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(KSPR Springfield)   Hysterically screaming at an EMT to save your daughter? That's a pepper spraying and arrest   (kspr.com) divider line 156
    More: Asinine, EMT, Joplin, daughter died  
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7459 clicks; posted to Main » on 28 Sep 2013 at 5:57 AM (42 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-28 07:45:22 AM

NIXON YOU DOLT!!!!!: assault doesn't always mean touched. that's battery. in the missouri statute it also includes " attempted to" in the actual assault definition.


I understand this.
 
2013-09-28 07:46:41 AM

log_jammin: HindiDiscoMonster: aaaah, so your supposition is that police are always honest and never fudge the facts... good luck with that.

Not at all.

But your supposition seems to be that persons accused of a crime are always honest and never fudge the facts.


nope, but I tend not to believe the police anymore.. by default. How many more abuses of police power do you need to see all over the country till you realize they are not your friends, and would turn in their own mothers if they downloaded a song on the internet? Cops tend to have a moral superiority complex as well as an almost megalomanical need to show they are superior in every other way by throwing their dicks around and spraying everywhere just like a wild animal. This NEVER used to be the case till we started militarizing the police, and now we are farked. So, yes, I will tend to believe the victim over the police till proven otherwise. The police have turned into the largest and most powerful street gang in the country.
 
2013-09-28 07:59:01 AM
Well I hope their dead daughter is happy. Not only did she kill herself, but she also got her father and brother arrested. Selfish biatch.
 
2013-09-28 08:00:04 AM
 
"What I'll tell you is that the conduct that's alleged is directly contradictory to our values, our mission statement, our code of ethics," the chief said.


And therein lies the problem, you fark.
Of course a cop acting like an asshole is contradictory to what he is *supposed* to be doing. Sure doesn't stop it from happening though.
 
2013-09-28 08:10:03 AM
Say it with me boys & girls:


jury nullification
 
2013-09-28 08:10:06 AM
"Get up or I will render you unable to get up"
Yeah, that makes farking sense. A taser is not supposed to be a 'obey all my commands or else" device. It is a less lethal alternative to removing a threat. You got a guy that is very agressive guy walking toward you and won't stop? That's what a taser is for. You got a guy that is a threat that is not immediatly harming anyone, but you can't safely approach? That's what a taser is for. You got a guy running from you and your fat ass can't keep up? taser.

A guy you've already used a 'compliance device' on, who is on the ground unable to do anything? That's when you just walk up and slap on cuffs if you feel he might be so damn dangerous. Hell, if you are so damn adament that he stand up, use a pain compiance hold, or you know, just grab and lift. Are you gonna bean bag him because he won't get up while being tased as well?
 
2013-09-28 08:10:32 AM

TuteTibiImperes: The side of the EMT and the officer isn't being told here.  If the father and son were obstructing their efforts, they deserve the charges.  If not, the investigation will reveal that.


ah yes, the completely impartial investigation into the officers actions. i'm sure it will be completely fair and not at all biased.
 
2013-09-28 08:13:10 AM

ghare: And so, since she was dead, they pepper-sprayed a grieving hysterical father  - for what? Interfering with their treatment of a dead girl? Nothing else would have sufficed, huh? No sympathy for the guy? No hugs, two guys don't just grab him and neutralize him, nothing would do except a pepper spraying? Well, I guess it's better than the lethal beatings cops hand out sometimes for people screaming, or looking at them wrong.


This.  In D&D terms, I'd rather have neutral good cops than lawful neutral ones.
 
2013-09-28 08:14:01 AM
If you become violent you may be arrested. How is this news?
 
2013-09-28 08:14:19 AM
Why wasn't the firearm and the bullets locked up separately?

/ walks away to go get popcorn
 
2013-09-28 08:17:13 AM

spidermann: Say it with me boys & girls:


jury nullification


Except that the court *really* hates that. I think they ask you now if you believe in that, and if you say yes, they kick you off the jury pool (got jury duty coming up next month. yeah.) And they (From what I've heard) ask you under oath, so if you lie and say you don't agree with it, and then push for that, they can get you with prejury

.

Cagey B: Screaming hysterical people are not likely to help any given situation, and should be tased repeatedly in the scrotal regions until reason prevails.


