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(Huffington Post)   GOP admits that the shutdown/debt ceiling fight isn't about Obamacare or the budget, it's really just about pride. Well if there's a better reason to destroy the economy, I haven't heard it yet   (huffingtonpost.com) divider line 176
    More: Stupid, Indiana Republican, GOP, obamacare, Marlin Stutzman, government shutdown, Boehner, senate democrats  
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3832 clicks; posted to Politics » on 06 Oct 2013 at 2:45 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-06 10:00:02 AM  
so they're not terrorists... they're just petulant children? either way, the result is the same, and americans get hurt.
 
2013-10-06 10:05:17 AM  
You should have checked your pride at the door when you climbed on board the crazy train express with Ted Cruz.
 
2013-10-06 10:06:24 AM  
FOX News is going to have a hard time controlling the message on this one.  Virtually every GOP house member is a potential loose cannon.
 
2013-10-06 11:35:37 AM  
Proverbs 16:18
 
2013-10-06 11:51:16 AM  
Well, I just watch Savannah Guthrie interview Rand Paul and he is still insisting that this is over Obamacare and the need to curb our spending.   The fact that he lied throughout that interview and she never once called him on it depressed me.  It's too early for that.   I wanted to throw my coffee mug at him.   Grrrrrrrr, it's so infuriating.
 
2013-10-06 11:53:15 AM  

Gecko Gingrich: Proverbs 16:18


Indeed.
 
2013-10-06 11:53:15 AM  
Isn't there something on the back of the Constitution that allows us to ummm... do stuff to them for this? Maybe in invisible ink?
 
2013-10-06 11:53:25 AM  
In response, the only thing I can say is this....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3M68wcB6L0s
 
2013-10-06 11:58:23 AM  

Weaver95: In response, the only thing I can say is this....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3M68wcB6L0s


Love that flick.
 
2013-10-06 12:01:28 PM  

make me some tea: Gecko Gingrich: Proverbs 16:18

Indeed.


mmhm
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-10-06 12:09:03 PM  
The whole religious/southern/far-right thing has always been about pride.

These people have been wanting a fight for a long time and now they have one.  That's why they hate anything Obama does even when it is something they were for previously.
 
2013-10-06 12:12:29 PM  

vpb: The whole religious/southern/far-right thing has always been about pride.

These people have been wanting a fight for a long time and now they have one.  That's why they hate anything Obama does even when it is something they were for previously.


saaaay....wasn't pride and vanity something something deadly sin....?  hmm.  Pretty sure I read about that somewhere.
 
2013-10-06 12:18:09 PM  
In their defense, it has been several years of pride just f*cking with them. McCain, Romney, the Senate. The House is their last shot to really feel like they're in control. Well, that and numerous state legislatures, where they are essentially acting out their fantasies of what they'd rather be doing over the entire nation. The poor, persecuted job creators are essentially acting cosplaying what a "strong leadership" does, and to an audience of barely cognizant and barely literate yokels, so that no one will notice what they are doing with the other hand. The problem is that they've pretty much let the audience get onto the stage, and are somewhat "surprised" to find them engaging in all the antics that they imagined would happen.

It reminds me of working a Black Eyed Peas show a few years ago in Phoenix. The crew and folks rolled in early, and we laid out catering, and everyone was super polite, professional, and will.i.am and Fergie and Taboo were going to meet some fans, take them backstage, and give them a tour of the facilities and show them how things really worked, and introduce them to the tour staff, check out their dressing rooms, the bus, and through the clubs that they were going to do the pre-show. The fans were expecting some OUTRAGEOUSNESS, and they found a bunch of professional folks setting up a show, a decent spread for catering, all the performers really just getting ready for a big performance, and no diva behavior in the least. Will.i.am and Fergie were very polite, excited for the fans, and supportive, but there just wasn't a lot of shenanigans, because it was a big tour, the venue was sold well, and they definitely wanted to get another gig at the area. A few of the fans started to get some attitude with the staff, and the crew, will.i.am and Fergie told them that it wasn't cool, and chilled them out. The TEA Party idiots have been fed a bill of goods about "fighting the good fight" and when they got to Washington, yes, there is a fair amount of theater, but their expectations are really poisoning the room, because they've been spoon fed visions of the depth of the Democrats' depravity, and they are SO going to fight them. In the Senate, at least, there is a measure of civility, but in the House, these freshmen are READY to roll into combat, and what they're faced with is a lot of reading, talking, and more reading, more talking, and they are expecting to go in and regulate. This mess is drama, and by feeding into their fantasies, the leadership has painted itself into a corner.

