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(Buffalo News)   High school football player dies following helmet-to-helmet hit during game   (buffalonews.com) divider line 81
    More: Sad, football, Western New York, helmets  
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3031 clicks; posted to Sports » on 16 Sep 2013 at 10:20 PM (44 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-16 09:41:10 PM
This is part-of the reason why I think the focus on the NFL is a bit of a red herring...

When this society realizes how many NON-PROFESSIONAL former football players have suffered long-term injuries from the sport, what will happen?
(I guess I should be asking: who will pay for all of the lawsuits?)
 
2013-09-16 10:05:15 PM
This is definitely a death knell for (American) football in the US.
 
2013-09-16 10:19:08 PM
Things like this are why I don't want my son playing football.
 
2013-09-16 10:26:33 PM
This one's the death knell?

According to experts, 25 high school players suffered fatal injuries between 2003 and 2012.

BTW, a few kids died over that span doing cross country, too. I mean, it really sucks and it's a really crappy reason to die...but it's something that happens in all sports - in fact, I can find at least three different HS (or earlier) baseball-related deaths in the first page.
 
2013-09-16 10:29:13 PM

IAmRight: This one's the death knell?

According to experts, 25 high school players suffered fatal injuries between 2003 and 2012.

BTW, a few kids died over that span doing cross country, too. I mean, it really sucks and it's a really crappy reason to die...but it's something that happens in all sports - in fact, I can find at least three different HS (or earlier) baseball-related deaths in the first page.


Aluminum bats. At some point, youth leagues and high schools need to ban them. The ball comes scorching off of those things. Lots of little leaguers have been hurt and killed because the mound is so close to the pitchers and kids' reflexes are slower.
 
2013-09-16 10:30:22 PM
I took plenty of helme tto helmet hits and I'm potato
 
2013-09-16 10:31:44 PM
People can die doing ANYTHING strenuous.  Hell, they could die in a power walking class if they have an undiagnosed heart condition.  I'm a proponent for making high school and college football as safe as possible, but I think people who want it to die out completely are twerps.  People like to watch it, and people like to play it, and you assume the risk when you decide to play.
 
2013-09-16 10:31:56 PM

Nabb1: Aluminum bats. At some point, youth leagues and high schools need to ban them. The ball comes scorching off of those things. Lots of little leaguers have been hurt and killed because the mound is so close to the pitchers and kids' reflexes are slower.


Maybe we could at least start with making wooden bats optional. Even if you want to use a wooden bat, they're not going to let you.
 
2013-09-16 10:36:34 PM
1.bp.blogspot.com
 
2013-09-16 10:36:51 PM

Gosling: Nabb1: Aluminum bats. At some point, youth leagues and high schools need to ban them. The ball comes scorching off of those things. Lots of little leaguers have been hurt and killed because the mound is so close to the pitchers and kids' reflexes are slower.

Maybe we could at least start with making wooden bats optional. Even if you want to use a wooden bat, they're not going to let you.


NCAA schools allow metal and composite bats only of they are rated to produce ball speeds no greater than wood.
 
2013-09-16 10:46:38 PM
Thus endeth football.
 
2013-09-16 10:48:35 PM

Nabb1: Things like this are why I don't want my son playing football.


There are several prominent media personalities here that have now said they won't let their kids play football. It's definitely going to start a trend.
 
2013-09-16 10:54:24 PM
Frankly, though, I wouldn't mind flag football replacing football. It's not like it's all that much different, in terms of gameplay.
 
2013-09-16 10:57:39 PM

cameroncrazy1984: Nabb1: Things like this are why I don't want my son playing football.

There are several prominent media personalities here that have now said they won't let their kids play football. It's definitely going to start a trend.


25 deaths over 9 years compared to the total number of kids playing?  It's likely that statistically speaking driving to school is more dangerous.

I wouldn't have a problem with my hypothetical kids playing football if they wanted.  Yes, this death is a tragedy, but it's also a rare occurrence.

5,000 kids die every year due to situation related to under rage drinking.  Cut that in half to exclude college kids and you still have 100x the number of deaths per year from alcohol that you have from football over a 9 year span.

It's sad that this kid died, but there are far more dangerous things many high schoolers do than play football.
 
