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(The Newspaper)   "I asked him if he had a permit to protest the red light cameras, and he said no"   (thenewspaper.com ) divider line
    More: Florida, red light cameras, East Main Street, selective enforcement, free speech zone, Apopka, roofing  
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8056 clicks; posted to Main » on 16 Sep 2013 at 2:43 PM (2 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-16 03:33:09 PM  
He recognized Schmidter from a previous incident where Schmidter was jailed for handing out flyers on the courthouse steps outside of a designated free speech zone.

How the flying fark can a public courthouse legally have a "designated free speech zone"?
 
2013-09-16 03:34:57 PM  
Pfft....presidents...such attention whores.
 
2013-09-16 03:35:46 PM  

liam76: Unless he was breaking the law he didn'tneed a permit.

Handing out things at a red light deosn't seem to break any laws.


Little by little it's becoming unlawful to question or oppose "the powers that be".

/or "your betters" as they like to think of themselves
 
2013-09-16 03:36:13 PM  

patrick767: How the flying fark can a public courthouse legally have a "designated free speech zone"?


A courthouse might be the only place where that makes sense.  Signs and whatnot within X feet of a trial might be considered to be interfering with the trial.  I'm thinking that it might be similar to electioneering laws that prohibit political signs and speeches within 100 M of a polling station.

None of this applies to an intersection, however.  This is simply a case of cop outrage.
 
2013-09-16 03:36:50 PM  
Also, it might just be worth it to jump through the hoop just to get a permit.
 
2013-09-16 03:37:24 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: liam76: Unless he was breaking the law he didn'tneed a permit.

Handing out things at a red light deosn't seem to break any laws.

Little by little it's becoming unlawful to question or oppose "the powers that be".

/or "your betters" as they like to think of themselves


The Matrix was a prophecy.
 
2013-09-16 03:39:09 PM  
Someone needs to charge that policeman with being a no account Nazi dickhead.
 
2013-09-16 03:40:33 PM  

GoldSpider: I was under the impression that requiring citizens to be properly registered/licensed before they be allowed to exercise their constitutional rights was called "common sense".


Stop quoting our new hero Vladimir Putin.
 
2013-09-16 03:43:30 PM  

jaylectricity: Agent Smiths Laugh: liam76: Unless he was breaking the law he didn'tneed a permit.

Handing out things at a red light deosn't seem to break any laws.

Little by little it's becoming unlawful to question or oppose "the powers that be".

/or "your betters" as they like to think of themselves

The Matrix was a prophecy.


Dunno about that, but I'm not going to be surprised if this looms in the U.S. future.
 
2013-09-16 03:47:27 PM  
We become more and more of a police state every day.
 
2013-09-16 03:47:42 PM  

Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: "designated free speech zone"

Most offensive part of the story.


So much this.

I understand that they probably have a place for people to soap box a bit that allows them to be heard without being really in peoples' way.  It is probably an OK idea, but that is the worst farking name I could imagine for that.
 
2013-09-16 03:51:23 PM  

scottydoesntknow: feckingmorons: He was also convicted of jury tampering as he was giving stuff to jurors, but that is still on appeal.

Wait, is that the guy who was handing out leaflets informing potential jurors about jury nullification?


My favorite Depression Era story that is probably fake:  Poor guy is starving and steals a rich guy's cow.  Makes it to trail.  Jury comes up with:  Not Guilty, but he has to give the cow back.

Judge calls bullshiat, and tells them they can't do that.  Jury goes back to delibs.  Jury comes up with with:  Not Guilty, and he can keep the cow.
 
2013-09-16 03:53:24 PM  

Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: "designated free speech zone"

Most offensive part of the story.


Plus infinity.
 
2013-09-16 03:54:04 PM  

dpaul007: FTFA: "Schmidter was jailed for handing out flyers on the courthouse steps outside of a designated free speech zone."

What a "Free Speech Zone" might look like:

[www.horseshoesonline.com image 512x330]


Unrelated map fail... Tennessee and Missouri border, but are in the same color on your map, creating a new state of Tennesouri.
 
2013-09-16 03:54:06 PM  
My favorite part was that the judge at the trial recognized him from his prior appeals and told the cop "that's the last guy you want to mess with".

See you in court, suckas!
 
2013-09-16 03:54:24 PM  

NutWrench: "Other protestors across the street began heckling me for making a bad arrest," Officer Campbell wrote. "This information was added to show the demeanor of the group the arrested male was with."

Oh, whaaaah.


OK he was "with" a group that was "across the street"?????
 