And there is no will.i.am or Fergie to tell them all to chill the f*ck out.

Let that sink in a moment.

Yes. It's sad that will.i.am has more power over his fans than Boehner over his own caucus.
 
2013-10-06 12:22:02 PM  
Ahhh, Hubie, there's a reason why I have you favorited green.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-10-06 12:22:34 PM  

NewportBarGuy: Isn't there something on the back of the Constitution that allows us to ummm... do stuff to them for this? Maybe in invisible ink?


Well, Bush seemed certain that the president had the power to declare anyone an enemy combatant.  These guys probably supported that.

I see a way to kill two birds with one stone.

/ Three if we can waterboard them.
 
2013-10-06 12:25:22 PM  
So it's "party before country." Assholes.

F*ck them.
 
2013-10-06 12:27:47 PM  

Weaver95: vpb: The whole religious/southern/far-right thing has always been about pride.

These people have been wanting a fight for a long time and now they have one.  That's why they hate anything Obama does even when it is something they were for previously.

saaaay....wasn't pride and vanity something something deadly sin....?  hmm.  Pretty sure I read about that somewhere.


Well, there's Pride, there's Greed, there's Envy and Wrath....

....they're also probably guilty of Gluttony and maybe also Sloth, although it isn't relevant in this particular case.

/if you think Lust applies to them, whether or not it would be relevant in the context of the government shutdown, look at People Of Walmart or an airport men's room and then get back to me
 
2013-10-06 12:29:02 PM  
i40.tinypic.com
 
2013-10-06 12:29:07 PM  
Way to go Galt GOP. I don't think it's going to turn out the way you think.
 
2013-10-06 12:29:59 PM  

Ambivalence: Way to go Galt GOP. I don't think it's going to turn out the way you think.


the GOP seems to think the country wants to be destroyed.  I honestly don't know what to say to that.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-10-06 12:35:52 PM  

Weaver95: the GOP seems to think the country wants to be destroyed.  I honestly don't know what to say to that.


So did the Confederates.
 
2013-10-06 12:43:26 PM  
(Hubie- you a brother? IA205)
 
2013-10-06 12:44:29 PM  

Weaver95: In response, the only thing I can say is this....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3M68wcB6L0s


I now have  this stuck in my head.
 
2013-10-06 12:47:33 PM  

Marcus Aurelius: FOX News is going to have a hard time controlling the message on this one.  Virtually every GOP house member is a potential loose cannon.


This is why the conservative websites and Fox News have been hammering about the national park and monument closings so hard over the past few days.  Those closings are nothing more than routine cost-saving safety and security measures (and happened in the last shutdown in 1996 as well) but the GOP is so desperate to shift the blame that they're looking for anything they can pin on Obama to get the scent off of themselves for this mess.

They don't have a plan to fix anything, their own polls show public opinion turning against them quickly, so they're doing what they always do - spread FUD and blame the other guys hoping that they can manufacture outrage so that people stop blaming them for their mistakes.
 
2013-10-06 12:50:40 PM  

Therion: (Hubie- you a brother? IA205)


Irish-German-Japanese. Technically, hafu, but I prefer Kraut-Mick-Nip. It makes me sound like a tasty snack. But I'll accept aniki...
 
