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(LA Times)   Rhode Island police warned the navy that Aaron Alexis was hallucinating and hearing voices last month but navy officials deemed that he wasn't a threat. Defense chief Chuck Hagel says, "many warning signs were missed"   (latimes.com) divider line 97
    More: Stupid, Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel, Rhode Island, navy officials, Veterans Health Administration, Washington Navy Yard, threats, elf  
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1714 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Sep 2013 at 8:06 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-19 08:07:46 AM  
Ya think?
 
2013-09-19 08:10:10 AM  
although I hate to judge before all the facts are in, it's beginning to look like General Ripper exceeded his authority.
 
2013-09-19 08:12:42 AM  
Missed?  More like fingers in the ears yelling "I cant hear you, lalalalalalala!"  ignored!

There were all kinds of signs that were seen and/or known by people but nothing was acted upon.
 
2013-09-19 08:15:57 AM  
Unlike people in the cafeteria that morning.
 
2013-09-19 08:16:16 AM  
Rhode Island police warned the navy that Aaron Alexis was hallucinating and hearing voices last month but navy officials deemed that he wasn't a threat. Defense chief Chuck Hagel says, "many warning signs were missed completely ignored because he was doing his job.  Besides, what's he going to do, go postal and shoot up the place?"

This is probably closer to accurate.
 
2013-09-19 08:19:51 AM  
I bet they prescribed him some motrin for the voices.
 
nbt
2013-09-19 08:20:26 AM  
I know it makes me a bad person, but I can't help thinking of "Alice's Restaurant".
 
2013-09-19 08:20:56 AM  
A dozen or so funerals are a hell of a lot cheaper than providing professional counsel to every member of the forces whose behaviour raises a red flag or two.
 
2013-09-19 08:21:12 AM  

labman: Unlike people in the cafeteria that morning.


Magnificent.
 
2013-09-19 08:21:14 AM  
Nonsense. If the cowards in congress would take the NRA's cawk out of there mouths long enough to pass an assault weapons ban, this tragedy could have be averted!
 
2013-09-19 08:23:35 AM  

nbt: I know it makes me a bad person, but I can't help thinking of "Alice's Restaurant".


Shrink, I wanna kill......
 
2013-09-19 08:24:37 AM  

Road Warrior: Nonsense. If the cowards in congress would take the NRA's cawk out of there mouths long enough to pass an assault weapons ban, this tragedy could have be averted!


You're probably going to get a bite or two on that one.
 
2013-09-19 08:24:52 AM  

Boo_Guy: Missed?  More like fingers in the ears yelling "I cant hear you, lalalalalalala!"  ignored!

There were all kinds of signs that were seen and/or known by people but nothing was acted upon.


Considering the state of involuntary commitment law, I'm not entirely certain anything could have been done other than moving the location of his mass shooting to somewhere outside the security perimeter.
 
2013-09-19 08:25:26 AM  
If they got rid of everyone in the DoD that was hearing voices, it would become an Army of One.

Especially if you include the people who God told them to take a GS-12 position with Army Finance at Scott Air Force Base. Yes. God told them.

And the people who thought the National Guard Armory outside base was going to be a Civilian Rendition Center (Gulag). During construction, the weapons vault looked exactly like a gas chamber.
 
2013-09-19 08:26:19 AM  
Let's hear it for American mental healthcare.
 
2013-09-19 08:26:21 AM  

Road Warrior: Nonsense. If the cowards in congress would take the NRA's cawk out of there mouths long enough to pass an assault weapons ban, this tragedy could have be averted!


1/10. Too obvious. Please play again.
 
2013-09-19 08:27:21 AM  
FTA: "While in Newport, Alexis contacted human resources for his employer, the Experts, multiple times to complain about hearing voices in his hotel room, company spokesman Lou Colasuonno said. Company employees thought he was referring to actual voices, Colasuonno said, and moved him to new hotels twice "

WHAT THE SERIOUS fark?  I know they aren't rocket surgeons, but how could ANYBODY in human resources be that stupid?
 
2013-09-19 08:28:23 AM  
I can see the next killing.  "suspect talked about killing a large group of people but was dismissed by police"
 
2013-09-19 08:28:43 AM  
I'm not saying they did the right thing in any way but with the stigmatism associated with mental illness in this country no wonder they were reluctant to follow through on a warning. Just a note on his record saying it was looked into could have ruined him. He could have lost his clearance, his job, his career, and even if he had a doctor's not attesting otherwise it would have followed him around for the rest of his life.

As many other people have said, the problem is the lack of mental health services in the US and when they are available making sure the people who need them are found.
 
