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(Slate)   Conservatives long awaited Obamacare replacement bill is set to be unveiled, laughed at   (slate.com) divider line 473
    More: Amusing, obamacare  
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2816 clicks; posted to Politics » on 18 Sep 2013 at 11:50 AM (1 year ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-18 11:57:41 AM  
Is it tax cuts?

I bet it's tax cuts.
 
2013-09-18 11:58:34 AM  
Obamacare is the conservative/Republican alternative to a liberal/Democrat healthcare solution. Altneratives include the status quo, which all seem to agree has failed, "Medicare for all", single payer, or public option. The only real conservative alternative healthcare solution I see is continue with the health care policies we've had in this country that got us to this point in the first place, with some handy wavey notion of "tort reform" and lip service to "personal responsibility".

It's really frustrating that Republican's haven't claimed this as a victory. They won the health care debate and now are activly trying to bring us to a system that has been showed to fail.
 
2013-09-18 11:58:55 AM  
"The RSC press release announcing the bill's introduction included no hints of what the legislation might contain."

Until then, there is nothing to discuss. Just threads full of 'OMG I hate repubs'!!elevenses!!1!!
 
2013-09-18 11:59:17 AM  
I love snarky Yglesias.
 
2013-09-18 11:59:38 AM  
Mr. Whiteman, paging Mr. Whiteman! Mr. Whiteman to the Caucasian courtesy phone!

Tell me the difference between this group and a secret Klan rally?

www.slate.com
 
2013-09-18 12:00:47 PM  

minnesotaboy: Mr. Whiteman, paging Mr. Whiteman! Mr. Whiteman to the Caucasian courtesy phone!

Tell me the difference between this group and a secret Klan rally?

[www.slate.com image 568x346]


Better dressed.
 
2013-09-18 12:01:02 PM  

Lucky LaRue: HighOnCraic: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.

The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country.

Yeah. Okay. Because liberals haven't been saying this bill is crappy, but better than the sh*t sandwich we had before already.

Are you pretending conservatives aren't screaming non-stop about AHA now? All while supporting when not called "Obamacare"? Supporting it when you go issue by issue?

I'll stick with what HAS happened. You can live by what you believe WILL happen.

Thanks for proving my point.

It isn't what's good or bad for the country that people like you (and your counterparts on the far right) care about.  It's about standing in direct opposition to anything the other side proposes.

When did I stand in opposition? Where is the plan?

YOU are the one saying what "will" happen in the future. I'm pointing out what HAS ALREADY HAPPENED.

Are you trolling? Seriously. How do you claim to "prove a point" about something non-existent?

Oh. I GET IT. You are one of those "I'm above it all" people...

I'm not "above it all", certainly.  I just use rationality and logic to guide my political views, which is something that the far-left and far-right are incapable of.  The teahadist and the herbal tea baggers only care about their games of one-upmanship, and that's fine because it keeps you entertained, but what you are doing isn't politics and it doesn't help the country.

[ohwaityou'reseriousletmelaughevenharder.jpg]

This is what I least enjoy about talking with your lot.  You get so overwrought you can't even put forward ideas; you just start throwing out insults and celebrating a "score."


Your basic premise was proved incorrect in previous posts.  At this point, I don't think you believe the stuff you're posting.
 
2013-09-18 12:01:03 PM  

Lucky LaRue: coeyagi: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.

The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country.

The GOP has done nothing of value in the last 4.5 years.  This would be just extrapolation from the trending data.

Thanks for serving as yet another example that proves the point.


Go ahead, name something of value that the GOP as a whole has done in the last 4.5 years.

And no, we will not accept trying (and failing) to repeal the ACA 41 (it may be more by now) times.

Pencils Ready...

BEGIN!
 
2013-09-18 12:01:03 PM  
Wouldn't it just be so fun if the Republican alternative was single payer health care?
 
2013-09-18 12:01:25 PM  

AirForceVet: I believe the real issue is the Democrats have introduced the ACA that, once implemented, will become popular like Social Security and Medicare are now.


And I believe that ACA is much more like "No Child Left Behind" - well intentioned, utterly ineffective, too expensive to actually implement, and with enough bureaucratic nonsense for everyone on any side of the aisle to hate it. And once in place, very difficult to remove or replace.
 
2013-09-18 12:01:36 PM  

mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.


It's worse than that. His plan would 3x the current cost of most health care plans. It sounds as if he does not understand how insurance works.
 
2013-09-18 12:02:35 PM  

Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.

The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country.


The pretend Liberal behavior described here is equal to with the real Conservative behavior.
 
2013-09-18 12:03:39 PM  

Lucky LaRue: Lionel Mandrake: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.

