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(My Fox NY)   Remember when they said your E-ZPass wasn't used to track anything but your tolls on toll roads? Yeah, about that   ( ) divider line 163
    More: Interesting, E-ZPass, New York News, New York Civil Liberties Union  
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20254 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Sep 2013 at 8:45 PM (2 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»

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2013-09-21 08:07:23 AM  

SevenizGud: Suckmaster Burstingfoam: If you're not doing anything wrong, why have a problem with being tracked everywhere you go?

Because I don't want my parents to find out that I drive every Tuesday to the pancreatic cancer clinic? Jus' sayin'

Oh dayum. Even if snark, that's depressing.
2013-09-21 08:38:02 AM  

freak7: What I'd like to see them do is use EZ Pass to issue speeding tickets.

What I'd like to see them do is actually ticket people who drive in a dangerous manner, rather than people who break some sort of arbitrary limit.

/silly me.
2013-09-21 09:10:50 AM  

Just another Heartland Weirdass: How else can measure our infinite freedom, besides tracking it?

If we don't spy on ourselves then you'd be paying 10 for a banana and the terrorist would have won and God cant destroy evil without destroying all the evil people and stuff.

I like that, and think I'll use it.

2013-09-21 09:35:42 AM  

Benevolent Misanthrope: And people laughed at us librarians when we tried to explain how this would happen because of the nature of information and the ubiquity of information sharing and curiosity...

They just laughing at you because you're a librarian. It didn't have anything thing to do with that other stuff.
2013-09-21 09:36:50 AM  
Welcome to the 21st century!
2013-09-21 10:07:19 AM  
We have to know what your doing at all times so you don't know what we're doing.
2013-09-21 11:00:55 AM  
Just like Global Warming, we need a start point to go from, if you wish to measure the wane of personal liberty.

We really don't need either, but these are the times.
2013-09-21 11:06:18 AM  

wildcardjack: So... can we trade police having access to an omnipresent traffic monitoring system for NOT GETTING AMBER ALERTS PUSHED TO MY PHONE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE farkING NIGHT!

I don't know about your phone, but my phone has the ability to turn that crap off.

/ And an 'OFF' switch and removable battery for those times I really don't want to be bothered.
2013-09-21 11:44:58 AM
2013-09-21 01:27:22 PM

That is all.
2013-09-21 02:16:15 PM  

Macular Degenerate: And people said I was crazy when I didn't get an EZ Pass tag because they saved you 10% off your tolls. I'd rather preserve my privacy than sell it for $0.10 per transaction.

Do you carry a cell phone?  They are tracking that.  Do you have license plates on your car?  They are tracking that.  Use a credit or debit card?  Should I go on?

I think the nature of technology is that once people know how to do it, you can't stop it.  We may be better off if the nuclear bomb hadn't been invented, but you can't put that cat back in the bag.

Computers make it possible to do a lot of tracking, and like it or not, that is going to happen.

To me, fighting to stop it isn't worthwhile.  Better would be to fight on reasonable limits on who has access to the data.  It's all getting stored in a big database (technically several different databases.)  That data shouldn't be available to everyone.  It should only be available to certain law enforcement officers, and there should be a process involved that requires a warrant and oversight.  Nobody, law enforcement or not, should be able to use it to track, oh, say their ex wife or the hot girl that lives down the street, for instance.  Nobody should be able to look up anyone they personally know.

I'm sort of surprised that they haven't started putting RFID and easy-scan technology into the registration stickers we have to put on our windshields.  I figure it's just a matter of time.
2013-09-21 02:36:59 PM  

Oh wow, a condescending "expert" who is more concerned about his image as an expert than actually knowing what he is talking about, or being flat out wrong.

 I'm an RFID sw/fw engineer. My analogy was that many systems use UHF-band RFID carriers in the ~900 Mhz range, like the EZ-Pass, but that his "detection" system was only set up to notice UHF broadcasts in that frequency range, and may have had as little to do with EZ-Pass as your library card barcode does to your grocery store.

Firstly, there's no information in TFA about the device.  He may have been monitoring the device response itself, not general incoming signals. So it may be more specific than that.