2013-10-06 01:06:25 PM  
What's a little scary is the extent to which the GOP, at least publicly, has in no ways at all seemed to grasp the actual Democratic position here. They don't seem to understand that for Obama and Reid, this isn't about what policies are good or bad or worth negotiating over. It's not a substantive issue about policy. It's about the fundamental nature of how our political system works. If you use the CR or the Debt Ceiling is negotiating leverage, or you permit that to happen, you are fundamentally altering the nature of our constitutional system. Obama realizes what a massive mistake he made in 2011 by putting us on this path (by all accounts Reid understood it then and hated that Obama negotiated).

That's the issue. The nature of our government. Not any specific policy. And until the GOP understands that, we're in serious trouble.
 
2013-10-06 01:09:48 PM  
Good lines from Kevin Drum on this:

A month ago, Democrats might have shrugged over the device tax. Today, they know perfectly well what it would mean to let it go. It means that when the debt ceiling deadline comes up, there will be yet another demand. When the 6-week CR is up, there will be yet another. If and when appropriations bills are passed, there will be yet another. We've already seen the list. There simply won't be any end to the hostage taking. As their price for not blowing up the country, there will be an unending succession of short-term CRs and short-term debt limit extensions used as leverage for picking apart Obamacare-and everything else Democrats care about-piece by piece.

There's no way that any political party anywhere in the world would willingly put itself in this position. Does this mean that Democrats are "jamming" Boehner, leaving him no way to save some face? Yes it does, and human nature being what it is, that's truly unfortunate. But what other choice do they have? The newly Cruz-ified Republican Party has left them with no alternative.
 
2013-10-06 01:10:26 PM  

DamnYankees: What's a little scary is the extent to which the GOP, at least publicly, has in no ways at all seemed to grasp the actual Democratic position here. They don't seem to understand that for Obama and Reid, this isn't about what policies are good or bad or worth negotiating over. It's not a substantive issue about policy. It's about the fundamental nature of how our political system works. If you use the CR or the Debt Ceiling is negotiating leverage, or you permit that to happen, you are fundamentally altering the nature of our constitutional system. Obama realizes what a massive mistake he made in 2011 by putting us on this path (by all accounts Reid understood it then and hated that Obama negotiated).

That's the issue. The nature of our government. Not any specific policy. And until the GOP understands that, we're in serious trouble.


what if the GOP does understand what they are doing?  what if they're intentionally trying to undermine the constitution in order to re-engineer the basic structure of our government?
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-10-06 01:22:21 PM  

Weaver95: what if the GOP does understand what they are doing?  what if they're intentionally trying to undermine the constitution in order to re-engineer the basic structure of our government?


Many on the right want exactly that.  It's no secret.
 
2013-10-06 01:31:04 PM  

make me some tea: Weaver95: In response, the only thing I can say is this....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3M68wcB6L0s

Love that flick.


And one of my all time favorite songs.
 
2013-10-06 02:14:53 PM  

Weaver95: vpb: The whole religious/southern/far-right thing has always been about pride.

These people have been wanting a fight for a long time and now they have one.  That's why they hate anything Obama does even when it is something they were for previously.

saaaay....wasn't pride and vanity something something deadly sin....?  hmm.  Pretty sure I read about that somewhere.


It was taken out in the new translation of the Bible.  The Rafael Eduardian Cruz version now considers this on of the 7 Virtues.
 
2013-10-06 02:24:07 PM  

Weaver95: what if the GOP does understand what they are doing?  what if they're intentionally trying to undermine the constitution in order to re-engineer the basic structure of our government?


media1.policymic.com
"We're very excited. It's exactly what we wanted, and we got it." "This is about the happiest I've seen members in a long time because we've seen we're starting to win this dialogue on a national level."


Think about this. Think back to two weeks before the beginning of the sequester - would you have believed that Democrats would soon be upset because government was not being funded at the sequester level? That in a few short months, Democrats in the Senate would be voting unanimously to fund government at the reduced sequester level? Think about the Ryan budget, and the 2012 elections. Could anyone imagine that a year later, people would be calling their Congress critters to demand that government be funded at a level below even the Ryan budget?

