If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Fox News)   Good news from Michigan for once: Lawmakers are considering a bill to require a pint a beer to actually contain 16 ounces of beer   (foxnews.com) divider line 59
    More: Hero  
•       •       •

2732 clicks; posted to Main » on 07 Oct 2013 at 9:47 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



59 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2013-10-07 09:06:57 PM  
This kind of standardization has been present in the UK for a while.
Truth in advertising pretty much.
I'm all for it. We label food products in other places, why don't we have oz labeling requirements on our served beverages?

Weights and measures
BEER, LAGER AND CIDER
Except when mixed with other drinks, these products can only be sold draught in the following quantities:
1/3 pint
1/2 pint
2/3 pint
multiples of 1/2 pint

If you use glasses, every glass must be stamped with either the 'crown mark and number' or the new 'CE and M marking'. (Examples of the latter new marks required on new glasses first marketed after 30 October 2006 are shown at the end of this leaflet. The 'M06' box may be different as it reflects the year of manufacture - in the illustration given M06 is 2006 - M07 would be 2007, etc.) You will find that both types of marking will appear in circulation for some time as new stocks merge with old. If you use meters, glasses do not need to be stamped, but the meters must be stamped, the consumer must be able to see the glass being filled, and you must not fill the glass before it has been ordered.

SPIRITS
Unless sold in cocktails of three or more drinks, these products may only be sold in the following quantities:
25ml
35ml, or
multiples of these quantities

If you have switched to 35ml measures, the 25ml thimbles must be removed from the bar to avoid mistakes. Also, If you use 35ml measures for single shots, you cannot use 50ml for doubles. The correct double would be 2 x 35ml.

Old imperial measures (such as 1/6 gill) cannot be used for the sale of any spirits.

A notice, which is easy for consumers to read, must make it clear which quantity applies - for example:  'Gin, rum, whisky and vodka are sold on these premises in quantities of 25ml and multiples thereof'.

The same quantity must apply in all the bars of your pub, restaurant, or cafe - in other words, 25ml and 35ml specified quantities must not be sold at the same premises.

Whatever you use to measure gin, rum, whisky or vodka (optics, thimbles etc), they must be stamped and be where consumers can see them being used. Bottle top pourers are not usually stamped, and they should only be used by pouring them into a thimble before putting the drink into a glass for the consumer.

www.metricviews.org.uk
 
2013-10-07 09:50:06 PM  
We really need another law for this.
 
2013-10-07 09:51:13 PM  
Yes, but the travesty is that Natural Light, Miller Light, and Coors Silver Bullet are still considered beer.
 
2013-10-07 09:52:44 PM  
Now if only we can get restaurants and bars to serve the quantity of alcohol in their mixed drinks that they should.  I'm sick of weak margaritas.
 
2013-10-07 09:56:47 PM  
For beer it should be 20. Imperial and all that
 
2013-10-07 09:57:55 PM  
I don't get this.  Why should beer/liquor fall under any magical measurement system separate from anything that is sold at the grocery store?

And why is beer being called liquor?
 
2013-10-07 09:59:29 PM  
A pint 'of' beer, you illiterate moron.
 
2013-10-07 10:01:34 PM  
Hobbits of Michigan rejoice!
 
2013-10-07 10:02:36 PM  
It comes in pints??
 
2013-10-07 10:03:51 PM  

AverageAmericanGuy: A pint 'of' beer, you illiterate moron.


Or go all the way with it:
Good news a Michigan a once: Lawmakers are considering a bill to require a pint a beer to actually contain 16 ounces a beer
 
2013-10-07 10:07:15 PM  

Lachwen: It comes in pints??


Exactly.  Most chains will sell you a tall (20oz?) or a regular (12oz?).  Most nicer beer places will list price, proof, and volume.

/I got it
 
2013-10-07 10:16:00 PM  
There's a new brewpub near my house.  It has a big chalkboard, advertising "16 oz pints" of beer.  They use 16-oz glasses, with a finger of head and finger of air, so you get 14oz of beer.  It's a farking brewpub.  There's no shipping costs.  It's not a city club where I know I'm going to get ripped off.  I don't go there anymore.
 
2013-10-07 10:19:19 PM  

Sugarbombs: Why should beer/liquor fall under any magical measurement system separate from anything that is sold at the grocery store?


Proponents of ripping off patrons argue that the term "pint" isn't a measurement, but a type of container; a "pint of beer" is like a "cup of coffee" or "glass of milk," which vendors should be able to make any size they want. Kind of like Subway's argument that a footlong (tm) sub is a type of sandwich, not its length. Perhaps trademarking "pint" would be allow a loophole to continue underpouring beer?
 
