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(SeattlePI)   Move over, baggage check fee and reservation change fees. Welcome, the new Airline Not Being Rude to You Fee   (seattlepi.com) divider line 175
    More: Interesting, Airline Not Being Rude, civility, American Airlines, fees, airlines  
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15859 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 Sep 2013 at 2:22 PM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



175 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2013-09-30 10:52:31 AM  
FSM, I so hate the airlines.

http://www.beapilot.com
 
2013-09-30 12:16:01 PM  
"We've moved from takeaways to enhancements," says John F. Thomas of L.E.K. Consulting. "It's all about personalizing the travel experience."

Bullshiat.  It's about making the most amount of money for the least amount of service possible, an charging out the ass for what little service you do offer.

STFU.
 
2013-09-30 01:11:04 PM  
FTFA: "letting passengers pay to have an empty seat next to them."

I believe that's called "buying an extra ticket" and it's not exactly a new service.
 
2013-09-30 01:22:25 PM  
"The sides are not included in the price of a steak," he says. "Airline ticket prices should reflect the costs incurred by the individual passenger."

Where are you buying your steak?
 
2013-09-30 01:27:31 PM  

RedPhoenix122: "The sides are not included in the price of a steak," he says. "Airline ticket prices should reflect the costs incurred by the individual passenger."

Where are you buying your steak?


Well, to be fair, people who work for airlines have demonstrated that they do not fully comprehend food.
 
2013-09-30 01:40:26 PM  
"We have massive amounts of data," says Delta CEO Richard Anderson. "We know who you are. We know what your history has been on the airline. We can customize our offerings make millions off all that information we send to the NSA,"
 
2013-09-30 02:07:10 PM  

nmrsnr: I believe that's called "buying an extra ticket" and it's not exactly a new service.


I saw that earlier, but I believe instead it is either a bet by the passenger or a conditional fee that if there is an unfilled seat they will move them to be next to the fee-payer.

RedPhoenix122: Where are you buying your steak?


Steakhouses traditionally charge for sides a la carte, even if Outback gives you one with your slab o'beef.

I'm with Subby, though.  United doesn't even give out peanuts or pretzels anymore, and that's just a kick in the nuts given how horrible it is to connect through Dulles (cramped yet sprawling) or O'Hare (O'Delays).  USAir doesn't show movies, nor provide any entertainment system for cross-country flights like CLT-SAN that I flew last week.

Delta gives you drinks, a choice of peanuts/pretzels/Biscoffs, and always has a movie if not on-demand for cross-country flights.  Anything 737-sized or bigger gets entertainment included.
 
2013-09-30 02:25:55 PM  

dead: FSM, I so hate the airlines.

http://www.beapilot.com


FSM is such a unwieldy thing to say.  I'd suggest "Holy meatballs".
 
2013-09-30 02:26:05 PM  

factoryconnection: nmrsnr: I believe that's called "buying an extra ticket" and it's not exactly a new service.

I saw that earlier, but I believe instead it is either a bet by the passenger or a conditional fee that if there is an unfilled seat they will move them to be next to the fee-payer.

RedPhoenix122: Where are you buying your steak?

Steakhouses traditionally charge for sides a la carte, even if Outback gives you one with your slab o'beef.

I'm with Subby, though.  United doesn't even give out peanuts or pretzels anymore, and that's just a kick in the nuts given how horrible it is to connect through Dulles (cramped yet sprawling) or O'Hare (O'Delays).  USAir doesn't show movies, nor provide any entertainment system for cross-country flights like CLT-SAN that I flew last week.

Delta gives you drinks, a choice of peanuts/pretzels/Biscoffs, and always has a movie if not on-demand for cross-country flights.  Anything 737-sized or bigger gets entertainment included.


On Southwest they hold a basket of various snacks and say "take as many as you'd like"
 
2013-09-30 02:28:04 PM  

kidgenius: factoryconnection: nmrsnr: I believe that's called "buying an extra ticket" and it's not exactly a new service.

I saw that earlier, but I believe instead it is either a bet by the passenger or a conditional fee that if there is an unfilled seat they will move them to be next to the fee-payer.

RedPhoenix122: Where are you buying your steak?

Steakhouses traditionally charge for sides a la carte, even if Outback gives you one with your slab o'beef.

I'm with Subby, though.  United doesn't even give out peanuts or pretzels anymore, and that's just a kick in the nuts given how horrible it is to connect through Dulles (cramped yet sprawling) or O'Hare (O'Delays).  USAir doesn't show movies, nor provide any entertainment system for cross-country flights like CLT-SAN that I flew last week.

Delta gives you drinks, a choice of peanuts/pretzels/Biscoffs, and always has a movie if not on-demand for cross-country flights.  Anything 737-sized or bigger gets entertainment included.

On Southwest they hold a basket of various snacks and say "take as many as you'd like"


This.  Southwest airlines is awesome.  They do their job well, and I've never been treated like shiat.
 
2013-09-30 02:30:52 PM  

AntonChigger: kidgenius: factoryconnection: nmrsnr: I believe that's called "buying an extra ticket" and it's not exactly a new service.

I saw that earlier, but I believe instead it is either a bet by the passenger or a conditional fee that if there is an unfilled seat they will move them to be next to the fee-payer.

RedPhoenix122: Where are you buying your steak?

Steakhouses traditionally charge for sides a la carte, even if Outback gives you one with your slab o'beef.

I'm with Subby, though.  United doesn't even give out peanuts or pretzels anymore, and that's just a kick in the nuts given how horrible it is to connect through Dulles (cramped yet sprawling) or O'Hare (O'Delays).  USAir doesn't show movies, nor provide any entertainment system for cross-country flights like CLT-SAN that I flew last week.

Delta gives you drinks, a choice of peanuts/pretzels/Biscoffs, and always has a movie if not on-demand for cross-country flights.  Anything 737-sized or bigger gets entertainment included.

On Southwest they hold a basket of various snacks and say "take as many as you'd like"

This.  Southwest airlines is awesome.  They do their job well, and I've never been treated like shiat.


Unless you are specifically into that, in which case, they always stop when you say your safeword.  Mine is "teacups."
 
2013-09-30 02:31:06 PM  
I'm ok with all the stuff in the article, and I fly a lot.
 
2013-09-30 02:31:18 PM  
I have to say Delta's option for more legroom is awesome (Priority Plus maybe?). It is like an extra $24 per seat, but my 6'4" was actually comfortable on our flights last year. We got a little bit better service and on one flight priority plus only had like 4 people sitting in it (coach was packed). It was an early morning flight so I got to stretch out over an entire row and sleep.
 
2013-09-30 02:31:41 PM  
Flying remains cheaper now than it's just about ever been.

But please, keep complaining that too many other people are flying as well or that you wish you could get a 50 cent bag of peanuts.
 
2013-09-30 02:32:30 PM  
Meanwhile:

media.northjersey.com
 
2013-09-30 02:34:07 PM  

Dafatone: Flying remains cheaper now than it's just about ever been.

But please, keep complaining that too many other people are flying as well or that you wish you could get a 50 cent bag of peanuts.


I will complain about the fact that the seats are too close together for a person my height(exactly average for an adult male), which causes substantial pain for the hours I'm on the plane.  I didn't mind the 10% higher prices.
 
2013-09-30 02:36:55 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]


Beverage services during takeoff/landing?
 
2013-09-30 02:37:51 PM  
Dear Airline CEOs,

Despite all your efforts to make flying the most miserable, soul-crushing, and demeaning experience a traveler can have, these last two decades have been without question - The Golden Years of air travel.

See you soon in coach!  Reserve a middle row seat for me!

Forever yours,

Brap

P.S. I'm a masochist!
 
2013-09-30 02:38:58 PM  
Earplugs
Comfortable clothes
Snack
Extra hoodie to act as blanket, pillow or eye-shade
Emergency exit row window booked as soon as on-line seat selection starts.
Boarding pass on phone
All metal in the tray
Be nice to the stewardess


/how I make flying painless and easy and fun
/apparently this is all rocket science to most people
 
2013-09-30 02:41:34 PM  

Bill_Wick's_Friend: Earplugs
Comfortable clothes
Snack
Extra hoodie to act as blanket, pillow or eye-shade
Emergency exit row window booked as soon as on-line seat selection starts.
Boarding pass on phone
All metal in the tray
Be nice to the stewardess


/how I make flying painless and easy and fun
/apparently this is all rocket science to most people


They charge extra for Emergency Exit rows now.
 
2013-09-30 02:42:07 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]


I don't think that plane is high enough.
 
2013-09-30 02:42:12 PM  

ikanreed: Dafatone: Flying remains cheaper now than it's just about ever been.

But please, keep complaining that too many other people are flying as well or that you wish you could get a 50 cent bag of peanuts.

I will complain about the fact that the seats are too close together for a person my height(exactly average for an adult male), which causes substantial pain for the hours I'm on the plane.  I didn't mind the 10% higher prices.


You sound fat?
 
2013-09-30 02:43:42 PM  

Brockalisk: ikanreed: Dafatone: Flying remains cheaper now than it's just about ever been.

But please, keep complaining that too many other people are flying as well or that you wish you could get a 50 cent bag of peanuts.

I will complain about the fact that the seats are too close together for a person my height(exactly average for an adult male), which causes substantial pain for the hours I'm on the plane.  I didn't mind the 10% higher prices.

You sound fat?


Legs, doofus.
 
2013-09-30 02:43:47 PM  
Delta is not bad.  Staff is friendly and if you're nice, always get extra cookies and regular coffee refills.
 
2013-09-30 02:44:13 PM  
The world burns approximately 5,000 barrels of jet fuel a day, approx. 1,500,000 pounds.
Jet engines throw out approximately 60% of the fuel, unburned, volatilized.
This waste is deposited in the upper layers of the important part of our atmosphere, daily.

Come fly with me.
 
2013-09-30 02:44:44 PM  
The company that I'm currently consulting for only flies United or other Star Alliance carriers (which usually means Swiss Air).   Thankfully, this company only flies business class so I can't complain about the lack of legroom or amenities.   I think the stewardesses on United were delivered by Boeing with the planes and have been programed to be as surly as possible.  They sure knew how to make my last flight (Shanghai to Chicago) very unenjoyable; any request seemed like an inconvenience of Biblical proportions.

Conversely, Swiss Air always seems to have employees that like their jobs.
 
2013-09-30 02:45:28 PM  
Anyone ever fly Roots Air during the 30 seconds they were in business?

I flew twice...they gave you a choice between red or white wine with your chicken, fish or steak meal (and it was real food, not something I had to decipher).  They also gave you a warm, wet towel to wash your hands before AND after your meal...and a warm chocolate chip cookie for dessert.

Free in-flight entertainment...and the attendents were dressed so spiffily.

*sigh* Good times.
 
2013-09-30 02:45:34 PM  
I got a kick out of "renting Apple iPads preloaded with movies".  Not because it's a bad idea, but because the airlines keep pretending that if you use your phone or a tablet computer you are going to cause the plane to explode or some nonsense.
 
2013-09-30 02:46:07 PM  

snocone: The world burns approximately 5,000 barrels of jet fuel a day, approx. 1,500,000 pounds.
Jet engines throw out approximately 60% of the fuel, unburned, volatilized.
This waste is deposited in the upper layers of the important part of our atmosphere, daily.

Come fly with me.


Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand your point is.....................
 
2013-09-30 02:46:45 PM  

snocone: The world burns approximately 5,000 barrels of jet fuel a day, approx. 1,500,000 pounds.
Jet engines throw out approximately 60% of the fuel, unburned, volatilized.
This waste is deposited in the upper layers of the important part of our atmosphere, daily.

Come fly with me.


Crap, decimal points, math...
5,000,000 barrels, 1,500,000,000 pounds.
 
2013-09-30 02:46:59 PM  
i121.photobucket.com

/New king of the skys
 
2013-09-30 02:47:43 PM  

WTFDYW: snocone: The world burns approximately 5,000 barrels of jet fuel a day, approx. 1,500,000 pounds.
Jet engines throw out approximately 60% of the fuel, unburned, volatilized.
This waste is deposited in the upper layers of the important part of our atmosphere, daily.

Come fly with me.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand your point is.....................


Enjoy it while you can.
 
2013-09-30 02:49:37 PM  
Still not tricking me into giving them a single penny of my money ever again.

/and yes, I realize they don't care about me or my money.
 
