If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Newser)   735-foot Nordic Orion is the first major freighter to cross the Northwest Passage shaving 1000 miles off the usual route. That's good. It did it thanks to Global Warming. That's bad. Saved $80,000 of fuel. That's good. Carried coal to Finland. That's   (newser.com) divider line 112
    More: Interesting, Northwest Passage, scenic routes, Finland, global warming, Panama Canal, National Post  
•       •       •

7629 clicks; posted to Main » on 29 Sep 2013 at 2:13 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



112 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | » | Last | Show all
 
2013-09-28 10:25:59 PM
stanrogers.net

Obligatory for my Canadian friends.
 
2013-09-28 10:34:23 PM
The coal contains potassium benzoate
 
2013-09-28 10:39:40 PM

ArkAngel: The coal contains potassium benzoate


s3.amazonaws.com
???????????????????????
 
2013-09-28 10:52:43 PM
Can I go to Finland now?
 
2013-09-28 10:58:15 PM
.... that's what?

was subby cut off by the character limit.. OR WHERE THEY SILENCED!?
 
2013-09-29 12:05:46 AM
 
2013-09-29 12:11:20 AM

Red Shirt Blues: ArkAngel: The coal contains potassium benzoate


???????????????????????


That's bad
 
2013-09-29 12:20:32 AM
So, environmentally speaking, is this a win due to the emissions saved from the shorter trip, or do ships traveling through the Arctic create other problems?  It seems like ice breakers might inhibit the natural formation of the ice cap, which isn't a good thing.  Plus, if this becomes a busy shipping route, that's a lot of emissions in an environmentally vulnerable area.
 
2013-09-29 02:17:46 AM
That's what? WHAT? WHAT????
 
2013-09-29 02:18:13 AM

Red Shirt Blues: ArkAngel: The coal contains potassium benzoate

[s3.amazonaws.com image 200x266]
???????????????????????


Beat me to it. Kudos.
 
2013-09-29 02:21:37 AM
... all, folks.
 
2013-09-29 02:23:13 AM

Darth_Lukecash: [stanrogers.net image 800x640]

Obligatory for my Canadian friends.


Here for Stan. Not Canadian.
 
2013-09-29 02:23:14 AM
Will the 80,000 be used to buy crochet.
 
2013-09-29 02:23:25 AM

Darth_Lukecash: [stanrogers.net image 800x640]

Obligatory for my Canadian friends.


The Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald?
 
2013-09-29 02:23:51 AM

CipollinaFan: Will the 80,000 be used to buy crochet.


Frogurt*
 
2013-09-29 02:24:08 AM
No Ironic tag?
 
2013-09-29 02:24:36 AM
Incredible?
 
2013-09-29 02:27:11 AM
static.guim.co.uk

"Well boys, we probably should have zigged where we zagged."
 
2013-09-29 02:27:23 AM
I thought it said "Nordic Onion," and thought, "that's a really weird name for a freighter, but it's awesome."  Then I cleared my bleary eyes and became disappointed.
 
2013-09-29 02:31:44 AM
i1.ytimg.com
 
2013-09-29 02:34:03 AM

TuteTibiImperes: It seems like ice breakers might inhibit the natural formation of the ice cap, which isn't a good thing.


i.imgur.com
 
2013-09-29 02:38:46 AM

Cerebral Knievel: .... that's what?

was subby cut off by the character limit.. OR WHERE THEY SILENCED!?


Where they silenced, Cerebral, wher? :)
 
2013-09-29 02:39:32 AM

whenIsayGO: I thought it said "Nordic Onion," and thought, "that's a really weird name for a freighter, but it's awesome."  Then I cleared my bleary eyes and became disappointed.


We're gonna need a bigger gravy boat.

i.ebayimg.com
 
2013-09-29 02:44:17 AM
Well, damn. Combined with the financial/political meltdown; we're totally screwed. Oh well, let's sing the doom song!
 
2013-09-29 02:51:21 AM
www.lakesuperior.com
 
2013-09-29 02:51:41 AM
It's not coal for powering an electric plant, it's coal for making steel with.