2013-09-16 11:09:20 PM

TuteTibiImperes: cameroncrazy1984: Nabb1: Things like this are why I don't want my son playing football.

There are several prominent media personalities here that have now said they won't let their kids play football. It's definitely going to start a trend.

25 deaths over 9 years compared to the total number of kids playing?  It's likely that statistically speaking driving to school is more dangerous.

I wouldn't have a problem with my hypothetical kids playing football if they wanted.  Yes, this death is a tragedy, but it's also a rare occurrence.

5,000 kids die every year due to situation related to under rage drinking.  Cut that in half to exclude college kids and you still have 100x the number of deaths per year from alcohol that you have from football over a 9 year span.

It's sad that this kid died, but there are far more dangerous things many high schoolers do than play football.


Rage drinking kills.  Be responsible.  Drink only while mildly peeved
 
2013-09-16 11:09:32 PM

Nabb1: Gosling: Nabb1: Aluminum bats. At some point, youth leagues and high schools need to ban them. The ball comes scorching off of those things. Lots of little leaguers have been hurt and killed because the mound is so close to the pitchers and kids' reflexes are slower.

Maybe we could at least start with making wooden bats optional. Even if you want to use a wooden bat, they're not going to let you.

NCAA schools allow metal and composite bats only of they are rated to produce ball speeds no greater than wood.


Yep, and there are similar restrictions at the youth levels.

FWIW, scoring has been way down at the NCAA level since they instituted the new bat rules.
 
2013-09-16 11:15:23 PM

TuteTibiImperes: cameroncrazy1984: Nabb1: Things like this are why I don't want my son playing football.

There are several prominent media personalities here that have now said they won't let their kids play football. It's definitely going to start a trend.

25 deaths over 9 years compared to the total number of kids playing?  It's likely that statistically speaking driving to school is more dangerous.

I wouldn't have a problem with my hypothetical kids playing football if they wanted.  Yes, this death is a tragedy, but it's also a rare occurrence.

5,000 kids die every year due to situation related to under rage drinking.  Cut that in half to exclude college kids and you still have 100x the number of deaths per year from alcohol that you have from football over a 9 year span.

It's sad that this kid died, but there are far more dangerous things many high schoolers do than play football.


True, driving is statistically much more dangerous, but driving is something that most people need to do in order to get places. Now if you specifically mean TEENS driving to school you do have an absolutely excellent point. Teens don't need to drive to school.

Other people have mentioned deaths in cross country or track or soccer. But if those deaths are due to undiagnosed heart conditions, you could argue they would happen in football as well as while running to catch a bus or with sex.

A death that is imminent is not the same thing as a death that is completely preventable (ie, by not playing football). And we're also not counting the damage from other injuries like concussions, or the long-term repercussions from these same injuries. Yes, everything we do in our everyday lives is risky, this is true. But you can't pretend that because there is risk in everything that the risk of playing football is negligible. It is definitely more risky than other high school sports, particularly if you start looking at injury and specifically traumatic brain injury.

My parents didn't let me play football past my first year because of this risk. I didn't like the decision at the time, but I eventually came to agree with it. I was never going to make a living doing it, and there were other sports I enjoyed as much, so for me playing football had all the risk with little more reward than playing anything else. No brainer.
 
2013-09-16 11:18:42 PM
i.imgur.com

How do you expect to build a $59.6 million dollar stadium without sacrificing a few kids?
 
2013-09-16 11:20:19 PM
He is from the next town over from where I grew up. My friend was at the game and said he got injured on a late hit out of bounds. Pretty sad.
 
2013-09-16 11:21:49 PM

Snapper Carr: [i.imgur.com image 620x350]

How do you expect to build a $59.6 million dollar stadium without sacrificing a few kids?


dragonsdengaming.com

BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD COACH!
 
2013-09-16 11:21:51 PM

rga184: True, driving is statistically much more dangerous, but driving is something that most people need to do in order to get places. Now if you specifically mean TEENS driving to school you do have an absolutely excellent point. Teens don't need to drive to school.

Other people have mentioned deaths in cross country or track or soccer. But if those deaths are due to undiagnosed heart conditions, you could argue they would happen in football as well as while running to catch a bus or with sex.