Whenever I get stressed, I find nothing calms me down like a good shot of voltage to the nuts. I call it "Blue crackling calm down juice"
 
2013-09-28 08:28:04 AM

fluffy2097: IlGreven: Oh, I bet you'd be fun at the IPCC...

The daughter shot herself in the head with a gun. There is no possible way she was aware of the universe even existing milliseconds after pulling that trigger. She was dead when the family found her She was dead when EMT's arrived, she was dead when the family assaulted the EMT, she was dead when she fell off the gurney.

Sit the fark down and let emergency workers do their job.

/she was probably molested by her father or brother anyways leading to the suicide to begin with.
//Life is horrible. welcome to it.


Wow, that's an insane and completely basis accusation to make. Are all teenagers that kill themselves molested by their fathers and brothers? Because that would be the only way to come to your conclusion based on the simple fact that a teenager killed herself.
 
2013-09-28 08:29:45 AM

MythDragon: Except that the court *really* hates that.


They can hate it all they want. Still part of the law and the process.

MythDragon: I think they ask you now if you believe in that, and if you say yes, they kick you off the jury pool (got jury duty coming up next month. yeah.) And they (From what I've heard) ask you under oath, so if you lie and say you don't agree with it, and then push for that, they can get you with prejury


Nullifying jury nullification. Nothing like ruining the process of law just because your panties are twisted that, omg, regular citizens have an ounce of power. Nothing quite like making a criminal out of a peer because you don't like the law you're sworn to uphold.

/I know most judges these days don't even instruct that it's an option for juries
//and I get it, all of it
///the above is so sarcastic because it blows my mind how farked our legal system is yet is still held up as virtuous
 
2013-09-28 08:31:01 AM

fusillade762: He claims the situation escalated when he says the EMT turned away from Brooke to him to ask what had happened. He says, had the EMT been turned toward Brooke, he would have seen her fall off the gurney.

Seems like "Keeping Unconscious Patients on a Gurney" would be EMT 101.


Actually, EMT 101 is "scene safety".   And if it's not safe, I stop what I'm doing until it is safe.   That includes any kind of assault.   I've been on several calls recently where police had to intervene and  make sure that happened.
 
2013-09-28 08:31:53 AM
Yeah, I have to side with the police here. Young woman found shot in a park and two screaming lunatics. First and foremost, these two were helping no one and nothing. Obviously they had their reasons to believe it was a suicide, but the EMT and cop just arriving at the scene? ... the shooter could have been easily been one of the aggressive guys on the scene. The dad even says the EMT had turned and asked him what happened when he was screaming at the EMT to do his f'ing job. Next up he sees son getting sprayed and taken down to the ground.

With all that said, it may be the decent thing to drop all the charges. If I found my kid dead, I probably wouldn't be the best conversationist at the moment.
 
2013-09-28 08:32:35 AM

gibbon1: ecmoRandomNumbers: I think cops should be pepper-sprayed and tased once a month just so they remember how it feels. And shot once a year in a non-critical body part. Like the head.

There is a thought, if a cop pepper sprays someone he gets taken out behind the station and pepper sprayed. Just to make sure that cop has the right priorities.

Either way the idea pepper spray is an alternative to a gun is a lie.  The reality is it's an alternative to a night stick or a good talking to, depending on the cop and who his police chief is.

My gut says, 80% chance cops filed charges because they used excessive force and they know it. Lot of places they'd would have been taken down to the station, their eyes washed out, booted out to the curb, and the arrest wouldn't make it into the computer.


Exactly.

When I was a young POS, I mouthed off to a cop. He smacked me in the head 3 times before I could blink and told me in no uncertain terms that he was in charge and I needed to STFD and STFU. Today, I'd probably have been arrested, charged with interference, resisting, and attempt to influence a public servant; and my life ruined. As it is, I learned a very valuable lesson: The only things you say to a cop are "Am I being detained?" and "Am I free to leave?"
 
2013-09-28 08:33:47 AM

bborchar: fluffy2097: IlGreven: Oh, I bet you'd be fun at the IPCC...

The daughter shot herself in the head with a gun. There is no possible way she was aware of the universe even existing milliseconds after pulling that trigger. She was dead when the family found her She was dead when EMT's arrived, she was dead when the family assaulted the EMT, she was dead when she fell off the gurney.

