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(Fox News)   Head of a California youth football league receives hate mail because he supports the league's mercy rule that reprimands coaches who run the score up by more than 35 points on opponents   (foxnews.com) divider line 60
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611 clicks; posted to Sports » on 25 Sep 2013 at 4:50 PM (48 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-25 04:02:50 PM
Does he endorse handing out participation ribbons?
 
2013-09-25 04:11:28 PM
California has a program that punishes successful coaches?

Thats kinda farked up
 
2013-09-25 04:18:35 PM

basemetal: Does he endorse handing out participation ribbons?


It's not like they're not keeping score at all like a local church league does for basketball (Upward) they dont keep score at all till the kids are in the 9-10 year old range.
There's reason for a football game involving 6 year old to end with a score of 72 to 0, folks who get to wound up in that are likely trying to live vicariously through their kids.
JV, Varsity? I got no problem with it but for kids just learning the game there is no need to demoralize the other kids other than the coach has a small penis and imagines himself to be Bill Belichek
 
2013-09-25 04:20:17 PM

cman: California has a program that punishes successful coaches?

Thats kinda farked up


California has a program that punishes coaches for shiatting on 9-10 year olds. Unless you think demolishing other teams is the ONLY lesson that should be taught to kids that age.

Kids are dropping out of leagues in droves. This is a way to keep that from happening. There are probably some better ways, but if you think a coach is "successful" with kids that age, you might want to reconsider your priorities.
 
2013-09-25 04:56:15 PM
What about making 35 points a skunk? Once one team is winning by 35, the game is over. It will reduce chance for injuries. And the coach cant run up the score.
 
2013-09-25 04:57:04 PM
The main problem is people still pretending that sports teach positive life lessons.

Other than by negative example.
 
2013-09-25 04:59:17 PM
I can't believe there are still parents who let their kids play. all the "heads up" logos in the world will not change physics. Repeated violent impacts will turn your brain to mush.
 
2013-09-25 04:59:21 PM
The problem with the rule as implemented, is that there's a difference between intentionally running up the score and simply scoring a lot of points.  In the current case, it means a team could be punished if a kid runs back a pick-6, or a kickoff or punt for a touchdown, or if the opposing team simply can't tackle.  If they use a hard 35 point rule, what if you go over 35 points by getting a safety because the opposing team fumbles out of their own endzone?
   If a coach tells his players to intentionally not go 100% because they are winning by that much, someone is going to get hurt.
   What they should do instead is just move the game to a running lock after one team is up by 21 or 28 points, and then if the game gets within 7-10 points again, switch back to a standard clock.
 
2013-09-25 05:00:52 PM

mediablitz: cman: California has a program that punishes successful coaches?

Thats kinda farked up

California has a program that punishes coaches for shiatting on 9-10 year olds. Unless you think demolishing other teams is the ONLY lesson that should be taught to kids that age.

Kids are dropping out of leagues in droves. This is a way to keep that from happening. There are probably some better ways, but if you think a coach is "successful" with kids that age, you might want to reconsider your priorities.


No... kids aren't dropping out of football because they are getting beat by more than 35 points. They are dropping out of football because their parents don't want to have pudding for brains by the time they are in their mid 30s.

I don't think kids should play tackle football until they are 12. Play flag football and you can teach the game without worrying about them getting their head taken off.

I say this as a former player, high school football coach and having had several concussions. I had post concussion syndrome for several years after I stopped playing. Random migraine headaches and mood swings aren't/weren't fun.
 
2013-09-25 05:07:20 PM

The Muthaship: The main problem is people still pretending that sports teach positive life lessons.

Other than by negative example.


They do teach positive life lessons. Sports teach you how to work with others. They teach you how to handle yourself when you win and how to handle yourself when you lose. Sports teaches you true life lessons, such as some times no matter how hard you work, you don't win.

You learn more about yourself as a person during adversity than you do prosperity.
 
2013-09-25 05:08:36 PM

JSam21: The Muthaship: The main problem is people still pretending that sports teach positive life lessons.

Other than by negative example.

