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(NBC News)   Profiles of uninsured who would rather pay the fine than join Obamacare. Yes, they are exactly as you expect   (m.nbcnews.com) divider line 267
    More: Dumbass, obamacare, health cares, hold outs, socialized medicine  
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7956 clicks; posted to Politics » on 05 Oct 2013 at 5:13 PM (42 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



267 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-10-05 12:56:22 PM
"Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-10-05 01:08:21 PM
"I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said. "At some point where it would make financial sense to pay for insurance rather than pay fines, I will make the decision from a financial standpoint."

Yes, being a freeloader is usualy cheaper.  Getting all the benefits of living in a developed country while not paying taxes would probably save you some cash too.
 
2013-10-05 01:13:18 PM
So a guy who home schools his 10 kids in rural Idaho because he distrusts the government, a guy that believes both health insurance and single payer are evil, and a hypocrite.

The third guy is really a gem:

FTA:
Mark, a 51-year-old contractor in Colorado, recently worked through the pain of a broken rib because he lacks health insurance. He'll be signing up, even though his truck carries a bumper sticker that spells out Obama's name as "One big-ass mistake, America".
 
2013-10-05 01:57:24 PM
I think the Dems should go ahead and give up the individual mandate, totally.
But.... with a caveat. A big one.
Anyone that opts out, needs to be totally out. No insurance at all. You want to be a boostrappy individualist, you pay 100% for all care. No exceptions. And just like student loans, no discharge through bankruptcy.

All right, Randians, time to put up or shut up.
 
2013-10-05 02:09:30 PM
I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.
 
2013-10-05 02:44:45 PM
"I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said.


I calculated that it's cheaper for me not to have car insurance, as long as I am not in an accident.  It's cheaper for me to not have homeowner's insurance, as long as nothing happens to damage my house.  It's cheaper for me to not have health insurance, as long as I don't get sick or injured.

However, I realize those things could happen, so I bought the insurance anyway, to protect me from unexpected tragedies.  That's what insurance is for.  If I do get sick or injured, the money I spent on insurance will be more than offset by the money I save getting my care paid for.

Why is that concept so hard for Republicans to grasp?
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-10-05 02:58:39 PM

Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.


That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?
 
2013-10-05 03:32:34 PM

vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?


Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.
 
2013-10-05 03:43:56 PM
FloydA:

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.

ER's are going to have to deny treatment to anybody without health insurance. Maybe this whole death panel thing isn't actually that bad of an idea, if you could have been insured and chose not to be, then you're on your own. The boot-strap crowd can get all boot-strappy with their own emergency medical care.
 
2013-10-05 04:35:29 PM

ginandbacon: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*


*blink*
*blink*

*blink*

I...
 
2013-10-05 04:43:06 PM
Well, who did you think was crashing the exchanges trying to get in?  The young healthy people looking to increase their contribution to the collective, or the already costly unhealthy people looking to have someone else pick up most of their tab?

/Does it really surprise you that the intended victims of this ponzi scheme aren't eager to be fleeced?
 
2013-10-05 04:43:59 PM

FloydA: vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.


Ayup. This is the big thing everyone seems to miss. People are still going to get sick and you are still going to be stuck paying for it whether or not they have insurance.
 
2013-10-05 04:45:34 PM

Il Douchey: Well, who did you think was crashing the exchanges trying to get in?  The young healthy people looking to increase their contribution to the collective, or the already costly unhealthy people looking to have someone else pick up most of their tab?

/Does it really surprise you that the intended victims of this ponzi scheme aren't eager to be fleeced?


That's what you got out of this?
 
2013-10-05 04:47:54 PM

ginandbacon: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*


Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.
 
2013-10-05 04:48:43 PM
If'n he's fer it, I'm agin it
 
2013-10-05 05:00:37 PM

swaniefrmreddeer: ER's are going to have to deny treatment to anybody without health insurance. Maybe this whole death panel thing isn't actually that bad of an idea, if you could have been insured and chose not to be, then you're on your own. The boot-strap crowd can get all boot-strappy with their own emergency medical care.


Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.


Coco LaFemme: Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.


A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.
 
2013-10-05 05:09:45 PM
vartian:

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.

I was trying to be absurd, but the people against healthcare reform are the ones who will end up costing everybody when they show up in the ER. Medical bills are the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US and you can't get blood from a stone.
 
2013-10-05 05:10:06 PM

vartian: Coco LaFemme: Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.


You make it sound like I'm advocating for eugenics or something.  I'm not.  I'm advocating for common sense.  If you're poor and can barely afford to care for yourself, it makes absolutely no sense to have that many children.  If you've got so many kids that you can't afford to insure them and you have to put everyone on Medicaid, that's a problem.

Condoms are cheaper than health insurance.  Wrap that shiat up.
 
2013-10-05 05:10:14 PM
Honest question:  I thought you guys were going to get free universal healthcare like the rest of us do, what's this you gotta pay out of pocket business?  Why not just do the right thing and extract it via taxation like anything else?  Then these idiots who are so bad at life just flat out can't avoid what's best for them.
 
2013-10-05 05:13:35 PM

BumpInTheNight: Honest question:  I thought you guys were going to get free universal healthcare like the rest of us do, what's this you gotta pay out of pocket business?  Why not just do the right thing and extract it via taxation like anything else?  Then these idiots who are so bad at life just flat out can't avoid what's best for them.


That would be an ideal solution.  Unfortunately a large portion of the US population still views socialized programs as bad, despite how effective they are everywhere else they've been implemented, or how effective they've been here in terms of Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, and Public Education.
 
2013-10-05 05:17:11 PM

Dallymo: ginandbacon: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*

*blink*
*blink*

*blink*

I...


img.fark.net
 
2013-10-05 05:18:26 PM

Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.


A friend from high school who to date has been one of the derpiest derpers who ever derped, a total gun nut, and a giant racist sack of anti-Obama shiat just found out this week that he has MS.

Now I wouldn't wish MS on my worst enemy and I'm genuinely upset at the diagnosis, but I would be lying if I said I don't think the current existential crisis he's undergoing is more than a little instructive. I'll be curious to see what his views on ACA are 3 years hence.
 
2013-10-05 05:18:39 PM

vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?


It's duck season.
 
2013-10-05 05:19:56 PM

DirkValentine: It's duck season.


Wabbit season!
 
2013-10-05 05:21:07 PM
I can't help but note that the three people profiled are from Idaho, Montana and Colorado.
 
2013-10-05 05:21:24 PM
cc1984:That's what you got out of this?

Yup.  The article is hardly representative of the population.  You could cite three or four anecdotes among millions of Americans to suggest whatever you like.  Mine was more of a general questioning of the viability of Obamamcare.
 
2013-10-05 05:24:16 PM

Gosling: I can't help but note that the three people profiled are from Idaho, Montana and Colorado.


Colorado is a fairly blue state, but the other two....that's about what I'd expect.
 
2013-10-05 05:24:45 PM

swaniefrmreddeer: vartian:

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.

I was trying to be absurd, but the people against healthcare reform are the ones who will end up costing everybody when they show up in the ER. Medical bills are the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US and you can't get blood from a stone.


Whatever, you're canadian, what would you know about proper healthcare.
 
2013-10-05 05:25:00 PM
"I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

unless this guy's making $9500/year writing software (maybe school assignments on vDesk or something) sounds like he's in for a rude surprise.
 
2013-10-05 05:25:42 PM
Can we get Collett some birth control?
 
2013-10-05 05:26:26 PM

2wolves: Can we get Collett some birth control?


I don't even think Obamacare covers that.
 
2013-10-05 05:27:03 PM

Coco LaFemme: vartian: Coco LaFemme: Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.

You make it sound like I'm advocating for eugenics or something.  I'm not.  I'm advocating for common sense.  If you're poor and can barely afford to care for yourself, it makes absolutely no sense to have that many children.  If you've got so many kids that you can't afford to insure them and you have to put everyone on Medicaid, that's a problem.

Condoms are cheaper than health insurance.  Wrap that shiat up.


B-bu-but condoms make Baby Jesus cry!!!

/given that it's Idaho, I wouldn't be surprised if this was the reason that guy isn't using birth control
 
2013-10-05 05:28:33 PM

ginandbacon: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*


If he has that many kids, he would probably be eligible for Medicaid himself. I just looked up eligibility requirements for Medicaid in Idaho. For a household with 12 residents (himself, his wife and 10 kids), the most he can make is $8,590 a month ($103,080 a year). One of the ways an adult in Idaho to get Medicaid is if they have a child under the age of 19. As his kids are on Medicaid and he most likely has a kid under age 19, he would qualify as well.
 
2013-10-05 05:28:43 PM

Coco LaFemme: Gosling: I can't help but note that the three people profiled are from Idaho, Montana and Colorado.

Colorado is a fairly blue state, but the other two....that's about what I'd expect.


denver and boulder are blue, the rest of the state is pretty red.  colorado springs comes to mind.  see also: state reps voting against hurricane relief but for colorado flood disaster relief.
 
2013-10-05 05:28:53 PM

Dallymo: ginandbacon: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*

*blink*
*blink*

*blink*

I...


Yeah me too.
 
2013-10-05 05:31:18 PM

FloydA: vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.


Seriously. This is apparently a concept that Republicans are mentally incapable of understanding. They scream "No Obamacare! No government using my taxes to pay for other people's health" as if our taxes aren't already being used to pay for other people's health via ER expenses. And this is one of the 2 biggest reasons why the US spends so much in health care and yet has worse quality than almost every other developed country. If we're already spending the money anyway, what is the problem of reforming the system to make it a little more efficient?
 
2013-10-05 05:31:38 PM

swaniefrmreddeer: FloydA:

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.

ER's are going to have to deny treatment to anybody without health insurance. Maybe this whole death panel thing isn't actually that bad of an idea, if you could have been insured and chose not to be, then you're on your own. The boot-strap crowd can get all boot-strappy with their own emergency medical care.



if memory serves, and sometimes it dont
that was the "price" for buying out the charity hospitals
 
2013-10-05 05:32:42 PM

spcMike: swaniefrmreddeer: vartian:

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.

I was trying to be absurd, but the people against healthcare reform are the ones who will end up costing everybody when they show up in the ER. Medical bills are the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US and you can't get blood from a stone.

Whatever, you're canadian, what would you know about proper healthcare.


I went to the ER in the states once. They maxed out my credit card and I had insurance.
 
2013-10-05 05:32:42 PM
So the first guy has a ton of kids who are all on Medicaid.

If he were female and black, the Republicans would call him a welfare queen.
 
2013-10-05 05:33:06 PM
It's a tax, not a fine.

Which Kochsucking rag is this?
 
2013-10-05 05:33:32 PM

pueblonative: DirkValentine: It's duck season.

Wabbit season!


Ed Zachary
 
2013-10-05 05:33:34 PM
You guys are glossing over the best part.  The dude that has all 10 kids covered by Medicaid also believes:

FTA: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho

*facepalm*
 
2013-10-05 05:34:42 PM

LazarusLong42: So the first guy has a ton of kids who are all on Medicaid.

If he were female and black, the Republicans would call him a welfare queen.


Damn those imaginary republicans!
 
2013-10-05 05:35:47 PM

Frozboz: You guys are glossing over the best part.  The dude that has all 10 kids covered by Medicaid also believes:

FTA: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho

*facepalm*


Maybe he thinks keeping his kids out of the public school and homeschooling them himself evens out the balance.
 
2013-10-05 05:38:02 PM

Il Douchey: cc1984:That's what you got out of this?

Yup.  The article is hardly representative of the population.  You could cite three or four anecdotes among millions of Americans to suggest whatever you like.  Mine was more of a general questioning of the viability of Obamamcare.


You sounded so concerned.
 
2013-10-05 05:40:48 PM

Coco LaFemme: vartian: Coco LaFemme: Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.

You make it sound like I'm advocating for eugenics or something.  I'm not.  I'm advocating for common sense.  If you're poor and can barely afford to care for yourself, it makes absolutely no sense to have that many children.  If you've got so many kids that you can't afford to insure them and you have to put everyone on Medicaid, that's a problem.

Condoms are cheaper than health insurance.  Wrap that shiat up.


Keep in mind... If Reps stopped trying to defund, hamper or close Planned Parenthood, there are also cheap/free birth control pills. Heck, the state of Maine (when I was there from 2001-2006) gave away condoms upon request, without red tape or any tracking. All of that is cheaper and easier than the responsibility of being a parent. I made sure that I was never in a position to get pregnant when I couldn't afford more than myself... Because I want my children to not be in serious want.
 
2013-10-05 05:41:05 PM

Frozboz: You guys are glossing over the best part.  The dude that has all 10 kids covered by Medicaid also believes:

FTA: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho

*facepalm*


Don't forget this part of TFA soon after your quoted comment... But it's "absolutely not okay," that they are, Collett says quickly. "There are a lot of people out there that'll cry foul."
 
2013-10-05 05:44:07 PM
This guy ran for office.   http://www.gregcollettforidaho.com/
 
2013-10-05 05:44:18 PM

vudutek: I think the Dems should go ahead and give up the individual mandate, totally.
But.... with a caveat. A big one.
Anyone that opts out, needs to be totally out. No insurance at all. You want to be a boostrappy individualist, you pay 100% for all care. No exceptions. And just like student loans, no discharge through bankruptcy.

All right, Randians, time to put up or shut up.


One fatal flaw in your plan: the only people who would actually refuse emergency care to randian assholes would be other randian assholes.
 
2013-10-05 05:44:41 PM

Frozboz: You guys are glossing over the best part.  The dude that has all 10 kids covered by Medicaid also believes:

FTA: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho

*facepalm*


I think somebody should be double-checking his code...
 
2013-10-05 05:45:05 PM

DirkValentine: vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?

It's duck season.


Goddamn right. We've been beating the absolute dog shiat out of woodies and blue wings this week.
 
2013-10-05 05:46:16 PM
I think if people want to opt out of the mandate they should be allowed; however, the law needs to be changed which classifies those medical debts and related debts incurred because you opted out as non-bankruptable.  If you decide to freeload then you don't get a chance to wipe out the debt due to your bad decision.

We'll see how many people decide to opt out when they realize the true weight of their decision and that they can't squirm out of it later.
 
2013-10-05 05:47:20 PM

Il Douchey: Well, who did you think was crashing the exchanges trying to get in?  The young healthy people looking to increase their contribution to the collective, or the already costly unhealthy people looking to have someone else pick up most of their tab?

/Does it really surprise you that the intended victims of this ponzi scheme aren't eager to be fleeced?


The already costly people you mentioned were already getting socialized care via Medicare, Medicaid and the VA.

But you already knew that...
 
2013-10-05 05:49:23 PM
It would be immoral and unethical, but what I want is for these ppl, were they to get sick, have them just kicked to the curb. I'm sure jesus or someone will help them, he gave free health care too.
 
2013-10-05 05:53:40 PM

vartian: swaniefrmreddeer: ER's are going to have to deny treatment to anybody without health insurance. Maybe this whole death panel thing isn't actually that bad of an idea, if you could have been insured and chose not to be, then you're on your own. The boot-strap crowd can get all boot-strappy with their own emergency medical care.

Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

Coco LaFemme: Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.


If they are red state morons who oppose things just because Obama is for them then yes they do deserve to suffer
 
2013-10-05 05:55:27 PM
Wait, his ten kids are covered by medicaid but he doesn't even want that?

And this guy is a software developer?

Did someone put acid in my morning coffee?
 
2013-10-05 05:56:29 PM

Warlordtrooper: vartian: swaniefrmreddeer: ER's are going to have to deny treatment to anybody without health insurance. Maybe this whole death panel thing isn't actually that bad of an idea, if you could have been insured and chose not to be, then you're on your own. The boot-strap crowd can get all boot-strappy with their own emergency medical care.

Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

Coco LaFemme: Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.

If they are red state morons who oppose things just because Obama is for them then yes they do deserve to suffer


Obama is almost a Christlike figure here.

He suffered in order to give you salvation to the masses. For those who accept his sacrifice, a lifetime of grace awaits. For those who don't, punishment and damnation awaits.

/St. Bob the healer.
 
