Cats mostly don't bite, though. I've never seen or heard of anyone BITTEN by a cat unless the cat was badly hurt or fighting with another cat and the person foolishly tried to pick it up. A cat's primary defense is to scratch, and no, you can't train a cat not to scratch. Cats method of aggression is usually (in rough order):
1. Hiss/growl
2. Flee
3. Scratch
4. Bite only when cornered or grabbed.

Anyone foolish enough to ignore the first three, or to pick up a cat that is hissing, is going to get bitten; but no cat is ever going to just bite someone right off the bat unless it (the cat) is ill or hurt. It's not because they're still too close to their wild ancestors, I suspect; but because unlike dogs, they're not social (group) animals and so have no signals for maintaining order. Dogs do--nipping is a way to teach puppies how to behave and snapping is a way to maintain social distance; so you CAN teach a dog not to nip or snap. Since cats use scratching and biting as defensive mechanisms, there's really no way to train them out of it--any more than you can train a dog not to bite when it's cornered or hurt.


I have a friend who has a cat (mad person obviously) and I have actually seen that cat sitting quietly on his lap being petted before suddenly turning and biting him. No warning hiss, it doesn't flee, just bites him. Evidently it gets tired of being petted, or doesn't like the way it is being petted. But I always thought it was a bit of a bastard thing to just bite the hand, or face, of the person who is petting you, because you want them to leave you alone, instead of just getting off their lap to sit somewhere else. Apparently that cat does that quite often too. Why people would want to own a random biting/scratching device I don't know. There are more social animals out there that are also cute and furry.
 
2013-10-14 06:08:16 AM  

ransack.: khyberkitsune: simplicimus: picturescrazy: Unknown_Poltroon: Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.

I know it's been said multiple times but if it's a known living tiger, it's a known dangerous animal.

Didn't we recently have a clip posted here showing a tiger taking down a crocodile?

Jaguar.

Tigers and jaguars don't live together


Well, Tigers don't generally live with other Tigers, nor Jaguars with other Jaguars. Only Lions have a social organization, and sometimes domestic cats.
 
2013-10-14 06:15:06 AM  

Nidiot: I have a friend who has a cat (mad person obviously) and I have actually seen that cat sitting quietly on his lap being petted before suddenly turning and biting him. No warning hiss, it doesn't flee, just bites him. Evidently it gets tired of being petted, or doesn't like the way it is being petted. But I always thought it was a bit of a bastard thing to just bite the hand, or face, of the person who is petting you, because you want them to leave you alone, instead of just getting off their lap to sit somewhere else. Apparently that cat does that quite often too. Why people would want to own a random biting/scratching device I don't know. There are more social animals out there that are also cute and furry.


Nip or bite? There's a difference, mainly bleeding. I have a dog who likes to mouth me occasionally. I know he can bite through a lamb bone, but he just mouths me. Some people say he's biting me, but I would definitely know the difference.
 
2013-10-14 06:16:24 AM  

Warlordtrooper: Blame the victim much?


Victim? What 'victim'?
 
2013-10-14 06:21:52 AM  

Warlordtrooper: bborchar: Can't say I disagree with him. She knew better. Animals of any sort should always be treated with caution...especially farking tigers.

Bet she was wearing a short skirt too and just asking for it. Blame the victim much?


Given that she stuck her arm in the tiger's cage, I think blaming the victim in this particular case is totally appropriate. Actually, it's more like blaming the dumbass. How low does a person's IQ have to be before they haven't got enough intellectual capacity to work out not to stick any body part they ever want to see again, inside the cage of an enormous carnivorous animal? Would she also put her hand into a fire? How about into a meat grinder? What is wrong with people?
 
2013-10-14 06:30:26 AM  

Nidiot: What is wrong with people?


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/teenager-mauled-lion-dragged -c age-2027876

The really depressing thing is.. .this isn't a once-off. These people are out there.... infecting the gene-pool.
 
2013-10-14 06:36:14 AM  

Gyrfalcon: Nidiot: So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?

It will scratch you and run away.

Cats mostly don't bite, though. I've never seen or heard of anyone BITTEN by a cat unless the cat was badly hurt or fighting with another cat and the person foolishly tried to pick it up. A cat's primary defense is to scratch, and no, you can't train a cat not to scratch. Cats method of aggression is usually (in rough order):
1. Hiss/growl
2. Flee
3. Scratch
4. Bite only when cornered or grabbed.