2013-10-07 10:21:47 PM  

Lachwen: It comes in pints??


What's grey and comes in quarts?
 
2013-10-07 10:22:12 PM  

Sugarbombs: I don't get this.  Why should beer/liquor fall under any magical measurement system separate from anything that is sold at the grocery store?

And why is beer being called liquor?


I think this falls under a bigger scheme being pulled by several different serving establishments.  Bars aren't the only businesses advertising one measurement than what is delivered, such as the Subway debacle a couple months back.  If possible, they should expand this bill to include all served food measurements being advertised.  That includes the supposed quarter pounder patties that don't weigh near 4 ounces when served.  As for measurements at the grocery store, when was the last time you bought a half gallon of ice cream.  It wasn't recent, because they don't make a 64 oz tub anymore.  Most stores don't carry a full gallon bucket either, but at least they don't tell you it's a gallon.

/beer groups in with liquor because of the Michigan Liquor Control Commission that handles all alcohol related rules in the state.
 
2013-10-07 10:27:00 PM  

KidneyStone: For beer it should be 20. Imperial and all that


Michigan is part of an empire?
 
2013-10-07 10:27:27 PM  
A pint is a unit of.measure, why did this need to be dictated? Imagine how pissed people would be if ther gallon of gas only had 120 oz. or so?
 
2013-10-07 10:29:25 PM  

foo monkey: There's a new brewpub near my house.  It has a big chalkboard, advertising "16 oz pints" of beer.  They use 16-oz glasses, with a finger of head and finger of air, so you get 14oz of beer.


Not even. Pint glasses are tapered so a finger off the top is a lot more than a finger off the bottom.

I just did a little test, filling up a pint glass and pouring off a finger. As I have big hands, I used my pinky. A pinky off the top of a pint glass is 13 ounces. Two pinkies off the top is 10½ ounces.

See also: http://www.thebeergauge.com/
 
2013-10-07 10:31:45 PM  

Lachwen: It comes in pints??


Like elephants
 
2013-10-07 10:42:25 PM  
I know from my mathy weed days that 16oz is a pound.
 
2013-10-07 10:46:53 PM  

Lachwen: It comes in pints??


I'm getting one.
 
2013-10-07 10:50:09 PM  

T Baggins: Sugarbombs: Why should beer/liquor fall under any magical measurement system separate from anything that is sold at the grocery store?

Proponents of ripping off patrons argue that the term "pint" isn't a measurement, but a type of container; a "pint of beer" is like a "cup of coffee" or "glass of milk," which vendors should be able to make any size they want. Kind of like Subway's argument that a footlong (tm) sub is a type of sandwich, not its length. Perhaps trademarking "pint" would be allow a loophole to continue underpouring beer?


lack of warmth: Sugarbombs: I don't get this.  Why should beer/liquor fall under any magical measurement system separate from anything that is sold at the grocery store?

And why is beer being called liquor?

I think this falls under a bigger scheme being pulled by several different serving establishments.  Bars aren't the only businesses advertising one measurement than what is delivered, such as the Subway debacle a couple months back.  If possible, they should expand this bill to include all served food measurements being advertised.  That includes the supposed quarter pounder patties that don't weigh near 4 ounces when served.  As for measurements at the grocery store, when was the last time you bought a half gallon of ice cream.  It wasn't recent, because they don't make a 64 oz tub anymore.  Most stores don't carry a full gallon bucket either, but at least they don't tell you it's a gallon.

/beer groups in with liquor because of the Michigan Liquor Control Commission that handles all alcohol related rules in the state.


Local Blue Bell carries a half gal for republican true-to-ANSI reasons, and Ben & Jerry's carries a true pint for democratic true-to-ANSI reasons.  Or parties and so forth and treason and all that.

Quarter pound burgers advertise the weight before being cooked, but that's different.  If Mcdonald's wants to pump up water volume before cooking, that's its problem.  But truth be told their recent quarter pounders are pretty dry.

Weight law of the land is law of the land, though.
 
2013-10-07 10:50:24 PM  

Kygz: A pint is a unit of.measure, why did this need to be dictated? Imagine how pissed people would be if ther gallon of gas only had 120 oz. or so?


MI already has laws and inspections for proper gasoline measuring.  It is handled by MDARD, MI Department of Agricultural & Rural Development under MI act 283 of 1964.  So, really the same act 283 could cover this same issue, but I guess they want to tie it to the liquor licensing because MLCC may have more enforcers and financial resources than MDARD to ensure a full pour.  MDARD probably has its hands too full holding all those gas cans.

