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(SeattlePI)   Catholics in America love the new pope. Catholic bishops in America, not so much   (blog.seattlepi.com) divider line 95
    More: Obvious, Catholic Church, America's Catholics, Catholic bishop, non-Catholic, Quinnipiac University Polling Institute, Minnesota Legislature, Western Washington, American Catholics  
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9162 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Oct 2013 at 10:39 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-06 09:16:52 AM  
huh.  so less gays, more social justice and positive outreach.  that might not go over well with some of the more hardline US bishops.
 
2013-10-06 09:40:34 AM  
The laity in the US has been growing more and more fed up with American bishops for years, so this comes as no surprise.
 
2013-10-06 10:02:15 AM  

Nabb1: The laity in the US has been growing more and more fed up with American bishops for years, so this comes as no surprise.


yup.
 
2013-10-06 10:09:06 AM  
Religion is designed to get inside your bedroom and make you feel ashamed for it, then tell you what to do to repent your sins.

It used to be a brilliant way to control people, but that trust is eroding as the years go by.
 
2013-10-06 10:15:01 AM  
Guess these bishops are just going to have to get their minds right, since the Pope speaks for God.

Francis isn't quite as radical as some seem to think, nor is he going to reverse a lot of positions, but the atmosphere that he's trying to create within the Church IS a breath of fresh air, and it's what the Catholics have needed for some time.
 
2013-10-06 10:25:32 AM  
As a lapsed Catholic, some of the poll numbers in that article make me happy. In my anecdotal experience, Catholics are much more progressive than the Catholic Church. I don't know many who care that much about gay marriage, and don't think I know any that care about a birth control mandate in health care. It has always seemed to me that when the Catholic Church made stands against things like the birth control mandate, it was evangelicals (or just right wingers in general) who yelled the loudest about Catholics being forced to violate their religious beliefs, while the ordinary Catholic didn't really care about such nonsense. Also, anecdotal evidence is a form of evidence.
 
2013-10-06 10:37:13 AM  
Honestly, no matter how positively the Pope is viewed, Catholicism in the US is facing serious problems.  The average age for priests in the US 63, and there isn't exactly a bumper crop of new homegrown priests to take their places.  Couple this with the closing of a lot of Catholic elementary schools in many cities, and the high percentage of younger Catholics who leave the faith (or are simply Christmas and Easter Catholics), and it's a recipe for failure.
 
2013-10-06 10:41:36 AM  
All those American Catholics who idolized John Paul II? Those hardline U.S. bishops are his appointees.
 
2013-10-06 10:42:41 AM  
Has the Pope said if it is OK to pop a catholic chick in the pooper yet?
 
2013-10-06 10:42:45 AM  
My BiL thinks the new Pope sucks precisely because he doesn't hate the HomGheys enough.
 
2013-10-06 10:42:47 AM  
Does the Pope shiat in the woods?
 
2013-10-06 10:43:33 AM  
When you start poking at a deeply entrenched system like that, it's no surprise those within the system are gonna be upset.
 
2013-10-06 10:44:28 AM  
 
2013-10-06 10:45:08 AM  
I knew Peter Sartain "Father Pete" in Memphis. He was a fair, thoughtful, balanced man. How far the mighty have fallen once they get into positions of power. It actually makes me ill to see how much of an about-face he has done in his views. Yah, yah, I get that he's high up in the hierarchy now and he has to toe the party line, but still. What a sad.
 
2013-10-06 10:47:08 AM  

Fluid: When you start poking at a deeply entrenched system like that, it's no surprise those within the system are gonna be upset.


Isn't the Pope's word the word of God?  Are Bishops questioning the word of God?
 
2013-10-06 10:47:34 AM  

FlashHarry: Nabb1: The laity in the US has been growing more and more fed up with American bishops for years, so this comes as no surprise.

yup.


seconded
 
2013-10-06 10:48:22 AM  

Weaver95: huh.  so less gays, more social justice and positive outreach.  that might not go over well with some of the more hardline US bishops.


They think he should ex-communicate himself, that or make efforts to re-enter the fold by acting as lookout while the bishops attend a junior outreach sodomy conference.
 
2013-10-06 10:55:54 AM  

Muta: Has the Pope said if it is OK to pop a catholic chick in the pooper yet?


Fluid:

When you start poking at a deeply entrenched system like that, it's no surprise those within the system are gonna be upset.

These two comments compliment each other so well, I had to bring them together.
 
2013-10-06 10:59:16 AM  

Muta: Fluid: When you start poking at a deeply entrenched system like that, it's no surprise those within the system are gonna be upset.

Isn't the Pope's word the word of God?  Are Bishops questioning the word of God?


