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(Deadline)   Downton Abbey ratings take a downturn in its third week due to the premiere of Homeland, of all things   (deadline.com) divider line 52
    More: Followup, Downton Abbey, Downton, homeland, premieres, period drama  
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1299 clicks; posted to Entertainment » on 07 Oct 2013 at 9:42 AM (46 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-07 09:13:10 AM
Meanwhile, Down-town Abby, the prostitute who dresses like a nun, is still open for business.
 
2013-10-07 09:56:55 AM
Maybe killing off a main character during a "Holiday" special wasn't a good idea?

`Merry Christmas, every-AAAAAAAAAAH!!!' *CRASH*
 
2013-10-07 10:10:45 AM
Never saw Homeland and barely know it exists. I can't even tell you what channel it's on. Downton Abbey, OTOH, I buy it by the season on Amazon Video and my wife makes a nice meal in the slow cooker and we have a good time watching it together.
 
2013-10-07 10:10:52 AM

oldfarthenry: Maybe killing off a main character during a "Holiday" special wasn't a good idea?

`Merry Christmas, every-AAAAAAAAAAH!!!' *CRASH*


As I recall that actor wasn't going to be coming back anyway due to not wanting to do it anymore. It isn't like Bewitched where you can simply toss in a new Darren and act like nothing has happened.
 
2013-10-07 10:16:00 AM

oldfarthenry: Maybe killing off a main character during a "Holiday" special wasn't a good idea?

`Merry Christmas, every-AAAAAAAAAAH!!!' *CRASH*


*spoiler for Americans or the torrent-phobic*

And then in the first episode this season they also "killed" off one of the lead downstairs staff as well in an awkwardly written dialogue:

"Where's O'Brien?"

"Oh she left this morning for India and didn't tell anyone that she was planning to quit"
 
kth
2013-10-07 10:23:07 AM

oldfarthenry: Maybe killing off a main character during a "Holiday" special wasn't a good idea?

`Merry Christmas, every-AAAAAAAAAAH!!!' *CRASH*


My mom was outraged. Outraged I tell you.

it gave me a little insight to my rant at the end of Battlestar Galactica. The apple apparently did not fall far from the tree.
 
2013-10-07 10:24:26 AM

Tax Boy: oldfarthenry: Maybe killing off a main character during a "Holiday" special wasn't a good idea?

`Merry Christmas, every-AAAAAAAAAAH!!!' *CRASH*

*spoiler for Americans or the torrent-phobic*

And then in the first episode this season they also "killed" off one of the lead downstairs staff as well in an awkwardly written dialogue:

"Where's O'Brien?"

"Oh she left this morning for India and didn't tell anyone that she was planning to quit"


WTF???

Well, I suppose I'm OK with that - they were working too hard to make both her and Thomas change their ways and stop being totally evil, and it was killing both characters.
 
2013-10-07 10:30:19 AM

Rude Turnip: Never saw Homeland and barely know it exists. I can't even tell you what channel it's on. Downton Abbey, OTOH, I buy it by the season on Amazon Video and my wife makes a nice meal in the slow cooker and we have a good time watching it together.


Unless you pay for Showtime you can't watch Homeland anyway. Season 1 of homeland is the best spy tv show around and up there with The Sandbaggers on the all time list.
 
2013-10-07 10:33:25 AM
Wait til you poor farkers see the third episode of season 4. Outrage I tell you!!!
 
2013-10-07 10:35:45 AM

Radioactive Ass: oldfarthenry: Maybe killing off a main character during a "Holiday" special wasn't a good idea?

`Merry Christmas, every-AAAAAAAAAAH!!!' *CRASH*

As I recall that actor wasn't going to be coming back anyway due to not wanting to do it anymore. It isn't like Bewitched where you can simply toss in a new Darren and act like nothing has happened.


I bet he asked for more money, and they told him to take a hike. Probably a shot across to the bow to the rest of the cast in case they were planning on doing the same.
 
2013-10-07 10:47:50 AM
The show seems to be in a death spiral. In addition to characters who have been killed off or left those who are still on the show are being put through the mill. Hell, Mosley is working for the village laying tar macadam!
 
2013-10-07 10:48:09 AM
Is Saul a double agent?
 
2013-10-07 10:52:48 AM

thornhill: I bet he asked for more money, and they told him to take a hike. Probably a shot across to the bow to the rest of the cast in case they were planning on doing the same.


Actually no. He just didn't want to do that show anymore. At least everything that I've read on it says so, no mention of contract negotiations. Maybe he just didn't want to get typecast in that sort of role. There are plenty of actors out there that have had that problem.
 