2013-10-05 05:57:01 PM
I'm the libbiest lib ever, but it makes no rational sense for me to accept ACA coverage. I work for a very small business that is exempted from pretty much all employment law in the first place, so there's no mandate to provide or subsidize coverage; and I make too much money to be given any federal subsidy for my premiums. For me to enroll in a bronze-level plan, I'm looking at monthly premiums that cost about 9.5% of my income to get 60% coverage. In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0 and coincidentally, I've been saving around 10% of my monthly income for the last eight or nine years. If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using (and if  I do, the plan I'd be getting would only cover 60% of expenses) when I could be using that money to save for a home or a car or something other than letting an insurance executive make a yacht payment.

I really want to hold out for single payer. The deal I'm getting is a huge shiat sandwich.
 
2013-10-05 05:59:29 PM
"I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said. "At some point where it would make financial sense to pay for insurance rather than pay fines, I will make the decision from a financial standpoint."

Yeah, Mark?  That 'point' is called when you unexpectedly get sick or injured.  Unless, of course, you're one of those republicans who manages to expectedly get sick.  Then you might have a point.  Oh, wait ...

Mark, a 51-year-old contractor in Colorado, recently worked through the pain of a broken rib because he lacks health insurance.

... you're not one of them, or else you would have been able to avoid breaking a rib.  Tell me Mark, how much did the ambulance ride and ER visit for that cost you?  Would it have been cheaper if you had been paying insurance premiums for a few years beforehand.  Or how about if that rib broke just a bit more and poked a lung?  What's your plan then?
 
2013-10-05 05:59:47 PM

vudutek: I think the Dems should go ahead and give up the individual mandate, totally.
But.... with a caveat. A big one.
Anyone that opts out, needs to be totally out. No insurance at all. You want to be a boostrappy individualist, you pay 100% for all care. No exceptions. And just like student loans, no discharge through bankruptcy.

All right, Randians, time to put up or shut up.


My hope is that 5 years hence when some dipshiat show up in the ER without insurance he/she will be given the dirty looks and lectured.  He will get the minimum stabilizing treatment and billed out the wazoo.
 
2013-10-05 06:00:44 PM

GhostFish: And this guy is a software developer?


He does the cows for Farmville.
 
2013-10-05 06:05:01 PM

fusillade762: Ayup. This is the big thing everyone seems to miss. People are still going to get sick and you are still going to be stuck paying for it whether or not they have insurance.


Except that pre-Obamacare there was some sympathy for people who didn't have insurance.  Without knowing the details of someone's life I could assume that health insurance wasn't available or affordable for this person.  Post-Obamacare when someone waltzes into the ER without insurance people are going to want to know why.  I think there will be some social pressure on these deadbeats.
 
2013-10-05 06:05:28 PM

likefunbutnot: If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using


And you know that ... how?
 
2013-10-05 06:06:33 PM

red5ish: GhostFish: And this guy is a software developer?

He does the cows for Farmville.


That was way better than the joke I was going to make.
 
2013-10-05 06:08:35 PM

FloydA: "I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said.


I calculated that it's cheaper for me not to have car insurance, as long as I am not in an accident.  It's cheaper for me to not have homeowner's insurance, as long as nothing happens to damage my house.  It's cheaper for me to not have health insurance, as long as I don't get sick or injured.

However, I realize those things could happen, so I bought the insurance anyway, to protect me from unexpected tragedies.  That's what insurance is for.  If I do get sick or injured, the money I spent on insurance will be more than offset by the money I save getting my care paid for.

Why is that concept so hard for Republicans to grasp?


Because they lack insight and conscience.
 
2013-10-05 06:11:01 PM

the_vegetarian_cannibal: FloydA: vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.

Seriously. This is apparently a concept that Republicans are mentally incapable of understanding. They scream "No Obamacare! No government using my taxes to pay for other people's health" as if our taxes aren't already being used to pay for other people's health via ER expenses. And this is one of the 2 biggest reasons why the US spends so much in health care and yet has worse quality than almost every other developed country. If we're already spending the money anyway, what is the problem of reforming the system to make it a little more efficient?


That would be soshulizum.
 
2013-10-05 06:11:47 PM

likefunbutnot: I'm the libbiest lib ever, but it makes no rational sense for me to accept ACA coverage. I work for a very small business that is exempted from pretty much all employment law in the first place, so there's no mandate to provide or subsidize coverage; and I make too much money to be given any federal subsidy for my premiums. For me to enroll in a bronze-level plan, I'm looking at monthly premiums that cost about 9.5% of my income to get 60% coverage. In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0 and coincidentally, I've been saving around 10% of my monthly income for the last eight or nine years. If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using (and if  I do, the plan I'd be getting would only cover 60% of expenses) when I could be using that money to save for a home or a car or something other than letting an insurance executive make a yacht payment.

I really want to hold out for single payer. The deal I'm getting is a huge shiat sandwich.


No no.  It's excellent legislation -- which was not at all a handout to the health insurance industry -- that must be defended at all costs because we had to do SOMETHING~!
 
2013-10-05 06:11:53 PM
i.imgur.com
howdemocracyworks.files.wordpress.com

I cannot grasp why a modern, developed country would not have universal healthcare.

I mean, I've seen the Fark threads that show up every now and then, with farkers begging for donations because their nearest and dearest are sick. And it's depressing to see. My mother survived breast cancer because, through general taxation, everyone in the UK has a basic safety net of the NHS.

She could have gone private, and paid for it, which would have cost big £££s. She may have got her treatment sooner, or in more comfortable conditions. But she didn't have to as healthcare is a basic foundation of society that everyone needs at some point.

And the ultimate irony is in those images I've posted. Americans spend the most on healthcare, with the smallest returns.

/I'm not suggesting that the NHS is perfect, by the way. There have been several major scandals recently, but it seems better than what's available to your average American.
 
2013-10-05 06:12:27 PM

red5ish: GhostFish: And this guy is a software developer?

He does the cows for Farmville.


I had you Farkied simply as "smart" previous to that post.

I will now add "funny" to your Farkie.

Congratulations. You've earned it.

/Depressing article all in all.
//Coulda been sub-titled "Profles in Derpage".
///Third slashie goes where?
 
2013-10-05 06:12:32 PM

pueblonative: 2wolves: Can we get Collett some birth control?

I don't even think Obamacare covers that.


But boner pills are still covered.
 
2013-10-05 06:13:27 PM

iron de havilland: [i.imgur.com image 850x462]
[howdemocracyworks.files.wordpress.com image 675x349]

I cannot grasp why a modern, developed country would not have universal healthcare.

I mean, I've seen the Fark threads that show up every now and then, with farkers begging for donations because their nearest and dearest are sick. And it's depressing to see. My mother survived breast cancer because, through general taxation, everyone in the UK has a basic safety net of the NHS.

She could have gone private, and paid for it, which would have cost big £££s. She may have got her treatment sooner, or in more comfortable conditions. But she didn't have to as healthcare is a basic foundation of society that everyone needs at some point.

And the ultimate irony is in those images I've posted. Americans spend the most on healthcare, with the smallest returns.

/I'm not suggesting that the NHS is perfect, by the way. There have been several major scandals recently, but it seems better than what's available to your average American.


yup
 
2013-10-05 06:14:41 PM

2wolves: pueblonative: 2wolves: Can we get Collett some birth control?

I don't even think Obamacare covers that.

But boner pills are still covered.


The catholic church doesn't seem to have a problem with old guys having non-reproductive sex.
 
2013-10-05 06:17:31 PM
"Collett counts himself among the 29 percent of people who said in an NBCNews/Kaiser poll they are angry about the health reform law. "The issue for me is that it is not the proper role of government," he said.

Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."


I really can't get over this
 
2013-10-05 06:18:48 PM

whistleridge: A friend from high school who to date has been one of the derpiest derpers who ever derped, a total gun nut, and a giant racist sack of anti-Obama shiat just found out this week that he has MS.

Now I wouldn't wish MS on my worst enemy and I'm genuinely upset at the diagnosis, but I would be lying if I said I don't think the current existential crisis he's undergoing is more than a little instructive. I'll be curious to see what his views on ACA are 3 years hence.


I can tell you exactly what his views will be.

In private, he'll be happy and grateful that Obama changed things so that health insurance companies can't deny him coverage for pre-existing conditions, thereby making the cost of his treatments is merely extremely painful through copays and deductibles, rather than bankrupting and then totally unaffordable.

In public, he will never, ever, ever again mention or make note of how he is financing his treatment.  He will still rail against Obama and the rest of the socialists, but if ever someone asks him a question on Obamacare, he will find some way to either move the conversation to another subject, dodge the question, or simply shut up.

I know this because it is the behavior of one of my coworkers.  His son had just graduated college and was unable to find a job.  However, he still needed to pay for his insulin and some other drugs related to his diabetes - which in total, without insurance, would cost around $600 a month.  My coworker was complaining one day about how his son wasn't going to be able to afford those drugs and he (the father) would have to give him the money to pay out of pocket.  That's when I pointed out that one of the changes of Obamacare was that kids could stay on parents plans until they were 26 - or, in other words, the kid didn't need to find his own insurance for another 4 years.

My coworker was going to pay out-of-pocket for his son's medication simply because he didn't know the child was still covered under his own insurance.  Since then, he has never spoken up about Obamacare again, although he still does broadcast Glen Beck daily across the office.

I'm holding my next comment in reserve for if the son doesn't get insurance through work when he ages out of dad's plan - asking if pop's is glad that insurance companies have to sell him a policy even though he has a $7,200/year pre-existing condition.
 
2013-10-05 06:19:46 PM

Karac: And you know that ... how?


14 out of the last 15 years, I've had zero medical expenses. I'm at low risk for developing chronic health issues over the next five years and the most likely way that I would be injured is in an automobile accident, in which case my car insurance would provide coverage.

I don't think it makes rational sense for me to pay slightly more than half what I pay to have a home each month for the right to 60% off coupon of expenses that I will either not use at all *or* will still be so vastly expensive that I will be bankrupted after care has been provided.
 
2013-10-05 06:20:29 PM

super_grass: LazarusLong42: So the first guy has a ton of kids who are all on Medicaid.

If he were female and black, the Republicans would call him a welfare queen.

Damn those imaginary republicans!


Oh, if only they were imaginary.
 
2013-10-05 06:23:06 PM

Daniels: likefunbutnot: I'm the libbiest lib ever, but it makes no rational sense for me to accept ACA coverage. I work for a very small business that is exempted from pretty much all employment law in the first place, so there's no mandate to provide or subsidize coverage; and I make too much money to be given any federal subsidy for my premiums. For me to enroll in a bronze-level plan, I'm looking at monthly premiums that cost about 9.5% of my income to get 60% coverage. In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0 and coincidentally, I've been saving around 10% of my monthly income for the last eight or nine years. If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using (and if  I do, the plan I'd be getting would only cover 60% of expenses) when I could be using that money to save for a home or a car or something other than letting an insurance executive make a yacht payment.

I really want to hold out for single payer. The deal I'm getting is a huge shiat sandwich.

No no.  It's excellent legislation -- which was not at all a handout to the health insurance industry -- that must be defended at all costs because we had to do SOMETHING~!


I think what dipshiat meant to say is: While you personally do not benefit from the new healthcare law, is the extra burden worth it for your less fortunate neighbors to have access to healthcare where they previously wouldn't?
 
2013-10-05 06:23:46 PM

iron de havilland: I cannot grasp why a modern, developed country would not have universal healthcare.

I mean, I've seen the Fark threads that show up every now and then, with farkers begging for donations because their nearest and dearest are sick. And it's depressing to see. My mother survived breast cancer because, through general taxation, everyone in the UK has a basic safety net of the NHS.

She could have gone private, and paid for it, which would have cost big £££s. She may have got her treatment sooner, or in more comfortable conditions. But she didn't have to as healthcare is a basic foundation of society that everyone needs at some point.

And the ultimate irony is in those images I've posted. Americans spend the most on healthcare, with the smallest returns.

/I'm not suggesting that the NHS is perfect, by the way. There have been several major scandals recently, but it seems better than what's available to your average American.


Because if Jesus wanted poor people to have healthcare, he would have gone around healing them himself.
 
2013-10-05 06:25:57 PM
Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered.

While growing up my father worked for the Forest Service.

I graduated from the University of Idaho in 1997 with a B.S. degree.

We home school our children and attend church in Marsing as members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.


His childhood security was made possible by the government. His college education was made possible by the government. His kids' health is made possible by the government. Based on Medicaid and family number, they are on food stamps. When I think of a young Republican tool, this is their snapshot.
 
2013-10-05 06:26:16 PM
Not having health insurance in the U.S., where doctors and hospitals charge prices bordering on absurdity *just because they can*, is one of the dumbest things you can do.

"I'm healthy, I don't need it."

That's fine, until you get hit by a bus and need months of hospital care.
 
2013-10-05 06:27:23 PM

likefunbutnot: I'm the libbiest lib ever, but it makes no rational sense for me to accept ACA coverage. I work for a very small business that is exempted from pretty much all employment law in the first place, so there's no mandate to provide or subsidize coverage; and I make too much money to be given any federal subsidy for my premiums. For me to enroll in a bronze-level plan, I'm looking at monthly premiums that cost about 9.5% of my income to get 60% coverage. In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0 and coincidentally, I've been saving around 10% of my monthly income for the last eight or nine years. If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using (and if  I do, the plan I'd be getting would only cover 60% of expenses) when I could be using that money to save for a home or a car or something other than letting an insurance executive make a yacht payment.

I really want to hold out for single payer. The deal I'm getting is a huge shiat sandwich.


The reason to get insurance is for the security.  It's quite possible for a single accident or illness to push you into seven figures of medical expenses, meaning one single adverse event could shoot your dreams of home ownership down the toilet forever.

Also note the 60% is an average across everyone on the plan - those who actually have a serious injury or illness will have a much higher percentage of their expenses paid by insurance, so if you do manage to rack up a million dollars in medical expenses, you're certainly not on the hook for 400k of it.

If you're fairly healthy, you actually want a lower actuarial value for your plan, because the decrease in premiums, for you, will be greater than the increase in out-of-pocket expenses.  You're assuming more of the risk for your health, but if you're overall quite healthy, that risk is lessened.  A gold or platinum plan makes a lot more sense for someone that is sicker - the increase in premiums wouldn't be worth it for a healthier person, but the decrease in cost-sharing makes sense if you're less healthy.
 
2013-10-05 06:28:57 PM

likefunbutnot: I don't think it makes rational sense for me to pay slightly more than half what I pay to have a home each month for the right to 60% off coupon of expenses that I will either not use at all *or* will still be so vastly expensive that I will be bankrupted after care has been provided.


You are either a liar or living in Guatemala in which case, none of this applies.
 
2013-10-05 06:29:30 PM

FloydA: "I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said.


I calculated that it's cheaper for me not to have car insurance, as long as I am not in an accident.  It's cheaper for me to not have homeowner's insurance, as long as nothing happens to damage my house.  It's cheaper for me to not have health insurance, as long as I don't get sick or injured.

However, I realize those things could happen, so I bought the insurance anyway, to protect me from unexpected tragedies.  That's what insurance is for.  If I do get sick or injured, the money I spent on insurance will be more than offset by the money I save getting my care paid for.

Why is that concept so hard for Republicans to grasp?


I blame the meth.
 
2013-10-05 06:30:01 PM

Karac: likefunbutnot: If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using

And you know that ... how?


Duh, because he didn't need it before.
 
2013-10-05 06:33:37 PM

likefunbutnot: 14 out of the last 15 years, I've had zero medical expenses.


I know someone who went 15 years without seeing a doctor, meanwhile his bladder got so big it shut down his kidneys and he almost died.  Spent many days in the hospital, some in a coma, and might be on a catheter the rest of his life.  You may very well be hurting yourself by not getting preventative care.
 
2013-10-05 06:34:03 PM
And two years from now they will be first in line to complain that they dont get services fast enough.
 
2013-10-05 06:35:06 PM

red5ish: GhostFish: And this guy is a software developer?

He does the cows for Farmville.


There were 10 times where he did the wrong cow.
 
2013-10-05 06:36:00 PM
organizmx: "Collett counts himself among the 29 percent of people who said in an NBCNews/Kaiser poll they are angry about the health reform law. "The issue for me is that it is not the proper role of government," he said.

Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."


I really can't get over this

It's nothing new.