Anyone foolish enough to ignore the first three, or to pick up a cat that is hissing, is going to get bitten; but no cat is ever going to just bite someone right off the bat unless it (the cat) is ill or hurt. It's not because they're still too close to their wild ancestors, I suspect; but because unlike dogs, they're not social (group) animals and so have no signals for maintaining order. Dogs do--nipping is a way to teach puppies how to behave and snapping is a way to maintain social distance; so you CAN teach a dog not to nip or snap. Since cats use scratching and biting as defensive mechanisms, there's really no way to train them out of it--any more than you can train a dog not to bite when it's cornered or hurt.


My cat will bite my wife's ankle as she goes to bed about 4 times a year. enough to draw blood sometimes. It has its claws too (usually declawed cats learn swatting doesn't work and default to biting.

/now you've heard of a cat that bites when it is not cornered or or ill.
 
2013-10-14 06:36:36 AM  

simplicimus: Nip or bite? There's a difference, mainly bleeding. I have a dog who likes to mouth me occasionally. I know he can bite through a lamb bone, but he just mouths me. Some people say he's biting me, but I would definitely know the difference.


I guess it was a nip. I guess it served as the warning, which I guess works because it will make the petting stop.

I have another friend who has a Jack Russell cross who will sometime mouth her, mostly if she has been away for the weekend or something like that where he really missed her. You can tell that he does it out of a need to bond again more than anything. Almost a holding of her hand using the only thing he can hold with, given he doesn't have opposable thumbs.

He is also able to bite through entire bones with no trouble, so if he wanted to do some damage there is no doubt he could, small as he is.
 
2013-10-14 06:38:29 AM  

harrydorcas: The Mother Feline stares at you and agrees with her tigress SO.

[www.paradisegalleries.com image 485x575]


Well, I'm glad it's morning here, because I'm sure not sleeping after seeing THAT...
 
2013-10-14 06:39:32 AM  

radarlove: Wouldn't it be awesome if a rogue tornado ripped this place to shreds, freeing the tigers to gorge themselves on the slow and squishy Oklahoma populace?

I need to go get the tornado machine warmed up...


Have you noticed that there have been no tornadoes, earthquakes, hurricanes, or blizzards since the government shutdown?
 
2013-10-14 06:42:59 AM  

radarlove: Wouldn't it be awesome if a rogue tornado ripped this place to shreds, freeing the tigers to gorge themselves on the slow and squishy Oklahoma populace?

I need to go get the tornado machine warmed up...


Ooh, "Tigernado"...you start on the script, I'll get the SyFy Channel on the horn, we'll make a bundle!
 
2013-10-14 06:44:25 AM  

picturescrazy: Unknown_Poltroon: Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.

I know it's been said multiple times but if it's a known living tiger, it's a known dangerous animal.


After all dogs have been bred to be "safe" around humans for thousands of years, and still they will occasionally attack (ignoring ones trained to do so). So considering any other large animal "safe" is intrinsically stupid, however well trained or behaved they can be normally.
 
2013-10-14 06:51:55 AM  
No Krusty Land House of Knives references? Fark, I am dissappoint.
 
2013-10-14 06:53:14 AM  

Smackledorfer: doglover: Jument: Tigers are all cute and cuddly and awesome until one day, your arm gets mauled to bits. You really couldn't pay me enough to put any part of me into a cage with an animal that could kill you as easily as look at you.

It's not something they pay you do. In fact, zoos have elaborate systems of redundant fencing and pulleys so just such an event doesn't occur.

Not all of them. I heard one time in Oklahoma a lady got her arm bitten off.


All of this has happened before, and it will all happen again. . .

http://www.igorilla.com/gorilla/animal/tapir_attack_in_Oklahoma_City _P artTwo.html
 
2013-10-14 07:42:53 AM  

401kman: wingedkat: I suppose some of the trouble is that if the tiger is accused of mauling an employee, the tiger could be killed.   That seems unreasonable, because it is pretty natural for any caged animal to grab something that enters a cage.

So, this is clearly an accident caused by the caught coat, the employee's fault for disobeying procedure, or the owner's fault for establishing unsafe procedures and/or conditions.

