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(RealClear)   Former NFL player Brian Holloway, after giving the hundreds of kids who trashed his house the chance to own up to their actions and be forgiven and only four showed up: "Okay, fine, let's start arresting people"   (realclear.com) divider line 322
    More: Followup, Brian Holloway, NFL, Los Angeles Raiders, broken windows  
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15536 clicks; posted to Main » on 27 Sep 2013 at 10:14 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-27 01:32:27 PM

tmonsta: TMZ is reporting that the house is in foreclosure and was abandoned at the time of party and that Holloway is making a big deal of this to solicit donations.

http://www.tmz.com/2013/09/22/brian-holloway-patriots-party-house-fo re closure-new-york/


Well then let the bank sue these little bastards. Damage is damage.


Oooooh, Bank of America vs. 300 Douchebags. I wouldn't know who to cheer for.
 
2013-09-27 01:32:50 PM

fireclown: what is the legal track record for using self-published crime photos in court?  It will work great for shaming, but what are the odds of any of this sticking in court?

/I have no law GED


Courts ruled in 2012 that self published pics on facebook and other social media sites can be used.
 
2013-09-27 01:34:00 PM
Random Anonymous Blackmail:
you ignored your chance to make it right so now you get door number 2.

"But that's my Number Two door!"

/ Off to PMITNTD prison!
 
2013-09-27 01:34:08 PM

super_grass: theflatline: super_grass: I get his frustration, but this is just too close to vigilanteism. They're just kids, and posting their pics online is only going to lead to harassment and mistaken identities. Combine that with the attractive nuisance and unsupervised (read: unsafe) condition of his house I'd say things are pretty damned even.

Human safety is worth more than your McMansion, I'm afraid.


So every one who has a summer house, or even leaves their house unattended can not hold anyone liable for breaking in and trashing it because no one was home at the time?

So if 300 kids pop by your house when you are out of town, destroy it, you are going to let bygones be bygones?

Plus these kids posted their own pics online, that is where he got them from.  They are the ones that put it out there.

How are these kids endangered by their pics online?  That the cops will arrest them for a crime they committed, that they themselves posted?

Guy gave them a chance to own it, even threw a big lunch and provided all the stuff necessary to clean up the joint, and only four people showed.

IF you're some 1%-er with a house that you don't live in all year, don't be surprised when people take advantage of the situation. Get some insurance and move on.


Wow, exactly what I would expect someone who actively defended Comrade Chavez in threads when that shiatbag was alive and profusely thanked him once he finally croaked to say.  He's a rich guy, he deserves to be punished for his ill-gotten wealth or at least have no right to retribution when that wealth is criminally lessened by others.  I know, you're upset probably that there's no communist-wanna-be who can come appropriate the properties and businesses of these bourgeois 1-%er bastards, but try to remember little things called property laws that these kids broke, and then bragged about.
 
2013-09-27 01:34:21 PM

meathome: super_grass: IF you're some 1%-er with a house that you don't live in all year, don't be surprised when people take advantage of the situation. Get some insurance and move on.

interesting logic.  By that same logic, the 1%-er should use his or her privilege to generate publicity to publicly shame those who have committed the wrong, and seek the assistance of the authorities (who, of course, would want to help out the 1%-er over the rest of us) in rounding up the rabble and putting them on trial in order to show the populace just who is in charge.

Am I doing it right?

BTW: read the article and look at the pics.  You're (mostly) looking at privileged kids behaving badly.  The righteous indignation doesn't work as good when the people committing the crime against a 1%-er are also "of means".

/dude seems to be damn level-headed and kind to others considering what happened
//in many regards, he seems to be more concerned about what happens to the kids involved than their own parents do


My guess (I don't follow sports or sports stars) is he grew up "without means" and had a bunch of friends who didn't make it out, and didn't want to handicap these kids in any horrible way.
 
2013-09-27 01:38:17 PM

Seraphym: super_grass: theflatline: super_grass: I get his frustration, but this is just too close to vigilanteism. They're just kids, and posting their pics online is only going to lead to harassment and mistaken identities. Combine that with the attractive nuisance and unsupervised (read: unsafe) condition of his house I'd say things are pretty damned even.

Human safety is worth more than your McMansion, I'm afraid.


So every one who has a summer house, or even leaves their house unattended can not hold anyone liable for breaking in and trashing it because no one was home at the time?

So if 300 kids pop by your house when you are out of town, destroy it, you are going to let bygones be bygones?

Plus these kids posted their own pics online, that is where he got them from.  They are the ones that put it out there.

How are these kids endangered by their pics online?  That the cops will arrest them for a crime they committed, that they themselves posted?

Guy gave them a chance to own it, even threw a big lunch and provided all the stuff necessary to clean up the joint, and only four people showed.

IF you're some 1%-er with a house that you don't live in all year, don't be surprised when people take advantage of the situation. Get some insurance and move on.