[keepgovernmenthandsoffmymedicaresigns.jpg]
 
2013-10-05 06:37:10 PM

DigitalCoffee: red5ish: GhostFish: And this guy is a software developer?

He does the cows for Farmville.

There were 10 times where he did the wrong cow.


AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!! Oh this poor sap!
 
2013-10-05 06:37:21 PM

pueblonative: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

unless this guy's making $9500/year writing software (maybe school assignments on vDesk or something) sounds like he's in for a rude surprise.




He's correct, the fine for the first year is $95.
 
2013-10-05 06:38:02 PM
When your income is barely enough to survive on, and every dollar counts, it's understandable that paying $100 a year in fines sounds like a better option than paying $100 a month for subsidized health coverage.
 
2013-10-05 06:41:15 PM

likefunbutnot: I don't think it makes rational sense for me to pay slightly more than half what I pay to have a home each month for the right to 60% off coupon of expenses that I will either not use at all *or* will still be so vastly expensive that I will be bankrupted after care has been provided.


60% insurance doesn't mean you pay 40% across the board.  You pay considerably more than 40% of the cheaper, common expenses (you're probably paying about 66-80% of the cost of an office visit as part of the copay) but in exchange, you pay a lot less than 40% of a major cost (for example, for a severe heart attack, insurance would probably end up paying around 97% of the cost).  The risk of going bankrupt can be greatly reduced (and would more likely come from a loss of income rather than a large amount of expense).
 
2013-10-05 06:42:54 PM

Schroedinger's Glory Hole: Daniels: likefunbutnot: I'm the libbiest lib ever, but it makes no rational sense for me to accept ACA coverage. I work for a very small business that is exempted from pretty much all employment law in the first place, so there's no mandate to provide or subsidize coverage; and I make too much money to be given any federal subsidy for my premiums. For me to enroll in a bronze-level plan, I'm looking at monthly premiums that cost about 9.5% of my income to get 60% coverage. In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0 and coincidentally, I've been saving around 10% of my monthly income for the last eight or nine years. If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using (and if  I do, the plan I'd be getting would only cover 60% of expenses) when I could be using that money to save for a home or a car or something other than letting an insurance executive make a yacht payment.

I really want to hold out for single payer. The deal I'm getting is a huge shiat sandwich.

No no.  It's excellent legislation -- which was not at all a handout to the health insurance industry -- that must be defended at all costs because we had to do SOMETHING~!

I think what dipshiat meant to say is: While you personally do not benefit from the new healthcare law, is the extra burden worth it for your less fortunate neighbors to have access to healthcare where they previously wouldn't?


No.  I meant exactly what I said.  I'm pro single-payer.  It was garbage when it was passed and it's garbage now.  Only now dipshiats are pretending it's not garbage when it pushed back what we actually need to do 30-50 more years.
 
2013-10-05 06:44:14 PM

organizmx: iron de havilland: I cannot grasp why a modern, developed country would not have universal healthcare.

I mean, I've seen the Fark threads that show up every now and then, with farkers begging for donations because their nearest and dearest are sick. And it's depressing to see. My mother survived breast cancer because, through general taxation, everyone in the UK has a basic safety net of the NHS.

She could have gone private, and paid for it, which would have cost big £££s. She may have got her treatment sooner, or in more comfortable conditions. But she didn't have to as healthcare is a basic foundation of society that everyone needs at some point.

And the ultimate irony is in those images I've posted. Americans spend the most on healthcare, with the smallest returns.

/I'm not suggesting that the NHS is perfect, by the way. There have been several major scandals recently, but it seems better than what's available to your average American.

Because if Jesus wanted poor people to have healthcare, he would have gone around healing them himself.


+1, would LOL again
 
2013-10-05 06:44:40 PM

poot_rootbeer: When your income is barely enough to survive on, and every dollar counts, it's understandable that paying $100 a year in fines sounds like a better option than paying $100 a month for subsidized health coverage.


It does sound better until you actually get sick, go to the ER and are instantly saddled with more than your entire year's worth of premiums in one shot.
 
2013-10-05 06:45:22 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Il Douchey: Well, who did you think was crashing the exchanges trying to get in?  The young healthy people looking to increase their contribution to the collective, or the already costly unhealthy people looking to have someone else pick up most of their tab?

/Does it really surprise you that the intended victims of this ponzi scheme aren't eager to be fleeced?

That's what you got out of this?


For the perpetually persecuted, there are always victims.
 
2013-10-05 06:45:33 PM
"I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered.

So die in a fire you sack of shiat.
 
2013-10-05 06:46:05 PM
I'm paying for my own health care at the moment. A few days ago I received notice that my plan is not up to snuff and is going to die at the end of the year so I have to bump up to a different plan. Whee.

/Young Adult Blue Max
//soon to be Bronze plan something or other
 
2013-10-05 06:47:06 PM

poot_rootbeer: When your income is barely enough to survive on, and every dollar counts, it's understandable that paying $100 a year in fines sounds like a better option than paying $100 a month for subsidized health coverage.


Not when you factor in the value you gain by the insurance.  That's like saying the cost of owning a house is a lot more than the cost of living in a cardboard box under the bridge.  While that's true, you're getting something for that cost.

When I was uninsured, I had a very frightening episode.  I've told this one before, but I was crumpled in a ball on the floor from severe abdominal pain at about 2 in the morning.  I was weighing in my head whether or not to go to a hospital.  I knew I would be bankrupted from the cost of the ambulance and the emergency department, but on the other hand, if this was appendicitis and my appendix burst, it would probably have killed me.

Laying on the floor in agony weighing certain financial ruin versus potential death was among the worst experiences of my life.  If I could possibly have been insured for only $100 a month I would have jumped on that so fast it would make your head spin.
 
2013-10-05 06:47:22 PM

gaspode: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered.

So die in a fire you sack of shiat.


Can't get laid?
 
2013-10-05 06:48:51 PM

Dallymo: ginandbacon: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*

*blink*
*blink*

*blink*

I...


He's the one who says that he doesn't think government has a role in healthcare. Yes, the guy with 10 kids on Medicaid.
 
2013-10-05 06:49:05 PM

HempHead: pueblonative: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

unless this guy's making $9500/year writing software (maybe school assignments on vDesk or something) sounds like he's in for a rude surprise.

He's correct, the fine for the first year is $95.


His logic (like yours) is faulty.

The penalty for 2014 is $95 or 1% of your income, whichever is greater. So unless he makes $9,500 a year, he's going to be paying more than $95.
 
2013-10-05 06:51:07 PM

vartian: swaniefrmreddeer: ER's are going to have to deny treatment to anybody without health insurance. Maybe this whole death panel thing isn't actually that bad of an idea, if you could have been insured and chose not to be, then you're on your own. The boot-strap crowd can get all boot-strappy with their own emergency medical care.

Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

Coco LaFemme: Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.


Yeah, the Republican position on health care is disgusting.
 
2013-10-05 06:51:20 PM

Daniels: Schroedinger's Glory Hole: Daniels: likefunbutnot: I'm the libbiest lib ever, but it makes no rational sense for me to accept ACA coverage. I work for a very small business that is exempted from pretty much all employment law in the first place, so there's no mandate to provide or subsidize coverage; and I make too much money to be given any federal subsidy for my premiums. For me to enroll in a bronze-level plan, I'm looking at monthly premiums that cost about 9.5% of my income to get 60% coverage. In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0 and coincidentally, I've been saving around 10% of my monthly income for the last eight or nine years. If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using (and if  I do, the plan I'd be getting would only cover 60% of expenses) when I could be using that money to save for a home or a car or something other than letting an insurance executive make a yacht payment.

I really want to hold out for single payer. The deal I'm getting is a huge shiat sandwich.

No no.  It's excellent legislation -- which was not at all a handout to the health insurance industry -- that must be defended at all costs because we had to do SOMETHING~!

I think what dipshiat meant to say is: While you personally do not benefit from the new healthcare law, is the extra burden worth it for your less fortunate neighbors to have access to healthcare where they previously wouldn't?

No.  I meant exactly what I said.  I'm pro single-payer.  It was garbage when it was passed and it's garbage now.  Only now dipshiats are pretending it's not garbage when it pushed back what we actually need to do 30-50 more years.


We have insane farkers who are willing to shut down the government over a heavily compromised plan.  What possibility do you actually think there is of getting anything even close to single-payer in place with them around?!  This is the first step.  We've already waited for far, far too long to take that step.
 
2013-10-05 06:51:30 PM

Coco LaFemme: ginandbacon: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*

Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.


I think this butthook is also running for state legislature.  Seems like the same guy...
 
2013-10-05 06:52:35 PM

likefunbutnot: Karac: And you know that ... how?

14 out of the last 15 years, I've had zero medical expenses. I'm at low risk for developing chronic health issues over the next five years and the most likely way that I would be injured is in an automobile accident, in which case my car insurance would provide coverage.





LOL! You have never talked to someone injured in an automobile accident thatdidn't have health insurance have you?
You can hit that $30k per accident per person maximum in one visit to the ER after a not very serious accident.

When the hospital finds out you have no insurance they will move you to county poor folks hospital.

And then start sending you the bills.
 
2013-10-05 06:53:32 PM

gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid


I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:

www.gregcollettforidaho.com
 
2013-10-05 06:54:20 PM
"I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

He's exactly the right age bracket for a death blow heart attack. Just about 37 to 43 yo is when they start dropping.

//died unexpectedly
//died suddenly
 
2013-10-05 06:55:07 PM

The Dynamite Monkey: Coco LaFemme: ginandbacon: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*

Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.

I think this butthook is also running for state legislature.  Seems like the same guy...


Figures.
 
2013-10-05 06:59:03 PM

HOOBOY!: HempHead: LOL! You have never talked to someone injured in an automobile accident thatdidn't have health insurance have you?
You can hit that $30k per accident per person maximum in one visit to the ER after a not very serious accident.

When the hospital finds out you have no insurance they will move you to county poor folks hospital.

And then start sending you the bills.

I was in the ICU for 2 weeks. $300,000. $30K didn't cover the Tylenol they gave me.


It's always shocking when you see the ambulance bill, and that farker just got you to the hospital.
 
2013-10-05 06:59:33 PM

The Dynamite Monkey: gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid

I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:

[www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 200x245]


Wow, scanning over the rest of this douchebag's site and then keeping that whole 'too poor for ten kids but had them any ways and getting gov hand outs left, right & center to cover for that' would spin his campaign right into the ground.

Anyone living in Idaho should be wary of this asshole.
 
2013-10-05 07:02:32 PM
The good news for Mr. Collett is that he can get his kids out from under Medicaid's thumb for only $285.  From healthcare.gov:

In 2014 the fee for uninsured children is $47.50 per child. The most a family would have to pay in 2014 is $285.

It's important to remember that someone who pays the fee won't get any health insurance coverage. They still will be responsible for 100% of the cost of their medical care.


$475 worth of government-free kids for only $285!
 
2013-10-05 07:04:21 PM

likefunbutnot: Karac: And you know that ... how?

14 out of the last 15 years, I've had zero medical expenses. I'm at low risk for developing chronic health issues over the next five years and the most likely way that I would be injured is in an automobile accident, in which case my car insurance would provide coverage.

I don't think it makes rational sense for me to pay slightly more than half what I pay to have a home each month for the right to 60% off coupon of expenses that I will either not use at all *or* will still be so vastly expensive that I will be bankrupted after care has been provided.


It's not always the chronic conditions that get you.  The bill the hospital sent our insurance company for my husband's appendectomy was $25,000.  That was just the hospital alone.  Not exactly something you can plan on.
 
2013-10-05 07:06:43 PM
GOP voters putting themselves in a position where they're more likely to die early?

i2.kym-cdn.com
 
2013-10-05 07:07:23 PM

www.gregcollettforidaho.com

Greg Collett, running for State Rep in Idaho.



That's right, programmer who can't afford all his kids wants to decide on the fate of yours.
 
2013-10-05 07:09:16 PM

likefunbutnot: I'm the libbiest lib ever, but it makes no rational sense for me to accept ACA coverage. I work for a very small business that is exempted from pretty much all employment law in the first place, so there's no mandate to provide or subsidize coverage; and I make too much money to be given any federal subsidy for my premiums. For me to enroll in a bronze-level plan, I'm looking at monthly premiums that cost about 9.5% of my income to get 60% coverage. In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0 and coincidentally, I've been saving around 10% of my monthly income for the last eight or nine years. If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using (and if  I do, the plan I'd be getting would only cover 60% of expenses) when I could be using that money to save for a home or a car or something other than letting an insurance executive make a yacht payment.

I really want to hold out for single payer. The deal I'm getting is a huge shiat sandwich.


That's 60% of expenses up to a ceiling (around 10k but varies IIRC) by the way, so if you have any large expenses you're not paying 40%. people get this wrong a lot it seems.
 
2013-10-05 07:10:00 PM

HOOBOY!: vrax: HOOBOY!: HempHead: LOL! You have never talked to someone injured in an automobile accident thatdidn't have health insurance have you?
You can hit that $30k per accident per person maximum in one visit to the ER after a not very serious accident.

When the hospital finds out you have no insurance they will move you to county poor folks hospital.

And then start sending you the bills.

I was in the ICU for 2 weeks. $300,000. $30K didn't cover the Tylenol they gave me.

It's always shocking when you see the ambulance bill, and that farker just got you to the hospital.

I live about 3 miles from the hospital. $1800 and we didn't even hit a drive thru.


I mean, I'm thankful as anything for our first responders, but when you see the itemization on those bills, it's just absurd.  It's like the Army procured those bandages at the same time as their golden toilet seats or something.
 
2013-10-05 07:10:24 PM

vudutek: I think the Dems should go ahead and give up the individual mandate, totally.
But.... with a caveat. A big one.
Anyone that opts out, needs to be totally out. No insurance at all. You want to be a boostrappy individualist, you pay 100% for all care. No exceptions. And just like student loans, no discharge through bankruptcy.

All right, Randians, time to put up or shut up.

 
2013-10-05 07:14:20 PM

vpb: "I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said. "At some point where it would make financial sense to pay for insurance rather than pay fines, I will make the decision from a financial standpoint."

Yes, being a freeloader is usualy cheaper.  Getting all the benefits of living in a developed country while not paying taxes would probably save you some cash too.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emergency_Medical_Treatment_and_Active_ La bor_Act
time to repeal this act
and let this asshole die next time he needs ER treatment
or at least ream him for every penny left to his name
 
2013-10-05 07:16:08 PM

BumpInTheNight: [www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 157x220]Greg Collett, running for State Rep in Idaho.


That's right, programmer who can't afford all his kids wants to decide on the fate of yours.


THAT guy has known the touch of an actual woman?
 
2013-10-05 07:18:21 PM

Craptastic: BumpInTheNight: [www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 157x220]Greg Collett, running for State Rep in Idaho.


That's right, programmer who can't afford all his kids wants to decide on the fate of yours.

THAT guy has known the touch of an actual woman?


They're all foster children so maybe not.  That concept just raises even more red flags like how does someone who can't afford to insure his kids keep getting allowed to buy more?
 
2013-10-05 07:18:33 PM

BumpInTheNight: [www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 157x220]Greg Collett, running for State Rep in Idaho.


That's right, programmer who can't afford all his kids wants to decide on the fate of yours.



i39.tinypic.com
 
2013-10-05 07:19:10 PM

HOOBOY!: As a husband, father, independent contractor, hobby farmer


As a hobby farmer in Idaho, he pays less real estate tax than his neighbors. How much less? Probably 99% less.

Link

Republicans, here is your poster child.
 
2013-10-05 07:19:29 PM

FloydA: vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.


Every farking thread... every farking one...

THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!
 
2013-10-05 07:20:26 PM

BumpInTheNight: [www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 157x220]Greg Collett, running for State Rep in Idaho.


That's right, programmer who can't afford all his kids wants to decide on the fate of yours.


Now, to be fair to him, it doesn't appear that he's still running.  He seems to have lost the primary.
But, just to poke fun at this guy with 10 kids on medicaid (a federal/state program), here's one of his quotes from the site
Idaho should not support the food stamp program nor any other welfare program.  It is time to stop the forced redistribution of wealth.  Adding arbitrary requirements to qualify for programs that should not even exist in the first place does not do anything to solve the real problem.
 