2013-09-16 03:58:20 PM  

Coconice: scottydoesntknow: feckingmorons: He was also convicted of jury tampering as he was giving stuff to jurors, but that is still on appeal.

Wait, is that the guy who was handing out leaflets informing potential jurors about jury nullification?

My favorite Depression Era story that is probably fake:  Poor guy is starving and steals a rich guy's cow.  Makes it to trail.  Jury comes up with:  Not Guilty, but he has to give the cow back.

Judge calls bullshiat, and tells them they can't do that.  Jury goes back to delibs.  Jury comes up with with:  Not Guilty, and he can keep the cow.


Almost definitely fake, yeah.  Great story, though, I've got to remember that one.

fireclown: patrick767: How the flying fark can a public courthouse legally have a "designated free speech zone"?

A courthouse might be the only place where that makes sense.  Signs and whatnot within X feet of a trial might be considered to be interfering with the trial.  I'm thinking that it might be similar to electioneering laws that prohibit political signs and speeches within 100 M of a polling station.

None of this applies to an intersection, however.  This is simply a case of cop outrage.


There are also issues of harassment, impediment to vehicle/pedestrian traffic, etc.  Campus I went to undergrad on was frequently visited by street preachers, real Westboro types.  They would actually follow people around from time to time, such as "sinfully dressed" women, yelling and insulting them all the while.  It got so bad, the school set up a "free speech zone" so they'd at least have to stay in one place.  Obviously that wasn't the issue here, but there are legitimate standards that can be used.

/I know, I know, CSB.
 
2013-09-16 04:02:53 PM  

SDRR: [keithandthemovies.files.wordpress.com image 500x339]


That minkey might be herpes infected though..
 
2013-09-16 04:10:12 PM  

Agent Smiths Laugh: jaylectricity: Agent Smiths Laugh: liam76: Unless he was breaking the law he didn'tneed a permit.

Handing out things at a red light deosn't seem to break any laws.

Little by little it's becoming unlawful to question or oppose "the powers that be".

/or "your betters" as they like to think of themselves

The Matrix was a prophecy.

Dunno about that, but I'm not going to be surprised if this looms in the U.S. future.


Well shiat, kid...your screen name is a reference to the Matrix. What else do you expect from me?
 
2013-09-16 04:11:21 PM  

Headso: you think it's common sense for this guy to have to get a permit to handout flyers?


If it's reasonable to require people to get permission to exercise other rights, why not?
 
2013-09-16 04:11:59 PM  

Last Man on Earth: There are also issues of harassment, impediment to vehicle/pedestrian traffic, etc. Campus I went to undergrad on was frequently visited by street preachers, real Westboro types. They would actually follow people around from time to time, such as "sinfully dressed" women, yelling and insulting them all the while. It got so bad, the school set up a "free speech zone" so they'd at least have to stay in one place. Obviously that wasn't the issue here, but there are legitimate standards that can be used.


Thing is, there's already policies to handle all of those.  Speeding will get you a ticket; this is fairly reasonable.  Impounding every car in the country to make sure people won't speed on the other hand...
 
2013-09-16 04:19:28 PM  

Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: rjakobi: scottydoesntknow: feckingmorons: He was also convicted of jury tampering as he was giving stuff to jurors, but that is still on appeal.

Wait, is that the guy who was handing out leaflets informing potential jurors about jury nullification?

Ah, so he's an attention whore.

Lock them all up.

abfalter: I wish I had the time to dedicate my life to being a complete jackass pain in the ass for some petty cause.

Unfortunately, I already HAVE a life...

That's not how free speech works.  If you can mandate who can have it based on how much of a pain in the ass they are, then we've already lost the Right.


No, it is exactly how free speech works.

I did not say that he had NO RIGHT to do this.  I am saying he is an IDIOT for doing so.
 
2013-09-16 04:22:10 PM  

A Non Amos: How is this even constitutional?


www.supershadow.org
"I will make it constitutional."
 
2013-09-16 04:23:48 PM  

abfalter: I did not say that he had NO RIGHT to do this. I am saying he is an IDIOT for doing so.


The security of this nation depends on complete and total compliance.
 
2013-09-16 04:24:00 PM  

Honest Bender: Permit?  Doesn't the First Amendment cover that?  The right to peacefully assemble?  I know that stuff is never as simple as it seems, though.


No, it's pretty simple. It means people have the right to peacefully assemble and protest the government. The people at the founding of the country were worried that the government would attempt to obstruct this right. They made them put it in writing and add the Bill of Rights to the Constitution. TJ and Co. thought this was redundant and unnecessary but it made the common folk happy.
 
