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(Think Progress)   Park Service: We're sorry, but the WWII Memorial is closed due to the government shut down. WWII Veterans: How about no? Does no work for you?   (thinkprogress.org) divider line 354
    More: Hero, WWII Memorial, veterans, park police  
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17293 clicks; posted to Main » on 01 Oct 2013 at 12:40 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-10-01 01:25:25 PM  

HAMMERTOE: Lost Thought 00: Everyone wants teh services, no one wants to pay for it. Freedom ain't free. Pony up if you want to honor your fallen comrades at a public memorial

They're veterans who survived. They've "ponied up" all they need to. You are in their debt.


The debt was paid when they cashed their paychecks.
 
2013-10-01 01:26:19 PM  

Amos Quito: [onlineathens.com image 850x566]

With this guy laid off, the TER-RISTS are free to knock the WTC memorial to the ground!

OMG!



Without the Feds on patrol, terrorists could have knocked down the world trade center. oh wait.
 
2013-10-01 01:26:44 PM  

James!: Amos Quito: [onlineathens.com image 850x566]

With this guy laid off, the TER-RISTS are free to knock the WTC memorial to the ground!

OMG!

Nobody shut down the NYPD.


Also, thank you for pointing that out. I wanted to punch someone.
 
2013-10-01 01:26:56 PM  

James!: mediablitz: jaybeezey: DirtyDeadGhostofEbenezerCooke: GOP: Doing things Hitler tried and failed to do.

Like institute nation health care and remove guns from the people? Oh, wait...

Yep. No other country on EARTH has instituted national health care or gun control laws.

ONLY HITLER.

Hitler actually lessened restrictions on gun ownership.  So long as you were a non-Jewish citizen your right to own a gun was very much expanded compared to his predecessors.


The whole "Hitler supported gun control" is an argument by, for and of retards.
 
2013-10-01 01:27:03 PM  
Has anyone mentioned the WW II Monument is actually really crappy?  It's just a rotund little plaza with state names posted randomly around it.  In no way does it evoke the war itself.  Just kind of a bland public space.  Oh, and it interrupts the flow from the Lincoln Memorial up to the Washington Memorial - it's not smooth to navigate.

Contrast with the Korean War Memorial which can be really haunting.  And the Vietnam War Memorial, which is genius.
 
2013-10-01 01:27:50 PM  
Fun Fact: DC can run about two weeks while the government is shut down.
 
2013-10-01 01:27:59 PM  

MVEAlpha: Lost Thought 00: parkke0108: Remember, what they're doing on the hill doesn't mean everyone else has to be stupid too.  I'm not surprised that the cops didn't force the vets out, and good on them for that.  I think that the rangers at the national parks should let people in too, despite the shutdown.

If a shopping mall shuts down would you suggest that it be left unlocked as well?

A public memorial and a shopping mall are not comparable.

/Except how they both sell overpriced doodads


Aside from being public vs. private property, what difference does it make?
 
2013-10-01 01:28:21 PM  
fickenchucker: "government rules with no thought behind them"

It's worse than that. They're insurance company rules.
With no shortage of data to justify them.
 
2013-10-01 01:28:22 PM  
I see that Fark comments remain the model for reasoned discourse on the internet.

/s
 
2013-10-01 01:28:41 PM  

DamnYankees: The WWII Memorial still sucks.


But but but Albert Speer was the best architect in history and that's why they gave him the commission for the WWII memorial
 
2013-10-01 01:28:54 PM  

YodaBlues: The Muthaship: Lord_Baull: Is it me, or does putting barricades in front of a public area just because there's no one to pick up trash around the area sound really stupid?

It is, but it aids the left's message.

[i.imgur.com image 500x273]


Dammit, the loop-back scared me...
 
2013-10-01 01:29:54 PM  
OMG!

Just went to the Grand Canyon National Park webpage: www.nps.gov/grca/

THEY CLOSED THE GRAND CANYON!

arizonablogging.net

Where will all the water from the Colorado River go now?
 
