"Ben was totally crazy," Saupner laughed. "After he invented a static electricity generator, he decided to use it to electrocute a turkey so he could cook it.

"He tried to hook his generator to the turkey, only he made a mistake and hooked up himself. He turned on the generator and knocked himself out."

I love this man moreso then ever now.

No mimes! Man, that's a selling point.

Damn mimes.

The real reason Di was murdered: she was for land-mime disposal.

/killer mimes

"Ben zapped people all the time with his static electricity experiments, so we're totally going to zap people tomorrow,"



Is that a law suit I smell?

Ol' Ben is my hero, he was quite a radical and thought outside the box in his day. I wanna have people celebrating my birthday in 300 years.

We should probably just mime our own business.

Sadly, this looks like something I would write.

The Franklin Institute Science Museum celebrates its namesake Ben's 298th birthday tomorrow by stunning families with a party they'll really get a charge out of.

"Ben zapped people all the time with his static electricity experiments, so we're totally going to zap people tomorrow," promised Kerry Saupner, who created the electrifying Bentertainment.

Totally? Like, so totally.

Sam and Max... Freelance police.

Mummers? Can we have no mummers, please? I hate mummers.

mime you all!

And in tribute to Ben Franklin, The Panthers are all set to zap the Philly Eagles from the playoff. Unless you guys get Rush Limbaugh to say something stupid before kickoff. Then the Eagles will win the Superbowl.

"Ben zapped people all the time with his static electricity experiments, so we're totally going to zap people tomorrow,"

"Ben was totally crazy," Saupner laughed. "After he invented a static electricity generator, he decided to use it to electrocute a turkey so he could cook it.

"He tried to hook his generator to the turkey, only he made a mistake and hooked up himself. He turned on the generator and knocked himself out."

Apparently this party is funded by the Philadelphia Middle School Ben Franklin Appreciation Society.

A man who's sacrifice an ounce of freedom for any degree of security deserves neither.

Stan Freeberg makes an excellent joke about Franklin in his "First Thanksgiving" sketch (on United States of America album), about accidentally cooking the turkey instead of the eagle, and how they should stuff it with bread crumbs to make it look fatter.

The lady's liked his personal massager too. ONly it was 20 pounds and only worked during thunderstorms.

If you would not be forgotten
As soon as you are dead and rotten,
Either write things worthy reading,
Or do things worth the writing.

- Ben Franklin

I thought birtdays stopped when you died.

/nothin

They should hand out light bulbs too

Ben was a studs stud. He boffed his way through France. My man.

plus you can't tell me ol' Ben didn't enjoy a spliff every now and then...

Beer is living proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy.
-BF

http://www.houseofquotes.com/quotes/alcohol/

I hate mimes!

/Caleb

but... no hookers helping you pee upside down?

God, I forgot about the heart. It was great and the electric show would scare the bejesus out of me every time and I knew it was coming.

The guy that's playing Ben Franklin is a real trip in downtown Philly. I don't know if he's salaried by the City, but he just wanders around in a colonial getup and a tri-corner hat and will take a picture with anyone. Doesn't drop character for anything.

2004-01-16 05:13:43 PM crazyjim

A man who's sacrifice an ounce of freedom for any degree of security deserves neither.
---------------------------

I know that is a paraphrase, but I hear that quote being thrown around everywhere nowadays.

Does anybodsy have a link or can direct me to the PRIMARY source material? (IE: Franklin's writings or a book collection of them, not "uh....here you go www.moveon.org)

Big Ben was quite the quoteable in his time, but the fact that this one has popped up so frequently in recent years makes me want to verify its author.
------


In other Ben Franklin news, Jefferson had him escorted around Paris by "minders" while negotiating the treaty of Paris so he wouldnt divulge any sensitive information while drunkenly cavorting in the bars and brothels.

Ben Franklin is great.

