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(Abc.net.au)   Spending over a decade studying and training to attain one of the most respected and valued jobs around still won't prevent you getting groped on the job if you are a woman   (abc.net.au) divider line 52
    More: Sad, female doctors, physical examinations, Monash University, studying, sexual discriminations, paid survey  
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16235 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Oct 2013 at 11:56 PM (40 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



Voting Results (Smartest)
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

2013-10-07 12:05:36 AM
7 votes:
My first thought was that the nurses have been getting it worse for far longer... but hey, now that it's happening to "important people" they can get all angry about it.
2013-10-06 09:55:18 PM
6 votes:
And if the docs have it bad, think about the abuse of the poor souls in retail sales and service.
2013-10-06 09:53:22 PM
6 votes:
Yeah, when you treat the public, you find out just how mean and disrespectful the public has gotten.
2013-10-07 12:41:50 AM
4 votes:
Male doctor here, have been "sexually harassed" by a couple of female patients now that I think about it. Don't really care, it's kinda funny when a wrinkly, old lady wants to be completely inappropriate with me. I could see how it would be different for females though. The tricky part (for me anyway) is rebuffing the patient without pissing them off.

A woman working at the VA hospital will get hit on by the vets more than any situation I've ever seen though. Literally more than a scantily clad woman at a singles' bar. It's insane.
2013-10-07 12:26:34 AM
4 votes:
It's almost as though when you strip away the textbooks and degrees and job titles and workplace etiquette, we're animals or something.
2013-10-06 09:43:16 PM
4 votes:
I've read a lot of stories from emergency room doctors needing to let off steam. Apparently sexual harassment  from the (drunk/stoned/stupid) patients is common, but so are four-point restraints and a nice dose of Haldol.
2013-10-06 09:02:15 PM
4 votes:
I really wouldn't take the chance of pissing off my doctor. Could end up getting prescribed something quite nasty.
2013-10-07 01:19:31 AM
3 votes:
How is this not 100%? Patients will grope you. Patients will masturbate in the room. Patients will talk to people who are not there. And that's just Tuesday.
Nurses put up with this bullshiat all the time.

People do odd thing when they are sick/drugged up and/or dying.
2013-10-07 12:14:01 AM
3 votes:
i.imgur.com
2013-10-07 12:13:25 AM
3 votes:
Sexual harassment is about abusing an imbalance of power between two parties. Generally the doctor is considered to be the one with the power in the relationship so unless the harasser is an employer it's unlikely to meet the legal definition of sexual harassment.
2013-10-07 12:04:36 AM
3 votes:
I blame porn:
lh3.ggpht.com
2013-10-06 10:49:27 PM
3 votes:
Men treat women like objects. Ric Romero reports.
2013-10-06 09:46:32 PM
3 votes:
Men get groped at work, too. Probably as often or even more because we're not allowed to complain about it.
2013-10-07 01:57:34 AM
2 votes:
People, let's not lose sight of the most significant fact here: this study took place in Australia.  Of course there's going to be a lot more sexual harrassment.
2013-10-07 01:24:27 AM
2 votes:

worlddan: ickory-smoked:

Yes, men are allowed to complain about harassment.

If a man sexually harasses a woman it's the man fault.
If a woman sexually harasses a man then it's the man's fault.
If a man sexually harasses a man then it's a man's fault.
If a woman sexually harasses a woman heads explode.


It's sad and pathetic that you actually believe that.
2013-10-07 12:53:39 AM
2 votes:

doglover: Men get groped at work, too. Probably as often or even more because we're not allowed to complain about it.


When I was putting  myself through University as a Surgical Tech one of the Nurse Anesthetists not only groped me, but hit on me and thoroughly expressed her interest in (cough) exploring one another's anatomy. And after getting herself a sizable handful of (cough) of my sensitive area a circulating nurse took me home one night after our shift to (cough) cook me dinner, but that was spoiled by her shooting her ex-husband in the (R) shoulder. Through the front door. As he was trying to break it in.

So, it happens. I learned to live with it.

"-)

/true
2013-10-07 12:42:51 AM
2 votes:

basemetal: And if the docs have it bad, think about the abuse of the poor souls in retail sales and service.


