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(Engadget)   When your Delta flight crashes, who will be at fault? Microsoft   (engadget.com) divider line 28
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2342 clicks; posted to Geek » on 28 Sep 2013 at 4:28 PM (40 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-28 04:39:03 PM
I can think of much cheaper ways to provide foot rests and/or coffee holders.
 
2013-09-28 05:19:11 PM
Windows 8 is a very stable OS

Probably the most stable Windows ever

Microsoft farked that chicken on the UI, but Microsoft did put so much effort into preventing computer crashes
 
2013-09-28 05:24:27 PM
Their flight attendants are all using Windows Phones, too. Someone at Microsoft backed up a dump truck full of money at the Delta offices.
 
2013-09-28 05:26:03 PM

Mad_Radhu: Their flight attendants are all using Windows Phones, too. Someone at Microsoft backed up a dump truck full of money at the Delta offices.


You got to admit (if what you are saying is true) this is the greatest Microsoft marketing strategy of all time. Microsoft has always suffered from piss-poor advertisement.
 
2013-09-28 05:29:49 PM

cman: Mad_Radhu: Their flight attendants are all using Windows Phones, too. Someone at Microsoft backed up a dump truck full of money at the Delta offices.

You got to admit (if what you are saying is true) this is the greatest Microsoft marketing strategy of all time. Microsoft has always suffered from piss-poor advertisement.


Nokia Lumia 820's
 
2013-09-28 05:59:36 PM
medical software companies are not held liable if a doctor prescribes a certain medicine because the software recommended it (no allergy interactions were found) but that patient does have documented allergies for that medicine.
 
2013-09-28 06:01:28 PM
Emirates uses Microsoft tablets. If you've ever flown Emirates, you know they pay attention to detail so maybe Delta will license whatever software Emirates is using instead of getting the nephew of some random junior VP to write it for them.

/Ok, probably not.
 
2013-09-28 06:09:06 PM
I guess it's Stupid to subby that they don't have iPads. They are not using them to fly the farking plane. The NFL haven't crashed and burned sine all coaches use Surfaces
 
2013-09-28 06:24:21 PM
If a Delta plane or any plane crashes, I'm going to think it's pilot error, faulty maintenance, or something along those lines.  Not because the airline company used a Windows Surface 2.
 
2013-09-28 06:25:06 PM

cman: Microsoft farked that chicken on the UI


I still hold out a glimmer of hope that Ballmer will be replaced by someone who will actually kick ass and take names and undo the vomit garbage of Metro/Modern/unnamable UI.  Yeah, it's a longshot.  Meanwhile I'll keep as many copies of W7 running and look for ways to migrate to Linux.  Driver support is a mofo for what I do or I woulda switched already.
 
2013-09-28 07:14:59 PM

Bacontastesgood: cman: Microsoft farked that chicken on the UI

I still hold out a glimmer of hope that Ballmer will be replaced by someone who will actually kick ass and take names and undo the vomit garbage of Metro/Modern/unnamable UI.  Yeah, it's a longshot.  Meanwhile I'll keep as many copies of W7 running and look for ways to migrate to Linux.  Driver support is a mofo for what I do or I woulda switched already.


W8 with Classic Shell. best of both worlds and very customisable. I upgraded from XP to W8 because they were doing it for $40 and (with Classic Shell) loved it so much I also upgraded my netbook and my second PC as well.

The only problem I've had is I set a few dozen high res pictures as the desktop backgrounds (I have a dual monitor setup) where they would randomly change every ten minutes and it seemed to slow the system down. A bit of Googling suggested it used up a huge amount of RAM so I stopped that and it seemed to cure it.
 
2013-09-28 07:22:23 PM

cman: Windows 8 is a very stable OS

Probably the most stable Windows ever

Microsoft farked that chicken on the UI, but Microsoft did put so much effort into preventing computer crashes


8.1 Fixes the UI a lot. It is also as you said stupid stable.
 
2013-09-28 07:23:15 PM

drjekel_mrhyde: I guess it's Stupid to subby that they don't have iPads. They are not using them to fly the farking plane. The NFL haven't crashed and burned sine all coaches use Surfaces


Surface Pro I guess cause the pen is probably great for them.
 
