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(Time)   How bad is the suicide problem in China? Incoming college students are being asked to sign waivers absolving the college of responsibility if they kill themselves   (world.time.com) divider line 78
    More: Sad, Chinese, students, City College of New York, Anhui Province, Ministry Of Health, Guangdong Province, waivers, moral responsibility  
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3744 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Sep 2013 at 12:28 PM (49 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-18 10:54:20 AM
But their roommate still gets a 4.0 for the semester, right?
 
2013-09-18 11:02:34 AM
Wouldn't a Chinese student just jump off a building and apologize to everyone on the way down for failing to achieve perfection? But I guess it now needs to be in writing.
 
2013-09-18 11:18:10 AM
Just put up the nets like they do at the factories.

farm5.static.flickr.com
 
2013-09-18 11:22:50 AM

blatz514: Just put up the nets like they do at the factories.

[farm5.static.flickr.com image 500x342]


For a photograph with no gore or violence whatsoever, that's surprisingly disturbing.  It's like "Your life will suck."  "Oh yeah, well I'll show you!"  "NO!  You can't take that way out either, get back to work"
 
2013-09-18 11:35:12 AM
Suicide is not a 'problem' in China.  Liability is.
 
2013-09-18 12:10:31 PM

Sybarite: But their roommate still gets a 4.0 for the semester, right?


Only if he went to Bayside High.

/nice reference.
 
2013-09-18 12:31:14 PM

nekom: blatz514: Just put up the nets like they do at the factories.

[farm5.static.flickr.com image 500x342]

For a photograph with no gore or violence whatsoever, that's surprisingly disturbing.  It's like "Your life will suck."  "Oh yeah, well I'll show you!"  "NO!  You can't take that way out either, get back to work"


Well said.
 
2013-09-18 12:32:27 PM
B on blood test = jump
 
2013-09-18 12:32:45 PM

Diogenes: Suicide is not a 'problem' in China.  Liability is.


Yay, they've successfully become 2nd america just like they wanted!

/I'll sue you for your potentially defamatory comment later
 
2013-09-18 12:32:50 PM

cryinoutloud: Wouldn't a Chinese student just jump off a building and apologize to everyone on the way down for failing to achieve perfection? But I guess it now needs to be in writing.


No that's Japan.

N china they kill themselves because they don't like being tortured.
 
2013-09-18 12:34:23 PM
Young people killing themselves in China?

It's all about the Youth in Asia.
 
2013-09-18 12:36:22 PM
Poor men to women ratios like in China usually lead to war. Suicide I suppose is a positive alternative.
 
2013-09-18 12:37:47 PM
They should come to the US where our lax gun laws allow them to go on murderous rampages before committing suicide.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Iowa_shooting
 
2013-09-18 12:40:01 PM
If your roommate kills them self, it's an automatic A
 
2013-09-18 12:40:02 PM

LarryDan43: Poor men to women ratios like in China usually lead to war. Suicide I suppose is a positive alternative.


It's the women committing suicide.
 
2013-09-18 12:40:23 PM
Chinese students are just too tense. Maybe the universities can offer free sleeping pills.
 
2013-09-18 12:40:47 PM

Madame Ovary: They should come to the US where our lax gun laws allow them to go on murderous rampages before committing suicide.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Iowa_shooting


twenty years ago. There are people on this site who will read this that were not born when that happened.
 
2013-09-18 12:42:23 PM
Because capitalism is FUN!
 
2013-09-18 12:44:14 PM

wildcardjack: LarryDan43: Poor men to women ratios like in China usually lead to war. Suicide I suppose is a positive alternative.

It's the women committing suicide.


Why don't they just come over here and run nail salons?
 
2013-09-18 12:44:48 PM

Day_Old_Dutchie: Young people killing themselves in China?

It's all about the Youth in Asia.

 
2013-09-18 12:45:06 PM
Long falls could be the royal road to pension shortfalls.
 
2013-09-18 12:45:35 PM

Snarfangel: Chinese students are just too tense. Maybe the universities can offer free sleeping pills.