The Democrats are fighting for the Republican position on healthcare in the 1990's, and now they're demanding the Republican position on governmental funding that seemed ridiculous just a couple of months ago. By what metric are the Democrats "winning" this battle on the direction of the country?
 
2013-10-06 02:24:24 PM  

Gecko Gingrich: Proverbs 16:18


I haven't read a Bible in probably 16 years, but I still knew what verse you were quoting.  For a party that claims to be so Christian and godly, they sure don't like following what their good book says.
 
2013-10-06 02:28:24 PM  
TITLE CARD: HOUSE FRICTION

(SCENE: A dimly lit Oval Office.)

OBAMA: I'm President of the United States. Here are the polls. This is a losing issue for you and your party. If you want a hope in hell of having your next candidate sitting in this chair, you have 48 hours to pass a clean CR with a debt ceiling increase. Our party pledges to support you on this.

(Camera backs out and a dim light turns on, illuminating a second figure in the corner of the room, behind the Resolute Desk. It's LLOYD BLANKFEIN, the bald-headed CEO of Goldman Sachs, and he's dressed as Marcellus Wallace. The scene is lit dimly enough that he even looks blah.)

i.imgur.com

BLANKFEIN: And I am President of Goldman Sachs. Here's a chart of the S&P for the past four weeks, updated every 30 minutes. See how it goes down when one of your guys puts his ugly motherfarkin' mug on camera or reads Dr. Motherfarkin' Seuss, and how it goes back up when it looks like you're going to capitulate and pass a continuing resolution anyways? We've made ourselves some sweet money going short since then, and we could make a shiatload more if you manage to make more people panic next week, but if you actually cause a default, we don't know if our - business partners - will be able to pay us back on those winnings. So you see, this isn't just a losing issue for him (BLANKFEIN points dismissively at OBAMA) ...it's also turning into a losing issue for us.

So if you want a hope in hell of seeing this farkin' desk again, regardless of whether it's your guy or his guy sitting behind it four years from now, you have until the 17th to tell any of your friends to cover their shorts before you submit to the House this guy's clean CR with an accompanying debt ceiling increase. Pass one clean bill with whatever the fark he (BLANKFEIN points again, dismissively, to OBAMA) wants on it, and our party pledges to support your candidate in the primary against whoever who challenges them, but beyond that, we're sick of hearing about your farkin' primaries. Fark with the debt ceiling in any way, and we support the Democratic candidate in the general regardless of which of your candidates wins your farkin' primary.

BOEHNER: (whimpers, a tear running down his orange-shaded cheek)

BLANKFEIN: I think you're gonna find, when all this shiat is over and done, I think you're gonna find yourself one smilin' motherfarker. Thing is, Boehner, right now you still got some ability. But painful as it may be, ability don't last. And your days are just about over. Now that's a hard motherfarkin' fact of life, but that's a fact of life your ass is gonna hafta git realistic about. You see this business is filled to the brim with unrealistic motherfarkers. Motherfarkers who thought their ass aged like wine. If you mean it turns to vinegar, it does. If you mean it gets better with age, it don't. Besides, even if you went all the way, what would you be? President of the United farkin' States? Who gives a shiat? I doubt you can even get a credit card based on that.

A HAND places an envelope full of money on the table in front of BOEHNER

BLANKFEIN: Night of the House vote, you may fell a slight sting, that's pride farkin' wit you. Fark pride! Pride only hurts, it never helps. You fight through that shiat. 'Cause in 2014, when you're kickin' it on K Street you're gonna say to yourself, "Lloyd Blankfein was right." By the 17th, your ass goes down.

BOEHNER: The more radical elements of my party will have to b-

BLANKFEIN: (cuts him off) By the 17th, your ass goes down.

BOEHNER: (whimpers, nods his head)

BLANKFEIN: Say it.

BOEHNER: By the 17th, my ass goes down.
 