2013-10-01 01:30:38 PM  

James!: Amos Quito: [onlineathens.com image 850x566]

With this guy laid off, the TER-RISTS are free to knock the WTC memorial to the ground!

OMG!

Nobody shut down the NYPD.


Hell, they could go a year on just bribes and kickbacks. And free heros.
 
2013-10-01 01:32:44 PM  

TheShavingofOccam123: James!: Amos Quito: [onlineathens.com image 850x566]

With this guy laid off, the TER-RISTS are free to knock the WTC memorial to the ground!

OMG!

Nobody shut down the NYPD.

Hell, they could go a year on just bribes and kickbacks. And free heros.hoagies. FTFY

 
2013-10-01 01:33:49 PM  

Red Shirt Blues: TheShavingofOccam123: James!: Amos Quito: [onlineathens.com image 850x566]

With this guy laid off, the TER-RISTS are free to knock the WTC memorial to the ground!

OMG!

Nobody shut down the NYPD.

Hell, they could go a year on just bribes and kickbacks. And free heros.hoagies Sammieflip-bops. FTFY

 
2013-10-01 01:34:33 PM  
Ha, E-verify is also shut down.  Thanks, republicans.
 
2013-10-01 01:34:39 PM  

Lost Thought 00: Carousel Beast: You know, because no WW2 vets voted for Roosevelt.

Most WW2 vets were not old enough to vote at the time. Certainly any that are alive today were not allowed to vote. Voting age was 21 (higher in some states). That didn't change until Vietnam protests


Pure BS....my Grandfather was born in 1915 (was 21 in 1935) and served in WWII (ship getting torpedoed by the Japanese) and is currently 98 (99 in 2 months)...is suppose to take part in the 'Honor Flight' November 2nd to D.C.
 
2013-10-01 01:37:03 PM  

Pitabred: Lawnchair: Lord_Baull: Is it me, or does putting barricades in front of a public area just because there's no one to pick up trash around the area sound really stupid?

No, not just you.  I'm a lefty-lefty, but there's a lot of dumb drama going on here too.  I've already hit a couple of federal websites that are blacked out (some Library of Congress links, some Census Factfinder figures).  I mean, seriously, the servers are there.  They're presumably still plugged in (enough to give me the "shut down" message anyway).  Blocking the info is pedantic.  Seriously... websites run by Orthodox Jews don't shut down for the Sabbath (on the "we're not doing work by leaving this running" reasoning).  There's no reason to shut down the websites.  Or public grounds.  I know, employees can't work, but get the Boy Scouts out to pick up trash or whatever.

Running a single serve to say "Sorry, we're closed" is a lot less expensive than running the tens of servers that contain the actual information. Believe it or not, websites aren't magic or free.


And if the servers are compromised by hackers or other malware, the support staff will not be around to respond. Shutting them off is pretty reasonable.
 
2013-10-01 01:37:07 PM  

Lost Thought 00: The debt was paid when they cashed their paychecks.


Hardly.
 
2013-10-01 01:37:53 PM  
How is the internet still on?  Isn't that part of Skynet which is part of the government?
 
2013-10-01 01:38:01 PM  

DubyaHater: lockers: DubyaHater: The police have no obligation to prevent crime.

wat?

He's right. Often times the do preventive services, but they are there to enforce the law, not prevent it from being broken.

Right, but when a fight breaks out in a public place, the police usually step in to prevent it from escalating.


But they don't have to. And you can't sue them if they don't. So there's no liability to attach.

\Well, you can, but you won't win
 
2013-10-01 01:38:08 PM  

Amos Quito: OMG!

Just went to the Grand Canyon National Park webpage: www.nps.gov/grca/

THEY CLOSED THE GRAND CANYON!

[arizonablogging.net image 550x311]

Where will all the water from the Colorado River go now?


Mount Rushmore is closed as well.

We are paying Christo $10 Million to cover it up so that nobody can see it.  Because it's closed.
 
