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(New York Magazine)   "The conservative movement sustains itself by constantly disregarding its warnings of the last mortal threat to liberty and redirecting itself onto the next one. If the Obamacare train does not wreck, what will they do next?"   (nymag.com) divider line 361
    More: Interesting, Joe McCarthy, cultural war, obamacare, Cuccinelli, economic cost, President Eisenhower  
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2472 clicks; posted to Politics » on 16 Sep 2013 at 6:50 AM (45 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-16 12:02:37 AM
Great article.

Oh, and the answer is that in 10 years they will run as defenders of the ACA and slam liberals for trying to mess with it.
 
2013-09-16 12:13:19 AM
They'll do the same as they always have: embrace Progressivism as if it was their own and pretend that it's conservative (Social Security, drug laws/regulations, Medicare, the MIC, etc.).
 
2013-09-16 12:14:59 AM
If we continue with our one party system disguised as a two party system, who will gaze at our navel for us?
 
2013-09-16 12:17:45 AM
They'll move on.  Outrage is a never-failing well for them.
 
2013-09-16 12:18:32 AM
This may be the last line of the article, but the whole thing is a great basic summary of what's going on with Obamacare and how unprecedented and deranged the GOP is about it.
 
2013-09-16 12:39:46 AM
Obamacare isn't perfect, but it's better than what we had.  In a perfect world we'd have universal single payer, and in an imperfect but just world we'd at least have the public option, but since we live in a society dominated by corporate interests, we've got what we've got.

Still, the GOP needs something other than 'repeal it' as their plan.  If you want to do away with it, what do you want to replace it with?  Obamacare may be a gas station egg salad sandwich, but it's still better than the shiat sandwich the GOP wants us to go back to eating instead.
 
2013-09-16 12:46:53 AM
There's always Mexicans, Gays, and Science.
 
2013-09-16 01:18:09 AM

TuteTibiImperes: Obamacare isn't perfect, but it's better than what we had. In a perfect world we'd have universal single payer, and in an imperfect but just world we'd at least have the public option, but since we live in a society dominated by corporate interests, we've got what we've got.


Perfect is the enemy of good.
 
2013-09-16 01:31:59 AM
It's still whacked-over-the-head-with-a-2x4 stunning that they are screaming so frantically and hysterically about ACA almost to the point of threatening actual bloodshed against a thing that they themselves designed.
 
2013-09-16 01:34:42 AM
"We can't afford everything we do now, let alone provide free medical care to able-bodied adults," as Missouri Republican Rob Schaaf, author of the state's harsh anti-Obamacare initiative, put it. "I have a philosophical problem with doing that."

The GOP in a nutshell.
 
2013-09-16 01:36:08 AM

Kittypie070: It's still whacked-over-the-head-with-a-2x4 stunning that they are screaming so frantically and hysterically about ACA almost to the point of threatening actual bloodshed against a thing that they themselves designed.


At least it's a real thing they're fighting against, even if they're wrong.  I wouldn't be surprised if the GOP powers that be have been pushing the fight against the ACA, futile as it may be, to keep them away from the more damaging (to themselves) birther and secret muslim rabbit holes.
 
2013-09-16 01:38:43 AM
At this point, it's not about Conservatism, or even national goals. It's preserving power, conserving donors, and servicing their clientele. Radicals? They can look out for them--both economic as well as socially radical. What is damning for me, is that there is a whole industry dedicated to generating papers, books, journals, and more, to make it appear that these radical notions are somehow Conservative, and moreover, not an affront to the Constitution, our our posterity. It banks on folks who have little concept of history, little curiosity, and with notions of "scholarship" that pretty much froze in their sophomore years of college, if they even got that far. It banks on the incurious, the ignorant, and especially those who are willfully so. Those who are bright enough to understand what is being done, are just disingenuous enough to point to rigged papers, skewed studies, and point like a damn spaniel to the "evidence" so that the rubes won't tell that they're snickering a bit.

It's not about Conservatism. It is about masking radicals under the guise and veneer of "Conservatism" to make them feel like that they have the weight of history behind them, when they wish for a nation that has never been, or worse, to set the Wayback Machine to bring the days of Robber Barons back, and ignoring the damage that they'll do to the nation, the economy, and the world around them, all for a few bucks today, because those who thirst for it most, know that they can remove themselves from the fallout, and those who cheer them on, are hoping that they'll be dealt in, or at least be behind strong walls and protected as this brand of NeoFeudalism sweeps, with fiefdoms of corporate flags and religious enclaves spread out.

And, yes, it's rucking fecockulous...
 
2013-09-16 01:40:16 AM

hubiestubert: At this point, it's not about Conservatism, or even national goals.


when has it been?
 
2013-09-16 01:58:22 AM
Yeah, I don't really get it. I turned on FOX news sometime last week and Senator Ted Cruz is doing commercials asking people to call in to verbally sign a petition to defund Obamacare. Let it go you farking clowns. Click here scroll down, and look at these whackadoodles in green who've pledged to oppose funding.
 