2013-09-30 02:50:08 PM  
Try to avoid the sudden loss of altitude fee. It's a killer.
 
2013-09-30 02:50:33 PM  
Theres a couple of facts here that everyone glosses over.  The airline industry is pretty interesting when you think about it and I've found it fun to read up on...

- Ticket prices are increasing slower than inflation.  Everyone complains about how much tickets cost but when it comes down to it, they're the cheapest they've ever been.  Its so cheap that often you can fly across the country for cheaper than you could do it in a car, bus, or train... and its much faster and safer.

- Not only is it the cheapest its ever been, but its also the safest and most convenient.  Crashes don't happen very often anymore and there are more flights than ever.

- Airlines are barely profitable.  I read a little while ago that in the last 30 years, the airline industry has shown a net loss.  Its not like these companies are charging all these fees and consistently making money hand over fist.  This is an industry with a tiny margin.  They're getting money from you one way or another, but they're barely getting enough of it to survive.

- With websites like travelocity and expedia, airlines are screwed as far as being able to charge what they like for tickets.  Its become a commodity to consumers and if an airline charges a dollar more than the other, the consumer goes for the cheaper option.  They really can't even control their profits.

- They also can't control their costs, with oil being the highest cost they have.  Just as much as it hits you in the wallet at the gas pump, it hits airlines too.

- I think these fees are great.  The airline is going to get its money one way or another.  I think its great that I don't have to pay for things I don't use.  Why put meals and bag costs on everyone instead of just charging those who use these services?

- Last but not least, consumers are getting exactly what they want.  Everyone complains about the costs of tickets but for the most part always buys the cheapest option.  When you show consistently that cost is more important than anything else, thats what the airlines will cater to.  They make it as cheap as they can by cutting frills and services.  Thats what people pay for.

- Speaking of which, consumers have done a great job of destroying the experience too.  Just a part of what society has become I guess.  I remember back when people treated flying as something special.  You dressed nicely for it.  You were polite to those around you.  You didn't worry about kids kicking the back of your seat for hours.  You didn't worry about people spilling over into your tiny amount of personal space.  People actually formed lines to get on the plane instead of a mad cattle rush.  Airlines didn't cheapen the experience, society did.  Don't complain about the airlines, complain about your fellow passengers.  They're the ones that are doing their best to make it a horrible experience.

- The TSA.  Enough said.
 
2013-09-30 02:51:05 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]


Ahhh, the train. The cost of flying at the speed of a bus.
 
2013-09-30 02:51:10 PM  

GanjSmokr: Still not tricking me into giving them a single penny of my money ever again.

/and yes, I realize they don't care about me or my money.


You were half right.
 
2013-09-30 02:51:18 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]


you can opt to pay the same price as an airline ticket and arrive ten hours later.
 
2013-09-30 02:52:19 PM  

snocone: WTFDYW: snocone: The world burns approximately 5,000 barrels of jet fuel a day, approx. 1,500,000 pounds.
Jet engines throw out approximately 60% of the fuel, unburned, volatilized.
This waste is deposited in the upper layers of the important part of our atmosphere, daily.

Come fly with me.

Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand your point is.....................

Enjoy it while you can.


So you swim the oceans when you have to get overseas? Do you teleport? Do you ride bicycle on cross country flights? You can't follow thread topic?

/i'm sure the answer to all the above is no
 
2013-09-30 02:52:48 PM  
FTA: Once on the ground, they can skip baggage claim, having their luggage delivered directly to their home or office.

Who the hell would opt for this service? They lose my luggage enough as it is. Maybe have my luggage waiting for me and taken to my vehicle.
 
2013-09-30 02:53:07 PM  
Flew WestJet for the first time last week.

Everything except one bag, soft drinks, coffee, and a tiny bag of cheese snacks is for a fee.  Every single seat has a surcharge, some more than others.

They also offer free TV, when the "satellite is working".  It wasn't, both ways.  The screen is about a 7 inch screen and cannot be tilted to where a taller person can see it.

There is a channel where you can watch your flight crawl across the continent.  It appears to have been designed in the 1980s.  Most likely outsourced.

If you are over 5 foot 8, it is truly a tormenting experience, as the distance between the back of the seat in front, and teh front of the back of your seat is (much) less than the distance between the back of your back and your knee.  There are no power outlets, so when your smart phone, your only source of diversion, runs out, you cannot recharge.

WestJet's inflight magazine, "Up!" is well, not a very good magazine.  Obviously, good magazines cost.

Of course the seats are way too close together to even think of using a normal laptop.

And of course, the screaming children.

Yes, travel by air is a horrible experience.  All you can think of, as with any form of torture, is let it be over, let it be over.
 
2013-09-30 02:53:15 PM  

toraque: RedPhoenix122: "The sides are not included in the price of a steak," he says. "Airline ticket prices should reflect the costs incurred by the individual passenger."

Where are you buying your steak?

Well, to be fair, people who work for airlines have demonstrated that they do not fully comprehend food.


When you buy an airline steak, you get the top and bottom. The sides are extra,
 
2013-09-30 02:53:34 PM  

ikanreed: Dafatone: Flying remains cheaper now than it's just about ever been.

But please, keep complaining that too many other people are flying as well or that you wish you could get a 50 cent bag of peanuts.

I will complain about the fact that the seats are too close together for a person my height(exactly average for an adult male), which causes substantial pain for the hours I'm on the plane.  I didn't mind the 10% higher prices.


I'm 6'2" and I've yet to find an airline seat outside of first class that I can sit in comfortably.  My knees touch against the seat in front and I have to hold my arms tightly against my side for the entire trip.  It sucks.
 
2013-09-30 02:53:59 PM  

JuggleGeek: I got a kick out of "renting Apple iPads preloaded with movies".  Not because it's a bad idea, but because the airlines keep pretending that if you use your phone or a tablet computer you are going to cause the plane to explode or some nonsense.


The airlines don't have any choice.  Its a Federal Aviation Regulation... a federal law... that they have to comply with.  They are legally forced to make you turn that thing off and put it away or they face fines.  They individual flight attendants face discipline if they don't make you do it.

It has nothing to do with what the airlines thing is necessary or how reasonable it is.  Its solely that its a law they have to follow, whether they like it or not.  They don't have a choice.

Want to be able to use your ipad?  Get the law changed.  Its the government causing this problem, not the airlines.
 
2013-09-30 02:55:33 PM  

Trocadero: They charge extra for Emergency Exit rows now.


Not yet on Air Canada or WestJet, the two airlines that I fly most.  Hope their execs aren't reading fark today.

IndyMBA: I think the stewardesses on United were delivered by Boeing with the planes and have been programed to be as surly as possible.


United is the Air Canada "Star Alliance" partner so I've flown them a lot to and from LA.  Totally agree with you on that.  Especially compared to Air Canada (gets a lot of kvetching from Canadian travelers but I've never found them to be too bad) and ESPECIALLY compared to the other Star Alliance carriers I've flown (Air China, Swissair, Lufthansa) the United staff seem to be cartoonishly / sit-comishly bad at their jobs.  Hope their execs ARE reading Fark today.
 
2013-09-30 02:55:56 PM  
Part of the problem is with the internet, and all of the ticketing sites, airlines now have to concentrate on offering the lowest published price possible. Even if Delta is superior in every respect to United, someone who flies once or twice a year where loyalty stuff doesn't matter is just going to go with whomever comes up the cheapest in the ballpark time range they want to leave at on kayak or whatever.

20 years ago airlines could afford to differentiate themselves with their services, because when you went to book a flight you either went through a travel agent, or picked up the phone to the airline you thought of first, or had enjoyed flying in the past, to see if they had something in your scheduled time range. Assuming they did, you wouldn't bother calling 5 other carriers to see who could save you $8.

For those of you who say Jet Blue and SouthWest are awesome, you clearly have never flown them when something goes wrong. You really get what you pay for then.

Sure, part of me longs for the day of air travel of old, where people cared how they dressed, you got fed, the drink service was good, etc, but really, how important is that? Even going transcontinental you are only sitting on the plane for 6 hours. Is it so difficult to grab a bite to eat (which even from the food court would be better than it was on the plane in the "good old days") or sit in a seat that is a little smaller than you'd like? BTW, I'm 6'2, and fit just fine in a normal coach seat.

As for baggage fees and stuff like that, if you travel enough where $25 a flight is a concern, there are ways to avoid not paying them, such as carrying an airline credit card, being in their frequent flyer program, etc.

I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.
 
2013-09-30 02:58:46 PM  

95629: Theres a couple of facts here that everyone glosses over.  The airline industry is pretty interesting when you think about it and I've found it fun to read up on...



Spoken far more eloquently than me. Welcome to totalfark.
 
2013-09-30 02:59:32 PM  

Bill_Wick's_Friend: Trocadero: They charge extra for Emergency Exit rows now.

Not yet on Air Canada or WestJet, the two airlines that I fly most.  Hope their execs aren't reading fark today.

IndyMBA: I think the stewardesses on United were delivered by Boeing with the planes and have been programed to be as surly as possible.

United is the Air Canada "Star Alliance" partner so I've flown them a lot to and from LA.  Totally agree with you on that.  Especially compared to Air Canada (gets a lot of kvetching from Canadian travelers but I've never found them to be too bad) and ESPECIALLY compared to the other Star Alliance carriers I've flown (Air China, Swissair, Lufthansa) the United staff seem to be cartoonishly / sit-comishly bad at their jobs.  Hope their execs ARE reading Fark today.


See my previous post.  On Westjet, exit row seats are more expensive.  Or they were a few days ago.
 
2013-09-30 03:00:11 PM  
Sounds fine to me.  There's got to be a price point somewhere between $200 and $4,000 for people that are willing to pay for some nice stuff but just can't afford the full business/first experience.
 
2013-09-30 03:01:42 PM  

fireclown: Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]

you can opt to pay the same price as an airline ticket and arrive ten hours later.


And avoid as much TSA debasement and get better accommodations.

I'm in no hurry.
 
2013-09-30 03:02:24 PM  

JuggleGeek: I got a kick out of "renting Apple iPads preloaded with movies".  Not because it's a bad idea, but because the airlines keep pretending that if you use your phone or a tablet computer you are going to cause the plane to explode or some nonsense.


When was the last time you have flown? For a while now you have been able to use electronic devices once the plane hits 10k feet, usually a few minutes after takeoff up until about 10 minutes before landing.

You are SUPPOSED to put it in airplane mode, but nobody is really checking up on you. Sure if you busted out your phone and started trying to make calls you would get hassled by a stewardess, but that is about it.

Hell, most flights I have been on this year offer wifi, at a pretty fair price.
 
2013-09-30 03:04:11 PM  

95629: JuggleGeek: I got a kick out of "renting Apple iPads preloaded with movies".  Not because it's a bad idea, but because the airlines keep pretending that if you use your phone or a tablet computer you are going to cause the plane to explode or some nonsense.

The airlines don't have any choice.  Its a Federal Aviation Regulation... a federal law... that they have to comply with.  They are legally forced to make you turn that thing off and put it away or they face fines.  They individual flight attendants face discipline if they don't make you do it.

It has nothing to do with what the airlines thing is necessary or how reasonable it is.  Its solely that its a law they have to follow, whether they like it or not.  They don't have a choice.

Want to be able to use your ipad?  Get the law changed.  Its the government causing this problem, not the airlines.



Looks like it will be happening soon. (Or not) http://bigstory.ap.org/article/panel-backs-easing-electronic-device-u s e-planes
 
2013-09-30 03:04:56 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: fireclown: Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]

you can opt to pay the same price as an airline ticket and arrive ten hours later.

And avoid as much TSA debasement and get better accommodations.

I'm in no hurry.


Again, someone who clearly never flies. If you aren't an idiot and are capable of emptying your pockets and taking off your belt and tossing them into your carry on while waiting on line, and then removing and putting your shoes back on without it taking you half an hour, you will have no issues with the TSA. I feel bad for THEM having to spend all day watching people freeze up and get flustered when they have to untie their farking shoes.
 
2013-09-30 03:07:14 PM  

Bill_Wick's_Friend: Trocadero: They charge extra for Emergency Exit rows now.

Not yet on Air Canada or WestJet, the two airlines that I fly most.  Hope their execs aren't reading fark today.



I flew Air Canada once (IAH to YYC). It was the best flight I've ever been on. Even better than the 2nd best - mid '80s Southwest. Nice airplanes. Plenty of room. Extremely nice stewards. Just an all around excellent experience.

