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(Some Programmer)   You might want to remove your smartphone from your desk   (i-programmer.info) divider line 60
    More: PSA, smartphones, vectors, Georgia Institute of Technology, neural networks, signal processing, keystrokes  
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10603 clicks; posted to Geek » on 01 Oct 2013 at 1:00 PM (47 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



60 Comments   (+0 »)
   
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2013-10-01 12:08:19 PM
If I am suppose to be worry that they are already watching my internet traffic (whoever they are) why should I be afraid of this?
 
2013-10-01 12:12:13 PM
I have read of this ages ago.
 
2013-10-01 12:12:24 PM
I put it on my desk and it captured: "I put it on my desk and it captured: "I put it on my desk and it captured:
 
2013-10-01 12:15:30 PM
I'm about as concerned about this as I am with Van Eck Phreaking.
 
2013-10-01 12:19:32 PM

comhcinc: If I am suppose to be worry that they are already watching my internet traffic (whoever they are) why should I be afraid of this?


Well, it could also capture log ins, pin numbers and the URLs for all that moose porn you've been downloading.
 
2013-10-01 12:30:03 PM

NutWrench: comhcinc: If I am suppose to be worry that they are already watching my internet traffic (whoever they are) why should I be afraid of this?

Well, it could also capture log ins, pin numbers and the URLs for all that moose porn you've been downloading.


Yeah but again I thought that was already happening? I mean I get off on know people are watching........
 
2013-10-01 12:43:20 PM

Langdon_777: I have read of this ages ago.


Yeah, I thought so too and went to find an old article.  Thing is, there are a bunch from just the last couple of days, but I was able to find the older report as well, from 2011:
http://www.tgdaily.com/mobility-features/59137-smartphones-can-spy-a s- you-type-on-your-pc
Just not sure why this is news again.
 
2013-10-01 12:52:53 PM
Sure its possible, just like a threesome between the hot chicks from that comedy show about that modern family, you know the ones.  Possible has a pretty wide scope of application.
 
2013-10-01 01:04:25 PM

BumpInTheNight: Sure its possible, just like a threesome between the hot chicks from that comedy show about that modern family, you know the ones.

www.womenlivingincommunity.com


Oh boy, do I.
 
2013-10-01 01:05:04 PM
Really? Well, i'm typing a story about a teenager getting sent 100K years into the future (unintentionally) in a US air force experiment that destroys a whole town.The aliens all look like the fevered dreams of a taxidermist on a really bad shroom trip.
 
2013-10-01 01:24:20 PM
Hmmm, the spot where I have a keyboard that might be used near my smartphone has an odd keyboard in a drawer, so you'd have a signal through the sliding rails and impulses at odd angles. Although if you knew the odd, almost ignored, model of keyboard at my desktop workstation it might be really easy because it's not a flat plane.
 
2013-10-01 01:28:51 PM

BumpInTheNight: Sure its possible, just like a threesome between the hot chicks from that comedy show about that modern family, you know the ones.


i.imgur.comi.imgur.com
 
2013-10-01 01:30:23 PM
*yawn*... More "everything we do is being watched/captured"

If anyone is worried about this, the NSA, FBI, or whatever other organization is an evil spying ring.. Move to Alaska.. Don't own a phone, don't get the internet and only communicate by carrier pigeon or smoke signals.
 
2013-10-01 01:38:26 PM

NutWrench: comhcinc: If I am suppose to be worry that they are already watching my internet traffic (whoever they are) why should I be afraid of this?

Well, it could also capture log ins, pin numbers and the URLs for all that moose porn you've been downloading.


If someone can manage to hijack my phone they'll already have most of that
 
2013-10-01 01:39:58 PM

styckx: *yawn*... More "everything we do is being watched/captured"

If anyone is worried about this, the NSA, FBI, or whatever other organization is an evil spying ring.. Move to Alaska.. Don't own a phone, don't get the internet and only communicate by carrier pigeon or smoke signals.


They can use satellites to track my smoke signals and the birds all work for The Man already
 
2013-10-01 01:42:01 PM
So, IF they hijack your phone, then manage to figure out exactly where your phone is in relation to your keyboard, and things work out just right, they might figure out anywhere from half to 3/4 of what you're typing?

Why wouldn't they just install a keylogger if they have that much access to your stuff? They'd get 100% of everything then.
 
2013-10-01 01:50:45 PM
This is why I only use Dragon speech software for sensitive documents.
 
2013-10-01 01:53:01 PM
keys were pressed while a sensor data was fed to two neural networks. The data was processed to produce a feature vector based on a range of temporal and frequency information.

On no! Everyone will be doing this in no time! EVERYBODY PANIC!
 
2013-10-01 01:54:41 PM
eighty something words per minutes biatches... not very accurately though.  Try to steal that.
 