2013-10-05 07:20:46 PM
According to his bio, he is a Mormon.  Add more crazy to the fire.
 
2013-10-05 07:25:25 PM

BumpInTheNight: Craptastic: BumpInTheNight: [www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 157x220]Greg Collett, running for State Rep in Idaho.


That's right, programmer who can't afford all his kids wants to decide on the fate of yours.

THAT guy has known the touch of an actual woman?

They're all foster children so maybe not.  That concept just raises even more red flags like how does someone who can't afford to insure his kids keep getting allowed to buy more?


Wait, these are foster children?  What irresponsible government agency is giving him children he can't afford to insure properly?
 
2013-10-05 07:28:10 PM
I expect people who wouldn't be able to pay even a heavily subsidized insurance rate, and still wouldn't be able to scrounge up enough money to pay a copay on a routine doctor's visit...

*checks link*

...oh, of course, it's the smaller percentage of people who could afford it, but are assholes.
 
2013-10-05 07:29:18 PM

HempHead: pueblonative: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

unless this guy's making $9500/year writing software (maybe school assignments on vDesk or something) sounds like he's in for a rude surprise.

He's correct, the fine for the first year is $95.


also the only way the IRS can collect it is by deducting it from a tax refund.
It is part of the obamacare law that they can't garnishee your wages or do any of the usual sort of things they can do for any other debt.
 
2013-10-05 07:32:17 PM

firefly212: Every farking thread... every farking one...

THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!


Why do you post this when you can easily find that it is false? The ER treats everyone who comes in the door with a problem. More than half of all ER visits are for non-urgent care.

And there is obvious abuse. The Integrated Care Collaboration in Central Texas determined that nine patients accounted for about 2,700 emergency room visits there.
 
2013-10-05 07:32:44 PM

HempHead: pueblonative: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

unless this guy's making $9500/year writing software (maybe school assignments on vDesk or something) sounds like he's in for a rude surprise.

He's correct, the fine for the first year is $95.


No he isn't.

The fine for the first year is $95 or 1% of his income, whichever is greater.  So if he's making $9500 a year he's right.  If he's making any more than that, however, the fine goes up.
 
2013-10-05 07:34:21 PM

firefly212: FloydA: vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.

Every farking thread... every farking one...

THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!


(Hoping you are joking, but...) LOL!  Tell that to the ER!  I've sat in the ER for hours with people who are there with just about every minor thing your could name.  Our local major ER splits people off into what is essentially an urgent care subgroup for your typical uninsured cold, flu, and boo-boo people, but the intake is exactly the same.  Their load would probably be cut in half if these people had access to your typical primary care physician.
 
2013-10-05 07:34:52 PM

AnEvilGuest: HempHead: pueblonative: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

unless this guy's making $9500/year writing software (maybe school assignments on vDesk or something) sounds like he's in for a rude surprise.

He's correct, the fine for the first year is $95.

also the only way the IRS can collect it is by deducting it from a tax refund.
It is part of the obamacare law that they can't garnishee your wages or do any of the usual sort of things they can do for any other debt.


Also that is true.  However, you know what they can garnish your wages for?  Medical bills.
 
2013-10-05 07:37:22 PM

Karac: likefunbutnot: If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using

And you know that ... how?


He saw it on the Internet. It was posted by a French model.
 
2013-10-05 07:37:28 PM

Il Douchey: Does it really surprise you that the intended victims of this ponzi scheme aren't eager to be fleeced?


Actually, young fitness nuts are among the demographic least likely to be critical of Obamacare.  You know, liburals.
 
2013-10-05 07:37:45 PM

DigitalCoffee: red5ish: GhostFish: And this guy is a software developer?

He does the cows for Farmville.

There were 10 times where he did the wrong cow.


Okay, there've been a lot of comments about this guy needing condoms and such, and all his kids being on Medicaid, but I just visited his site. As far as I can tell, his kids are either adopted or foster care children -- and if foster care . . . well, they're automatically covered by Medicare.

I'm not white knighting this guy. In fact I wanted to change his Weeners, ""I calculated it out. . . ." to something that more accurately represented his politics: I studied it out. . . .

Family profile, Greg Collett

He's still a moron . . . but he seems to have one or two redeeming qualities.
 
2013-10-05 07:38:17 PM

HOOBOY!: vrax: (Hoping you are joking, but...) LOL! Tell that to the ER! I've sat in the ER for hours with people who are there with just about every minor thing your could name. Our local major ER splits people off into what is essentially an urgent care subgroup for your typical uninsured cold, flu, and boo-boo people, but the intake is exactly the same. Their load would probably be cut in half if these people had access to your typical primary care physician.

Hey, pal. My dry skin WAS an emergency to me.


You know who could have helped with that:

lh3.ggpht.com
 
2013-10-05 07:39:08 PM
The fine is almost the biggest problem I have with all of this.  In my opinion, the fine should be replaced with really shiatty high deductible coverage, so at least people are getting something if they have to pay anyway.
 
2013-10-05 07:42:34 PM

likefunbutnot: Karac: And you know that ... how?

14 out of the last 15 years, I've had zero medical expenses. I'm at low risk for developing chronic health issues over the next five years and the most likely way that I would be injured is in an automobile accident, in which case my car insurance would provide coverage.

I don't think it makes rational sense for me to pay slightly more than half what I pay to have a home each month for the right to 60% off coupon of expenses that I will either not use at all *or* will still be so vastly expensive that I will be bankrupted after care has been provided.


And then BOOM! MRSA

/or a spider bite
//or a slippery wet floor
///or angry bees
////or virtually anything
 
2013-10-05 07:42:40 PM

HOOBOY!: vrax: (Hoping you are joking, but...) LOL! Tell that to the ER! I've sat in the ER for hours with people who are there with just about every minor thing your could name. Our local major ER splits people off into what is essentially an urgent care subgroup for your typical uninsured cold, flu, and boo-boo people, but the intake is exactly the same. Their load would probably be cut in half if these people had access to your typical primary care physician.

Hey, pal. My dry skin WAS an emergency to me.


I'm sorry!  Here..


i44.tinypic.com
 
2013-10-05 07:43:09 PM
Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered.

Dude is a parasite plain and simple.
 
2013-10-05 07:44:08 PM

FloydA: "I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said.


I calculated that it's cheaper for me not to have car insurance, as long as I am not in an accident.  It's cheaper for me to not have homeowner's insurance, as long as nothing happens to damage my house.  It's cheaper for me to not have health insurance, as long as I don't get sick or injured.

However, I realize those things could happen, so I bought the insurance anyway, to protect me from unexpected tragedies.  That's what insurance is for.  If I do get sick or injured, the money I spent on insurance will be more than offset by the money I save getting my care paid for.

Why is that concept so hard for Republicans to grasp?


It's even more stupid than that. You actually may not get into an accident or have your home burn down, but you will eventually get sick and need to go to a hospital.

Health "insurance" is really a giant misnomer.
 
2013-10-05 07:44:09 PM

The Dynamite Monkey: gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid

I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:

[www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 200x245]


In as much of an assclown as this guy is, his kids are covered by Medicaid.  So the only thing he doesn't feel is worth insuring is himself, which. . .well, now that you think about it.


BraveNewCheneyWorld: The fine is almost the biggest problem I have with all of this.  In my opinion, the fine should be replaced with really shiatty high deductible coverage, so at least people are getting something if they have to pay anyway.


In other words, you don't show insurance and you have the funds you get signed up for Medicaid E and the premiums get taken  out of your paycheck.  If you want to get out of it you show proof of insurance and three months paid ahead of time.  That's fine (pardon the pun).  Or, if you want the fine to be effective, make it the median between a silver and gold plan.
 
2013-10-05 07:44:20 PM

Delay: firefly212: Every farking thread... every farking one...

THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!

Why do you post this when you can easily find that it is false? The ER treats everyone who comes in the door with a problem. More than half of all ER visits are for non-urgent care.

And there is obvious abuse. The Integrated Care Collaboration in Central Texas determined that nine patients accounted for about 2,700 emergency room visits there.


Huey P long medical center ER in Louisiana: as a kid I've been there for sprained wrist, broken arm, and dizziness/fainting. Because we had Medicaid (or w/e the hell covers kids there).

Wait 6 hours before you are seen, yeah, but they still treat you.
 
2013-10-05 07:44:51 PM

Bucky Katt: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered.

Dude is a parasite plain and simple.


Wonder if he's related to that douchebag in Arizona, the polygamist who has 27 kids by three or four women, never works and collects welfare on all of them because Jeezus.
 
2013-10-05 07:46:27 PM

vicioushobbit: Delay: firefly212: Every farking thread... every farking one...

THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!

Why do you post this when you can easily find that it is false? The ER treats everyone who comes in the door with a problem. More than half of all ER visits are for non-urgent care.

And there is obvious abuse. The Integrated Care Collaboration in Central Texas determined that nine patients accounted for about 2,700 emergency room visits there.

Huey P long medical center ER in Louisiana: as a kid I've been there for sprained wrist, broken arm, and dizziness/fainting. Because we had Medicaid (or w/e the hell covers kids there).

Wait 6 hours before you are seen, yeah, but they still treat you.


I forgot to add the ER visit for appendicitis, where people with SPIDER BITES were seen before my ass.
 
2013-10-05 07:47:25 PM
FTA: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."


Also FTA: ""I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup."

I read both sentences, then read them again. Then i decided to place my brain in a warm bath, and not think any more for the day.
/f*cking idiots
 
2013-10-05 07:50:06 PM

The Dynamite Monkey: gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid

I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:

[www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 200x245]


Okay, you're just being ingenuous . . . obviously you've been to his site (ya got the picture). Did you miss the part about them being adoptive foster kids? Of course they're on Medicaid . . . they are wards of the state.

I've ignored most of the moronic statements others made because it was likely the commenters were unaware of the nature of the relationship between Greg and the kids, but you went to his site and know he didn't sire them.

He may have sired one or two (I think I see an infant), but he didn't sire ten of them.
 
2013-10-05 07:53:32 PM

HammerHeadSnark: The Dynamite Monkey: gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid

I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:

[www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 200x245]

Okay, you're just being ingenuous . . . obviously you've been to his site (ya got the picture). Did you miss the part about them being adoptive foster kids? Of course they're on Medicaid . . . they are wards of the state.

I've ignored most of the moronic statements others made because it was likely the commenters were unaware of the nature of the relationship between Greg and the kids, but you went to his site and know he didn't sire them.

He may have sired one or two (I think I see an infant), but he didn't sire ten of them.


So he took in eight other kids without the means to insure them and let the state pick that tab up, rather than free them from the tyranny of gubmn't healthcare?  Is that what you're saying?
 
2013-10-05 07:54:46 PM

HammerHeadSnark: The Dynamite Monkey: gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid

I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:

[www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 200x245]

Okay, you're just being ingenuous . . . obviously you've been to his site (ya got the picture). Did you miss the part about them being adoptive foster kids? Of course they're on Medicaid . . . they are wards of the state.

I've ignored most of the moronic statements others made because it was likely the commenters were unaware of the nature of the relationship between Greg and the kids, but you went to his site and know he didn't sire them.

He may have sired one or two (I think I see an infant), but he didn't sire ten of them.


Who cares if they're his biological children or not?  He can't afford to properly insure them, and he keeps getting more and more....like he's collecting Beanie Babies or Pokemon or something.  It makes no difference if he's adopting them or farking his wife into a coma.  If you can't afford to take care of your progeny properly, DON'T HAVE CHILDREN.
 
2013-10-05 07:59:45 PM

Il Douchey: Well, who did you think was crashing the exchanges trying to get in?  The young healthy people looking to increase their contribution to the collective, or the already costly unhealthy people looking to have someone else pick up most of their tab?

/Does it really surprise you that the intended victims of this ponzi scheme aren't eager to be fleeced?


You didn't read the article, did you?
 
2013-10-05 08:02:04 PM

FloydA: vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.


The bills will follow them and if they owe enough they might be forced into bankruptcy, I have seen it happen, so at least we get some schadenfreude.
 
2013-10-05 08:03:22 PM

firefly212: FloydA: vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.

Every farking thread... every farking one...

THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!


The one where I work does. Wish it didn't, wish patients knew what an emergency was, but you're incorrect. I've seen folks come in for refills on their meds.
 
2013-10-05 08:09:23 PM

vpb: "I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said. "At some point where it would make financial sense to pay for insurance rather than pay fines, I will make the decision from a financial standpoint."

Yes, being a freeloader is usualy cheaper.  Getting all the benefits of living in a developed country while not paying taxes would probably save you some cash too.


I'm curious how he'd answer this question if he were pinned behind the steering wheel that's crushing his sternum.
 
2013-10-05 08:12:07 PM

HOOBOY!: HammerHeadSnark: The Dynamite Monkey: gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid

I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:

[www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 200x245]

Okay, you're just being ingenuous . . . obviously you've been to his site (ya got the picture). Did you miss the part about them being adoptive foster kids? Of course they're on Medicaid . . . they are wards of the state.

I've ignored most of the moronic statements others made because it was likely the commenters were unaware of the nature of the relationship between Greg and the kids, but you went to his site and know he didn't sire them.

He may have sired one or two (I think I see an infant), but he didn't sire ten of them.

What does this change?


His adopted/foster kids are covered by Medicaid because it's a condition their placement, but he doesn't think they should be. While he's still a gigantic dumbass (who has run for public office in Idaho twice and gotten trounced both times...think about that, he's too crazy to govern in Idaho!), he's not a hypocrite since if he had his way he'd leave his own kids uninsured too. So he's got that going for him, I guess.
 
2013-10-05 08:13:01 PM
So he took in eight other kids without the means to insure them and let the state pick that tab up, rather than free them from the tyranny of gubmn't healthcare?  Is that what you're saying?

No, I'm saying they are *not* his kids . . . they are wards of the state and the state pays their insurance *and* an allowance for their clothes and all kinds of stuff. All the guy and his wife did was remove some kids from an orphanage and provide them a home.

Of course, the guy and his wife prob'ly get eight or nine hunnert bucks per kid per month . . . but hey, he's raisin' somebody else's kids. That oughta be worth somethin'. Right?

I'm not a Republican and my first thoughts were pretty much in line with everyone else's re: him being some anti-gubmint maroon. I guess in my heart I have a small amount of respect for the guy that willfully picks up another man's burden.

Now you guys stop being mad at me . . . I'm in Costa Rica recovering from (self-paid) oral surgery.
 
2013-10-05 08:13:38 PM
Occam's Disposable Razor:  The one where I work does. Wish it didn't, wish patients knew what an emergency was, but you're incorrect. I've seen folks come in for refills on their meds.

Rural?  More patients = more DSH money.
 
2013-10-05 08:13:52 PM
Mark, a 51-year-old contractor in Colorado, recently worked through the pain of a broken rib because he lacks health insurance. He'll be signing up, even though his truck carries a bumper sticker that spells out Obama's name as "One big-ass mistake, America".

"Obamacare, here we come," said Mark, who also declined to give his full name.


We don't need his full name. I hope he gets the insurance, heals properly and has the courage and mental fortitude to scrape that bumper sticker off his truck.
 
2013-10-05 08:14:01 PM

HammerHeadSnark: DigitalCoffee: red5ish: GhostFish: And this guy is a software developer?

He does the cows for Farmville.

There were 10 times where he did the wrong cow.

Okay, there've been a lot of comments about this guy needing condoms and such, and all his kids being on Medicaid, but I just visited his site. As far as I can tell, his kids are either adopted or foster care children -- and if foster care . . . well, they're automatically covered by Medicare.

I'm not white knighting this guy. In fact I wanted to change his Weeners, ""I calculated it out. . . ." to something that more accurately represented his politics: I studied it out. . . .

Family profile, Greg Collett

He's still a moron . . . but he seems to have one or two redeeming qualities.


You are correct, all foster children who receive federal reimbursement for foster care expenses are eligible for Medicaid. However, in my understanding, Idaho is one of those states that does not accept federal reimbursement. Who would have thought?