A death that is imminent is not the same thing as a death that is completely preventable (ie, by not playing football). And we're also not counting the damage from other injuries like concussions, or the long-term repercussions from these same injuries. Yes, everything we do in our everyday lives is risky, this is true. But you can't pretend that because there is risk in everything that the risk of playing football is negligible. It is definitely more risky than other high school sports, particularly if you start looking at injury and specifically traumatic brain injury.

My parents didn't let me play football past my first year because of this risk. I didn't like the decision at the time, but I eventually came to agree with it. I was never going to make a living doing it, and there were other sports I enjoyed as much, so for me playing football had all the risk with little more reward than playing anything else. No brainer.


Fair enough, and it would be interesting to see injury/death rates in football compared to other sports.  Lacrosse, Hockey, and other collision sports can get pretty brutal as well.

Even if the risk is higher, 25 deaths over 9 years isn't a huge number, and most players get through fine with no long term brain damage.  It's worth having a discussion about, but Football is by far the most popular sport in the USA, and I don't see that changing due to more data coming out about the potential for injury.
 
2013-09-16 11:23:22 PM

ladodger34: Nabb1: Gosling: Nabb1: Aluminum bats. At some point, youth leagues and high schools need to ban them. The ball comes scorching off of those things. Lots of little leaguers have been hurt and killed because the mound is so close to the pitchers and kids' reflexes are slower.

Maybe we could at least start with making wooden bats optional. Even if you want to use a wooden bat, they're not going to let you.

NCAA schools allow metal and composite bats only of they are rated to produce ball speeds no greater than wood.

Yep, and there are similar restrictions at the youth levels.

FWIW, scoring has been way down at the NCAA level since they instituted the new bat rules.


Well... yeah.  Not every ball comes scorching off the bat in a line drive to Mars.
 
2013-09-16 11:23:52 PM
He's so high in that pic...

www.buffalonews.com
 
2013-09-16 11:38:40 PM
Well if he wouldn't have been using his cell phone while driving..
 
2013-09-16 11:58:12 PM

Nabb1: Things like this are why I don't want my son playing football.


You can easily take out an eye will a well aimed shuttle cock.
 
2013-09-17 12:00:26 AM

puffy999: This is part-of the reason why I think the focus on the NFL is a bit of a red herring...

When this society realizes how many NON-PROFESSIONAL former football players have suffered long-term injuries from the sport, what will happen?
(I guess I should be asking: who will pay for all of the lawsuits?)



It's all sports frankly.

I've been hit in the head with many a shoulder check and puck to the dome playing both junior and college hockey. I've been hit in the head playing safety in high school football. I've been hit in the head by a pitch playing little league. I've been kicked in the head by violent negros playing basketball and wearing a Sarah Palin shirt.

And NONE of that has stopped me from being an asshole on Fark.

Re-define your numbers.

/yeah, the basketball part was BS
//I'm 5'8
///and I grew up among a 99.8% white population
 
2013-09-17 12:14:34 AM
I'm tellin' ya, they're going to have to just imprison Merriweather at this rate...
 
2013-09-17 12:18:44 AM
<areyounotentertained.jpeg>
 
2013-09-17 12:22:06 AM
Full-face motorcycle helmets.
 
2013-09-17 12:36:01 AM
Had three concussions in baseball before 4th grade. Had another two playing basketball in elementary school.

Learned my lesson (stay away from any physical activity) in high school when I shattered both knees playing volleyball in PE.

I've been hospitalized over a dozen times for sports or recreational injuries, which I halted as soon as I graduated high school.

I am astonished athletic deaths are so rare.
 
2013-09-17 01:14:12 AM

BolloxReader: Had three concussions in baseball before 4th grade. Had another two playing basketball in elementary school.

Learned my lesson (stay away from any physical activity) in high school when I shattered both knees playing volleyball in PE.

I've been hospitalized over a dozen times for sports or recreational injuries, which I halted as soon as I graduated high school.

I am astonished athletic deaths are so rare.


You sound incredibly fragile.  Or have the worst farking luck.

/I've seen both in teenagers
//Managed to never get injured beyond a sprained ankle the whole time I was playing sports as a kid and as a teenager
 
2013-09-17 01:22:32 AM
Maybe I was lucky, but I never was hurt badly playing sports. Other than a bunch of concussions playing soccer and street hockey.at least I never played football.
 