2013-09-16 04:25:04 PM  

OtherLittleGuy: rjakobi: Ah, so he's an attention whore.

Lock them all up.

You know who else were attention whores?

[wsmith769.edublogs.org image 250x351]

[0.static.wix.com image 655x512]

[www.history.com image 605x412]

/last guy blogged about it


Let us not forget some other great A.W.'s who were pesky troublemakers:
Washington, Jefferson, Hamilton, and Franklin; just to name a few.
Upstarts, I say. Upstarts, the lot of them.
 
2013-09-16 04:30:48 PM  

GoldSpider: Headso: you think it's common sense for this guy to have to get a permit to handout flyers?

If it's reasonable to require people to get permission to exercise other rights, why not?


I was just down at town hall getting a permit to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. Why can't everybody get one?!?!
 
2013-09-16 04:32:42 PM  

Last Man on Earth: Coconice: scottydoesntknow: feckingmorons: He was also convicted of jury tampering as he was giving stuff to jurors, but that is still on appeal.

Wait, is that the guy who was handing out leaflets informing potential jurors about jury nullification?

My favorite Depression Era story that is probably fake:  Poor guy is starving and steals a rich guy's cow.  Makes it to trail.  Jury comes up with:  Not Guilty, but he has to give the cow back.

Judge calls bullshiat, and tells them they can't do that.  Jury goes back to delibs.  Jury comes up with with:  Not Guilty, and he can keep the cow.

Almost definitely fake, yeah.  Great story, though, I've got to remember that one.

fireclown: patrick767: How the flying fark can a public courthouse legally have a "designated free speech zone"?

A courthouse might be the only place where that makes sense.  Signs and whatnot within X feet of a trial might be considered to be interfering with the trial.  I'm thinking that it might be similar to electioneering laws that prohibit political signs and speeches within 100 M of a polling station.

None of this applies to an intersection, however.  This is simply a case of cop outrage.

There are also issues of harassment, impediment to vehicle/pedestrian traffic, etc.  Campus I went to undergrad on was frequently visited by street preachers, real Westboro types.  They would actually follow people around from time to time, such as "sinfully dressed" women, yelling and insulting them all the while.  It got so bad, the school set up a "free speech zone" so they'd at least have to stay in one place.  Obviously that wasn't the issue here, but there are legitimate standards that can be used.

/I know, I know, CSB.


The " sinfully " dressed women part is a CSB. Dunno about the rest.
 
2013-09-16 04:36:29 PM  
GOD dammit! You're right. I should go back.
 
2013-09-16 04:51:01 PM  

jaylectricity: The Matrix was a prophecy.


Where it's OK to assault a battery.
 
2013-09-16 04:53:28 PM  

Coconice: Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: "designated free speech zone"

Most offensive part of the story.

So much this.

I understand that they probably have a place for people to soap box a bit that allows them to be heard without being really in peoples' way.  It is probably an OK idea, but that is the worst farking name I could imagine for that.


Wait, you agree with the statement and then said the exact opposite.  It sounds like the only issue you have is with the name?  Do you really not see how offensive it is to corral free speech into a designated area "without being really in peoples' way"?  Have you ever SEEN a so-called "free speech zone"?  It's almost always a tiny little fenced-off area way at the back of the venue or, more often, blocks away from the event.  They are so far "out of peoples' way" that their message cannot be heard at all.  The last one I encountered was on public land at a National Park.  It was a 20'x20' square made of chain-link fence and it was not visible or within earshot of any of the common areas (parking lot, restrooms, ranger station, etc.)   There was a tiny placard near the ranger station directing people to it.  It made me want to vomit.
 
2013-09-16 04:54:35 PM  
During the commotion, a man came out of Chuck's Wagon restaurant and identified himself as a former county judge to one of the other officers on the scene. He recognized Schmidter from a previous incident where Schmidter was jailed for handing out flyers on the courthouse steps outside of a designated free speech zone.

"That's the last person you need to mess with," the judge warned.


The dumbass quotient just tripled for the cop. On top of this his cause just got enough publicity to almost guarantee a referendum by by red light cameras.
 
2013-09-16 04:56:24 PM  

Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: Coconice: Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: "designated free speech zone"

Most offensive part of the story.

So much this.

I understand that they probably have a place for people to soap box a bit that allows them to be heard without being really in peoples' way.  It is probably an OK idea, but that is the worst farking name I could imagine for that.