They do teach positive life lessons. Sports teach you how to work with others. They teach you how to handle yourself when you win and how to handle yourself when you lose. Sports teaches you true life lessons, such as some times no matter how hard you work, you don't win.

You learn more about yourself as a person during adversity than you do prosperity.


We much watch different sports...
 
2013-09-25 05:09:13 PM
I think we're all forgetting the real victim in this scandal...

Me.

How am I supposed to convince people to drop a dime on the Anderson/Central Valley clash if they know the spread is only double-digits? This commish is RUINING my business!
 
2013-09-25 05:10:29 PM
They have to play the full game, right? As a player, wouldn't you be demoralized if the game was called because you fell behind by 7 touchdowns?

So... a skunk doesn't work, but how about not allowing points to be added if the score is greater than "X" over the other team's score? Make it 4 touchdowns... 28 points. If you go ahead by more than that, the points don't count.

It gives the other team a chance to catch up, the winning team still has reason to play (maintain possession and cut down the other team's chances of catching up), and both teams can walk off the field feeling good about putting in a full effort.

Seems like a better solution than forcing a coach to "slack off" in a game, or calling a skunk (which has much the same effect on the losing players' morale as running up a score).
 
2013-09-25 05:13:09 PM

The Muthaship: JSam21: The Muthaship: The main problem is people still pretending that sports teach positive life lessons.

Other than by negative example.

They do teach positive life lessons. Sports teach you how to work with others. They teach you how to handle yourself when you win and how to handle yourself when you lose. Sports teaches you true life lessons, such as some times no matter how hard you work, you don't win.

You learn more about yourself as a person during adversity than you do prosperity.

We much watch different sports...


Ok... so tell me what you think about sports. And I'm not talking on the professional or college level.
 
2013-09-25 05:17:59 PM

JSam21: tell me what you think about sports.


I don't have the energy for a full tirade.

But, by and large, they're ruined by ill-motivated coaches and jackass parents, incompetent league management and officials and generally not worth the time they take away for other pursuits better designed to teach the lessons that sports are constantly hyped as teachers of.  Just my opinion.  I played tons of sports and I have 3 kids that play sports.  But, I find them generally a net negative.


/there are rare exceptions
 
2013-09-25 05:22:09 PM

basemetal: Does he endorse handing out participation ribbons?


cman: California has a program that punishes successful coaches?

Thats kinda farked up


Really? You're biatching about this being a rule in pee-wee football???

I mean, I can understand it being a bit ridiculous at the college level (or even high school) but kids? Come on.

/personally thinks running up the score is a petty and classless move
//unless it's a major rivalry game, then all bets are off
 
2013-09-25 05:24:39 PM

NuttierThanEver: basemetal: Does he endorse handing out participation ribbons?

It's not like they're not keeping score at all like a local church league does for basketball (Upward) they dont keep score at all till the kids are in the 9-10 year old range.
There's reason for a football game involving 6 year old to end with a score of 72 to 0, folks who get to wound up in that are likely trying to live vicariously through their kids.
JV, Varsity? I got no problem with it but for kids just learning the game there is no need to demoralize the other kids other than the coach has a small penis and imagines himself to be Bill Belichek


Oh hell, six year olds?  Yeah, they need a run rule.

/and 6 year olds to about ten should be playing some kind of flag football
 
2013-09-25 05:26:54 PM
I totally lost my faith in the normal mental-well-being of most parents when my kids youth soccer.  Some people just have issues.  They really need to have leagues where parents/coaches can't assemble teams to just demolish the other kids.
 
2013-09-25 05:30:07 PM

Rising_Zan_Samurai_Gunman: The problem with the rule as implemented, is that there's a difference between intentionally running up the score and simply scoring a lot of points.  In the current case, it means a team could be punished if a kid runs back a pick-6, or a kickoff or punt for a touchdown, or if the opposing team simply can't tackle.  If they use a hard 35 point rule, what if you go over 35 points by getting a safety because the opposing team fumbles out of their own endzone?
   If a coach tells his players to intentionally not go 100% because they are winning by that much, someone is going to get hurt.
   What they should do instead is just move the game to a running lock after one team is up by 21 or 28 points, and then if the game gets within 7-10 points again, switch back to a standard clock.