2013-09-17 01:24:48 AM

mooseyfate: BolloxReader: Had three concussions in baseball before 4th grade. Had another two playing basketball in elementary school.

Learned my lesson (stay away from any physical activity) in high school when I shattered both knees playing volleyball in PE.

I've been hospitalized over a dozen times for sports or recreational injuries, which I halted as soon as I graduated high school.

I am astonished athletic deaths are so rare.

You sound incredibly fragile.  Or have the worst farking luck.

/I've seen both in teenagers
//Managed to never get injured beyond a sprained ankle the whole time I was playing sports as a kid and as a teenager


Got through HS with only a muscle tear.

Blew my knee to farking hell in college. Ten years later it's still a constant source of pain.

Miss my weekly soccer game, but had to quit over knee issues.
 
2013-09-17 01:27:05 AM

Nabb1: Things like this are why I don't want my son playing football.


Explain to him that there are more Microsoft millionaires than sports millionaires. (True statistic)
 
2013-09-17 01:55:07 AM
But no, seriously, why does everyone deride the very idea of turning the sport into flag football? Sure, checks are cool in hockey and big hits are cool sometimes in football (though when they result in someone getting hurt even temporarily, as they often do, it really lessens a lot of the coolness now), hockey is very watchable without big hits and football would still be watchable as flag football. You can still bump and you can still play tight coverage, you just don't get to separate people by destroying them over the middle. And what offenses gain by that, they lose by how easy it can be to get flags off compared to tackling some of 'em.

/also, it'd be funny to see guys cheat and tie their flags on to have any score overturned by the refs upon the flag test in the end zone
 
2013-09-17 03:00:16 AM

IAmRight: But no, seriously, why does everyone deride the very idea of turning the sport into flag football? Sure, checks are cool in hockey and big hits are cool sometimes in football (though when they result in someone getting hurt even temporarily, as they often do, it really lessens a lot of the coolness now), hockey is very watchable without big hits and football would still be watchable as flag football. You can still bump and you can still play tight coverage, you just don't get to separate people by destroying them over the middle. And what offenses gain by that, they lose by how easy it can be to get flags off compared to tackling some of 'em.

/also, it'd be funny to see guys cheat and tie their flags on to have any score overturned by the refs upon the flag test in the end zone


You don't really have to turn it in to flag football.  You really just have to take off all the padding and helmets.  Guys wouldn't turn themselves in to a headfirst missile if the actual top of their head was the thing they were leading with.

The unintended consequence of making the game more safe was making it wildly unsafer.
 
2013-09-17 03:02:34 AM
"God received a new angel today," one girl wrote, echoing the comments of another who said Janes was "up with the angels playing football."

Hopefully he doesn't experience a halo-to-halo hit.
 
2013-09-17 04:17:48 AM

Daniels: IAmRight: But no, seriously, why does everyone deride the very idea of turning the sport into flag football? Sure, checks are cool in hockey and big hits are cool sometimes in football (though when they result in someone getting hurt even temporarily, as they often do, it really lessens a lot of the coolness now), hockey is very watchable without big hits and football would still be watchable as flag football. You can still bump and you can still play tight coverage, you just don't get to separate people by destroying them over the middle. And what offenses gain by that, they lose by how easy it can be to get flags off compared to tackling some of 'em.

/also, it'd be funny to see guys cheat and tie their flags on to have any score overturned by the refs upon the flag test in the end zone

You don't really have to turn it in to flag football.  You really just have to take off all the padding and helmets.  Guys wouldn't turn themselves in to a headfirst missile if the actual top of their head was the thing they were leading with.

The unintended consequence of making the game more safe was making it wildly unsafer.


Similar thing happened with boxing. Before padded gloves few people hit in the face because it could break the hand. Now they get constant blows to the head. I think you're right, more safety is less safe. Although not knowing anything about American Football as I do, why don't the helmets have more padding? Or are they already very well padded?
 
2013-09-17 04:30:26 AM
Where's your soccer gods now
 
2013-09-17 04:31:12 AM

tbhouston: Where's your soccer gods now


farm3.staticflickr.com
 
2013-09-17 05:46:04 AM
This wouldn't have happened if someone had been carrying a gun.
 