Only when he says it is; so far, he's merely stating his opinion.
 
2013-10-06 11:01:24 AM  
He needs to watch his back.  *AhemJohnPaulOneCoughCough*
 
2013-10-06 11:07:22 AM  
The floor of hell is paved with the skulls of bishops. - St. Athanasius, Council of Nicaea, AD 325
 
2013-10-06 11:07:39 AM  
St. Malachi last seen wagging his finger.
 
2013-10-06 11:09:16 AM  
The thing about the priesthood is that it really offers excellent job security, probably some of the best you can get anywhere these days. I've been suggesting it to my brother for a while. Room, board, a salary, usually no commute to speak of, vacation time, seminary's paid for...

...there are just all of these other things that go along with it.

/Not like he's dating or anything though.
//maybe he just doesn't like the alb.
///he'd still be allowed to experiment with homebrewing. And he could bless the beer!
 
2013-10-06 11:10:07 AM  
I know!  They're such assholes!

FlashHarry: Nabb1: The laity in the US has been growing more and more fed up with American bishops for years, so this comes as no surprise.

yup.

seconded


Thirded

/I heart Francis
 
2013-10-06 11:10:50 AM  
Back in the eighties, American Bishops were too liberal for the laity.  What happened?
 
2013-10-06 11:10:51 AM  
Hey, c'mon now. The bishops have a very difficult job!

Shuffling boy-rapers among the parishes and hiding assets isn't easy.
 
2013-10-06 11:13:05 AM  
Can't make any of the cross-back bastards happy. Where's Allen Hunt, the dirty-double switcher when you need him?
 
2013-10-06 11:13:17 AM  

LibertyHiller: Muta: Fluid: When you start poking at a deeply entrenched system like that, it's no surprise those within the system are gonna be upset.

Isn't the Pope's word the word of God?  Are Bishops questioning the word of God?

Only when he says it is; so far, he's merely stating his opinion.


The Pope is only infallible when he speaks ex cathedra. The last time that happened was 1950. What Francis is doing in his recent speeches is more like memos from the CEO. And if the Bishops disagree with the boss too much or often, the Pope has mechanisms for dealing with it.
 
2013-10-06 11:13:33 AM  

lingua: The thing about the priesthood is that it really offers excellent job security, probably some of the best you can get anywhere these days. I've been suggesting it to my brother for a while. Room, board, a salary, usually no commute to speak of, vacation time, seminary's paid for...

...there are just all of these other things that go along with it.

/Not like he's dating or anything though.
//maybe he just doesn't like the alb.
///he'd still be allowed to experiment with homebrewing. And he could bless the beer!


The local seminary actually has a bar, too.  Been invited but being in a seminary bar with the SO's Irish relatives just didn't seem like a wise idea.

fugeeface: He needs to watch his back.  *AhemJohnPaulOneCoughCough*


I kinda do worry about that.
 
2013-10-06 11:13:55 AM  

flondrix: Back in the eighties, American Bishops were too liberal for the laity.  What happened?


consortiumnews.com
 
2013-10-06 11:15:16 AM  
Well, he does have some nerve, following the teachings of Christ like that.  Some nerve indeed.

/Fark the bishops.
//yeah, not at all young enough for their tastes...
 
2013-10-06 11:17:24 AM  
Keep in mind that Ratzinger set the bar quite low.
 
2013-10-06 11:19:13 AM  
Silly cults.
 
2013-10-06 11:22:11 AM  

simplicimus: LibertyHiller: Muta: Fluid: When you start poking at a deeply entrenched system like that, it's no surprise those within the system are gonna be upset.

Isn't the Pope's word the word of God?  Are Bishops questioning the word of God?

Only when he says it is; so far, he's merely stating his opinion.

The Pope is only infallible when he speaks ex cathedra. The last time that happened was 1950. What Francis is doing in his recent speeches is more like memos from the CEO. And if the Bishops disagree with the boss too much or often, the Pope has mechanisms for dealing with it.

Ex cathedra

is only one of the requirements; although the 1994 letter Ordinatio Sacerdotalis is not itself an ex cathedra proclamation, its contents ("only men can be priests") are considered infallible teaching.
 
2013-10-06 11:24:24 AM  

fugeeface: He needs to watch his back.  *AhemJohnPaulOneCoughCough*


pixel.nymag.com

/should avoid the bedtime tea
 
2013-10-06 11:25:53 AM  
It amuses me that people refer to a pope who advocates the actual teachings of Jesus as "radical."
 
2013-10-06 11:28:26 AM  

LibertyHiller: Muta: Fluid: When you start poking at a deeply entrenched system like that, it's no surprise those within the system are gonna be upset.