Go 24 points up, and punt every possession and let your second string practice defence. Wow, that was totally hard. Have you had a concussion?
 
2013-09-25 05:33:45 PM

basemetal: Does he endorse handing out participation ribbons?


cman: California has a program that punishes successful coaches?

Thats kinda farked up


Has nothing to do with it.  Pop Warner (or at least OECPW) has had rules like this since I played in the 80s.  Win by more than 35 points and the coach is suspended for the next game.  That's 25 years ago.  Youth football is for youths.  Humiliation and losing are different things.  One teaches character, and one makes you want to quit entirely.
 
2013-09-25 05:34:19 PM

karmaceutical: I totally lost my faith in the normal mental-well-being of most parents when my kids youth soccer.  Some people just have issues.  They really need to have leagues where parents/coaches can't assemble teams to just demolish the other kids.


How is that different then college sports where teams in the SEC schedule games against teams that they have spreads of 50plus points against

/fully agree that parents should be banned from having input into child sports leagues
 
2013-09-25 05:35:15 PM
The flag football league my oldest used to play in had a mercy rule (that was on the books but ignored by everyone) enforced after a helicopter parent biatched incessantly in the 9-11 age group.  They had to stop keeping score and turned off the boards after a 28 or 35 point lead was established.  Our team sucked badly so about half our games went mercy rule.

You know who hated that the most?  Our kids.  4th quarter the other teams subbed out their best couple of kids so "everyone got to play" and our kids would eventually score.  They were pissed when their points didn't go on the board.  They felt gypped, and I couldn't blame them.  Even if it's 99-0 every kid wants to see that 7 go on the board, especially if it was theirs.
 
2013-09-25 05:35:37 PM
They should do the same thing in soccer.  If you're up 3 - 0, you're just rubbing their faces in it.
 
2013-09-25 05:36:46 PM

The Muthaship: The main problem is people still pretending that sports teach positive life lessons.

Other than by negative example.


i simply can't believe this got any bites let alone a drawn out argument.


The Muthaship: I don't have the energy for a full tirade....  I played tons of sports and I have 3 kids that play sports.  But, I find them generally a net negative.


and then this got included, so there's that...
 
2013-09-25 05:36:59 PM

The Muthaship: JSam21: tell me what you think about sports.

I don't have the energy for a full tirade.

But, by and large, they're ruined by ill-motivated coaches and jackass parents, incompetent league management and officials and generally not worth the time they take away for other pursuits better designed to teach the lessons that sports are constantly hyped as teachers of.  Just my opinion.  I played tons of sports and I have 3 kids that play sports.  But, I find them generally a net negative.


/there are rare exceptions


I agree with you on the fact that there is a lot of parasitic elements in youth sports. Most of them have to due with money. Parents spending the equivalent of the money that they think they will save on college to get their kids private coaching/training so that they will get scholarships.

The club or "select" level of sports is what is killing youth sports. People that run programs to make money are killing youth sports.The bad coaches are killing youth sports. Mostly it is the bad parents that are ruining sports for the kids. I don't blame the game officials since most of them are kids themselves.

I think you and I have more in common than you think. I currently coach high school baseball and I would never coach any of my child's teams. Why you ask? 1) Because I know I'm not wired to coach kids under the age of 14. 2) Because I'd rather sit in the stands and enjoy watching them play the game and have fun. If I'm coaching I wouldn't be able to fully enjoy that. 3) I don't like to dwell on what could have been done differently with my kid's team and if I coached that's all I would do. 4) I can't have a beer while coaching.

Will I "force" my kids to play sports? Yep, for one year. It is then up to them if they want to keep playing after that.
 
2013-09-25 05:38:47 PM
Why would you make little kids play football? They can barely understand that only the goalie can pick up the ball while playing soccer.
 