2013-09-19 08:30:22 AM  
ugh.  i feel badly for the VA staff who saw him--getting hung out to dry for simple triage.

warning signs are just that, warning signs.  mental health is wickedly complicated; ever see someone descend into this kind of trouble?  it's awful and you don't really know what you can do to help (a former roommate; eventually we had to help get him committed... and then again... and then again...).

underpaid, overworked people, even well meaning ones, aren't likely to make a godawful fuss up a bureaucratic pecking order if they don't think they can get things done, which means that if they don't have a feasible solution to propose, then nothing is likely to happen.

sadly, what seems likely to happen is that the VA system will be punished by funding cuts, when what should happen is that they'll be given MORE resources.

/cheerful this morning
 
2013-09-19 08:33:10 AM  

CheatCommando: Boo_Guy: Missed?  More like fingers in the ears yelling "I cant hear you, lalalalalalala!"  ignored!

There were all kinds of signs that were seen and/or known by people but nothing was acted upon.

Considering the state of involuntary commitment law, I'm not entirely certain anything could have been done other than moving the location of his mass shooting to somewhere outside the security perimeter.


Agreed,  its unfortunate.
 
2013-09-19 08:33:30 AM  
Don't believe everything you read.
 
2013-09-19 08:40:58 AM  
It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!
 
2013-09-19 08:41:22 AM  

dittybopper: Road Warrior: Nonsense. If the cowards in congress would take the NRA's cawk out of there mouths long enough to pass an assault weapons ban, this tragedy could have be averted!

You're probably going to get a bite or two on that one.


Sshh. You'll scare away all the fish
 
2013-09-19 08:47:19 AM  
And these are the people (government agents) many of you would like to have a monopoly on the use of guns.
They're incompetent.
 
2013-09-19 08:47:50 AM  
Why haven't they looked into whoever was following him around and using microwaves to keep him away? It's like the media is just cover that part of it up.

I'm just askin questions
 
2013-09-19 08:51:51 AM  
Yarrr, this quim be tastin' like the chef's special!
 
2013-09-19 08:51:59 AM  
If only there were a body of government, organization, or even a law that identifies threats to security, domestic or foreign...
 
2013-09-19 08:52:13 AM  
When I heard he was hearing voices through the walls and floor I figured he just lived in a shiatty apartment.

/have heard voices through walls and the floors and even sometimes the ceiling
//used to live in shiatty apartmentns
///It doesn't always mean you're crazy
 
2013-09-19 08:55:55 AM  

AngryDragon: FTA: "While in Newport, Alexis contacted human resources for his employer, the Experts, multiple times to complain about hearing voices in his hotel room, company spokesman Lou Colasuonno said. Company employees thought he was referring to actual voices, Colasuonno said, and moved him to new hotels twice "

WHAT THE SERIOUS fark?  I know they aren't rocket surgeons, but how could ANYBODY in human resources be that stupid?


Not sure what the other two hotels were, but one of the hotels was the Marriott, which is one of the best hotels in Newport.  It's not like they were putting him up in the Ramada on East Main Road - he was in a waterfront hotel.  In Newport, that's as good as it gets.
 
2013-09-19 08:56:04 AM  

HypnozombieX: Why haven't they looked into whoever was following him around and using microwaves to keep him away? It's like the media is just cover that part of it up.

I'm just askin questions


www.keeptalkinggreece.com

25.media.tumblr.com
 
2013-09-19 08:59:16 AM  

JohnCarter: HypnozombieX: Why haven't they looked into whoever was following him around and using microwaves to keep him away? It's like the media is just cover that part of it up.

I'm just askin questions

[www.keeptalkinggreece.com image 600x450]

[25.media.tumblr.com image 400x400]


EXACTLY!!! They know whats up!!!
 
2013-09-19 08:59:42 AM  

AngryDragon: FTA: "While in Newport, Alexis contacted human resources for his employer, the Experts, multiple times to complain about hearing voices in his hotel room, company spokesman Lou Colasuonno said. Company employees thought he was referring to actual voices, Colasuonno said, and moved him to new hotels twice "

WHAT THE SERIOUS fark?  I know they aren't rocket surgeons, but how could ANYBODY in human resources be that stupid?


You answered your own question.
 
2013-09-19 08:59:49 AM  
How many people believe they have a personal relationship with god, and that he speaks to them and personally intervenes in their lives? The only difference between them and this guy is that the message this time was "Kill people" rather than "Eat at IHOP, tip 10%."
 