2013-10-07 11:09:12 AM

Dwight_Yeast: The show seems to be in a death spiral. In addition to characters who have been killed off or left those who are still on the show are being put through the mill. Hell, Mosley is working for the village laying tar macadam!


I think the show needs to end soon anyway. It started out focusing on the end of a particular era and lifestyle in Britain. If it loses that focus, it's just a soap opera in period clothing. At the very least, they should not be afraid to radically alter the upstairs-downstairs dynamic to reflect the changes in society, etc.
 
2013-10-07 11:10:17 AM

Radioactive Ass: thornhill: I bet he asked for more money, and they told him to take a hike. Probably a shot across to the bow to the rest of the cast in case they were planning on doing the same.

Actually no. He just didn't want to do that show anymore. At least everything that I've read on it says so, no mention of contract negotiations. Maybe he just didn't want to get typecast in that sort of role. There are plenty of actors out there that have had that problem.


What's more likely:

A) To help his career, he left one of the most popular TV shows which has a relatively minimal time commitment because there are so few episodes per season;

or

B) He said he'd leave the show unless they paid him more, and they said leave.

This is show business -- it's all about the money.
 
2013-10-07 11:13:39 AM
Evidently the showrunners have miscalculated the delaying of showing the wizards actually using their powers for so long.
 
2013-10-07 11:18:58 AM

someonelse: Dwight_Yeast: The show seems to be in a death spiral. In addition to characters who have been killed off or left those who are still on the show are being put through the mill. Hell, Mosley is working for the village laying tar macadam!

I think the show needs to end soon anyway. It started out focusing on the end of a particular era and lifestyle in Britain. If it loses that focus, it's just a soap opera in period clothing. At the very least, they should not be afraid to radically alter the upstairs-downstairs dynamic to reflect the changes in society, etc.


The other problem is that they like to make huge jumps forward in time. The show began in 1912, the latest season began in 1922, but the actors have only aged 4 years. I suspect the show wants to end in 1939, but that means a lot of people are going to need to be dead from old age (or wearing a ton of makeup).
 
2013-10-07 11:20:27 AM

oldfarthenry: Maybe killing off a main character during a "Holiday" special wasn't a good idea?

`Merry Christmas, every-AAAAAAAAAAH!!!' *CRASH*


Worked for Doctor Who.
 
2013-10-07 11:22:22 AM

Tax Boy: oldfarthenry: Maybe killing off a main character during a "Holiday" special wasn't a good idea?

`Merry Christmas, every-AAAAAAAAAAH!!!' *CRASH*

*spoiler for Americans or the torrent-phobic*

And then in the first episode this season they also "killed" off one of the lead downstairs staff as well in an awkwardly written dialogue:

"Where's O'Brien?"

"Oh she left this morning for India and didn't tell anyone that she was planning to quit"


SERIOUSLY!?! Ugh, that's retareded. I mean, I get why they had to kill Matthew. It'd be darn near impossible to write him off the show without killing him, since how would they have his character leave without taking his wife and kid with him?

But I think I might just stop watching. It's gotten REALLY soap-opera-y and last season was pretty crappy. I did appreciate them making Thomas more sympathetic; he's now more than just a caricature.
 
2013-10-07 11:26:40 AM

taxandspend: Tax Boy: oldfarthenry: Maybe killing off a main character during a "Holiday" special wasn't a good idea?

`Merry Christmas, every-AAAAAAAAAAH!!!' *CRASH*

*spoiler for Americans or the torrent-phobic*

And then in the first episode this season they also "killed" off one of the lead downstairs staff as well in an awkwardly written dialogue:

"Where's O'Brien?"

"Oh she left this morning for India and didn't tell anyone that she was planning to quit"

Awkwardly written, but it's the same situation. She wanted a break from the show just like Mr. Crawley. Only difference she might come back to the show.


At least they set up O'Brien's leaving in the Scotland special so it wasn't a surprise to the viewers. They had her wistfully talking about travel after learning that the family they were visiting were going to India, the other Lady's maid didn't want to leave Scotland, and the Lady of the House liked how O'Brien did her hair.

Last night was a whole different story. After a somewhat slow start, the drama has been set off with a bang and I am not sure I like the direction it is going. Potential for too many soap cliche's. At least they haven't SORAS'ed the kids.
 
2013-10-07 11:41:22 AM

catmandu: Last night was a whole different story. After a somewhat slow start, the drama has been set off with a bang and I am not sure I like the direction it is going. Potential for too many soap cliche's.


Next week:

ZOMG!!! Blah people jazz dancing!
 