2013-10-06 02:33:42 PM  

DamnYankees: Good lines from Kevin Drum on this:

A month ago, Democrats might have shrugged over the device tax. Today, they know perfectly well what it would mean to let it go. It means that when the debt ceiling deadline comes up, there will be yet another demand. When the 6-week CR is up, there will be yet another. If and when appropriations bills are passed, there will be yet another. We've already seen the list. There simply won't be any end to the hostage taking. As their price for not blowing up the country, there will be an unending succession of short-term CRs and short-term debt limit extensions used as leverage for picking apart Obamacare-and everything else Democrats care about-piece by piece.

There's no way that any political party anywhere in the world would willingly put itself in this position. Does this mean that Democrats are "jamming" Boehner, leaving him no way to save some face? Yes it does, and human nature being what it is, that's truly unfortunate. But what other choice do they have? The newly Cruz-ified Republican Party has left them with no alternative.


2012 was a watershed election. The GOP learned once and for all that, no matter how much of the white vote you get, no one will ever be elected President again just on the white vote. The demographics are inexorable: integrate minorities, or die.

Unfortunately, the lesson they seem to have taken away isn't 'change', it's 'if we use the white vote and gerrmandering to grab enough state legislatures and the House, we can control things in a different way.'

It sounds preposterous, but look at the evidence. NC, a once extremely moderate southern state, being railroaded to the 1920s ASAP. The House ignoring the traditional balance of power between the three federal branches and trying to rework things in their own favor. Immediately jumping on the opening provided by the SCOTUS ruling to shove through as many disenfranchising laws in as many states as possible. It's just three moves in a recent pattern that all indicate a shift in emphasis from Presidential politics to more local and legislative battles.
 
2013-10-06 02:41:21 PM  

ox45tallboy: Think about this. Think back to two weeks before the beginning of the sequester - would you have believed that Democrats would soon be upset because government was not being funded at the sequester level? That in a few short months, Democrats in the Senate would be voting unanimously to fund government at the reduced sequester level? Think about the Ryan budget, and the 2012 elections. Could anyone imagine that a year later, people would be calling their Congress critters to demand that government be funded at a level below even the Ryan budget?


that is because the democrats COMPROMISED in the senate. they lowered their original budget from 70 billion higher. it is what adults do.

what the tools in the house are doing ... well what would you expect from uneducated mouth breathers
 
2013-10-06 02:47:21 PM  
i wish it was about limiting power.  With less money the government gets smaller.  Then it is less powerful.
 
2013-10-06 02:48:08 PM  

FlashHarry: so they're not terrorists... they're just petulant children? either way, the result is the same, and americans get hurt.


You can say that about both parties.
 
2013-10-06 02:49:15 PM  

namatad: that is because the democrats COMPROMISED in the senate. they lowered their original budget from 70 billion higher. it is what adults do.


Wait, I don't get it.

Republicans wanted the Ryan budget. Dems wanted a good bit more (see Obama's budget proposal that was passed by the Senate with very little changes, but the House won't meet with them to discuss it.)

How in the fark does a "compromise" wind up with the Democrats demanding even less than what the Republicans were offering? That's not a compromise. WTF?
 
2013-10-06 02:54:27 PM  

ox45tallboy: By what metric are the Democrats "winning" this battle on the direction of the country?


We shall see what happens in 2014 and 2016, that will be the metric.
 
2013-10-06 02:56:39 PM  
The most disgusting thing I've read all day.


This is a level of asshattery that not even Joe Francis could achieve if he tried.
 
2013-10-06 02:57:41 PM  

make me some tea: ox45tallboy: By what metric are the Democrats "winning" this battle on the direction of the country?

We shall see what happens in 2014 and 2016, that will be the metric.


Alas, if history has shown us anything, nothing much will change in 2014. Between the gerrymandering and the mouth breathing ...
 
2013-10-06 02:58:12 PM  

ox45tallboy: namatad: that is because the democrats COMPROMISED in the senate. they lowered their original budget from 70 billion higher. it is what adults do.

Wait, I don't get it.