Considering the owner's defensiveness and rush to blame the employee, I wonder if this is something unsafe due to either conditions or procedures he'd established, or forgotten to establish..

The tiger is carrying his baby.    I guess that would be a higer?  Human tiger hybrid, ohh great now I can't sleep.

Ten bucks says this guy has done the same damn thing a bunch of times.  And everyone else has done the same thing, just that she got her arm stuck in the cage when she was doing something that everyone else was doing as well.

I don't know the whole story here, but I am certainly aware that people at work always follow each other's example... I don't care what you do or where you work, it happens everywhere I have worked.
~



Pretty much my thoughts exactly. It boils down to whether this is a lie: "The park has a strict rule against introducing any body part into a wild animal enclosure."

I'd like to know just how STRICTLY these RULES are being enforced. I'm leaning towards him being full of crap.how

BTW, him saying she "pulled her own arm out" was a little bit insensitive and reckless. But I know he was being metaphorical, and personally, it gave me a bit of a larf. But it gives you an insight into the kinda guy that he is.
 
2013-10-14 07:53:25 AM  
Tigers can't get you. You have to go to them
 
2013-10-14 07:54:57 AM  
She offered the tiger a toy and the tiger took the toy.   That's how it is.

If you wear a fluffy bunchy coat into a manufacturing plant and a piece of machinery grabs your arm and mangles it, its YOUR farking fault.  You don't wear fluffy bunchy clothing around things that can catch it and tear it and your arms up.

To the tiger's understanding, if it is placed inside the cage - its for the tiger to fark-up.

If I were an insurance adjuster I'd write it up that way.  I'd have it investigated as an intentional act by the employee to defraud.
 
2013-10-14 07:55:31 AM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: Animal laws are pretty screwed up.


Don't get me started on bird law.


www.law-school-case-briefs.com
 
2013-10-14 08:05:13 AM  
 The tiger was in his cage, and she violated his space by sticking her arm into his space," said Mr Schreibvogel, before adding that the park has a strict rule against introducing any body part into a wild animal enclosure.

He then went on to add "I mean... she was asking for it. Did you see how she was dressed!?!? She wanted it and the cat gave it to her."
 
2013-10-14 08:07:36 AM  

simplicimus: picturescrazy: Unknown_Poltroon: Was this a known dangerous animal?  Then yeah, shes a dumbass.
If this was "Tigger the tiger, sure you can scratch his belly"  then they need a suin.

I know it's been said multiple times but if it's a known living tiger, it's a known dangerous animal.

Didn't we recently have a clip posted here showing a tiger taking down a crocodile?


It was a jaguar taking down a caiman.  But same thing, sure.
 
2013-10-14 08:08:29 AM  

ReapTheChaos: Don'y you hate it when people pull off their own limbs then try to blame the wildlife? Pisses me right off every damn time.


ib3.huluim.com

This is nothing out of the unusual. Cows turn themselves inside out all the time.
 
2013-10-14 08:23:58 AM  
Maybe we should just let the nice kitty live in the wild where it belongs.

/at least in the factory they put guards on the machinery so you can't Darwin yourself
 
2013-10-14 08:26:13 AM  

Nidiot: I have a friend who has a cat (mad person obviously) and I have actually seen that cat sitting quietly on his lap being petted before suddenly turning and biting him. No warning hiss, it doesn't flee, just bites him. Evidently it gets tired of being petted, or doesn't like the way it is being petted. But I always thought it was a bit of a bastard thing to just bite the hand, or face, of the person who is petting you, because you want them to leave you alone, instead of just getting off their lap to sit somewhere else. Apparently that cat does that quite ...


There's two degrees of domestic cat bites from what I can tell, and I think it comes from a fundamentally different muscle use in the jaw.

The first is a pin, what we're calling a nip in response to your post. Humans have thinner skin than other cats would, and a nip can break it and cause blood, but it's intended to hold in place. When cats wrestle and they're nipping at the necks, or when a mother cat picks up a kitten, that's a pin bite. It's intended to be a first result to "stop" or "hold damn still", like a pinch.

The other is a puncture, which is an actual cat bite. Punctures are designed to break the skin, and due to the bacteria on the teeth, are basically venomous. House cats do not run around doing this to people all the time. You've really got to get them to the end of their stress rope.
 