Maybe they should have though twice before exporting all of their massage engineers to US airports and malls.
 
2013-09-18 12:46:03 PM

wildcardjack: LarryDan43: Poor men to women ratios like in China usually lead to war. Suicide I suppose is a positive alternative.

It's the women committing suicide.


Well we're screwed
 
2013-09-18 12:46:16 PM
i.qkme.me
 
2013-09-18 12:49:28 PM

Crewmannumber6: wildcardjack: LarryDan43: Poor men to women ratios like in China usually lead to war. Suicide I suppose is a positive alternative.

It's the women committing suicide.

Why don't they just come over here and run nail salons?


Those are Vietnamese.

Different Asians syndrome.
 
2013-09-18 12:50:10 PM

RedPhoenix122: Sybarite: But their roommate still gets a 4.0 for the semester, right?

Only if he went to Bayside High.

/nice reference.


www.chucksconnection.com
I SAID I'LL LIGHT IT!
 
2013-09-18 12:50:30 PM

Sybarite: But their roommate still gets a 4.0 for the semester, right?


Of course,  四 (4 in Chinese) is a near homophone of 死 (death), so that isn't quite as lucky as you would think.
 
2013-09-18 12:50:38 PM

LarryDan43: Poor men to women ratios like in China usually lead to war. Suicide I suppose is a positive alternative.


No war yet you mean.
 
2013-09-18 12:50:58 PM
Advice for potential suicides in China:

Take some government officials with you. Or at least some police officers. Seriously.

/the Chinese government really *is* the devil. We just ignore it because they sell us cheap stuff
 
2013-09-18 12:51:22 PM
These kids should just start smokin the dope and realize that C's get degrees.
 
2013-09-18 12:53:04 PM

nekom: blatz514: Just put up the nets like they do at the factories.

[farm5.static.flickr.com image 500x342]

For a photograph with no gore or violence whatsoever, that's surprisingly disturbing.  It's like "Your life will suck."  "Oh yeah, well I'll show you!"  "NO!  You can't take that way out either, get back to work"


Go see them in person sometime; its haunting.  Such a Chinese solution to a problem without any consideration for the individual.
 
2013-09-18 12:59:01 PM
Thanks Obama!
 
2013-09-18 01:03:09 PM
And to think, this is currently America's main competitor for superpower status.
 
2013-09-18 01:03:48 PM

lohphat: Crewmannumber6: wildcardjack: LarryDan43: Poor men to women ratios like in China usually lead to war. Suicide I suppose is a positive alternative.

It's the women committing suicide.

Why don't they just come over here and run nail salons?

Those are Vietnamese.

Different Asians syndrome.


Nope, Korean.

i1.ytimg.com
 
2013-09-18 01:04:50 PM
From TFA: "But a massive increase in the numbers of students taking university courses coupled with a sharp economic slowdown has meant that, for many, a degree is not the golden ticket it once seemed to be."

Would it be unseemly of me to giggle and say "How's it feel?"
 
2013-09-18 01:05:00 PM

Madame Ovary: They should come to the US where our lax gun laws allow them to go on murderous rampages before committing suicide.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Iowa_shooting


I checked, and it turns out, there WERE laws against having guns on campus then!  Somehow, the magical barrier this formed around the university was somehow disrupted before his rampage, or obviously this never would have happened.

Back more to the actual topic on hand, China is going to be interesting.  Imagine a country with 4x the population size of the US, with wage and quality of life disparity that pales even compared to the welfare recipient vs. super-rich you see in the US; people still actually starve to death, and the majority of the population is living in actual poverty.  Yet, in the last 30 years, they've gone from basically turn of the century technology to producing much of the world's most technological goods, but this has only benefited a small handful of people.  At the same time, they've been opening up capitalistic markets, making mass communication available, and focusing on education - especially literacy.

Unfortunately, they have massive governmental restrictions that historically, have curtailed those previous gains and lowered morale, much of it even more invasive due to the new technologies available.  Their stance on environmental issues, worker rights, human rights, and so on mean that the same folks working in those technology companies are often abused, paid high wage relative to their impoverished brethren, but made to suffer both physically and psychologically for it while the fat cats at the top reap the rewards.  There's even a system where the rich pay the poor to serve jail time on their behalf!