2013-10-07 11:48:32 AM
I'm sure there were plenty of viewings of Downton Abbey on DVRs right after Homeland ended.
 
2013-10-07 11:51:28 AM

Rude Turnip: Never saw Homeland and barely know it exists. I can't even tell you what channel it's on. Downton Abbey, OTOH, I buy it by the season on Amazon Video and my wife makes a nice meal in the slow cooker and we have a good time watching it together.


Well if that's not the gayest thing I've ever heard...
 
2013-10-07 11:51:40 AM

catmandu: Last night was a whole different story. After a somewhat slow start, the drama has been set off with a bang and I am not sure I like the direction it is going. Potential for too many soap cliche's. At least they haven't SORAS'ed the kids.


Last night on a very special episode of Downton Abbey, some seriously exploitative bullshiat took place.
 
2013-10-07 11:52:18 AM
Carth:
Unless you pay for Showtime you can't watch Homeland anyway.

LOL!  Oh, you're serious.  Huh.
 
2013-10-07 12:05:58 PM
I'm almost two years behind on this show, so I'm not getting a kick out of these replies.
 
2013-10-07 12:31:19 PM

someonelse: Dwight_Yeast: The show seems to be in a death spiral. In addition to characters who have been killed off or left those who are still on the show are being put through the mill. Hell, Mosley is working for the village laying tar macadam!

I think the show needs to end soon anyway. It started out focusing on the end of a particular era and lifestyle in Britain. If it loses that focus, it's just a soap opera in period clothing. At the very least, they should not be afraid to radically alter the upstairs-downstairs dynamic to reflect the changes in society, etc.


I've read a number of things Julian Fellows has written (online and elsewhere) and he's totally obsessed by the inter-war period, has been all his life.  And while it was something of a golden age for country house living, it also saw the end of the era, and not because of the Second World War.  The death tax hurt, as did the end of the subsidies, but (and this is something that Fellows, who's a Tory, likely won't address) the First World War showed the working class of the UK that there were other ways to make money than in service.  Both men and women could work factory jobs for shorter hours and greater pay than they got at a large country house.  And as the pool of workers dried up, those who owned the big houses refused to increase the wages they offered.  So by the time WWII came, there were few people left in service.

The death of Matthew seemed shocking and out of place in the holiday special, but those sorts of deaths were common in his class in that era: I was reading something recently about  family who basically lost their estate because the young heir got himself killed in a plane crash (he was piloting) and there had been no preparations for the death duties, so the estate ended up broke.

Honestly one of the ends of the show may be having the Abbey pulled down.  Several hundred country houses were demolished in 1938 and 1939 to avoid death duties, and more in 1954.  Something like five hundred houses in all.
 
2013-10-07 12:50:29 PM
Last night on a very special episode of Downton Abbey, some seriously exploitative bullshiat took place.

Ya know, I watch TV for enjoyment, NOT to be tramatized. I read what happened, and it makes me want to skip the series when it comes to the US. I want HAPPY. I want FULFILLING. I want INSPIRATION. I don't want to be bummed out. Yet these TV writers seem to take a perverse interest in upsetting people FOR ART!!
 
2013-10-07 12:56:44 PM
The first season was really good, and the second season took a nice turn for the unexpected. But I came away from the holiday special for season 2 feeling like the show had ended (except for Mr. Bates, of course.)

Then the third season started with more manufactured drama about money problems, and I just felt like, "meh, I don't care where this is going enough to keep up with it." Hearing the big twist from the third season holiday special pretty much killed my interest in the show.
 
2013-10-07 01:20:12 PM
After all they've been through, I hope Anna and Bates have some happy, trouble-free time together this season.
 
2013-10-07 01:22:04 PM

thornhill: The other problem is that they like to make huge jumps forward in time.


I used to think it was interesting when shows did this, but now I usually think it's just lazy writing.
 
2013-10-07 01:27:14 PM

Dwight_Yeast: I've read a number of things Julian Fellows has written (online and elsewhere) and he's totally obsessed by the inter-war period, has been all his life. And while it was something of a golden age for country house living, it also saw the end of the era, and not because of the Second World War. The death tax hurt, as did the end of the subsidies, but (and this is something that Fellows, who's a Tory, likely won't address) the First World War showed the working class of the UK that there were other ways to make money than in service. Both men and women could work factory jobs for shorter hours and greater pay than they got at a large country house. And as the pool of workers dried up, those who owned the big houses refused to increase the wages they offered. So by the time WWII came, there were few people left in service.


That aspect is a lot more interesting than "Lord Grantham feels bored and marginalized," or "Which rich guy will look after Lady Mary?"
 