Sit the fark down and let emergency workers do their job.

/she was probably molested by her father or brother anyways leading to the suicide to begin with.
//Life is horrible. welcome to it.

Wow, that's an insane and completely basis accusation to make. Are all teenagers that kill themselves molested by their fathers and brothers? Because that would be the only way to come to your conclusion based on the simple fact that a teenager killed herself.


*baseless

/farking mobile
 
2013-09-28 08:34:48 AM

robohobo: I'm sure all those who have such a hatred for police have forever foresworn 911 and police intervention.


/and I bet they farking love the government
//their side, anyhow


I've managed to avoid calling 911my entire life. And no cop has EVER intervened on my behalf. Ever. No matter the situation. It has been my experience in my 50 years that any time the police come around, things get exponentially worse. For everyone involved.
I have never seen a time that a cop has resolved or helped resolve anything without making someone's life miserable unnecessarily.
The only time police should be called is when you need a police report for insurance purposes.
And then only after having that argument with your insurance co.
 
2013-09-28 08:48:56 AM
This is why I just stay at home and watch TV....when my daughter is attempting suicide.

I'd just get in the way of everyone involved.
 
2013-09-28 08:49:58 AM
The cop in this case, and any similar case has essentially two options

1: Do nothing and let the assault continue

2: Stop the assault with some form of physical intervention. That can be anything from a physical on the ground fight, baton, taster, spray even firearms.

People who get up in arms about police using pepper spray seem to forget that it's the  least harmful out of any of those options. Tasers pierce the skin. Batons and fighting are worse as they often involve blunt force trauma on both the subject and the officer. So instead of one guy crying for an hour and having to wash his face, you have 2 guys in the emergency room with lacerations, broken bones and maybe head trauma.

So many people seem to want to go back to the days before police had tasers and spray. And those people don't know history. Back then blackjacks and sap gloves were issued to officers and continued the norm. Beating a person unconscious was just part of the job. It was either that or shoot them. Injuries to both the officer  and the subject have gone down since tasers and spray became widely used.
 
2013-09-28 08:53:15 AM
FTA: "What I'll tell you is that the conduct that's alleged is directly contradictory to our values, our mission statement, our code of ethics," the chief said. "Those are not the things we engage in."

LOL is he a cop or a comedian?!

And, why the fark are police departments allowed to investigate themselves?? Of course they're not going to find anything wrong. They never do.
 
2013-09-28 08:56:33 AM

fluffy2097: The family found Brooke in a park near their house, unconscious from a single gunshot wound to the head.

EMT's also cannot put grey matter back together inside a skull when it has been turned into giblets by a hollow point round or buckshot.


i.huffpost.com

Begs to differ.


If my daughter/son/loved one was laying on the ground hovering  between life and death I would be SCREAMING too. And If my daughter/son/loved fell off the gurney for ANY reason I would also encourage that EMT to do his farking job.

Poor EMT, under duress.

And fark the police
 
2013-09-28 09:02:20 AM

fluffy2097: IlGreven: Oh, I bet you'd be fun at the IPCC...

The daughter shot herself in the head with a gun. There is no possible way she was aware of the universe even existing milliseconds after pulling that trigger. She was dead when the family found her She was dead when EMT's arrived, she was dead when the family assaulted the EMT, she was dead when she fell off the gurney.

Sit the fark down and let emergency workers do their job.

/she was probably molested by her father or brother anyways leading to the suicide to begin with.
//Life is horrible. welcome to it.


So you fantasize about molesting your kids?
 
2013-09-28 09:06:41 AM

log_jammin: red5ish: There isn't enough independent information in this crappy excuse for an article to form any kind of opinion except that the author is a lazy coont.

It's not that the writer is necessarily lazy, it's just that without a police report there is only his side to go on, and apart for "we put her in the ambulance...then backed away" he doesn't give any real details.

My son and I placed my daughter in the ambulance and backed away.

we ran her over to the parked ambulance. We put her on the gurney that was halfway out of the ambulance, and I screamed that my daughter had shot herself
...
At this point, I backed away because I thought they would put her in the ambulance and drive away


My feeling is that he did not "back away" as he says he did.