2013-10-01 01:38:15 PM  

PainInTheASP: topcon: What's to "shut down?"  It's a little monument you can walk around.  It could exist for the next century(ies) without anyone touching it.

Well you know, it$ the little thing$ like the park brochure ($7.50), conce$$ions (hot dog: $5, $oft drink: $3), tour$ ($25 adult$$$, $12.50 youth$$, children under 5 free--with rental of park $troller: $20/day).

Mainly ju$t en$uring the $afety and comfort of the clientele by providing adequate $taff and re$ources.

/Just my 2¢


Nothing in DC, not the Monuments or even the Museums have an admission fee, and the "concessions" are independent street vendors with hotdog carts.  (seriously, growing up in DC i was shocked to find out that in places like NY and Chicago people  charged admission to something like a museum.  In my mind it had always been a public resource like the library)

/Henry Smithson FTW!
 
2013-10-01 01:39:18 PM  

I_C_Weener: How is the internet still on?  Isn't that part of Skynet which is part of the government?


I'm routed through 7 Boxxies.  Let them tr...+++++++CARRIER LOST+++++
 
2013-10-01 01:41:55 PM  

ringersol: It's all just legal theatre.
 The barricades are there so the government can argue they aren't liable if someone should fall.  They were trying to keep people out, honest.

 The police are there so they can argue it isn't *their* fault if someone disregarded the barricade and then falls.  They were enforcing the barricade, scouts honor!


The congressman is doing the 'distracting' so no innocent plebe is charged with obstruction, if someone who disregarded the barricade later falls.  He was just asking some honest questions about the policy! (not that he's getting sued in any case)

And the story is there so we can all feel good about a 'common sense' triumph over those knuckleheads in DC.
  / A real triumph would be a legal system that didn't require this charade


// God forbid one of those veterans *does* fall -- this common sense triumph would turn into a serious shiat-show in record time


Pretty dang much, but in our National Parks, the big ones, like Mesa Verde and a ton of others, this IS serious business because those folks do more than just pick up litter. There are a ton of Rangers who are high and dry, not to mention the attached fire departments and more.

Search and rescue? Fire Departments? There are a LOT of services that are essentially shut down, and the cost for maintenance and the simple stuff like cutting brush to keep wildfires in check, monitoring and maintaining historical sites and public lands is grinding to a halt.

This sort of story is essentially to head off a ton of others that illustrate the enormity of what this means to folks, and eats up inches in papers and only so many pages posted a day, so that folks aren't faced with what this actually means. It's theater, designed to distract.
 
2013-10-01 01:42:22 PM  

grumpfuff: James!: Amos Quito: [onlineathens.com image 850x566]

With this guy laid off, the TER-RISTS are free to knock the WTC memorial to the ground!

OMG!

Nobody shut down the NYPD.

Also, thank you for pointing that out. I wanted to punch someone.



katherinegscott.files.wordpress.com

Just take the pills, grumpy.
 
2013-10-01 01:43:28 PM  

Harry Freakstorm: WW II Vet: Why is the park closed?

Park Police: Because there's no one here who can run it. No bloody money in the budget, matey.


I've been there, it isn't like there's a tilt-a-whirl, it's a park.  It's a big open space with some benches.  What does someone have to do to "run" that?
 
2013-10-01 01:43:37 PM  
350f2h3jkir93bsly2c4imnks5.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com

Hey look!  The RNCC is even blaming the closure on the Democrats.
 
2013-10-01 01:43:52 PM  

Amos Quito: [onlineathens.com image 850x566]

With this guy laid off, the TER-RISTS are free to knock the WTC memorial to the ground!

OMG!


It is very sad to see what people (ALL OF YOU WHO ARE AMERICAN CITIZENS WITH THE POWER TO VOTE) have let this country become.
 
2013-10-01 01:45:16 PM  

Amos Quito: OMG!

Just went to the Grand Canyon National Park webpage: www.nps.gov/grca/

THEY CLOSED THE GRAND CANYON!

