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(Politico)   Pentagon: All soldiers, including National Guard members, can get benefits for same-sex partners. OK Gov Fallin: not in my state they can't Pentagon: fine, they can just go to the nearest FEDERAL military base and apply for them there then   (politico.com) divider line 142
    More: Dumbass, Oklahoma National Guard, Gov. Fallin, same-sex couples, soldiers  
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3696 clicks; posted to Politics » on 20 Sep 2013 at 12:04 PM (48 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-20 12:51:17 PM

Karac: This is what, three states now that have pulled this?  What do they think they're really accomplishing?

Gay guardsman goes to his unit and gets an admin clerk to add his spouse to DEERS.  The states of Texas, Oklahoma, or Louisiana are out exactly dick, since these are federal DoD benefits the soldiers are getting.  All they're out is the clerks time, and guess what?  That's guys under salary so they don't have to pay him any more either.

They're just being dicks, biatching and moaning when an adult points out that it's only decent to share their toys with the other kids.

Congratulations Mary Fallin.  You've made your mark on history.  In another generation when textbooks add a few paragraphs on how gays got equal rights there's going to be a picture of you.  Right next to George Wallace, James Earl Ray, and the Ku Klux Klan.


No, she won't. Those guys had a way bigger impact on history than her. She'd barely merit a single line.

It's more along the lines of "you'll be that family member no one talks about because they're too embarrassed to admit their relation." You know, like those people who had high-ranking members of the KKK in their families, but not high-ranking enough for anyone else to remember.
 
2013-09-20 12:51:28 PM
Today's Republican Party: What A Bunch Of C*nts™
 
2013-09-20 12:54:08 PM

COMALite J: Karac: This is what, three states now that have pulled this? What do they think they're really accomplishing?

Gay guardsman goes to his unit and gets an admin clerk to add his spouse to DEERS. The states of Texas, Oklahoma, or Louisiana are out exactly dick, since these are federal DoD benefits the soldiers are getting. All they're out is the clerks time, and guess what?  That's guys under salary so they don't have to pay him any more either.

They're just being dicks, biatching and moaning when an adult points out that it's only decent to share their toys with the other kids.

Congratulations Mary Fallin. You've made your mark on history. In another generation when textbooks add a few paragraphs on how gays got equal rights there's going to be a picture of you. Right next to George Wallace, James Earl Ray, and the Ku Klux Klan.

The Texas case is particularly interesting, since Major General John Nichols claimed to be going by what the Texas State Constitution (as amended by Texas voters via Proposition 2 on November 8, 2005) states.

But if so, he really should deny marriage benefits to all Texas Guardsman. Here's what the amended §32 of the Texas State Constitution actually says:Sec. 32.  MARRIAGE.   (a)  Marriage in this state shall consist only of the union of one man and one woman.
(b)  This state or a political subdivision of this state may not create or recognize any legal status identical or similar to marriage.(Added Nov. 8, 2005.)

It is, of course, a fundamental law of logic, math, law, and, well, pretty much everything in every field of human endeavor, that anything is always "identical to" itself! A is A. X = X. The Identity Property.

§32(a) was just what the fundie bigot ordered, but §32(b) explicitly states that neither Texas nor any political subdivision thereof may create nor recognize any legal status identical or similar to marriage as just defined in §32(a)!!

That's right: All Texas marriages were annulled on November 8, 2005. For the past n ...


That...that's beautiful. Your newsletter, sir. I wants.
 
2013-09-20 12:54:42 PM

Sofa_king_kewl: FTFA "the governor was following the wish of Oklahoma voters, who approved a constitutional amendment in 2004 that prohibits giving benefits of marriage to gay couples."

I guess since libs don't give a damn about the US Constitution, not following a single states is a given.


Considering you didn't know the US Constitution trumps the states' you are not in a place to talk.
 
2013-09-20 12:55:36 PM

Sofa_king_kewl: FTFA "the governor was following the wish of Oklahoma voters, who approved a constitutional amendment in 2004 that prohibits giving benefits of marriage to gay couples."

I guess since libs don't give a damn about the US Constitution, not following a single states is a given.


That meant STATE benefits not FEDERAL benefits. Amazing as it may seem states don't have control over FEDERAL benefits.
 
2013-09-20 12:56:54 PM

Benevolent Misanthrope: JollyMagistrate: Sofa_king_kewl: FTFA "the governor was following the wish of Oklahoma voters, who approved a constitutional amendment in 2004 that prohibits giving benefits of marriage to gay couples."

I guess since libs don't give a damn about the US Constitution, not following a single states is a given.