2013-09-25 05:39:45 PM

dentalhilljack: The flag football league my oldest used to play in had a mercy rule (that was on the books but ignored by everyone) enforced after a helicopter parent biatched incessantly in the 9-11 age group.  They had to stop keeping score and turned off the boards after a 28 or 35 point lead was established.  Our team sucked badly so about half our games went mercy rule.

You know who hated that the most?  Our kids.  4th quarter the other teams subbed out their best couple of kids so "everyone got to play" and our kids would eventually score.  They were pissed when their points didn't go on the board.  They felt gypped, and I couldn't blame them.  Even if it's 99-0 every kid wants to see that 7 go on the board, especially if it was theirs.


I agree with your statements wholeheartedly
 
2013-09-25 05:41:28 PM

dentalhilljack: The flag football league my oldest used to play in had a mercy rule (that was on the books but ignored by everyone) enforced after a helicopter parent biatched incessantly in the 9-11 age group.  They had to stop keeping score and turned off the boards after a 28 or 35 point lead was established.  Our team sucked badly so about half our games went mercy rule.

You know who hated that the most?  Our kids.  4th quarter the other teams subbed out their best couple of kids so "everyone got to play" and our kids would eventually score.  They were pissed when their points didn't go on the board.  They felt gypped, and I couldn't blame them.  Even if it's 99-0 every kid wants to see that 7 go on the board, especially if it was theirs.


How does a talent gap like that happen. When I played minor league baseball the parents/coaches did a good job making sur the talent was spread around the league. There weren't too many uncompetitive games. I did come oh on a losing end of one where w spent an hour as the fielding side and it sucked but my dad just told me to try harder next game
Come to think about it losing the championship game was more disappointing then that one and that was a close game
 
2013-09-25 05:42:21 PM

Warlordtrooper: karmaceutical: I totally lost my faith in the normal mental-well-being of most parents when my kids youth soccer.  Some people just have issues.  They really need to have leagues where parents/coaches can't assemble teams to just demolish the other kids.

How is that different then college sports where teams in the SEC schedule games against teams that they have spreads of 50plus points against

/fully agree that parents should be banned from having input into child sports leagues


I'm no Fark Genius, but I can think of at least 1 major difference between youth sports and the SEC
 
2013-09-25 05:44:24 PM
God damned iPhone posting screwing up my grammer
 
2013-09-25 05:44:31 PM

Warlordtrooper: dentalhilljack: The flag football league my oldest used to play in had a mercy rule (that was on the books but ignored by everyone) enforced after a helicopter parent biatched incessantly in the 9-11 age group.  They had to stop keeping score and turned off the boards after a 28 or 35 point lead was established.  Our team sucked badly so about half our games went mercy rule.

You know who hated that the most?  Our kids.  4th quarter the other teams subbed out their best couple of kids so "everyone got to play" and our kids would eventually score.  They were pissed when their points didn't go on the board.  They felt gypped, and I couldn't blame them.  Even if it's 99-0 every kid wants to see that 7 go on the board, especially if it was theirs.

How does a talent gap like that happen. When I played minor league baseball the parents/coaches did a good job making sur the talent was spread around the league. There weren't too many uncompetitive games. I did come oh on a losing end of one where w spent an hour as the fielding side and it sucked but my dad just told me to try harder next game
Come to think about it losing the championship game was more disappointing then that one and that was a close game


Mostly because there isn't talent evaluation. It is mostly just coaches having their kids friends on the team.
 
2013-09-25 05:45:01 PM

bhcompy: One teaches character, and one makes you want to quit entirely.


Or, if you're not much into being humiliated and the other team really wants to keep trying to embarrass you, it will lead to fights.

It's funny how many people in here want to pretend that 100% logic is something to aspire to. You guys know the experiment where you offer 10 bucks to two people; the first person can split it up however they want and the second person can approve of it, allowing each person to get the money, or decline the money, meaning both people won't get it? How, if everyone were perfectly logical, then the first person would take $9, maximizing their take, and the second person would accept it, because $1 is better than $0?

Yeah, except that's not how it works in real life. Dipsh*t in front of you tries a 9/1 split and most people are going to go with "f*ck that guy, I'd rather have nothing than have that asshole get 9x what I get."