Wow, exactly what I would expect someone who actively defended Comrade Chavez in threads when that shiatbag was alive and profusely thanked him once he finally croaked to say.  He's a rich guy, he deserves to be punished for his ill-gotten wealth or at least have no right to retribution when that wealth is criminally lessened by others.  I know, you're upset probably that there's no communist-wanna-be who can come appropriate the properties and businesses of these bourgeois 1-%er bastards, but try to remember little things called property laws that these kids broke, and then bragged about.


All property is a form of theft. And you can't sue for damages to your stolen goods.
 
2013-09-27 01:38:51 PM

emocomputerjock: Slappy McLongstockings: Guadior42: What the Fark are you talking about?

For instance..the NFL and the Pink Ribbon problem. They sell the Pink Ribbon football and the Pink Ribbon people sell their Pink Ribbon logo to companies like Yoplait who makes products with chemicals known to cause breast cancers. Same with Victoria's Secret. So many of their products contain parabens.

The chemicals used in the production of NFL paraphernalia all over the world kills people while others cheer with them and they think they have a moral high ground?

I think not.

Got damn.


Even after all of the gun threads and talk about crazy people lately, that might be the first legitimate crazy person I have seen around these parts. I hope they are getting help.
 
2013-09-27 01:41:49 PM

Fubegra: groppet: I am suprised none of them came forward he gave them chances and has a crap ton of evidence. If I had done this my parents would have kicked my ass up and down the block.

Back when I was a teenager, my folks told me that if I ended up in jail, they weren't going to bail me out. Fortunately, I stayed out of jail.

WTF is it with those parents? Are they convinced that their little snowflakes would never do something like this, or are they whichactively encourages them to be asshats?


FTFY
 
2013-09-27 01:44:12 PM

super_grass: I get his frustration, but this is just too close to vigilanteism. They're just kids, and posting their pics online is only going to lead to harassment and mistaken identities. Combine that with the attractive nuisance and unsupervised (read: unsafe) condition of his house I'd say things are pretty damned even.

Human safety is worth more than your McMansion, I'm afraid.


 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Part of the problem.
 
2013-09-27 01:47:46 PM

tmonsta: TMZ is reporting that the house is in foreclosure and was abandoned at the time of party and that Holloway is making a big deal of this to solicit donations.

http://www.tmz.com/2013/09/22/brian-holloway-patriots-party-house-fo re closure-new-york/


Even in foreclosure it is somebody's property.  The owner could still be libel for unrecovered monies, the mortgage holder and even the tax payers if taxes are owed.   It is not open to destruction by a bunch of thug and thuggette wanna be douches.




Link

helpmesave300.com
helpmesave300.com
helpmesave300.com
helpmesave300.com
helpmesave300.com
helpmesave300.com
 
2013-09-27 01:50:04 PM

super_grass: theflatline: super_grass: I get his frustration, but this is just too close to vigilanteism. They're just kids, and posting their pics online is only going to lead to harassment and mistaken identities. Combine that with the attractive nuisance and unsupervised (read: unsafe) condition of his house I'd say things are pretty damned even.

Human safety is worth more than your McMansion, I'm afraid.


So every one who has a summer house, or even leaves their house unattended can not hold anyone liable for breaking in and trashing it because no one was home at the time?

So if 300 kids pop by your house when you are out of town, destroy it, you are going to let bygones be bygones?

Plus these kids posted their own pics online, that is where he got them from.  They are the ones that put it out there.

How are these kids endangered by their pics online?  That the cops will arrest them for a crime they committed, that they themselves posted?

Guy gave them a chance to own it, even threw a big lunch and provided all the stuff necessary to clean up the joint, and only four people showed.

IF you're some 1%-er with a house that you don't live in all year, don't be surprised when people take advantage of the situation. Get some insurance and move on.


The LAW was broken here. They BROKE into the man's house. They DESTROYED his property. He is in his RIGHT to protect his property and livelihood. These kids, even those ignorant of whose house it is, still BROKE THE LAW! This means there is a CONSEQUENCE to THEIR actions The idea that because someone does not use their home(s) all the time does not mean they can not charge someone for breaking and entering.

/Ignorance of the law is no excuse.
//Punishment for every kid who did not show up to help clean up.
 
2013-09-27 01:53:38 PM

umad: emocomputerjock: Slappy McLongstockings: Guadior42: What the Fark are you talking about?

For instance..the NFL and the Pink Ribbon problem. They sell the Pink Ribbon football and the Pink Ribbon people sell their Pink Ribbon logo to companies like Yoplait who makes products with chemicals known to cause breast cancers. Same with Victoria's Secret. So many of their products contain parabens.

The chemicals used in the production of NFL paraphernalia all over the world kills people while others cheer with them and they think they have a moral high ground?

I think not.

Got damn.

Even after all of the gun threads and talk about crazy people lately, that might be the first legitimate crazy person I have seen around these parts. I hope they are getting help.


I don't know about that, super_grass is certainly trying to catch up with him in that department.
 
2013-09-27 01:55:01 PM
encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com
 
2013-09-27 01:56:01 PM

super_grass: Seraphym: super_grass: theflatline: super_grass: I get his frustration, but this is just too close to vigilanteism. They're just kids, and posting their pics online is only going to lead to harassment and mistaken identities. Combine that with the attractive nuisance and unsupervised (read: unsafe) condition of his house I'd say things are pretty damned even.