He posted his schematics. The cow moos when the tag is read (ostensibly it's EPC) which would happen from any number of UHF systems broadcasting inventory commands. His cow would moo in walmart, or near a DHL office.

Secondly, the read distance on passive tags is something like 20 feet, so if you're driving around and getting pinged then it's probably something on the actual road.

The read distance of standard UHF tags in the 900Mhz range is up to about 30m or about 100 feet. That's for standard C1G2 passive tags. For C3, its 100 meters, but thats battery assisted passive, and fairly new. He

Thirdly, the news contacted NYC-DoT and the city told them that the readers were theirs and that they were using them to monitor vehicles.

Ok? Did they say whose vehicles? I've had RFID clients who use UHF to monitor their own fleets. I've helped install similar systems. Yes, it notices tags from other systems when they come by, but you know what?  - they ignore that data, because it isnt what they are concerned about. Most of the time the EPC code is utterly meaningless other than identifying the manufacturer of the IC embedded in the tag is (NXP, TI, Fujitsu, etc) - Fedex, DHL, UPS, and other uncountable shipping companies use rfid to track their fleets, pallets, people, all using tags that would be "read" just as an "EZ-Pass" tag would be "read". But the EPC data is only meaningful if it is cross referenced to some database. And any other data on the data isn't read in these inventory broadcasts - that would require additional, targeted commands. Making the jump that the type of "reading" that he detects is sinister is, like I mentioned, as silly as making the jump that your grocery store is spying on your reading habits because they both use barcodes. Vehicles already have licenses plates to identify the vehicle, and they can already be logged visually - at an even greater distance I might add.

Now, if you found evidence that your tags were being -written- to, that's a whole other kettle of fish.  That would require additional, deliberate, commands targeted at specific tags. But there isn't anything anywhere (that I've seen) to hint that this is happening. That would cause some raised eyebrows, but not just tags wandering into random UHF fields and being activated. Even crazy rfid time-cube guy with the screaming monkey and mooing cow doesn't make that claim.

This guy's website is entertaining, in a sort of "grandpa forgot his medication" sort of way.   "It will become obvious to "watchers" you aredoing this" ...."The Watchers".. nice.

I'm just letting you know that from a professional RFID guy's perspective, this guy is loopy, and probably schizophrenic. (The last part is my wife's opinion, and that is HER area of expertise)

Read the Forbes article: "E-ZPasses Get Read All Over New York (Not Just At Toll Booths)". It contains links to all the relevant pages and some investigative journalism.

Yes, E-ZPass readers are installed in the streets of NYC. NY DoT says they are used for collecting traffic information. pukingmonkey found readers that would set off his detectors.

They are made by TransCore.
TransCore, a company that makes the RFID readers that New York is using to pick up on E-ZPasses, was more forthcoming. A 2013 case study from the company notes that the $50 million project to improve traffic congestion in New York also involved the installation of a network of traffic microwave sensors, and has been successful enough that the city plans to expand it another 270 blocks.
"The tag ID is scrambled to make it anonymous.  The scrambled ID is held in dynamic memory for several minutes to compare with other sightings from other readers strategically placed for the purpose of measuring travel times which are then averaged to develop an understanding of traffic conditions," says TransCore spokesperson Barbara Catlin by email. "Travel times are used to estimate average speeds for general traveler information and performance metrics.  Tag sightings (reads) age off the system after several minutes or after they are paired and are not stored because they are of no value. Hence the system cannot identify the tag user and does not keep any record of the tag sightings."

ISO15693  says: "This guy's website is entertaining, in a sort of "grandpa forgot his medication" sort of way."

What website are you talking about you condescending twat? All I know about is his DEFCON presentation and his twitter feed. Do you need to make up imaginary things so you can feel that you are superior while ignoring that there is a network of TransCore readers in NYC?
2013-09-21 08:05:22 PM  

Huggermugger: ciberido: styckx: They still aren't tracking my fapping habits though right?

You've been a very naughty boy.

That's the first time I've seen a man wearing glasses frames from the Sophia Loren collection.

Real Genius was released in 1985.  Fashion was considerably more unisex then.
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