"Your feeling"?? Well, holy shiat it's solved then!!
 
2013-09-28 09:09:14 AM
So maybe making the EMT fear for their life wasn't the most effective method for the parent?  It's reasonable to ask what happened as part of the triage process.
 
2013-09-28 09:16:02 AM

blacksho89: When I was a young POS, I mouthed off to a cop. He smacked me in the head 3 times before I could blink and told me in no uncertain terms that he was in charge and I needed to STFD and STFU. Today, I'd probably have been arrested, charged with interference, resisting, and attempt to influence a public servant; and my life ruined. As it is, I learned a very valuable lesson: The only things you say to a cop are "Am I being detained?" and "Am I free to leave?"


Except that mouthing off to a cop isn't a crime. If you go up to one and cause interferince, then sure. If he's trying to arrest someone else or invesitage something, and you go over and get in his business, then a little pepper to the face is in order. If you are out walking your dogs at 2am because you were up and felt like walking your dogs, and a cop rolls by and asks why you were walking your dogs at 2am, and you tell him it's because you are on the way back from porking his mom, he's got no grounds. Hell, even if he's got you stopped for speeding and you decide to get a little lippy and ask if this is making him late for the station locker room dick sucking contest, he has no right to tase/spray/beat/shoot you. Sure it really doesn't help when you go to court, since judges don't look favorably on people who are assholes to cops, but it doesn't mean the cop gets to play the role of the Punisher.

Cops are there to enforce the law. Not enforce their sensitive feelings when their women's underwear gets all twisted up. Of course you *shouldn't* mouth off to a cop, since it well never result in anything good, but neither should it net you an ass kicking.
 
2013-09-28 09:24:48 AM

Ker_Thwap: So maybe making the EMT fear for their life wasn't the most effective method for the parent?  It's reasonable to ask what happened as part of the triage process.


If the EMT was in fear of his life in this situation maybe they need to rethink their career career choice. It's a high stress job on the easy days. For some reason, my sympathy is not with the EMT in this case.


1.bp.blogspot.com

There's always work at the post office.


/and people only occasionally die there!
 
2013-09-28 09:25:09 AM

MythDragon: blacksho89: When I was a young POS, I mouthed off to a cop. He smacked me in the head 3 times before I could blink and told me in no uncertain terms that he was in charge and I needed to STFD and STFU. Today, I'd probably have been arrested, charged with interference, resisting, and attempt to influence a public servant; and my life ruined. As it is, I learned a very valuable lesson: The only things you say to a cop are "Am I being detained?" and "Am I free to leave?"

Except that mouthing off to a cop isn't a crime. If you go up to one and cause interferince, then sure. If he's trying to arrest someone else or invesitage something, and you go over and get in his business, then a little pepper to the face is in order. If you are out walking your dogs at 2am because you were up and felt like walking your dogs, and a cop rolls by and asks why you were walking your dogs at 2am, and you tell him it's because you are on the way back from porking his mom, he's got no grounds. Hell, even if he's got you stopped for speeding and you decide to get a little lippy and ask if this is making him late for the station locker room dick sucking contest, he has no right to tase/spray/beat/shoot you. Sure it really doesn't help when you go to court, since judges don't look favorably on people who are assholes to cops, but it doesn't mean the cop gets to play the role of the Punisher.

Cops are there to enforce the law. Not enforce their sensitive feelings when their women's underwear gets all twisted up. Of course you *shouldn't* mouth off to a cop, since it well never result in anything good, but neither should it net you an ass kicking.


For someone so very sensitive to your rights, it's a bit sad to see you're a misogynist.
 
2013-09-28 09:26:03 AM

log_jammin: mediablitz: "He says the incident was immediately reviewed and the officer involved has not been reprimanded or corrected in any way."

How convenient.

convenient? Just based on this article, and no other evidence, I'd most likely come to the same conclusion. The cop probably didn't do anything wrong.




I wish I could write my own rules.
 
2013-09-28 09:30:42 AM
There are certainly interpretations of the article that would suggest inappropriate use of police force, but really, the majority of interpretations would support the individuals trying to control the scene.  I would suspect that the charges go away as soon as the risk of lawsuits go away.  But pepper spraying a hysterical person who was, at minimum, creating tension and confusion (I somehow distrust the accuracy pf the account of a person who had just experienced the trauma he had, and who had admittedly lost his composure) to control the scene and prevent escalation or interference is absolutely within bounds.