2013-10-07 01:29:54 PM

mark12A: Last night on a very special episode of Downton Abbey, some seriously exploitative bullshiat took place.

Ya know, I watch TV for enjoyment, NOT to be tramatized. I read what happened, and it makes me want to skip the series when it comes to the US. I want HAPPY. I want FULFILLING. I want INSPIRATION. I don't want to be bummed out. Yet these TV writers seem to take a perverse interest in upsetting people FOR ART RATINGS!!


FTFY.  That's what drove me away.  I loved the first season's examination of what the new era means for the old ways, the interesting characters, and of course the class interactions (Carson is the real lord of that manor).  By the end of the third season, I had come to believe that the writers had run out of ideas and were now operating on the soap opera "Well how can we fark up these people this time? Because that's what people really want to see" model.  Not even going to watch the fourth season.
 
2013-10-07 01:29:57 PM

mark12A: Last night on a very special episode of Downton Abbey, some seriously exploitative bullshiat took place.

Ya know, I watch TV for enjoyment, NOT to be tramatized. I read what happened, and it makes me want to skip the series when it comes to the US. I want HAPPY. I want FULFILLING. I want INSPIRATION. I don't want to be bummed out. Yet these TV writers seem to take a perverse interest in upsetting people FOR ART!!


I am perfectly ok with being bummed out, but there has to be an artistic purpose to it.  What is the story justification for having a random character show up and do something horrible and then leave?  What are we going to learn about the characters as a result of this event that necessitated it?  I am not going to deny the brilliance of the performance or the fact that such an event can and does happen all the time, but Fellowes' rationale is lost on me.
 
2013-10-07 01:47:15 PM

Stile4aly: mark12A: Last night on a very special episode of Downton Abbey, some seriously exploitative bullshiat took place.

Ya know, I watch TV for enjoyment, NOT to be tramatized. I read what happened, and it makes me want to skip the series when it comes to the US. I want HAPPY. I want FULFILLING. I want INSPIRATION. I don't want to be bummed out. Yet these TV writers seem to take a perverse interest in upsetting people FOR ART!!

I am perfectly ok with being bummed out, but there has to be an artistic purpose to it.  What is the story justification for having a random character show up and do something horrible and then leave?  What are we going to learn about the characters as a result of this event that necessitated it?  I am not going to deny the brilliance of the performance or the fact that such an event can and does happen all the time, but Fellowes' rationale is lost on me.


I am going to give it time and see how it plays out. The character is not going away because the toff he is valet for is interested in Mary so there will be more opportunities for contact.
 
2013-10-07 02:08:30 PM
Spoiler for Americans.


Last night, they took one very sensible and sobre character and randomly turned her into the stereotypical good-time girl, screaming with laughter and playing late night card games (and she was warned several times by her husband for HAVING TOO MUCH FUN).


And then had her raped.

I dread to think what Jezebel made of it.
 
2013-10-07 02:09:56 PM

Mad Scientist: After all they've been through, I hope Anna and Bates have some happy, trouble-free time together this season.



Unlikely, given Bates is clearly a psychopath.
 
2013-10-07 02:15:45 PM
The show started as an interesting look at the characters as they reacted to the history of the time. The second season kept this up nicely. The third season...not so much, it became a soap opera, and didn't feel like it was responding to events as much. I'd like it if they could return to that feel this season. Because it's gone from feeling like something educational and interesting to appeal to the masses, to something that degenerating to only appeal to the lowest common denominator, and that's sad.
 
2013-10-07 02:39:34 PM

Carth: Unless you pay for Showtime you can't watch Homeland anyway. Season 1 of homeland is the best spy tv show around and up there with The Sandbaggers on the all time list.


You know how I know you didn't read the article?  Homeland doesn't run on Showtime in the U.K.
 
2013-10-07 03:05:51 PM

StrikitRich: Carth: Unless you pay for Showtime you can't watch Homeland anyway. Season 1 of homeland is the best spy tv show around and up there with The Sandbaggers on the all time list.
  Homeland doesn't run on Showtime in the U.K.


And the person I was talking to doesn't live in the UK. Funny how that works.
 
2013-10-07 03:21:29 PM

Carth: StrikitRich: Carth: Unless you pay for Showtime you can't watch Homeland anyway. Season 1 of homeland is the best spy tv show around and up there with The Sandbaggers on the all time list.
  Homeland doesn't run on Showtime in the U.K.

And the person I was talking to doesn't live in the UK. Funny how that works.


And Downton Abbey isn't airing in the US yet.  Funny how that works since the article was about DA's ratings.
 