You cannot ballot box away the rights of someone else, even by popular vote. See Proposition 8, etc. Just because she was following a ballot referendum doesn't make her right or constitutional, as recent Supreme Court findings have shown.

Also, it's just plain asshattery. If the military is offering benefits, what is it to the state government? They aren't paying for it.

Because she's the governor and she damn well wants you to know that SHE is the Commander-In-Chief of the Oklahoma Guard.  SHE is.  HER!  Not Washington, not that guy, HER!  SHE'S IN CONTROL, DAMMIT!!!!  RESPECT HER AUTHORITAH!!!


Except when it comes to FEMA funding for tornado-related damage.  Then it's all 'WE NEEDZ GUBMINT MONEAH~!"
 
2013-09-20 12:59:45 PM

COMALite J: Here's what the amended §32 of the Texas State Constitution actually says:

Sec. 32. MARRIAGE. (a) Marriage in this state shall consist only of the union of one man and one woman.
(b) This state or a political subdivision of this state may not create or recognize any legal status identical or similar to marriage.

(Added Nov. 8, 2005.)

It is, of course, a fundamental law of logic, math, law, and, well, pretty much everything in every field of human endeavor, that anything is always "identical to" itself! A is A. X = X. The Identity Property.

§32(a) was just what the fundie bigot ordered, but §32(b) explicitly states that neither Texas nor any political subdivision thereof may create nor recognize any legal status identical or similar to marriage as just defined in §32(a)!!

That's right: All Texas marriages were annulled on November 8, 2005. For the past nearly eight years, there is not and has not been any such thing as a legally married couple in Texas! Since this includes recognition as well as creation of such legal status, that includes people who married elsewhere then moved to Texas, people from other States visiting friends or families in Texas or just there on business, or even people just passing through!

The insertion of one simple two-syllable five-letter very common word into §32(b), namely, "other," between "any" and "legal status," would've prevented this and done precisely what the fundie bigots intended. But, they refused to insert it, even after having been warned of this problem well before the Amendment was ratified by the voters!

In the immortal words of Homer J. Simpson: "D'oh!!!"

Bonus: Depending on how "similar to" is interpreted, while they could not be called "marriage" due to §32(a), it may well be that §32(b) does permit civil unions for same-sex and polygamous unions only, but not for monogamous heterosexual couples!


img.pandawhale.com
 
2013-09-20 01:00:25 PM

Sofa_king_kewl: FTFA "the governor was following the wish of Oklahoma voters, who approved a constitutional amendment in 2004 that prohibits giving benefits of marriage to gay couples."

I guess since libs don't give a damn about the US Constitution, not following a single states is a given.


The US Constitution supercedes anything that might contradict it in state constitutions, and civil rights are not doled out via referendum. That's part of the whole point of the US (at least originally).

Yet another Teabagger Philosopher who slept through high school civics...
 
2013-09-20 01:00:47 PM
HA HA! Suck it, rightards!
 
2013-09-20 01:03:49 PM
www.zuguide.com

Man, that's just mean.
 
2013-09-20 01:05:56 PM
This thread is amazing.

I used to think Farklibs were just misguided ideologues but, it seems, they're intentionally ignoring the fact that this Gov. is merely following state law. Additionally, she's instructed same-sex couples on how to obtain benefits directly from the Federal Gov't.

Yet, the Farklibs here have nothing but blind hatred and unfounded contempt.
 
2013-09-20 01:06:19 PM

sprawl15: Why do Republicans hate the troops?


These are the same assclowns that booed a soldier that asked about DADT during an RNC debate.  I think their contempt for the troops is pretty clear.
 
2013-09-20 01:06:34 PM

Karac: Congratulations Mary Fallin.  You've made your mark on history.


Not even a footnote.  When all is said and done, she will be only one of the faceless millions whose ignorance and arrogance stood in the way of their humanity.  No one will remember her name.
 
2013-09-20 01:07:15 PM
No self respecting drag queen would want to look like that.

images.politico.com
 
2013-09-20 01:09:04 PM
Well, the military is drawing down. I guess now we know which states to target for base closures.
 
2013-09-20 01:10:12 PM

Magorn: Sofa_king_kewl: FTFA "the governor was following the wish of Oklahoma voters, who approved a constitutional amendment in 2004 that prohibits giving benefits of marriage to gay couples."

I guess since libs don't give a damn about the US Constitution, not following a single states is a given.

That US constitution you speak of? It has something in it called "The federal Supremacy CLause" which state, to wit: "

This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any state to the contrary notwithstanding. it ALSO has something called the Due Process clause of the 14th Amendment which says:


 No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Now this last bit is super-important since the cited provision of the OK state Constitution is in clear violation of it.