/MDARD does have a hard time checking all the gas stations, since once at the state fair, MDARD had a booth asking folks to report short fueling and were giving away 1 gallon cans.
 
2013-10-07 10:52:28 PM  

Lachwen: It comes in pints??


You make a LOTR joke and everyone acts like you're trolling...
 
2013-10-07 11:01:45 PM  
Can we also get a law saying that bags of chips can't be sold half empty?
 
2013-10-07 11:07:31 PM  

This Looks Fun: Lachwen: It comes in pints??

You make a LOTR joke and everyone acts like you're trolling...


Yeah, but "hobbiting" doesn't have a good ring to it.
 
2013-10-07 11:23:52 PM  
I support this.

/drinking Short's
//Huma LL
 
2013-10-07 11:30:49 PM  
The tiny American pint at 16-ounces is already 4-ounces short of being a real pint so to be short changing on the 16-ounce pour is a crime. I was dismayed when I ordered a pint last year in San Diego only to be handed the same glass I pour my 12-ounce bottles into. I had to confirm with the server that this was in fact their pint and then did some looking online and realized our American brethren had been seriously screwed over in the weights and measures department (on top of not being metric).
 
2013-10-07 11:31:38 PM  
I once had a customer loss his farking crap over his beer glass being 14.5 oz instead of a proper pint. The thing is we never claimed it was a pint. Our draught beers were one size.

The manager came over and made him chill the fark down and comped him, really just to shut him up.

//Bennigan's in MI
//Ten years ago
 
2013-10-07 11:42:19 PM  

Nezorf: This kind of standardization has been present in the UK for a while.
Truth in advertising pretty much.
I'm all for it. We label food products in other places, why don't we have oz labeling requirements on our served beverages?


Truth in advertising, yes.  However, I think your rules are going too far.  As far as I'm concerned any quantity should be acceptable, it just should be labeled as such.
 
2013-10-07 11:52:56 PM  

Lekneh: I once had a customer loss his farking crap over his beer glass being 14.5 oz instead of a proper pint. The thing is we never claimed it was a pint. Our draught beers were one size.

The manager came over and made him chill the fark down and comped him, really just to shut him up.

//Bennigan's in MI
//Ten years ago


If you don't claim it's a real pint, I don't care.

I personally l like the system Corner in Ypsi and Wolverine in Ann Arbor (and, last I visited, Founders in GR) have: chalkboard, beers, % alcohol, and prices for different ounce sizes listed.  Easy and informative.

Sometimes overly so (found out a newer beer the SO and I picked up in six pack form from the store a week earlier was damn close to 10%. ... on the plus side, it wasn't that our tolerance was crashing, so that was nice.
 
2013-10-08 12:07:40 AM  
You don't have standardised units of measure already? Next thing you will tell me you aren't metricized either...
 
2013-10-08 12:18:42 AM  

lack of warmth: As for measurements at the grocery store, when was the last time you bought a half gallon of ice cream.


Three days ago. Publix's store brand ice cream (much better than Breyer's IMO) is sold in real half-gallon containers, as is Blue Bell.  Just because Walmart doesn't offer a full half gallon doesn't mean they don't exist anymore.
 
2013-10-08 12:20:10 AM  
Subby's headline and spelling..  So basically, a pint is required to have a beer before finally containing 16 ounces.  How does one get a pint drunk anyway.
 
2013-10-08 12:38:41 AM  
Don't states already have a "Weights and Measures" type of department, I'm guessing mostly used for things like scales at transportation weight stations and grain silos.  Maybe for gas station pumps as well, since gas can have a per-gallon state tax it's in the State's interest to make sure a gallon is a gallon.  States have ABC (or similar) departments who regulate the boozey stuff, so why isn't this already a thing?

No snark, just wondering about another of the weird alcohol laws we have because states get to be all 10th Amendmenty on alcohol.
 
2013-10-08 12:55:45 AM  

max_pooper: Lachwen: It comes in pints??

What's grey and comes in quarts?


My grandpa.
 
2013-10-08 01:00:04 AM  
Can I get 0.0623 cubic smoots of your best lager?
 
2013-10-08 01:10:58 AM  

Science_Guy_3.14159: Can I get 0.0623 cubic smoots of your best lager?


No. A monkey poured coffee in my smoots.
 
2013-10-08 01:17:39 AM  

Science_Guy_3.14159: Can I get 0.0623 cubic smoots of your best lager?