I've been groped a few times at work. The last time it happened, I received a lecture from upper management about how I should have screamed or ran to find a supervisor. Yep, I'm totally gonna do that when the groper is some elderly man and there's tons of customers around. My main priority at the time was to get away as fast as I could, otherwise I just shut down.
2013-10-07 12:14:09 AM
2 votes:

Hickory-smoked: doglover: Men get groped at work, too. Probably as often or even more because we're not allowed to complain about it.

I can't tell if you're just amusing yourself or you actually believe that.

Yes, men are allowed to complain about harassment.


Men are allowed to complain of course, but they tend to be treated like lesser beings for reporting it.

"Big strong man got harrased by a weak woman? Poor baby, go cry and fill out a report, we'll look into it if we feel like it."

I have seen this before, this kind of reaction to a guy trying to get help.
2013-10-07 12:05:35 AM
2 votes:
descendants of those who raped as they pleased for a large chunk of history behave this way? i'm shocked.
2013-10-06 10:29:41 PM
2 votes:

fusillade762: I really wouldn't take the chance of pissing off my doctor. Could end up getting prescribed something quite nasty.


Or getting jabbed with something sharp.
2013-10-07 11:13:46 AM
1 votes:

Graffito: LiberalConservative: Evolutions is a biatch. Men seem to be programmed to grope while women seem rather gropable (and perhaps get to select who gropes them). And anyhow, what about all the wanted/appreciated gropes?

If it's wanted it's called a caress.  A grope means that it is unwanted.

If men are so unable to control themselves maybe we should round them up and place them in special camps.   Don't you think that  labelling men as out-of-control assholes is an insult to men?


But there's the problem; one does not know if the outcome is grope or caress (yeah, yeah, baring certain "situations"). The groper only has to successfully caress once in 10 (20, 50, 100?) to make such an attempt a worthwhile endevour at a shot of passing on their genetic material...
Perhaps men who are non-out-of-control-assholes are simply controlling themselves just so that they can employ an alternate method (pickup line, warm hello, offer to buy a drink, etc) enabling a shot at passing on their genetic material simply because they believe that would provide a greater chance than a grope/caress attempt? Couldn't that also be considered assholish, and thus insulting to men also. Hmm... maybe you are right about those special camps.
2013-10-07 11:10:06 AM
1 votes:

Bigdogdaddy: I exposed myself to a nurse at the doctor's office.  Was there to get a shot in the ass, had lose cargo shorts and went commando.  I forgot about the keys, cell phone, Nintendo DS, change, wallet in them.  I undid my belt and the pants slipped out my fingers and fell to the floor.  I figured, oh well, too late now.  I'm glad she was a nurse with a sense of humor and not one that was all offended by it.


I'm sure she's seen similar things before.

Pincy: My GP is female and not entirely unattractive. She's married with a couple of kids, I'm married with a couple of kids, It's just not an issue for the most part. Though the prostate check is, err, uncomfortable.

I'm sure all the women who have to go through a pelvic exam every year are playing their violins for you.


Pelvic exams involve sticking fingers into a place things are meant to enter.  Prostate checks involve sticking fingers where they aren't meant to go.

razyjean: I have a question for the ladies: do you prefer a male or female OB/GYN?

I prefer female, because they have the same parts as I do and are more inclined to respect the sensitive nature of the area (plus, I had one male Dr. that made me feel kind of uncomfortable; like he enjoyed giving the exam just a little too much).

My mother-in-law says that only a man should look at a woman's parts. I honestly didn't even know how to respond to that. I tried explaining my views, but it was like talking to a puppy, blank stare and all (like she couldn't comprehend the words I was speaking).


My wife most definitely wants a female gyn.  The ob part is moot.
2013-10-07 10:16:24 AM
1 votes:

razyjean: My mother-in-law says that only a man should look at a woman's parts. I honestly didn't even know how to respond to that. I tried explaining my views, but it was like talking to a puppy, blank stare and all (like she couldn't comprehend the words I was speaking).


My current Gyno is a near-retirement tiny Chinese man which is amusing to me since I'm 5'8". I was a little nervous at first but he's completely harmless and very nice. In fact the only thing that's weird about it is he is very much pro-baby so it took a while to convince him that yes, hysterectomy was how I wanted to fix the endometriosis since the other treatment didn't work. The waiting room is a little intimidating, because he's probably delivered 500+ babies and they're all on the walls.
2013-10-07 09:30:40 AM
1 votes:

Lady J: razyjean:

I have a question for the ladies: do you prefer a male or female OB/GYN?