[arizonablogging.net image 550x311]

Where will all the water from the Colorado River go now?


You do realize that people need to be rescued in the Grand Canyon every year, right? People die in National Parks. I visited Yosemite last year and 3 park rangers were loading a guy who had died on the trail onto a stretcher. So, maybe you aren't aware, but park rangers actually have important jobs to do. Sucks if they closed it because people sign up years in advance to stay at the bottom (Phantom Ranch), but is it right for them to leave it open and let every yahoo who is going to hike down with no water just go on in and die??!
 
2013-10-01 01:47:16 PM  
Ignoring the shutdown because you're inconvenienced is literally an endorsement of socialism and Obamacare.

Why do these vets hate America?
 
2013-10-01 01:47:17 PM  
Something just smacks of pre-planned BS about this whole thing.
 
2013-10-01 01:47:33 PM  

AngryJailhouseFistfark: topcon: What's to "shut down?"  It's a little monument you can walk around.  It could exist for the next century(ies) without anyone touching it.

Except this is Homeland and if some jackass trips and busts his head open on a marble column or drowns in the fountain you know that they sue the shiat out of the US Park Service.


These are WWII vets, not Obama voters.
 
2013-10-01 01:47:50 PM  

Scorpitron is reduced to a thin red paste: Has anyone mentioned the WW II Monument is actually really crappy?  It's just a rotund little plaza with state names posted randomly around it.  In no way does it evoke the war itself.  Just kind of a bland public space.  Oh, and it interrupts the flow from the Lincoln Memorial up to the Washington Memorial - it's not smooth to navigate.

Contrast with the Korean War Memorial which can be really haunting.  And the Vietnam War Memorial, which is genius.


There was HUGE controvery when the WWII memorial was designed,  More than one commentator, and many angry Vets pointed out how "fascist" the grandiose design was. Not only that but it missed a huge point.  Americans, typically do not build memorials to "wars' As a whole, just occassional remeberances of individual battles.   Precedent was broken for the Vietnam War Memorial largely because of a feeling that the war was too amorphous to be broken into discrete events or battles, and partially as a make good for ignoring the vets fo that war for so very long.


The Korean War  Memorial, beautiful as it is, was a bad idea, based on "me too"-ing of Korean war vets who felt even LES attention had been paid to them than Vietnam war vets (and Korea is often called "the Forgotten war") So they got their memorial.   And in Post 9/11 uber patriotic America someone demanded to know why "the Greatest generation didn't have a memorial too, thus this monstrosity was birthed.  The fact is, that while it was officially something else, WW II vets have had a perfectly seriviceable memorial just across the river from DC fro decades:


symonsez.files.wordpress.com
 
2013-10-01 01:47:51 PM  

Mr. Eugenides: Harry Freakstorm: WW II Vet: Why is the park closed?

Park Police: Because there's no one here who can run it. No bloody money in the budget, matey.

I've been there, it isn't like there's a tilt-a-whirl, it's a park.  It's a big open space with some benches.  What does someone have to do to "run" that?


I mentioned this above, but a month or two ago there was some graffiti vandalism on the Lincoln Memorial - and I mean on the damn pedestal, not like an outer part of the building. Patrols are a big reason that kind of thing doesn't happen more often, plus the park service had to do the cleanup. I imagine they're just trying to keep the damage to a minimum, but it does suck to have all that closed to the public... Also I expect that this shutdown means they won't be working to repair the obelisk, so that's another delay...
 
2013-10-01 01:49:20 PM  

mediablitz: SlothB77: its outside.  you can just walk onto it.  a rope isn't going to stop anyone.

Go walk into Glacier National Park. It's outside, after all...


It makes a lot of sense to close the big parks.  If somebody gets in trouble in Yosemite or Glacier N.P. the park service is the only folks around to rescue them.  If someone pisses into a reflecting pool on the National Mall DC Police should be able to step up and take care of it.  I would close the Washington Monument and probably the Lincoln and Jefferson monuments but the WW2 memorial is a pretty open place I could see leaving open.
 
