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(Des Moines Register)   Couple that refused to let a gay wedding take place at their private venue turn around and sue the Civil Rights Commission because they keep getting negative calls and emails about their decision   (desmoinesregister.com) divider line 461
    More: Strange, Civil Rights Commission, music venue, Grimes, public accommodations, traders, emails, lesbian rights  
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6886 clicks; posted to Main » on 09 Oct 2013 at 1:13 PM (49 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-09 12:32:19 PM
Good luck with that.
 
2013-10-09 12:37:06 PM
Being a dickbag isn't a protected class.
 
2013-10-09 12:42:11 PM
If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.
 
2013-10-09 12:53:51 PM
Actions meet Consequences.
 
2013-10-09 12:55:55 PM
That same argument has been used forever and it doesn't work. It's especially unpleasant reading historical accounts of people demanding their religious rights to treat black people like shiat.
 
2013-10-09 12:57:02 PM
They should start with a complaint to the Department of Public Health.  It really is a public health concern.  They could catch teh ghey.
 
2013-10-09 01:13:43 PM
FaRk them right in the ass.

You want to be a douchetard? Expect to get called out on it. That is what makes this a great nation.
 
2013-10-09 01:16:19 PM
I don't understand. They claim to not have anything against gay people, yet they refused to allow them to borrow the space for a little while. Being nice to people violates their religion? Sounds like a shiatty religion. It's not as though the gays were asking this couple to be joined in marriage to them.

Bigots gonna bigot.
 
2013-10-09 01:16:24 PM
Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please? Isn't it possible that these calls and emails could be considered harassment?
 
2013-10-09 01:17:05 PM
I'm sorry but.....

assets0.ordienetworks.com
 
2013-10-09 01:17:23 PM
If this works out maybe Reilly Cooper (from the Philly Eagles) can use this to get relief from his hate-mail for using the n-word towards a security guard at a concert.
 
2013-10-09 01:19:08 PM

duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please? Isn't it possible that these calls and emails could be considered harassment?


Well, yeah.

When I worked at BK in college, we kicked people out for being dicks, or eating Subway in the store, or any number of reasons.

We never kicked someone out for being gay, or black, or Indian, or even being an ignorant Yooper.
 
2013-10-09 01:19:35 PM

duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please? Isn't it possible that these calls and emails could be considered harassment?


You would think, but in order to be politically correct you must deny people whom you find offense in some manner that isn't "because your teh gay"
 
2013-10-09 01:20:38 PM

The My Little Pony Killer: I don't understand. They claim to not have anything against gay people, yet they refused to allow them to borrow the space for a little while. Being nice to people violates their religion? Sounds like a shiatty religion. It's not as though the gays were asking this couple to be joined in marriage to them.

Bigots gonna bigot.


well put
 
2013-10-09 01:21:40 PM
duffblue

Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please?
They didn't build that.

You have no rights to your own life, don't even hope you can pretend to own property.
 
2013-10-09 01:21:49 PM

duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please? Isn't it possible that these calls and emails could be considered harassment?


The Civil Rights Commission deals with people being discriminated against because they are a protected class. If people were calling harrasing them because they were black, Muslim, gay, female, disable etc etc, then the Office of Civil Rights would get involved but as I stated earlier:

what_now: Being a dickbag isn't a protected class.

 
2013-10-09 01:22:02 PM
i.imgur.com
about sums it up
 
2013-10-09 01:22:24 PM

Coco LaFemme: If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.


Actually I don't think it is illegal. It's shiatty, but I'm pretty sure one can refuse business to anyone they want for any reason
 
2013-10-09 01:22:43 PM

what_now: Being a dickbag isn't a protected class.


Coco LaFemme: If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.


And we're done.
 
2013-10-09 01:23:12 PM
They probably don't have any case under a civil rights statute, but they might be able to get an injunction against people driving away their business.
 
2013-10-09 01:24:54 PM

duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please? Isn't it possible that these calls and emails could be considered harassment?



It would probably depend if they're from the same person or not.
 
2013-10-09 01:26:33 PM

AverageAmericanGuy: They probably don't have any case under a civil rights statute, but they might be able to get an injunction against people driving away their business.


Why do you hate economic freedom Mao?
 
2013-10-09 01:27:00 PM

Coco LaFemme: If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.


Lest you forget, civil rights belong to everyone. It's their venue, just because you think it's homophobic or bigoted doesn't make you right. They have a case and hopefully it won't have to go to SCOTUS to resolve it. Just as you, they have their own beliefs, they along with you get to have their own beliefs. It's their property, would you care for it if a klansman decided that they wanted to have a rally on your property? Would you be for it, or would you deny them because of their beliefs? It's a two way avenue that you've decided to head out on...you need to learn that it really does work both ways.
 