Idaho currently foster care pays (monthly) $274 up to age 2, $300 up to age 9 and $431 up to age 16. The Federal (MARC) levels are (monthly) $602 up to age 2, $689 up to age 9 and $756 up to age 16. Essentially, Idaho needs to increase its payments to get reimbursed by the Federal government, therefore his kids are on Medicaid because of family size and his income.
 
2013-10-05 08:15:00 PM

FloydA: Why is that concept so hard for Republicans to grasp?


If you get sick, you should be putting all your faith in Jesus.

Buying health insurance demonstrates a lack of faith

They find your lack of faith disturbing
 
2013-10-05 08:15:00 PM

HammerHeadSnark: Now you guys stop being mad at me . . . I'm in Costa Rica recovering from (self-paid) oral surgery.


Whoa that's rough, don't the Costa Ricans know about tools like scalpels and such?
 
2013-10-05 08:15:50 PM

vrax: poot_rootbeer: When your income is barely enough to survive on, and every dollar counts, it's understandable that paying $100 a year in fines sounds like a better option than paying $100 a month for subsidized health coverage.

It does sound better until you actually get sick, go to the ER and are instantly saddled with more than your entire year's worth of premiums in one shot.


What the Fark Independents fail to realize is an ER will stabilize you and provide emergency treatment. The additional maintenance treatment can and will be denied if you are without insurance or ability to pay. Granted without the maintenance treatment  you will be back at some point but you will be much sicker than if you had the maintenance treatments you might need. This is especially true with things like diabetes and many heart issues. Also, the fact that they have to treat you in the ER does not mean that they don't charge you and will happily force you into bankruptcy for the cost of the treatment.
 
2013-10-05 08:17:05 PM

HammerHeadSnark: No, I'm saying they are *not* his kids . . . they are wards of the state and the state pays their insurance *and* an allowance for their clothes and all kinds of stuff. All the guy and his wife did was remove some kids from an orphanage and provide them a home.



While technically you are correct, if it is anything like the "home" around the corner with 8 foster kids they are raised like cattle because "the more the merrier*"

*"merrier" being a word from a long forgotten language that means "greater the government pays us".
 
2013-10-05 08:18:33 PM

HammerHeadSnark: So he took in eight other kids without the means to insure them and let the state pick that tab up, rather than free them from the tyranny of gubmn't healthcare?  Is that what you're saying?

No, I'm saying they are *not* his kids . . . they are wards of the state and the state pays their insurance *and* an allowance for their clothes and all kinds of stuff. All the guy and his wife did was remove some kids from an orphanage and provide them a home.

Of course, the guy and his wife prob'ly get eight or nine hunnert bucks per kid per month . . . but hey, he's raisin' somebody else's kids. That oughta be worth somethin'. Right?

I'm not a Republican and my first thoughts were pretty much in line with everyone else's re: him being some anti-gubmint maroon. I guess in my heart I have a small amount of respect for the guy that willfully picks up another man's burden.

Now you guys stop being mad at me . . . I'm in Costa Rica recovering from (self-paid) oral surgery.


Not mad at you, bro.  Not even mad at the dude for taking in kids.  But given that apparently he can't afford to insure those kids that he's taken in he might have thought "you know, maybe some government paid for health care isn't a bad thing in certain situations."  yeah it would be nice if it could be done without the government, but it can't.
 
2013-10-05 08:18:52 PM

Coco LaFemme: Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.


These are the same folks who think birth control and abortion is the devil.

vicioushobbit: I forgot to add the ER visit for appendicitis, where people with SPIDER BITES were seen before my ass.


Proper prioritization can solve this, and some of it is happening to some existent, but not to the level of detail that it should.

CSB time:

A few years ago, I had a pericarditis episode and my wife drove me to the ER.  I knew it wasn't a heart attack (because it was drug-induced and slow building), but I didn't quite know exactly what it is.  A hot shower made it much worse, which prompted me to get help, and it had all of the symptoms a heart attack by the time I was at the ER.

I remember getting to the ER with chest pain, shortness of breath, and telling the front desk lady my symptoms.  She then sat us down to get my medical information.  I remember thinking how dumbfounded I was with this lady casually trying to get my goddamn insurance information while I'm having, for all she knows, a heart attack right in front of her.

About 4-5 minutes into this paperwork bullshiat, with my wife answering most of my questions, I said something to the effect of "Chest pain... trouble breathing... doctor NOW!"  She disappeared behind a curtain and, a few seconds later, came back with "Yes, okay, they are ready for you now".

At least the blitzkerg of doctors and nurses right afterwards made up for it.
 
2013-10-05 08:19:03 PM
So you're telling me Operation Enlightened Trust Fund, or whatever that Koch Bros "grass-roots" campaign was to get college-educated kids to pay the fine instead of sign up was a hilarious failure??

/b-b-b-but liberal institutions REMOVE free will!!
 
2013-10-05 08:22:39 PM
Why is health care so expensive that every single person needs insurance to pay for it?
Why does any US citizen need insurance?
 
2013-10-05 08:23:16 PM

vudutek: I think the Dems should go ahead and give up the individual mandate, totally.
But.... with a caveat. A big one.
Anyone that opts out, needs to be totally out. No insurance at all. You want to be a boostrappy individualist, you pay 100% for all care. No exceptions. And just like student loans, no discharge through bankruptcy.

All right, Randians, time to put up or shut up.


And hospitals have the right to deny you service based on your inability to pay. If they want free markets...unfetter the hospitals from this barbaric requirement of being forced to waste resources on non-paying clients.
 
2013-10-05 08:26:53 PM

PinkFuzzyBunny: vudutek: I think the Dems should go ahead and give up the individual mandate, totally.
But.... with a caveat. A big one.
Anyone that opts out, needs to be totally out. No insurance at all. You want to be a boostrappy individualist, you pay 100% for all care. No exceptions. And just like student loans, no discharge through bankruptcy.

All right, Randians, time to put up or shut up.

And hospitals have the right to deny you service based on your inability to pay. If they want free markets...unfetter the hospitals from this barbaric requirement of being forced to waste resources on non-paying clients.


multimedia.billybrew.com


But keep on jerking off to Ayn Rand collecting her ss check while tossing teh poors to the hyenas.
 
2013-10-05 08:32:45 PM

jst3p: While technically you are correct, if it is anything like the "home" around the corner with 8 foster kids they are raised like cattle because "the more the merrier*"


Not defending this guy but don't paint all foster parents with the same brush.  I know one foster family who have fostered a lot of kids - and ended up adopting several of them.  Also know foster kids at my school whose stories make your heart break (like the kid who thankfully was being fostered when his father killed the kids grandmother.  He ended up being adopted by his foster family :-)
 
2013-10-05 08:34:35 PM

HotIgneous Intruder: Why is health care so expensive that every single person needs insurance to pay for it?
Why does any US citizen need insurance?


Good question. Base health care costs in the US are mostly set by the government. Here is 2012:

The formula for calculating 2012 physician fee schedule payment amount is as follows:
2012 Non-Facility Pricing Amount =
[(Work RVU * Work GPCI) +
(Transitioned Non-Facility PE RVU * PE GPCI) +
(MP RVU * MP GPCI)] * Conversion Factor (CF)
2012 Facility Pricing Amount =
[(Work RVU * Work GPCI) +
(Transitioned Facility PE RVU * PE GPCI) +
(MP RVU * MP GPCI)] * CF
The conversion factor for CY 2012 is $34.0376.

All clear?
 
2013-10-05 08:37:38 PM

LazarusLong42: So the first guy has a ton of kids who are all on Medicaid.

If he were female and black, the Republicans would call him a welfare queen.


And think of the food stamps he gets
 
2013-10-05 08:40:05 PM

LazarusLong42: So the first guy has a ton of kids who are all on Medicaid.

If he were female and black, the Republicans would call him a welfare queen.


I knew he was white simply from how they were using him as an example.
 
2013-10-05 08:50:23 PM

Wadded Beef: Mark, a 51-year-old contractor in Colorado, recently worked through the pain of a broken rib because he lacks health insurance. He'll be signing up, even though his truck carries a bumper sticker that spells out Obama's name as "One big-ass mistake, America".

"Obamacare, here we come," said Mark, who also declined to give his full name.

We don't need his full name. I hope he gets the insurance, heals properly and has the courage and mental fortitude to scrape that bumper sticker off his truck.


My girlfriend's family lives in the Denver suburbs and unfortunately, she knows plenty of people who are pretty much exactly like the guy in the article.

/and yes, they have the same bumper stickers too
 
2013-10-05 08:55:22 PM
Delay: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered.

While growing up my father worked for the Forest Service.

I graduated from the University of Idaho in 1997 with a B.S. degree.

We home school our children and attend church in Marsing as members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.


==

His childhood security was made possible by the government. His college education was made possible by the government. His kids' health is made possible by the government. Based on Medicaid and family number, they are on food stamps. When I think of a young Republican tool, this is their snapshot.

The family is probably also receiving Church Welfare too. Mormons take care of their own if they request it.
 
2013-10-05 08:57:12 PM

Doc Lee: Occam's Disposable Razor:  The one where I work does. Wish it didn't, wish patients knew what an emergency was, but you're incorrect. I've seen folks come in for refills on their meds.

Rural?  More patients = more DSH money.


Jackson, MS. Was the same story in Shreveport, LA when I was there, but I've heard Louisiana's governor is doing his best to bankrupt the healthcare system there by refusing federal funds, so their policies may have changed since then. I know Shreveport is no longer a level 1 trauma center.

Jackson has a "rapid track" that we try to shunt non emergent patients to, but it's understaffed and basically only open during business hours, so it doesn't help a whole lot.
 
2013-10-05 08:59:20 PM
Idaho currently foster care pays (monthly) $274 up to age 2, $300 up to age 9 and $431 up to age 16. The Federal (MARC) levels are (monthly) $602 up to age 2, $689 up to age 9 and $756 up to age 16. Essentially, Idaho needs to increase its payments to get reimbursed by the Federal government, therefore his kids are on Medicaid because of family size and his income.

So this guy gets about $4000 a month based on his family picture.  Nice way to supplement your income.  As a bonus, you have a bunch of chore slaves!

And he also gets to fill their heads with bullshiat and screw them up permanently, and your entry into Heaven is guaranteed if you sign up at least 10 people
 
2013-10-05 09:04:36 PM
"I would benefit from a socialized healthcare situation right now. But that's not to say that the socialized method is a good idea," he said. And he doesn't gamble with his two sons. One, in college, is covered through the school plan, while his high-school-aged son is covered by his mother's health insurance that she gets through her employer.

www.palzoo.net
 
2013-10-05 09:06:08 PM

Somacandra: The family is probably also receiving Church Welfare too. Mormons take care of their own if they request it.


Good point. Mormon contributions to fund his lifestyle are tax deductible expenses. I had not thought about that.
 
2013-10-05 09:13:16 PM

pueblonative: HammerHeadSnark: So he took in eight other kids without the means to insure them and let the state pick that tab up, rather than free them from the tyranny of gubmn't healthcare?  Is that what you're saying?

No, I'm saying they are *not* his kids . . . they are wards of the state and the state pays their insurance *and* an allowance for their clothes and all kinds of stuff. All the guy and his wife did was remove some kids from an orphanage and provide them a home.

Now you guys stop being mad at me . . . I'm in Costa Rica recovering from (self-paid) oral surgery.

Not mad at you, bro.  Not even mad at the dude for taking in kids.  But given that apparently he can't afford to insure those kids that he's taken in he might have thought "you know, maybe some government paid for health care isn't a bad thing in certain situations."  yeah it would be nice if it could be done without the government, but it can't.


Absolutely nothing in the article even suggested he couldn't afford insurance for the kids. The state of Idaho automatically enrolls foster kids in Medicaid . . . the health (and insurance) of foster kids is the responsibility of the state. While the guy may be providing a home for the kids, they are still wards of, and the responsibility of, the state. When the guy and his wife get a kid the kid arrives with a plastic garbage bag with all his worldly possessions, a file folder detailing school grades and accomplishments, and a Medicaid policy number . . . because, you see, the kids are not this guy's kids. They are the state's kids and the state has certain responsibilities, one of which is providing health care. Their dental care is also state paid. Clothing, too. Depending on the state -- and the child's age -- an allowance for spending money might also be available.

The only things foster families are required to provide are good home environment, educational opportunities, and food. Having a foster kids is like boarding someone's pet. Only much more work.

You guys can keep harping on crap about the insurance and Medicaid, but you clearly don't understand. Here's a short answer: ALL foster kids are always on Medicaid until they reach their majority. At that point they have "aged out" and are sent packing into the cold, cruel world . . . penniless and broken, setting forth once again with their shredded and torn garbage bag stuffed once again with all they possess. Well, that is, unless "mom 'n dad" adopt them and 'let' them care for the young 'uns.

/To the guy who wondered if Costa Ricans, without benefit of scalpels, do surgery with their teeth (oral surgery) I can say that's the first I've laughed since Monday.
 
2013-10-05 09:17:33 PM

TheAnalogKid: And he also gets to fill their heads with bullshiat and screw them up permanently, and your entry into Heaven is guaranteed if you sign up at least 10 people


In my work I deal with a lot of Mormon folks in Utah. I don't agree with their religion, and they never try to convert me (that may say more about me than them). They invite me to dinner at their houses and we often talk politics intelligently.

I don't agree that Mormon religious beliefs are any more bullshiat than some other religion.
 
2013-10-05 09:18:37 PM

BumpInTheNight: HammerHeadSnark: Now you guys stop being mad at me . . . I'm in Costa Rica recovering from (self-paid) oral surgery.

Whoa that's rough, don't the Costa Ricans know about tools like scalpels and such?


that was pretty funny. It made me laugh. Thanks.

Actually, this place is both awesome and amazingly affordable. Enough so that I saved thousands even while flying here first class from Seattle. Next time I may bring some tools with me -- will you be available?
 
2013-10-05 09:21:32 PM

Markoff_Cheney: Coco LaFemme: Gosling: I can't help but note that the three people profiled are from Idaho, Montana and Colorado.

Colorado is a fairly blue state, but the other two....that's about what I'd expect.

denver and boulder are blue, the rest of the state is pretty red.  colorado springs comes to mind.  see also: state reps voting against hurricane relief but for colorado flood disaster relief.


Don't forget Fort Collins, Vail, Aspen and Telluride. Fort Collins is a college town and the others are resort towns. I don't know why the resort towns go blue, but they do.
 
2013-10-05 09:25:10 PM
that's fine. They just have to pay upfront for medical services...
 
2013-10-05 09:25:19 PM

Delay: HammerHeadSnark: DigitalCoffee: red5ish: GhostFish: And this guy is a software developer?

He does the cows for Farmville.

There were 10 times where he did the wrong cow.

Okay, there've been a lot of comments about this guy needing condoms and such, and all his kids being on Medicaid, but I just visited his site. As far as I can tell, his kids are either adopted or foster care children -- and if foster care . . . well, they're automatically covered by Medicare.

I'm not white knighting this guy. In fact I wanted to change his Weeners, ""I calculated it out. . . ." to something that more accurately represented his politics: I studied it out. . . .

Family profile, Greg Collett

He's still a moron . . . but he seems to have one or two redeeming qualities.

You are correct, all foster children who receive federal reimbursement for foster care expenses are eligible for Medicaid. However, in my understanding, Idaho is one of those states that does not accept federal reimbursement. Who would have thought?

Idaho currently foster care pays (monthly) $274 up to age 2, $300 up to age 9 and $431 up to age 16. The Federal (MARC) levels are (monthly) $602 up to age 2, $689 up to age 9 and $756 up to age 16. Essentially, Idaho needs to increase its payments to get reimbursed by the Federal government, therefore his kids are on Medicaid because of family size and his income.


I had no idea Idaho was so backward . . . wait! Yes I did. Thanks for the numbers. I'm not certain how much the family gets each month or if whatever is received is taxable (on a state or federal level), but I don't begrudge that family a single cent. Children are a commitment -- one that I've never made.

The guy looks jerky and nerdy, and I'd prob'ly look upon him with disdain and sneer at him from my barstool, but knowing he's a foster parent tempers my natural nastiness.
 
2013-10-05 09:30:13 PM
/leaving satisfied
//excessive ignorance never fails to disappoint
 
2013-10-05 09:32:22 PM

FloydA: "I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said.