I prefer female, because they have the same parts as I do and are more inclined to respect the sensitive nature of the area (plus, I had one male Dr. that made me feel kind of uncomfortable; like he enjoyed giving the exam just a little too much).

My mother-in-law says that only a man should look at a woman's parts.  I honestly didn't even know how to respond to that.  I tried explaining my views, but it was like talking to a puppy, blank stare and all (like she couldn't comprehend the words I was speaking).

female. mainly because I would mistrust the motivations of any man who wanted to be a gynaecologist


wooo sexism.

i thought about how cool it would be a gynecologist when i was like 18, but that only lasted a minute till i realized i'd have to deal with a lot of yeast infections, jungles, and old women.

24.media.tumblr.com
2013-10-07 09:29:35 AM
1 votes:

THE GREAT NAME: someonelse: Tat'dGreaser: Gotta love the old men's rights thread on the ole Fark

It's like when you come across a weird racist toy at an antiques store. It's oddly amusing at first, but ultimately sad.

So, you find racism amusing?


Occasionally, as a precursor to sadness and mild nausea.
2013-10-07 09:22:52 AM
1 votes:

Trapper439: Benevolent Misanthrope: Men treat women like objects. Ric Romero reports.

Yes. Because men are all the same, and all men do this. Good job fighting sexism there.


It doesn't have to be all or even most.  There just have to be enough horrible men to make it nearly impossible for a woman to go through life without encountering some pretty much all the time, and it's pretty clear that this happens.

Also, it is true that most men at least tacitly support this kind of treatment, as do many women who have been trained since birth to view women as inferior objects whose purpose is to titillate men whenever men want to get off.
2013-10-07 08:46:42 AM
1 votes:

LiberalConservative: Evolutions is a biatch. Men seem to be programmed to grope while women seem rather gropable (and perhaps get to select who gropes them). And anyhow, what about all the wanted/appreciated gropes?


If it's wanted it's called a caress.  A grope means that it is unwanted.

If men are so unable to control themselves maybe we should round them up and place them in special camps.   Don't you think that  labelling men as out-of-control assholes is an insult to men?
2013-10-07 06:24:58 AM
1 votes:

razyjean: ladyfortuna: Pincy: Mr. Eugenides: Abox: I've only seen one chick doctor and that was for strep throat.  She prescribed antibiotics without even taking a throat swab...I thought that was weird and I never went back to her.

My GP is female and not entirely unattractive.  She's married with a couple of kids, I'm married with a couple of kids, It's just not an issue for the most part.  Though the prostate check is, err, uncomfortable.

I'm sure all the women who have to go through a pelvic exam every year are playing their violins for you.

Indeed. Especially when they forget the lubricant for the speculum.

/not kidding even a little bit.
//it was just that once, thank god

You poor thing!


I have a question for the ladies: do you prefer a male or female OB/GYN?

I prefer female, because they have the same parts as I do and are more inclined to respect the sensitive nature of the area (plus, I had one male Dr. that made me feel kind of uncomfortable; like he enjoyed giving the exam just a little too much).

My mother-in-law says that only a man should look at a woman's parts.  I honestly didn't even know how to respond to that.  I tried explaining my views, but it was like talking to a puppy, blank stare and all (like she couldn't comprehend the words I was speaking).


I disagree with your reasoning that female gyno's are more delicate. I feel the exact opposite actually. I think because they share our pudendum, and must go through the same exams they feel as though they have a license to to be err.. less caring. Granted, I've only had two GYNs to draw this preference from. I very much prefer my male gyno to my last female doc, compared to her seeing him is like a spa day. No joke. Although, I do have a inkling that she was just an unusually horrible doctor and he is an A++, above average doc.
@ Lady J
I have no qualms with a man wanting to be a gyno. My doc actually said that he became a OBGYN because he felt that it was a "happy" medical field. He spoke about how being a general surgeon was an option, but he couldn't always fix a problem, and make the person happy. (EG installing a colostomy bag, fixed the issue, but the patient was less than thrilled) Delivering babies, helping women to plan for families, or avoid them, and making, what could be, an unpleasant experience a nice one does sound like a "happy" medical field!
Unless you're that evil, uncaring, heavy-handed witch I saw that just wants to crush delicate, sensitive, petite flowers /sniff. Oh, and happiness, I think she tried to crush my main source of it too.
2013-10-07 05:42:28 AM
1 votes:

aerojockey: People, let's not lose sight of the most significant fact here: this study took place in Australia.  Of course there's going to be a lot more sexual harrassment.