2013-10-01 01:49:55 PM  
Hope they all lit up Lucky Strikes and beat up the guards.
 
2013-10-01 01:50:18 PM  

spidermilk: Amos Quito: OMG!

Just went to the Grand Canyon National Park webpage: www.nps.gov/grca/

THEY CLOSED THE GRAND CANYON!

[arizonablogging.net image 550x311]

Where will all the water from the Colorado River go now?

You do realize that people need to be rescued in the Grand Canyon every year, right? People die in National Parks. I visited Yosemite last year and 3 park rangers were loading a guy who had died on the trail onto a stretcher. So, maybe you aren't aware, but park rangers actually have important jobs to do. Sucks if they closed it because people sign up years in advance to stay at the bottom (Phantom Ranch), but is it right for them to leave it open and let every yahoo who is going to hike down with no water just go on in and die??!



No, leave the parks open.

Let 'em shut down the NSA and the farking IRS.
 
2013-10-01 01:51:43 PM  

spidermilk: Amos Quito: OMG!

Just went to the Grand Canyon National Park webpage: www.nps.gov/grca/

THEY CLOSED THE GRAND CANYON!

[arizonablogging.net image 550x311]

Where will all the water from the Colorado River go now?

You do realize that people need to be rescued in the Grand Canyon every year, right? People die in National Parks. I visited Yosemite last year and 3 park rangers were loading a guy who had died on the trail onto a stretcher. So, maybe you aren't aware, but park rangers actually have important jobs to do. Sucks if they closed it because people sign up years in advance to stay at the bottom (Phantom Ranch), but is it right for them to leave it open and let every yahoo who is going to hike down with no water just go on in and die??!


I worked in a national park recently, and this shut down is hitting a lot of folks already. Folks have little idea what sort of things happen beyond camp grounds and traffic tickets for being dumbasses. Let's not even talk about actual Federal offices.

Guess folks just want the GUB'MENT to keep their mots off their Medicaid...
 
2013-10-01 01:52:56 PM  

Deep Contact: Hope they all lit up Lucky Strikes and beat up the guards.


Then handed out chocolate to bystanders.
 
2013-10-01 01:54:04 PM  
How many of the "I've got mine" generation voted for the tea-hadists that got us into this mess?  Chaps my azz that they have no problem if others are inconvenienced.

Wonder how they would feel if a group from the NAACP pushed aside barriers to the ML King Memorial.

Keep da Gubmint out of my affairs says the Vet who bought his home with a Govt. subsidized loan and got his education with the Govt. subsidized GI Bill and now relies on Govt. sponsored Medicare/Medicaid.
 
2013-10-01 01:54:29 PM  
img.fark.net
 
2013-10-01 01:54:34 PM  
The reason the government closes things like parks, museums and other seemingly random stuff, is they don't want the public to know how well we'd get along without all the extra crap they throw on us.

 You and I know perfectly well that we could get boy scouts or non-profits to run these things and be a helluva lot more efficient than what we currently pay for. But then a whole lot of folks in gov't who've found themselves a nice well paid cushy positions would be suddenly out of a job.

 And neither party is okay with reducing the amount of government jobs available, because once we start with parks and museums, things like EPA, FEMA, ATF and other bloated agencies are next. Once we're done with streamlining those guys, we suddenly realize we're paying way too much for other things, including our current representatives for the actual work they do. And we start cutting back on that to something more reasonable (ie: no forever pay and benefits... go get a real job when you're done ect.)

 They know it's a slippery slope, so they cling to every meaningless job they can in order to prevent the American people from gaining momentum...
 
2013-10-01 01:56:09 PM  

Amos Quito: grumpfuff: James!: Amos Quito: [onlineathens.com image 850x566]

With this guy laid off, the TER-RISTS are free to knock the WTC memorial to the ground!

OMG!

Nobody shut down the NYPD.

Also, thank you for pointing that out. I wanted to punch someone.