It made the United flight back from Edmonton to Denver that much more unbearable.

The best I've heard of is Air Singapore. I'd love to fly them one day from the stories I've heard.
 
2013-09-30 03:08:37 PM  
Fark em, I'll just be rude right back.
 
2013-09-30 03:08:52 PM  

MadMattressMack: The best I've heard of is Air Singapore. I'd love to fly them one day from the stories I've heard.


I've heard the same thing.
 
2013-09-30 03:09:12 PM  

kpaxoid: See my previous post.  On Westjet, exit row seats are more expensive


Intersting. Did not know that.  As I read your post I went back over my last several flights in my head.  Air Canada, Air Canada, Alaska, Air Canada, United....

I think the last time I flew WestJet was Passover last year.  Not by any design.  It's just worked out that way with prices and schedules, I guess.
 
2013-09-30 03:09:27 PM  

LineNoise: I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.


You look down upon people who want to be comfortable when they fly?  Do you scowl at them as you lift the tea to your lips, pinky held high?
 
2013-09-30 03:09:58 PM  

kpaxoid: See my previous post.  On Westjet, exit row seats are more expensive.  Or they were a few days ago.


usually the upgrade charge to the economy+ or exit row seats is pretty fair. On United Its usually around 50 bucks for a flight from NYC-Chicago, and a little under $100 for NYC-CA. If you have status with the airline (fly round trip cross country or the equivalent 5 times a year or so), they are free if any are unsold. Have a slightly higher status and they are free at time of booking. They are also cheaply upgraded to using miles. Open an airline credit card, and the signup bonus alone will be enough for you to upgrade to those seats probably 10 times.

The point of it is this: if you are someone who only flies a couple of times a year, none of what they charge for now is going to make you not fly them, you are just going off whatever comes up cheapest on orbitz. If you are someone who flies frequently, there are several ways for you to avoid most of these charges, that come at a benefit to you.
 
2013-09-30 03:11:04 PM  

LineNoise: Agent Smiths Laugh: fireclown: Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]

you can opt to pay the same price as an airline ticket and arrive ten hours later.

And avoid as much TSA debasement and get better accommodations.

I'm in no hurry.

Again, someone who clearly never flies. If you aren't an idiot and are capable of emptying your pockets and taking off your belt and tossing them into your carry on while waiting on line, and then removing and putting your shoes back on without it taking you half an hour, you will have no issues with the TSA. I feel bad for THEM having to spend all day watching people freeze up and get flustered when they have to untie their farking shoes.


You're partially correct. I stopped flying about a year before 9/11, before the TSA existed.

Having seen multitudinous reports of their abuses and excesses, it's a decision I've not yet regretted.

And seriously, given the sheer volume of reports of theft and assorted abuses committed by the TSA, you're going to go with blaming the public?

/besides, trains are cool
 
2013-09-30 03:11:27 PM  

vrax: LineNoise: I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.

You look down upon people who want to be comfortable when they fly?  Do you scowl at them as you lift the tea to your lips, pinky held high?


What about airline travel makes people think they can look like an absolute slob when they do it. Is that 3 hour flight to St Louis really such a burden on you that you need to dress like you were going to bed or the gym to get on it?

You looking like a slob just cheapens the experience for everyone else on the plane. Then everyone acts all shocked when the airlines follow suit.
 
2013-09-30 03:12:35 PM  

ikanreed: dead: FSM, I so hate the airlines.

http://www.beapilot.com

FSM is such a unwieldy thing to say.  I'd suggest "Holy meatballs".


Yes, if you're a hipster, please go right ahead.
 
2013-09-30 03:12:49 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: fireclown: Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]

you can opt to pay the same price as an airline ticket and arrive ten hours later.

And avoid as much TSA debasement and get better accommodations.

I'm in no hurry.


Over short distances, trains aren't too bad.  I recently took one from Pittsburgh to DC.  But there was only one per day and it still took about seven hours (Amtrack, the Capital Limited).  If I would have been going to the west coast, the trip would have been measured in DAYS, and I would likely have had to score a motel if I were changing trains.

And while I'm on the subject of Amtrack, would it kill them to provide wifi?  Along the PA corridor there is no phone signal at all.  And if they could arrange for roll-off luggage on the Capital Limited (essentially a rack that allows you to take your bike off the train at any stop instead of having to pack it in a bike box and wait for the few stops that let you get your checked luggage), it would be really helpful for people riding the Great Allegheney Passage.
 
2013-09-30 03:14:00 PM  

LineNoise: vrax: LineNoise: I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.

You look down upon people who want to be comfortable when they fly?  Do you scowl at them as you lift the tea to your lips, pinky held high?

What about airline travel makes people think they can look like an absolute slob when they do it. Is that 3 hour flight to St Louis really such a burden on you that you need to dress like you were going to bed or the gym to get on it?

You looking like a slob just cheapens the experience for everyone else on the plane. Then everyone acts all shocked when the airlines follow suit.


Don't you have a gym to get to?

www.mbird.com
 
2013-09-30 03:14:46 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: You're partially correct. I stopped flying about a year before 9/11, before the TSA existed.

Having seen multitudinous reports of their abuses and excesses, it's a decision I've not yet regretted.

And seriously, given the sheer volume of reports of theft and assorted abuses committed by the TSA, you're going to go with blaming the public?


I fly on average at least once a week. I have never had a problem with the TSA. Sure, occasionally i'll open my suitcase to find a note saying they took a peak in it, about 1 in 5 times someone might need to pat down a shoulder or leg or something that showed up goofy on a scanner, and maybe 1 in 20 I might get my shoes swabbed or something, but that is it. I don't find any of it to be some gross violation of my privacy that forces me to go into the fetal position in my hotel shower when i get to where I'm headed.

Its just some folks doing their job. Is most of it theater, of course. But what are they supposed to do? Go back to the good old days of 70s style skyjackings every other week?
 
2013-09-30 03:16:37 PM  

LineNoise: vrax: LineNoise: I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.

You look down upon people who want to be comfortable when they fly?  Do you scowl at them as you lift the tea to your lips, pinky held high?

What about airline travel makes people think they can look like an absolute slob when they do it. Is that 3 hour flight to St Louis really such a burden on you that you need to dress like you were going to bed or the gym to get on it?

You looking like a slob just cheapens the experience for everyone else on the plane. Then everyone acts all shocked when the airlines follow suit.


Yes, sweats, sandals and t-shirts = slob.  That you are from NY couldn't be more obvious.  I find it hilarious that you complain about people and their shoes and then biatch about people wearing flip-flops on a flight.  There is no winning with you.  You should probably wear blinders when you are out in public.  I just spent the entire weekend in Long Beach.  That place would make you cry in a corner.
 
2013-09-30 03:17:15 PM  

fireclown: Agent Smiths Laugh: fireclown: Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]

you can opt to pay the same price as an airline ticket and arrive ten hours later.

And avoid as much TSA debasement and get better accommodations.

I'm in no hurry.

Over short distances, trains aren't too bad.  I recently took one from Pittsburgh to DC.  But there was only one per day and it still took about seven hours (Amtrack, the Capital Limited).  If I would have been going to the west coast, the trip would have been measured in DAYS, and I would likely have had to score a motel if I were changing trains.

And while I'm on the subject of Amtrack, would it kill them to provide wifi?  Along the PA corridor there is no phone signal at all.  And if they could arrange for roll-off luggage on the Capital Limited (essentially a rack that allows you to take your bike off the train at any stop instead of having to pack it in a bike box and wait for the few stops that let you get your checked luggage), it would be really helpful for people riding the Great Allegheney Passage.


http://www.amtrak.com/journey-with-wi-fi-train-station

http://www.amtrak.com/servlet/ContentServer?SnippetName=IBLegacy&pag en ame=am/AM_Snippet_C/SnippetWrapper&ibsref=wifiAvailable

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/national/2013/05/amtraks-wifi-upgrade -a llows-more-people-complain-about-amtrak-wifi/65340/

It's a work in progress.
 
2013-09-30 03:19:31 PM  

LineNoise: Agent Smiths Laugh: You're partially correct. I stopped flying about a year before 9/11, before the TSA existed.

Having seen multitudinous reports of their abuses and excesses, it's a decision I've not yet regretted.

And seriously, given the sheer volume of reports of theft and assorted abuses committed by the TSA, you're going to go with blaming the public?

I fly on average at least once a week. I have never had a problem with the TSA. Sure, occasionally i'll open my suitcase to find a note saying they took a peak in it, about 1 in 5 times someone might need to pat down a shoulder or leg or something that showed up goofy on a scanner, and maybe 1 in 20 I might get my shoes swabbed or something, but that is it. I don't find any of it to be some gross violation of my privacy that forces me to go into the fetal position in my hotel shower when i get to where I'm headed.

Its just some folks doing their job. Is most of it theater, of course. But what are they supposed to do? Go back to the good old days of 70s style skyjackings every other week?


The funny thing is that you said that.

The scary thing is that you might actually believe it.

They told you to fear and you did.
 
2013-09-30 03:19:46 PM  

fireclown: Over short distances, trains aren't too bad.  I recently took one from Pittsburgh to DC.  But there was only one per day and it still took about seven hours (Amtrack, the Capital Limited).  If I would have been going to the west coast, the trip would have been measured in DAYS, and I would likely have had to score a motel if I were changing trains.

And while I'm on the subject of Amtrack, would it kill them to provide wifi?  Along the PA corridor there is no phone signal at all.  And if they could arrange for roll-off luggage on the Capital Limited (essentially a rack that allows you to take your bike off the train at any stop instead of having to pack it in a bike box and wait for the few stops that let you get your checked luggage), it would be really helpful for people riding the Great Allegheney Passage.


I use Amtrak a fair amount between NYC and BOS\DC. I also occasionaly take them up to Rochester.

NYC - DC beats flying time wise assuming no problems. NYC-BOS is about a wash. Ultimately it depends on what time you go and where you are leaving from and going to. They do offer wifi, but if its a relatively full train, it is going to be worse than tethering to your phone.

NYC-ROC is about 6 hours, the longest I'd want to sit on a train. The flight is about 45 minutes, so even with security and time to get to the airport and what not, flying crushes it. Cost wise they usually run about the same if you book 2 weeks out. I'll take the train to mix it up now and then if I have a lot of work to do, but I could never see willingly taking a train a longer distance than that.
 
2013-09-30 03:19:47 PM  

LineNoise: I fly on average at least once a week. I have never had a problem with the TSA. Sure, occasionally i'll open my suitcase to find a note saying they took a peak in it,



Why do you need a farking suitcase? Also, I try to be as comfortable as possible when flying. T-Shirt and shorts if possible. It's silly not to do it.
 
2013-09-30 03:24:09 PM  

Madbassist1: LineNoise: I fly on average at least once a week. I have never had a problem with the TSA. Sure, occasionally i'll open my suitcase to find a note saying they took a peak in it,


Why do you need a farking suitcase? Also, I try to be as comfortable as possible when flying. T-Shirt and shorts if possible. It's silly not to do it.


If I'm on the road for a week, I'll usually check a bag. Sure, I could cram it all into my carry on if I want, but now I need to spend extra time packing it on both ends, have to limit what i bring, and honestly, only save maybe 10 minutes at checkin and baggage claim. Not really worth it. I'd rather just toss my laptop bag up in the overhead rather than jamming it under my seat and making me uncomfortable.

As for the clothes argument, yes, wearing sweat pants, flip flops, sandals, etc is slobish if you aren't going to the friggin beach or pool. Shorts on planes I have never been a fan of. You are in close quarters with a bunch of people, does the guy next to you really want your bare leg brushing against him? Your bare feet on the floor next to him, etc?

At least I take solace in the fact that if people who dress like that are ever on a plan that has to evacuate, they will probably hurt themselves somehow.
 
2013-09-30 03:24:57 PM  

DanZero: "We have massive amounts of data," says Delta CEO Richard Anderson. "We know who you are. We know what your history has been on the airline. We can customize our offerings make millions off all that information we send to the NSA,"


My skin tingled, and not in a good way.
 
2013-09-30 03:25:46 PM  

vrax: I find it hilarious that you complain about people and their shoes and then biatch about people wearing flip-flops on a flight.


People who wear flip-flops or sandals on their flight are already going to be punished when they realize just how cold their feet are getting on the plane. Those same people will wear shoes and socks on their next flight.
 