So now they've got a massive, literate, potentially well connected society, where the benefits of westernization are at least well known to the public at large, and they're riding the crest of an economic surge that will eventually perform the standard boom-bust cycle, with a massive poverty-stricken population that is effectively denied real advancement while watching the select few profit directly from their abuse.

I'm thinking we'll see a revolution in the next, say, 20 years in China, and I wonder what form it will take.  If it's going to be a violent uprising or if it'll be an 'end of communist russia' style breakup, or something altogether.

What I am sure of though, is that China can't stick to the current path for another 20 years and not simply go down in a ball of flame.
 
2013-09-18 01:06:44 PM

Diogenes: Suicide is not a 'problem' in China.  Liability is.


Actually it is encouraging the Chinese are starting to worry about liability. It used to be of no concern and almost inconceivable that a powerful person or institution could be blamed for the fate of a lesser person.

Even today China isn't really a nation of laws. If some mid-high level person screws up and causes a bunch of deaths then higher ups may decide upon execution as punishment - which is more a bureaucratic decision than a legal decision.
 
2013-09-18 01:07:41 PM
Would this type of required exculpatory contract even be allowed in the United States for college freshman?
 
2013-09-18 01:09:20 PM
I wonder US students would be under more stress if incoming freshman knew that the bottom 20% of them would be unable to find jobs that required a college degree, and would still have to pay back the loans they took out, and they would never be anything more than slaves to that debt for the rest of their miserable lives. That's not really a problem as far as society goes. Maybe if it was 50%, that would be a problem. But it's 20%, so we're not going to fix it, and you kids better hope you're not in that 20%.
Midterms are coming up, kids. You'd better study.
 
2013-09-18 01:15:03 PM

quietwalker: Madame Ovary: They should come to the US where our lax gun laws allow them to go on murderous rampages before committing suicide.  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/University_of_Iowa_shooting

I checked, and it turns out, there WERE laws against having guns on campus then!  Somehow, the magical barrier this formed around the university was somehow disrupted before his rampage, or obviously this never would have happened.

Back more to the actual topic on hand, China is going to be interesting.  Imagine a country with 4x the population size of the US, with wage and quality of life disparity that pales even compared to the welfare recipient vs. super-rich you see in the US; people still actually starve to death, and the majority of the population is living in actual poverty.  Yet, in the last 30 years, they've gone from basically turn of the century technology to producing much of the world's most technological goods, but this has only benefited a small handful of people.  At the same time, they've been opening up capitalistic markets, making mass communication available, and focusing on education - especially literacy.

Unfortunately, they have massive governmental restrictions that historically, have curtailed those previous gains and lowered morale, much of it even more invasive due to the new technologies available.  Their stance on environmental issues, worker rights, human rights, and so on mean that the same folks working in those technology companies are often abused, paid high wage relative to their impoverished brethren, but made to suffer both physically and psychologically for it while the fat cats at the top reap the rewards.  There's even a system where the rich pay the poor to serve jail time on their behalf!

So now they've got a massive, literate, potentially well connected society, where the benefits of westernization are at least well known to the public at large, and they're riding the crest of an economic surge that will eventually perform the standard boom-bust cycle, with a massive poverty-stricken population that is effectively denied real advancement while watching the select few profit directly from their abuse.

I'm thinking we'll see a revolution in the next, say, 20 years in China, and I wonder what form it will take.  If it's going to be a violent uprising or if it'll be an 'end of communist russia' style breakup, or something altogether.

What I am sure of though, is that China can't stick to the current path for another 20 years and not simply go down in a ball of flame.


I cannot wait until the workerless factories are perfected. Then china will have massive unemployment, massive warchest and lots of technological advanced countries around it. WW3 will start in China.
 
2013-09-18 01:16:54 PM

WordyGrrl: From TFA: "But a massive increase in the numbers of students taking university courses coupled with a sharp economic slowdown has meant that, for many, a degree is not the golden ticket it once seemed to be."