2013-09-28 10:39:22 PM
images2.wikia.nocookie.net
 
2013-09-28 11:47:23 PM

Lanadapter: [images2.wikia.nocookie.net image 640x480]


Yes, I do actually.  Is she over 18?  She doesn't look it.
 
2013-09-28 11:55:59 PM

Bacontastesgood: cman: Microsoft farked that chicken on the UI

I still hold out a glimmer of hope that Ballmer will be replaced by someone who will actually kick ass and take names and undo the vomit garbage of Metro/Modern/unnamable UI.  Yeah, it's a longshot.  Meanwhile I'll keep as many copies of W7 running and look for ways to migrate to Linux.  Driver support is a mofo for what I do or I woulda switched already.


I've been dreading the coming years when inevitably I will have to upgrade from Windows 7.  Then last week Valve announces SteamOS.  Suddenly I'm thinking "can you make do with Win7 for the next five years?  You can hold on long enough for SteamOS to get internet, chat, basic word processing, and maybe a limited wine wrapper, right?" I mean I'm mostly a gamer, that's why I've stuck with Windows this long.  If SteamOS actually goes anywhere though then I'm not longer stuck to Windows.  And hey, free OS upgrades forever.  Legally even!

That's if they don't fix the awful UI choices they've made with Windows 8.  8.1 is a step in the right direction, but it's still got issues that just suck from a desktop perspective.  Ditch the "hot zones" so multiple monitor users don't lose their minds, and either lose the Start Screen or make it so that you can have a folder structure that goes more than two deep.

And yes, I know that a free third-party program would fix all of this, but if an OS is so messed up that just to use its basic interface adequately I need a third party program, I start to seriously question why I'm using it.
 
2013-09-29 01:11:56 AM

yukichigai: I've been dreading the coming years when inevitably I will have to upgrade from Windows 7. Then last week Valve announces SteamOS. Suddenly I'm thinking "can you make do with Win7 for the next five years? You can hold on long enough for SteamOS to get internet, chat, basic word processing, and maybe a limited wine wrapper, right?" I mean I'm mostly a gamer, that's why I've stuck with Windows this long. If SteamOS actually goes anywhere though then I'm not longer stuck to Windows. And hey, free OS upgrades forever. Legally even!

That's if they don't fix the awful UI choices they've made with Windows 8. 8.1 is a step in the right direction, but it's still got issues that just suck from a desktop perspective. Ditch the "hot zones" so multiple monitor users don't lose their minds, and either lose the Start Screen or make it so that you can have a folder structure that goes more than two deep.

And yes, I know that a free third-party program would fix all of this, but if an OS is so messed up that just to use its basic interface adequately I need a third party program, I start to seriously question why I'm using it.


That's where I'm sitting as well, currently using win7 because of its gaming capabilities, no intention of going to Metro and looking forward to the idea of Linux actually being a viable platform for games.  What I'm really hoping for is not just SteamOS because I'm thinking its going to be a purpose built thing that may not be that great at other stuff but rather by association other more full fledged Linux distros will benefit from its presence mainly in the area of sufficient drivers for GPUs and developers leaning away from the lock-in of Directx thus tying their titles to windows.  Worst case if SteamOS is the next viable option for gaming is that I've got an ESX host I can use to spin up whatever windows flavoured VMs I want for doing not-gaming stuff on, the only application where I really need the full fledged hardware of my desktop available is gaming. the rest of my use cases are pretty OS independent already.
 
2013-09-29 01:30:57 AM

BumpInTheNight: What I'm really hoping for is not just SteamOS because I'm thinking its going to be a purpose built thing that may not be that great at other stuff but rather by association other more full fledged Linux distros will benefit from its presence mainly in the area of sufficient drivers for GPUs and developers leaning away from the lock-in of Directx thus tying their titles to windows.