The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country.

Yeah. Okay. Because liberals haven't been saying this bill is crappy, but better than the sh*t sandwich we had before already.

Are you pretending conservatives aren't screaming non-stop about AHA now? All while supporting when not called "Obamacare"? Supporting it when you go issue by issue?

I'll stick with what HAS happened. You can live by what you believe WILL happen.

Thanks for proving my point.

It isn't what's good or bad for the country that people like you (and your counterparts on the far right) care about.  It's about standing in direct opposition to anything the other side proposes.

No such point was proved.  He said liberals aren't thrilled with the ACA, but it's better than nothing, not "It sucks but it pisses the right off so I'm for it"

If you can't see the difference, it's probably best to avoid trying to converse with you.

Listen, I'm not at all perturbed that you don't want to talk to me simply because I refuse to narrow my world-view down with the black-and-white filters you put on every day to make your hatred for the other side seem more righteous.


You are a complete ass.  Good thing you can be an ITG.  At a bar you'd be beaten bloody with this attitude.
 
2013-09-18 12:03:42 PM  
So their health care bill is like Romney's economic plan.
 
2013-09-18 12:03:49 PM  

HighOnCraic: Lucky LaRue: HighOnCraic: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.

The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country.

Yeah. Okay. Because liberals haven't been saying this bill is crappy, but better than the sh*t sandwich we had before already.

Are you pretending conservatives aren't screaming non-stop about AHA now? All while supporting when not called "Obamacare"? Supporting it when you go issue by issue?

I'll stick with what HAS happened. You can live by what you believe WILL happen.

Thanks for proving my point.

It isn't what's good or bad for the country that people like you (and your counterparts on the far right) care about.  It's about standing in direct opposition to anything the other side proposes.

When did I stand in opposition? Where is the plan?

YOU are the one saying what "will" happen in the future. I'm pointing out what HAS ALREADY HAPPENED.

Are you trolling? Seriously. How do you claim to "prove a point" about something non-existent?

Oh. I GET IT. You are one of those "I'm above it all" people...

I'm not "above it all", certainly.  I just use rationality and logic to guide my political views, which is something that the far-left and far-right are incapable of.  The teahadist and the herbal tea baggers only care about their games of one-upmanship, and that's fine because it keeps you entertained, but what you are doing isn't politics and it doesn't help the country.

[ohwaityou'reseriousletmelaughevenharder.jpg]

This is what I least enjoy about talking with your lot.  You get so overwrought you can't even put forward ideas; you just start throwing out insults and celebrating a "score."

Your basic premise was proved incorrect in previous posts.  At this point, I don't think you believe the stuff you're posting.


What is it that you assume my basic premise is, exactly, that it has been dis-proven?  I am beginning to suspect you just talk in circles until people get tired of trying to extract reason from you.
 
2013-09-18 12:03:58 PM  

Lucky LaRue: coeyagi: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.

The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country.

The GOP has done nothing of value in the last 4.5 years.  This would be just extrapolation from the trending data.

Thanks for serving as yet another example that proves the point.


You do realize that is how you lose elections and lose faith, right?  By being a worthless sack of obstructionist douchebags for 4.5 years.  I mean, we'll take a look and listen to what they have to say, but ultimately why would we think - without seeing it yet - that it would do anything but help HMOs and doctors more and regular people less?  They have done nothing for anyone in the lower classes except sh*t on their faces.

Why do you enjoy having your face sh*t upon?
 
2013-09-18 12:04:07 PM  

Lionel Mandrake: Mike_LowELL: I am in full support of this bill.  I can't wait to see what they propose in the bill.

OK...that was funny


he's one of our best, along with PN.
 
2013-09-18 12:04:10 PM  

Mike_LowELL: I am in full support of this bill.  I can't wait to see what they propose in the bill.


Well played.
 
2013-09-18 12:04:37 PM  

Lucky LaRue: Generation_D: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.

The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country.

Yeah. Okay. Because liberals haven't been saying this bill is crappy, but better than the sh*t sandwich we had before already.

Are you pretending conservatives aren't screaming non-stop about AHA now? All while supporting when not called "Obamacare"? Supporting it when you go issue by issue?

I'll stick with what HAS happened. You can live by what you believe WILL happen.

Thanks for proving my point.

It isn't what's good or bad for the country that people like you (and your counterparts on the far right) care about.  It's about standing in direct opposition to anything the other side proposes.

The bill was passed and is now law. Anyone going against that is probably doing so because they have an obstructionist goal, and would fark the country rather than do what is right.

A Republican, in other words.