Go on a ride along for a couple of days with your local EMS.  You will change your opinion.
 
2013-09-28 09:30:58 AM
When I march on King's Landing, my army will spring from a curated list of the coldest, hardest badasses Fark forums can offer. I will take my dragons to your homes, and kill both your firstborn and all your bastards before your eyes to test your ability to think and act rationally in the face of horrifying blood and grief. Those who fail will not gain entrance into my army, but your lives will be spared. Your nipples will be removed, however, as punishment for being full-of-shiat ITGs. The rest will march, and Westeros will be MINE.

/Psychopathic T. sends his regards.
//stab
 
2013-09-28 09:31:08 AM

Eve L. Koont: log_jammin: red5ish: There isn't enough independent information in this crappy excuse for an article to form any kind of opinion except that the author is a lazy coont.

It's not that the writer is necessarily lazy, it's just that without a police report there is only his side to go on, and apart for "we put her in the ambulance...then backed away" he doesn't give any real details.

My son and I placed my daughter in the ambulance and backed away.

we ran her over to the parked ambulance. We put her on the gurney that was halfway out of the ambulance, and I screamed that my daughter had shot herself
...
At this point, I backed away because I thought they would put her in the ambulance and drive away


My feeling is that he did not "back away" as he says he did.

"Your feeling"?? Well, holy shiat it's solved then!!


It's entirely possible that the father's panicked, unwitting interference led to his daughter falling off the gurney. And this entire thread is basically speculation, since there is incomplete information. So what.
 
2013-09-28 09:40:39 AM

MycroftHolmes: There are certainly interpretations of the article that would suggest inappropriate use of police force, but really, the majority of interpretations would support the individuals trying to control the scene.  I would suspect that the charges go away as soon as the risk of lawsuits go away.  But pepper spraying a hysterical person who was, at minimum, creating tension and confusion (I somehow distrust the accuracy pf the account of a person who had just experienced the trauma he had, and who had admittedly lost his composure) to control the scene and prevent escalation or interference is absolutely within bounds.

Go on a ride along for a couple of days with your local EMS.  You will change your opinion.


There is nothing on earth that would cause me to believe a man needed pepper sprayed, arrested and criminally charged for being hysterical as his child's body and brains slide off a gurney. Nothing.

I see it's not yet clear that the issue is less 'control of the scene' as it is the continued punishment once containment had been achieved. THAT is the problem.
 
2013-09-28 09:41:39 AM

JuniorII: Ker_Thwap: So maybe making the EMT fear for their life wasn't the most effective method for the parent?  It's reasonable to ask what happened as part of the triage process.

If the EMT was in fear of his life in this situation maybe they need to rethink their career career choice. It's a high stress job on the easy days. For some reason, my sympathy is not with the EMT in this case.


[1.bp.blogspot.com image 450x247]

There's always work at the post office.


/and people only occasionally die there!


When you work a high stress job, you learn to pay attention to your surroundings.  It's not only medically necessary to ask "what happened" it's also a good survival technique.  I hope you're not suggesting the EMT is somehow cowardly for not showing a basic sense of self preservation.  It's never wise to turn your back on a person who is screaming at you.
 
2013-09-28 09:42:15 AM

someonelse: Eve L. Koont: log_jammin: red5ish: There isn't enough independent information in this crappy excuse for an article to form any kind of opinion except that the author is a lazy coont.

It's not that the writer is necessarily lazy, it's just that without a police report there is only his side to go on, and apart for "we put her in the ambulance...then backed away" he doesn't give any real details.

My son and I placed my daughter in the ambulance and backed away.

we ran her over to the parked ambulance. We put her on the gurney that was halfway out of the ambulance, and I screamed that my daughter had shot herself
...
At this point, I backed away because I thought they would put her in the ambulance and drive away


My feeling is that he did not "back away" as he says he did.

"Your feeling"?? Well, holy shiat it's solved then!!

It's entirely possible that the father's panicked, unwitting interference led to his daughter falling off the gurney. And this entire thread is basically speculation, since there is incomplete information. So what.