Human safety is worth more than your McMansion, I'm afraid.


So every one who has a summer house, or even leaves their house unattended can not hold anyone liable for breaking in and trashing it because no one was home at the time?

So if 300 kids pop by your house when you are out of town, destroy it, you are going to let bygones be bygones?

Plus these kids posted their own pics online, that is where he got them from.  They are the ones that put it out there.

How are these kids endangered by their pics online?  That the cops will arrest them for a crime they committed, that they themselves posted?

Guy gave them a chance to own it, even threw a big lunch and provided all the stuff necessary to clean up the joint, and only four people showed.

IF you're some 1%-er with a house that you don't live in all year, don't be surprised when people take advantage of the situation. Get some insurance and move on.

Wow, exactly what I would expect someone who actively defended Comrade Chavez in threads when that shiatbag was alive and profusely thanked him once he finally croaked to say.  He's a rich guy, he deserves to be punished for his ill-gotten wealth or at least have no right to retribution when that wealth is criminally lessened by others.  I know, you're upset probably that there's no communist-wanna-be who can come appropriate the properties and businesses of these bourgeois 1-%er bastards, but try to remember little things called property laws that these kids broke, and then bragged about.

All property is a form of theft. And you can't sue for damages to your stolen goods.


You can't own property, man!
www.aarondunlap.com
 
2013-09-27 01:58:03 PM
If they sue then the little shiats will have to take the stand and try to explain what they were doing in those pics and how they came to be there. Now their name is attached to a court case as a matter of public record and anyone who googles their name can read all about it.

Not to mention thw only reason the pics were out there is because the dumbasses posted them online in the first place.
 
2013-09-27 01:59:14 PM

scubamage: super_grass: Seraphym: super_grass: theflatline: super_grass: I get his frustration, but this is just too close to vigilanteism. They're just kids, and posting their pics online is only going to lead to harassment and mistaken identities. Combine that with the attractive nuisance and unsupervised (read: unsafe) condition of his house I'd say things are pretty damned even.

Human safety is worth more than your McMansion, I'm afraid.


So every one who has a summer house, or even leaves their house unattended can not hold anyone liable for breaking in and trashing it because no one was home at the time?

So if 300 kids pop by your house when you are out of town, destroy it, you are going to let bygones be bygones?

Plus these kids posted their own pics online, that is where he got them from.  They are the ones that put it out there.

How are these kids endangered by their pics online?  That the cops will arrest them for a crime they committed, that they themselves posted?

Guy gave them a chance to own it, even threw a big lunch and provided all the stuff necessary to clean up the joint, and only four people showed.

IF you're some 1%-er with a house that you don't live in all year, don't be surprised when people take advantage of the situation. Get some insurance and move on.

Wow, exactly what I would expect someone who actively defended Comrade Chavez in threads when that shiatbag was alive and profusely thanked him once he finally croaked to say.  He's a rich guy, he deserves to be punished for his ill-gotten wealth or at least have no right to retribution when that wealth is criminally lessened by others.  I know, you're upset probably that there's no communist-wanna-be who can come appropriate the properties and businesses of these bourgeois 1-%er bastards, but try to remember little things called property laws that these kids broke, and then bragged about.

All property is a form of theft. And you can't sue for damages to your stolen goods.

You can't own property, man.


I'll go get some more bricks.
 
2013-09-27 02:11:31 PM

super_grass: All property is a form of theft. And you can't sue for damages to your stolen goods.


What color is the sky in your world?
 
2013-09-27 02:12:13 PM

Headso: Lost Thought 00: freak7: Chances are, most of the parents don't even know their kids were at the party.

They are minors (I assume) under their care and supervision. Lack of knowledge is not an excuse, because it is their job and responsibility to account for the whereabouts of their children at all times.

should all parents put a tracking device on their teenagers or suffer the consequences of their 16 and 17 year old's actions? Kids lie about where they are going to be, a parent could make every attempt to know their kids whereabouts be satisfied that they do and still their kid went to this party.


No.  But all parents should raise their kids with some basic concepts of decency so when their friend says, "Hey, we're gonna go to some party Seth's throwing in some house he broke into and trash the place!" their children say no.  This is not that hard a concept.
 
2013-09-27 02:13:15 PM

Xhan: My lack of sympathy for them is compounded by the multiple instances of duckface and seeing "shiat was live" so many times in the screenshots. Seriously, who says that? Am I just getting old?


Gad I wasn't the only one that wanted to see them punished just for the excessive use of 'Live'. Ive never heard that one before and by the end of the save300 site I was sick of it.
 
2013-09-27 02:14:11 PM
hasty ambush: tmonsta: TMZ is reporting that the house is in foreclosure and was abandoned at the time of party and that Holloway is making a big deal of this to solicit donations.

http://www.tmz.com/2013/09/22/brian-holloway-patriots-party-house-fo re closure-new-york/

Even in foreclosure it is somebody's property.  The owner could still be libel for unrecovered monies, the mortgage holder and even the tax payers if taxes are owed.   It is not open to destruction by a bunch of thug and thuggette wanna be douches.