I have a feeling it will definitely be geared towards working as a gaming system, sure, but I can't imagine they'd completely wall off the ability to run other apps.  Valve has to know that there are plenty of people out there like me, people who really only use Windows because that's what games are made for, but who still do other things on their computers.  Blocking the ability to do those other things would seriously affect how many people use SteamOS, and even though it's free I'm sure they've got money indirectly riding on how many people use it as an OS.  Also I can't imagine "Linux, now with walled garden" being too good for sales.
 
2013-09-29 04:50:13 AM

yukichigai: I have a feeling it will definitely be geared towards working as a gaming system, sure, but I can't imagine they'd completely wall off the ability to run other apps. Valve has to know that there are plenty of people out there like me, people who really only use Windows because that's what games are made for, but who still do other things on their computers. Blocking the ability to do those other things would seriously affect how many people use SteamOS, and even though it's free I'm sure they've got money indirectly riding on how many people use it as an OS. Also I can't imagine "Linux, now with walled garden" being too good for sales.


Well here's hoping, I for one am very much looking forward to their addition to the gaming ecosystem on that front.  It'll also provide me with a great excuse to upgrade all the TV PCs into gaming capable ones too.  I hope they've also got Intel involved too because NUCs are awesome.
 
2013-09-29 08:19:43 AM

yukichigai: And yes, I know that a free third-party program would fix all of this, but if an OS is so messed up that just to use its basic interface adequately I need a third party program, I start to seriously question why I'm using it.


If the end result meets your needs then what's wrong with using third party programms? Does that mean you refuse to use Chrome or Firefox and only use IE that comes with Windows? Or refuse to use PSP and stick with Paint?
The best part of PCs is that they are modular, I replaced my video card with a dual monitor card for example because I wanted dual monitors (a feature W8 supports better than earlier versions). What's wrong with doing the same with the OS?
If you're happy with 7 then stick with it. But if you want to upgrade and think 8 would offer advantages but are refusing to upgrade simply because you don't like a feature that you know can be easily fixed then isn't that cutting your nose off to spite your face?
 
2013-09-29 08:26:51 AM

Flint Ironstag: If the end result meets your needs then what's wrong with using third party programms? Does that mean you refuse to use Chrome or Firefox and only use IE that comes with Windows? Or refuse to use PSP and stick with Paint?


None of those things are integrated features of the Operating System itself.  All of the things you have described are things which are accomplished by using separate programs already, even if they are made by the same company and come included with the OS.

Look, if the stereo my car comes with is crap, replacing it is hardly unexpected.  But if the next edition of my car comes with a flight stick instead of a steering wheel, why am I looked at funny when I say I want to look at a different model of car?
 
2013-09-29 08:46:23 AM

yukichigai: Flint Ironstag: If the end result meets your needs then what's wrong with using third party programms? Does that mean you refuse to use Chrome or Firefox and only use IE that comes with Windows? Or refuse to use PSP and stick with Paint?

None of those things are integrated features of the Operating System itself.  All of the things you have described are things which are accomplished by using separate programs already, even if they are made by the same company and come included with the OS.


But what's the problem? If you can add Photoshop and Chrome etc to make a PC better suited to your needs then why not add something that adds a Start button and Menu?
When using a PC all that matters is that it does what I want and is easy to use.
What's the problem?

If MS tomorrow bought Classic Shell and shipped Windows 8 with it as standard would that be better? What is the difference? The end result is the same. It works the same. It has the same features.

This is like a comment in a property thread on fark I was reading yesterday about someone whose wife rejected a house that was a great deal just because the rooms were painted garish colours. The fact that the house was otherwise perfect and that the colours problem could be fixed in a day with $100 worth of paint just didn't occur to her.

Again, if you're happy with W7 then great. But if you actually want to upgrade to 8 but are refusing to do so because of an issue that you know can be removed in a couple of minutes at no cost just seems odd.


Look, if the stereo my car comes with is crap, replacing it is hardly unexpected.  But if the next edition of my car comes with a flight stick instead of a steering wheel, why am I looked at funny when I say I want to look at a different model of car?