Republicans wanted the Ryan budget. Dems wanted a good bit more (see Obama's budget proposal that was passed by the Senate with very little changes, but the House won't meet with them to discuss it.)

How in the fark does a "compromise" wind up with the Democrats demanding even less than what the Republicans were offering? That's not a compromise. WTF?


I got into politics on 9/11. Here's what my world looks like:

The Republicans are ideologues who behave like petulant children to get their way.

The Democrats clean up the mess and try to limit the damage.

That's it. That's how America's political world works.  That is how my generation has grown up. We need a huge change, because you're right, the Democrats don't compromise--they just try to keep America from farking imploding.

We have serious, serious problems. It's not 'both sides are bad' or 'politics is dirty' anymore. Our political system revolves around zealot children screaming and some sane adults trying to keep things running. That's not going to end well for anyone.
 
2013-10-06 02:58:22 PM  
1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-10-06 02:59:03 PM  

Smeggy Smurf: FlashHarry: so they're not terrorists... they're just petulant children? either way, the result is the same, and americans get hurt.

You can say that about both parties.


You can say a lot of things that don't make sense.
 
2013-10-06 03:01:57 PM  

namatad: make me some tea: ox45tallboy: By what metric are the Democrats "winning" this battle on the direction of the country?

We shall see what happens in 2014 and 2016, that will be the metric.

Alas, if history has shown us anything, nothing much will change in 2014. Between the gerrymandering and the mouth breathing ...


Look at what we're seeing 'right now', then.

The Democrats are galvanized into a united front.  Galvanized by terror of what happens if they negotiate with terrorist tactics, that is.

The GOP is fractured, no matter what Boehner thinks or says aloud.

The polls have the vast majority of Americans fully aware of who's to blame for this mess.

And every day, we're seeing more and more articles from Republican voters about how awesome Obamacare is now that they've actually applied for it.

This is not going to get better over time for the GOP.  It only gets worse.  The longer they hold out, the angrier Americans are and the more united the Democrats are and the closer we get to November 2014.

If they were smart, they'd pass a clean CR and a debt ceiling raise and get back to the issues where Americans actually like them.  Like prayer in school and guns and other stupid shiat like that.

But, they won't.  Because Pride.
 
2013-10-06 03:03:53 PM  
ok, it's time for another episode of "stupid questions with CoryD"

why the fark is there not a campaign to force a recall election for these representatives? they clearly aren't doing their jobs, isn't that how it's supposed to work? can someone please explain this process to my dumb ass?


thanks.
 
2013-10-06 03:05:39 PM  
It's not about pride.
It's about Gay Pride.

/Wide stance looks pretty hawt, right Boner?
 
2013-10-06 03:06:18 PM  

Infernalist: namatad: make me some tea: ox45tallboy: By what metric are the Democrats "winning" this battle on the direction of the country?

We shall see what happens in 2014 and 2016, that will be the metric.

Alas, if history has shown us anything, nothing much will change in 2014. Between the gerrymandering and the mouth breathing ...

Look at what we're seeing 'right now', then.

The Democrats are galvanized into a united front.  Galvanized by terror of what happens if they negotiate with terrorist tactics, that is.

The GOP is fractured, no matter what Boehner thinks or says aloud.

The polls have the vast majority of Americans fully aware of who's to blame for this mess.

And every day, we're seeing more and more articles from Republican voters about how awesome Obamacare is now that they've actually applied for it.

This is not going to get better over time for the GOP.  It only gets worse.  The longer they hold out, the angrier Americans are and the more united the Democrats are and the closer we get to November 2014.

If they were smart, they'd pass a clean CR and a debt ceiling raise and get back to the issues where Americans actually like them.  Like prayer in school and guns and other stupid shiat like that.

But, they won't.  Because Pride.


except very few of the 80 teabaggers are vulnerable.

the GOPers that will lose to Democrats will be moderates, and the idealogical divide will get worse
 
2013-10-06 03:07:10 PM  
If I can't FIND a problem with the government...

th07.deviantart.net

I'll MAKE one!
 
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