This is just the kind of clap-trap I am talking about.  In your world-view, anyone opposed to your agenda is an obstructionist who would rather f*ck the country than do what is right.  In the tea-baggers world-view, anyone opposed to their agenda is an unpatriotic socialist who would rather f*ck the country than stand up for freedom.

Both world views make for great entertainment, but are pretty f*cking ridiculous when it comes to governance.


Says the guy who started the partisan attacks in this thread. You are worse than the people you claim to hate, because you erroneously place yourself above the fray.
 
2013-09-18 12:04:43 PM  
Ah, taking on the Fredo role in American Politics


nilesfiles.files.wordpress.comI can handle things! I'm smart! Not like everybody says... like dumb... I'm smart and I want respect!
 
2013-09-18 12:04:45 PM  

Lucky LaRue: I am beginning to suspect you just talk in circles until people get tired of trying to extract reason from you.


I see you just met HighonCraic :)
 
2013-09-18 12:05:31 PM  

Lucky LaRue: This is just the kind of clap-trap I am talking about.  In your world-view, anyone opposed to your agenda is an obstructionist who would rather f*ck the country than do what is right.  In the tea-baggers world-view, anyone opposed to their agenda is an unpatriotic socialist who would rather f*ck the country than stand up for freedom.

Both world views make for great entertainment, but are pretty f*cking ridiculous when it comes to governance.


"Well, the important thing is that you've found a way to feel superior to both."
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-09-18 12:05:39 PM  

minnesotaboy: Mr. Whiteman, paging Mr. Whiteman! Mr. Whiteman to the Caucasian courtesy phone!

Tell me the difference between this group and a secret Klan rally?


No hoods?
 
2013-09-18 12:05:58 PM  

Lucky LaRue: This is what I least enjoy about talking with your lot.  You get so overwrought you can't even put forward ideas; you just start throwing out insults and celebrating a "score."


Says the person whose boobies was "The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country. "
 
2013-09-18 12:06:02 PM  

Heliovdrake: Lucky LaRue: coeyagi: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.

The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country.

The GOP has done nothing of value in the last 4.5 years.  This would be just extrapolation from the trending data.

Thanks for serving as yet another example that proves the point.

Go ahead, name something of value that the GOP as a whole has done in the last 4.5 years.

And no, we will not accept trying (and failing) to repeal the ACA 41 (it may be more by now) times.

Pencils Ready...

BEGIN!


So, you are ready to concede that liberals will hate anything put forward by a Republican even if it is exactly what s/he wants, simply because it was put forward by a Republican?  Because, you know, that is what I am observing just now - I haven't opined on what the GOP has or has not done in the last 4.5 years.
 
2013-09-18 12:06:07 PM  

BojanglesPaladin: AirForceVet: I believe the real issue is the Democrats have introduced the ACA that, once implemented, will become popular like Social Security and Medicare are now.

And I believe that ACA is much more like "No Child Left Behind" - well intentioned, utterly ineffective, too expensive to actually implement, and with enough bureaucratic nonsense for everyone on any side of the aisle to hate it. And once in place, very difficult to remove or replace.


I know right?

Really hard, the GOPs had like not one but 2 national elections, and even then another 41 shots... no joy there either.

It's almost like America wants the ACA.
 
2013-09-18 12:06:26 PM  
Holy shiat, this thread is on 5 popped collar alert.
 
2013-09-18 12:06:44 PM  

FlashHarry: point of order: obamacare - and specifically, the individual mandate - IS a conservative idea, having originated at the heritage foundation in the 1990s.


No one cares who came up with the idea, the problem is that it's an affront to individual freedom.
 
2013-09-18 12:07:05 PM  

BojanglesPaladin: Lucky LaRue: I am beginning to suspect you just talk in circles until people get tired of trying to extract reason from you.

I see you just met HighonCraic :)


I love it when ConservaTrolls high five on Fark.  An angel gets its wings.... ripped the f*ck off and sold to a Chinese pillow manufacturer.
 
2013-09-18 12:07:34 PM  
Here comes the latest 3-page document extolling the virtues of the Free Market that everyone will pretend is an actual proposal for a bill.
 
2013-09-18 12:07:40 PM  

MadHatter500: Lucky LaRue: Lionel Mandrake: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Lucky LaRue: mediablitz: Offer the same thing. Call it something different. Claim victory.

The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country.

Yeah. Okay. Because liberals haven't been saying this bill is crappy, but better than the sh*t sandwich we had before already.

Are you pretending conservatives aren't screaming non-stop about AHA now? All while supporting when not called "Obamacare"? Supporting it when you go issue by issue?

I'll stick with what HAS happened. You can live by what you believe WILL happen.