Wait, you agree with the statement and then said the exact opposite.  It sounds like the only issue you have is with the name?  Do you really not see how offensive it is to corral free speech into a designated area "without being really in peoples' way"?  Have you ever SEEN a so-called "free speech zone"?  It's almost always a tiny little fenced-off area way at the back of the venue or, more often, blocks away from the event.  They are so far "out of peoples' way" that their message cannot be heard at all.  The last one I encountered was on public land at a National Park.  It was a 20'x20' square made of chain-link fence and it was not visible or within earshot of any of the common areas (parking lot, restrooms, ranger station, etc.)   There was a tiny placard near the ranger station directing people to it.  It made me want to vomit.


Like a bunch of sheep in a pen. Idiots.
 
2013-09-16 04:59:21 PM  

Last Man on Earth
There are also issues of harassment, impediment to vehicle/pedestrian traffic, etc.  Campus I went to undergrad on was frequently visited by street preachers, real Westboro types.  They would actually follow people around from time to time, such as "sinfully dressed" women, yelling and insulting them all the while.  It got so bad, the school set up a "free speech zone" so they'd at least have to stay in one place.  Obviously that wasn't the issue here, but there are legitimate standards that can be used.

Then harassment of some kind might apply, but free speech zones on campus are bullshiat too. My university set one like that up as well. We had the usual assortment of crazy preachers before and after the designation of a "free speech zone".

fireclown: patrick767: How the flying fark can a public courthouse legally have a "designated free speech zone"?

A courthouse might be the only place where that makes sense.  Signs and whatnot within X feet of a trial might be considered to be interfering with the trial.  I'm thinking that it might be similar to electioneering laws that prohibit political signs and speeches within 100 M of a polling station.

None of this applies to an intersection, however.  This is simply a case of cop outrage.


I should have specified that this was outside the courthouse. I can see it making more inside.
 
2013-09-16 05:03:38 PM  
Redflex has cameras around where I live. We never got to vote, and have never been presented with an opportunity to object.

Ironically, one got hit by a car a while back. If it wasn't there, there wouldn't have even been an accident!

My thought is: these cameras do not have air conditioning. The components in them are rated typically to 85 degrees C. If the enclosure has ever persistently been above that (like in our Texas summers) how can Redflex or the police certify the equipment is still within spec?
 
2013-09-16 05:04:11 PM  

Last Man on Earth: They would actually follow people around from time to time, such as "sinfully dressed" women, yelling and insulting them all the while.  It got so bad, the school set up a "free speech zone" so they'd at least have to stay in one place.  Obviously that wasn't the issue here, but there are legitimate standards that can be used.


There are standards and it's reckless to imply there are not. Behavior like you describe is clearly undesirable, and if it is ongoing it is probably illegal. But harassment requires systematic and/or continuing actions against a specific target before the behavior becomes illegal, and that standard exists specifically to avoid the use of anti-harassament laws in prosecuting protestors.
 
2013-09-16 05:11:41 PM  

WelldeadLink: jaylectricity: The Matrix was a prophecy.

Where it's OK to assault a battery.


I didn't even get the joke at first, I just loved the play on words! [funny]
 
2013-09-16 05:14:45 PM  

Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: Coconice: Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: "designated free speech zone"

Most offensive part of the story.

So much this.

I understand that they probably have a place for people to soap box a bit that allows them to be heard without being really in peoples' way.  It is probably an OK idea, but that is the worst farking name I could imagine for that.

Wait, you agree with the statement and then said the exact opposite.  It sounds like the only issue you have is with the name?  Do you really not see how offensive it is to corral free speech into a designated area "without being really in peoples' way"?  Have you ever SEEN a so-called "free speech zone"?It's almost always a tiny little fenced-off area way at the back of the venue or, more often, blocks away from the event.  They are so far "out of peoples' way" that their message cannot be heard at all.  The last one I encountered was on public land at a National Park.  It was a 20'x20' square made of chain-link fence and it was not visible or within earshot of any of the common areas (parking lot, restrooms, ranger station, etc.)   There was a tiny placard near the ranger station directing people to it.  It made me want to vomit.


No, I have not seen this or any other "free speech zone."

Being so far away that peoples' messages cannot be heard would violate my very limited support for such a thing.

My only support for this type of thing comes from the fact that I feel that my right to travel through an area unmolested is no less important than the right of protestors to be heard.
 
2013-09-16 05:34:53 PM  
Coconice:
Being so far away that peoples' messages cannot be heard would violate my very limited support for such a thing.

My only support for this type of thing comes from the fact that I feel that my right to travel through an area unmolested is no less important than the right of protestors to be heard.


