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(MSNBC)   Half the deadliest shootings in U.S. history happened in past six years. Thanks Obama   (maddowblog.msnbc.com) divider line 278
    More: Obvious, U.S., Columbine High School, shootings, spree killers  
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3545 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Sep 2013 at 5:03 AM (30 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-17 11:48:50 PM
Yeah, that 2007 VT shooting has Obama's fingerprints all over it.
 
2013-09-17 11:51:35 PM
The other half? Also Obama's fault.

That farkin' time machine is a bullet magnet.
 
2013-09-17 11:51:36 PM

Norad: Yeah, that 2007 VT shooting has Obama's fingerprints all over it.


i301.photobucket.com

Sheeeeeeeeeeeeit yeah, BABY!
 
2013-09-17 11:54:27 PM
Uh huh. Let's ask the Indians at Wounded Knee about that, shall we?
 
2013-09-18 12:08:02 AM
Of all the bad things that have happened since his first inauguration/and-or might be blamed on him, these are wayyy down on the scale. Which I'm guessing was the point of subbys trolly headline, amirite?
 
2013-09-18 12:17:57 AM
Hmmm. I wonder what people have been running out and buying in record numbers during the past 6 years that could be connected to shootings? Hmmm.....
 
2013-09-18 12:28:47 AM
We've had the worst economy in generations, and it hasn't gotten a whole lot better, particularly for young people, and young males especially (you know, the people more prone to mental illness and violence, and less likely to have a support system in place, than the general population).  There are less economic opportunities, corrosive cultural influences, stigmatization of the mentally ill, appallingly low access to health care, let alone psychiatric care, and a society that discourages treatment ("man up!" or "get help, but a permanent mark on your record").  Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there a spike in such spree or mass shootings during the Reagan years while the middle class was being decimated?  And I'm ignoring the alarming connection between SSRI withdrawal and inexplicable, horrible acts of violence and mass murder.

The guns have been around forever, and throughout much of our history, have been easier to obtain than they are now.  Guns are a red herring, intended by the powers that be to keep us all distracted and squabbling.
 
2013-09-18 12:34:31 AM

Fark It: Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there a spike in such spree or mass shootings during the Reagan years while the middle class was being decimated?


No - only two according to the article.  Same as the 90's.
 
2013-09-18 12:35:52 AM

shower_in_my_socks: Hmmm. I wonder what people have been running out and buying in record numbers during the past 6 years that could be connected to shootings? Hmmm.....


If my local Bass Pro shop is any indication, .22 LR ammo is responsible for every mass shooting for the past 5 years.
 
2013-09-18 12:39:21 AM
And they're being pulled off by the mentally ill so naturally we need more gun control.  What about mentally ill control?  But no, it's the gun that didn't kill anyone until the mentally ill got involved.  By the way, the latest guy was under the governments control,... the same government that some people want to control the guns,  does this make sense?  Mr. Loony tunes who has had really serious issues doesn't get "controlled" until after he he goes postal, but the guns that weren't doing anything until he picked them up need to be controlled.   He would find another tool, the voices would have told him to.
 
2013-09-18 12:49:32 AM

John Buck 41: Of all the bad things that have happened since his first inauguration/and-or might be blamed on him, these are wayyy down on the scale. Which I'm guessing was the point of subbys trolly headline, amirite?


I thought it was sarcasm, not trolling. But that's just me.
/not submitter
 
2013-09-18 01:04:07 AM
When i saw this last night the first thought I had was what the chart would look like if normalized to population-years.  There'd probably still be a bump, but nothing close to an increase as drastic as depicted.
 
2013-09-18 01:12:24 AM
"Deadliest" is strictly a personal viewpoint from my point of view.
 
2013-09-18 01:19:30 AM

Fark It: We've had the worst economy in generations, and it hasn't gotten a whole lot better, particularly for young people, and young males especially (you know, the people more prone to mental illness and violence, and less likely to have a support system in place, than the general population).  There are less economic opportunities, corrosive cultural influences, stigmatization of the mentally ill, appallingly low access to health care, let alone psychiatric care, and a society that discourages treatment ("man up!" or "get help, but a permanent mark on your record").  Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there a spike in such spree or mass shootings during the Reagan years while the middle class was being decimated?  And I'm ignoring the alarming connection between SSRI withdrawal and inexplicable, horrible acts of violence and mass murder.

The guns have been around forever, and throughout much of our history, have been easier to obtain than they are now.  Guns are a red herring, intended by the powers that be to keep us all distracted and squabbling.


I dunno, the guy who did the Sandy Hook shooting had rich parents and plenty of access to quality mental healthcare.
 