What if the stereo is fantastic but the speakers are crap? Wouldn't the logical solution be to keep the stereo and replace the speakers?
Again with component hifi that was the whole point. You could pick and choose what brand and model of each component you wanted to suit your preference.
 
2013-09-29 01:55:29 PM
I am a software / IT guy, and there are simply some places that computers are not the right solution. For example, voting systems, where pencil and paper is perfectly adequate and where it's very hard to make eVoting secure (no current system even gets the basics right). Another example is that paper flight manuals don't blue screen when you need them in an emergency.

For things like ABS where a little software makes things work better, it needs to be embedded firmware, not something with an OS. The space shuttle used a flight computer with a Rockwell 6502 8-bit CPU and 64k of RAM - not fancy, but it's easy for a single human to examine and understand every single line of code at once and how they interact, making bugs very rare.

This issue is not unique to Microsoft, it's simply good common sense.
 
2013-09-29 02:50:18 PM

Flint Ironstag: yukichigai: Flint Ironstag: If the end result meets your needs then what's wrong with using third party programms? Does that mean you refuse to use Chrome or Firefox and only use IE that comes with Windows? Or refuse to use PSP and stick with Paint?

None of those things are integrated features of the Operating System itself.  All of the things you have described are things which are accomplished by using separate programs already, even if they are made by the same company and come included with the OS.


But what's the problem? If you can add Photoshop and Chrome etc to make a PC better suited to your needs then why not add something that adds a Start button and Menu?
When using a PC all that matters is that it does what I want and is easy to use.
What's the problem?

If MS tomorrow bought Classic Shell and shipped Windows 8 with it as standard would that be better? What is the difference? The end result is the same. It works the same. It has the same features.

This is like a comment in a property thread on fark I was reading yesterday about someone whose wife rejected a house that was a great deal just because the rooms were painted garish colours. The fact that the house was otherwise perfect and that the colours problem could be fixed in a day with $100 worth of paint just didn't occur to her.

Again, if you're happy with W7 then great. But if you actually want to upgrade to 8 but are refusing to do so because of an issue that you know can be removed in a couple of minutes at no cost just seems odd.


Look, if the stereo my car comes with is crap, replacing it is hardly unexpected.  But if the next edition of my car comes with a flight stick instead of a steering wheel, why am I looked at funny when I say I want to look at a different model of car?


What if the stereo is fantastic but the speakers are crap? Wouldn't the logical solution be to keep the stereo and replace the speakers?
Again with component hifi that was the whole point. You could pick and choose ...


Why are you arguing with people who are trying to turn this into a 'Windows 8' hate thread?

They have already admitted that they are still using Windows 7 so what could they possibly know about it Windows 8?

Think about it.

They have obviously not used Win 8 long enough to understand why it is a better OS than Windows 7 BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT USING IT.
 
2013-09-29 06:49:07 PM

Flint Ironstag: If MS tomorrow bought Classic Shell and shipped Windows 8 with it as standard would that be better? What is the difference? The end result is the same. It works the same. It has the same features.


Both Classic Shell and Start8 are not officially supported, and (IIRC) both use some undocumented hacks in order to function.  If MS officially integrated Classic Shell it would make a difference because it wouldn't mean I have to worry about my third-party program breaking after the latest Windows Update, and that Microsoft has actually listened to the customer base and realized that not everyone thinks the big dumb simple tiles system is what they want for a menu.

Look, you want to know why I'm so vehemently against any part of what was introduced with Metro?  Because its completely counter to what a lot of PC users wanted in a desktop, and Microsoft's insistence on keeping some portions of it in is their way of going, "okay, come on though, it wasn't ALL bad, right?"  No, it really was all bad.  Exactly zero parts of that control scheme make sense for a desktop OS (don't even get me started on Server OSes), and no amount of rebranding and hype are going to change that.

fisker: Think about it.

They have obviously not used Win 8 long enough to understand why it is a better OS than Windows 7 BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT USING IT.


