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(Washington Post)   Breaking: Boehner, McConnell, Pelosi and Reid will be meeting at the White House with President Obama at 5:30 ET today. Will this standoff end?   (washingtonpost.com) divider line 625
    More: Unlikely, President Obama, White House, Boehner, McConnell v. FEC, no solutions, government shutdown, House Republicans, House Minority Leader  
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1135 clicks; posted to Politics » on 02 Oct 2013 at 2:03 PM (52 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-02 06:18:56 PM
Is C-Span a thing now?
 
2013-10-02 06:18:57 PM

Deucednuisance: cameroncrazy1984: dwrash: I never said they were to be a rubber stamp... they can only propose amendments, they cannot create NEW legislation, NEW legislation has to originate in the House.

Uh, then explain why the Senate was able to pass a budget that didn't originate in the House?

I'd rather he go to www.Thomas.gov, and then explain what all those Bills with designations beginning "S.xyz" are, if not Senate Bills.


The "S" is for "Soshulizm" as the Senate is full of Democrats. It is for those bills that the House lets get through but never seriously considers, just so that the Republicans in the Senate can perform their patriotic duty of preventing Democrats from infecting national legislation with their evil commie stuff.
 
2013-10-02 06:22:54 PM
Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.
 
2013-10-02 06:25:56 PM

DamnYankees: Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.


This seems like a face-saving attempt. And if the meeting went anything like we think it did, it won't go very far.
 
2013-10-02 06:26:12 PM

DamnYankees: Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.


ohgeeznotshiatshiatagain.jpg
 
2013-10-02 06:26:38 PM

DamnYankees: Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.


...What the hell is a "grand fiscal bargain"?
 
2013-10-02 06:28:38 PM
ah - "grand fiscal bargain"

I remember this - at the end of the night, your coach-and-four turn  into a pumpkin and mice
 
2013-10-02 06:29:50 PM

cameroncrazy1984: This seems like a face-saving attempt. And if the meeting went anything like we think it did, it won't go very far.


Clutch2013: ...What the hell is a "grand fiscal bargain"?


Here's the thing. This "grand fiscal bargain" can mean one of two things to me, both of which imply Obama should slam the door in the GOP's face:

1) It means the GOP is actually willing to increase revenue. Of course, if they are willing to do this and make an actual concession, there's no need for this to be tied to the CR or the debt limit. Just pass those first, and then we can trade revenue for spending cuts.

2) It just means the GOP wants to get more entitlement cuts in exchange for literally nothing.

Obama should reject both of those choices. And I don't know what a third option would even look like.
 
2013-10-02 06:31:35 PM

parasol: Which sort of begs the question - if nothing but for historians - are the Tea Party members so ignorant as to their own government and it's underpinnings (ie why the FDA is nice to have) or are they already living so far off the grid they really DON'T care?
Keeping in mind this "faction" is comprised of preppers and self-proclaimed patriots and so on? (NTTIAWIT)
Its an interesting mix of "don't need gov't programs because I am a "have" and "don't need gov't programs because I am paranoid and self-reliant"
The comments from this group scare me - because, as has been mentioned here for days? They don't seem to care about the complex fiscal structure of the US and how many ways things can go wrong.
They don't need to - they are "ready for the revolution"


I think it's a combination of both. If you pair the idea that "free markets provide the best solutions in all cases" with a flavor of Christianity that says "your success in this life proves your godliness," you get this weird feedback loop where more money means you are more loved by your God who will reward you with more money. Anything which impedes that in any way, such as taxes or regulations on businesses, are not only an economic affront, but also a religious one, because their core religious beliefs are intertwined with their economic and political beliefs.

Obamacare pulls this even further. Not only is the evil tax man stealing money from you that was provided by god for your righteousness, he's breaking the fundamental belief that "good people are rewarded and bad people are punished," because, well, if God had wanted to reward those people, he already would have.

Then again, I had an argument with a guy one day who basically said, "We should get rid of the FDA and USDA, and let the free market take control, because people will naturally gravitate to the companies that kill the fewest people," so some of them just don't give a fark.
 