[katherinegscott.files.wordpress.com image 324x523]

Just take the pills, grumpy.


If you want to spread your derp, that's fine. But try to at least not make it so blatantly full of shiat.
 
2013-10-01 01:56:39 PM  

Lost Thought 00: Carousel Beast: You know, because no WW2 vets voted for Roosevelt.

Most WW2 vets were not old enough to vote at the time. Certainly any that are alive today were not allowed to vote. Voting age was 21 (higher in some states). That didn't change until Vietnam protests


The average age of a U. S. soldier in WW2 was 26. Older than Vietnam soldiers by about seven years.
 
2013-10-01 01:57:07 PM  

Deep Contact: Hope they all lit up Lucky Strikes and beat up the guards.


Hey! Only officers get Lucky Strikes. The grunts smoke Raleighs.

/I bet they're all wearing the captain's slipper too
 
2013-10-01 02:04:17 PM  

cuzsis: The reason the government closes things like parks, museums and other seemingly random stuff, is they don't want the public to know how well we'd get along without all the extra crap they throw on us.

 You and I know perfectly well that we could get boy scouts or non-profits to run these things and be a helluva lot more efficient than what we currently pay for. But then a whole lot of folks in gov't who've found themselves a nice well paid cushy positions would be suddenly out of a job.


From the people who brought you 'Let's sell our ports to Dubai' comes the next big idea: Let's put organizations with agendas in charge of our cultural heritage. I'm sure a wealthy Islamic charity would be interested in maintaining our monuments.
 
2013-10-01 02:05:10 PM  

Cataholic: Lord_Baull: Is it me, or does putting barricades in front of a public area just because there's no one to pick up trash around the area sound really stupid?

You have to pay people to put up barricades.  How else are you going to claim that not running the government costs $2 Billion more than the $3 Billion a day you spend running it.



This kind of comment really boggles my mind, and there are many in this thread.

Do you mean to tell me that you aren't actually capable of understanding what a skeleton crew is? That you've heard of this news, but somehow avoided hearing that some federal workers deemed "essential" are still working - like the kind of folks who would be needed to police areas or shut down operations.

I'm pretty sure I've met beach towels who could understand these concepts, so I'm guessing it's not a lack of ability so much as willful ignorance.
 
2013-10-01 02:08:06 PM  
Wow... it's like a reality distortion field has descended on the some of the more dogmatic liberal Farkers here today.

"Shutting down" the national parks probably cost more than running them over the course of several weeks, and wasn't dictated by congress, but by the executive branch. The simple, unvarnished truth is that no fences needed to be erected to prevent people from walking on public grounds, except for the executive branch making a big butthurt "I'm taking my ball and going home" statement about the shutdown.

The politics of the shutdown notwithstanding, fencing off public land is simply politics at its most dogmatic and idiotic. Siding with the National Parks department on this one is just as idiotic. Try unplugging your ears and face the truth - this is another example of government waste, and the sole intention is to punish the public for not being outraged and siding with the President in a political matter.

That the only reason anybody is even noticing the "shutdown" is because of the effects of government spending MORE money to artificially "shutdown" parks and web sites is very telling of how bloated and unnecessary our government has become.
 
2013-10-01 02:10:32 PM  

mongbiohazard: Cataholic: Lord_Baull: Is it me, or does putting barricades in front of a public area just because there's no one to pick up trash around the area sound really stupid?

You have to pay people to put up barricades.  How else are you going to claim that not running the government costs $2 Billion more than the $3 Billion a day you spend running it.


This kind of comment really boggles my mind, and there are many in this thread.

Do you mean to tell me that you aren't actually capable of understanding what a skeleton crew is? That you've heard of this news, but somehow avoided hearing that some federal workers deemed "essential" are still working - like the kind of folks who would be needed to police areas or shut down operations.

I'm pretty sure I've met beach towels who could understand these concepts, so I'm guessing it's not a lack of ability so much as willful ignorance.


If they have staff to police the area then what's the need to shut it down?
 
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