Actually, I have used it, admittedly back when it was in Release Candidate stages and the UI was still called Metro.  Yes, there are some nice features, but touchpad-oriented controls for my desktop system were not one of those nice things.

Yeah, it seems like "just one thing", except it's "just one thing" that I have to access anytime I do anything on the OS.  That's why I used the flight stick/steering wheel example above, because I'll be constantly interacting with it for the duration of my use of the OS.  It may be minorly annoying but it's going to be minorly annoying me the ENTIRE time I'm on the computer.  It doesn't matter if the metaphorical car here gets 25% more gas mileage if I get a horrendous stress headache every time I drive it.
 
2013-09-29 09:45:19 PM

yukichigai: Flint Ironstag: If MS tomorrow bought Classic Shell and shipped Windows 8 with it as standard would that be better? What is the difference? The end result is the same. It works the same. It has the same features.

Both Classic Shell and Start8 are not officially supported, and (IIRC) both use some undocumented hacks in order to function.  If MS officially integrated Classic Shell it would make a difference because it wouldn't mean I have to worry about my third-party program breaking after the latest Windows Update, and that Microsoft has actually listened to the customer base and realized that not everyone thinks the big dumb simple tiles system is what they want for a menu.

Look, you want to know why I'm so vehemently against any part of what was introduced with Metro?  Because its completely counter to what a lot of PC users wanted in a desktop, and Microsoft's insistence on keeping some portions of it in is their way of going, "okay, come on though, it wasn't ALL bad, right?"  No, it really was all bad.  Exactly zero parts of that control scheme make sense for a desktop OS (don't even get me started on Server OSes), and no amount of rebranding and hype are going to change that.


I totally agree with you about MS trying to force a touch interface onto desktop users and the total uselessness of that. Had they made Metro an option, or asked you on first start up "Do you want traditional desktop or touch interface?" then W8 would have been great.

But still how is Classic Shell any different from any of the hundreds of programms you will have on your PC, from Firefox and Chrome to Photoshop and iTunes, not to mention all the many 'behind the scenes' stuff like Adobe, Adblock, Java, graphics card software, printer management, DIVX, codecs etc etc. You have dozens of things running at any one time. What is one more?

Again, if W7 does what you want it to and W8+Classic Shell doesn't offer you any advantage then great, stick with what works, just as I stuck with XP for years even after Vista and 7 came out.
But if W8 offers you any advantage but you are refusing to use it solely because of an issue that can be fixed in a minute, for free, then that I fail to understand. I hate the Metro Start screen and the touch controls. But I love W8 on my PC, with Classic Shell. (Start8 also offers the same, possibly more, functionality. But Classic Shell is free and I'm cheap)
 
2013-09-29 11:10:58 PM

Flint Ironstag: Again, if W7 does what you want it to and W8+Classic Shell doesn't offer you any advantage then great, stick with what works, just as I stuck with XP for years even after Vista and 7 came out.
But if W8 offers you any advantage but you are refusing to use it solely because of an issue that can be fixed in a minute, for free, then that I fail to understand. I hate the Metro Start screen and the touch controls. But I love W8 on my PC, with Classic Shell. (Start8 also offers the same, possibly more, functionality. But Classic Shell is free and I'm cheap)


It's more that while Windows 8 offers some things, it doesn't offer enough to make up for the downsides.  Even with Start8 or Classic Shell you've still got hot zones and other touchscreen idiocy that can't be turned off.  The limited performance boost doesn't really make up for that, at least not to the point where I'm in any rush to upgrade.

Windows 7 does what I need fine, and even if Windows 8 had all of the UI problems solved completely it doesn't have any quantifiable advantages that make me go "oh shiat, I'd better upgrade RIGHT FARKING NOW."  It's just a little better at best.  I'd much rather just wait a few years for either Windows 9 to be released (hopefully with the stupid UI choices toggleable) or for SteamOS to actually go somewhere.  I'm cheap too. :P
 
2013-09-29 11:10:58 PM

yukichigai: Actually, I have used it,


thechive.files.wordpress.com
 
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