2013-10-14 08:28:14 AM  
Dammit, maybe there just needs to be some sort of policy at zoos, whereby anyone who wants to go hug and pet the pretty, fluffy animal, is allowed into the cage by the keepers, so they can really express their deep emotional bond with said animal.

There would be winners all round.

The animals get fresh meat and the astoundingly stupid get removed from the gene pool.
 
2013-10-14 08:35:01 AM  

edmo: Maybe we should just let the nice kitty live in the wild where it belongs.

/at least in the factory they put guards on the machinery so you can't Darwin yourself


They had a 'guard' on the tiger, it was the cage, the one she stuck her arm into.
 
2013-10-14 08:58:27 AM  
I kinda was with the zoo owner, until

Mr Schreibvogel told the Mail Online that he is planning to release a six-song country-western music album, titled Joe Exotic - The Tiger King, with music videos

/daring that he puts both kinds on the album, tho
 
2013-10-14 09:18:07 AM  
I'm surprised.
 114 posts in, and the Big Cat Rescue shills haven't poked up their heads yet. I guess they're asleep at the wheel today, which is even more surprising, considering the raging hate-boner that Carole Baskins has had towards Joe Schriebvogel for years now.
 
2013-10-14 10:23:15 AM  

common sense is an oxymoron: wingedkat: I suppose some of the trouble is that if the tiger is accused of mauling an employee, the tiger could be killed.   That seems unreasonable, because it is pretty natural for any caged animal to grab something that enters a cage.

So, this is clearly an accident caused by the caught coat, the employee's fault for disobeying procedure, or the owner's fault for establishing unsafe procedures and/or conditions.

Considering the owner's defensiveness and rush to blame the employee, I wonder if this is something unsafe due to either conditions or procedures he'd established, or forgotten to establish..


It seems to be okay when he does it.

[www.ndjglobalnews.com image 560x425]

[kwtv.images.worldnow.com image 633x360]


When I see him, my Douche-Meter registers a 8.79, just under Mr. 26-Minutes-to-the-Gym Guy (8.87)
 
2013-10-14 10:55:49 AM  
evilmrsock:

There's two degrees of domestic cat bites from what I can tell, and I think it comes from a fundamentally different muscle use in the jaw.

The first is a pin, what we're calling a nip in response to your post. Humans have thinner skin than other cats would, and a nip can break it and cause blood, but it's intended to hold in place. When cats wrestle and they're nipping at the necks, or when a mother cat picks up a kitten, that's a pin bite. It's intended to be a first result to "stop" or "hold damn still", like a pinch.

The other is a puncture, which is an actual cat bite. Punctures are designed to break the skin, and due to the bacteria on the teeth, are basically venomous. House cats do not run around doing this to people all the time. You've really got to get them to the end of their stress rope.

~



That was huge, cheers. Never heard it explained before.
 
2013-10-14 11:07:57 AM  
You mess with the bull you get the bull semen.
 
2013-10-14 11:29:53 AM  

Fark_Guy_Rob: linuxpyro


Actually, Isabel has let children pet her and play with her with no problems.  I'm sure that they got too rough she might still attack, but I think it's more an issue of finding bigger humans intimidating.  I see your point though.

Gyrfalcon: Nidiot: So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?

It will scratch you and run away.

Cats mostly don't bite, though. I've never seen or heard of anyone BITTEN by a cat unless the cat was badly hurt or fighting with another cat and the person foolishly tried to pick it up. A cat's primary defense is to scratch, and no, you can't train a cat not to scratch. Cats method of aggression is usually (in rough order):
1. Hiss/growl
2. Flee
3. Scratch
4. Bite only when cornered or grabbed.

Anyone foolish enough to ignore the first three, or to pick up a cat that is hissing, is going to get bitten; but no cat is ever going to just bite someone right off the bat unless it (the cat) is ill or hurt. It's not because they're still too close to their wild ancestors, I suspect; but because unlike dogs, they're not social (group) animals and so have no signals for maintaining order. Dogs do--nipping is a way to teach puppies how to behave and snapping is a way to maintain social distance; so you CAN teach a dog not to nip or snap. Since cats use scratching and biting as defensive mechanisms, there's really no way to train them out of it--any more than you can train a dog not to bite when it's cornered or hurt.