Well, you're just dealing in smoots, not Hawley-Smoots.  Them things is much more valuable.  Unless you import them.
 
2013-10-08 02:17:20 AM  

zzrhardy: You don't have standardised units of measure already? Next thing you will tell me you aren't metricized either...


Of course we do.  A pint is 16 ounces.  But cheap-ass bar owners put less than 16 ounces of beer into the glass, claiming that when someone orders a "pint" they're requesting a style of glassware, not a liquid measure.  Which is just a stupid claim on its face anyway; a pint glass is called a pint glass because it's supposed to hold a pint.  But don't try convincing the stingy bar owners.

/Pedant, awaaaaaayy!
 
2013-10-08 03:21:38 AM  

Loren: Nezorf: This kind of standardization has been present in the UK for a while.
Truth in advertising pretty much.
I'm all for it. We label food products in other places, why don't we have oz labeling requirements on our served beverages?

Truth in advertising, yes.  However, I think your rules are going too far.  As far as I'm concerned any quantity should be acceptable, it just should be labeled as such.


So, what you're saying is that if someone orders a pint of beer at a bar, you don't care whether they actually get a pint, as long as the bar advertises somewhere that it's pints are 12oz.

It's attitudes like yours that got Britain to get all specific about weights and measures in the first place.
 
2013-10-08 03:24:23 AM  

AverageAmericanGuy: A pint 'of' beer, you illiterate moron.


Ha! I met couple americans who talked like that. I could care less. Let are kids walk!
 
2013-10-08 04:22:36 AM  

KidneyStone: For beer it should be 20. Imperial and all that


sat1va: The tiny American pint at 16-ounces is already 4-ounces short of being a real pint so to be short changing on the 16-ounce pour is a crime. I was dismayed when I ordered a pint last year in San Diego only to be handed the same glass I pour my 12-ounce bottles into. I had to confirm with the server that this was in fact their pint and then did some looking online and realized our American brethren had been seriously screwed over in the weights and measures department (on top of not being metric).


An Imperial pint is actually only 19 American oz, because the Imperial and American systems even have different size ounces.

/But don't tell my favorite dive bar.
 
2013-10-08 04:27:18 AM  
So, how do you guys even know how much you're getting?  Is it just sold by the glass or what?

1 Pint (UK) - 568ml - 20oz - 19.2 US oz
1 Pint (US) - 473ml - 16.65oz - 16 US oz
 
2013-10-08 05:10:35 AM  

Feed_The_Walrus: So, how do you guys even know how much you're getting?  Is it just sold by the glass or what?

1 Pint (UK) - 568ml - 20oz - 19.2 US oz
1 Pint (US) - 473ml - 16.65oz - 16 US oz


Meanwhile, in Socialist Sweden (and pretty much everywhere apart from UK/US), the half litre (500ml) is the standard 'large' beer measure, with 300ml being a small.

The only real exception being ex-pat bars, that sometimes sell in UK pint glasses, as to make brits feel more at 'home', simply adjusting their prices to account for the difference.
 
2013-10-08 06:04:00 AM  

sat1va: The tiny American pint at 16-ounces is already 4-ounces short of being a real pint so to be short changing on the 16-ounce pour is a crime. I was dismayed when I ordered a pint last year in San Diego only to be handed the same glass I pour my 12-ounce bottles into. I had to confirm with the server that this was in fact their pint and then did some looking online and realized our American brethren had been seriously screwed over in the weights and measures department (on top of not being metric).


For the better part of my first 2 years in England, I was amazed how drunk I got after just 2-3 beers. It dawned on me that all pints in the UK are 20 ounces. I had previously seen British pubs in the US boasting about their. 20 ounce "imperial pints" and thought it was just a marketing gimmick.
 
2013-10-08 07:46:53 AM  

cgremlin: lack of warmth: As for measurements at the grocery store, when was the last time you bought a half gallon of ice cream.

Three days ago. Publix's store brand ice cream (much better than Breyer's IMO) is sold in real half-gallon containers, as is Blue Bell.  Just because Walmart doesn't offer a full half gallon doesn't mean they don't exist anymore.


Watch the attitude, I shop at Kroger.  There really is no need for walmart insults.  At least Kroger sells the really good local brand Hudsonville, but their cartons are short of 64 oz.  They have the bigger carton of the ice cream section, but is only about 60 oz.  Breyer's is the worst for size vs price, selling nearly as high as Hudsonville yet B's gives you only 48 oz.