2013-10-07 05:33:38 PM

someonelse: That aspect is a lot more interesting than "Lord Grantham feels bored and marginalized," or "Which rich guy will look after Lady Mary?"


I kinda like the running plot that Lord Grantham is the worst money-manager in the history of forever.  Not a profligate spender, but just someone who ALWAYS makes the wrong financial decision at every turn.
 
2013-10-07 06:02:37 PM

mark12A: Last night on a very special episode of Downton Abbey, some seriously exploitative bullshiat took place.

Ya know, I watch TV for enjoyment, NOT to be tramatized. I read what happened, and it makes me want to skip the series when it comes to the US. I want HAPPY. I want FULFILLING. I want INSPIRATION. I don't want to be bummed out. Yet these TV writers seem to take a perverse interest in upsetting people FOR ART!!


I love the show but I'd be the last person to call it art.
 
2013-10-07 06:51:08 PM
"Became" a soap opera. lol

It was a soap opera the very first episode. Sorry you don't like where they're taking it now.
 
2013-10-07 07:22:32 PM

Dwight_Yeast: someonelse: That aspect is a lot more interesting than "Lord Grantham feels bored and marginalized," or "Which rich guy will look after Lady Mary?"

I kinda like the running plot that Lord Grantham is the worst money-manager in the history of forever.  Not a profligate spender, but just someone who ALWAYS makes the wrong financial decision at every turn.


I think Mary is going to turn out to be a brilliant money manager and businesswoman and there's going to be conflict over the horror of having a woman in charge.
 
2013-10-07 07:31:13 PM

Dwight_Yeast: I kinda like the running plot that Lord Grantham is the worst money-manager in the history of forever.  Not a profligate spender, but just someone who ALWAYS makes the wrong financial decision at every turn.


This lack of brainpower is what you get when you have several hundred years of British inbreeding.

/Lady Mary married her cousin
 
2013-10-07 09:54:19 PM

Tax Boy: his lack of brainpower is what you get when you have several hundred years of British inbreeding.

/Lady Mary married her cousin


Having read quite a bit of English history recently, it's really no so much inbreeding as the problems you get when you start assigning roles based on lineage rather than skill.  It Lord Grantham had had other people managing his money and estate, he could have greatly increased the family fortune, as they would have made good investments, modernized farming practices and generally brought things into the 20th century.  But he's believes that he was put into  a certain role and that it's up to him to do the decision-making; it's like if captaining a ship was a hereditary position: you'd get some great captains and some lousy ones, as it's not the sort of skill that transmits generically.

The funny thing is that the real life Price of Wales is in much the same position, but having watched a couple documentaries about him, he knows when to pull back and leave the decision-making to the experts.  That's why the Duchy of Cornwall (the inherited lands which are supposed to support the Price of Wales) are making so much money these days that he gives 40% of the income away and there's still enough to pay his bills!

And Lady Mary and Matthew were third or fourth cousins (it was a joke in the first episodes as to how distantly he was related to the rest of the family), so there's no problem with inbreeding there.

Also ironically: one of the reasons they're shooting at Highclare castle is that Julian Fellows wanted to help his friends, Lord and Lady Canerveon out.  The current lord had the estate dumped in his lap when his father died and he found that there was no money and the house hadn't been repaired since his grandfather's day.  He's tried everything he could think of (including turning the service areas in the basement into a King Tut experience) but he barely made enough money to put a new roof on the house.

So Fellows dreamed up the idea of a TV series with the notion that the rental fees would help pay for repair work.  Then the series became a massive international hit, and the Canerevons are making money hand over fist at the moment, giving tours and renting the house out for events (something they were trying to do before the show started).  It should end up putting the house on a solid footing, even if the show does end soon (which it seems like it will; if they keep going after WWII, I will be shocked).
 
2013-10-07 10:05:49 PM

Mad Scientist: After all they've been through, I hope Anna and Bates have some happy, trouble-free time together this season.


Ha, nice one.
 
2013-10-08 12:12:43 AM

Bungles: Mad Scientist: After all they've been through, I hope Anna and Bates have some happy, trouble-free time together this season.


Unlikely, given Bates is clearly a psychopath.


They going to run a motel with his mother?
 
2013-10-08 12:57:13 AM

Bungles: Spoiler for Americans.


Last night, they took one very sensible and sobre character and randomly turned her into the stereotypical good-time girl, screaming with laughter and playing late night card games (and she was warned several times by her husband for HAVING TOO MUCH FUN).


And then had her raped.

I dread to think what Jezebel made of it.


Just read up on this. I'm done with the show.
 
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