I don't get it. And I say so not defending Australia, as I'm under no illusion that we've got a particularly good record on the matter.
2013-10-07 05:09:46 AM
1 votes:
razyjean:

I have a question for the ladies: do you prefer a male or female OB/GYN?

I prefer female, because they have the same parts as I do and are more inclined to respect the sensitive nature of the area (plus, I had one male Dr. that made me feel kind of uncomfortable; like he enjoyed giving the exam just a little too much).

My mother-in-law says that only a man should look at a woman's parts.  I honestly didn't even know how to respond to that.  I tried explaining my views, but it was like talking to a puppy, blank stare and all (like she couldn't comprehend the words I was speaking).


female. mainly because I would mistrust the motivations of any man who wanted to be a gynaecologist
2013-10-07 04:51:24 AM
1 votes:
I'd rather see male gyno. They don't know what it's like having lady parts, so I find them to be more gentle and respectful.
2013-10-07 03:42:14 AM
1 votes:

doloresonthedottedline: Sometimes. But then you get a patient like me who just says "I'm extremely tired all the time" and a few other odd things. Which specialist do you send me to?

Believe it or not, the sleep doctor was the absolute last specialist I saw. After a neurosurgeon, endocrinologist, cardiologist, psychiatrist, neurologist.. Apparently doctors don't realize that, past a certain point, most people don't distinguish between sleepiness and fatigue.



That just proves my point. You just send them to specialists in any old order. Tired? A -ologist. No? B- ologist, C-ologist. They'll get help or die sometime during the process.
2013-10-07 02:45:57 AM
1 votes:

Mr. Eugenides: Abox: I've only seen one chick doctor and that was for strep throat.  She prescribed antibiotics without even taking a throat swab...I thought that was weird and I never went back to her.

My GP is female and not entirely unattractive.  She's married with a couple of kids, I'm married with a couple of kids, It's just not an issue for the most part.  Though the prostate check is, err, uncomfortable.


I'm sure all the women who have to go through a pelvic exam every year are playing their violins for you.
2013-10-07 02:43:12 AM
1 votes:

Mr. Eugenides: Though the prostate check is, err, uncomfortable.


No. Really?

Uncomfortable as it may be, in my experience,
a) no female physician has clamped a fake hand on my right shoulder. *shudder*
2) no female physician has acted with less than professional demeanor during a prostate exam. (see a above)
iii) no female physician has had larger fingers than any male physician who performed a prostate exam on me.

That's all I have to say about that.
2013-10-07 01:37:08 AM
1 votes:

doglover: mr lawson: troggy: I've never understood why having Dr. before your name or ,M.D. after is supposed to confer automatic societal respect. Medical doctors are the biological equivalent of car mechanics and IT monkeys.

simple...one can live with a car or a computer that's broke. Not so much with a body that is broken.

But the mechanic actually has to know something. The IT guy has to be able to fix things. Machines don't fix themselves. Bodies do. A general practitioner only has to know a handful of drug names to make you feel better while you heal and how to say "I'm refering you to a specialist."


Sometimes. But then you get a patient like me who just says "I'm extremely tired all the time" and a few other odd things. Which specialist do you send me to?

Believe it or not, the sleep doctor was the absolute last specialist I saw. After a neurosurgeon, endocrinologist, cardiologist, psychiatrist, neurologist.. Apparently doctors don't realize that, past a certain point, most people don't distinguish between sleepiness and fatigue.

/the answer was narcolepsy
//studies show she sucked no more than most at diagnosing it
2013-10-07 01:29:48 AM
1 votes:
ciberido:

It's sad and pathetic that you actually believe that.

It's sad and pathetic that you think that I think that you think that I think you think I think you actually believe that.
2013-10-07 01:21:54 AM
1 votes:

troggy: I've never understood why having Dr. before your name or ,M.D. after is supposed to confer automatic societal respect. Medical doctors are the biological equivalent of car mechanics and IT monkeys.


3/10

Actually... 6/10. You've got a few good chunks of bait on that hook.
2013-10-07 01:20:59 AM
1 votes:

doglover: Men get groped at work, too. Probably as often or even more because we're not allowed to complain about it.