2013-09-30 03:26:06 PM  

fireclown: Agent Smiths Laugh: fireclown: Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]

you can opt to pay the same price as an airline ticket and arrive ten hours later.

And avoid as much TSA debasement and get better accommodations.

I'm in no hurry.

Over short distances, trains aren't too bad.  I recently took one from Pittsburgh to DC.  But there was only one per day and it still took about seven hours (Amtrack, the Capital Limited).  If I would have been going to the west coast, the trip would have been measured in DAYS, and I would likely have had to score a motel if I were changing trains.

And while I'm on the subject of Amtrack, would it kill them to provide wifi?  Along the PA corridor there is no phone signal at all.  And if they could arrange for roll-off luggage on the Capital Limited (essentially a rack that allows you to take your bike off the train at any stop instead of having to pack it in a bike box and wait for the few stops that let you get your checked luggage), it would be really helpful for people riding the Great Allegheney Passage.


The Northeast Corridor and Empire Corridor have Wifi.  They're working on it.
 
2013-09-30 03:27:20 PM  

LineNoise: Madbassist1: LineNoise: I fly on average at least once a week. I have never had a problem with the TSA. Sure, occasionally i'll open my suitcase to find a note saying they took a peak in it,


Why do you need a farking suitcase? Also, I try to be as comfortable as possible when flying. T-Shirt and shorts if possible. It's silly not to do it.

If I'm on the road for a week, I'll usually check a bag. Sure, I could cram it all into my carry on if I want, but now I need to spend extra time packing it on both ends, have to limit what i bring, and honestly, only save maybe 10 minutes at checkin and baggage claim. Not really worth it. I'd rather just toss my laptop bag up in the overhead rather than jamming it under my seat and making me uncomfortable.

As for the clothes argument, yes, wearing sweat pants, flip flops, sandals, etc is slobish if you aren't going to the friggin beach or pool. Shorts on planes I have never been a fan of. You are in close quarters with a bunch of people, does the guy next to you really want your bare leg brushing against him? Your bare feet on the floor next to him, etc?

At least I take solace in the fact that if people who dress like that are ever on a plan that has to evacuate, they will probably hurt themselves somehow.


Just how much travel do you have to do for your HOA?
 
2013-09-30 03:29:51 PM  

LineNoise: Madbassist1: LineNoise: I fly on average at least once a week. I have never had a problem with the TSA. Sure, occasionally i'll open my suitcase to find a note saying they took a peak in it,


Why do you need a farking suitcase? Also, I try to be as comfortable as possible when flying. T-Shirt and shorts if possible. It's silly not to do it.

If I'm on the road for a week, I'll usually check a bag. Sure, I could cram it all into my carry on if I want, but now I need to spend extra time packing it on both ends, have to limit what i bring, and honestly, only save maybe 10 minutes at checkin and baggage claim. Not really worth it. I'd rather just toss my laptop bag up in the overhead rather than jamming it under my seat and making me uncomfortable.

As for the clothes argument, yes, wearing sweat pants, flip flops, sandals, etc is slobish if you aren't going to the friggin beach or pool. Shorts on planes I have never been a fan of. You are in close quarters with a bunch of people, does the guy next to you really want your bare leg brushing against him? Your bare feet on the floor next to him, etc?

At least I take solace in the fact that if people who dress like that are ever on a plan that has to evacuate, they will probably hurt themselves somehow.


One, I'm not arguing with you. I understand your position, but honestly, why the fark do I care if you don't like what I'm wearing? I don't dress to impress you, slick, and it's silly if you dress to impress me.

As far as the suitcase thing, I'm going under the assumption that if you fly once a week, you can slink home and change out your clothes. Of course you may be going from City A to City B to City C; rather than from A to B to A to C which is the way I operate. If that's the case, of course you need a suitcase.
 
2013-09-30 03:29:52 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: GanjSmokr: Still not tricking me into giving them a single penny of my money ever again.

/and yes, I realize they don't care about me or my money.

You were half right.


No, with as little as I flew before I stopped, I'm pretty confident they don't care about either.

/at least they sure didn't seem to care with the way I was treated the last time I flew.
 
2013-09-30 03:30:02 PM  
6'2" and broad-shouldered. If it wasn't mandatory for my job, I'd never fly. I'm hoping my next transatlantic flight is my last.
 
2013-09-30 03:30:04 PM  

lockers: vrax: I find it hilarious that you complain about people and their shoes and then biatch about people wearing flip-flops on a flight.

People who wear flip-flops or sandals on their flight are already going to be punished when they realize just how cold their feet are getting on the plane. Those same people will wear shoes and socks on their next flight.


Are these some special arctic flights you've been on?
 
2013-09-30 03:34:12 PM  

kpaxoid: There are no power outlets, so when your smart phone, your only source of diversion, runs out, you cannot recharge.


Yeah, it's the airline's fault that you can't read a farking book or do a crossword puzzle...

/pick up a $5 puzzle book or a $10 paperback and you're set for most flights, both ways.
 
2013-09-30 03:36:15 PM  
"It's all about personalizing the travel experience."

People can buy a plane ticket from any airline, ok?  They fly Delta for the atmosphere and the attitude.  That what the fees are about.  They're about fun.
 
2013-09-30 03:39:47 PM  

kidgenius: factoryconnection: nmrsnr: I believe that's called "buying an extra ticket" and it's not exactly a new service.

I saw that earlier, but I believe instead it is either a bet by the passenger or a conditional fee that if there is an unfilled seat they will move them to be next to the fee-payer.

RedPhoenix122: Where are you buying your steak?

Steakhouses traditionally charge for sides a la carte, even if Outback gives you one with your slab o'beef.

I'm with Subby, though.  United doesn't even give out peanuts or pretzels anymore, and that's just a kick in the nuts given how horrible it is to connect through Dulles (cramped yet sprawling) or O'Hare (O'Delays).  USAir doesn't show movies, nor provide any entertainment system for cross-country flights like CLT-SAN that I flew last week.

Delta gives you drinks, a choice of peanuts/pretzels/Biscoffs, and always has a movie if not on-demand for cross-country flights.  Anything 737-sized or bigger gets entertainment included.

On Southwest they hold a basket of various snacks and say "take as many as you'd like"


That's because they are brilliant. Those snacks probably cost them pennies per packet. If you take five, you probably don't even cost them a dollar and you leave thinking you got amazing service because you got five packs of shiatty snacks worth 50 cents. It's sort of crazy when you step back and think about it.
 
2013-09-30 03:40:14 PM  

Madbassist1: One, I'm not arguing with you. I understand your position, but honestly, why the fark do I care if you don't like what I'm wearing? I don't dress to impress you, slick, and it's silly if you dress to impress me.

As far as the suitcase thing, I'm going under the assumption that if you fly once a week, you can slink home and change out your clothes. Of course you may be going from City A to City B to City C; rather than from A to B to A to C which is the way I operate. If that's the case, of course you need a suitcase.


A combination of both. Frequently I'll be going from City A to City B on monday, with the expectation of staying in city B until Wednesday, and then returning to city A, but the possibility of having to stay there until Friday may be there, or on Wednesday, i might find out instead of returning to city A, I am needed in city C for the remainder of the week.

Can I get away with a carry on if I go all George Clooney? Of course, and I have many times. However it doesn't cost me anything to check a bag, only adds a few minutes on each end, and I more than make up for it by not having to pack as carefully or suddenly finding out i shorted myself a pair of underwear or socks and having to run out and buy them at a 7-11 or something the morning before a meeting.

And actually for folks who fly a bunch, and only need to bring a couple of days of clothes with them,  http://www.skyroll.com/  is the greatest invention ever.
 
2013-09-30 03:40:19 PM  

vrax: lockers: vrax: I find it hilarious that you complain about people and their shoes and then biatch about people wearing flip-flops on a flight.

People who wear flip-flops or sandals on their flight are already going to be punished when they realize just how cold their feet are getting on the plane. Those same people will wear shoes and socks on their next flight.

Are these some special arctic flights you've been on?


Any long flight will get chilly by time you hit cruising speed. It's not like the air circulates top to bottom, but hey, just try it and see that if it doesn't make the experience less enjoyable.
 
2013-09-30 03:41:56 PM  

skrame: kpaxoid: There are no power outlets, so when your smart phone, your only source of diversion, runs out, you cannot recharge.

Yeah, it's the airline's fault that you can't read a farking book or do a crossword puzzle...

/pick up a $5 puzzle book or a $10 paperback and you're set for most flights, both ways.


To be fair, on a multimillion dollar passenger plane it is a little absurd not to have USB power ports for devices these days.  It's not exactly expensive new tech.
 
2013-09-30 03:42:31 PM  

Jument: That's because they are brilliant. Those snacks probably cost them pennies per packet. If you take five, you probably don't even cost them a dollar and you leave thinking you got amazing service because you got five packs of shiatty snacks worth 50 cents. It's sort of crazy when you step back and think about it.


Also southwest makes their bread and butter on coach flights, same as Jet Blue. Delta, UA, AA, etc's bread and butter is business travelers.
 
2013-09-30 03:45:59 PM  

lockers: vrax: lockers: vrax: I find it hilarious that you complain about people and their shoes and then biatch about people wearing flip-flops on a flight.

People who wear flip-flops or sandals on their flight are already going to be punished when they realize just how cold their feet are getting on the plane. Those same people will wear shoes and socks on their next flight.

Are these some special arctic flights you've been on?

Any long flight will get chilly by time you hit cruising speed. It's not like the air circulates top to bottom, but hey, just try it and see that if it doesn't make the experience less enjoyable.


I have, all the way from SF to Stockholm, by way of Texas and Chicago.  Some 20ish farkin' hours of flight.  Not cold.
 
2013-09-30 03:46:00 PM  

RedPhoenix122: "The sides are not included in the price of a steak," he says. "Airline ticket prices should reflect the costs incurred by the individual passenger."

Where are you buying your steak?


Probably somewhere better than Outback or Chilli's it sounds like.
 
2013-09-30 03:46:00 PM  
I looked for an Onion tag, was surprised it wasn't there.
 
2013-09-30 03:46:14 PM  

vrax: To be fair, on a multimillion dollar passenger plane it is a little absurd not to have USB power ports for devices these days.  It's not exactly expensive new tech.


Your right, it isn't  that expensive. Until you need to add it to a few hundred airplanes in your fleet. And then fix it when it breaks from 30 different people a day plugging and unplugging stuff, who don't care about it. Ever wonder why there are two headphone jacks on your seat on most planes? Its so if one breaks, they don't have an angry flyer.

Now lets assume 100 people, (half a decent sized plane) plug in a device to charge. That added power has to come from somewhere, which means more fuel to burn. the cabling, ports, power generation, etc is all more weight that the plane has to cart around, and again, fuel it has to burn, even if that plane is only half full, or if only 3 people really need to charge stuff.
 
2013-09-30 03:48:38 PM  
Yeah but how much do I have to pay for lip service?
 
2013-09-30 03:53:43 PM  

DubtodaIll: Yeah but how much do I have to pay for lip service?


Lips are free, but the tongue costs extra
 
2013-09-30 03:54:16 PM  
I dress 'business casual' for a flight because that's what I choose to wear when in public but I sure as hell don't judge others for wearing sweatpants on an airplane.  Jesus Christ you people have issues.
 
2013-09-30 03:55:08 PM  
I repeat: The airline industry is the only industry that is openly hostile to their customers.
 
2013-09-30 03:55:59 PM  

Egoy3k: I dress 'business casual' for a flight because that's what I choose to wear when in public but I sure as hell don't judge others for wearing sweatpants on an airplane.  Jesus Christ you people have issues.


I'm not judging someone wearing sweatpants in public. I'm just reading the message they send out:

"I have given up on life"
 
2013-09-30 03:59:24 PM  
worth repeating...

"We have massive amounts of data," says Delta CEO Richard Anderson. "We know who you are.
 
2013-09-30 03:59:27 PM  

gerrychampoux: I repeat: The airline industry is the only industry that is openly hostile to their customers.


They are also the only industry where people have some misconceived notion as to what they are supposed to get in return for their fare.

Do people gripe about greyhound not offering free drink service, or a super comfy seat?

People want to pay as little as possible for their plane ticket. They have spoken. Yet they then get pissed off when the airline can't afford to give them every little thing they want for free.

fark, drinking on a plane is still cheaper than drinking in most airport bars. Most planes have more TV channels than most hotel rooms have. Hell, the internet on my fight last week was faster than it was in the damned Marriot i stayed at. What more do you want?
 