That they exist at all should be an affront to any American.  The very idea that you can only say what's on your mind when you are in a spot designated by a duly-authorized government employee is detestable.  As for your right to travel, we already have laws regarding personal harassment, assault and battery, and so forth.  We should be using those, when appropriate.  However, I might also suggest that inconveniencing you as you go about your business may be precisely why it's so important.  Can you imagine if the 1963 civil rights march on Washington (for example) was not allowed to proceed because it "impeded traffic" or some other nonsense?

Consider this article regarding the G8 summit in 2012.  In this case, the "free speech zone" was over a mile away from the summit.  Far enough away so that our royalty don't have to be bothered by the unwashed peasants.

If selected as the so-called designated protest area during the G8/NATO summits in Chicago in May, many protest leaders said they will not be going there.
"It is frankly insulting. The point of our protest is the G8 and NATO and not some be sodden field in the south end of Grant Park," Andy Thayer, protest organizer, said.

"When the government that we are questioning, challenging, designates where and how and to whom we can bring that message, then it is, by definition, no longer free speech," Jay Becker, protest organizer, said.


By relegating protesters to a FSZ away from the event, the government therefore effectively destroyed any planned demonstration during the summit.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
 
2013-09-16 05:42:05 PM  
You must file your request for a Free Speech permit three weeks prior to your scheduled protest. Remember staying from your designated Free Speech Zone may result in arrest.

Please enjoy the safe and sane exercising of your Constitution Rights!
 
2013-09-16 05:45:32 PM  

Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: The last one I encountered was on public land at a National Park. It was a 20'x20' square made of chain-link fence and it was not visible or within earshot of any of the common areas (parking lot, restrooms, ranger station, etc.) There was a tiny placard near the ranger station directing people to it. It made me want to vomit

 
If I went to enjoy a national park and it was so filled with KKK so I couldn't enjoy the park for its intended purpose it would make me want to vomit more.

Roads, parks, courts, etc are all public property that we have democratically decided have certain uses.  I dont agree with the way free speech are often set up but that doesn't mean those areas are a free for all protest wise.
 
2013-09-16 05:45:53 PM  
retailers.s3.amazonaws.com

These men live and die to maintain the following Free Speech Zone:

i.infopls.com
fark the police in this story, fark the red light cameras, and fark anyone who tries to limit your rights.
 
2013-09-16 05:46:54 PM  

mama2tnt: gilgigamesh: netizencain: "Once traffic came to a stop, he would walk in between cars"

Maybe that was the bigger issue.

I don't know what the deal is where he lives, but here in New Orleans homeless panhandlers and fundraisers (often children) do this all the time unmolested. It bugs the fark out of me, especially the kids, for obvious reasons.

Firefighters with boots, homeless with signs, whatever - they're all over the streets in my town, and not one of them seems afraid of being run over. It especially bothers me to see them on the skinny little medians - just one texter or old person can take 'em out. (And should.)


As a volunteer firefighter in my state, and struggling to make ends meet to keep the department open (to protect people like you during fires, wrecks, natural disasters), I understand their fundraising tactics.  I suggest you join and see how hard it is to keep a public free service open....

Maybe someone should "take you out".
 
2013-09-16 05:52:23 PM  

dpaul007: FTFA: "Schmidter was jailed for handing out flyers on the courthouse steps outside of a designated free speech zone."

What a "Free Speech Zone" might look like:

[www.horseshoesonline.com image 512x330]


Four colors suffice.
 
2013-09-16 05:54:23 PM  

liam76: Unless he was breaking the law he didn'tneed a permit.

Handing out things at a red light deosn't seem to break any laws.


No more than selling newspapers or flowers does.
Hmmm...cops don't happen to get a cut of the red light proceeds, do they?
 
2013-09-16 05:55:03 PM  

Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: Can you imagine if the 1963 civil rights march on Washington (for example) was not allowed to proceed because it "impeded traffic" or some other nonsense?


You know they applied for and got permits, right?


Pelvic Splanchnic Ganglion: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances


You know that means more than just non, violent, right?
 
2013-09-16 06:21:27 PM  

ka1axy: Hmmm...cops don't happen to get a cut of the red light proceeds, do they?


They get jobs with red light camera contractors once they retire.
http://www.thenewspaper.com/news/36/3680.asp
 
2013-09-16 06:30:46 PM  

Coconice: My only support for this type of thing comes from the fact that I feel that my right to travel through an area unmolested is no less important than the right of protestors to be heard.


I was not aware you had such a right.
 
2013-09-16 06:56:13 PM  
Congress shall make no law abridging the freedom of speech.


There that is his permit.
 
2013-09-16 06:56:20 PM  
They guy should have just carried a pocket sized Constitution and presented it when asked if he had a permit.
 
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