Sorry to break Newser's love of irony.
 
2013-09-29 02:53:34 AM
WOW! That might reduce someones fuel bill. How horrible!
 
2013-09-29 02:54:25 AM
Remember kids, the northwest passage now covers the entire surface of the earth.

/at least for one season, until this inevitable cooling that has been going on for 16+ years now creates a thicker ice cap
 
2013-09-29 03:03:04 AM
You left us hanging like that?

You're killing me, Smalls.
 
2013-09-29 03:05:23 AM

CipollinaFan: CipollinaFan: Will the 80,000 be used to buy crochet.

Frogurt*


The frogurt is also cursed.
 
2013-09-29 03:08:01 AM

HighZoolander: TuteTibiImperes: It seems like ice breakers might inhibit the natural formation of the ice cap, which isn't a good thing.

[i.imgur.com image 481x640]



By breaking it up, just like chipped ice melts faster than a huge chunk of ice in a drink. The greater the surface area of the ice exposed to the water, the faster it will melt, and ice breakers break up the ice resulting in more being exposed.
 
2013-09-29 03:09:11 AM
Since no one else has linked to the Stan Rogers song, here it is: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVY8LoM47xI
 
2013-09-29 03:10:44 AM
At least they weren't carrying it to Newcastle. Boy, what a waste of time THAT would have been!!
 
2013-09-29 03:17:29 AM
*Metallica noises*
 
2013-09-29 03:21:49 AM

SevenizGud: /at least for one season, until this inevitable cooling that has been going on for 16+ years now creates a thicker ice cap


What inevitable cooling might look like:

i.imgur.com
 
2013-09-29 03:35:14 AM

Ivo Shandor: SevenizGud: /at least for one season, until this inevitable cooling that has been going on for 16+ years now creates a thicker ice cap

What inevitable cooling might look like:

[i.imgur.com image 640x465]


I'd like to see a long term graph of the same.

Instead of just 1979 to 2011, how about 1911 to 2011?  Or even 1011 to 2011 (something we can really sink our teeth into)?

If stats arent available, were just jerking taffy.
 
2013-09-29 03:42:48 AM

TomD9938: I'd like to see a long term graph of the same.

Instead of just 1979 to 2011, how about 1911 to 2011? Or even 1011 to 2011 (something we can really sink our teeth into)?


Obviously not as reliable as the modern satellite + aircraft observations, but...
i.imgur.com
(link)
 
2013-09-29 04:03:52 AM

Ivo Shandor: TomD9938: I'd like to see a long term graph of the same.

Instead of just 1979 to 2011, how about 1911 to 2011? Or even 1011 to 2011 (something we can really sink our teeth into)?

Obviously not as reliable as the modern satellite + aircraft observations, but...
[i.imgur.com image 500x375]
(link)


So, we're doomed and it's all Western civilizations fault.  Thanks a lot industrial revolution.  Way to go penicillan.

Davinci pissed away his time with art and machinery, while he could have been working to halt mans progress.
 
2013-09-29 04:09:23 AM

HighZoolander: TuteTibiImperes: It seems like ice breakers might inhibit the natural formation of the ice cap, which isn't a good thing.

[i.imgur.com image 481x640]


Snow and ice reflect sunlight, reducing solar forcing on climate. Less snow and ice means more heat. It's positive reinforcement.
 
2013-09-29 04:10:20 AM

Ehcks: HighZoolander: TuteTibiImperes: It seems like ice breakers might inhibit the natural formation of the ice cap, which isn't a good thing.

[i.imgur.com image 481x640]

Snow and ice reflect sunlight, reducing solar forcing on climate. Less snow and ice means more heat. It's positive reinforcement.


FEEDBACK, damnit brain. Positive FEEDBACK.
 
2013-09-29 04:13:27 AM

Ivo Shandor: TomD9938: I'd like to see a long term graph of the same.

Instead of just 1979 to 2011, how about 1911 to 2011? Or even 1011 to 2011 (something we can really sink our teeth into)?