You may wish to inform the US Supreme Court of your brilliant legal deduction because they've never issued a ruling that invalidated a state's prohibition on same-sex marriage.
 
2013-09-20 01:12:17 PM

Aristocles: This thread is amazing.

I used to think Farklibs were just misguided ideologues but, it seems, they're intentionally ignoring the fact that this Gov. is merely following state law. Additionally, she's instructed same-sex couples on how to obtain benefits directly from the Federal Gov't.

Yet, the Farklibs here have nothing but blind hatred and unfounded contempt.


She isn't going to sleep with you
 
2013-09-20 01:12:51 PM

Aristocles: This thread is amazing.

I used to think Farklibs were just misguided ideologues but, it seems, they're intentionally ignoring the fact that this Gov. is merely following state law. Additionally, she's instructed same-sex couples on how to obtain benefits directly from the Federal Gov't.

Yet, the Farklibs here have nothing but blind hatred and unfounded contempt.


Look at how stupid you are.
 
2013-09-20 01:13:29 PM
Pete and Repeat were in a boat. Pete fell out. Who's left?

That being said, this was really the best move for the governor to make politically. She gets to appeal to the derpers by being tough on the homoqueers without actually blocking anything, not to mention the fact that she is legally obligated to uphold the state constitution. She herself acknowledged that they could just go to a federal installation and apply for the benefits. It's do-nothing appearance politics. It's the one thing that our "leaders" are really good at.

Crotchrocket Slim: The US Constitution supercedes anything that might contradict it in state constitutions, and civil rights are not doled out via referendum. That's part of the whole point of the US (at least originally).

Yet another Teabagger Philosopher who slept through high school civics...


Unless/until the state amendment fails a court challenge, it has the weight of law. It's not the governor's place to just decide what is constitutional and what isn't. That's why we have the judicial branch. Maybe that Teabagger Philosopher wasn't the only one who slept through high school civics....
 
2013-09-20 01:19:31 PM

Cataholic: Magorn: Sofa_king_kewl: FTFA "the governor was following the wish of Oklahoma voters, who approved a constitutional amendment in 2004 that prohibits giving benefits of marriage to gay couples."

I guess since libs don't give a damn about the US Constitution, not following a single states is a given.

That US constitution you speak of? It has something in it called "The federal Supremacy CLause" which state, to wit: "

This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in pursuance thereof; and all treaties made, or which shall be made, under the authority of the United States, shall be the supreme law of the land; and the judges in every state shall be bound thereby, anything in the constitution or laws of any state to the contrary notwithstanding. it ALSO has something called the Due Process clause of the 14th Amendment which says:


 No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Now this last bit is super-important since the cited provision of the OK state Constitution is in clear violation of it.

You may wish to inform the US Supreme Court of your brilliant legal deduction because they've never issued a ruling that invalidated a state's prohibition on same-sex marriage.


That's because they haven't had to as of yet inasmuch as a properly formed complaint brought by someone with proper standing hasn't reached them yet and they do have an "actual case and controvery" requirement.   However the Line of Cases from  Skinner v. Oklahoma,  through  Loving v. VA and Zablocki v. Redhail  and  Turner v. Safely make it perfectly clear what result follows such a properly formatted challenge fairly decided
 
2013-09-20 01:20:43 PM
Oklahoma Gov. Mary Fallin

More like Mary Failin.amiright?!?!?
 
2013-09-20 01:24:18 PM

Aristocles: This thread is amazing.

I used to think Farklibs were just misguided ideologues but, it seems, they're intentionally ignoring the fact that this Gov. is merely following state law. Additionally, she's instructed same-sex couples on how to obtain benefits directly from the Federal Gov't.

Yet, the Farklibs here have nothing but blind hatred and unfounded contempt.


The Governor is breaking national law re: the constitution, which (as mentioned many times in this thread) specifically bars such actions from occurring in several ways. If the Oklahoma State Legislature legalized murder and required the Governor to kill 20 people a day she still would be immediately arrested because state law does not. and cannot, override federal law.

Blind hate/unfounded contempt is only involved here with legislation concerning banning a specific population from rights for the sole reason of hate. If you have a reason why LGBT couples should not have the same rights of others that is not based on hate or contempt I think much of the country, the Supreme Court included, would love to hear it. Because so far, the bigoted masses such as yourselves have not been able to come up with any legal justification for their self loathing and impotent rage.
 
2013-09-20 01:32:07 PM

JollyMagistrate: Aristocles: This thread is amazing.