I am not defending the kids actions, I just think it is another one of the situations where everyone involved is a colossal douche-bag. In the late nineties Brian Holloway broke into the same house and wrecked it to drive out his soon-to-be ex-wife.

http://www.nytimes.com/1997/06/01/sports/one-more-athlete-s-wife-pic ks -up-the-pieces-of-her-life.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm
 
2013-09-27 02:14:43 PM

maxximillian: Xhan: My lack of sympathy for them is compounded by the multiple instances of duckface and seeing "shiat was live" so many times in the screenshots. Seriously, who says that? Am I just getting old?

Gad I wasn't the only one that wanted to see them punished just for the excessive use of 'Live'. Ive never heard that one before and by the end of the save300 site I was sick of it.


Forget about the damages. Those douchebag photos should be made illegal.
 
2013-09-27 02:15:07 PM

trappedspirit: MadMattressMack: trappedspirit: Pocket Ninja: He needs to expand his website to start publicly shaming the worthless enablers those kids have as parents as well.

What did the parents do again?

Enabled their children. Parents can be held liable and he can sue them for damages if he can prove their snow flake was the one that did the damage. So the ones who took picks of them breaking stuff or spray painted their name are really in trouble.

What did they do to enable this?  That's what I am asking.


In many states, including Virginia where I live, it's called contributing to the delinquency.  It's basically, you're such a shiatty parent that you've allowed your son/daughter to commit crimes, and you'll be held liable. 
You have a responsibility to know where your minor is, what he/she is doing and if you can't do that, the state will find you liable for their actions.

Simple.  You've enabled their shiatty behavior by not being a good parent.
 
2013-09-27 02:28:24 PM

Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Headso: I read some of the tweets from the website the guy put up, the funny thing is it sounded like some of the kids didn't even know the party was being held in a house that was broken into to. Saying stuff like "thanks to the hosts, this was a great party"

Did you see the pictures of the house? Graffiti everywhere, lots of damage, and the $20k estimate does not include contents. Anyone there had to have known something was not right.

No not really. Spray cans could have come out at any time during the night.

Just a word of advice: If you are either so myopic or gullible as to believe the kids at the party "totally thought everything was cool" then you might want to shut down your email accounts before you get any messages from Nigerian prices needing needing your assistance.

What, never went to a party where you didn't know the homeowner?


Of course, but not knowing the homeowner isn't the problem. No adult presence is the first clue. If you show up at a party, in a nice house, with 100+ people (all between 14 and 20) but no adults, you're damn right you should be suspicious. And I am speaking from experience on this.


Which do you think is more likely, a conspiracy of 300 teenagers who picked out a house and planned a party and maintained perfect secrecy up until the moment the party started and then as a group went immediately full retard and posted pics everywhere -or- a grouop of 8 or so teenagers who planned a party and broke the locks plus 292 teenagers who got a text saying "my c-razy uncle says we got the house for this weekend! Tell all your friends!"

You don't need to be part of the "planning committee" to be responsible for what happens. If you are involved in an activity that you know, or reasonably should know, is illegal you are responsible and I contend that given the damage that occurred and the circumstances of the party, the vast majority of people in attendance must have known that something was not right.

As posting pictures you seem to see this as an indication that the people there did not know they were doing anything wrong. I hate to point it out to you, but YouTube, Twitter, and Facebook are filled with idiots who post illegal stuff and are simply shocked when their posts are entered as evidence against them.
 
2013-09-27 02:32:25 PM
Well at the very least this thread sorted out the people that can face up to the damages they cause support certain things...and the ones too afraid to.

Fortunately you can just remove people that don't care to even try and imagine the rivers of chemical waste they help cause with their rampant consumerism...eventually you may be left with a handful of people willing to at least tackle the issue.
 
2013-09-27 02:38:08 PM

Matthew Keene: Slappy McLongstockings: http://www.pinkribbon.org/ThinkPink/CaseStudiesofCauseMarketing.aspx

and for once..try and think for yourself....

Where are the campaigns for testicular cancer? This pink ribbon shiat is discriminatory. I say 'Brownish-Yellow Ribbons for Testicular Cancer!'


Personally I would find the diagnosis of most of the people here simply to be justice and would appreciate the pain they will feel since they care not for the pain they cause others so they can play a game and wave around plastic pom poms.
 
2013-09-27 02:39:35 PM

Tyrosine: Of course, but not knowing the homeowner isn't the problem. No adult presence is the first clue. If you show up at a party, in a nice house, with 100+ people (all between 14 and 20) but no adults, you're damn right you should be suspicious. And I am speaking from experience on this.


What the hell are you talking about?  This was a high school party.  They should be suspicious if there were adults present, not the other way around.  Adults and high school keggers tend not to mix. That's why they are held when parents go out of town.
 