I know, right?  We should really work to repeal all those laws criminalizing men reporting sexual harassment.
2013-10-07 01:17:13 AM
1 votes:

Chariset: I've read a lot of stories from emergency room doctors needing to let off steam. Apparently sexual harassment from the (drunk/stoned/stupid) patients is common, but so are four-point restraints and a nice dose of Haldol.


Yeah, that was my first thought on reading it--how many of the harassers are unimpaired?
2013-10-07 12:55:53 AM
1 votes:

mr lawson: troggy: I've never understood why having Dr. before your name or ,M.D. after is supposed to confer automatic societal respect. Medical doctors are the biological equivalent of car mechanics and IT monkeys.

simple...one can live with a car or a computer that's broke. Not so much with a body that is broken.


But the mechanic actually has to know something. The IT guy has to be able to fix things. Machines don't fix themselves. Bodies do. A general practitioner only has to know a handful of drug names to make you feel better while you heal and how to say "I'm refering you to a specialist."
2013-10-07 12:49:25 AM
1 votes:

troggy: I've never understood why having Dr. before your name or ,M.D. after is supposed to confer automatic societal respect. Medical doctors are the biological equivalent of car mechanics and IT monkeys.


simple...one can live with a car or a computer that's broke. Not so much with a body that is broken.
2013-10-07 12:48:31 AM
1 votes:

worlddan: troggy: I've never understood why having Dr. before your name or ,M.D. after is supposed to confer automatic societal respect. Medical doctors are the biological equivalent of car mechanics and IT monkeys.

The tread was being derailed in the other direction. If it rocks back and forth too much I might get see sick.


Go see your mechanic for that.  He can prescribe you something.
2013-10-07 12:22:51 AM
1 votes:

Abox: I've only seen one chick doctor and that was for strep throat.  She prescribed antibiotics without even taking a throat swab...I thought that was weird and I never went back to her.


My GP is female and not entirely unattractive.  She's married with a couple of kids, I'm married with a couple of kids, It's just not an issue for the most part.  Though the prostate check is, err, uncomfortable.
2013-10-07 12:18:43 AM
1 votes:
I've only seen one chick doctor and that was for strep throat.  She prescribed antibiotics without even taking a throat swab...I thought that was weird and I never went back to her.
2013-10-07 12:16:55 AM
1 votes:

doglover: Men get groped at work, too. Probably as often or even more because we're not allowed to complain about it.


You're allowed to complain about. I know men who have done just that. There were no reprisals, either.
2013-10-07 12:13:46 AM
1 votes:
ickory-smoked:

Yes, men are allowed to complain about harassment.

If a man sexually harasses a woman it's the man fault.
If a woman sexually harasses a man then it's the man's fault.
If a man sexually harasses a man then it's a man's fault.
If a woman sexually harasses a woman heads explode.
2013-10-07 12:09:39 AM
1 votes:
doglover: Men get groped at work, too. Probably as often or even more because we don't we're not allowed to complain about it.

FTFY
2013-10-07 12:06:20 AM
1 votes:

doglover: Men get groped at work, too. Probably as often or even more because we're not allowed to complain about it.


I can't tell if you're just amusing yourself or you actually believe that.

Yes, men are allowed to complain about harassment.
2013-10-07 12:06:14 AM
1 votes:
reminds me of my last physical.
I ended up with a young resident.
not a bad looking woman at all.
at the end she got  a bit weird as she asked if there was anything else.
I said no. then she she hemmed and hawed and then finally said: "most men want me to check their prostate"
Something about the way she said that made me feel really sorry for her.
so I lied and told her "No, I'm good. Maybe next time"
2013-10-06 10:32:10 PM
1 votes:
Thirty per cent of those surveyed reported that they were touched or grabbed during consultations, with 36 per cent having been subjected to gender-based remarks


This probably is a big issue for women doctors, I couldn't find with a 30 second google search any data about male doctors having this problem, still, I bet at least some do.


i.imgur.com
2013-10-06 10:10:49 PM
1 votes:

doglover: Men get groped at work, too. Probably as often or even more because we're not allowed to complain about it.


I've never been groped at work.
2013-10-06 09:34:02 PM
1 votes:
That's what they get for being attractive and within a 10 foot radius.  If they didn't want to be sexually harassed they'd be unattractive and further away
 
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