Thanks for proving my point.

It isn't what's good or bad for the country that people like you (and your counterparts on the far right) care about.  It's about standing in direct opposition to anything the other side proposes.

No such point was proved.  He said liberals aren't thrilled with the ACA, but it's better than nothing, not "It sucks but it pisses the right off so I'm for it"

If you can't see the difference, it's probably best to avoid trying to converse with you.

Listen, I'm not at all perturbed that you don't want to talk to me simply because I refuse to narrow my world-view down with the black-and-white filters you put on every day to make your hatred for the other side seem more righteous.

You are a complete ass.  Good thing you can be an ITG.  At a bar you'd be beaten bloody with this attitude.


Ah, yes.  When all else fails, turn your righteous anger towards violence and threats of violence.  You really *are* the opposite side of the teabagger coin, aren't you?
 
2013-09-18 12:08:15 PM  

Mr. Coffee Nerves: Without having seen the bill I still feel I can confidently predict the language will include some, if not all, of the following:

Corporate tax cuts
Replacing Medicaid and Medicare with vouchers that will be massively useful when a 77-year-old with diabetes and congestive heart failure goes shopping on the free market for insurance
Requirements that anyone applying for said vouchers must register as a Republican and give proxy to a panel comprised of Karl Rove, Rick Santorum, Rush Limbaugh and Snuggle, the Fabric Softener Bear
Corporate tax cuts. Different ones, but still.
$1.5 trillion in direct payments to defense contractors to invent a gun that fires poor people at Muslins


Actually, from what I've read, it's more like this:

Open up interstate sales (meaning I can buy insurance from Delaware even though it doesn't meet Kansas's regulatory requirements)
Spend a little money on high-risk pools for people with PREX
Cap non-economic losses in medical malpractice suits
Give everyone buying individual insurance a big tax deduction
Expanding HSAs
Let small businesses pool together for purchasing health insurance

It's an absolutely atrocious plan that is, in my mind, worse than what we had pre-ObamaCare.
 
2013-09-18 12:09:56 PM  

balthan: Lucky LaRue: This is just the kind of clap-trap I am talking about.  In your world-view, anyone opposed to your agenda is an obstructionist who would rather f*ck the country than do what is right.  In the tea-baggers world-view, anyone opposed to their agenda is an unpatriotic socialist who would rather f*ck the country than stand up for freedom.

Both world views make for great entertainment, but are pretty f*cking ridiculous when it comes to governance.

"Well, the important thing is that you've found a way to feel superior to both."


There are a lot of people in the world whose political views I respect, admire, and attempt to emulate.  But, really, it's not hard to feel superior to two tribes of warring morons.
 
2013-09-18 12:09:56 PM  
I am going to keep an open mind and give them the benefit of doubt.


/Ha! Not really.
 
2013-09-18 12:11:07 PM  
I hear that a Republican governor from Massachusetts had some pretty good ideas about healthcare reform.  What was his name again?
 
2013-09-18 12:11:59 PM  

Soup4Bonnie: I love snarky Yglesias.


Thanks for the heads up, now I know not to click.

--

It seems like the Farklib view is "If those darn teahadicans er fer it.... aaaaahm agin' it!" It's like dems and Farklibs don't really care about the problem at all, they just want to defeat their political opponents no matter the cost.
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-09-18 12:12:18 PM  

Aristocles: No one cares who came up with the idea, the problem is that it's an affront to individual freedom.


Fark individual freedom.  People created society for a reason, because anarchy sucks.

Besides, you're "individual freedom" is more about scamming the rest of us into paying for your health care.
 
2013-09-18 12:12:28 PM  

Heliovdrake: Really hard, the GOPs had like not one but 2 national elections, and even then another 41 shots... no joy there either.

It's almost like America wants the ACA.


The one is not evidence of the other, and I don't think one can say that "America wants ACA". Everyone's insurance continues to go up year over year, and most of the 'negative' parts have been delayed, so it's too early to say what America thinks about an implemented ACA.

Also, you might want to review the teabagger 2010 election results which were among other things, a response to ACA. Also worth reviewing that while you can get numbers if you ask about a particular piece of ACA (and there ARE some really good reforms in the turdpile), the overall popularity is not exactly overwhelming.
 
2013-09-18 12:13:14 PM  

theknuckler_33: Lucky LaRue: This is what I least enjoy about talking with your lot.  You get so overwrought you can't even put forward ideas; you just start throwing out insults and celebrating a "score."