I calculated that it's cheaper for me not to have car insurance, as long as I am not in an accident.  It's cheaper for me to not have homeowner's insurance, as long as nothing happens to damage my house.  It's cheaper for me to not have health insurance, as long as I don't get sick or injured.

However, I realize those things could happen, so I bought the insurance anyway, to protect me from unexpected tragedies.  That's what insurance is for.  If I do get sick or injured, the money I spent on insurance will be more than offset by the money I save getting my care paid for.

Why is that concept so hard for Republicans to grasp?


That's one area where the "no pre-existing condition" part of the law is problematic, in that you can wait until you're sick to buy insurance, hence the fines.

This whole "compromise" is a farce; if we had gotten single payer we'd just be paying for this out of paychecks, and bozos like that couldn't try to screw the rest of us.
 
2013-10-05 09:35:08 PM

Selena Luna: Don't forget Fort Collins, Vail, Aspen and Telluride. Fort Collins is a college town and the others are resort towns. I don't know why the resort towns go blue, but they do.


They have contact with the outside world.

Republican politicians and media sources try to convince their victims that anyone from the northeast or the west coast are just limousine liberals out to steal all their money and give it to lazy, drugged-out, freeloading black welfare queens.

This is much harder to do if the their targets have been inoculated by actually met an someone from either coast or a person with a skin tone darker than lite mayonnaise.
 
2013-10-05 09:35:08 PM

HammerHeadSnark: Absolutely nothing in the article even suggested he couldn't afford insurance for the kids. The state of Idaho automatically enrolls foster kids in Medicaid . . . the health (and insurance) of foster kids is the responsibility of the state. While the guy may be providing a home for the kids, they are still wards of, and the responsibility of, the state. When the guy and his wife get a kid the kid arrives with a plastic garbage bag with all his worldly possessions, a file folder detailing school grades and accomplishments, and a Medicaid policy number . . . because, you see, the kids are not this guy's kids. They are the state's kids and the state has certain responsibilities, one of which is providing health care. Their dental care is also state paid. Clothing, too. Depending on the state -- and the child's age -- an allowance for spending money might also be available.


Other than the fact that he said that he'd rather pay the fine.  Okay, the state puts them on Medicaid regardless of the families ability to provide insurance.I get that.  But if he could afford it, wouldn't he have said something about that.he's providing insurance other than what the state is.  And if they cut that from the interview I'd expect him to put out his side of the story and scream about NBC being liars.  And from what I've seen, most policies include the parent paying as well as the kids.
 
2013-10-05 09:37:16 PM
"Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

But did anyone ever help me out?
 
2013-10-05 09:39:55 PM

BumpInTheNight: Craptastic: BumpInTheNight: [www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 157x220]Greg Collett, running for State Rep in Idaho.


That's right, programmer who can't afford all his kids wants to decide on the fate of yours.

THAT guy has known the touch of an actual woman?

They're all foster children so maybe not.  That concept just raises even more red flags like how does someone who can't afford to insure his kids keep getting allowed to buy more?


If they are foster kids, he is getting a stipend from the state to care for them.

"June 3, 2013

Dear Foster Parent,
As you may have heard, during the last legislative session, the Idaho Legislature approved an additional increase in the monthly foster care stipend rates.  This increase will become effective July 1, 2013.  The new rates are:
Ages 0-5         $329 per month per child from $301
Ages 6-12       $366 per month per child from $339
Ages 13 +       $487 per month per child from $453"
http://healthandwelfare.idaho.gov/Children/AdoptionFosterCareHome/Fo st erAdoptiveParentResources/tabid/1899/Default.aspx
 
2013-10-05 09:44:07 PM

HammerHeadSnark: The guy looks jerky and nerdy, and I'd prob'ly look upon him with disdain and sneer at him from my barstool, but knowing he's a foster parent tempers my natural nastiness.


Same here, although falsely portraying himself to be a providing father to 10 kids when he is not providing for their care at all seems to be a lie. I still consider him to be a Republican tool. No worse than any of the others. It's like Marcus Bachmann pretending to be a husband.
 
2013-10-05 09:44:38 PM

Il Douchey: Well, who did you think was crashing the exchanges trying to get in?  The young healthy people looking to increase their contribution to the collective, or the already costly unhealthy people looking to have someone else pick up most of their tab?

/Does it really surprise you that the intended victims of this ponzi scheme aren't eager to be fleeced?


Do you realize that one of the things driving the increases in healthcare is a lack of preventative care? Treat hypertension early, and you may not have a costly heart attack.

/Republicans
//are dumbshiats
 
2013-10-05 09:46:00 PM
Surprisingly troll-free in this thread.
 
2013-10-05 09:51:17 PM

Il Douchey: Well, who did you think was crashing the exchanges trying to get in?  The young healthy people looking to increase their contribution to the collective, or the already costly unhealthy people looking to have someone else pick up most of their tab?

/Does it really surprise you that the intended victims of this ponzi scheme aren't eager to be fleeced?


I feel the same way, I've never been in an accident or had a ticket for almost 18 years.  So why should I have to pay for car insurance?  I'm just getting fleeced, having to pay for bad drivers making mistakes.

/What do you mean that's how insurance pools work?
 
2013-10-05 09:51:24 PM
i18.photobucket.com
 
2013-10-05 09:56:46 PM

firefly212: THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!


That is one of the goals of Obamacare. With insurance people are more likely to see their own physician rather than use emergency services for non-urgent issues. Is this what you mean, that the ER is meant for emergencies?
 
2013-10-05 09:58:50 PM

Ablejack: firefly212: THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!

That is one of the goals of Obamacare. With insurance people are more likely to see their own physician rather than use emergency services for non-urgent issues. Is this what you mean, that the ER is meant for emergencies?


It's what I find funny about the 'just go to the ER' mentality.  Sure, they will treat your heart attack, maybe even give you some pills that will last a few weeks.  But what about afterwards, follow up care?  You will be charged an arm and a leg on follow up appointments and medicine and nobody will give that to you unless you have insurance, or cash up front.
 
2013-10-05 10:00:04 PM

Ablejack: firefly212: THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!

That is one of the goals of Obamacare. With insurance people are more likely to see their own physician rather than use emergency services for non-urgent issues. Is this what you mean, that the ER is meant for emergencies?


Apparently the time of ER doctors spent diagnosing non-emergencies isn't money better spent elsewhere.
 
2013-10-05 10:01:11 PM

pueblonative: HammerHeadSnark: Absolutely nothing in the article even suggested he couldn't afford insurance for the kids. The state of Idaho automatically enrolls foster kids in Medicaid . . . the health (and insurance) of foster kids is the responsibility of the state. While the guy may be providing a home for the kids, they are still wards of, and the responsibility of, the state. When the guy and his wife get a kid the kid arrives with a plastic garbage bag with all his worldly possessions, a file folder detailing school grades and accomplishments, and a Medicaid policy number . . . because, you see, the kids are not this guy's kids. They are the state's kids and the state has certain responsibilities, one of which is providing health care. Their dental care is also state paid. Clothing, too. Depending on the state -- and the child's age -- an allowance for spending money might also be available.

Other than the fact that he said that he'd rather pay the fine.  Okay, the state puts them on Medicaid regardless of the families ability to provide insurance.I get that.  But if he could afford it, wouldn't he have said something about that.he's providing insurance other than what the state is.  And if they cut that from the interview I'd expect him to put out his side of the story and scream about NBC being liars.  And from what I've seen, most policies include the parent paying as well as the kids.


This is from 2007:  Pick a state

I'm gonna come right out and say it. Many of the families that enroll as foster parents do so for a variety of reasons, but two stand out: the wife wants children (but can't bear) or they see a financial benefit to providing foster care. The more children, the more they receive. I don' know this family's motivations, but outside of what he earns as a programmer they're prob'ly bringing in another $4000-$5000 per month. If their motivation is solely financial (unlikely), do you think they'd spend a single dime of their own money on some damn foster kid?

My state offers everything I mentioned: food, play clothes, medical, dental, school clothes, and even money for discretionary spending by the child. (Oh, school trips and even day camp during the summer months.)

Now it's time for my dinner . . . I bought it; I'm eatin' it.
 
2013-10-05 10:05:15 PM

MrSplifferton: Il Douchey: Well, who did you think was crashing the exchanges trying to get in?  The young healthy people looking to increase their contribution to the collective, or the already costly unhealthy people looking to have someone else pick up most of their tab?

/Does it really surprise you that the intended victims of this ponzi scheme aren't eager to be fleeced?

I feel the same way, I've never been in an accident or had a ticket for almost 18 years.  So why should I have to pay for car insurance?  I'm just getting fleeced, having to pay for bad drivers making mistakes.

/What do you mean that's how insurance pools work?


I totally agree. I've not used my auto insurance in nearly 20 years. Ergo, by the same logic that says healthy people don't need health insurance, I do not need auto insurance. My home has never been robbed or damaged in an earthquake; why should I bother having homeowner's insurance? My brother-in-law is not a shady contractor, why does he need liability insurance? My boss is not a crooked lawyer, why must he carry malpractice insurance?

Why can't anyone just not have insurance until they actually need it? Obviously it's just a scheme by insurers and the government to fleece money from honest law-abiding citizens to support bad drivers, crooked lawyers and gypsy contractors!
 
2013-10-05 10:06:59 PM
Conservative thinking will destroy this country once and for all...

Farking idiots the whole lot.
 
2013-10-05 10:15:29 PM

Delay: HotIgneous Intruder: Why is health care so expensive that every single person needs insurance to pay for it?
Why does any US citizen need insurance?

Good question. Base health care costs in the US are mostly set by the government. Here is 2012:

The formula for calculating 2012 physician fee schedule payment amount is as follows:
2012 Non-Facility Pricing Amount =
[(Work RVU * Work GPCI) +
(Transitioned Non-Facility PE RVU * PE GPCI) +
(MP RVU * MP GPCI)] * Conversion Factor (CF)
2012 Facility Pricing Amount =
[(Work RVU * Work GPCI) +
(Transitioned Facility PE RVU * PE GPCI) +
(MP RVU * MP GPCI)] * CF
The conversion factor for CY 2012 is $34.0376.

All clear?


I'm good on PFS, actually; where were you when I was elbow-deep in OPPS/ASC methodology this afternoon?
 
2013-10-05 10:30:39 PM

iron de havilland: I cannot grasp why a modern, developed country would not have universal healthcare.


It's easy. Look at it thsi way: First, imagine someone who has a comfortable or better standard of living, and is a selfish asshole who doesn't give a fark how bad others have it, as long as he and his are OK. Then imagine the kind of person who repeats such sayings as "gubmint bad" and "gubmint can't do anything right" and "I should be free to do whatever the hell I please on my land" In other words, someone just like the first asshole, but poor. Finally, imagine the type of person who is such a peice of shiat that he thinks things like "Well, I ain't got it so great, but I'll be damned if them wetbacks and darkies are going to get a dime of my tax money"

Now multiply those 3 people by about 25 million, and you've got the stupidest, stubbornest, most selfish group of the American public who won't give a goddamned dime to anyone they don;t like. And believe me, there's a LOT of people they don't like. Add to this the fact that the majority of them will GLADLY cut off their nose to spite their face, and you'll see why the "greatest country in the world" spends more money per capita than any other industrialized nation in the world for worse healthcare

tl;dr: It's because there are a lot of stupid, short-sighted, selfish assholes in the US who put the teabaggers into national political offices.
 
2013-10-05 10:31:27 PM
swaniefrmreddeer:  if you could have been insured and chose not to be, then you're on your own. The boot-strap crowd can get all boot-strappy with their own emergency medical care.

Someone insisting on learning the hard way makes that person pretty disposable, in my book
 
2013-10-05 10:53:35 PM

FloydA: "I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said.


I calculated that it's cheaper for me not to have car insurance, as long as I am not in an accident.  It's cheaper for me to not have homeowner's insurance, as long as nothing happens to damage my house.  It's cheaper for me to not have health insurance, as long as I don't get sick or injured.

However, I realize those things could happen, so I bought the insurance anyway, to protect me from unexpected tragedies.  That's what insurance is for.  If I do get sick or injured, the money I spent on insurance will be more than offset by the money I save getting my care paid for.

Why is that concept so hard for Republicans to grasp?


no long term strategy.
this seems to be a consistent theme with republicans.  Even the business minded ones don't usually think past the next quarter/cycle, etc..
 
2013-10-05 10:58:20 PM

iron de havilland: [i.imgur.com image 850x462]
[howdemocracyworks.files.wordpress.com image 675x349]

I cannot grasp why a modern, developed country would not have universal healthcare.

I mean, I've seen the Fark threads that show up every now and then, with farkers begging for donations because their nearest and dearest are sick. And it's depressing to see. My mother survived breast cancer because, through general taxation, everyone in the UK has a basic safety net of the NHS.

She could have gone private, and paid for it, which would have cost big £££s. She may have got her treatment sooner, or in more comfortable conditions. But she didn't have to as healthcare is a basic foundation of society that everyone needs at some point.

And the ultimate irony is in those images I've posted. Americans spend the most on healthcare, with the smallest returns.

/I'm not suggesting that the NHS is perfect, by the way. There have been several major scandals recently, but it seems better than what's available to your average American.


The ACA doesn't get us any closer to other countries than we are right now.
 
2013-10-05 11:05:59 PM
A true solution is a change to the Hippocratic oath: help only those with insurance or who can pay cash, everyone else is a leach and should be allowed to die in the gutter.  I guarantee that the "Obama haters" would be weeded out of the gene pool in 10 years.

Besides, what "software developer" in his 40's doesn't already have access to better insurance than Obamacare.  If you don't, you suck as a software developer or are a cheap bastard and deserve what you get.

Additionally, if you have any number of kids and are employable, you should be able to pay for them 100%; otherwise, don't have kids - ya freaking hypocritical leaches.  Separatist 'tards in Idaho do not add any value at all to the US or the world.
 
2013-10-05 11:10:44 PM

ginandbacon: "Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid, the joint state-federal health insurance plan for people with low income and children who are not covered."

*sigh*


It's either that or medical experiments for the lot of 'em.

content9.flixster.com
 
2013-10-05 11:12:25 PM
To those people outside the U.S. who don't understand why the world's richest, most powerful country lacks a universal healthcare system:

I'm sure you've heard people talk about American exceptionalism. That's the belief by some Americans that the United States is the culmination of historical trend toward freedom, democracy, and economic perfection. We are special, a singular monument to the aspirations of all people, everywhere. And, since we have no real health care "system", then no health care system must be the best health care system there is. If we instead adopt something like the ACA, we'll start sliding downward into socialism and fascism and all the other isms that afflict the rest of the entire world--we'll stop being special. So really what this comes down to is, a small but extremely powerful and vocal minority of people in the United States think that if we adopt a system that provides everyone with access to health care, then we'll be like every other country in the world. And they can't live with the thought. So they're willing to destroy the country to keep that from happening.

Yes, it's completely delusional. But don't act like you've never had batshiat insane leaders before.
 
2013-10-05 11:13:52 PM

vartian: swaniefrmreddeer: ER's are going to have to deny treatment to anybody without health insurance. Maybe this whole death panel thing isn't actually that bad of an idea, if you could have been insured and chose not to be, then you're on your own. The boot-strap crowd can get all boot-strappy with their own emergency medical care.

Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

Coco LaFemme: Maybe the lesson to be learned here is not to breed like the human race is dying out when you can't properly take care of all your spawnlings.  The United States is not an agrarian society anymore, we don't need people having 10+ children to make sure there's enough manual labor for the farms.

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.


I agree, simply put people seem to feel self righteous with no empathy for other people. I has a sad :(.

The children are covered, I see no reason why the adults should have to be legally required to pay a private company for a service they have no financial means to afford.  It reeks of the worst kind of right wing ideology.
 
2013-10-05 11:18:12 PM
I'm sure someone has said it already, but....

Having 10 kids and not having health insurance is child abuse. They should be taken from that home.

Medicaid....Jesus farking Christ you farking piece of shiat.
 