2013-10-02 06:31:57 PM

DamnYankees: cameroncrazy1984: This seems like a face-saving attempt. And if the meeting went anything like we think it did, it won't go very far.

Clutch2013: ...What the hell is a "grand fiscal bargain"?

Here's the thing. This "grand fiscal bargain" can mean one of two things to me, both of which imply Obama should slam the door in the GOP's face:

1) It means the GOP is actually willing to increase revenue. Of course, if they are willing to do this and make an actual concession, there's no need for this to be tied to the CR or the debt limit. Just pass those first, and then we can trade revenue for spending cuts.

2) It just means the GOP wants to get more entitlement cuts in exchange for literally nothing.

Obama should reject both of those choices. And I don't know what a third option would even look like.


Or he's just pulling shiat out of ass to make himself look like he's in the loop
 
2013-10-02 06:32:55 PM
Mmm, the grand fiscal bargain. I remember when they used to carry that at Hardees. A weeks worth of sodium packed into one meal!
 
2013-10-02 06:33:31 PM

DamnYankees: Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.


Grand fiscal bargain? Is that like double secret probation?
 
2013-10-02 06:34:47 PM

Peter von Nostrand: Or he's just pulling shiat out of ass to make himself look like he's in the loop


He's not the only one reporting it.

Jeff Zeleny @jeffzeleny

Is a Grand Bargain coming back to the capital this fall? That's what Hill leaders are telling @ABC today. A CR/debt fight deal brewing.
 
2013-10-02 06:37:15 PM
Well? Is there white smoke or black smoke coming out of the Roosevelt room chimney?
 
2013-10-02 06:37:16 PM
Unfortunately, the rumor is easy to believe given Obama's past performance. I keep thinking maybe he's learned his lesson, finally. We'll see. In any case, getting anything useful through the House without dem support is essentially impossible now so it really doesn't matter what Boner agrees to.
 
2013-10-02 06:38:07 PM
www.zentrader.ca
WTF is this guys problem?
 
2013-10-02 06:38:24 PM

Soup4Bonnie: Peter von Nostrand: Or he's just pulling shiat out of ass to make himself look like he's in the loop

He's not the only one reporting it.

Jeff Zeleny @jeffzeleny

Is a Grand Bargain coming back to the capital this fall? That's what Hill leaders are telling @ABC today. A CR/debt fight deal brewing.


Or maybe I am. Your call
 
2013-10-02 06:39:02 PM

DamnYankees: Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.


Why would he?  Because the last grand fiscal bargain that Obama tried to negotiate with Boehner went so well?
 
2013-10-02 06:39:17 PM

Evil High Priest: Unfortunately, the rumor is easy to believe given Obama's past performance. I keep thinking maybe he's learned his lesson, finally. We'll see. In any case, getting anything useful through the House without dem support is essentially impossible now so it really doesn't matter what Boner agrees to.


That's why this smacks of Boehner still trying to pretend like he's in charge.
 
2013-10-02 06:46:13 PM

quizzical: Why would he?  Because the last grand fiscal bargain that Obama tried to negotiate with Boehner went so well?


As you just said, Obama has clearly wanted one, asked for one repeatedly, and the only reason it didn't happen was because of Boehner.  Obama has always been hung up on the idea, in part as a way to lock in a budget and avoid these constant continuing CR battles.

There's additional cause for concern because Obama has in the past utterly caved, and it's a hard thing to stop being concerned about in part because we're in the current situation because he caved 2 years ago and the GOP thinks he (or someone in the Dem leadership) will do it again.

Maybe the fear is irrational in the current situation, but it's not without some basis.
 
2013-10-02 06:54:11 PM

Shrugging Atlas: DamnYankees: Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.

ohgeeznotshiatshiatagain.jpg


I told you guys.

Capitulation is coming.  Goddamn Democrats.
 
2013-10-02 06:59:17 PM

Peter von Nostrand: DamnYankees: cameroncrazy1984: This seems like a face-saving attempt. And if the meeting went anything like we think it did, it won't go very far.

Clutch2013: ...What the hell is a "grand fiscal bargain"?