2013-09-16 02:04:39 AM

log_jammin: hubiestubert: At this point, it's not about Conservatism, or even national goals.

when has it been?


About forty minutes before the party decided to bring in the Religious Right. The erosion of the party began there, and it only gained steam when the NeoCons realized that they could ally with the Religious Right. Both were radical fringes, but together, coupled with the publishing houses that they brought to the table, they changed the game. They got Reagan into the Presidency, and that got the NeoCons the traction that they needed to take center stage, and they couldn't have done it without the cash that the Religious Right brought to the table. Couple those victories, with the eventual rise of Rove and his ilk to Newt's "Revolution" within Congress, and it pretty much became all style over substance, only without the mirrorshades and cortical plugs that Gibson imagined.

Now? Now, it's about message. Not policy. Narrative. Narrative is king. With the rise of captive media, at a national level with the ease of access that Fox News has, it is an extension of the Old Skool AM talk radio blather--only with better suits, and women with the same bleach blond hair and easily interchangeable--it isn't about policy, certainly not about specifics, it's about maintaining a narrative, and one that can be retconned at any point. The Ivory Tower types that the NeoCons brought to the table, have been experimenting, and using their captive sources for some time in publishing, and on AM radio, but now they have a whole new sphere to experiment with. Beck was just an expansion on the populist theme, and a nice puppet that could be played with. Rush had to be sidelined, so that new faces, more acceptable faces, could be put forward. It's the same drivel. It's the same radicalized notions, but instead of screaming into a radio mic on an AM dial into the desert night, folks have to moderate their tone, and "ask the questions" and then bring up "experts" who have written exactly what they've been told to write, to supply the scholarship to give the impression of support, and ignore all the folks who tore apart these particular works in that "secret" world of academia.

The generation of support for narrative is the single most dangerous threat to our democracy, because our media is now seen as complicit, because it's been cast as "sides"--with folks questioning MSNBC's slant on everything, because folks question what's on FOX--and that is as much fallout from the "fairness doctrine" and its passing, but still, folks cling to the format, because it's now useful to appear "fair and balanced"--especially if you don't actually have to be.

The radicalism of the party, and its support of intellectually and ethically bankrupt practices is what soured me from the party, but it's not as recent a thing, as some like to suggest. Years ago, there was more Real Politik governing the decisions, but those folks grew into the new model...
 
2013-09-16 02:14:04 AM
spot on.
 
2013-09-16 02:27:17 AM
I'm just goddamn tired of it all.
 
2013-09-16 02:34:57 AM
Abortion.

They've been milking that one for decades, and it's never going away. Please think of the little, unborn babies!
 
2013-09-16 03:04:28 AM

hubiestubert: rucking fecockulous


I'm gonna have to use that.
 
2013-09-16 03:44:31 AM

ecmoRandomNumbers: Abortion.

They've been milking that one for decades, and it's never going away. Please think of the little, unborn babies! uppity women who think they can make decisions about their bodies without a man's permission.


Fixed it for you.
 
2013-09-16 05:45:25 AM
The contrast between the cautiousness of mainstream health-policy analysts and the perfervid certainty of those on the right reprises what has become a common pattern in American political debate. Remember this time last fall, when pollsters, political scientists, and analysts like Nate Silver read the campaign data and guardedly declared Barack Obama the presidential front-runner, while a coterie of self-styled conservative public-opinion analysts and their allies crafted a counternarrative in which Mitt Romney was marching toward victory? That asymmetry of confidence lent the Republican arguments a vigor that masked their vaporousness. The imbalance fed upon itself. Conservatives assumed that the cautious evenhandedness of liberal analysts must signal some deeper uncertainty, which in turn made them bolder still. Ultimately, most political reporters got suckered into taking the contrived Romney-momentum story seriously.

this really is a good article.
 
2013-09-16 06:52:49 AM
Wel New Yorker. If you keep writing articles like that they might turn their poutrage cannons on YOU!
 
2013-09-16 06:57:58 AM
But it will wreck. It already has...can't you see the flames and hear the cries of despair?

You can't? It's obvious to anyone who can see. Over there, a mother and two small children, frightened and confused by the carnage around them.

What do you mean you don't see anything? Haven't you been listening to me? This is a complete and total disaster! Oh, God, the devastation! I almost can't bear to look...Oh no, that elderly man, thrown from the wreckage and impaled on....oh God, no...

Look, I don't know what to tell you. I've told you of this train wreck, described the scene...maybe you're not good enough to see it. Yes, that must be it. Only people who really love their country can see as I do.
 
2013-09-16 07:02:13 AM
Libsplaining conservatism?
 
2013-09-16 07:07:54 AM

Mrbogey: Libsplaining conservatism?


And conservatives constantly showing they do not have the ability to create new terms or insults, they just take so-called 'liberal' ones without actually understanding the context behind them.