2013-09-27 02:45:05 PM

meathome: Headso: should all parents put a tracking device on their teenagers or suffer the consequences of their 16 and 17 year old's actions? Kids lie about where they are going to be, a parent could make every attempt to know their kids whereabouts be satisfied that they do and still their kid went to this party.

That's great and all, but the parents are still responsible for the consequences.  The idea is to make sure that parents do more than the bare minimum in raising their kids, and for everyone to know that the old "kids will be kids" response doesn't cut it when a law is broken.

I think a citation is in order.  Since this occurred in NY, then NY Penal Law 260.10(2) is probably what they'd use to hold the parents accountable (since that is what it was written for).

Personally, I have to applaud Holloway for showing such restraint and decorum considering the circumstances.  My younger brother threw a party at my parents' house where things got out of hand.  While my brother got the brunt of their wrath (and rightfully so), the manner in which my parents immediately dealt with the rest of the kids was neigh close to a war crime.  Their response to the parents was "either you deal with them or we do".  The other parents washed their hands and let mine have at it.

On the up side, I didn't have to do any real yard work, maintenance, etc. for my parents for about a year.

/when my younger brother screws up, he does so in near Spielburgian fashion


Do tell what your parents did to the other kids. Sounds interesting.
 
2013-09-27 02:46:48 PM

super_grass: All property is a form of theft. And you can't sue for damages to your stolen goods.


From the dictionary:   property is that which is had by or belongs to/with something, whether as an attribute or a component.

And it turns out that NY Penal Code 145.0 says that you can sue for damages to it.

/obvious troll is obvious
 
2013-09-27 02:49:41 PM
Out of curiosity if they took the pictures themselves couldn't they get him for copyright infringement?

/These kids should DIAF.
 
2013-09-27 02:50:46 PM

Tyrosine: Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Headso: I read some of the tweets from the website the guy put up, the funny thing is it sounded like some of the kids didn't even know the party was being held in a house that was broken into to. Saying stuff like "thanks to the hosts, this was a great party"

Did you see the pictures of the house? Graffiti everywhere, lots of damage, and the $20k estimate does not include contents. Anyone there had to have known something was not right.

No not really. Spray cans could have come out at any time during the night.

Just a word of advice: If you are either so myopic or gullible as to believe the kids at the party "totally thought everything was cool" then you might want to shut down your email accounts before you get any messages from Nigerian prices needing needing your assistance.

What, never went to a party where you didn't know the homeowner?

Of course, but not knowing the homeowner isn't the problem. No adult presence is the first clue. If you show up at a party, in a nice house, with 100+ people (all between 14 and 20) but no adults, you're damn right you should be suspicious. And I am speaking from experience on this.


Which do you think is more likely, a conspiracy of 300 teenagers who picked out a house and planned a party and maintained perfect secrecy up until the moment the party started and then as a group went immediately full retard and posted pics everywhere -or- a grouop of 8 or so teenagers who planned a party and broke the locks plus 292 teenagers who got a text saying "my c-razy uncle says we got the house for this weekend! Tell all your friends!"

You don't need to be part of the "planning committee" to be responsible for what happens. If you are involved in an activity that you know, or reasonably should know, is illegal you are responsible and I contend that given the damage that occurred and the circumstances of the party, the vast majority of people in attendance must have known that something was ...


We had this discussion the last time this story made the rounds. in NY you have to KNOW you are Trespassing for it to be so. So if the kid who knew Holloway who supposedly cooked up this party told people it was his place or whatever then they did not knowingly trespass and as such rightfully believed they were invited on to the property. I don't know about you but I cannot recall any party in HS which i attended where parents were in attendance especially when kegs were involved.

So it is entirely possible that some of the kids who are in these photos did not know they were in the home illegally, also unless there are timestamps on the photos showing kid A at the party when things were being destroyed etc they have no responsibility in my mind for any of the damage that occurred in that home. Especially if they believed that someone who owned or lived in the house was there. How many kids who have thrown parties while their folks were away trashed their own homes or let other people do it. I have seen it first hand so it wouldn't be completely crazy to see at a huge party. This is why kids call the cops on their own parties all the time. They cant control the scene so they call the cops to clear everyone out.

I went to a lot of parties in HS, many times not knowing the owner etc. If something was broken in the house does that automatically make me or anyone else there responsible ? I don't think so. It makes whoever broke it responsible.

So I can see how some parents wouldn't want their kids named dragged through the mud simply because they showed up at a party that got out of hand. The kids could have been completely oblivious to the fact that their hosts broke in to the home.
 
2013-09-27 02:51:37 PM

Warlordtrooper: Out of curiosity if they took the pictures themselves couldn't they get him for copyright infringement?

/These kids should DIAF.


They wouldn't have standing - facebook owns those images, likewise, so does twitter. At least according to their EULAs.
 
2013-09-27 02:58:25 PM

tmonsta: In the late nineties Brian Holloway broke into the same house and wrecked it to drive out his soon-to-be ex-wife.


How is that germane?  Exactly who is on trial here?  What Brian Holloway did 15 years ago really has no bearing on what these kids did 1 month ago.  And by the way, when he broke into that same house who was the owner of record?  How does one break into their own property?