So what? Emotion is a stake here.
 
2013-09-28 09:44:59 AM
Hey, this is Joplin. Just sayin'.
 
2013-09-28 09:45:32 AM
FTFA: "If you Google our names you see our arrest record, and I want that to go away, that's what I want," he said."

HAHAHAHAHA!

Welcome to the Internet, sir. Jennifer Lopez would like to have a word with you.
 
2013-09-28 09:46:23 AM

psychopathic tendencies: There is nothing on earth that would cause me to believe a man needed pepper sprayed, arrested and criminally charged for being hysterical as his child's body and brains slide off a gurney. Nothing.


Unless his hysterics preempted and possibly caused the sliding off, and/or  his child had been shot without positive proof that it was self inflicted.  As I stated earlier, nothing in the article presented the fate of the firearm used, so yeah, if I was a cop (when I was an EMT) you better believe that not knowing exactly where it was would compromise the safety of the scene.
 
2013-09-28 09:48:21 AM
I have no problem with the pepper spray and initial arrest, but for farks sake just drop the charges afterwards. People often aren't in their right mind when they see their sister/daughter with her brains leaking out.
 
2013-09-28 09:48:45 AM

JuniorII: Ker_Thwap: So maybe making the EMT fear for their life wasn't the most effective method for the parent?  It's reasonable to ask what happened as part of the triage process.

If the EMT was in fear of his life in this situation maybe they need to rethink their career career choice. It's a high stress job on the easy days. For some reason, my sympathy is not with the EMT in this case.


[1.bp.blogspot.com image 450x247]

There's always work at the post office.


/and people only occasionally die there!


I know a couple of people who work at the post office. It's not a fun job. Because of pressure on gov't jobs, they are constantly watched, measured, having their hours cut. Getting work-related health problems and not being able to take much time off. carriers are often given shiatty vehicles to drive that don't have working heaters and no AC.

\just sayin'
 
2013-09-28 09:51:27 AM
The greatest barrier to patient care is the family. People need to recognize that just because we are not panicking doesn't mean we don't care ad aren't doing our job. Often there are thinngs that we need to do at the scene before we initiate transport. We are able to do everything in the back of that ambulance that can be done in the hospital, short of surgery.
He likely helped facilitate her death by not calling 911 immediately. I am sorry for his loss, but I'm sure he's not telling the whole story.
 
2013-09-28 09:53:17 AM

Ritley: I have no problem with the pepper spray and initial arrest, but for farks sake just drop the charges afterwards. People often aren't in their right mind when they see their sister/daughter with her brains leaking out.


This I can agree with.
 
2013-09-28 09:54:10 AM
The family found Brooke in a park near their house, unconscious from a single gunshot wound to the head.  They loaded her in their car and met an ambulance near the police department.

So one of those charges should be tampering with a crime scene. If it isn't he should be greatful.
 
2013-09-28 09:54:35 AM

Ker_Thwap: JuniorII: Ker_Thwap: So maybe making the EMT fear for their life wasn't the most effective method for the parent?  It's reasonable to ask what happened as part of the triage process.

If the EMT was in fear of his life in this situation maybe they need to rethink their career career choice. It's a high stress job on the easy days. For some reason, my sympathy is not with the EMT in this case.


[1.bp.blogspot.com image 450x247]

There's always work at the post office.


/and people only occasionally die there!

When you work a high stress job, you learn to pay attention to your surroundings.  It's not only medically necessary to ask "what happened" it's also a good survival technique.  I hope you're not suggesting the EMT is somehow cowardly for not showing a basic sense of self preservation.  It's never wise to turn your back on a person who is screaming at you.


Someone or something was making a lot of noise at an accident scene? Say it isn't so. If an EMT never turned their back on a person that was yelling at them (not 'I'm gonna kill you!' it was "do your job my daughter is dying!' see the difference?) I'm betting there would be a lot more dead people on the street.

Securing a person the gurney or operating table is superstar important. In the OR you never let a person fall. Never. And the 'what happened' question was pretty obvious: major head trauma. Self preservation is important, don't get me wrong, maybe most important. But please don't try to defend an EMT who made glaring mistakes.
 