And that's what it turns into when you try to style on people. "Oh, you don't like it? Then stop me." Okay, you now have a broken leg. Looks like I stopped you! Quit crying. That's competition, pussy.
 
2013-09-25 05:45:40 PM
The $200 fine which they now say doesn't exist probably led to most of the hate mail, but the mercy rule itself will generate some controversy. Life is a competition, and sports are a teaching tool that drives home this point. If parents want a non-competitive leisure activity for their precious unique snowflakes that is inclusive to all, I suggest soccer.
 
2013-09-25 05:46:34 PM

JSam21: The club or "select" level of sports is what is killing youth sports. People that run programs to make money are killing youth sports.The bad coaches are killing youth sports. Mostly it is the bad parents that are ruining sports for the kids. I don't blame the game officials since most of them are kids themselves.

I think you and I have more in common than you think. I currently coach high school baseball and I would never coach any of my child's teams. Why you ask? 1) Because I know I'm not wired to coach kids under the age of 14. 2) Because I'd rather sit in the stands and enjoy watching them play the game and have fun. If I'm coaching I wouldn't be able to fully enjoy that. 3) I don't like to dwell on what could have been done differently with my kid's team and if I coached that's all I would do. 4) I can't have a beer while coaching.


Soccer and basketball are the worst, followed closely by baseball.  They are club sports through and through.  NJB and AYSO are glorified babysitters at this point, and Pony/Little League/Cal Ripken/etc aren't too far behind(but travel ball is generally off season or not often enough to give kids enough practice, so the good ones still play regular leagues).

Football is different.  There are camps for football, but there is no replacement for leagues like Pop Warner.  No one would put their kid in a club league to play right guard, and Pop Warner is already $400+ per season, so imagine what a club league would cost.

I've coached youth baseball, football, and wrestling.  I'd never coach youth baseball again because of the politics(including high school), but football and wrestling are a dream to coach.

Foxxinnia: Why would you make little kids play football? They can barely understand that only the goalie can pick up the ball while playing soccer.


You'd be surprised what kids can learn when you challenge them
 
2013-09-25 05:52:24 PM

JSam21: Warlordtrooper: dentalhilljack: The flag football league my oldest used to play in had a mercy rule (that was on the books but ignored by everyone) enforced after a helicopter parent biatched incessantly in the 9-11 age group.  They had to stop keeping score and turned off the boards after a 28 or 35 point lead was established.  Our team sucked badly so about half our games went mercy rule.

You know who hated that the most?  Our kids.  4th quarter the other teams subbed out their best couple of kids so "everyone got to play" and our kids would eventually score.  They were pissed when their points didn't go on the board.  They felt gypped, and I couldn't blame them.  Even if it's 99-0 every kid wants to see that 7 go on the board, especially if it was theirs.

How does a talent gap like that happen. When I played minor league baseball the parents/coaches did a good job making sur the talent was spread around the league. There weren't too many uncompetitive games. I did come oh on a losing end of one where w spent an hour as the fielding side and it sucked but my dad just told me to try harder next game
Come to think about it losing the championship game was more disappointing then that one and that was a close game

Mostly because there isn't talent evaluation. It is mostly just coaches having their kids friends on the team.


Coaches used to bring teams in, and people rightly biatched.  Then the league went pure draft, and the coaches biatched.  The last system we played under had a draft with a "combine", but the coaches were allowed to protect three players from the draft pool in a league where rosters are about 9-10 kids depending on signups.

The drafts are a friggin' joke - the coaches know which kids they've been coaching up in the off season and are gonna select anyway.  As a coach not in the loop, your best bet is to luck out and snag one or two of the second-tier kids who wasn't protected.  God forbid the league let the coach protect only his kid and draw the rest from a hat.

The quality of the league varies on the season.  In the fall teams are more balanced because the ringers are playing tackle football in the community leagues.  Come springtime the skill players from the tackle leagues monopolize the flag league to get off-season drills in.
 