Isabel (technically my brother's cat) was originally a stray, and actually has warmed up to people quite a bit while we've had her.  You're right that you probably can't teach cats not to hiss, bite, or scratch, but if they're more comfortable around you it's a non-issue.  (On the other hand, I've been scratched by almost all the cats I've had by accident while playing.)
 
2013-10-14 11:42:40 AM  
i141.photobucket.com
Animals don't hurt people.  People hurt people.
 
2013-10-14 12:29:26 PM  

Nidiot: HindiDiscoMonster: Nidiot: Fark_Guy_Rob: linuxpyro: One of my cats will attack you if you try to pet her and she doesn't want you too, or if she just feels like it.  If it's a bigger cat, say 400 lbs or so, it should be obvious why you might want to be a little more careful.

/Cats like to bite and scratch things

Sadly, if some snot-nose little kid runs up to your cat and gets scratched or bitten....regardless of the situation, you'll be blamed.  Lawsuits and, potentially, the death of your cat.  Animal laws are pretty screwed up.

I've heard of that happening with dogs, but not cats. Is there a precedent of that happening?

To be fair, dog owners are generally required to not let their pets attack people, why is there a double standard that cats are allowed to be right little shiats? Does smacking a cat and disciplining it when it is violent teach it that certain behaviours are just not acceptable, or not?

fun fact: cats are not dogs.
if you want to make a comparison say: wolves and cats... domestic dogs are far too removed from their wild roots.

So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?


Probably the cat would run away and learn to dislike you.

You can't easily unprogram an animal out of it's basic state. When a cat feels threatened or perturbed, it will bite and scratch. It's a fight-or-flight kind of reflex born of millions of years of evolution. Dogs are more trainable, certainly, but if trigger a dog's fight of flight reflex it may still get chompy on you.

My cats do whatever the hell they want. If you leave them alone when they feel like it, they learn that there is absolutely nothing to fear around you and they are generally very relaxed and cool about things. IMHO that is the secret to a well-behaved cat: just leave the damn thing alone sometimes. As a plus, it will get lonely and seek out your company.
 
2013-10-14 12:55:52 PM  

Nidiot: HindiDiscoMonster: Nidiot: Fark_Guy_Rob: linuxpyro: One of my cats will attack you if you try to pet her and she doesn't want you too, or if she just feels like it.  If it's a bigger cat, say 400 lbs or so, it should be obvious why you might want to be a little more careful.

/Cats like to bite and scratch things

Sadly, if some snot-nose little kid runs up to your cat and gets scratched or bitten....regardless of the situation, you'll be blamed.  Lawsuits and, potentially, the death of your cat.  Animal laws are pretty screwed up.

I've heard of that happening with dogs, but not cats. Is there a precedent of that happening?

To be fair, dog owners are generally required to not let their pets attack people, why is there a double standard that cats are allowed to be right little shiats? Does smacking a cat and disciplining it when it is violent teach it that certain behaviours are just not acceptable, or not?

fun fact: cats are not dogs.
if you want to make a comparison say: wolves and cats... domestic dogs are far too removed from their wild roots.

So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?


Mine generally looks at me like "oh shiat, that was a mistake" if she gets a smack for biting. She rarely bites, though, and if she does, I evaluate the situation: did you do something to warrant it? Then kitty doesn't get a smack. I can tell you when you start if she's going t obite or claw and if you ignore the warning and you get scratched or bit, kitty doesn't get in trouble.

It's called paying attention to your critter and knowing their body language and personality. My cat, for instance, will not let anyone but me touch her feet or belly. anyone else who does it gets claws or teeth. If they ignore me when I tell them this, then that's on them.
 
2013-10-14 02:06:55 PM  

HindiDiscoMonster: Nidiot: HindiDiscoMonster: Nidiot: Fark_Guy_Rob: linuxpyro: One of my cats will attack you if you try to pet her and she doesn't want you too, or if she just feels like it.  If it's a bigger cat, say 400 lbs or so, it should be obvious why you might want to be a little more careful.

/Cats like to bite and scratch things

Sadly, if some snot-nose little kid runs up to your cat and gets scratched or bitten....regardless of the situation, you'll be blamed.  Lawsuits and, potentially, the death of your cat.  Animal laws are pretty screwed up.

I've heard of that happening with dogs, but not cats. Is there a precedent of that happening?