When I was 11 I was caught shoplifting a pack of gum from a convenience store.  So if some thug sets my car on fire tomorrow I guess that means I can't pursue them legally?  After all, I did commit an offense.

/ I'm also guilty of bending my library card in half and sharpening pencils on both ends.  Fortunately I was never caught for those heinous acts.
 
2013-09-27 03:02:05 PM

farm machine: sharpening pencils on both ends.


You should have been expelled from school and sent to a a gulag for that act of terrorism.
 
2013-09-27 03:04:19 PM

scubamage: Warlordtrooper: Out of curiosity if they took the pictures themselves couldn't they get him for copyright infringement?

/These kids should DIAF.

They wouldn't have standing - facebook owns those images, likewise, so does twitter. At least according to their EULAs.


But copyright is assigned the moment the image is taken.
 
2013-09-27 03:04:27 PM
Here's someone who understands that sometimes teenagers do very stupid things and he chose not to ruin their life over it.  He gave them every opportunity to make amend and the result is a threatened lawsuit and just one kid who stepped forward because he knew he had farked up.  Yeah, release the kraken.

I agree, massive public shaming starting with the parents.  Fark 'em all up the pooper.
 
2013-09-27 03:05:48 PM

scubamage: Warlordtrooper: Out of curiosity if they took the pictures themselves couldn't they get him for copyright infringement?

/These kids should DIAF.

They wouldn't have standing - facebook owns those images, likewise, so does twitter. At least according to their EULAs.


Wow, the clueless remain clueless.  People have been convicted of and had their facebook and myspace, twitter, blog posts, used in courts for at least the last five years.

Has nothing to do with ownership of the images on whether or not they can be used in court, a quick subpoena and they magically are in court.
 
2013-09-27 03:08:21 PM

theflatline: scubamage: Warlordtrooper: Out of curiosity if they took the pictures themselves couldn't they get him for copyright infringement?

/These kids should DIAF.

They wouldn't have standing - facebook owns those images, likewise, so does twitter. At least according to their EULAs.

Wow, the clueless remain clueless.  People have been convicted of and had their facebook and myspace, twitter, blog posts, used in courts for at least the last five years.

Has nothing to do with ownership of the images on whether or not they can be used in court, a quick subpoena and they magically are in court.


I wasn't implying that their use in court as evidence would be invalid but rather that the guys use of them on his website he set up violated copyright law just as it would If I put up movies or pictures on my own website when I don't own the copyright.  I'm not going to defend these asshats just thinking about an odd legal situation.
 
2013-09-27 03:16:33 PM

Slappy McLongstockings: Matthew Keene: Slappy McLongstockings: 
Where are the campaigns for testicular cancer? This pink ribbon shiat is discriminatory. I say 'Brownish-Yellow Ribbons for Testicular Cancer!'

Personally I would find the diagnosis of most of the people here simply to be justice and would appreciate the pain they will feel since they care not for the pain they cause others so they can play a game and wave around plastic pom poms.


Wow, do you go to church here?

elizabethgrattan.com

Either you're trolling, or you really need to get some help. I'm not saying that in a condescending way, but as someone who is able to recognize that thinking along these lines is a sign of a serious problem/s that need to be addressed. Please, this isn't an attempt to come down on you. Please give these people a call and see if they can help you:

http://www.nami.org/Content/ContentGroups/Helpline1/Mental_Health_Pr of essionals_Who_They_Are_and_How_to_Find_One.htm
 
2013-09-27 03:16:46 PM

tmonsta: hasty ambush: tmonsta: TMZ is reporting that the house is in foreclosure and was abandoned at the time of party and that Holloway is making a big deal of this to solicit donations.

http://www.tmz.com/2013/09/22/brian-holloway-patriots-party-house-fo re closure-new-york/

Even in foreclosure it is somebody's property.  The owner could still be libel for unrecovered monies, the mortgage holder and even the tax payers if taxes are owed.   It is not open to destruction by a bunch of thug and thuggette wanna be douches.

I am not defending the kids actions, I just think it is another one of the situations where everyone involved is a colossal douche-bag. In the late nineties Brian Holloway broke into the same house and wrecked it to drive out his soon-to-be ex-wife.

http://www.nytimes.com/1997/06/01/sports/one-more-athlete-s-wife-pic ks -up-the-pieces-of-her-life.html?pagewanted=all&src=pm


If you own the house and everything in it, as he did according to the article, he's not really breaking in.  He was violating a restraining order, but all the things he took were his to take.  It's a dickish move - something that often happens in nasty divorce cases - but it's in no way the same as teenagers breaking into a strangers house and having a party.
 
2013-09-27 03:30:21 PM

yves0010: super_grass: theflatline: super_grass: I get his frustration, but this is just too close to vigilanteism. They're just kids, and posting their pics online is only going to lead to harassment and mistaken identities. Combine that with the attractive nuisance and unsupervised (read: unsafe) condition of his house I'd say things are pretty damned even.