Obviously not as reliable as the modern satellite + aircraft observations, but...
[i.imgur.com image 500x375]
(link)


Yeah, when he said that, my first thought was "careful what you wish for, it might be far worse for your point than you think it will be".

Oh MAN was I right.

Of course, now I have to go weep quietly for a while. Jesus effing christ that's a sobering chart.
 
2013-09-29 04:28:41 AM

TomD9938: So, we're doomed and it's all Western civilizations fault. Thanks a lot industrial revolution. Way to go penicillan.

Davinci pissed away his time with art and machinery, while he could have been working to halt mans progress.


Exactly, being environmentally responsible means we have to go back to the stone age.

This is why eliminating mercury in gas meant no one could drive a car anymore.

It's also why banning DDT made it impossible to grow crops.
 
2013-09-29 04:39:03 AM

Darth_Lukecash: [stanrogers.net image 800x640]

Obligatory for my Canadian friends.


I use his song White Squall when I teach ballads in the poetry part of my LA gig; I can't sing it as well as Stan (what a frigging voice!).  But when I tell the story about how he died I can see that I'm really touching a few of the kids - he was truly a great and genuine hero.  I used to live (read your profile) in OC, back in the 1960's, when it was the headquarters of the John Birch Society.  I imagine it's hard being a liberal in OC even today, back then it was one bullying session after another.
 
2013-09-29 04:41:45 AM

Ivo Shandor: SevenizGud: /at least for one season, until this inevitable cooling that has been going on for 16+ years now creates a thicker ice cap

What inevitable cooling might look like:

[i.imgur.com image 640x465]


What cherry picking might look like
 
2013-09-29 04:44:06 AM

Wolf_Blitzer: This is why eliminating mercury in gas meant no one could drive a car anymore


I think you meant lead, but point well taken.

There are many noble and important environmental causes (Im a big believer in habitat conservation and dam removals for instance), and then there is the den of charlatans that is the AGW movement.
 
2013-09-29 04:48:02 AM
Despite the pessimistic nature of this thread, I'm an optimist WRT our future. Yes, we as a species might go through a crunch late this century, but:

Thorium: There's enough of it to fuel us for the next 1000 years. Zero emission energy and at least theoretically clean and safe.

Efficiency: Better batteries, less demanding circuitry, home manufacturing devices (not going to jinx the thread by mentioning the current hobbyist version) that put an end to long-distance cargo transport, etc. IOW: Lower energy demands pr person.

Genetic engineering; the useful, good kind, not the evil Monsanto kind. Our descendants will redesign everything so it works properly. Food from vats. Internal testicles. Yay.

All we have to do is wait for the teabaggers and "nukes and GM R bad m'kay" hippies to die off so we can get to work fixing things.

/coffee hasn't kicked in yet
 
2013-09-29 04:54:59 AM

stirfrybry: Ivo Shandor: SevenizGud: /at least for one season, until this inevitable cooling that has been going on for 16+ years now creates a thicker ice cap

What inevitable cooling might look like:

[i.imgur.com image 640x465]

What cherry picking might look like


What not reading all the comments before posting might look like.
 
2013-09-29 07:04:00 AM

TomD9938: There are many noble and important environmental causes (Im a big believer in habitat conservation and dam removals for instance), and then there is the den of charlatans that is the AGW movement.


Just so you know, the "den of charlatans" includes nearly all scientists working in the field worldwide.

But you don't care.  You saw the modern ice data, couldn't calculate a slope for yourself to see how unsustainable the trend is, so you demanded longer-term data.  Someone provided longer-term data reinforcing that the recent ice loss is incredibly anomalous, and you retreated to vomit out "stupid penicillin", because obviously being responsible for externalities means forgetting all knowledge, living in yurts, and Obama has to get a Heartland Institute tattoo.

You decided your conclusion long ago, and you're fumbling around unsuccessfully for facts to prop it up.  Sorry that reality doesn't coincide with the narrative you want.
 