Says the person whose boobies was "The sad thing is that all the liberals would immediately start screaming about how bad the bill was for the country. "


At least it was an *idea*, and not this inarticulate shiat-slinging that you guys have been doing.  I've seen a lot of posts in here where people have claimed they'd be thrilled if the Republicans put forward a bill that's exactly like Obamacare, and that's pretty cool.  Unfortunately, I'm down here in the mud with you nit-wits, listening to you argue why you would be justified hating conservatives, no matter what they did.
 
2013-09-18 12:13:47 PM  

BojanglesPaladin: And I believe that ACA is much more like "No Child Left Behind" - well intentioned, utterly ineffective, too expensive to actually implement, and with enough bureaucratic nonsense for everyone on any side of the aisle to hate it. And once in place, very difficult to remove or replace.


[citation needed]
 
2013-09-18 12:14:12 PM  

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Reading from the text of the proposed bill: "Oo ee oo ah ah, ting, tang, walla walla bing bang"


I read it more as:

Pee ppo kro ha ha
Pee ppo kro ha ha
Pee ppo kro ha ha
And that means oh go screw
 
2013-09-18 12:14:30 PM  

coeyagi: BojanglesPaladin: Lucky LaRue: I am beginning to suspect you just talk in circles until people get tired of trying to extract reason from you.

I see you just met HighonCraic :)

I love it when ConservaTrolls high five on Fark.  An angel gets its wings.... ripped the f*ck off and sold to a Chinese pillow manufacturer.


They've got their projectors on at full strength!
 
2013-09-18 12:14:33 PM  

BojanglesPaladin: "The RSC press release announcing the bill's introduction included no hints of what the legislation might contain."

Until then, there is nothing to discuss. Just threads full of 'OMG I hate repubs'!!elevenses!!1!!


Scalise didn't give a lot of details during that phone call , but said the bill would include protections for people with pre-existing conditions - one of the main benefits of Obamacare.
"We address that to make sure that people with pre-existing conditions cannot be discriminated against," he said.
He promised, however, that it would not "put in place mandates that increase the costs of health care and push people out of the insurance that they like."


Plenty to discuss.
 
2013-09-18 12:14:45 PM  
I'm glad to see they finally brought their comprehensive plan to fruition

api.ning.com
 
2013-09-18 12:14:59 PM  
Wouldn't the appropriate time to reveal this plan be back when ACA was being drafted and debated?  Or even in the run-up to the 2012 election?  How is this supposed to come across as anything but a hastily thrown-together opportunity to take yet another baseless pot-shot at the President?
 
2013-09-18 12:15:19 PM  

MaudlinMutantMollusk: Reading from the text of the proposed bill: "Oo ee oo ah ah, ting, tang, walla walla bing bang"


The new bill speaks in tongues, praise Jesus.
 
2013-09-18 12:15:39 PM  

vpb: Aristocles: No one cares who came up with the idea, the problem is that it's an affront to individual freedom.

Fark individual freedom.  People created society for a reason, because anarchy sucks.

Besides, you're "individual freedom" is more about scamming the rest of us into paying for your health care.


Obamacare will force the well-to-do to pay for my health care. But I believe that freedom is more important.

btw, I'm somewhat of an anarchist... or so I've been told.
 
2013-09-18 12:15:44 PM  
www.balloon-juice.com

So, are we back to this, yet?
 
2013-09-18 12:15:57 PM  

BojanglesPaladin: Heliovdrake: Really hard, the GOPs had like not one but 2 national elections, and even then another 41 shots... no joy there either.

It's almost like America wants the ACA.

The one is not evidence of the other, and I don't think one can say that "America wants ACA". Everyone's insurance continues to go up year over year, and most of the 'negative' parts have been delayed, so it's too early to say what America thinks about an implemented ACA.

Also, you might want to review the teabagger 2010 election results which were among other things, a response to ACA. Also worth reviewing that while you can get numbers if you ask about a particular piece of ACA (and there ARE some really good reforms in the turdpile), the overall popularity is not exactly overwhelming.


Sure, if you mean they were a response to people like Sarah Palin repeatedly lighting their pants on fire about what was in the bill.
 
2013-09-18 12:16:32 PM  

Lucky LaRue: At least it was an *idea*, and not this inarticulate shiat-slinging that you guys have been doing.  I've seen a lot of posts in here where people have claimed they'd be thrilled if the Republicans put forward a bill that's exactly like Obamacare, and that's pretty cool.  Unfortunately, I'm down here in the mud with you nit-wits, listening to you argue why you would be justified hating conservatives, no matter what they did.


Looks like the House GOP plan is ... get ready for it ... tax cuts!

Sorry, Lucky LaRue, but the bill put up by the House Republicans sucks.

Myself, I would rather see a single payer system, but looks like the ACA is the better path for now.
 
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