2013-09-25 05:53:41 PM

bhcompy: JSam21: The club or "select" level of sports is what is killing youth sports. People that run programs to make money are killing youth sports.The bad coaches are killing youth sports. Mostly it is the bad parents that are ruining sports for the kids. I don't blame the game officials since most of them are kids themselves.

I think you and I have more in common than you think. I currently coach high school baseball and I would never coach any of my child's teams. Why you ask? 1) Because I know I'm not wired to coach kids under the age of 14. 2) Because I'd rather sit in the stands and enjoy watching them play the game and have fun. If I'm coaching I wouldn't be able to fully enjoy that. 3) I don't like to dwell on what could have been done differently with my kid's team and if I coached that's all I would do. 4) I can't have a beer while coaching.

Soccer and basketball are the worst, followed closely by baseball.  They are club sports through and through.  NJB and AYSO are glorified babysitters at this point, and Pony/Little League/Cal Ripken/etc aren't too far behind(but travel ball is generally off season or not often enough to give kids enough practice, so the good ones still play regular leagues).

Football is different.  There are camps for football, but there is no replacement for leagues like Pop Warner.  No one would put their kid in a club league to play right guard, and Pop Warner is already $400+ per season, so imagine what a club league would cost.

I've coached youth baseball, football, and wrestling.  I'd never coach youth baseball again because of the politics(including high school), but football and wrestling are a dream to coach.

Foxxinnia: Why would you make little kids play football? They can barely understand that only the goalie can pick up the ball while playing soccer.

You'd be surprised what kids can learn when you challenge them


You're right, football is a different animal. The politics in youth sports is bad. I know at the high school I work at, individual programs/teams aren't allowed to keep the money they fundraise. It all goes into a total athletic department account.
 
2013-09-25 06:00:46 PM

IAmRight: Or, if you're not much into being humiliated and the other team really wants to keep trying to embarrass you, it will lead to fights.


That's what I was thinking.  This mercy rule might seem draconian, but it's a hell of a lot better than the alternative.  This league apparently had a big problem with blowouts before the rule was enforced, and youth sports aren't known for their sportsmanship, especially among the "adults" involved.  You can only keep your starters in and run up the score so many times before some pissed-off parent orders his son to go Lawrence Taylor on the coach's kid the next time he starts showboating in the end zone.  At some point, it becomes well worth the penalty to teach that smug farker that he's not raising the next Adrian Peterson.
 
2013-09-25 06:06:16 PM

JSam21: You're right, football is a different animal. The politics in youth sports is bad. I know at the high school I work at, individual programs/teams aren't allowed to keep the money they fundraise. It all goes into a total athletic department account.


That's good.  My high school had a 20+ year boys basketball coach thrown in jail for embezzling team funds to the tune of hundreds of thousands(playing on the team cost somewhere in the neighborhood of $600/yr in '00 and the coach was siphoning off that and other fundraisers/boosters) and in the past 3 years the boys baseball team has fired 2 coaches for taking money coaching the pony travel ball team and preselecting freshman rosters without tryouts.  The school fired the AD and put a long time tenured teacher in charge to clean up the sports programs because there's too much of that shiat going on. My school is in a moderately affluent area, so money isn't a problem, and that makes boosters a real problem.
 
2013-09-25 06:09:03 PM

Olympic Trolling Judge: IAmRight: Or, if you're not much into being humiliated and the other team really wants to keep trying to embarrass you, it will lead to fights.

That's what I was thinking.  This mercy rule might seem draconian, but it's a hell of a lot better than the alternative.  This league apparently had a big problem with blowouts before the rule was enforced, and youth sports aren't known for their sportsmanship, especially among the "adults" involved.  You can only keep your starters in and run up the score so many times before some pissed-off parent orders his son to go Lawrence Taylor on the coach's kid the next time he starts showboating in the end zone.  At some point, it becomes well worth the penalty to teach that smug farker that he's not raising the next Adrian Peterson.