2013-09-29 07:05:16 AM
Uncle Tractor:
...Genetic engineering; the useful, good kind, not the evil Monsanto kind. Our descendants will redesign everything so it works properly. Food from vats. Internal testicles. Yay.

All we have to do is wait for the teabaggers and "nukes and GM R bad m'kay" hippies to die off so we can get to work fixing things...


I'm really not convinced that GM itself is the problem, so much that as a species, we've been known to screw things up pretty badly, and at practically ever turn. We only modestly understand the potential impact of our actions today. Furthermore, we throw whole ecosystems out of balance. I posit that if something as simple as contemporary farming is dangerous enough to warrant concern, we should still be fairly afraid of something as dangerous as genetics.

Poorly designed or implemented irrigation/drainage systems prevent proper absorption of water into and heavily tax the water table, as well as contribute to one of many kinds of erosion. Mass planting of a few crop types, (nutrient use patterns, root depth, pests and diseases) immensely depletes the soil of nutrients, upsets symbioses which assist in nitrogen fixation, and prompts the use of fast-acting water-soluble fertilizers that contaminate the water table. This is not to mention the pesticides and defoliants used, which actively kill many beneficial insects and plants including wild legumes, whose roots host nitrogen-fixing fungi and bacteria. (soy is a legume as well, but likely doesn't make up for the vast amounts of corn that are grown under subsidy and in the absence of normal crop rotation.) That's all just a tidbit of what we know that we've damaged just by practicing large scale agriculture. There are various other issues like accelerated soil compaction exacerbated by heavy machinery and our methods of tillage, driving away natural pollinators and fertilizers and predators of nuisance animals like deer by deforesting too aggressively, and the immense risk of top-soil wind and water erosion we likely risk.

We can't seem to decide and agree on how children should be taught in public schools, or what good nutrition actually consists of, or what comprises good parenting comprehensively. We still somehow have a problem with people going hungry just at the doorstep of dozens of organizations that claim to want to help, let alone in the third world. We still have people who torture and murder, just for fun. The U.S. still has a justice system that treats someone in possession of cannabis-related paraphernelia with as much severity as far more heinous of criminals, but many sex crimes are treated as trivial by comparison. There have been cases where the convicted have been exonerated by DNA, only to be denied appeal. Our best idea of a cancer treatment generally involves exposure to medicines that are known to mutate dna, supposedly one of the causes of cancer. We still fairly routinely have oil spills, and one of our best efforts to correct the problem is to get hippies to wash off birds with dish soap so we can fix the broken PR. We don't really know how to reliably and reproducibly solve problems that are much more mundane and delicate than genetics.

In short, respectfully, I don't know what we've been fixing, but I think we've been doing it wrong.
 
2013-09-29 07:11:52 AM
TomD9938:

So, we're doomed and it's all Western civilizations fault.  Thanks a lot industrial revolution.  Way to go penicillan.

Davinci pissed away his time with art and machinery, while he could have been working to halt mans progress.


Penicillin didn't do jack shiat to melt the arctic, it was people burning farking coal and oil to power every single damn thing for 100 years. If you're saying population is the issue, well, we have condoms, pills, diaphrams, IUDs, shots, and many other methods to deal with that - perhaps if we had been wiser we would have used them in the past but we can sure start now. And as far as I can tell, it's not "progress" to merely bulldoze everything for parking lots or drive for hours every day commuting to a crap job because you can't afford to live closer. We could have a good society, in fact a better society, without crapping all over everything. There are other energy sources, there are other ways to live.

Leonardo da Vinci, incidentally, lived in a time before heavy use of fossil fuels, or the discovery of penicillin, or any number of things we have now... If you're implying that his art or machines have a direct connection to burning coal and oil in massive quantities, I think you need to really think HARD about why or how you made this absurd leap.

Aside from that, maybe you should give up that myth of "progress". "Progress" to where, exactly? Space? It's empty and full of radiation, and we already know that remote probes work better. The singularity? Sounds like a secular version of "the rapture" to me. What exacly are we trying to "progress" to?
 
Displayed 50 of 112 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | » | Last | Show all

View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest


This thread is closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report