2013-10-09 01:27:01 PM

I_Am_Weasel: Actions meet Consequences.


When Actions and Consequences are introduced to Personal Responsibility and they become friends, then I'll be shocked.

/Mainly because then the end of days is upon us.
 
2013-10-09 01:28:13 PM
And they made me a hateful person, and I am not

Uh huh.

Odgaard said she has gay friends,

And there we are.

The schadenfreude from watching bigots squirm from the consequences of their hatred and ignorance really is satisfying.
 
2013-10-09 01:28:13 PM

I_Am_Weasel: Actions meet Consequences.



Karma is a biatch, but she believes in equality.
 
2013-10-09 01:28:35 PM

duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please?


If this were true why aren't their any openly 'whites only' establishments in Missouri?
 
2013-10-09 01:28:38 PM

machoprogrammer: Coco LaFemme: If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.

Actually I don't think it is illegal. It's shiatty, but I'm pretty sure one can refuse business to anyone they want for any reason


That's what I'm getting at. Don't they have the right to do it? Even if they are assholes, couldn't the rude phone calls be considered harassment?

Put it in another way:
Business is cool with anyone marrying who they want, they get rude calls and emails from people who disagree. Is this okay with you?
 
2013-10-09 01:29:16 PM

machoprogrammer: Coco LaFemme: If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.

Actually I don't think it is illegal. It's shiatty, but I'm pretty sure one can refuse business to anyone they want for any reason


Actually, no. That's what the civil rights/antidiscrimination laws are all about as I understand it- whether or not it's nice, right, moral, etc, you are free to deny service to someone for any reason that you like AS LONG AS that reason is NOT that they're a member of a 'protected' group or for a reason related to those protections.

Someone smells like they've been sleeping in a dumpster for the last week? Go ahead and boot them. They're waving their dicks around like light sabers? Kick them out (and probably call the police). They're black/hispanic/asian/some culture you don't like/GLBT/Muslim? BZZZT. If you'd accept/provide the same service to a straight christian white male that you're denying them, then you've broken the law.
 
2013-10-09 01:29:46 PM
I'll bet they have gay friends. Do they say they have gay friends?

Odgaard said she has gay friends, and has employed and served gays and lesbians at her business.

I knew they had gay friends.
 
2013-10-09 01:29:52 PM

duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please? Isn't it possible that these calls and emails could be considered harassment?


No, and possibly. But harassment is a criminal matter.
 
2013-10-09 01:30:24 PM

Egoy3k: duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please?

If this were true why aren't their any openly 'whites only' establishments in Missouri?


I'm asking because I don't know. That's how people learn things.
 
2013-10-09 01:31:02 PM

duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please?


I might be wrong on this, but I thought it worked as follows:

They can refuse service to anyone, but the reason has to be right. I can kick a black guy out of my establishment for being rowdy. I cannot kick him out for being black. Nor can I kick him out for being male, or for being gay, or for being a muslim. Those are protected classes.

It's too late to argue that the denial of service was based on something else, since they happily admitted that they denied service base on sexual orientation. I'd say that they're out of luck. But I'm not a lawyer, so don't take my word for it.
 
2013-10-09 01:31:13 PM

what_now: Being a dickbag isn't a protected class.


cough*bankers*cough
 
2013-10-09 01:31:24 PM

machoprogrammer: Coco LaFemme: If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.

Actually I don't think it is illegal. It's shiatty, but I'm pretty sure one can refuse business to anyone they want for any reason


You sure about that? Think of this hypothetical... You're a private restaurant owner, maybe you run a diner. You decide you're going to refuse business to, say, black people. You post a sign to that effect, even. Your justification is that you can refuse business to anyone you want for any reason.
Still think it's going to be legal?
 
2013-10-09 01:32:29 PM

Egoy3k: duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please?

If this were true why aren't their any openly 'whites only' establishments in Missouri?


....wow I suck at english.
 
2013-10-09 01:32:31 PM
Interesting case really. You do have the right to refuse service as a business but since the gay couple isn't suing (drtfa) then their crying about mean phone calls is just butthurt tears.

/unless someone is actually threatening them in the calls, that's d-bag action too
 
2013-10-09 01:32:58 PM
Sue the folks that are harassing you if they are breaking the law. I'm okay with that. But to assume that your being discriminated against because of your views? You've lost the case.
 
2013-10-09 01:33:23 PM

Sin_City_Superhero: duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please?

I might be wrong on this, but I thought it worked as follows:

They can refuse service to anyone, but the reason has to be right. I can kick a black guy out of my establishment for being rowdy. I cannot kick him out for being black. Nor can I kick him out for being male, or for being gay, or for being a muslim. Those are protected classes.

It's too late to argue that the denial of service was based on something else, since they happily admitted that they denied service base on sexual orientation. I'd say that they're out of luck. But I'm not a lawyer, so don't take my word for it.