2013-10-01 01:59:01 PM

styckx: *yawn*... More "everything we do is being watched/captured"

If anyone is worried about this, the NSA, FBI, or whatever other organization is an evil spying ring.. Move to Alaska.. Don't own a phone, don't get the internet and only communicate by carrier pigeon or smoke signals.


Or Airstrip One.
 
2013-10-01 02:00:48 PM

mrlewish: eighty something words per minutes biatches... not very accurately though.  Try to steal that.


Twenty-five words per minute with this:

i41.tinypic.com

And there ain't no dittyboppers left on active duty that I'm aware of.  Oh, and I can make it pretty damned hard for a machine to copy it, but still keep it relatively easy for a trained human to do so.
 
2013-10-01 02:03:00 PM
Perhaps I should switch from my Model M that my neighbors can probably hear...
 
2013-10-01 02:09:45 PM
Amazing!

/Not really, not at all.
 
2013-10-01 02:17:16 PM
interesting because it's hard to imagine a sensor lying a foot away that can tell the difference between an "H" and a "J", especially with the variation in human keystrokes that could make it more difficult to suss out whether or not a different key was struck. i guess that's where the neural net comes in, those can 'learn' some crazy things and could foreseeably adapt to tell the difference between typing consistency and typing locations.
 
2013-10-01 02:27:33 PM
Why bother trying to decipher text from vibrations if you can simply decipher them based on the sounds of the keys?
 
2013-10-01 02:31:03 PM
I fell, so, so, so, bad for whoever has to read MY transcripts.

I've been busy making a script for a narrated version of 2G1C so the blind and deaf can enjoy it too.

/The busty blond spasmed, trying to hold back her love for the cup.
//She could not and her thick, chunky love spewed out upon Julie.
 
2013-10-01 02:40:37 PM

Hella Fark: interesting because it's hard to imagine a sensor lying a foot away that can tell the difference between an "H" and a "J", especially with the variation in human keystrokes that could make it more difficult to suss out whether or not a different key was struck. i guess that's where the neural net comes in, those can 'learn' some crazy things and could foreseeably adapt to tell the difference between typing consistency and typing locations.


Even if you can only get general locations of the keys hit, you can really narrow things down by looking in a dictionary and assuming that people are typing actual words for the most part.

Spaces are probably pretty distinct (big key and gets hit in a different way than usual), which I'm sure helps since you can then split up words with good probability.  Once you have them separated you can look at the probable keys for each keypress, match it up with a dictionary and letter/digraph/trigraph frequency table and do pretty well.
 
2013-10-01 02:44:52 PM

derio42: Why bother trying to decipher text from vibrations if you can simply decipher them based on the sounds of the keys?


Yeah, because sound is totally not vibration at all.
 
2013-10-01 02:52:50 PM
Oh shiat, now everyone knows that I'm cautiosly optimistic about the '13 Chiefs, and over the moon about the '13-14 Jayhawks!
 
2013-10-01 02:57:44 PM
Apple didn't include the three laws of smart phones when they made their product.

The Three Laws of Smart Phones:
1. A smart phone may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
2. A smart phone must obey the orders given to it by human beings, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. A smart phone must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.

Your only recourse:
imageshack.us
 
2013-10-01 03:09:24 PM

comhcinc: If I am suppose to be worry that they are already watching my internet traffic (whoever they are) why should I be afraid of this?


Hey! What do you have against half-misinformed jackasses with a pathetically obvious agenda sowing FUD?
 
2013-10-01 03:20:07 PM

styckx: *yawn*... More "everything we do is being watched/captured"

If anyone is worried about this, the NSA, FBI, or whatever other organization is an evil spying ring.. Move to Alaska.. Don't own a phone, don't get the internet and only communicate by carrier pigeon or smoke signals.


Or move to New Hampshire?
s11.postimg.org
 
2013-10-01 03:22:06 PM
So how to stop such eavesdropping? Leave the phone outside the room or keep in in a bag next to the desk rather than on it.

Or just leave it on something soft, like a spare mouse pad, that will absorb vibrations.

dittybopper: Twenty-five words per minute with this:


One of the not-very-useful-at-the-moment skills I still think about picking up, if only for the novelty.
 
2013-10-01 03:27:27 PM
Just detecting raw keypresses didn't produce a very accurate result
Word recognition only achieved a 46% accuracy (of a 2nd word when it already knew the first)
if the phone is too far from the keyboard then the vibrations aren't strong enough,
if the user taps on the desk or plays a radio then there is too much interference and
if the user types too fast the processor can't keep up.


So how to stop such eavesdropping?

Um, doesn't sound like I really have to do anything...
 
2013-10-01 03:29:28 PM

timujin: Langdon_777: I have read of this ages ago.

Yeah, I thought so too and went to find an old article.  Thing is, there are a bunch from just the last couple of days, but I was able to find the older report as well, from 2011:
http://www.tgdaily.com/mobility-features/59137-smartphones-can-spy-a s- you-type-on-your-pc
Just not sure why this is news again.