2013-09-28 09:55:13 AM

JuniorII: fluffy2097: The family found Brooke in a park near their house, unconscious from a single gunshot wound to the head.

EMT's also cannot put grey matter back together inside a skull when it has been turned into giblets by a hollow point round or buckshot.



Begs to differ.


If my daughter/son/loved one was laying on the ground hovering  between life and death I would be SCREAMING too. And If my daughter/son/loved fell off the gurney for ANY reason I would also encourage that EMT to do his farking job.

Poor EMT, under duress.

And fark the police


Kay. In a link upthread to a different article, dad says that he ran up to the ambulance and threw the corpse onto a half-unloaded stretcher. And you're surprised that the body fell off the stretcher? The EMTs didn't load the carcass, and a half unloaded stretcher is in a difficult spot to reach. I wonder if dad had the presence of mind to buckle the seatbelts after tossing his daughter onto the stretcher that was 4 feet off the ground.

The "do your job" shiat was about the EMTs not peeling out as soon as the cadaver was in the back. They have things to do that A) need two sets of hands to accomplish, or B) need to do a couple of things that don't go well while bouncing down the road in the back of a box truck. If dad wanted someone to drive like a maniac to the hospital without evaluating or providing medical care, he should have just left her in his car and not called the ambulance.
 
2013-09-28 09:56:03 AM

Semantic Warrior: psychopathic tendencies: There is nothing on earth that would cause me to believe a man needed pepper sprayed, arrested and criminally charged for being hysterical as his child's body and brains slide off a gurney. Nothing.

Unless his hysterics preempted and possibly caused the sliding off, and/or  his child had been shot without positive proof that it was self inflicted.  As I stated earlier, nothing in the article presented the fate of the firearm used, so yeah, if I was a cop (when I was an EMT) you better believe that not knowing exactly where it was would compromise the safety of the scene.


There is nothing on earth that would cause me to believe a man needed pepper sprayed, arrested and criminally charged for being hysterical as his child's body and brains slide off a gurney he carries his child's body and brains to a gurney. Nothing.

That might serve my point better. The real issue I have is again in bold.
 
2013-09-28 10:00:18 AM
Not seeing the part about driving like a maniac and I still stand by the assertion that people with giblet brains recover sometimes. Saying that she was dead, what does any of it matter presupposes an awful lot.

But I did not know that dad was the one who loaded her onto the gurney. I will read the 'rest of the story' and use my head thinker about this.

No mater what, unless there was clear and present danger to them, the EMT should have made sure that she was secured, not dad, no matter what. One was trained, one was hysterical.
 
2013-09-28 10:05:20 AM
The EMT/paramedic's job is to keep a patient alive long enough to reach the hospital, this isn't done by just driving off the moment someone is chucked on the back. Someone screaming and cursing at you how you should be doing your job while having no medical knowledge, is sometimes understandable, but never helpful in achieving this.

I am concerned how many people here have implied I should just take a beating (with no consequences for the attacker because they are upset) for doing my hardest to save a life and do my job!
 
2013-09-28 10:08:27 AM

psychopathic tendencies: Semantic Warrior: psychopathic tendencies: There is nothing on earth that would cause me to believe a man needed pepper sprayed, arrested and criminally charged for being hysterical as his child's body and brains slide off a gurney. Nothing.

Unless his hysterics preempted and possibly caused the sliding off, and/or  his child had been shot without positive proof that it was self inflicted.  As I stated earlier, nothing in the article presented the fate of the firearm used, so yeah, if I was a cop (when I was an EMT) you better believe that not knowing exactly where it was would compromise the safety of the scene.

There is nothing on earth that would cause me to believe a man needed pepper sprayed, arrested and criminally charged for being hysterical as his child's body and brains slide off a gurney he carries his child's body and brains to a gurney. Nothing.

That might serve my point better. The real issue I have is again in bold.


Without any statement from the police department, however, we only have this guy's version of events.  Most likely the father has omitted some details.  Reading the story only mentions the son was pepper sprayed first, but the way it's written, I could infer he (the son) was just standing there while his father was being hysterical and the police arrived on scene, immediately sprayed the son, then went for the father.  I doubt that's what happened.
 
2013-09-28 10:11:31 AM
Good. Acting like an ass at a rescue scene is bullshiat.
 
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