Football is also generally very heavy on parental involvement and attendance, so the parents are more invested(living vicariously through their kids) and the bleachers are always full.  There were certain cities and rivalry games when I played and my son played Pop Warner that required police presences because parents would brawl if the game went badly(and sometimes for no reason at all).
 
2013-09-25 06:22:51 PM

bhcompy: JSam21: You're right, football is a different animal. The politics in youth sports is bad. I know at the high school I work at, individual programs/teams aren't allowed to keep the money they fundraise. It all goes into a total athletic department account.

That's good.  My high school had a 20+ year boys basketball coach thrown in jail for embezzling team funds to the tune of hundreds of thousands(playing on the team cost somewhere in the neighborhood of $600/yr in '00 and the coach was siphoning off that and other fundraisers/boosters) and in the past 3 years the boys baseball team has fired 2 coaches for taking money coaching the pony travel ball team and preselecting freshman rosters without tryouts.  The school fired the AD and put a long time tenured teacher in charge to clean up the sports programs because there's too much of that shiat going on. My school is in a moderately affluent area, so money isn't a problem, and that makes boosters a real problem.


I have no idea how it should cost that much to play a high school sport. I have a $1500 budget for my season, that doesn't include umpires. I had a pitching machine's wheels melt off from being in the shed all summer. The wheels are $500 to replace. I need 10 dozen baseballs at $50/dozen. I have to order hats, which the kids then buy and that's the only out of pocket costs they have to spend. If they want cage jackets, thermal fleeces, bench coats, undershirts, or long sleeve shirts they have to buy that. I encourage them to get either a coat or fleece but they don't have to buy one.

Jerseys, pants, and belts are provided. Their only mandatory out of pocket is $30.
 
2013-09-25 06:47:38 PM
People love to pile on - it's the American way.
 
2013-09-25 07:33:40 PM

Rising_Zan_Samurai_Gunman: If a coach tells his players to intentionally not go 100% because they are winning by that much, someone is going to get hurt.


Also, a rule like this just shifts who quits.  Normally, it'd be the demoralized 1st teamers on bad teams. Here, it's the frustrated 2nd and 3rd teamers on the good teams, who can't give their all for fear of being punished.
 
2013-09-25 08:04:30 PM
unrealitymag.bcmediagroup.netdna-cdn.com
 
2013-09-25 08:32:53 PM
I just finished a 5 season stint coaching my daughter's rec league soccer team (U9 through U11).  We played in a multi-association league, and our team was the only one in our association at our age level, so you took all comers and they all had to play at least half the game.  The rarely enforced mercy rule was to call off the dogs if you ever led by 6 goals or more.

When I took over the team it was stocked with rank beginners in the lowest division, but they held their own.  Once I improved fitness and taught them some basic tactics and positions they started pounding teams pretty regularly.  Eventually I came up with my own rules to avoid complete blowouts.  If up by 4 goals I no longer allowed shots from within the penalty area and would try to get them to pass the ball more.  If up by 5 goals I would tell them no more shots at all, just pass the ball.  If up by 5 goals with a lot of time left I'd swap the defense with the offense and let them play.  I figured getting them out of their comfort zone would help, and I was amazed at how well the forwards could play defense.  The downside was that if a defender had a breakaway and scored you had to let it happen.  A lot of times it was the first time they'd ever scored a goal.

But what I'd tell the team was that winning with class is important.  Everyone hates sore losers, but sore winners are just as bad.  And everyone always says you have to learn how to lose, but you also have to learn how to win.  And when the game is over and it's been a blowout you don't gloat, you shake hands and say good game and then be all happy afterwards.  I love the sport and the last thing I wanted to do was humiliate anybody and make them quit altogether.  I wanted to win, and we won a lot, but this is rec.  Not academy or competitive.

And the worst thing about youth sports?  Come on, it's the parents.  This ragtag bunch of kids won 80% of their games in the last 18 months, had the hands down best defense of the entire league, a solid offense, and parents still told me to my face that I wasn't doing good enough.  In rec league.  I think one ref put it the best when things got out of hand in one game, 'guys, this isn't the World Cup here, take it down a notch'.  Even though I'd already announced my 'retirement' at the time, the final stamp on the whole thing was when my daughter started yelling at a parent from the bench to tell her to shut up and stop yelling at me.  My last act as coach was basically to tell that parent to go to hell.