2013-09-17 06:38:41 AM

fatalvenom: I've been hit in the head with many a shoulder check and puck to the dome playing both junior and college hockey. I've been hit in the head playing safety in high school football. I've been hit in the head by a pitch playing little league. I've been kicked in the head by violent negros playing basketball and wearing a Sarah Palin shirt.  And NONE of that has stopped me from being an asshole on Fark.


One could speculate it's the primary reason.
 
2013-09-17 07:24:50 AM

Slaxl: Daniels: IAmRight: But no, seriously, why does everyone deride the very idea of turning the sport into flag football? Sure, checks are cool in hockey and big hits are cool sometimes in football (though when they result in someone getting hurt even temporarily, as they often do, it really lessens a lot of the coolness now), hockey is very watchable without big hits and football would still be watchable as flag football. You can still bump and you can still play tight coverage, you just don't get to separate people by destroying them over the middle. And what offenses gain by that, they lose by how easy it can be to get flags off compared to tackling some of 'em.

/also, it'd be funny to see guys cheat and tie their flags on to have any score overturned by the refs upon the flag test in the end zone

You don't really have to turn it in to flag football.  You really just have to take off all the padding and helmets.  Guys wouldn't turn themselves in to a headfirst missile if the actual top of their head was the thing they were leading with.

The unintended consequence of making the game more safe was making it wildly unsafer.

Similar thing happened with boxing. Before padded gloves few people hit in the face because it could break the hand. Now they get constant blows to the head. I think you're right, more safety is less safe. Although not knowing anything about American Football as I do, why don't the helmets have more padding? Or are they already very well padded?


They hit the face when there were no gloves. They just didn't strike as hard. The idea was merely to get a bit of swelling 'round the eyes to interfere with vision, or maybe to get a cut or two opened, which might bleed enough over the next 20 rounds or so, to cause fainting from blood loss. Even these lighter blows did still result in brain damage, once they began to accumulate. At least that's what physicians found when performing autopsies on former prize fighters. I'll concede that the use of gloves worsened neurological outcomes for boxers, though.
 
2013-09-17 07:32:42 AM
Everyone within a mile of the football field to be sued in 5..4..3..
 
2013-09-17 08:06:53 AM

cameroncrazy1984: Nabb1: Things like this are why I don't want my son playing football.

There are several prominent media personalities here that have now said they won't let their kids play football. It's definitely going to start a trend.


I'm concerned about the social ramifications though.  The wealthy people will take their kids out of football, but as long as there's money to be made and DI scholarships to be rewarded, the poor kids will only have more incentive to risk their health and lives for the chance to lift their families out of poverty.

puffy999: This is part-of the reason why I think the focus on the NFL is a bit of a red herring...

When this society realizes how many NON-PROFESSIONAL former football players have suffered long-term injuries from the sport, what will happen?
(I guess I should be asking: who will pay for all of the lawsuits?)


Yeah, HS and smaller college programs are big problems, largely because they can't afford fancy concussion diagnostics or team physicians on the sideline---but their players are just as vulnerable, if not more so.  I know some research is being done on finding ways to make concussion diagnostics more accessible, but it's a serious problem.
 
2013-09-17 08:10:26 AM

bborchar: People can die doing ANYTHING strenuous.  Hell, they could die in a power walking class if they have an undiagnosed heart condition.  I'm a proponent for making high school and college football as safe as possible, but I think people who want it to die out completely are twerps.  People like to watch it, and people like to play it, and you assume the risk when you decide to play.


Stupid twerps and their undiagnosed head conditions.
 
2013-09-17 08:41:44 AM
Flag football would never work in the United States for the same reason Soccer doesn't sell out 100,000 seat stadiums here. People like the big hits.
 
2013-09-17 09:00:26 AM
The problem is that they're wearing too much protection. Guys put on a helmet and suddenly think they can run head first into a speeding locomotive.
 
2013-09-17 09:04:27 AM

Snapper Carr: [i.imgur.com image 620x350]

How do you expect to build a $59.6 million dollar stadium without sacrificing a few kids?


That stadium sucks, too. Should be tall instead of wide, and should have roofs to trap the noise.

/English
 
2013-09-17 09:18:05 AM
I knew a kid that died during a baseball game... he was a Sophomore when I was a year out of HS. Died from a line-drive hit right to the chest, right there on the field. He had an underlying heart condition already.
 
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