Would it be unseemly of me to giggle and say "How's it feel?"


Slow your schadenfreude.  The students don't pay, and end up with massive debt - usually.  Not only that, the government deliberately restricts what you can study, in an attempt to ensure that your education won't be a waste when it comes time for you to earn a living.  Despite that line from the article, China has actually made good headway at ensuring graduates get jobs.

Now, on the other hand, there are private universities that cost money, and the trend of the rich or well connected is to send their children to the US for schooling.  Because they do have such high competitiveness in education, sometimes these are seen as the better route, even if it costs money.

The real issue is that there's no well defined middle class, and if you're not at the top, you're at the bottom.  When they say these people don't have jobs, they ~may~ be saying that they actually run the risk of starving to death or working in the equivalent of an 18'th century industrial factory with a nearly complete lack of labor rights and horrific safety concerns.  Which is what the REST of the country may have to deal with, if they're not dirt farming.
 
2013-09-18 01:32:07 PM
Meanwhile in America, you have to sign waivers for all kinds of stupid crap.
But keep thinking you're better or different than other countries somehow.
 
2013-09-18 01:33:09 PM
China is pretty well running neck to neck along with Africa to be the most f**ked up nation in the world.

From forced birth control to environmental pollution on nearly an unheard of scale, to few, if any labor laws to massively corrupt civil servants and basically a cultivated 'f**k you' attitude among the average citizens.

They've been tearing down relics of their past at a major rate, ignoring the pleas and cries of international archeologists, ignoring building codes and have done such things like build huge cities -- then didn't populate them. There's one designed for maybe a million people that (A) has no streets, (B) is out in the middle of nowhere and (C) currently holds a maintenance population of a few thousand.

A Chinese businessman millionaire bought the top suit of an apartment complex and decided to modify it, by building several hundred tons of rustic mountain top on the roof. Now the building is cracking since it was never designed for the additional weight, neighbors are complaining, he never bothered with permits and the city officials have been well paid off to leave him alone. In another example, a businessman built a huge home on top of his 4 story factory -- wider than the factory itself. It's perched on far too thin cement columns and doesn't match the original designs he gave the planning commission to get permission to build it.

It's also far too heavy for the much older factory holding it all up.

The wealthy have a history of just moving in on others land to build huge homes, which is pi$$ing off farmers who usually own the land. See, they don't bother buying the land first or asking permission.

China is a nightmare country. I suspect that the only reason Islamic Terrorists aren't throwing bombs over there like everywhere else is because they know they can't do much more damage and the Chinese probably wouldn't care.

Don't forget the big female shortage, which started during the forced birth control: male babies are more important than female there, so far more girls were aborted than males. This had about the expected results. It never dawned on the government that without girls, there will be no boys.

They promptly compensated by developing a thriving 'wife stealing' business and invest6ing in 'white slavery'.

In the past, male heavy China has deliberately initiated small wars to bleed off some of the far too many guys in the population. I recall one record telling of a battle charge where thousands of Chinese faced a well armed enemy, yet didn't have the guns to supply all the troops. So, as the soldiers in the front lines got shot down, new troops coming up grabbed up their still smoking weapons and continued the charge.

The enemy obligingly mowed down the majority of the forces, helping to decrease the population in China.
China at times, makes the genocidal, Tribal tradition clinging guerrillas of several African rebel armies seem like geniuses in war. At least they don't hack up albino citizens for use in folk cures.

However, they have been known to run over kids, drive off and everyone else just go about their business as the kid lays there, bleeding to death.
 
2013-09-18 01:35:40 PM

quietwalker: WordyGrrl: From TFA: "But a massive increase in the numbers of students taking university courses coupled with a sharp economic slowdown has meant that, for many, a degree is not the golden ticket it once seemed to be."

Would it be unseemly of me to giggle and say "How's it feel?"