CSB or whatever I guess?
 
2013-09-25 09:37:38 PM

Loan Starr: But what I'd tell the team was that winning with class is important.

 
It's because of all the dickhead coaches who don't understand this that they had to implement this rule in the first place.  Yes, yes, everyone needs to learn to lose, but we've gone way overboard on winning is the only thing mentality.
 
2013-09-25 09:45:54 PM

LesserEvil: They have to play the full game, right? As a player, wouldn't you be demoralized if the game was called because you fell behind by 7 touchdowns?

So... a skunk doesn't work, but how about not allowing points to be added if the score is greater than "X" over the other team's score? Make it 4 touchdowns... 28 points. If you go ahead by more than that, the points don't count.

It gives the other team a chance to catch up, the winning team still has reason to play (maintain possession and cut down the other team's chances of catching up), and both teams can walk off the field feeling good about putting in a full effort.

Seems like a better solution than forcing a coach to "slack off" in a game, or calling a skunk (which has much the same effect on the losing players' morale as running up a score).


Never played football, but just about every other youth sport. In my experience, by the time you're down enough to get skunked, you're already plenty demoralized. At that point, you just want to get outta there. Even if the score isn't going up on the board, it's not like you aren't pulling the puck out of your net (or whatever the football equivalent is, watching the other team moonwalk into your endzone?).

I'm curious how often this sort of blowout occurs at that level. In the local hockey leagues, it's fairly rare to get a mercy ruled game. The teams are pretty evenly matched. Good teams play the good teams, the lousy teams play the lousy teams. Even if the hockey is terrible, the games are generally pretty close.

/You do get the odd "six players showed up for one team" game that gets out of hand
 
2013-09-25 09:46:34 PM
That's just farking wonderful. I had the Junior lions -41 and they stop the game at 35, I think some little legs will get broken after that game.
 
2013-09-25 10:47:31 PM
Yay, everyone gets a trophy and no feelings get hurt.  And we wonder why people snap and shoot people at 19 years old when they have went through life never having to deal with adversity and suddenly they don't get that promotion or don't get that acceptance letter to the school they wanted and just don't know how to deal with it.
 
2013-09-25 10:54:30 PM
My son plays middle school football right now, and his team is not awful but also not good (mostly 6th and 7th graders only a few kids who have gone through a growth spurt yet), but everyone who is not injured or having an academic issue plays in every game.  There are classy teams they play who don't try and run up the score, put in their reserves (often facing our reserves as coach says everyone plays), and keep it fun for all even if you lose by 3 or 4 touchdowns.  Then there are teams that just try and blast you, leaving 2/3rds of their team just sitting on the bench while the best few get to play all the downs, offense and defense.  One team got caught going so far as to have high school kids (who hadn't made the high school team) play on the middle school team, of course being a couple years older they kicked everyone's butt until they were found out and had to forfeit all the games.

These blowout win teams aren't fun for 5/6ths of the kids in the game, namely the losing team and the 2/3rds of the kids on the winning team who just sit there all game.  Most of these kids aren't going to make it into college football, let alone the NFL, even the supposed "stars".  Lets have some fun, your star can show his stuff in the first half of that blowout, then maybe let the kid who is going to be replacing him in a year get some experience in a game, doing so makes it better for the kids plus develops your team for the long haul.
 
2013-09-25 11:10:40 PM
I should add we just got back from a game, and even though my son's team lost by 28 points there was really only one issue (a player from the winning team pushed one of our players, and a scuffle ensued).  There were some great plays by the defense (keeping the other team out of the end zone a couple of times on goal line stands), a few good passes, and some nice runs.  The difference was really turnovers, my son's team had some bad snaps, fumbles, and an interception or two while only creating a couple of turnovers themselves.  Even so the kids were upbeat and focused on all that went right and not one what went wrong, they had fun and they grew as players and as people, in part because they got to play.
 
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