I used to think Farklibs were just misguided ideologues but, it seems, they're intentionally ignoring the fact that this Gov. is merely following state law. Additionally, she's instructed same-sex couples on how to obtain benefits directly from the Federal Gov't.

Yet, the Farklibs here have nothing but blind hatred and unfounded contempt.

The Governor is breaking national law re: the constitution, which (as mentioned many times in this thread) specifically bars such actions from occurring in several ways. If the Oklahoma State Legislature legalized murder and required the Governor to kill 20 people a day she still would be immediately arrested because state law does not. and cannot, override federal law.

Blind hate/unfounded contempt is only involved here with legislation concerning banning a specific population from rights for the sole reason of hate. If you have a reason why LGBT couples should not have the same rights of others that is not based on hate or contempt I think much of the country, the Supreme Court included, would love to hear it. Because so far, the bigoted masses such as yourselves have not been able to come up with any legal justification for their self loathing and impotent rage.


So I guess you think the Feds should start busting up the head shops popping up in states that have decriminalized mary jane? And, according to you, the Federal government should punish states that don't comply with Obamacare?
 
2013-09-20 01:32:50 PM
Oh look another thread where Aristocles is making himself look like a total idiot, and troll.

Must be a day ending is Y
 
2013-09-20 01:39:43 PM
Another day, another example of how Republicans are hateful, hypocritical shiatbags. Fark y'all. Right in the eye.
 
2013-09-20 01:41:05 PM

JollyMagistrate: If you have a reason why LGBT couples should not have the same rights of others that is not based on hate or contempt I think much of the country, the Supreme Court included, would love to hear it.


Point of order: "Because the Bible" isn't based on hate or contempt.

However, SCOTUS also doesn't care about the Bible as a justification for the law (except Scalia because he helped write it; and Thomas, because...um...Coke?).
 
2013-09-20 01:41:38 PM

Aristocles: So I guess you think the Feds should start busting up the head shops popping up in states that have decriminalized mary jane? And, according to you, the Federal government should punish states that don't comply with Obamacare?


The feds can bust up head shops in states where mary jane is decriminalized at a state level.  In fact, they do.
The states which don't comply with Obamacare don't need the federal government to punish them - they're doing a damn fine job on that score themselves.
 
2013-09-20 01:48:44 PM

trotsky: Once more we prove why the even Jefferson believed the Articles of Confederation were crap and that a stronger Federal Government was needed.


The odd Jefferson, on the other hand...
 
2013-09-20 01:49:05 PM
I never thought the next Supremacy clause battle was going to be fought this way.
 
2013-09-20 01:52:37 PM
Karac: [T]there's going to be a picture of you.  Right next to George Wallace, James Earl Ray, and the Ku Klux Klan.

Now that's not fair. George Wallace was smart and honest enough to realize he was wrong and publicly renounce his past support for segregation.
 
2013-09-20 01:54:04 PM

Aristocles: So I guess you think the Feds should start busting up the head shops popping up in states that have decriminalized mary jane?


Can you explain why you dislike freedom so much? It seems pretty un-American to oppose people seeking more freedom, and it also seems quite anti-conservative to want more interference with our lives, or to support the existing encroachments on our freedom- whether that be freedom to marry or to use marijuana.

Do you have a good reason why you oppose MORE freedom, and in fact support the encroachment of state and Federal law on our rights?
 
2013-09-20 01:54:20 PM

jigger: trotsky: Once more we prove why the even Jefferson believed the Articles of Confederation were crap and that a stronger Federal Government was needed.

The odd Jefferson, on the other hand...


Don't you mean...bizarro Jefferson?
 
2013-09-20 01:55:36 PM

Aristocles: So I guess you think the Feds should start busting up the head shops popping up in states that have decriminalized mary jane?


Christ, I know you're nothing but a bottom of the barrel troll, but "Mary Jane"? You try way too hard to be hep and with it.
 
2013-09-20 01:56:28 PM
9,500 guardsmen, eh? How dare this Governor disenfranchise hundreds, if not thousands, of same-sex married couples.

Oh, wait....9,500?

She's probably just picking on a few dozen.
 
2013-09-20 02:02:27 PM

thismomentinblackhistory: 9,500 guardsmen, eh? How dare this Governor disenfranchise hundreds, if not thousands, of same-sex married couples.

Oh, wait....9,500?

She's probably just picking on a few dozen.


And Rosa Park's bus driver was only picking on one woman.
 
2013-09-20 02:05:14 PM

Ed Grubermann: Aristocles: So I guess you think the Feds should start busting up the head shops popping up in states that have decriminalized mary jane?