Most farkers won't like this one bit. Wonder what Franklin would have thought about our current situation regarding "check your religion at the door" government policies?
edited text below, full text at: http://personal.pitnet.net/primarysources/franklin.html

-------------

Benjamin Franklin Requests Prayer in the Constitutional Convention
June 28, 1787


Mr. President [to George Washington]

[intro paragraph about the imperfection of man and the historical basis for writing the constitution omitted]

....In this situation of this Assembly, groping as it were in the dark to find political truth, and scarce able to distinguish it when presented to us, how has it happened, Sir, that we have not hitherto once thought of humbly applying to the Father of lights to illuminate our understandings? In the beginning of the Contest with G. Britain, when we were sensible of danger we had daily prayer in this room for the divine protection.- Our prayers, Sir, were heard, & they were graciously answered. All of us who were engaged in the struggle must have observed frequent instances of a superintending providence in our favor. To that kind providence we owe this happy opportunity of consulting in peace on the means of establishing our future national felicity. And have we now forgotten that powerful friend? or do we imagine that we no longer need his assistance? I have lived, Sir, a long time, and the longer I live, the more convincing proofs I see of this truth- that God Governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without his notice, is it probable that an empire can rise without his aid? We have been assured, Sir, in the sacred writings, that "except the Lord build the House they labour in vain that build it." I firmly believe this; and I also believe that without his concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better, than the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our little partial local interests; our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall become a reproach and bye word down to future ages. And what is worse, mankind may hereafter from this unfortunate instance, despair of establishing Governments by Human wisdom and leave it to chance, war and conquest.

I therefore beg leave to move-that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and its blessings on our deliberations, be held in this Assembly every morning before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the Clergy of this City be requested to officiate in that Service-

Mr. [Roger] SHERMAN seconded the motion.

Mr. [Alexander] HAMILTON & several others expressed their apprehensions that however proper such a resolution might have been at the beginning of the convention, it might at this late day, I bring on it some disagreeable animadversions. & lead the public to believe that the embarrassments and dissensions within the Convention, had suggested this measure. It was answered by Docr. F. Mr. SHERMAN & others, that the past omission of a duty could not justify a further omission-that the rejection of such a proposition would expose the Convention to more unpleasant animadversions than the adoption of it: and that the alarm out of doors that might be excited for the state of things within, would at least be as likely to do good as ill.

Mr. WILLIAMSON, observed that the true cause of the omission could not be mistaken. The Convention had no funds.

Mr. RANDOLPH proposed in order to give a favorable aspect to ye. measure, that a sermon be preached at the request of the convention on 4th of July, the anniversary of Independence; & thenceforward prayers be used in ye. Convention every morning. Dr. FRANKn. 2ded. this motion After several unsuccessful attempts for silently postponing the matter by adjourng. the adjournment was at length carried, without any vote on the motion.

How odd. Ben Franklin, Quaker, asking for a member of the clergy of the city to officiate over a prayer.

Since I asked the question, I might as well show the answer:

According to Bartleby's familiar quotations (which is a secondary source, but a reliable one), the quote:

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

It was penned by Franklin in the "Historical Review of Pennsylvania" published 1759. According to Bartleby's, the quote was in fairly general usage at the time, with it popping up in use by the general legislature of Pennsylvania as early as 1755.


So it isnt like Babs quoting fake Shakespeare lines. Other searches tend to support that Franklin wrote the quote.


-FSF

2004-01-16 06:21:50 PM Bone_Daddy73
How odd. Ben Franklin, Quaker, asking for a member of the clergy of the city to officiate over a prayer.
------------------------

Franklin wasn't a quaker. You are mistaking him with the quaker oats guy. While he was a freethinker, a deist, a mason, and a regular praiser of God- the was not a quaker. There are a number of his writing in which is is concerned that Pennsylvania will turn into a Quaker theocracy.

Rickythepenguin: Im not saying the Framers didnt believe in Separation of Church and State. But they were not trying to scrub religion out of public view like today. That is much different that trying to avoid a Theocracy.

And the modern "strict barrier Separation of Church and State" idea is one that was most fervently held by Adams and Jefferson.

The founders were actually pretty divided on the issue. Much like people are today. Im saying that Franklin was not on the Adams/Jefferson side of the issue.

The legal basis of "Separation of Church and State" comes from SCOTUS decisions, the first of which referenced a Jefferson letter to a Baptist group. It has since been strengthened through other affirming decisions that have followed.