2013-09-30 04:01:00 PM  

LineNoise: Egoy3k: I dress 'business casual' for a flight because that's what I choose to wear when in public but I sure as hell don't judge others for wearing sweatpants on an airplane.  Jesus Christ you people have issues.

I'm not judging someone wearing sweatpants in public. I'm just reading the message they send out:

"I have given up on life"


If you wear flops or high heels on an airplane, you're not very bright.
Comfortable is one thing, tripping all over yourself while navigating your way through the fiery rubble is another.
Especially if I'm behind you.

Now sit back and relax. We'll push away from the gate momentarily.
 
2013-09-30 04:01:38 PM  

Egoy3k: I dress 'business casual' for a flight because that's what I choose to wear when in public but I sure as hell don't judge others for wearing sweatpants on an airplane.  Jesus Christ you people have issues,  LineNoise.


FTFY.
 
2013-09-30 04:02:21 PM  

LineNoise: Egoy3k: I dress 'business casual' for a flight because that's what I choose to wear when in public but I sure as hell don't judge others for wearing sweatpants on an airplane.  Jesus Christ you people have issues.

I'm not judging someone wearing sweatpants in public. I'm just reading the message they send out:

"I have given up on life"


The fact that you haven't given up on life while at an american airport says a lot of bad things about your intelligence.
 
2013-09-30 04:04:06 PM  

LineNoise: Egoy3k: I dress 'business casual' for a flight because that's what I choose to wear when in public but I sure as hell don't judge others for wearing sweatpants on an airplane.  Jesus Christ you people have issues.

I'm not judging someone wearing sweatpants in public. I'm just reading the message they send out:

"I have given up on life"


I have to give props where it's due - you are the most consistent bigot on Fark.
 
2013-09-30 04:04:18 PM  

LineNoise: vrax: To be fair, on a multimillion dollar passenger plane it is a little absurd not to have USB power ports for devices these days.  It's not exactly expensive new tech.

Your right, it isn't  that expensive. Until you need to add it to a few hundred airplanes in your fleet. And then fix it when it breaks from 30 different people a day plugging and unplugging stuff, who don't care about it. Ever wonder why there are two headphone jacks on your seat on most planes? Its so if one breaks, they don't have an angry flyer.

Now lets assume 100 people, (half a decent sized plane) plug in a device to charge. That added power has to come from somewhere, which means more fuel to burn. the cabling, ports, power generation, etc is all more weight that the plane has to cart around, and again, fuel it has to burn, even if that plane is only half full, or if only 3 people really need to charge stuff.


Yes, that's great, except for the fact that they've installed an LCD screen into the back of every seat on the damned plane.  The weight of a USB port?  WTF, it's not a NASA mission!  One person's set of golf clubs weighs more than 300 ports.  The extra 2.5W requirement and small amount of extended cabling and bulk port cost isn't going to add up to much.  These guys aren't running free, public transit.  They can and should make minor investments to upgrade the passenger-side experience.
 
2013-09-30 04:04:21 PM  

gerrychampoux: I repeat: The airline industry is the only industry that is openly hostile to their customers.


I fly regularly but not all the time.  I've found that if you're civil to airline staff they are always civil back.  Thus I've never experienced such hostility.  People that show up late and b*tch that the plane has left, people that don't understand the carry-on policy, people that REFUSE TO TURN OFF THEIR F*CKING PHONES bring the torment upon themselves.

Just be a decent person and keep with the rules and you'll be fine.  Occasionally odd things will happen, but I refuse to take it out on someone with no control over the situation.  The TSA screeners, however... sometimes there is no pleasing those grabby doofuses.
"Sir, why did you take off your ring?"
"Because it is metal."
"We'd never expect people to take their wedding rings off."  (False)
"Yeah, you're right, that's ridiculous. I'm glad you mentioned it." (Also false)
 
2013-09-30 04:06:31 PM  
www.toddalcott.com Lounges, cabin suites, sit down meals and even an after-dinner cigar... Yes, rigid airships filled with safe, natural helium are the best way to fly.
 
2013-09-30 04:07:50 PM  

ikanreed: The fact that you haven't given up on life while at an american airport says a lot of bad things about your intelligence.


Really? Why?

Food at most major airports is actually pretty good. There are good bars with interesting people. The little Irish pub in midway on a friday night during irregular operations is probably one of the most fun bars you will ever go to. Hell, where else can you plop down on a bar stool and order a beer at 9am and not be judged? You meet interesting people. The whole operation of the place and what it takes to do so is fascinating if you step back for a moment and take it all in.

And again, if you fly enough and get lounge access, priority screening, comped upgrades, its an entirely other experience all together. Like I said, I'm on a plane pretty much every week, and don't mind it at all. I actually miss it a little bit if I go a few weeks without flying.
 
2013-09-30 04:11:34 PM  
The change I wish all the airlines would make is actually enforcing the size limits on carryon luggage.

You know, that little box near the ticket counter that says, "If your bag doesn't fit in here, you must check it"?


I often board a plane early, because I have a severe back problem (and a cane, for the people who look at me and think I'm perfectly healthy), so I don't have a problem (and my carryon fits under my seat), but watching people try to stuff everything they own into an overhead bin just pisses me off.

And then, when deplaning, as they try wrestle it out, I've seen more than a few dropped on people (including me), and there's never an apology for hitting someone in the shoulder with their 30 lb bag.


I've often considered, on a Saturday when I have ~absolutely~ nothing else to do, going down to LAX dressed like I work for one of the airlines, and enforcing bag size limits.
 
2013-09-30 04:12:56 PM  

apotheosis27: worth repeating...

"We have massive amounts of data," says Delta CEO Richard Anderson. "We know who you are.


My first stab at a headline was
'We have massive amounts of data,' says Delta CEO Richard Anderson.  'We know who you are.  We just don't know where your luggage is'
 
2013-09-30 04:13:42 PM  

Carousel Beast: LineNoise: Egoy3k: I dress 'business casual' for a flight because that's what I choose to wear when in public but I sure as hell don't judge others for wearing sweatpants on an airplane.  Jesus Christ you people have issues.

I'm not judging someone wearing sweatpants in public. I'm just reading the message they send out:

"I have given up on life"

I have to give props where it's due - you are the most consistent bigot on Fark.


And he's obviously never seen the Patton Oswalt bit on sweatpants.
 
2013-09-30 04:13:56 PM  

LineNoise: Hell, where else can you plop down on a bar stool and order a beer at 9am and not be judged?


LOL! The alcoholic shakes his tiny fist at the flip-flop people.
 
2013-09-30 04:15:01 PM  

vrax: es, that's great, except for the fact that they've installed an LCD screen into the back of every seat on the damned plane.  The weight of a USB port?  WTF, it's not a NASA mission!  One person's set of golf clubs weighs more than 300 ports.  The extra 2.5W requirement and small amount of extended cabling and bulk port cost isn't going to add up to much.  These guys aren't running free, public transit.  They can and should make minor investments to upgrade the passenger-side experience.


And that LCD screen is generating revenue, either by people paying for service, displaying advertisements, and simplifying their safety instructions.

A USB port, however, is consuming revenue, again, even if ever so small, multiply that across an entire fleets operations every day, and it starts to add up.

A couple of years ago, there was a story how united was able to save a couple hundred thousand bucks a year simply by changing their cashew supply in their lounges to a vendor that didn't guarantee a low percentage of broken nuts. United made the mistake of trying to use it as an example of how they were cutting costs without cutting service. People went into an uproar over it. The end result was united realizing that they couldn't win, and if they were going to take flack over it, why even bother giving people farking nuts to begin with.

Now think about it, when was the last time you really noticed if 95% of the cashews in your mixed nuts were broken or not. Even if you did, did it really impact your enjoyment of said nuts?

But somewhere people got in their mind that not only should they be entitled to free nuts, but that the quality control on those nuts should be impeccable, and managed by a six sigma blackbelt, less their fine attention to the details of the shape of a cashew be insulted.
 
2013-09-30 04:17:06 PM  

vrax: LineNoise: Hell, where else can you plop down on a bar stool and order a beer at 9am and not be judged?

LOL! The alcoholic shakes his tiny fist at the flip-flop people.


whynotboth.jpg
 
2013-09-30 04:17:19 PM  

mithras_angel: The change I wish all the airlines would make is actually enforcing the size limits on carryon luggage.

You know, that little box near the ticket counter that says, "If your bag doesn't fit in here, you must check it"?


I often board a plane early, because I have a severe back problem (and a cane, for the people who look at me and think I'm perfectly healthy), so I don't have a problem (and my carryon fits under my seat), but watching people try to stuff everything they own into an overhead bin just pisses me off.

And then, when deplaning, as they try wrestle it out, I've seen more than a few dropped on people (including me), and there's never an apology for hitting someone in the shoulder with their 30 lb bag.


I've often considered, on a Saturday when I have ~absolutely~ nothing else to do, going down to LAX dressed like I work for one of the airlines, and enforcing bag size limits.


You really should see the airline skit on the latest SNL.
 
2013-09-30 04:17:23 PM  

LineNoise: Hell, where else can you plop down on a bar stool and order a beer at 9am and not be judged?


Anywhere else, I'd have to order a Bloody Mary to not be judged.
 
2013-09-30 04:19:48 PM  

vrax: LineNoise: Hell, where else can you plop down on a bar stool and order a beer at 9am and not be judged?

LOL! The alcoholic shakes his tiny fist at the flip-flop people.


How do you know I didn't just get off a nonstop from Hong Kong, and its actually 10pm local time on a friday for me? How do you know that I'm not very anxious when it comes to flying, and that drink helps steady me so I am comfortable on the plane?

See, thats the beauty of airports. You can throw certain social conventions out the window. Everyone is essentially reduced to two classes of people, and you are all peers in your group from the time you enter the security line, until the time your bag comes tumbling down the carousel. Its as close as we have come to eliminating bigotry, racism, elitism, etc so far. Everyone is in it together, equally.

And such a place as close to utopia as that, surely has no room for people wearing sweatpants or flipflops.
 
2013-09-30 04:26:35 PM  

LineNoise: vrax: es, that's great, except for the fact that they've installed an LCD screen into the back of every seat on the damned plane.  The weight of a USB port?  WTF, it's not a NASA mission!  One person's set of golf clubs weighs more than 300 ports.  The extra 2.5W requirement and small amount of extended cabling and bulk port cost isn't going to add up to much.  These guys aren't running free, public transit.  They can and should make minor investments to upgrade the passenger-side experience.

And that LCD screen is generating revenue, either by people paying for service, displaying advertisements, and simplifying their safety instructions.

A USB port, however, is consuming revenue, again, even if ever so small, multiply that across an entire fleets operations every day, and it starts to add up.

A couple of years ago, there was a story how united was able to save a couple hundred thousand bucks a year simply by changing their cashew supply in their lounges to a vendor that didn't guarantee a low percentage of broken nuts. United made the mistake of trying to use it as an example of how they were cutting costs without cutting service. People went into an uproar over it. The end result was united realizing that they couldn't win, and if they were going to take flack over it, why even bother giving people farking nuts to begin with.

Now think about it, when was the last time you really noticed if 95% of the cashews in your mixed nuts were broken or not. Even if you did, did it really impact your enjoyment of said nuts?

But somewhere people got in their mind that not only should they be entitled to free nuts, but that the quality control on those nuts should be impeccable, and managed by a six sigma blackbelt, less their fine attention to the details of the shape of a cashew be insulted.


Well, I would have cancelled it on nut allergy grounds and been done with it.

If they are terrified over USB port maintenance, they can install an extremely low maintenance port type and sell a port-to-USB adapter for $5, greatly recouping their expenditure.
 
2013-09-30 04:29:21 PM  

LineNoise: vrax: LineNoise: Hell, where else can you plop down on a bar stool and order a beer at 9am and not be judged?

LOL! The alcoholic shakes his tiny fist at the flip-flop people.

How do you know I didn't just get off a nonstop from Hong Kong, and its actually 10pm local time on a friday for me? How do you know that I'm not very anxious when it comes to flying, and that drink helps steady me so I am comfortable on the plane?

See, thats the beauty of airports. You can throw certain social conventions out the window. Everyone is essentially reduced to two classes of people, and you are all peers in your group from the time you enter the security line, until the time your bag comes tumbling down the carousel. Its as close as we have come to eliminating bigotry, racism, elitism, etc so far. Everyone is in it together, equally.