2013-10-05 11:22:17 PM

cepson: To those people outside the U.S. who don't understand why the world's richest, most powerful country lacks a universal healthcare system:

I'm sure you've heard people talk about American exceptionalism. That's the belief by some Americans that the United States is the culmination of historical trend toward freedom, democracy, and economic perfection. We are special, a singular monument to the aspirations of all people, everywhere. And, since we have no real health care "system", then no health care system must be the best health care system there is. If we instead adopt something like the ACA, we'll start sliding downward into socialism and fascism and all the other isms that afflict the rest of the entire world--we'll stop being special. So really what this comes down to is, a small but extremely powerful and vocal minority of people in the United States think that if we adopt a system that provides everyone with access to health care, then we'll be like every other country in the world. And they can't live with the thought. So they're willing to destroy the country to keep that from happening.

Yes, it's completely delusional. But don't act like you've never had batshiat insane leaders before.


Wow, that's Oliver Stone grade battshiat crazy, paranoid, conspiratorial insanity right the brotha.
 
2013-10-05 11:24:38 PM

cepson: To those people outside the U.S. who don't understand why the world's richest, most powerful country lacks a universal healthcare system:

I'm sure you've heard people talk about American exceptionalism. That's the belief by some Americans that the United States is the culmination of historical trend toward freedom, democracy, and economic perfection. We are special, a singular monument to the aspirations of all people, everywhere. And, since we have no real health care "system", then no health care system must be the best health care system there is. If we instead adopt something like the ACA, we'll start sliding downward into socialism and fascism and all the other isms that afflict the rest of the entire world--we'll stop being special. So really what this comes down to is, a small but extremely powerful and vocal minority of people in the United States think that if we adopt a system that provides everyone with access to health care, then we'll be like every other country in the world. And they can't live with the thought. So they're willing to destroy the country to keep that from happening.

Yes, it's completely delusional. But don't act like you've never had batshiat insane leaders before.


Neat post. Kinda helps explain the whole "refusal to switch to the metric system" thingy too.
 
2013-10-05 11:27:07 PM

likefunbutnot: In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0


So you haven't had even a routine physical in years?  That sounds like a good idea.
 
2013-10-05 11:28:51 PM

Gyrfalcon: Why can't anyone just not have insurance until they actually need it?


I know your not being serious here but this is actually what a lot of people think.
 
2013-10-05 11:29:52 PM

GhostFish: Wait, his ten kids are covered by medicaid but he doesn't even want that?

And this guy is a software developer?

Did someone put acid in my morning coffee?


There's a lot of idiot software developers out there. Believe me.
 
2013-10-05 11:36:02 PM
Why should a young healthy person buy anything? They'll have an inflated premium to pay for the subsidized people, there are laws that guarantees treatment and it's illegal to exclude preexisting conditions.

If this surprises you, then you're an idiot.
 
2013-10-05 11:39:47 PM

Pincy: likefunbutnot: In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0

So you haven't had even a routine physical in years?  That sounds like a good idea.


If you don't go the the doctor, you can't find out if you are sick. Getting sick is the expensive part.

CHECKMATE LIBTARD!
 
2013-10-05 11:43:38 PM

MugzyBrown: there are laws that guarantees treatment


All the ER is obliged to do is stabilize you if you have a life-threatening condition.  If this surprises you then you're an idiot.
 
2013-10-05 11:45:20 PM

Fart_Machine: MugzyBrown: there are laws that guarantees treatment

All the ER is obliged to do is stabilize you if you have a life-threatening condition.  If this surprises you then you're an idiot.


What's your point?
 
2013-10-05 11:45:55 PM

MugzyBrown: Why should a young healthy person buy anything? They'll have an inflated premium to pay for the subsidized people, there are laws that guarantees treatment and it's illegal to exclude preexisting conditions.

If this surprises you, then you're an idiot.


I agree.  And if a condition occurs unexpectedly, that person should be allowed to die a painful death unless they foot the bill entirely.  Their choice.  They should be kicked repeatedly for being idiots.  I hate idiots.  The first question someone should be asked in a car wreck is if they have insurance.  If not, they should be told that MugzyBrown is laughing at them and calling them idiots.  Or a heart attack.  Or a stroke.

I agree with you.  I love it when idiots and leaches die.

Oddly, life is a pre-existing condition.  Money is not.  I have never heard of a fetus who bought his/her way out of the womb.
 
2013-10-05 11:54:57 PM

MugzyBrown: Why should a young healthy person buy anything? They'll have an inflated premium to pay for the subsidized people, there are laws that guarantees treatment and it's illegal to exclude preexisting conditions.

If this surprises you, then you're an idiot.


Why should we be legally required to purchase something from a private company?
 
2013-10-06 12:03:26 AM

cepson: To those people outside the U.S. who don't understand why the world's richest, most powerful country lacks a universal healthcare system:

I'm sure you've heard people talk about American exceptionalism. That's the belief by some Americans that the United States is the culmination of historical trend toward freedom, democracy, and economic perfection. We are special, a singular monument to the aspirations of all people, everywhere. And, since we have no real health care "system", then no health care system must be the best health care system there is. If we instead adopt something like the ACA, we'll start sliding downward into socialism and fascism and all the other isms that afflict the rest of the entire world--we'll stop being special. So really what this comes down to is, a small but extremely powerful and vocal minority of people in the United States think that if we adopt a system that provides everyone with access to health care, then we'll be like every other country in the world. And they can't live with the thought. So they're willing to destroy the country to keep that from happening.

Yes, it's completely delusional. But don't act like you've never had batshiat insane leaders before.


I agree completely, except to point out that the United States has actually been exceptional in many ways. Both good and bad. I try to remind myself of this when talking to conservatives.
 
2013-10-06 12:06:56 AM

Pincy: Gyrfalcon: Why can't anyone just not have insurance until they actually need it?

I know your not being serious here but this is actually what a lot of people think.


And the flip side, seen just as often is: People SHOULD HAVE bought insurance before they needed it! If they don't have insurance, why should they expect treatment they can't afford?

It's like people never listen to the crap that comes out of their mouths.
 
2013-10-06 12:17:04 AM
Idaho, 10 kids, hates Obamasocialismhealthcare, but thinks medicare covering his spawn is just fine.
/Bet the guy is Mormon
 
2013-10-06 12:34:34 AM

MugzyBrown: Fart_Machine: MugzyBrown: there are laws that guarantees treatment

All the ER is obliged to do is stabilize you if you have a life-threatening condition.  If this surprises you then you're an idiot.

What's your point?


I'll give you an example of the problem with the guaranteed treatment theory.  Schizophrenia usually surfaces in late teens early 20's.  You get psychotic and are hospitalized for a month because you are guaranteed treatment at the ER.  However, all your psych meds that can cost over $600/month for generics will not be guaranteed.

So what happens then?

You get psychotic once your meds run out and end up back in the ER then the psych ward for another month, ad nauseum.  Or, if you get real unlucky you kill a bunch of people like we've been seeing with a lot of the mass shootings.

Your treatment is assured, follow up not so much.
 
2013-10-06 12:45:39 AM

MugzyBrown: Fart_Machine: MugzyBrown: there are laws that guarantees treatment

All the ER is obliged to do is stabilize you if you have a life-threatening condition.  If this surprises you then you're an idiot.

What's your point?


I'm sure those with chronic medical conditions might have an issue with what you consider adequate "guaranteed treatment".
 
2013-10-06 12:50:48 AM

MountainClimber: Idaho, 10 kids, hates Obamasocialismhealthcare, but thinks medicare covering his spawn is just fine.
/Bet the guy is Mormon


Actually, he doesn't want his kids covered either. Other than that you nailed it.
 
2013-10-06 01:14:42 AM

The Dynamite Monkey: gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid

I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:


A couple of those kids are not like the others...
 
2013-10-06 01:27:12 AM

likefunbutnot: Karac: And you know that ... how?

14 out of the last 15 years, I've had zero medical expenses. I'm at low risk for developing chronic health issues over the next five years and the most likely way that I would be injured is in an automobile accident, in which case my car insurance would provide coverage.

I don't think it makes rational sense for me to pay slightly more than half what I pay to have a home each month for the right to 60% off coupon of expenses that I will either not use at all *or* will still be so vastly expensive that I will be bankrupted after care has been provided.


Let me tell you a story. I'm a bit of an exercise nut, I ride around 15km a day on my bike to and from work, etc. When I was 29 I suddenly developed an  inability to climb stairs, or walk fast without being left gasping like I'd run a marathon. Ended up in emergency and found out I'd had a "multiple, massive bilateral pulmonary embolism." Basically, out of the blue as far as I knew, my body decided to end me by clogging up my lungs with blood clots. The doctors kept saying shiat like "How does a healthy 29 year old throw a clot like this?" and "are you sure you don't smoke?  Have you ever smoked? Travelled anywhere?" I survived, only to lose the lower part of my right lung a year later to the same shiat. During the intervening time I had to spend a couple months taking an injectable anti-coagulant that cost 1400 bucks a month. Turns out I have a genetic clotting disorder and I'm going to have to take blood thinners for the rest of my life. Luckily for me I'm Canadian so I didn't have to pay out of pocket for the endless CTs, MRI, and all the other alphabet soup tests. I would've had to pay for the prescriptions if I did not have supplementary insurance so the 1400$ a month drug cost me 2$.

Point is I could've saved like 20$ a month by not getting that supplementary insurance, and then I would've been broke. If you're an American then you'd have it worse because you have no public healthcare. Being stuck in the hospital for a couple weeks could easily get very expensive. The whole point of insurance is to try to mitigate unforeseen disasters. Saying "Well I've never gotten sick before..." is kind of irrelevant, I could've said the same thing at my 29th birthday, but a couple months later I would likely have said "fark, I can't slow my breathing long enough to sleep, or eat"

/actually doing a lot better now
//hard motherfarker
 
2013-10-06 01:36:29 AM

vudutek: I think the Dems should go ahead and give up the individual mandate, totally.
But.... with a caveat. A big one.
Anyone that opts out, needs to be totally out. No insurance at all. You want to be a boostrappy individualist, you pay 100% for all care. No exceptions. And just like student loans, no discharge through bankruptcy.

All right, Randians, time to put up or shut up.


One more condition, no emergency room access if you can't pay for it.  Somalia rules.  If you cant pay for care, and have a serious illness, you die.
 
2013-10-06 01:44:32 AM

pueblonative: "I don't think that the government should be involved in health care or health insurance," says Greg Collett, a 41-year-old software developer in Caldwell, Idaho, who would rather pay the fine for now -- $95 the first year -- than signup.

unless this guy's making $9500/year writing software (maybe school assignments on vDesk or something) sounds like he's in for a rude surprise.


I think a lot of people planning on paying "the $95" are in for the same surprise. Maybe they should have taken the time to learn more about the ACA.
 
2013-10-06 01:51:38 AM
FTFA: "Collett counts himself among the 29 percent of people who said in an NBC News/Kaiser poll they are angry about the health reform law. "The issue for me is that it is not the proper role of government," he said."

But he has 10 kids on Medicaid.

"Trying to get whatever you can back -- I have nothing against that. You have to at some point try and get your tax dollars back."

Oh. OK then.
 
2013-10-06 02:48:08 AM
Stop smoking butts! That's nasty.
 
2013-10-06 02:57:37 AM
That Greg Collette guy is just the type of foster parent I personally despise. My wife's career has centered around case management of foster children. There are two types of foster homes, ones where people are passionate about children in need, and those who figure they can bring in some money without getting a pesky job. Greg is absolutely the latter... As most are, sadly.
 
2013-10-06 02:57:59 AM
If you get health insurance within the next year insurance companies must ignore pre-existing conditions at enrollment and after.  However, if you wait beyond one year they can consider pre-existing conditions.  That way people can't wait years until they have a health problem before getting insurance.
 
2013-10-06 03:11:12 AM

kalor: I think if people want to opt out of the mandate they should be allowed; however, the law needs to be changed which classifies those medical debts and related debts incurred because you opted out as non-bankruptable.  If you decide to freeload then you don't get a chance to wipe out the debt due to your bad decision.

We'll see how many people decide to opt out when they realize the true weight of their decision and that they can't squirm out of it later.


Poasted elsewhere:

...I hereby decree that from this day, no, from this very hour forward, that any Tea Party member, GOP member, Fundamentalist Christian, Dominionist, or conservative who recieves any type whatsoever of healthcare services from any hospital, clinic or other medical facility, shall immediately be declared a terrorist and traitor to the United States and is to be punished in an appropriate manner by the appropriate law enforcement agency.
In fact, all medical facilities in GOP/Red Zones shall be declared unfit for use and demolished.
 
2013-10-06 03:14:49 AM

Delay: firefly212: Every farking thread... every farking one...

THE ER DOES NOT TREAT YOU FOR THINGS THAT ARENT EMERGENCIES!

Why do you post this when you can easily find that it is false? The ER treats everyone who comes in the door with a problem. More than half of all ER visits are for non-urgent care.

And there is obvious abuse. The Integrated Care Collaboration in Central Texas determined that nine patients accounted for about 2,700 emergency room visits there.


I'm not certain which of you is right. My anecdotal evidence is an incident that happened a number of years ago. I had an accident in which I had severe damage to my left ulna, I'd shattered about an inch of bone. 

I went to the ER. It was a Thursday. I did receive treatment but, that treatment consisted of a some pain pills, a soft cast, a prescription for more pain pills, and a referral to an orthopedic surgeon that I should call the next Monday to set up an intake appointment sometime later that week. I was then sent home.

I went to the ER with a broken bone (I was also in shock but I came out of that while I was waiting for the doc to check me out). The kind folks at the ER checked me out, made a diagnoses, stabilized me, and then sent me on my way with instructions telling me what I should do next. This was when I had insurance.

My point is that, while you will be treated in the ER, it will be just enough to stabilize you. Once they reach the point that you no longer need emergency or urgent care, they will send you home and tell you to contact a non emergency doctor. Without insurance that's not really an option, so you just go home. When your health problem flares up again you have no other option than to go to the ER and start the whole process again.
 
2013-10-06 03:48:08 AM

FloydA: "I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said.


I calculated that it's cheaper for me not to have car insurance, as long as I am not in an accident.  It's cheaper for me to not have homeowner's insurance, as long as nothing happens to damage my house.  It's cheaper for me to not have health insurance, as long as I don't get sick or injured.

However, I realize those things could happen, so I bought the insurance anyway, to protect me from unexpected tragedies.  That's what insurance is for.  If I do get sick or injured, the money I spent on insurance will be more than offset by the money I save getting my care paid for.

Why is that concept so hard for Republicans to grasp?


Wind energy is a boondoggle to these scum, because wind energy can't provide 100% of our power. Who cares if it can effectively provide 10 to 20 percent? If it's not 100%, it's a failure.

Simpleton binary thinking. Complex things are hard, so they have to be reduced to "yes" or "no." Can wind energy provide ALL our energy? No. So it's 100% useless.

Are they in 100% good health? Than health insurance is 100% useless.

Their idiots, basically.
 
2013-10-06 05:04:59 AM

impaler: FloydA: "I calculated it out and it is cheaper for me for the next four years to pay the fine rather than get coverage," Collett said.


I calculated that it's cheaper for me not to have car insurance, as long as I am not in an accident.  It's cheaper for me to not have homeowner's insurance, as long as nothing happens to damage my house.  It's cheaper for me to not have health insurance, as long as I don't get sick or injured.

However, I realize those things could happen, so I bought the insurance anyway, to protect me from unexpected tragedies.  That's what insurance is for.  If I do get sick or injured, the money I spent on insurance will be more than offset by the money I save getting my care paid for.

Why is that concept so hard for Republicans to grasp?

Wind energy is a boondoggle to these scum, because wind energy can't provide 100% of our power. Who cares if it can effectively provide 10 to 20 percent? If it's not 100%, it's a failure.

Simpleton binary thinking. Complex things are hard, so they have to be reduced to "yes" or "no." Can wind energy provide ALL our energy? No. So it's 100% useless.

Are they in 100% good health? Than health insurance is 100% useless.

Their idiots, basically.


Well said.
 
2013-10-06 07:08:57 AM

R.A.Danny: iron de havilland: [i.imgur.com image 850x462]
[howdemocracyworks.files.wordpress.com image 675x349]

I cannot grasp why a modern, developed country would not have universal healthcare.

I mean, I've seen the Fark threads that show up every now and then, with farkers begging for donations because their nearest and dearest are sick. And it's depressing to see. My mother survived breast cancer because, through general taxation, everyone in the UK has a basic safety net of the NHS.