There is no Constitutional basis for Separation of Church and State. Only a guarantee of freedom of religion and the free exercise therof.

Here's an interesting Franklin fact:

Ben Franklin sponsored Voltaire's induction into the Masonic brotherhood during his time in Paris.


/history nerd.

He wrote some rather amusing papers as well.

Ben Franklin was a tool - read his letter of March 22nd 1775 to his son - asshat. Seriously. Total tool. He couldn't get up himself any further...

Also, he was a post thief...

/historian

2004-01-16 06:56:21 PM Xhan
He wrote some rather amusing papers as well. (link to a Franklin letter regarding the possibility of making Farts not stink)
------------

There must have been some sort of creepy Franklin obsession with body smells:

He liked to take "air baths" instead of ones using H20 (which isnt that horrible an idea considering how fetid Philly h20 must have been in the 1700's).
So Franklin would open up all the windows and doors in his house, strip down buck ass nekkid, and air out his junk- he thought it made him stink less.

Rickythepenguin:

You make good points in your response, and I can surely hear where you are coming from. I agree with some of your points.

My personal view on the issue is that our government should try to strike a happy medium between wanting to put up giant electric-light Jesus (or a huge ten commandments monument) on top of a federal building and trying to prevent things like Nativity displays from happening on public greens.

Earlier when I said, "scrub religion out of public view" I meant it in terms of displays that happen on public property, IE someone wanting to pray in school or a cross headstone in a public military cemetary.

The "ten commandments" monument guy, Judge Moore (I believe that was his name) annoyed me. He is right, but only partially. Our laws were based on the Commandments, but also on things like the Magna Carta and English Common law. Now you can't bring up that fact without people thinking that you are some sort of religious nutball.

oh great that religious nutball F. Scott Fitzpanarchy is at it again. *sigh*

:p

Thanx for the reminder of why i don't read the daily news.

My 10-year old kid writes better than that.

It's Ben Franklins birthday. Yeah he was a scientist, author, philosopher among many other things. But when it came to a party, Ben was a wildman.

Beer! women! celebration! It's what he would have wanted.

FSP - We always claimed him, whether he wanted us or not. I am quaker, and am therefore qualified to speak on behalf of all quakers, when I say a quaker theocracy would have been a terrible idea. Imagine a state senate that ran on concensus rather than majority. Unthinkable.

A strange logical contradiction - you imply Franklin wanted an entanglement of church and state in one post, and state that he feared the same thing in the next. Was he afraid of quakers, but not religions with preachers? This does not jibe with my (admittedly limited) understanding of our founding uncle.

Bone Daddy says:
you imply Franklin wanted an entanglement of church and state in one post, and state that he feared the same thing in the next. Was he afraid of quakers, but not religions with preachers? This does not jibe with my (admittedly limited) understanding of our founding uncle.

-------------------

No, what I said was that Franklin wanted to avoid Pennsylvania becoming a Quaker theocracy in the colonial era. But he was not for trying to completely secularize and abolish all forms of religious expression in government life. He was obviously a fairly religious man who prayed to God and considered the Constitution somewhat of a divine duty. But he didnt want a theocracy. Happy medium.

That is interesting about the consensus, though. I dont think anything would get done. Although, maybe that wouldn't be such a bad thing for government- sometimes.

Ricky the Penguin:
I don't know much about federal indian law, I have only taken one class on the subject. Although from what I have read, Scalia has been a real arsehole to the Native American side in cases of religion. That is usually pretty uncharacteristic of him, he seems to fall on the side of the religious group and religious expression most of the time.

Reading some of the transcripts of the questions put forward, it seems that Scalia doesnt really think of Indians as having a "real" religion and that they are just using their overly broad earth-deifying beliefs to prevent white intrusion on their land.

A case I can recall off the top of my head involves a Washington state tribe trying to block a logging road because it would have cut down a 300 year old tree that they considered sacred and did spring rituals by every year. Scalia wrote the decision that rejected the Indian argument and allowed the US dept. of the interior to cut down the tree.