FUD has an interesting cycle. I am not exactly sure why I should be worried about my own phone recording what I am typing on a keyboard... it is my phone after all. If it is owned then I think there are bigger things to worry about.
 
2013-10-01 03:31:55 PM

kronicfeld: I'm about as concerned about this as I am with Van Eck Phreaking.


pretty much
 
2013-10-01 03:58:58 PM
something something tempest something...
 
2013-10-01 04:00:38 PM
oh, this has nothing at all to do with emanations.  huh.

...  heh.  emanations.
 
2013-10-01 04:08:03 PM

timujin: Langdon_777: I have read of this ages ago.

Yeah, I thought so too and went to find an old article.  Thing is, there are a bunch from just the last couple of days, but I was able to find the older report as well, from 2011:


That 2011 report is the one being discussed in TFA; there isn't a new paper.  So yeah, I don't know why this is news again.
 
2013-10-01 04:45:35 PM

dittybopper: mrlewish: eighty something words per minutes biatches... not very accurately though.  Try to steal that.

Twenty-five words per minute with this:

[i41.tinypic.com image 640x523]

And there ain't no dittyboppers left on active duty that I'm aware of.  Oh, and I can make it pretty damned hard for a machine to copy it, but still keep it relatively easy for a trained human to do so.


Um, with the amount of RF given off when that switch arcs I could set an AM radio up 50 feet from the telegraph and still hear the dits and dots and dashes.
 
2013-10-01 04:54:47 PM
This just isn't happening. People would have to release the death grips they have on their smartphones at all times for them to be placed desk to begin with.
 
2013-10-01 05:31:20 PM
You mean that GPS equipped constant personal companion that you've willingly typed all of your banking PINs and passwords into might parse 45% of the annual office supplies budget spreadsheet you're typing? The horror...
 
2013-10-01 05:40:15 PM
"Be careful the next time someone leaves their phone on your desk."

Always be on the look out for a new free phone.
 
2013-10-01 06:45:23 PM
The phones in the room can hear it just as well.
They did a study, it is possible to record the keystrokes from as far as 20 feet away and still retain high precision information about the strokes.

Bit of advice:  change keyboards daily.
 
2013-10-01 07:22:18 PM

red5ish: Apple didn't include the three laws of smart phones when they made their product.

The Three Laws of Smart Phones:
1. A smart phone may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
2. A smart phone must obey the orders given to it by human beings, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. A smart phone must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.

Your only recourse:
[imageshack.us image 500x375]



Android did, though.
 
2013-10-01 08:03:33 PM
I knew all this in the 80's from the USAF tempest program. Every piece of equipment has a control radius. Remember VCR's? The control radius for them was over a mile. Yes your government could see what porn you were watching from a mile away in the 80's. Just imagine what they can do now.
 
2013-10-01 08:09:25 PM

Linux_Yes: red5ish: Apple didn't include the three laws of smart phones when they made their product.

The Three Laws of Smart Phones:
1. A smart phone may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm.
2. A smart phone must obey the orders given to it by human beings, except where such orders would conflict with the First Law.
3. A smart phone must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.

Your only recourse:
[imageshack.us image 500x375]


Android did, though.


Android is Google. I don't know if Google do this, but it's quite possible for them to know a lot about you from your Android phone, especially if you are logged in to your GMail account. They can even know where you go or at least where your phone goes day in and day out. From that they can deduce where you live and where you work.
 
2013-10-01 09:12:08 PM

ArcadianRefugee: So how to stop such eavesdropping? Leave the phone outside the room or keep in in a bag next to the desk rather than on it.

Or just leave it on something soft, like a spare mouse pad, that will absorb vibrations.

dittybopper: Twenty-five words per minute with this:

One of the not-very-useful-at-the-moment skills I still think about picking up, if only for the novelty.


It's useful. I use it just about every day, and I used to copy Morse code for a living.
 
2013-10-01 09:15:09 PM

Mr. Eugenides: dittybopper: mrlewish: eighty something words per minutes biatches... not very accurately though.  Try to steal that.

Twenty-five words per minute with this:

[i41.tinypic.com image 640x523]

And there ain't no dittyboppers left on active duty that I'm aware of.  Oh, and I can make it pretty damned hard for a machine to copy it, but still keep it relatively easy for a trained human to do so.

Um, with the amount of RF given off when that switch arcs I could set an AM radio up 50 feet from the telegraph and still hear the dits and dots and dashes.


If your hearing dits dots and dashes, then you ain't gonna know what I'm sending.
 
2013-10-01 09:22:05 PM
When I was a line cook I could recognize when certain dishes were ordered by the sound dot-matrix printer made printing them out on the order chit. Long words, patterns of spaces, lots of "big" letters clumped together...

/tangentially related I guess
 
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