To be fair, dog owners are generally required to not let their pets attack people, why is there a double standard that cats are allowed to be right little shiats? Does smacking a cat and disciplining it when it is violent teach it that certain behaviours are just not acceptable, or not?

fun fact: cats are not dogs.
if you want to make a comparison say: wolves and cats... domestic dogs are far too removed from their wild roots.

So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?

you would likely get hissed at and likely scratched. If you abuse any animal, however, you are likely to cause a negative reaction. Cats are much more difficult to train because they all have an independent streak within them. No matter their size, 8oz to 900lb... they all have moments of cute and cuddly, and moments of the worst PMS you have ever seen.


They also have a smaller pre-frontal cortex  (accounting for relative mass) than dogs, which makes them harder to train, because they find it harder to learn (they run more closely to instinct). They can be trained, it is just harder, and generally, they are fine when left to their own devices. Until they aren't and scratch, bite, get on the counter, whatever.
 
2013-10-14 02:16:08 PM  
Always remember;  Five ends are pointy.
 
2013-10-14 03:41:54 PM  

Jim_Callahan: Ambivalence: He's not wrong. She put her arm in the cage, she might as well have taken a chainsaw to it.

Wild animals, especially carnivores, should not be trifled with.

Except the facility in question has a long, extensive history of facilities violations, so it's more likely that the boss just never bothered to train her, or the cages are set up where you have to stick your arms in to feed the damn things, or something.


I've never been trained to handle animals. Guess what I wouldn't do? It's called common sense and natural instinct.

I'm sucks of people blaming people for their own stupidity. This is called natural selection. A hundred years ago there would be no finger pointing at who's fault it was.

Darwin.
 
2013-10-14 05:10:50 PM  
Nidiot:

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?
  "


My cat when tired of being petted, or just for whatever reason will go ahead and bite your hand.  The immediate response was to smack the cat.

The cat did learn that when it bites it will be hit,so the first thing this cat does after biting is to prepare to be hit.

So the cat knows it will be hit when it bites, but the cat does still bite.

Cats are little sociopaths, they know the difference between right and wrong, they just don't care.
 
2013-10-14 05:35:34 PM  

Jeng: Nidiot:

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?  "


My cat when tired of being petted, or just for whatever reason will go ahead and bite your hand.  The immediate response was to smack the cat.

The cat did learn that when it bites it will be hit,so the first thing this cat does after biting is to prepare to be hit.

So the cat knows it will be hit when it bites, but the cat does still bite.

Cats are little sociopaths, carnivores, they don't know the difference between right and wrong, they just don't care.


Reverse the relative sizes of pet and owner, and they'd hunt humans down and eat us like a mice.
I don't think it'd be personal, though.
 
2013-10-14 05:57:56 PM  

Nidiot: So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?


I would find a new home for my cat as I am obviously not mature enough to handle animal ownership.

/really, really hope you don't smack your pets to "train" them
 
2013-10-14 06:00:11 PM  

Nidiot: Gyrfalcon: Nidiot: So are you saying cats cannot be trained to not bite you, because they are still too closely related to their wild ancestors?

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?

It will scratch you and run away.

Cats mostly don't bite, though. I've never seen or heard of anyone BITTEN by a cat unless the cat was badly hurt or fighting with another cat and the person foolishly tried to pick it up. A cat's primary defense is to scratch, and no, you can't train a cat not to scratch. Cats method of aggression is usually (in rough order):
1. Hiss/growl
2. Flee
3. Scratch
4. Bite only when cornered or grabbed.

Anyone foolish enough to ignore the first three, or to pick up a cat that is hissing, is going to get bitten; but no cat is ever going to just bite someone right off the bat unless it (the cat) is ill or hurt. It's not because they're still too close to their wild ancestors, I suspect; but because unlike dogs, they're not social (group) animals and so have no signals for maintaining order. Dogs do--nipping is a way to teach puppies how to behave and snapping is a way to maintain social distance; so you CAN teach a dog not to nip or snap. Since cats use scratching and biting as defensive mechanisms, there's really no way to train them out of it--any more than you can train a dog not to bite when it's cornered or hurt.