Here's the thing. This "grand fiscal bargain" can mean one of two things to me, both of which imply Obama should slam the door in the GOP's face:

1) It means the GOP is actually willing to increase revenue. Of course, if they are willing to do this and make an actual concession, there's no need for this to be tied to the CR or the debt limit. Just pass those first, and then we can trade revenue for spending cuts.

2) It just means the GOP wants to get more entitlement cuts in exchange for literally nothing.

Obama should reject both of those choices. And I don't know what a third option would even look like.

Or he's just pulling shiat out of ass to make himself look like he's in the loop


Poisoning the well.

The GOP can latch on to this rumor, then beat Obama and Reid over the head with it.
 
2013-10-02 07:00:25 PM
Just announced: no deal, no negotiations to come.
 
2013-10-02 07:00:48 PM

Shrugging Atlas: Maybe the fear is irrational in the current situation, but it's not without some basis.


I wouldn't say it's irrational.  It's just that Obama has had his "Please proceed" face on this week, and I'm optimistic he'll stick to it.   He needs to get a clean CR through, and then they can talk about whatever they need to for the budget.  Anything less than a clean CR just encourages the Republicans to pull this shiat again during the debt ceiling fight, or again in six weeks when the CR runs out.
 
2013-10-02 07:01:56 PM

Deucednuisance: Just announced: no deal, no negotiations to come.


Good.  We shouldn't negotiate with these guys.  They can do their jobs, or they get nothing.
 
2013-10-02 07:01:59 PM

AngryDragon: Shrugging Atlas: DamnYankees: Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.

ohgeeznotshiatshiatagain.jpg

I told you guys.

Capitulation is coming.  Goddamn Democrats.


It appears you told us wrong:

Deucednuisance: Just announced: no deal, no negotiations to come.

 
2013-10-02 07:02:40 PM

Deucednuisance: Just announced: no deal, no negotiations to come.


Cite? Not seeing it on twitter, which always has stuff first.
 
2013-10-02 07:03:05 PM

Shrugging Atlas: quizzical: Why would he?  Because the last grand fiscal bargain that Obama tried to negotiate with Boehner went so well?

As you just said, Obama has clearly wanted one, asked for one repeatedly, and the only reason it didn't happen was because of Boehner.  Obama has always been hung up on the idea, in part as a way to lock in a budget and avoid these constant continuing CR battles.

There's additional cause for concern because Obama has in the past utterly caved, and it's a hard thing to stop being concerned about in part because we're in the current situation because he caved 2 years ago and the GOP thinks he (or someone in the Dem leadership) will do it again.

Maybe the fear is irrational in the current situation, but it's not without some basis.



I can see how it would be appealing, now that the House GOP has itself in a headlock, to use this opportunity to make an actual full-fledged budget deal already so they can stop doing this derail-the-entire-government shiat continually and go back to playing in their clubhouse with their futile theocratic bills and leave the rest of us alone for a year or two. I just don't believe that they'll make an acceptable deal with Obama, and if there were a deal I'm not persuaded that Boehner would stand up to the troglodyte caucus to make it happen.
 
2013-10-02 07:03:10 PM

DamnYankees: Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.


I feel like I've seen this movie before.  Didn't care for the ending.
 
2013-10-02 07:08:31 PM

DamnYankees: Deucednuisance: Just announced: no deal, no negotiations to come.

Cite? Not seeing it on twitter, which always has stuff first.


Presser, live on WUSA Channel 9. Reid and Pelosi speaking firmly, GOP has stomped off.
 
2013-10-02 07:09:01 PM
The Republicans will not negotiate in good faith.

Extend the Bush tax cuts just a little longer...
Don't cripple the filibuster, we'll stop abusing it...
Just do as we say, and we'll only cut food stamps a tiny little bit...

And what happens? They get what they want and then continue on pursuing more of the same, slowly chipping away at the Democrats and achieving dominance piece by piece.

They do not bargain. They ransom and bide their time for the next chance to do it again, and again.

Crisis after crisis, mostly engineered by them and every time they get something that they want.