She could have gone private, and paid for it, which would have cost big £££s. She may have got her treatment sooner, or in more comfortable conditions. But she didn't have to as healthcare is a basic foundation of society that everyone needs at some point.

And the ultimate irony is in those images I've posted. Americans spend the most on healthcare, with the smallest returns.

/I'm not suggesting that the NHS is perfect, by the way. There have been several major scandals recently, but it seems better than what's available to your average American.

The ACA doesn't get us any closer to other countries than we are right now.


Before Obamacare: I couldn't afford private health insurance.
After Obamacare: I can.

Before Obamacare: With a lot of pre-existing conditions, you couldn't get health insurance, whether you could pay or not.
After Obamacare: You can.

Yes, I agree with you on one thing - we should go to single-payer like every other developed country.  But to say that the health care system in no better today than it was five years ago?  That's just being whiny.

It's like don't ask/don't tell.  Sure, it was a bad policy which forced gays who wanted to serve in the military to remain in the closet.  Sure, getting rid of the discrimination completely is what we should have done in the 90's instead of waiting another 15 years.  BUT - since the policy before Clinton was that gays couldn't serve AT ALL, and that investigators could bust through that closet door and search them out - then you have to admit that the situation, while still shiatty, stunk a lot less than it did before.

A perfect plan is better than a good plan.  But sometimes you just don't have the votes and support from the other guys to enact that perfect plan.  And a good plan today is better than a perfect plan ... at some unspecified time in the future that may or may not ever occur.
 
2013-10-06 08:49:54 AM

Karac: I cannot grasp why a modern, developed country would not have universal healthcare.


The sad thing is that the resistance to the ACA is either A) "the black guy is not on my team so I'm against it" or B) fear of change based opposition (created by A).  For just one example, the same people who say the ACA is "socialist" and "takes away our freedom" also believe that there are nine countries more "economically free" that the USA.... all have universal health care.  http://www.heritage.org/index/


If the Republicans were willing to work on this legislation like every other piece of legislation we could fix any problems with it.  No one suggested the law is or even could be perfect when first introduced but it has already benefited many people (pre-existing conditions, slowing down health insurance cost hikes, young people on their parent's insurance etc....).  It is sure as heck better than going back to the most expensive (for taxpayers like me) and least effective healthcare system....free emergency room visits.
 
2013-10-06 08:50:29 AM

FloydA: vpb: Hoban Washburne: I would hope that each of these assholes has a catastrophic health issue, but then they'd still get healthcare and just pass the costs on to the rest of us.

That raises an interesting question.

What happens when people get sick, don't have insurance and it isn't an open season?  I guess they get to be the example of why it's stupid to not have insurance?

Sadly, no.  They just go to the ER and get treated, and then when they can't pay, the hospital has to swallow the cost, which they pass on to everyone else.


Does that apply to chemotherapy, ongoing dialysis, or ongoing trestmemt for HIV?

I'm ignorant on this though I assumed that someone needing this sort of treatment without money or insurance might as well get measured for a coffin.
 
2013-10-06 08:56:56 AM

Il Douchey: cc1984:That's what you got out of this?

Yup.  The article is hardly representative of the population.  You could cite three or four anecdotes among millions of Americans to suggest whatever you like.  Mine was more of a general questioning of the viability of Obamamcare.


Was it not passed by Congress, the Senate and signed into law by the President? Has it not also passed the constitutional sniff test by the Supreme Court?
 
2013-10-06 09:17:28 AM

Daniels: Schroedinger's Glory Hole: Daniels: likefunbutnot: I'm the libbiest lib ever, but it makes no rational sense for me to accept ACA coverage. I work for a very small business that is exempted from pretty much all employment law in the first place, so there's no mandate to provide or subsidize coverage; and I make too much money to be given any federal subsidy for my premiums. For me to enroll in a bronze-level plan, I'm looking at monthly premiums that cost about 9.5% of my income to get 60% coverage. In 14 of the last 15 years, my health care costs have been $0 and coincidentally, I've been saving around 10% of my monthly income for the last eight or nine years. If I accept coverage, I'm looking at living paycheck to paycheck in order to have insurance that I'm not going to be using (and if  I do, the plan I'd be getting would only cover 60% of expenses) when I could be using that money to save for a home or a car or something other than letting an insurance executive make a yacht payment.

I really want to hold out for single payer. The deal I'm getting is a huge shiat sandwich.

No no.  It's excellent legislation -- which was not at all a handout to the health insurance industry -- that must be defended at all costs because we had to do SOMETHING~!

I think what dipshiat meant to say is: While you personally do not benefit from the new healthcare law, is the extra burden worth it for your less fortunate neighbors to have access to healthcare where they previously wouldn't?

No.  I meant exactly what I said.  I'm pro single-payer.  It was garbage when it was passed and it's garbage now.  Only now dipshiats are pretending it's not garbage when it pushed back what we actually need to do 30-50 more years.


Do you think single payer would ever become reality though? There's just too much resistance to it.
 
2013-10-06 09:18:13 AM
Mr. Splifferton:I feel the same way, I've never been in an accident or had a ticket for almost 18 years.  So why should I have to pay for car insurance?  I'm just getting fleeced, having to pay for bad drivers making mistakes.

You have car insurance for the next 18 years, not the last.  Car insurance companies can use your good record to assign low premiums to you; just as they use a drunk's six DWI's to assign high premiums or refuse to cover him.  Obamacare is different; it would take your expected cost and the drunk's, add them together and split the difference.  So you are penalized for his bad behavior and he is rewarded for your good behavior.

/Insurance can only work when there is uncertainty or when prospective likelihood of use is taken into account.  Once you know who is more likely to draw from the pool, you have to discriminate based on that likelihood, or else the system breaks down.
 
2013-10-06 09:24:46 AM
kg2095: Was it not passed by Congress, the Senate and signed into law by the President? Has it not also passed the constitutional sniff test by the Supreme Court?

Yes to all of that.  None of which means it's viable. It's not.
 
2013-10-06 09:25:16 AM

The Dynamite Monkey: gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid

I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:


What sort of dickhead has a flag in his hallway?
 
2013-10-06 09:30:18 AM
In Idaho, foster parents are paid between $10-15 per day, per child by the state in addition to food stamps and Medicaid. The chance to indoctrinate ten helpless kids into your bizarre belief system AND be hailed as saints for taking on the burden? Priceless.

I'd be curious to know how many foster children the family has adopted outright. My guess would be none, unless there was some financial incentive/tax break for doing so which outweighed all that pesky government interference in their live$.
 
2013-10-06 09:36:48 AM

cepson: To those people outside the U.S. who don't understand why the world's richest, most powerful country lacks a universal healthcare system:

I'm sure you've heard people talk about American exceptionalism. That's the belief by some Americans that the United States is the culmination of historical trend toward freedom, democracy, and economic perfection. We are special, a singular monument to the aspirations of all people, everywhere. And, since we have no real health care "system", then no health care system must be the best health care system there is. If we instead adopt something like the ACA, we'll start sliding downward into socialism and fascism and all the other isms that afflict the rest of the entire world--we'll stop being special. So really what this comes down to is, a small but extremely powerful and vocal minority of people in the United States think that if we adopt a system that provides everyone with access to health care, then we'll be like every other country in the world. And they can't live with the thought. So they're willing to destroy the country to keep that from happening.

Yes, it's completely delusional. But don't act like you've never had batshiat insane leaders before.


Heh. I'm Canadian. The number one father of Conferation and our first (and arguably greatest) Prime Minister was a batshiat crazy drunk who made the finest speech of his career while waving a never emptying water tumbler of straight gin around. Here's to Sir John A. MacDonald!
 
2013-10-06 09:42:08 AM

Rozotorical: MugzyBrown: Why should a young healthy person buy anything? They'll have an inflated premium to pay for the subsidized people, there are laws that guarantees treatment and it's illegal to exclude preexisting conditions.

If this surprises you, then you're an idiot.

Why should we be legally required to purchase something from a private company?


The Supreme Court ruled this was essentially a tax, that's why. Plus the ACA was passed by a duly elected Congress. Sorry you don't like this and the other side presented absolutely no alternative (to be fair the Democrats thought the GOP would be happy to have their idea applied; I guess even the GOP realizes their ideas are terrible).
 
2013-10-06 10:07:29 AM

Il Douchey: kg2095: Was it not passed by Congress, the Senate and signed into law by the President? Has it not also passed the constitutional sniff test by the Supreme Court?

Yes to all of that.  None of which means it's viable. It's not.


If it's not viable that's because it was compromised so that it could pass through Congress.

Despite that it's still better than what it's replacing.
 
2013-10-06 10:14:14 AM

Il Douchey: kg2095: Was it not passed by Congress, the Senate and signed into law by the President? Has it not also passed the constitutional sniff test by the Supreme Court?

Yes to all of that.  None of which means it's viable. It's not.


Based on what evidence? CBO numbers state that it will save the government billions of dollars over the next 10 years. Where's the non-viability?
 
2013-10-06 10:33:04 AM

IamKaiserSoze!!!: cepson: To those people outside the U.S. who don't understand why the world's richest, most powerful country lacks a universal healthcare system:

I'm sure you've heard people talk about American exceptionalism. That's the belief by some Americans that the United States is the culmination of historical trend toward freedom, democracy, and economic perfection. We are special, a singular monument to the aspirations of all people, everywhere. And, since we have no real health care "system", then no health care system must be the best health care system there is. If we instead adopt something like the ACA, we'll start sliding downward into socialism and fascism and all the other isms that afflict the rest of the entire world--we'll stop being special. So really what this comes down to is, a small but extremely powerful and vocal minority of people in the United States think that if we adopt a system that provides everyone with access to health care, then we'll be like every other country in the world. And they can't live with the thought. So they're willing to destroy the country to keep that from happening.

Yes, it's completely delusional. But don't act like you've never had batshiat insane leaders before.

Wow, that's Oliver Stone grade battshiat crazy, paranoid, conspiratorial insanity right the brotha.


Oliver Stone-grade batshiat crazy paranoid conspiratorial insanity is trying to deny your fellow citizens affordable healthcare (while utilizing it yourself) with unprecedented bureaucratic obstinacy, offering no alternatives in return, launching a nationwide propaganda campaign filled with outright lies, accusing those who need or want it of being socialist leeches, and VOTING FOR THE MAN WHO PROVED IT WORKS IN NOVEMBER, 2012.
 
2013-10-06 10:33:11 AM

Il Douchey: kg2095: Was it not passed by Congress, the Senate and signed into law by the President? Has it not also passed the constitutional sniff test by the Supreme Court?

Yes to all of that.  None of which means it's viable. It's not.


If you support going full single payer, I'd agree that would be better.

If you think letting private insurance companies were just fine as they were I'd ask you if they actually killed of Superman permanently in the 1990s in the alternative reality you must have been living in within the last few decades.
 
2013-10-06 11:02:03 AM

Coco LaFemme: Gosling: I can't help but note that the three people profiled are from Idaho, Montana and Colorado.

Colorado is a fairly blue state, but the other two....that's about what I'd expect.


That's the point, they want you to think they're all back country Hicks so you can dismiss the entire populations opinions.

Small government homeschool dude with 10 kids is an extreme outlier even in Idaho.. You think inner city black dude with 10+ baby mammas is gonna sign up for healthcare?

At least Idaho dude probably only has one wife and is actively attempting to educate his kids. I would hope at least.
 
2013-10-06 11:16:46 AM
The ACA is not viable for many reasons; but at root, the federal government is attempting to take on a problem that it does't have the authority or the ability to resolve.  The scheme that they came up with is rigged, corrupt and unsustainable. Not saying that past or alternate approaches are better or worse, just saying that Obamacare is poorly conceived, badly enacted, and doomed to fail.
 
2013-10-06 11:35:18 AM

HOOBOY!: HammerHeadSnark: The Dynamite Monkey: gaspode: Collett, who is married and has 10 children, says the kids are covered by Medicaid

I don't wish DIAF on anyone as a rule, but here is what he feels is not worth insuring:

[www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 200x245]

Okay, you're just being ingenuous . . . obviously you've been to his site (ya got the picture). Did you miss the part about them being adoptive foster kids? Of course they're on Medicaid . . . they are wards of the state.

I've ignored most of the moronic statements others made because it was likely the commenters were unaware of the nature of the relationship between Greg and the kids, but you went to his site and know he didn't sire them.

He may have sired one or two (I think I see an infant), but he didn't sire ten of them.

What does this change?


He's raising children that aren't his own who would otherwise be homeless or abused? But this is about health insurance right, not the general well being of the population or anything.
 
2013-10-06 11:35:27 AM

Il Douchey: The ACA is not viable for many reasons; but at root, the federal government is attempting to take on a problem that it does't have the authority or the ability to resolve


In what respect are they "attempting to take on" the problem, under what specific constraints do they not "have the authority" and what part or parts of it are "rigged, corrupt and unsustainable" and why?
 
2013-10-06 12:22:30 PM

Il Douchey: The ACA is not viable for many reasons; but at root, the federal government is attempting to take on a problem that it does't have the authority or the ability to resolve.  The scheme that they came up with is rigged, corrupt and unsustainable. Not saying that past or alternate approaches are better or worse, just saying that Obamacare is poorly conceived, badly enacted, and doomed to fail.


Works fine in Massachusetts.
 
2013-10-06 12:37:05 PM

swaniefrmreddeer: vartian:

A wish for denial of treatment, Invoking of untreated sickness and a call for child limitation. This is not a fun thread.

I was trying to be absurd, but the people against healthcare reform are the ones who will end up costing everybody when they show up in the ER. Medical bills are the number one cause of bankruptcy in the US and you can't get blood from a stone.


If there are fewer stones, you can try harder. So there's that.
 
2013-10-06 12:43:40 PM

BumpInTheNight: [www.gregcollettforidaho.com image 157x220]Greg Collett, running for State Rep in Idaho.


That's right, programmer who can't afford all his kids wants to decide on the fate of yours.


Lost in a landslide...to a girl.
 
2013-10-06 01:13:54 PM

Il Douchey: The ACA is not viable for many reasons; but at root, the federal government is attempting to take on a problem that it does't have the authority or the ability to resolve.  The scheme that they came up with is rigged, corrupt and unsustainable. Not saying that past or alternate approaches are better or worse, just saying that Obamacare is poorly conceived, badly enacted, and doomed to fail.


It helps if you try to form a detailed argument if you're intent on sowing FUD
 
2013-10-06 02:02:19 PM
cc1984:In what respect are they "attempting to take on" the problem, under what specific constraints do they not "have the authority" and what part or parts of it are "rigged, corrupt and unsustainable" and why?

If the ACA is not an attempt to address the healthcare problem, then what's this all about? what are we doing here?

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

Under Obamacare, some favored citizens get special waivers and subsidies (i.e. unions and congress) and other citizens don't. Obama arbitrarily enforces some elements of the law, arbitrarily delays others without congressional consent.  The law has been deemed by Supreme Court to be a tax to raise revenues, yet the bill originated in the Senate (revenue bills must originate in the house).  Obama didn't debate the bill on C-Span or post it online for five days before voting on it, as he promised.  Americans are being forced by gov't to purchase something they don't want.  None of the legislators who voted for the law read it before voting.  The law has never enjoyed majority support from the people it affects. The phrase "The Secretary shall determine"  appears in the law so many times that it can effectively be twisted to do or mean whatever the Secretary of HHS wants it to do or mean on the fly. And on and on.  But I think you already know all that.
 
2013-10-06 09:29:35 PM

DigitalCoffee: red5ish: GhostFish: And this guy is a software developer?

He does the cows for Farmville.

There were 10 times where he did the wrong cow.


I'm sitting on a plane in Phoenix, waiting to take off,and I just gota lot of confused looks because I was laughing so hard for no apparent reason.
 
2013-10-06 11:25:16 PM
Il Douchey 2013-10-06 09:24:46 AM

kg2095: Was it not passed by Congress, the Senate and signed into law by the President? Has it not also passed the constitutional sniff test by the Supreme Court?

Yes to all of that. None of which means it's viable. It's not.


You're completely delusional.

*sound of toilet flushing*
 
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