And such a place as close to utopia as that, surely has no room for people wearing sweatpants or flipflops.


I don't, and I'm giving you a bad time.  *poke poke*

Besides, if you were very anxious, you'd have a Xanax with your drink, like me, you n00b!
 
2013-09-30 04:29:50 PM  

LineNoise: Food at most major airports is actually pretty good. There are good bars with interesting people. The little Irish pub in midway on a friday night during irregular operations is probably one of the most fun bars you will ever go to. Hell, where else can you plop down on a bar stool and order a beer at 9am and not be judged? You meet interesting people. The whole operation of the place and what it takes to do so is fascinating if you step back for a moment and take it all in.

And again, if you fly enough and get lounge access, priority screening, comped upgrades, its an entirely other experience all together. Like I said, I'm on a plane pretty much every week, and don't mind it at all. I actually miss it a little bit if I go a few weeks without flying.


Airport bars suck. I don't care how much ambiance you want in your farking bar its not worth 8 bucks a beer and 10 bucks a shot.

Free comps? They're awesome and I love them. On Airtran its FREE booze. All you can drink for duration of the flight. Awesome.
 
2013-09-30 04:33:41 PM  

LineNoise: How do you know that I'm not very anxious when it comes to flying, and that drink helps steady me so I am comfortable on the plane?


Yeah, that's the excuse use on my wife when I come home drunk from the airport. Which is often.
 
2013-09-30 04:37:39 PM  
If I could fly JAL or Korean Air domestically, I would. I have yet to fly a U.S. airline that didn't make me a bit embarrassed for my countrymen. It's bad enough that we deal with their service, but also think of the poor foreigners who are caught unawares while on a trip. NOT a good impression, they're getting.

URAPNIS: If you wear flops or high heels on an airplane, you're not very bright.
Comfortable is one thing, tripping all over yourself while navigating your way through the fiery rubble is another.
Especially if I'm behind you.

Now sit back and relax. We'll push away from the gate momentarily.


Anyone who's ever worked in or around the aviation field knows to wear long pants and secure, full coverage shoes on flights. When I see folks riding in pantyhose and sandals, I shudder; I've seen pics of what happens to passengers who tried to evacuate while wearing those.
 
2013-09-30 04:40:39 PM  

eajc4f: If I could fly JAL or Korean Air domestically, I would. I have yet to fly a U.S. airline that didn't make me a bit embarrassed for my countrymen. It's bad enough that we deal with their service, but also think of the poor foreigners who are caught unawares while on a trip. NOT a good impression, they're getting.

URAPNIS: If you wear flops or high heels on an airplane, you're not very bright.
Comfortable is one thing, tripping all over yourself while navigating your way through the fiery rubble is another.
Especially if I'm behind you.

Now sit back and relax. We'll push away from the gate momentarily.

Anyone who's ever worked in or around the aviation field knows to wear long pants and secure, full coverage shoes on flights. When I see folks riding in pantyhose and sandals, I shudder; I've seen pics of what happens to passengers who tried to evacuate while wearing those.


Yeah, they get run over by a firetruck!
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-09-30 04:47:02 PM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: "We've moved from takeaways to enhancements," says John F. Thomas of L.E.K. Consulting. "It's all about personalizing the travel experience."

Bullshiat.  It's about making the most amount of money for the least amount of service possible, an charging out the ass for what little service you do offer.

STFU.


OK. At the risk of causing a singularity and imploding the entire universe and the enveloping ether in which it resides I really MUST agree most whole-hardheartedly with BM here.

Flying used to be something nice, something special. Good times. Now? I liken it to being forced to understand what cattle must experience on their way to the abattoir.

Farking horrible.
 
2013-09-30 04:52:50 PM  
If you don't like the flying experience than don't fly.  As long as you understand what you're givin g up (speed, safety, arrival time, etc...) there's nothing to complain about.

/the people that complain the most, fly the least
//they're the reasons why airfare is for the lowest common denominator
///It's not your living room on a Sunday morning, it's a multimillion engineering masterpiece.  Treat it as such
 
2013-09-30 04:52:55 PM  

LineNoise: Do people gripe about greyhound not offering free drink service, or a super comfy seat?


I rode greyhound once.  The seats were more comfortable than airline seats, as far as I know they still offer free bags, etc...

People tend to get irked by 'ala cart' service because it's a much more expensive option if you're not getting the bare minimum.
Somebody mentioned that sides are traditionally extra at steak places.  All the steak places I've been to included sides, but consider the model.  There are transactional costs with each billing item, making it more expensive per item than bundles.

Place A can offer a Steak meal for $20 and toss about a buck's worth of potatoes, vegetables, and such with each meal.
Place B can offer said steak for $18 and charge $3 for a potato, vegetable, or whatever else you want.

If you're just eating steak, B is cheaper.  Start adding sides and A is.

Think about it guys - doughnuts cheaper by the dozen.  Cases cheaper than individual packets.  Bundle deals.

If first class wasn't so often 4X the price, I'd consider it more often.
 
2013-09-30 04:54:06 PM  

Bill_Wick's_Friend: Trocadero: They charge extra for Emergency Exit rows now.

Not yet on Air Canada or WestJet, the two airlines that I fly most.  Hope their execs aren't reading fark today.

IndyMBA: I think the stewardesses on United were delivered by Boeing with the planes and have been programed to be as surly as possible.

United is the Air Canada "Star Alliance" partner so I've flown them a lot to and from LA.  Totally agree with you on that.  Especially compared to Air Canada (gets a lot of kvetching from Canadian travelers but I've never found them to be too bad) and ESPECIALLY compared to the other Star Alliance carriers I've flown (Air China, Swissair, Lufthansa) the United staff seem to be cartoonishly / sit-comishly bad at their jobs.  Hope their execs ARE reading Fark today.


I fly pretty much only with WestJet while I'm down south, but I haven't been too thrilled with their "premium" seating things they started recently.  Seems like every seat is premium now, at least when I tried to book most recently.

The one thing they do have going for them is not overbooking, which is the single reason I won't fly Air Canada.  I live waaay the hell north, and there is not a chance that I'm going to risk getting bumped off my red eye back to Ontario...

On the other hand, there's First Air or Canadian North, who have exemplary service; hot meal, free wine, warm cookies!  All for the low low price of ~$1700 return per person on my last flight... Meh, we're way up north, we're used to the bend over prices...
 
2013-09-30 04:56:12 PM  

gja: Flying used to be something nice, something special. Good times. Now? I liken it to being forced to understand what cattle must experience on their way to the abattoir.


From what I understand, fly first class.  It's closer to what flying used to cost, and still has all the frills.
 
2013-09-30 05:03:28 PM  

The Fett: it's a multimillion engineering masterpiece.  Treat it as such


No. No, it's really not.
 
2013-09-30 05:04:09 PM  

durbnpoisn: ikanreed: Dafatone: Flying remains cheaper now than it's just about ever been.

But please, keep complaining that too many other people are flying as well or that you wish you could get a 50 cent bag of peanuts.

I will complain about the fact that the seats are too close together for a person my height(exactly average for an adult male), which causes substantial pain for the hours I'm on the plane.  I didn't mind the 10% higher prices.

I'm 6'2" and I've yet to find an airline seat outside of first class that I can sit in comfortably.  My knees touch against the seat in front and I have to hold my arms tightly against my side for the entire trip.  It sucks.


6'5 here -- my trick when i'm stuck in coach is to simply take off my shoes and slide my feed over them into the space beneath the seat. Works in MOST cases. 

My other issue is that my shoulders are wider than the seats. Sitting by the aisle isn't too awful if you don't mind being clubbed in the shoulder by every passer-by.
 
2013-09-30 05:05:22 PM  

LineNoise: Part of the problem is with the internet, and all of the ticketing sites, airlines now have to concentrate on offering the lowest published price possible. Even if Delta is superior in every respect to United, someone who flies once or twice a year where loyalty stuff doesn't matter is just going to go with whomever comes up the cheapest in the ballpark time range they want to leave at on kayak or whatever.

20 years ago airlines could afford to differentiate themselves with their services, because when you went to book a flight you either went through a travel agent, or picked up the phone to the airline you thought of first, or had enjoyed flying in the past, to see if they had something in your scheduled time range. Assuming they did, you wouldn't bother calling 5 other carriers to see who could save you $8.

For those of you who say Jet Blue and SouthWest are awesome, you clearly have never flown them when something goes wrong. You really get what you pay for then.

Sure, part of me longs for the day of air travel of old, where people cared how they dressed, you got fed, the drink service was good, etc, but really, how important is that? Even going transcontinental you are only sitting on the plane for 6 hours. Is it so difficult to grab a bite to eat (which even from the food court would be better than it was on the plane in the "good old days") or sit in a seat that is a little smaller than you'd like? BTW, I'm 6'2, and fit just fine in a normal coach seat.

As for baggage fees and stuff like that, if you travel enough where $25 a flight is a concern, there are ways to avoid not paying them, such as carrying an airline credit card, being in their frequent flyer program, etc.

I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.


Blame the TSA for how people dress on the airplane. You need shoes you can get on and off quickly - no laces strongly preferable. You need pants that won't fall down when you take your belt off and hold your arms over your head. Although anyone who isn't traveling for business and dresses up nice - dude, this ain't the 50s when everyone had loads of space and real silverware and flying was only for the super rich. Nice clothes are uncomfortable and wrinkle up when you're crammed in tiny seats (which yes, have gotten smaller or at least less legroom in the last 20 years or so, even as people have gotten bigger).... people dressed for comfort even back in the 80s, just it was usually jeans instead of sweatpants and sneakers instead of whatever else.

But there were always kids screaming and kicking your seats. I never liked flying, because of that, and because the air quality is just terrible - like "this is borderline not to trigger my asthma" terrible. Needs. More. Oxygen. And less recirculated germs.
 
2013-09-30 05:06:20 PM  

jvowles: My other issue is that my shoulders are wider than the seats. Sitting by the aisle isn't too awful if you don't mind being clubbed in the shoulder by every passer-by.


Persons larger than economy seats should buy two seats or first class.

I'm not saying you do this, but most oversized persons just intrude into the personal space of those unfortunate enough to sit next to them.

Then again, I feel like they're far too lax with carry ons these days.
 
2013-09-30 05:07:35 PM  

Larmer: Bill_Wick's_Friend: Trocadero: They charge extra for Emergency Exit rows now.

Not yet on Air Canada or WestJet, the two airlines that I fly most.  Hope their execs aren't reading fark today.

IndyMBA: I think the stewardesses on United were delivered by Boeing with the planes and have been programed to be as surly as possible.

United is the Air Canada "Star Alliance" partner so I've flown them a lot to and from LA.  Totally agree with you on that.  Especially compared to Air Canada (gets a lot of kvetching from Canadian travelers but I've never found them to be too bad) and ESPECIALLY compared to the other Star Alliance carriers I've flown (Air China, Swissair, Lufthansa) the United staff seem to be cartoonishly / sit-comishly bad at their jobs.  Hope their execs ARE reading Fark today.

I fly pretty much only with WestJet while I'm down south, but I haven't been too thrilled with their "premium" seating things they started recently.  Seems like every seat is premium now, at least when I tried to book most recently.

The one thing they do have going for them is not overbooking, which is the single reason I won't fly Air Canada.  I live waaay the hell north, and there is not a chance that I'm going to risk getting bumped off my red eye back to Ontario...

On the other hand, there's First Air or Canadian North, who have exemplary service; hot meal, free wine, warm cookies!  All for the low low price of ~$1700 return per person on my last flight... Meh, we're way up north, we're used to the bend over prices...


I'll be the first to admit that UAL Flight Attendants are the most horrible in the known galaxy, however, if you are not a demanding passenger their IFE setups and content are some of the best.  Domestic is domestic (it's the bus), but internationally, the interior and offerings, aside from service, are pretty damn good.
 
2013-09-30 05:09:35 PM  

Cid_Highwind: The Fett: it's a multimillion engineering masterpiece.  Treat it as such

No. No, it's really not.


Yes, yes...it really is.  Let me know when you find an A320 or 737 on CraigsList.
 
2013-09-30 05:10:40 PM  

LineNoise: vrax: LineNoise: I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.

You look down upon people who want to be comfortable when they fly?  Do you scowl at them as you lift the tea to your lips, pinky held high?