/wow, throwing out a walmart insult, you putz
//also, making sure you buy no less than a half gallon, you sound fat
///Hudsonville rocks, if you are willing to pay non generic prices to get some MI special flavors and not get a full half gallon
////we don't have a Publix, and I really don't care
 
2013-10-08 08:20:52 AM  
If 13 is a baker's dozen, will 17 now be a brewer's pint?
 
2013-10-08 09:13:35 AM  
I don't understand. I thought you all had guns?
 
2013-10-08 09:18:38 AM  
People in the comments on TFA are all butthurt about it being a waste of government resources, but in my opinion this is actually the sort of thing government is supposed to do - ensure a free and fair marketplace so people can honestly compete, along with enforcing truth in advertising.

Besides, I doubt this legislation tied up lawmakers for weeks with filibusters and debates, anyway.
 
2013-10-08 09:33:11 AM  
It's pretty simple. The glasses get a mark on the side that says how much beer is in there and everyone pours to the line.
 
2013-10-08 09:57:24 AM  

Ouze: People in the comments on TFA are all butthurt about it being a waste of government resources, but in my opinion this is actually the sort of thing government is supposed to do - ensure a free and fair marketplace so people can honestly compete, along with enforcing truth in advertising.

Besides, I doubt this legislation tied up lawmakers for weeks with filibusters and debates, anyway.


Which is one of the things I really like about ordering a beer in Europe. The glass has a line on it. I can see it, the bartender can see it, and we both know that he's selling me what I'm paying for.

This whole 'a pint is a style not a measurement' thing is bullshiat.
 
2013-10-08 10:25:53 AM  

Foxxinnia: Can we also get a law saying that bags of chips can't be sold half empty?


"....contents may have settled during shipping..."
 
2013-10-08 11:04:32 AM  

uttertosh: So, what you're saying is that if someone orders a pint of beer at a bar, you don't care whether they actually get a pint, as long as the bar advertises somewhere that it's pints are 12oz.

It's attitudes like yours that got Britain to get all specific about weights and measures in the first place.


No.  I do care.  I have no problem with a 12oz beer but if you sell that as a pint you should get busted.

heili skrimsli: Which is one of the things I really like about ordering a beer in Europe. The glass has a line on it. I can see it, the bartender can see it, and we both know that he's selling me what I'm paying for.


That sounds like a good way to handle it.
 
2013-10-08 12:49:48 PM  

Bruxellensis: Foxxinnia: Can we also get a law saying that bags of chips can't be sold half empty?

"....contents may have settled during shipping..."


"people don't like bags full of chip crumbs"

Those bags have to go through a lot of abuse from factory to shelf, the empty air space is to protect the chips.
 
2013-10-08 01:10:21 PM  

IRQ12: Bruxellensis: Foxxinnia: Can we also get a law saying that bags of chips can't be sold half empty?

"....contents may have settled during shipping..."

"people don't like bags full of chip crumbs"

Those bags have to go through a lot of abuse from factory to shelf, the empty air space is to protect the chips.


Funny I couldn't find that written anywhere on the bag.
 
2013-10-08 01:28:57 PM  
Right.  Next they'll expect a footlong hotdog to measure 12 inches.
 
2013-10-08 01:40:55 PM  

jimpoz: foo monkey: There's a new brewpub near my house.  It has a big chalkboard, advertising "16 oz pints" of beer.  They use 16-oz glasses, with a finger of head and finger of air, so you get 14oz of beer.

Not even. Pint glasses are tapered so a finger off the top is a lot more than a finger off the bottom.

I just did a little test, filling up a pint glass and pouring off a finger. As I have big hands, I used my pinky. A pinky off the top of a pint glass is 13 ounces. Two pinkies off the top is 10½ ounces.

See also: http://www.thebeergauge.com/


I remember that thing, we had a thread on it

As a Michigan resident, I can get behind this.  If I order a pint, I want to get a full pint of beer.  As others have mentioned up-thread, using the system they have in Europe of putting official fill lines on the glasses looks like a good way to implement the law if it's passed.  You either use the state approved glassware or you stop calling what you're selling pints.
 
2013-10-08 08:52:35 PM  
uttertosh: Feed_The_Walrus: So, how do you guys even know how much you're getting?  Is it just sold by the glass or what?

1 Pint (UK) - 568ml - 20oz - 19.2 US oz
1 Pint (US) - 473ml - 16.65oz - 16 US oz

Meanwhile, in Socialist Sweden (and pretty much everywhere apart from UK/US), the half litre (500ml) is the standard 'large' beer measure, with 300ml being a small.



And in Germany half litre is a small and Litres is a regular.
 
Displayed 59 of 59 comments

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report