Human safety is worth more than your McMansion, I'm afraid.


So every one who has a summer house, or even leaves their house unattended can not hold anyone liable for breaking in and trashing it because no one was home at the time?

So if 300 kids pop by your house when you are out of town, destroy it, you are going to let bygones be bygones?

Plus these kids posted their own pics online, that is where he got them from.  They are the ones that put it out there.

How are these kids endangered by their pics online?  That the cops will arrest them for a crime they committed, that they themselves posted?

Guy gave them a chance to own it, even threw a big lunch and provided all the stuff necessary to clean up the joint, and only four people showed.

IF you're some 1%-er with a house that you don't live in all year, don't be surprised when people take advantage of the situation. Get some insurance and move on.

The LAW was broken here. They BROKE into the man's house. They DESTROYED his property. He is in his RIGHT to protect his property and livelihood. These kids, even those ignorant of whose house it is, still BROKE THE LAW! This means there is a CONSEQUENCE to THEIR actions The idea that because someone does not use their home(s) all the time does not mean they can not charge someone for breaking and entering.

/Ignorance of the law is no excuse.
//Punishment for every kid who did not show up to help clean up.


Ignorance actually is an excuse for trespassing. Sorry to bust your jailboner.
 
2013-09-27 03:36:39 PM

Tyrosine: Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Headso: I read some of the tweets from the website the guy put up, the funny thing is it sounded like some of the kids didn't even know the party was being held in a house that was broken into to. Saying stuff like "thanks to the hosts, this was a great party"

Did you see the pictures of the house? Graffiti everywhere, lots of damage, and the $20k estimate does not include contents. Anyone there had to have known something was not right.

No not really. Spray cans could have come out at any time during the night.

Just a word of advice: If you are either so myopic or gullible as to believe the kids at the party "totally thought everything was cool" then you might want to shut down your email accounts before you get any messages from Nigerian prices needing needing your assistance.

What, never went to a party where you didn't know the homeowner?

Of course, but not knowing the homeowner isn't the problem. No adult presence is the first clue. If you show up at a party, in a nice house, with 100+ people (all between 14 and 20) but no adults, you're damn right you should be suspicious. And I am speaking from experience on this.


Which do you think is more likely, a conspiracy of 300 teenagers who picked out a house and planned a party and maintained perfect secrecy up until the moment the party started and then as a group went immediately full retard and posted pics everywhere -or- a grouop of 8 or so teenagers who planned a party and broke the locks plus 292 teenagers who got a text saying "my c-razy uncle says we got the house for this weekend! Tell all your friends!"

You don't need to be part of the "planning committee" to be responsible for what happens. If you are involved in an activity that you know, or reasonably should know, is illegal you are responsible and I contend that given the damage that occurred and the circumstances of the party, the vast majority of people in attendance must have known that something was not right.

As posting pictures you seem to see this as an indication that the people there did not know they were doing anything wrong. I hate to point it out to you, but YouTube, Twitter, and Facebook are filled with idiots who post illegal stuff and are simply shocked when their posts are entered as evidence against them.


I don't question that people post photos of themselves doing illegal shiat online. I question the narrative where its asserted that there's a lot of overlap between pros who do so and people who can keep a conspiracy involving 300 people quiet.
 
2013-09-27 03:36:44 PM

Warlordtrooper: Out of curiosity if they took the pictures themselves couldn't they get him for copyright infringement?

/These kids should DIAF.


Them pictures is mines!
 
2013-09-27 03:38:32 PM

Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Headso: I read some of the tweets from the website the guy put up, the funny thing is it sounded like some of the kids didn't even know the party was being held in a house that was broken into to. Saying stuff like "thanks to the hosts, this was a great party"

Did you see the pictures of the house? Graffiti everywhere, lots of damage, and the $20k estimate does not include contents. Anyone there had to have known something was not right.

No not really. Spray cans could have come out at any time during the night.

Just a word of advice: If you are either so myopic or gullible as to believe the kids at the party "totally thought everything was cool" then you might want to shut down your email accounts before you get any messages from Nigerian prices needing needing your assistance.

What, never went to a party where you didn't know the homeowner?

Of course, but not knowing the homeowner isn't the problem. No adult presence is the first clue. If you show up at a party, in a nice house, with 100+ people (all between 14 and 20) but no adults, you're damn right you should be suspicious. And I am speaking from experience on this.


Which do you think is more likely, a conspiracy of 300 teenagers who picked out a house and planned a party and maintained perfect secrecy up until the moment the party started and then as a group went immediately full retard and posted pics everywhere -or- a grouop of 8 or so teenagers who planned a party and broke the locks plus 292 teenagers who got a text saying "my c-razy uncle says we got the house for this weekend! Tell all your friends!"

You don't need to be part of the "planning committee" to be responsible for what happens. If you are involved in an activity that you know, or reasonably should know, is illegal you are responsible and I contend that given the damage that occurred and the circumstances of the party, the vast majority of people in attendance must have known that something was not right.