What about airline travel makes people think they can look like an absolute slob when they do it. Is that 3 hour flight to St Louis really such a burden on you that you need to dress like you were going to bed or the gym to get on it?

You looking like a slob just cheapens the experience for everyone else on the plane. Then everyone acts all shocked when the airlines follow suit.


Who, precisely, am I meant to impress? 

For me, it's the fact that I'm going to spend 4+ hours in a cramped, unpleasant space that I don't really fit in to begin with, and will be carrying a backpack and man-satchel and often bolting from one gate to another.  I prefer not to sweat through my decent clothes.

But I will wear jeans, a comfy button-down shirt, and sometimes a hoody. Usually shoes that I can slip on and off, but not always.
 
2013-09-30 05:11:00 PM  

Firethorn: Place A can offer a Steak meal for $20 and toss about a buck's worth of potatoes, vegetables, and such with each meal.


If you are eating in a place with a steak meal for $20, you aren't eating what most people would consider a steak dinner.


Firethorn: If first class wasn't so often 4X the price, I'd consider it more often.


Here is the thing, it isn't 4x enough if you fly enough. I sit up front probably 2/3rds the time I fly, either through a complimentary upgrade, or by using points I have. United knows I'm in a market where I can switch to delta or american, and they know I'm someone who flys very regularly, who will want to stick with one airline as often as possible to get perks. They also know I frequently book on a short notice, change flights around a lot, and don't care if their fare is 10 bucks more than someone elses. So I'm very valuable to them. Why they might make 20 bucks off a guy flying coach who bought his ticket 4 months ago, they are probably making 500 bucks off me because my boss called me last night and said "be in toledo tomorrow morning".

When you get on the plane and see the 15 or 20 people sitting in first class, probably 5 of them actually paid the full first class fare, if that. The rest of the people are their on points or some other upgrade.
 
2013-09-30 05:12:42 PM  

Madbassist1: LineNoise: I fly on average at least once a week. I have never had a problem with the TSA. Sure, occasionally i'll open my suitcase to find a note saying they took a peak in it,


Why do you need a farking suitcase? Also, I try to be as comfortable as possible when flying. T-Shirt and shorts if possible. It's silly not to do it.


Shorts on an airplane? Are you flying some magic airline where it doesn't get down to like 50 degrees (F) at cruising altitude?
 
2013-09-30 05:12:49 PM  

jvowles: For me, it's the fact that I'm going to spend 4+ hours in a cramped, unpleasant space that I don't really fit in to begin with, and will be carrying a backpack and man-satchel and often bolting from one gate to another.  I prefer not to sweat through my decent clothes.


time to get in shape if you can't sit in a seat for 4 hours without getting covered in sweat.
 
2013-09-30 05:13:24 PM  

LineNoise: When you get on the plane and see the 15 or 20 people sitting in first class, probably 5 of them actually paid the full first class fare, if that. The rest of the people are their on points or some other upgrade.


This
 
2013-09-30 05:15:01 PM  

LineNoise: vrax: To be fair, on a multimillion dollar passenger plane it is a little absurd not to have USB power ports for devices these days.  It's not exactly expensive new tech.

Your right, it isn't  that expensive. Until you need to add it to a few hundred airplanes in your fleet. And then fix it when it breaks from 30 different people a day plugging and unplugging stuff, who don't care about it. Ever wonder why there are two headphone jacks on your seat on most planes? Its so if one breaks, they don't have an angry flyer.

Now lets assume 100 people, (half a decent sized plane) plug in a device to charge. That added power has to come from somewhere, which means more fuel to burn. the cabling, ports, power generation, etc is all more weight that the plane has to cart around, and again, fuel it has to burn, even if that plane is only half full, or if only 3 people really need to charge stuff.


um... no, it's because the older style airplane headphones used a dual-prong connecter.

And the cost of that upgrade is high -- but for new planes, like Virgin America uses, it's standard and wonderful.
 
2013-09-30 05:17:25 PM  

Cid_Highwind: The Fett: it's a multimillion engineering masterpiece.  Treat it as such

No. No, it's really not.


More like lowest common denominator.
 
2013-09-30 05:17:39 PM  
"...and letting passengers pay to have an empty seat next to them."

This worries me a lot.

I try to move into seats that have an open seat next to them either before or after take-off, but now I can imagine them keeping track of which seats are open, and telling me I have to go back to my assigned seat.

Flying gets crappier and crappier every year.
 
2013-09-30 05:17:59 PM  
Remember when you used to pay a reasonable fee or price for a basic service and the company did it's damndest to throw in everything in the world to show you it deserved your money? Remember when companies weren't competing with lawyers to squeeze blood from your stones?
 
2013-09-30 05:19:57 PM  
It really is a shame that freight gets treated better than people on an airplane.
But, then, that's where the money is.
 
gja [TotalFark]
2013-09-30 05:20:16 PM  

Firethorn: gja: Flying used to be something nice, something special. Good times. Now? I liken it to being forced to understand what cattle must experience on their way to the abattoir.

From what I understand, fly first class.  It's closer to what flying used to cost, and still has all the frills.


No thanks. 1st class is far too often full of stiffs.

/CSB
I used to fly People's Express to Florida every couple of months back in the day (was young, single and like the girls who vaca'd in FL).
Seemed to get the same crew fairly often. Captain had a propensity for shoving the stalks ALL the way to the dashboard. Pisser of a takeoff, I loved it.
There was one female flight attendant who was hot and freeeeaaaky. She would sometimes sit on my lap and we would rap. Other times? Well I will omit that here.
The male flight attendant was wasting his talent working there. He was so goddamned funny. He really should have had a stand-up routine.
The man was hilarious, like laugh until your vision blurred funny. And we all had the greatest time on those flights.
I still remember when he pranked the entire plane by saying "please make your checks payable to (his name) and some old folks who weren't hip to the inside joke actually did! When he showed us the checks my buddy shot his drink through his nose.
We all laughed, had fun, made fun of each other and ourselves. Good times, good times. Oh, and $50 each way down to Sarasota-Bradenton.
/CSB
 
2013-09-30 05:21:59 PM  
I'm glad the last time I flew was in 06. I love planes and flying, but I hate airports and airlines
 
2013-09-30 05:22:40 PM  

jvowles: um... no, it's because the older style airplane headphones used a dual-prong connecter.

And the cost of that upgrade is high -- but for new planes, like Virgin America uses, it's standard and wonderful.


Aircraft are designed to last more than 30 yeaill refresh the interior from about every 10 years.  Virgin America has been in business operating in the US since 2009.  So, pretty soon even their aircraft will feel 'old' to you.

Seriously, Seattle to Miami is about the longest direct ride you can take in the US.  That's about 6 hours of battery life,
 
2013-09-30 05:24:13 PM  

The Fett: As long as you understand what you're givin g up (speed, safety, arrival time, norovirus, pissing/shiatting your pants while sitting on the tarmac for 3+ hours, etc...)


Just a couple other things people are giving up.
 
2013-09-30 05:25:25 PM  

LineNoise: Firethorn: Place A can offer a Steak meal for $20 and toss about a buck's worth of potatoes, vegetables, and such with each meal.

If you are eating in a place with a steak meal for $20, you aren't eating what most people would consider a steak dinner.


Um...no, that's about the going rate at the nation's largest "family" steak houses: Outback, Longhorn, etc.

Most dinners out at such places cost roughly one yuppy food stamp.

The next step up is the $30-$40 range and THAT usually comes with a side.

It's only the old-school style steak houses, like Morton's, Ruth's Chris, Fleming's, etc. that your steak starts at $35 and each side order costs a ten-spot.  Still, you can usually get a deal on them.  Restaurant week is a lovely thing.  You're paying more for quality, sure.

And then there's the REALLY nice places where the amount on the check only matters to you when you're adding gratuity.
 
2013-09-30 05:27:50 PM  

vrax: The Fett: As long as you understand what you're givin g up (speed, safety, arrival time, norovirus, pissing/shiatting your pants while sitting on the tarmac for 3+ hours, etc...)

Just a couple other things people are giving up.


DId you experience all of those at one time or was this from a Daily Mail article on Fark?
 
2013-09-30 05:32:42 PM  

The Fett: vrax: The Fett: As long as you understand what you're givin g up (speed, safety, arrival time, norovirus, pissing/shiatting your pants while sitting on the tarmac for 3+ hours, etc...)

Just a couple other things people are giving up.

DId you experience all of those at one time or was this from a Daily Mail article on Fark?


Norovirus?  Yes.  The only time I've ever had my body turn into a fountain of horror.

The pissing/shiatting your pants is just taken from the numerous flights delayed on tarmac for extended periods without access to the restrooms, like they aren't carrying humans or something.
 
2013-09-30 05:33:03 PM  

The Fett: Yes, yes...it really is.  Let me know when you find an A320 or 737 on CraigsList.


Easily found on the airliner equivalent, anyway.

Look, if budget airliners are "engineering masterpieces" so was my '87 Honda Prelude. They're all basically following the same basic template from the 1940s with incremental improvements. Just because they cost a lot of money to buy and maintain doesn't mean they're impressive, it just means they're large.

Aluminum tube. Control surfaces. Suck squeeze bang blow. Get fellated by Louis CK wannabes. It's quite a racket.
 
2013-09-30 05:36:40 PM  

Cid_Highwind: The Fett: Yes, yes...it really is.  Let me know when you find an A320 or 737 on CraigsList.

Easily found on the airliner equivalent, anyway.

Look, if budget airliners are "engineering masterpieces" so was my '87 Honda Prelude. They're all basically following the same basic template from the 1940s with incremental improvements. Just because they cost a lot of money to buy and maintain doesn't mean they're impressive, it just means they're large.

Aluminum tube. Control surfaces. Suck squeeze bang blow. Get fellated by Louis CK wannabes. It's quite a racket.


Guess how I know you know nothing about airplanes....Come on...guess.
 
2013-09-30 05:38:33 PM  

The Fett: jvowles: um... no, it's because the older style airplane headphones used a dual-prong connecter.

And the cost of that upgrade is high -- but for new planes, like Virgin America uses, it's standard and wonderful.

Aircraft are designed to last more than 30 yeaill refresh the interior from about every 10 years.  Virgin America has been in business operating in the US since 2009.  So, pretty soon even their aircraft will feel 'old' to you.

Seriously, Seattle to Miami is about the longest direct ride you can take in the US.  That's about 6 hours of battery life,


Assuming you're lucky enough to get a direct flight, which means you live near a major US hub airport and are flying to  another?  Sure.  But you're paying for it, too, and not always just in dollars. The shrinking number of flights means that fewer options are there. I'd really rather NOT fly at 5am to get a direct flight.

These days you're very lucky to get direct flights anywhere.
 
2013-09-30 05:40:48 PM  

Cid_Highwind: Look, if budget airliners are "engineering masterpieces" so was my '87 Honda Prelude.


Hey, the late 80's Prelude was a pretty damned well engineered car for it's time!
 
2013-09-30 05:43:03 PM  

vrax: Cid_Highwind: Look, if budget airliners are "engineering masterpieces" so was my '87 Honda Prelude.

Hey, the late 80's Prelude was a pretty damned well engineered car for it's time!


I remember, I totaled mine on my way home from the dealer.  Mega sads.
 
2013-09-30 05:46:33 PM  

The Fett: Guess how I know you know nothing about airplanes....Come on...guess.


Guess how I know you've never turned a wrench on one... Come on... guess.

vrax: Hey, the late 80's Prelude was a pretty damned well engineered car for it's time!


It was pretty neat, but I'm not going to defend the discomfort of squeezing into it and its tendency to eat alternators by 2003 by calling it a "marvel of engineering."
 
2013-09-30 05:49:32 PM  

RedPhoenix122: "The sides are not included in the price of a steak," he says. "Airline ticket prices should reflect the costs incurred by the individual passenger."

Where are you buying your steak?


THIS!  Airlines haven't been Ruth's Chris for a long time.  They're more like Golden Coral, except now they want to charge even more for the Mega Bar.
 
2013-09-30 05:49:50 PM  

The Fett: vrax: Cid_Highwind: Look, if budget airliners are "engineering masterpieces" so was my '87 Honda Prelude.

Hey, the late 80's Prelude was a pretty damned well engineered car for it's time!

I remember, I totaled mine on my way home from the dealer.  Mega sads.



i40.tinypic.com
 
2013-09-30 05:49:52 PM  

Cid_Highwind: The Fett: Guess how I know you know nothing about airplanes....Come on...guess.