Isn't the Pope's word the word of God?  Are Bishops questioning the word of God?

Only when he says it is; so far, he's merely stating his opinion.


So the Pope is repeating the stuff God mumbles under his breath?
 
2013-10-06 11:33:54 AM  
My head spins when i try to comprehend the fact that its the Catholic Church that is initiating a reaction against post-9/11 conservativism.
 
2013-10-06 11:37:28 AM  

Muta: LibertyHiller: Muta: Fluid: When you start poking at a deeply entrenched system like that, it's no surprise those within the system are gonna be upset.

Isn't the Pope's word the word of God?  Are Bishops questioning the word of God?

Only when he says it is; so far, he's merely stating his opinion.

So the Pope is repeating the stuff God mumbles under his breath?


I'd say it's more like JP2 and Benny16 pretended they were deaf, but whatever works for you.
 
2013-10-06 11:44:24 AM  

Three Crooked Squirrels: As a lapsed Catholic, some of the poll numbers in that article make me happy. In my anecdotal experience, Catholics are much more progressive than the Catholic Church. I don't know many who care that much about gay marriage, and don't think I know any that care about a birth control mandate in health care. It has always seemed to me that when the Catholic Church made stands against things like the birth control mandate, it was evangelicals (or just right wingers in general) who yelled the loudest about Catholics being forced to violate their religious beliefs, while the ordinary Catholic didn't really care about such nonsense. Also, anecdotal evidence is a form of evidence.


I think most folk don't care about the condom thing. It's abortion where there's a lot less division, I think. While the health of the mother is paramount, I don't think the church will deviate that far on the sanctity of life argument... whether it's murderers on death row, wars, or the abortion issue. Social justice, sanctity of life - kind of go hand in hand IMO.

/abusing children, not so much
 
2013-10-06 11:46:05 AM  
Yeah but are the bishops still interested in exploiting small children?
 
2013-10-06 12:00:47 PM  

flondrix: Back in the eighties, American Bishops were too liberal for the laity.  What happened?


JPII happened. People think of him as good ol' Pope, but he was an arch conservative who appointed likeminded bishops.
 
2013-10-06 12:01:46 PM  

bwilson27: Does the Pope shiat in the woods?



http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Is_the_bear_a_Catholic%3F

You're welcome.
 
2013-10-06 12:05:40 PM  

flondrix: Back in the eighties, American Bishops were too liberal for the laity.  What happened?


Older conservative Catholics are dying off.

The thing is the American branch of the church is about as conservative and retrograde as any outside of Africa and at times more conservative than the Vatican.

If you watch the church in Europe, even in Italy, they tend to speak the Vatican line then shrug their shoulders and do what they want.
 
2013-10-06 12:25:20 PM  
Dude is farking with the patriarchy and the shame based system of control.
 
2013-10-06 12:30:11 PM  

jaylectricity: Religion is designed to get inside your bedroom and make you feel ashamed for it, then tell you what to do to repent your sins.

It used to be a brilliant way to control people, but that trust is eroding as the years go by.


The problem religion has been having in this particular arena is that, in the '80s, AIDS kind of taught us all once and for all that our habit of leaving sex all arcane and mysterious because we thought it was exciting was capable of getting people straight-up killed.

So... we've been researching sexual topics, and in spite of religion scrabbling away at that last weak handhold with its dying gasps... people have gotten more educated in spite of all the effort, at least on average.  You can't really scare people about masturbation being a sin, for instance, when they can look it up online and find out that it's an important part of maintaining good prostate health.

People say that science is the enemy of religion, but that's not really the case.   Education is what's killing it, now just as in the 1500s when we started putting nails in that particular coffin by actually finding out how death, lightning, storms, precipitation, and so on worked, and, worse, telling everyone that cared.  Sex is just one of the last few nails.
 
2013-10-06 12:38:08 PM  
Well of course catholic clergy don't like him.
img.pr0gramm.com
 
2013-10-06 12:39:36 PM  

jaylectricity: Religion is designed to get inside your bedroom and make you feel ashamed for it, then tell you what to do to repent your sins.

It used to be a brilliant way to control little people, but that trust is eroding as the years go by.


FTFY. The elite were never really controlled, per se. You have no incentive to be good if you can just buy an expensive absolution before you die.
 
2013-10-06 12:40:02 PM  
Hell, I like the new pope and I ain't even Catholic
 
2013-10-06 12:50:10 PM  

Muta: Has the Pope said if it is OK to pop a catholic chick in the pooper yet?


As long as it's a chick not a guy, I don't think he's ever come hard against it. And even for young boys, he'll still let it slide.
 
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