As posting pictures you seem to see this as an indication that the people there did not know they were doing anything wrong. I hate to point it out to you, but YouTube, Twitter, and Facebook are filled with idiots who post illegal stuff and are simply shocked when their posts are entered as evidence against them.

I don't question that people post photos of themselves doing illegal shiat online. I question the narrative where its asserted that there's a lot of overlap between pros who do so and people who can keep a conspiracy involving 300 people quiet.


People who do so*.

Obviously. Outing yourself on facespace is non professional.
 
2013-09-27 03:39:02 PM
Let the prosecuter handle this >>>>


State
Cite

Crime
Elements
Prison
Fine

VT
http://www.leg.state.vt.us/statutes/fullchapter.cfm?Title=13&Chapter =0 23" target="_top">13 Sec. 1201
Burglary
Enters any building knowing that he is not licensed or privileged to do so, with the intent to commit a felony, petit larceny, simple assault, or unlawful mischief or enters a building lawfully with the intent to commit such crimes, and surreptitiously remains in the building after his right to do so ends, or after the premises are no longer open to the public.
15 years (25 years if an occupied dwelling)
Up to $1,000
 
2013-09-27 03:43:50 PM

Anschauer: Let the prosecuter handle this >>>>


State
Cite
Crime
Elements
Prison
Fine
VT
http://www.leg.state.vt.us/statutes/fullchapter.cfm?Title=13&Chapter =0 23" target="_top">13 Sec. 1201
Burglary
Enters any building knowing that he is not licensed or privileged to do so, with the intent to commit a felony, petit larceny, simple assault, or unlawful mischief or enters a building lawfully with the intent to commit such crimes, and surreptitiously remains in the building after his right to do so ends, or after the premises are no longer open to the public.
15 years (25 years if an occupied dwelling)
Up to $1,000


What does Vermont have to do with this story ? It took place in NY
 
2013-09-27 03:47:33 PM

Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Ned Stark: Tyrosine: Headso: I read some of the tweets from the website the guy put up, the funny thing is it sounded like some of the kids didn't even know the party was being held in a house that was broken into to. Saying stuff like "thanks to the hosts, this was a great party"

Did you see the pictures of the house? Graffiti everywhere, lots of damage, and the $20k estimate does not include contents. Anyone there had to have known something was not right.

No not really. Spray cans could have come out at any time during the night.

Just a word of advice: If you are either so myopic or gullible as to believe the kids at the party "totally thought everything was cool" then you might want to shut down your email accounts before you get any messages from Nigerian prices needing needing your assistance.

What, never went to a party where you didn't know the homeowner?

Which do you think is more likely, a conspiracy of 300 teenagers who picked out a house and planned a party and maintained perfect secrecy up until the moment the party started and then as a group went immediately full retard and posted pics everywhere -or- a grouop of 8 or so teenagers who planned a party and broke the locks plus 292 teenagers who got a text saying "my c-razy uncle says we got the house for this weekend! Tell all your friends!"


My uncles did that.

Planned it out ahead of time, got the parents a hotel room for the weekend, had the party, had 200 people show up (Quadruple lot house, but still) because my Uncle Moose knows EVERYBODY and invited EVERYBODY without telling his older brothers who were organizing it, did the cleanup, brought the parents home.

It's not unbelievable that the relatives might have said "Have fun".  Unlikely, yes, unbelievable, no.  Especially if the damage happened as the party was winding down and most of the guests had left (And I've been paying negative attention to this story, so I don't know if that's the case).
 
2013-09-27 03:47:37 PM

Ned Stark: Ignorance actually is an excuse for trespassing. Sorry to bust your jailboner.


Misapplied. Tresspassing requires intent. If a person didn't know they were on private property, they couldn't form the intent to trespass on it.
The ignorance wasn't of the law, rather it was ignorance of the status fo the property they were on.
 
2013-09-27 03:56:33 PM
I am all in favor of going after the kids criminally.  The problem lies in the fact of proving who caused the damage to charge them.  Attending a party is not illegal.  Attending a party where vandalism occurred is not illegal. You have to have people at the party with evidence they committed the harmful acts (graffiti, damaging walls, floors, etc.).   I am sure there are some who are on camera doing this behavior or some who admitted to doing these acts on social media.  These you can easily charge and hold accountable.  However the vast majority who attended probably will escape justice beyond the public shaming simply because you can't prove that they caused the damage to the house. Unless you come up with some conspiracy charge or some other creative attempt in order to get many to plead to something lesser or testify against the ones responsible for most of the damage.
 
2013-09-27 03:59:04 PM
And yes, there is potentially trespassing for everyone.  Burglary would be difficult unless you can show clear intent to do some other offense in the residence.  Of course does the local prosecutor want to spend the next several months sorting through hundreds of cases against these kids for relatively minor offenses that will clog the court system and ultimately result little if any punishment.
 
2013-09-27 04:06:16 PM
Apparently, NFL guy's home has been in foreclosure for a while, and was in such disrepair that neighbors thought it had been abandoned.  Even more interesting, they are saying teens have been routinely having parties there for quite some time, and one of the kids that organized it may have been squatting there.
 
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