Slow your schadenfreude.  The students don't pay, and end up with massive debt - usually.  Not only that, the government deliberately restricts what you can study, in an attempt to ensure that your education won't be a waste when it comes time for you to earn a living.  Despite that line from the article, China has actually made good headway at ensuring graduates get jobs.

Now, on the other hand, there are private universities that cost money, and the trend of the rich or well connected is to send their children to the US for schooling.  Because they do have such high competitiveness in education, sometimes these are seen as the better route, even if it costs money.

The real issue is that there's no well defined middle class, and if you're not at the top, you're at the bottom.  When they say these people don't have jobs, they ~may~ be saying that they actually run the risk of starving to death or working in the equivalent of an 18'th century industrial factory with a nearly complete lack of labor rights and horrific safety concerns.  Which is what the REST of the country may have to deal with, if they're not dirt farming.


This dichotomy made me sad.  This is Jimmy Choo's (luxury shoe guy) son, Danny who renounced the throne and went to Japan to live and breathe dolls.  It cuts from him and his dolls to the factory where they are made.  Skip to about 9:05.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xikk85_culture-japan-episode-1-shio ri -mikami-wonder-festival-and-japanese-festivals_shortfilms
 
2013-09-18 01:42:43 PM

rumpelstiltskin: I wonder US students would be under more stress if incoming freshman knew that the bottom 20% of them would be unable to find jobs that required a college degree, and would still have to pay back the loans they took out, and they would never be anything more than slaves to that debt for the rest of their miserable lives.


That's true of the top 20% of US students...
 
2013-09-18 01:43:11 PM
Well when you only have a 1 in 5 chance of ever getting farked by a woman, and you are not homosexually inclined killing yourself is the only option.
 
2013-09-18 01:44:28 PM

Slaves2Darkness: Well when you only have a 1 in 5 chance of ever getting farked by a woman, and you are not homosexually inclined killing yourself is the only option.


www.the-two-malcontents.com
 
2013-09-18 01:47:55 PM

quietwalker: WordyGrrl: From TFA: "But a massive increase in the numbers of students taking university courses coupled with a sharp economic slowdown has meant that, for many, a degree is not the golden ticket it once seemed to be."

Would it be unseemly of me to giggle and say "How's it feel?"

Slow your schadenfreude.  The students don't pay, and end up with massive debt - usually.  Not only that, the government deliberately restricts what you can study, in an attempt to ensure that your education won't be a waste when it comes time for you to earn a living.  Despite that line from the article, China has actually made good headway at ensuring graduates get jobs.

Now, on the other hand, there are private universities that cost money, and the trend of the rich or well connected is to send their children to the US for schooling.  Because they do have such high competitiveness in education, sometimes these are seen as the better route, even if it costs money.

The real issue is that there's no well defined middle class, and if you're not at the top, you're at the bottom.  When they say these people don't have jobs, they ~may~ be saying that they actually run the risk of starving to death or working in the equivalent of an 18'th century industrial factory with a nearly complete lack of labor rights and horrific safety concerns.  Which is what the REST of the country may have to deal with, if they're not dirt farming.


Well there is that whole you go work on the latest ishiat for the next 18 months or we kill you that occasionally happens to Chinese students. I was surprised that there were no riots, because if that had happened to me I'd have tried to burn down the university and been shot down dead like a dog that nobody loves.
 
2013-09-18 01:59:55 PM

Rik01: They promptly compensated by developing a thriving 'wife stealing' business and invest6ing in 'white slavery'.


Hadn't heard of that.  I just heard that there was a massive problem with tens of millions of men who would NEVER get married.

/And because of that "Better to cry in a car than laugh on a bicycle" thing, it's the poor guys who are (not) getting screwed.
//Have fun pulling the same crap as the Middle East, China.
 
2013-09-18 02:07:42 PM

The Southern Logic Company: Such a Chinese solution to a problem without any consideration for the individual.


That makes it doubly bad, because somewhere some executive or party official got the news "Sir, we've had a lot of suicides from people jumping out of windows at our factory" and his response was "Hmmm... Well, put up some nets then, that ought to stop it."

Different culture I know, but still that's crazy.
 
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