It has to stop. Obama said it himself. We as a nation can not go on like this and allow this to become our new standard operating procedure. It will destroy us and our credibility in all meanings of the word.
 
2013-10-02 07:09:01 PM

quizzical: I wouldn't say it's irrational. It's just that Obama has had his "Please proceed" face on this week, and I'm optimistic he'll stick to it. He needs to get a clean CR through, and then they can talk about whatever they need to for the budget. Anything less than a clean CR just encourages the Republicans to pull this shiat again during the debt ceiling fight, or again in six weeks when the CR runs out.


That's the argument they need to be leading with. They're getting too bogged down in details and Washington machinations on committees and whatnot. People just zone out and BSAB. Get on the air and make it clear that funding the government and passing the debt ceiling are not viable hostages for a functioning democracy. Make it clear that this is a debate about tactics, and that negotiating with extortionists will only result in more extortion.
 
2013-10-02 07:09:31 PM

quizzical: Anything less than a clean CR just encourages the Republicans to pull this shiat again during the debt ceiling fight, or again in six weeks when the CR runs out.



Yep... Do your farking jobs, House GOP, then, maybe, you'll get to talk about whatever nonsense you think is important afterwards.

Like goddamned children throwing a temper tantrum in the toy aisle at WalMart. Too bad we can't just drag them outside by their ears and give them a good swift kick in the ass.
 
2013-10-02 07:09:35 PM

Deucednuisance: DamnYankees: Deucednuisance: Just announced: no deal, no negotiations to come.

Cite? Not seeing it on twitter, which always has stuff first.

Presser, live on WUSA Channel 9. Reid and Pelosi speaking firmly, GOP has stomped off.


Thanks, just turning on TV.
 
2013-10-02 07:10:10 PM

Deucednuisance: DamnYankees: Deucednuisance: Just announced: no deal, no negotiations to come.

Cite? Not seeing it on twitter, which always has stuff first.

Presser, live on WUSA Channel 9. Reid and Pelosi speaking firmly, GOP has stomped off.


Good!
 
2013-10-02 07:10:32 PM

Deucednuisance: DamnYankees: Deucednuisance: Just announced: no deal, no negotiations to come.

Cite? Not seeing it on twitter, which always has stuff first.

Presser, live on WUSA Channel 9. Reid and Pelosi speaking firmly, GOP has stomped off.


And to clarify, WUSA is the CBS affiliate for Washington, DC.
 
2013-10-02 07:10:49 PM

Barry Lyndon's Annuity Cheque: I think it's a combination of both. If you pair the idea that "free markets provide the best solutions in all cases" with a flavor of Christianityheresy that says "your success in this life proves your godliness," you get this weird feedback loop where more money means you are more loved by your God who will reward you with more money. Anything which impedes that in any way, such as taxes or regulations on businesses, are not only an economic affront, but also a religious one, because their core religious beliefs are intertwined with their economic and political beliefs.


FTFY.  The prosperity gospel goes directly against the teachings of Jesus.
 
2013-10-02 07:11:50 PM

DamnYankees: Robert Costa @robertcostaNRO
breaking: I'm hearing from several House Rs that Boehner is angling for a grand fiscal bargain, Camp and Ryan talking about it to colleagues


Obama, if you fall for this, you're a dumbass.


If we're hearing this from "House R's" it's a lie.
 
2013-10-02 07:12:15 PM

parasol: It's practically their dream come true. These are some departments that are closed or mostly closed:

USDA inspections,


That one...that one boggles the farking mind.  I can understand why Republicans have a problem with federal science agencies, since they have to keep the solidly Republican block of religious conservatives happy, and they're not keen on science.  I can understand environmental agencies because the Republican party is bought and paid for by the Job Creators, peace be upon them, and environmental regulations tend to get in the way of profits.

But the USDA?  Why would you not want the food and medicine that you consume to have some sort of sanitary standard?  Rhetorical question, but are you farking crazy?  It's not even a feigned argument.  During the Republican primaries, Michelle Bachmann gave a speech in a meat packing plant where she literally said the meat packing industry was "too regulated" and as President, she would remove all regulations.
 
paj
2013-10-02 07:12:59 PM
The same lady who got crushed by Reza Aslan is now on Fox calling Nancy Pelosi a senator.
 