2013-09-18 01:32:13 AM

Tyee: By the way, the latest guy was under the governments control,... the same government that some people want to control the guns, does this make sense?


I think the lack of sense in that statement may not be the government's fault.
 
2013-09-18 01:54:34 AM

Mentat: I think the lack of sense in that statement may not be the government's fault.


Read it slower or maybe someone else can help you understand it.
 
2013-09-18 01:57:22 AM
If Obama had a son, he would look like Aaron Alexis.
 
2013-09-18 01:58:27 AM

doglover: Uh huh. Let's ask the Indians at Wounded Knee about that, shall we?


That's completely unfair. That was totally government sanctioned slaughter!
 
2013-09-18 01:59:23 AM

Tyee: Mentat: I think the lack of sense in that statement may not be the government's fault.

Read it slower or maybe someone else can help you understand it.


An independent contractor who once served in the Naval Reserve is not "under the government's control".  I can say that slower, if it helps.
 
2013-09-18 01:59:56 AM

Tyee: Mentat: I think the lack of sense in that statement may not be the government's fault.

Read it slower or maybe someone else can help you understand it.


So, every time a member of the armed forces does something bad, it proves that the entire government is bad?

t1.gstatic.com

Unavailable for comment.
 
2013-09-18 02:22:30 AM
They're not counting all the Iraqi citizens killed by W.
 
2013-09-18 02:26:18 AM

Tyee: And they're being pulled off by the mentally ill so naturally we need more gun control.  What about mentally ill control?  But no, it's the gun that didn't kill anyone until the mentally ill got involved.  By the way, the latest guy was under the governments control,... the same government that some people want to control the guns,  does this make sense?  Mr. Loony tunes who has had really serious issues doesn't get "controlled" until after he he goes postal, but the guns that weren't doing anything until he picked them up need to be controlled.   He would find another tool, the voices would have told him to.


Here's the problem. There needs to be a compromise on both sides for a solution to be found.  There is a problem, the symptoms are all there.  However the illness requires multiple solutions for interlocking issues.

You have the problem of the mentally ill, which we have cut public funding for for many years. There is also still a major social stigma against the mentally ill. There is also a very serious cost issue in treatment, which isn't adequately covered by Obama Care.

Then you have the fact than because there is no background check on a gun for mental illness, these people can get ahold of guns rather easily.

So why do you think that many are pressing for stricter gun regulation/ That's an easier solution than addressing the economic/medical issues that are driving these.
 
2013-09-18 03:03:10 AM
Normally when there's a mass shooting in the United States I find myself feeling very upset and sympathetic and a profound sense of tragedy. No I don't really feel anything.

I figure if the American voting public really doesn't give a shiat about this then why the hell should I.
 
2013-09-18 03:15:49 AM
Maybe we should require a current psych profile be on file before somebody buys a gun.
 
2013-09-18 03:44:52 AM
www.teenjury.com
If you squint, you can clearly see 4-year-old Obama pointing out targets for Charles Whitman...

1.bp.blogspot.com
And you'll find Obama's fingerprints on this gun used by George Hennard at 1990's Luby's Massacre
 
2013-09-18 05:09:04 AM
The economy was on a huge upswing during the 90s and a lot of that money was still floating around during the Dubya years, even though the bubble deflated in early 2000.

As fortunes erode, a lot of frustration emerges from the dust, and among the frustrated some will eventually snap and take out a bunch of people. You can't blame Obama for the state of the economy back in the early days of his administration. That was an economy he inherited: tech implosion and housing bubble disintegration.

But since then has the economy gotten better for those who were squeezed out of it back in 2008 and 2009? Are they still under-employed if not completely unemployed? That is something that Obama must take responsibility for.
 
2013-09-18 05:12:38 AM

Fark It: The guns have been around forever, and throughout much of our history, have been easier to obtain than they are now. Guns are a red herring, intended by the powers that be to keep us all distracted and squabbling.


True. Those kindergartners in Newtown were all red herringed to death.
 
2013-09-18 05:12:44 AM
I noticed a little while ago that USA Today's headline yesterday on the Navy shooting has one word in extra large font: "AGAIN".
 
2013-09-18 05:14:58 AM
Except Rachel Maddow didn't blame Obama in her report.  In reality, Obama has pushed for stricter gun laws.

Thanks right wingers, GOPers, Godly Christians, Tea Partiers  and everyone else on the right who is so beholden to the NRA and the greedy gun lobby.
 
2013-09-18 05:15:15 AM
Yeah Obama, maybe you should stop enraging all these gun nuts with your lack of gun grabbing. It's pissing the crazies off that you don't have FEMA teams ready to steal all their guns, so they are going off the rails and shooting folks, hoping to make their apocalyptic fantasy come true.