That makes sense.
 
2013-10-09 01:33:45 PM
I wonder when business owners are going to start waking up and seeing that, as Weasel said, actions meet consequences. We've had Sweet Cakes by Melissa refuse to create a wedding cake for a same-sex marriage, and their shop is now closed. We've had a dude sue the Church of England for their refusal to perform a gay marriage; a restaurant in Manhattan refused to cater a gay wedding because it was "bad feng shui."

You may feel that your right to conduct your business as you see fit is part of being an American, but so is the right to  live without being discriminated against.

I fully expect to see this facility collapse under the weight of hate and aggression that the owners' actions have brought about.
 
2013-10-09 01:34:12 PM

Egoy3k: Egoy3k: duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please?

If this were true why aren't their any openly 'whites only' establishments in Missouri?

....wow I suck at english.


As I understand it - it doesn't count if you catch it yourself before anyone else calls attention to it.
 
2013-10-09 01:34:48 PM

StrangeQ: And they made me a hateful person, and I am not

Uh huh.

Odgaard said she has gay friends,

And there we are.

The schadenfreude from watching bigots squirm from the consequences of their hatred and ignorance really is satisfying.


It's along the lines of people that claim "race baiting".  Race baiting: Oh you mean calling out the racists and them getting mad at you for "tricking" them into showing their true colors.
/I like watching them squirm too.
 
2013-10-09 01:34:49 PM

duffblue: Egoy3k: duffblue: Don't they have the right to refuse business to anyone they please?

If this were true why aren't their any openly 'whites only' establishments in Missouri?

I'm asking because I don't know. That's how people learn things.


OK then I'm glad to help.  I honestly wasn't trying to be a cock about it.
 
2013-10-09 01:35:05 PM

CutBoard: Coco LaFemme: If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.

Lest you forget, civil rights belong to everyone.It's their venue, just because you think it's homophobic or bigoted doesn't make you right. They have a case and hopefully it won't have to go to SCOTUS to resolve it. Just as you, they have their own beliefs, they along with you get to have their own beliefs.


Yes, they get to have their own beliefs. They can go home and practice their hatred and bigotry all they want. If they wanted to start the First National Church of We Hate Blacks, they could.
What they don't get to do is run a place of public accommodation while being bigots. They can't start the First National Bank of We Hate Blacks.

See, it's freedom of belief, not freedom to engage in discriminatory economic activity.
 
2013-10-09 01:35:18 PM
FTFA "I have nothing against gays and lesbians. Nothing," Odgaard said. "I just personally believe that a marriage is between one man and one woman. I don't condemn or judge anybody else for their beliefs and how they live their life."

And yet you did just that when you refused public accommodation for an event.  Fark'n hypocrites.
 
2013-10-09 01:35:31 PM

duffblue: machoprogrammer: Coco LaFemme: If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.

Actually I don't think it is illegal. It's shiatty, but I'm pretty sure one can refuse business to anyone they want for any reason

That's what I'm getting at. Don't they have the right to do it? Even if they are assholes, couldn't the rude phone calls be considered harassment?

Put it in another way:
Business is cool with anyone marrying who they want, they get rude calls and emails from people who disagree. Is this okay with you?


It isn't harassment unless it's the same person calling you over and over, after you've asked them to stop.  And either way, you can't sue the Civil Rights Commission because of it.
 
2013-10-09 01:35:39 PM

machoprogrammer: Coco LaFemme: If you want to be homophobic, that's your right.  It's not against the law.  However, making your homophobia someone else's problem by denying them services you would offer to a heterosexual couple is against the law, and you've got no legal recourse to sue because other people have a problem with your beliefs and attitudes.

If you don't like getting negative attention because you're ignorant twats, don't act like ignorant twats.

Actually I don't think it is illegal. It's shiatty, but I'm pretty sure one can refuse business to anyone they want for any reason


If they had just said, "We're already booked on your preferred date and are unable to accommodate your event," that would have been legal. To refuse to host the event because the couple is gay is illegal.
 
2013-10-09 01:35:42 PM
This would have never happened in  Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, Colorado, Florida,, Hawaii, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana,Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, Missouri ,Montana, Nebraska, Nevada,North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon,Pennsylvania,South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Virginia, West Virginia,Wisconsin, orWyoming.
 
2013-10-09 01:35:43 PM

Best Princess Celestia: what_now: Being a dickbag isn't a protected class.

cough*bankers*cough


Not cool, dude. Not cool. What did cockbags ever do to you to deserve that?
 
2013-10-09 01:36:18 PM
Hey hey, don't you people know that public shaming and making someone feel guilty about their choices in life is why we have religion?!

If you're gonna be a homophobe bigot, then you shouldn't be shocked when someone calls ya out on it.
 
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