I have a friend who has a cat (mad person obviously) and I have actually seen that cat sitting quietly on his lap being petted before suddenly turning and biting him. No warning hiss, it doesn't flee, just bites him. Evidently it gets tired of being petted, or doesn't like the way it is being petted. But I always thought it was a bit of a bastard thing to just bite the hand, or face, of the person who is petting you, because you want them to leave you alone, instead of just getting off their lap to sit somewhere else. Apparently that cat does that quite ...


On the other side of this coin, I have a friend whose cat will turn around and bite you BECAUSE she likes the way you're petting her and wants you to continue. She will actively keep coming back for more pettings after you pull your hand away and leave her alone post-bite.
 
2013-10-14 06:12:08 PM  

PunGent: Jeng: Nidiot:

Cat owners are weirder than I first thought.

So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?  "


My cat when tired of being petted, or just for whatever reason will go ahead and bite your hand.  The immediate response was to smack the cat.

The cat did learn that when it bites it will be hit,so the first thing this cat does after biting is to prepare to be hit.

So the cat knows it will be hit when it bites, but the cat does still bite.

Cats are little sociopaths, carnivores, they don't know the difference between right and wrong, they just don't care.

Reverse the relative sizes of pet and owner, and they'd hunt humans down and eat us like a mice.
I don't think it'd be personal, though.


I doubt cats know concepts like right or wrong, but if it acts like is knows it will be hit after it bites, then it has certainly worked out the concept of consequences. Though it hasn't worked out the simple concept of just leaving when it is tired of being petted.

Apparently, even when a cat knows a smack will ensue, it will still bite you. How sweet. (Thanks to  Jeng for the answer, btw.)

Also, why do people want to keep a pet that is just wishing you were smaller so it could kill and eat you? People in snake threads think snake owners are weird, no weirder than cat owners in my book. At least the snakes are kept locked in cages.
 
2013-10-14 07:54:08 PM  

The My Little Pony Killer: Nidiot: So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?

I would find a new home for my cat as I am obviously not mature enough to handle animal ownership.

/really, really hope you don't smack your pets to "train" them


I have horses. When one of my horses was new, he tried the nip-the-human-while-they-do-up-the-girth thing, and not because he was sore or had and injury, but because sometimes horses will. Girths aren't all that nice no matter how well fitted I'm sure, and horses can pick up bad habits if you let them, and evidently he had with a previous owner. He was smacked once and told *no*. He never did it again. Generally they don't do bad things, but they are simply too big an animal to allow any bad behaviour. If they repeatedly pull a foot away when you are trying to trim it or some such, they will get a smack along with a *no*. A verbal rebuff is used first, but occasionally that is not enough to do the job. But only if they are just trying it on, they are never reprimanded if the action is a result of fear or being in pain. That is the thing, they don't only act purely out of instinct, they will sometimes do something not out of fear or pain, but because they can, and are testing how much they can get away with.

But mostly they are just spoiled rotten.

The bull gets verbal reprimands, since they work on him. (When I had a dog she only needed verbal reprimands also.) The goat, well, all he might do is eat what he shouldn't, so he just has to be kept out of the garden. Or he head butts people, which is just what goats do. But neither of them bite.

I'd never get a cat. Apparently you get bitten and scratched at random for no good reason, and I am not the sort of person that would enjoy that.
 
2013-10-14 08:12:44 PM  

Nidiot: The My Little Pony Killer: Nidiot: So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?

I would find a new home for my cat as I am obviously not mature enough to handle animal ownership.

/really, really hope you don't smack your pets to "train" them

I have horses. When one of my horses was new, he tried the nip-the-human-while-they-do-up-the-girth thing, and not because he was sore or had and injury, but because sometimes horses will. Girths aren't all that nice no matter how well fitted I'm sure, and horses can pick up bad habits if you let them, and evidently he had with a previous owner. He was smacked once and told *no*. He never did it again. Generally they don't do bad things, but they are simply too big an animal to allow any bad behaviour. If they repeatedly pull a foot away when you are trying to trim it or some such, they will get a smack along with a *no*. A verbal rebuff is used first, but occasionally that is not enough to do the job. But only if they are just trying it on, they are never reprimanded if the action is a result of fear or being in pain. That is the thing, they don't only act purely out of instinct, they will sometimes do something not out of fear or pain, but because they can, and are testing how much they can get away with.

But mostly they are just spoiled rotten.