Christ, I know you're nothing but a bottom of the barrel troll, but "Mary Jane"? You try way too hard to be hep and with it.


I've seriously gone back to calling it reefer.  I love the old school terminology.
 
2013-09-20 02:06:07 PM

kbronsito: Why are we even bothering to have members of our national guard make different arrangements for benefits they are entitled to have?

When the a-hole governor of Alabama stood in the way of desegregation the federal government had the national guard move him from the school door. I'm pretty sure the OK national guard can move this bigoted ho from whatever door frame she wishes to stand under.


There's probably some strapping gay men who would be happy to take out the trash on the way to getting their benefits.
 
2013-09-20 02:07:07 PM

Rapmaster2000: Ed Grubermann: Aristocles: So I guess you think the Feds should start busting up the head shops popping up in states that have decriminalized mary jane?

Christ, I know you're nothing but a bottom of the barrel troll, but "Mary Jane"? You try way too hard to be hep and with it.

I've seriously gone back to calling it reefer.  I love the old school terminology.


Jazz Cigarettes has been my preferred terminology since college.
 
2013-09-20 02:07:19 PM

Aristocles: Fallin spokesman Alex Weintz said the governor was following the wish of Oklahoma voters, who approved a constitutional amendment in 2004 that prohibits giving benefits of marriage to gay couples. "Because of that prohibition, Gov. Fallin's general counsel has advised the National Guard not to process requests for benefits of same-sex couples," Weintz said. "Gay couples that have been legally married in other states will be advised they can apply for those benefits on federal facilities, such as Tinker Air Force Base, rather than state run facilities."

So, what's the story, Farklibs? The Gov. is following the letter of the law and advising same-sex couples how to get benefits.


2004 is an eternity ago on this issue. Even in Oklahoma. Would voters approve that amendment today? This is an example of panic legislation, old conservatives trying to lock down the laws they like because society is moving fast away from their position.
 
2013-09-20 02:07:32 PM

thismomentinblackhistory: 9,500 guardsmen, eh? How dare this Governor disenfranchise hundreds, if not thousands, of same-sex married couples.

Oh, wait....9,500?

She's probably just picking on a few dozen.


Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere.

// who said that?
// Iunno, probably some commie
 
2013-09-20 02:09:13 PM
Christ, what an asshole a biatch.
 
2013-09-20 02:10:44 PM

kbronsito: Why are we even bothering to have members of our national guard make different arrangements for benefits they are entitled to have?

When the a-hole governor of Alabama stood in the way of desegregation the federal government had the national guard move him from the school door. I'm pretty sure the OK national guard can move this bigoted ho from whatever door frame she wishes to stand under.


Your jib, I like the cut of it.
 
2013-09-20 02:13:11 PM
 She is a puppet for other, more powerful, men.


Isn't that how the GOP prefers their women?
 
2013-09-20 02:14:16 PM

Ed Grubermann: Aristocles: So I guess you think the Feds should start busting up the head shops popping up in states that have decriminalized mary jane?

Christ, I know you're nothing but a bottom of the barrel troll, but "Mary Jane"? You try way too hard to be hep and with it.


Yet it's so tantalizing we must comment. I have him suffiently dark grey so I don't have to see his derp, but for some reason I can't bring myself to ignore him.
 
2013-09-20 02:15:24 PM

hiker9999: She is a puppet for other, more powerful, men.


Isn't that how the GOP prefers their women?


Now I has a sad.
 
2013-09-20 02:17:52 PM
It really is amazing how one single relatively new gimmick account can run every single thread on the entire politics tab.
 
2013-09-20 02:19:38 PM

Karac: thismomentinblackhistory: 9,500 guardsmen, eh? How dare this Governor disenfranchise hundreds, if not thousands, of same-sex married couples.

Oh, wait....9,500?

She's probably just picking on a few dozen.

And Rosa Park's bus driver was only picking on one woman.


Oh I wasn't defending the Governor at all. I just think it's absurd she's going to such great lengths to disenfranchise a (few?) handfuls of people. The fact that we are dealing with dozens makes this all the more evil, although yeah, numbers don't really matter. She's the one taking a shotgun to a fruit fly.
 
2013-09-20 02:20:56 PM

MFAWG: sprawl15: Why do Republicans hate the troops?

They don't hate the troops. They just hate gay people more than they love America.


Completely concur with your comments about Republicans.
 
2013-09-20 02:31:07 PM
Oklahoma governor passionate defender of what she imagines Constitution to be.
 
2013-09-20 02:37:45 PM
yo libtards it's the USA not the USGAY!
 
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