Guess how I know you've never turned a wrench on one... Come on... guess.

vrax: Hey, the late 80's Prelude was a pretty damned well engineered car for it's time!

It was pretty neat, but I'm not going to defend the discomfort of squeezing into it and its tendency to eat alternators by 2003 by calling it a "marvel of engineering."


You couldn't be more wrong, but behold the glory of internet anonymity.
 
2013-09-30 05:53:57 PM  

Cid_Highwind: The Fett: Guess how I know you know nothing about airplanes....Come on...guess.

Guess how I know you've never turned a wrench on one... Come on... guess.

vrax: Hey, the late 80's Prelude was a pretty damned well engineered car for it's time!

It was pretty neat, but I'm not going to defend the discomfort of squeezing into it and its tendency to eat alternators by 2003 by calling it a "marvel of engineering."


I'm just going to assume that I'm misunderstanding and that you aren't complaining about a 16 year old alternator calling it quits.
 
2013-09-30 05:54:20 PM  
List fails without a "toss your ass and your screaming toddler out of the plane at cruising altitude" fee.

JuggleGeek: I got a kick out of "renting Apple iPads preloaded with movies".  Not because it's a bad idea, but because the airlines keep pretending that if you use your phone or a tablet computer you are going to cause the plane to explode or some nonsense.


Thankfully, the FCC is finally pulling their heads out of their asses and talking about overturning this stupidity.
 
2013-09-30 06:20:25 PM  

LineNoise: ikanreed: The fact that you haven't given up on life while at an american airport says a lot of bad things about your intelligence.

And again, if you fly enough and get lounge access, priority screening, comped upgrades, its an entirely other experience all together. Like I said, I'm on a plane pretty much every week, and don't mind it at all. I actually miss it a little bit if I go a few weeks without flying.


Yeah.  Trying to sell "flying doesn't suck" to people who look for whatever airline has the cheapest fare to go to Orlando or JFK or Logan are never going to understand.  I've been flying American pretty regularly for six years now and I can't really complain.  People have an expectation that the ticket they're paying $50 should come with the magical ability to not wait in line and a meal.
 
2013-09-30 06:59:10 PM  

vrax: LineNoise: vrax: LineNoise: I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.

You look down upon people who want to be comfortable when they fly?  Do you scowl at them as you lift the tea to your lips, pinky held high?

What about airline travel makes people think they can look like an absolute slob when they do it. Is that 3 hour flight to St Louis really such a burden on you that you need to dress like you were going to bed or the gym to get on it?

You looking like a slob just cheapens the experience for everyone else on the plane. Then everyone acts all shocked when the airlines follow suit.

Yes, sweats, sandals and t-shirts = slob.  That you are from NY couldn't be more obvious.  I find it hilarious that you complain about people and their shoes and then biatch about people wearing flip-flops on a flight.  There is no winning with you.  You should probably wear blinders when you are out in public.  I just spent the entire weekend in Long Beach.  That place would make you cry in a corner.


Crocs, leggings, and a comfy shirt for me. You can be comfortable and still look nice. I may only fly twice a year (Baltimore to NO, then back), but when I'm not comfy, I get grouchy. Not good. Just ignore the Mardi Gras beads I inevitably end up with and probably wear on the way home.

/Southwest all the way!
 
2013-09-30 07:01:54 PM  
"We want to get back to a point where people feel like travel isn't something to endure, but something they can enjoy," says Bob Kupbens, a former Target executive and Delta's current vice president of marketing and digital commerce.

Delta is the least respected brand name, even worse than Phillip Morris which kills thousands of people every year

That's some good marketing right there Bob.
 
2013-09-30 07:42:36 PM  

baltimoreblonde: vrax: LineNoise: vrax: LineNoise: I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.

You look down upon people who want to be comfortable when they fly?  Do you scowl at them as you lift the tea to your lips, pinky held high?

What about airline travel makes people think they can look like an absolute slob when they do it. Is that 3 hour flight to St Louis really such a burden on you that you need to dress like you were going to bed or the gym to get on it?

You looking like a slob just cheapens the experience for everyone else on the plane. Then everyone acts all shocked when the airlines follow suit.

Yes, sweats, sandals and t-shirts = slob.  That you are from NY couldn't be more obvious.  I find it hilarious that you complain about people and their shoes and then biatch about people wearing flip-flops on a flight.  There is no winning with you.  You should probably wear blinders when you are out in public.  I just spent the entire weekend in Long Beach.  That place would make you cry in a corner.

Crocs, leggings, and a comfy shirt for me. You can be comfortable and still look nice. I may only fly twice a year (Baltimore to NO, then back), but when I'm not comfy, I get grouchy. Not good. Just ignore the Mardi Gras beads I inevitably end up with and probably wear on the way home.

/Southwest all the way!


Exactly!  It's even recommended by experts, but not flying snobs.
 
2013-09-30 07:47:14 PM  
Charlie checked his bags in Austin, flew to New York City
And connected to Bangor, Maine.
When he got there, the attendant told him "ninety more dollars" --
Charlie couldn't get off that plane!

But did he ever return, no he never returned
And his fate is still unlearned.
He may fly forever in the skies of America,
He's the man who never returned.
 
2013-09-30 07:47:21 PM  

baltimoreblonde: Crocs, leggings, and a comfy shirt for me. You can be comfortable and still look nice. I may only fly twice a year (Baltimore to NO, then back), but when I'm not comfy, I get grouchy. Not good. Just ignore the Mardi Gras beads I inevitably end up with and probably wear on the way home.

/Southwest all the way!


Do you have to take a cab back to your trailer, or is there a bus?
 
2013-09-30 08:09:08 PM  

nmrsnr: FTFA: "letting passengers pay to have an empty seat next to them."

I believe that's called "buying an extra ticket" and it's not exactly a new service.


No, we did this for a flight last month. It's just a fee, I think we paid $60 (varies based on length of flight), nowhere near the cost of an extra ticket. But it really wasn't worth it. They have this large plastic thing blocking the middle seat and it's attached to the arm rests. It has cup holder indents. You cannot raise the arm rests. So the only extra space you get is shoulder room, which doesn't do that much. And you have a place to put your drink without lowering the tray table. We were very disappointed.
 
2013-09-30 08:31:18 PM  
I got my jimmies ruffled by the angriest flight attendant I've met in a while over reading my ipad before we taxied. Apparently she wasn't impressed by the level of attention she got from me during the safety talk. She got so irate she woke my fiancé up. We were flying on US Air. I've never had that problem on any other airline. I won't be patronizing Us Air for some time.
 
2013-09-30 08:35:49 PM  

LineNoise: vrax: LineNoise: I always get the suspicion that the people who complain the most about this stuff are the same people who get on a flight wearing flip flops, sweat pants, and a Nascar tshirt.

You look down upon people who want to be comfortable when they fly?  Do you scowl at them as you lift the tea to your lips, pinky held high?

What about airline travel makes people think they can look like an absolute slob when they do it. Is that 3 hour flight to St Louis really such a burden on you that you need to dress like you were going to bed or the gym to get on it?

You looking like a slob just cheapens the experience for everyone else on the plane. Then everyone acts all shocked when the airlines follow suit.


Why should I dress up for you? I'm not interviewing for a job.

Try just a bit of live and let live.
 
2013-09-30 08:49:31 PM  
Yea I honestly don't care how bad the service is or how little they give me as long as the tickets keep getting cheaper and cheaper. My SO flies weekly for work and we get to travel a lot to use all the rewards. If you are really cheap like me or flying stresses you out, try the following:

a) Bring your own food from home. I like to bring a sandwich, chips, homemade cookies, granola bars, and candy. I sound fat but I eat this stuff throughout my trip because I am really cheap.

b) If you are a thirsty person bring an empty water bottle and fill it up after security. Beyond easy. Plus if you are on a long trip you will probably get dehydrated otherwise.

c) Gum. First of all it makes you feel better when you haven't brushed your teeth for 16 hours and second you can use it to hide any terrible smells (like the guy in the seat next to you).

d) Be a tiny person. If you're 6' and 250 lbs then life sucks for you. Flying is when it pays to be short and tiny. Sorry because I know there is nothing you can do about this.

e) If you can't pick your carry on up (why do women pack bags that are too heavy for them to lift!??) and fit it in the overhead compartment then you brought too much stuff. That is all. If you have to pack a check bag (and it isn't full of stuff you need for work or essential medical supplies or something) you packed too much. You can carry your coat on the plane and you have no excuse to check a bag and complain about the fee. (If you don't mind the fee and want your golf clubs with you that is fine). I am female and I have packed 3 pairs of shoes and a hardhat (and all my clothes and toiletries) in my carry on.

Last 2 years I flew to La Guardia, Atlanta, San Juan, Phoenix, Ft Myers, San Francisco, Houston, and next week: Chicago (Midway thank God).

So I rambled.
 
2013-09-30 09:02:29 PM  
OK so I didn't know that shorts and flip flops were so offensive- I wore shorts and flip flops while flying last week. I apologize, but I was going to Phoenix. What exactly are the horrible things that happen to your legs and feet if you evacuate that won't happen if you are wearing pants. I mean, exactly HOW horrible could these things be that a pair of cotton dress pants would protect your legs? And you're telling me that my thin canvas shoes could protect my feet from this horrible thing that would happen to my feet in flip flops? Should I start wearing my steel-toes and hard hat *on* the plane in case of an evacuation!??

Also- once we boarded a 6 am flight and used all four of our 'free drink' coupons. We were going to Vegas so maybe you shouldn't go all crazy when you see people drinking at an 'unacceptable hour'- some of us are on vacation.
 
2013-09-30 09:54:35 PM  

LineNoise: baltimoreblonde: Crocs, leggings, and a comfy shirt for me. You can be comfortable and still look nice. I may only fly twice a year (Baltimore to NO, then back), but when I'm not comfy, I get grouchy. Not good. Just ignore the Mardi Gras beads I inevitably end up with and probably wear on the way home.

/Southwest all the way!

Do you have to take a cab back to your trailer, or is there a bus?

Actually, I can drive back to my own nice place, thank you. And considering my airfare (and the husband's) is paid for by family, I think I do just fine. I'll say hi for ya next time I hit Bourbon Street.
 
2013-09-30 11:37:43 PM  

RedPhoenix122: "The sides are not included in the price of a steak," he says. "Airline ticket prices should reflect the costs incurred by the individual passenger."

Where are you buying your steak?


At a real steak restaurant like Ruth's Chris. Not at Golden Corral or the Sizzler.

/I really like being able to get a bigger coach seat and priority boarding for a few bucks. Also don't mind paying for wifi on the flight. These are enhancements that make flying better, and are worth paying for. The ridiculous price of first/business class, not so much.
 
2013-09-30 11:44:45 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: Meanwhile:

[media.northjersey.com image 850x566]


Yeah, I wish the train was a practical alternative outside the Northeast Corridor, but it ain't. I took Amtrak from Atlanta to DC once. It's less than a two-hour flight. Fourteen hours on the train over crappy freight lines. The train was an hour late and had to speed up so much to make up time that I woke up with motion sickness. And the sleeper compartment costs more than a plane ticket, even if you have two people sharing it.
 
2013-09-30 11:50:34 PM  

mbillips: RedPhoenix122: "The sides are not included in the price of a steak," he says. "Airline ticket prices should reflect the costs incurred by the individual passenger."

Where are you buying your steak?

At a real steak restaurant like Ruth's Chris. Not at Golden Corral or the Sizzler.

/I really like being able to get a bigger coach seat and priority boarding for a few bucks. Also don't mind paying for wifi on the flight. These are enhancements that make flying better, and are worth paying for. The ridiculous price of first/business class, not so much.


I always have a hard time eating food from a chain restaurant, even a really expensive one.  There's gotta be a better local option near you, right?
 
2013-10-01 02:33:38 AM  

mbillips: At a real steak restaurant like Ruth's Chris. Not at Golden Corral or the Sizzler.


I'll admit that I have cheap tastes in steak, though I should have probably started at $30, not $20.

It's not hard to cook a steak I'll like - just keep it rare.

/I really like being able to get a bigger coach seat and priority boarding for a few bucks. Also don't mind paying for wifi on the flight. These are enhancements that make flying better, and are worth paying for. The ridiculous price of first/business class, not so much.

In other words you're a good step up from me.
 
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