Damn you Obama!
 
2013-09-18 05:16:44 AM

LAWriter: Except Rachel Maddow didn't blame Obama in her report.  In reality, Obama has pushed for stricter gun laws.

Thanks right wingers, GOPers, Godly Christians, Tea Partiers  and everyone else on the right who is so beholden to the NRA and the greedy gun lobby.


Pretty much. They've won this debate and the price is mass shootings that will continue to be commonplace because freedoms.
 
2013-09-18 05:20:56 AM

SilentStrider: I thought it was sarcasm, not trolling. But that's just me.


You'll find that, ultimately, they're a very uptight lot.
 
2013-09-18 05:22:19 AM

Carl Scroot: LAWriter: Except Rachel Maddow didn't blame Obama in her report.  In reality, Obama has pushed for stricter gun laws.

Thanks right wingers, GOPers, Godly Christians, Tea Partiers  and everyone else on the right who is so beholden to the NRA and the greedy gun lobby.

Pretty much. They've won this debate and the price is mass shootings that will continue to be commonplace because freedoms.


Yep. Because if we tighten up regulations to make it harder for unstable lunatics to acquire firearms that make their rampages easier and deadlier, we might as well erase the Constitution and let Russia or China annex us!
 
2013-09-18 05:23:32 AM
Nothing gets through Congress nationally, and I've already heard that members of Congress don't think they have the votes to do anything this time, either.  So the NRA and ALEC write laws for states, pass them out, and they get voted into law by people who don't even read them.

I heard something tonight about a state, North Carolina?, that passed something about guns as a universal right.. and now convicted felons and sex offenders can have all the guns they want, and even the people who voted for it are taken aback.. 'hey, I didn't mean that to happen!'
 
2013-09-18 05:25:44 AM

LordJiro: Carl Scroot: LAWriter: Except Rachel Maddow didn't blame Obama in her report.  In reality, Obama has pushed for stricter gun laws.

Thanks right wingers, GOPers, Godly Christians, Tea Partiers  and everyone else on the right who is so beholden to the NRA and the greedy gun lobby.

Pretty much. They've won this debate and the price is mass shootings that will continue to be commonplace because freedoms.

Yep. Because if we tighten up regulations to make it harder for unstable lunatics to acquire firearms that make their rampages easier and deadlier, we might as well erase the Constitution and let Russia or China annex us!


Someone posted that firearms were easier to acquire at some time here. Were they in a "take one" box at the grocery checkout or something? I can't imagine them being more accessible than they are now.
 
2013-09-18 05:30:00 AM

Ghastly: Normally when there's a mass shooting in the United States I find myself feeling very upset and sympathetic and a profound sense of tragedy. No I don't really feel anything.

I figure if the American voting public really doesn't give a shiat about this then why the hell should I.


Se what you've done, gun nuts? Now we've got farking Canadians making fun of us.

;)
 
2013-09-18 05:30:30 AM
given that 3/4 of headlines are of the trolly persuasion, and mods greenlight em with glee (increases posting... they arent stoopid), continuing to point out trolling nature of headlines is getting a bit redundant
 
2013-09-18 05:31:25 AM

Carl Scroot: Ghastly: Normally when there's a mass shooting in the United States I find myself feeling very upset and sympathetic and a profound sense of tragedy. No I don't really feel anything.

I figure if the American voting public really doesn't give a shiat about this then why the hell should I.

Se what you've done, gun nuts? Now we've got farking Canadians making fun of us.

;)


Pretty sure Canadians have been making fun of us for some time now.
 
2013-09-18 05:33:06 AM

LordJiro: Carl Scroot: Ghastly: Normally when there's a mass shooting in the United States I find myself feeling very upset and sympathetic and a profound sense of tragedy. No I don't really feel anything.

I figure if the American voting public really doesn't give a shiat about this then why the hell should I.

Se what you've done, gun nuts? Now we've got farking Canadians making fun of us.

;)

Pretty sure Canadians have been making fun of us for some time now.


Meh. Let those flappy heads have their fun.
 
2013-09-18 05:38:50 AM
I don't know what the pro-gun folks flock to these threads for- their side has clearly won.

I still think that if the gun control side wants to implement their policies instead of petitioning for more legislation, they should start arming inner-city people of color. That'll change the NRA's position right quick.
 
2013-09-18 05:39:46 AM

doglover: Uh huh. Let's ask the Indians at Wounded Knee about that, shall we?


i.imgur.com

Thanks, Obama!
 