2013-10-02 07:13:29 PM

Infernalist: AngryDragon: Lando Lincoln: AngryDragon: [i.imgur.com image 375x347]

It's coming.  You know it is.

I really hope you're wrong.

I really hope I am too.  The Democrats have a habit of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory though.

Old, tired and stupid meme is old, tired and stupid.

How many successful election cycles do we need before we bury that retarded meme?


Consider this my apology.  I'm stunned, but the Democrats stood their ground.

Very impressive.
 
2013-10-02 07:13:35 PM
Brian Beutler @brianbeutler

If this is Rs talking amongst themselves, "grand bargain" = GOP gets entitlement cuts, Dems get debt limit increase. Yes, @robertcostaNRO?


Costa said in a piece that Boehner had been calling in people all day telling them to be patient. Sure seems like this Grand Bargain is just his feverish wish.
 
2013-10-02 07:16:33 PM
WUSA replayed Boehner's very short remarks. Testy, repeated talking points, took no questions. Stormed off.

Somebody got a spanking.
 
2013-10-02 07:17:41 PM

Deucednuisance: WUSA replayed Boehner's very short remarks. Testy, repeated talking points, took no questions. Stormed off.

Somebody got a spanking.


Also a little odd McConell wasn't there with him.
 
2013-10-02 07:19:05 PM

Deucednuisance: DamnYankees: Deucednuisance: Just announced: no deal, no negotiations to come.

Cite? Not seeing it on twitter, which always has stuff first.

Presser, live on WUSA Channel 9. Reid and Pelosi speaking firmly, GOP has stomped off.


What a damn relief.
 
2013-10-02 07:24:54 PM

Deucednuisance: WUSA replayed Boehner's very short remarks. Testy, repeated talking points, took no questions. Stormed off.

Somebody got a spanking.


Good!
 
2013-10-02 07:25:07 PM

Deucednuisance: WUSA replayed Boehner's very short remarks. Testy, repeated talking points, took no questions. Stormed off.

Somebody got a spanking.



Surprised he didn't cry... Must not have had his afternoon High Ball.
 
2013-10-02 07:30:39 PM

DamnYankees: Deucednuisance: WUSA replayed Boehner's very short remarks. Testy, repeated talking points, took no questions. Stormed off.

Somebody got a spanking.

Also a little odd McConell wasn't there with him.


I think it's really telling.  He's got a primary fight and then a legit Dem candidate to face assuming he wins that.  He probably views Boehner as purely farking toxic under those circumstances, especially if Boehner made it clear in the meeting he has no intention of backing down.  McConell is a goofy looking fark, but he can read polls like everyone else and has to know this is going to be a disaster for the GOP if it goes on any longer.  He's going to let Boehner hang for this all on his own.
 
2013-10-02 07:31:44 PM

Shrugging Atlas: DamnYankees: Deucednuisance: WUSA replayed Boehner's very short remarks. Testy, repeated talking points, took no questions. Stormed off.

Somebody got a spanking.

Also a little odd McConell wasn't there with him.

I think it's really telling.  He's got a primary fight and then a legit Dem candidate to face assuming he wins that.  He probably views Boehner as purely farking toxic under those circumstances, especially if Boehner made it clear in the meeting he has no intention of backing down.  McConell is a goofy looking fark, but he can read polls like everyone else and has to know this is going to be a disaster for the GOP if it goes on any longer.  He's going to let Boehner hang for this all on his own.


Good! But I repeat myself.

/good
 
2013-10-02 07:35:52 PM

Deucednuisance: WUSA replayed Boehner's very short remarks. Testy, repeated talking points, took no questions. Stormed off.
Somebody got a spanking.


Sounds like that same someone's going to have to head back out to his right flank and try to convince them that, no, despite what they've all been saying the Democrats appear to be quite serious this time.

Oh, to be a fly on that wall for that conversation.
 
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