2013-09-19 09:04:32 AM  

mmagdalene: How many people believe they have a personal relationship with god, and that he speaks to them and personally intervenes in their lives?


well how many??

how does that work? they hear an actual voice, or they just 'get a feeling'?
 
2013-09-19 09:05:21 AM  
Hindsight is 20/20.
 
2013-09-19 09:19:08 AM  

KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!


Who said that? Or were you just injecting your own prejudice into the thread and seeing what you wanted to see?
 
2013-09-19 09:24:42 AM  

Brick-House: Ya think Dinozo?


Where is Gibbs when ya need him?
 
2013-09-19 09:24:59 AM  
On a more serious note, this guy's ramblings are more or less verbatim of what my one of neighbors has been mumbling since he had his psychological breakdown this spring. Whenever he goes off his meds he starts screaming about radiation and microwaves. He also stays up for days at a time, not eating and wearing only sweat pants. He's one of several ex-military people in my little neighborhood. Several of them including him were in counselling for PTSD, but so far, he's the only one who's started hearing voices.

/NSCSB
//Maybe the military IS dosing them with microwaves
///It's NOT aliens.
 
2013-09-19 09:26:29 AM  

mmagdalene: How many people believe they have a personal relationship with god, and that he speaks to them and personally intervenes in their lives? The only difference between them and this guy is that the message this time was "Kill people" rather than "Eat at IHOP, tip 10%."


If you're eating at IHOP, tipping 10% is probably less than a dollar per person.  Leave a $5 bill on the table and be a big spender for once.

/intentional threadjack
 
2013-09-19 09:26:39 AM  

KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!


Name one state or locale in the entire country where a history of serious mental illness is not a barrier to firearms ownership.
 
2013-09-19 09:27:05 AM  
Had Seattle convicted him of a crime, would he have been able to purchase a shotgun in VA? Own a gun in TX? Join the Navy Reserve?
I think if you shoot out someone's tires that should be the end of your right to own a gun.
I don't see why anyone would have a problem with that.
 
2013-09-19 09:29:43 AM  

AngryDragon: KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!

Name one state or locale in the entire country where a history of serious mental illness is not a barrier to firearms ownership.


Any state where the government doesn't have your medical records.
 
2013-09-19 09:30:05 AM  

KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!


Mental health care is in a sorry enough state without pitching that political hand grenade into the mix.
 
2013-09-19 09:32:10 AM  

AngryDragon: KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!

Name one state or locale in the entire country where a history of serious mental illness is not a barrier to firearms ownership.


Anywhere there is gun shows? (private sales)
 
2013-09-19 09:35:40 AM  

Nina_Hartley's_Ass: AngryDragon: KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!

Name one state or locale in the entire country where a history of serious mental illness is not a barrier to firearms ownership.

Any state where the government doesn't have your medical records.


It's still not legal.
 
2013-09-19 09:36:43 AM  

Witty_Retort: AngryDragon: KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!

Name one state or locale in the entire country where a history of serious mental illness is not a barrier to firearms ownership.

Anywhere there is gun shows? (private sales)


And this also doesn't make it legal.  Again, responsible gun owners want enforcement of existing laws.  There are enough of them already to prevent these things from happening.
 
2013-09-19 09:38:31 AM  

Witty_Retort: AngryDragon: KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!

Name one state or locale in the entire country where a history of serious mental illness is not a barrier to firearms ownership.

Anywhere there is gun shows? (private sales)


If you buy from a dealer at a gun show there is a check just like in a gun store.  Where this bull crap got started I have no idea.  There is no "gun show" loophole.
 
2013-09-19 09:39:13 AM  

AngryDragon: Witty_Retort: AngryDragon: KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!

Name one state or locale in the entire country where a history of serious mental illness is not a barrier to firearms ownership.

Anywhere there is gun shows? (private sales)

And this also doesn't make it legal.  Again, responsible gun owners want enforcement of existing laws.  There are enough of them already to prevent these things from happening.


So you agree to background checks for private sales?
 
2013-09-19 09:42:29 AM  

Bigdogdaddy: Witty_Retort: AngryDragon: KyngNothing: It's interesting to see people who simultaneously think he should have lost his job and be involuntarily committed, but that he shouldn't have lost his right to buy a gun!

Name one state or locale in the entire country where a history of serious mental illness is not a barrier to firearms ownership.

Anywhere there is gun shows? (private sales)

If you buy from a dealer at a gun show there is a check just like in a gun store.  Where this bull crap got started I have no idea.  There is no "gun show" loophole.


Hey, I'll meet ya after the show in the parking lot where I shall no longer be a dealer but a private citizen.
As I said private sales
Trying to muddle the situation is bad form.
 
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