2013-09-18 05:39:52 AM
'If We Had the Ammunition, We Could've Cleared that Building,' Son at Navy Yard Told Dad

Back in 1993, the Clinton administration virtually declared military establishments "gun-free zones." As a result, the policy banned "military personnel from carrying their own personal firearms and mandates that 'a credible and specific threat against [Department of the Army] personnel [exist] in that region" before military personnel 'may be authorized to carry firearms for personal protection." Indeed, most military bases have relatively few military police as they are in heavy demand to serve in Iraq and Afghanistan," according to economist John Lott.

Additionally, Lott discovered that "every public shooting since at least 1950 in the U.S. in which more than three people have been killed has taken place where citizens are not allowed to carry guns."

The answer is simple. Murderers pick places where they know their victims will be unarmed. It's time we debate having concealed carry on military bases. After all, there's no evidence showing that firearms owners are more irresponsible than the police, as Wall Street Journal columnist John Fund noted back in December of 2012:

"According to a 2005 to 2007 study by researchers at the University of Wisconsin and Bowling Green State University, police nationwide were convicted of firearms violations at least at a 0.002 percent annual rate. That's about the same rate as holders of carry permits in the states with 'shall issue' laws."

Use to be rifles were kept in the barracks with the Soldier/Marine:

i3.photobucket.com

Now they are kept "secure" in what amount to a locked vault (a practice started before Clinton):

www.506infantry.org
 
2013-09-18 05:40:15 AM

coco ebert: I don't know what the pro-gun folks flock to these threads for- their side has clearly won.


The thread below this one on the Politics tab had almost 200 comments when it went green.. I don't even want to touch that one.
 
2013-09-18 05:41:15 AM

Ghastly: Normally when there's a mass shooting in the United States I find myself feeling very upset and sympathetic and a profound sense of tragedy. No I don't really feel anything.

I figure if the American voting public really doesn't give a shiat about this then why the hell should I.


it is a curious experience watching all this stuff as an outside isnt it. i realise that americans hold the constitution dear, and they absolutely should, and personal freedom is a precious thing, but it is really hard to see the prevalant attitude as anything other than 'im having all the guns I want because I can and i dont care what happens'
 
2013-09-18 05:42:01 AM

coco ebert: I don't know what the pro-gun folks flock to these threads for- their side has clearly won.


Because they have to rationalize their beliefs after yet another mass shooting.
 
2013-09-18 05:46:10 AM

Lady J: Ghastly: Normally when there's a mass shooting in the United States I find myself feeling very upset and sympathetic and a profound sense of tragedy. No I don't really feel anything.

I figure if the American voting public really doesn't give a shiat about this then why the hell should I.

it is a curious experience watching all this stuff as an outside isnt it. i realise that americans hold the constitution dear, and they absolutely should, and personal freedom is a precious thing, but it is really hard to see the prevalant attitude as anything other than 'im having all the guns I want because I can and i dont care what happens'


Because "freedom".

What "freedom" in America may look like:

i28.photobucket.com
 
2013-09-18 05:46:44 AM
Came for unjustified, irrational Rachel Maddow hate, leaving disapointed.

LAWriter: Except Rachel Maddow didn't blame Obama in her report. In reality, Obama has pushed for stricter gun laws.


That's the joke.
 
2013-09-18 05:49:09 AM
What I like most about this silly little statlet is that it is utterly arbitrary. If we move the metric for "deadliest" a bit in either direction and look at the result, what does that tell us?
 
2013-09-18 05:51:21 AM
I personally don't have a problem with guns. I think there are more responsible gun owners than not. We just never hear from them because... well... why would we? They're responsible gun owners who probably live their entire lives without having to discharge their weapon at another human being.

Guns themselves aren't a problem so much. Yes, I do have an issue with armor-piercing automatic weapons that can go through your house and into my own and turn my brain into a fine red mist while I'm reading the latest derp on Fark.

I do have a problem with the people who want guns though. There need to be tighter restrictions on guns -- and not on the gun part of things. But on the people side of things. I think any responsible gun owner could recognize that the root of the problem isn't the guns themselves so much as the people who want to own and use them.

Which means better and easier access to mental health care, and certification and training programs at the state level which include psychiatric evaluations. It's not a panacea. But I think it's a lot more productive than going after the guns themselves.
 
2013-09-18 05:51:35 AM

Bonanza Jellybean: What I like most about this silly little statlet is that it is utterly arbitrary. If we move the metric for "deadliest" a bit in either direction and look at the result, what does that tell us?


Go figure it out and report back.

http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2012/12/mass-shootings-mother-jo ne s-full-data
 
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