The bull gets verbal reprimands, since they work on him. (When I had a dog she only needed verbal reprimands also.) The goat, well, all he might do is eat what he shouldn't, so he just has to be kept out of the garden. Or he head butts people, which is just what goats do. But neither of them bite.

I'd never get a cat. Apparently you get bitten and scratched at random for no good reason, and I am not the sort of person that would enjoy that.


Bullshiat, it's no different than living with a white North American female. If you aren't one then I bet you still want one in your home. Unless you're gay. Then you prefer gerbils.
 
2013-10-14 08:19:00 PM  

Nidiot: The My Little Pony Killer: Nidiot: So if a cat bites you and you immediately smack it in response, what would happen?

I would find a new home for my cat as I am obviously not mature enough to handle animal ownership.

/really, really hope you don't smack your pets to "train" them

I have horses. When one of my horses was new, he tried the nip-the-human-while-they-do-up-the-girth thing, and not because he was sore or had and injury, but because sometimes horses will. Girths aren't all that nice no matter how well fitted I'm sure, and horses can pick up bad habits if you let them, and evidently he had with a previous owner. He was smacked once and told *no*. He never did it again. Generally they don't do bad things, but they are simply too big an animal to allow any bad behaviour. If they repeatedly pull a foot away when you are trying to trim it or some such, they will get a smack along with a *no*. A verbal rebuff is used first, but occasionally that is not enough to do the job. But only if they are just trying it on, they are never reprimanded if the action is a result of fear or being in pain. That is the thing, they don't only act purely out of instinct, they will sometimes do something not out of fear or pain, but because they can, and are testing how much they can get away with.

But mostly they are just spoiled rotten.

The bull gets verbal reprimands, since they work on him. (When I had a dog she only needed verbal reprimands also.) The goat, well, all he might do is eat what he shouldn't, so he just has to be kept out of the garden. Or he head butts people, which is just what goats do. But neither of them bite.

I'd never get a cat. Apparently you get bitten and scratched at random for no good reason, and I am not the sort of person that would enjoy that.


...also, most horses I have known were just assholes. Like 14yr old boys, always trying to do shiat to piss you off, ambling toward that low hanging branch when you're daydreaming, sidestepping to squish you between his rump and the fence when you are cinching the saddle, stepping on and killing the kitten you just spent two weeks hand feeding cause momma cat got et by coyotes.
 
2013-10-14 08:54:50 PM  
Nidiot:
I'd never get a cat. Apparently you get bitten and scratched at random for no good reason, and I am not the sort of person that would enjoy that.

It's how we play.

Cats are awesome, because they're nice to you not because they're obedient and subservient, but because they like you.  Some cats like to be held and petted, I think that's kinda weird.  When I get home, my cat runs and meets me at the door and I pet his head once - this is the "En Garde".  Then we play tag for a few minutes, he tries to grab my hand and I try to tap the top of his head without getting bitten.

The funny thing is, if I just stick my hand out, he'll grab it and bite it, then drop down and look at me as if to say "What, why aren't you playing anymore?"

/he's 20 pounds of awesome
 
2013-10-15 04:32:18 AM  

Ohlookabutterfly: ...also, most horses I have known were just assholes. Like 14yr old boys, always trying to do shiat to piss you off, ambling toward that low hanging branch when you're daydreaming, sidestepping to squish you between his rump and the fence when you are cinching the saddle, stepping on and killing the kitten you just spent two weeks hand feeding cause momma cat got et by coyotes.


Lol. I bet they also had an expression of utter innocence on their face when they did it too.

Also anything squishable certainly does take a huge risk being around horse feet. I lost a chicken that way. Neither horse admitted to doing it. They seldom seem to notice what they put their feet on, but sometimes it is on purpose and they can have some deadly accuracy.

Mister Peejay: Cats are awesome, because they're nice to you not because they're obedient and subservient, but because they like you.


Dogs tend to be nice to you purely because they like you, the being obedient and subservient thing is an added perk that just makes them trainable. Dogs just have friendly natures, and generally simply like human company. Horses are nice to you probably because they've worked out they get food and scratches out of it.
 
2013-10-15 01:17:25 PM  

tuna fingers: Since this happened in Oklahoma, one can assume that everyone cited in the article has the reasoning skills of a 13 year old. Only dipshiats reside in OK.



-- said the person who's dumb enough to live in a desert
 
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