See: "Fark Liberal"
 
2013-09-16 07:09:01 AM

Mrbogey: Libsplaining conservatism?


Libserving "conservatives".
 
2013-09-16 07:09:23 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Good Lord.  That's not an 'article'.  It's a manifesto.


With you conservatives, it's always a man fest.  O?
 
2013-09-16 07:13:49 AM
The GOP has become Abbot and Costello.    And still the Democrats are Laurel and Hardy.   Obamacare is a disaster only because it didn't go far enough with universal healthcare.
 
2013-09-16 07:14:40 AM
They haven't hit peak outrage yet.

If they run out of new "scandals" they'll just go back to the top of their pile and start again.

/When they get to the bottom they'll go back to the top of the slide...
 
2013-09-16 07:19:09 AM

violentsalvation: Yeah, I don't really get it. I turned on FOX news sometime last week and Senator Ted Cruz is doing commercials asking people to call in to verbally sign a petition to defund Obamacare. Let it go you farking clowns. Click here scroll down, and look at these whackadoodles in green who've pledged to oppose funding.


I've seen the same ads on msnbc. Before that its was abolish the irs, both channels. Fools & money ...
 
2013-09-16 07:19:25 AM

jayhawk88: But it will wreck. It already has...can't you see the flames and hear the cries of despair?

You can't? It's obvious to anyone who can see. Over there, a mother and two small children, frightened and confused by the carnage around them.

What do you mean you don't see anything? Haven't you been listening to me? This is a complete and total disaster! Oh, God, the devastation! I almost can't bear to look...Oh no, that elderly man, thrown from the wreckage and impaled on....oh God, no...

Look, I don't know what to tell you. I've told you of this train wreck, described the scene...maybe you're not good enough to see it. Yes, that must be it. Only people who really love their country can see as I do.


had to say
that was a good play

(even tho
im not a fan
of the plan)
 
2013-09-16 07:24:35 AM
Michelle Obama's communist plot to get us to drink water.
 
2013-09-16 07:26:54 AM

Marcus Aurelius: If we continue with our one party system disguised as a two party system, who will gaze at our navel for us?


"Big picture" guys like you tend to forget that there are a whole lot of very real devils in all those fussy little details. Both sides are not the same, no matter how many times you mumble those mantras.
 
2013-09-16 07:28:33 AM

Marcus Aurelius: If we continue with our one party system disguised as a two party system, who will gaze at our navel for us?


Yawn
 
2013-09-16 07:28:35 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Alright, having scanned that condensed novel, I can sense something from it's author:  FEAR

It's not conservatives that are afraid of it, it's liberals who read that thing, 'New York'.  You don't have to spew out that much verbiage in an effort to sooth other liberals unless you, yourself, are terrified.

Democrats have got to remember the historic crushing they received in 2010 after ramming this thing down the country's throat w/o one single Republican vote.  Have Republicans voted in vain to repeal it 40 something times?  You bet.  And why?  Because they want the country to know - KNOW - that they had nothing to do with it, when this thing hits with full force.


Unions certainly aren't run by Republicans, and they hate it.  The employer mandate has already been (illegally) pushed back a year out of fear - and other elements have been changed or ignored (again, illegally) out of fear.  Wavers have been handed out all over the place out of fear.  Congress and other Washington elites have exempted themselves from it.  2/3rds of the states have refused to participate in it.

People are already losing their insurance, having their hours cut or losing their jobs entirely because of it.  It's contributing heavily to the REAL unemployment rate of 15%.  Just wait until millions of people start receiving demand letters from the IRS for their fines to be paid because they didn't understand that they have to buy insurance, or they refused to.  How will that help democrats?

And wait... just wait... until the first political candidate 'accidently' has her/his health history leaked to the press, right before election day...

[i44.tinypic.com image 660x371]


That reminds me - I need to call my broker and pick up some more ALCOA stock - I see them rising soon.
 
2013-09-16 07:31:05 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Alright, having scanned that condensed novel, I can sense something from it's author:  FEAR


Are they afraid the GOP will fail to defeat it for the 47th time?
 
2013-09-16 07:32:56 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Alright, having scanned that condensed novel, I can sense something from it's author:  FEAR


lurkmore.so
 
2013-09-16 07:33:18 AM
It's going to be a slow trainwreck.  Or really, just a messier version of the trainwreck that our healthcare system already was.

But predictions on new faux outrage (aside from random made-up scandals):  After 2014 it will be time again to start declaring every Presidential contender the most librul member of the Senate, and coming up with crazy narratives of how their election will be the end of America.
 
2013-09-16 07:33:52 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Alright, having scanned that condensed novel, I can sense something from it's author:  FEAR

It's not conservatives that are afraid of it, it's liberals who read that thing, 'New York'.  You don't have to spew out that much verbiage in an effort to sooth other liberals unless you, yourself, are terrified.

Democrats have got to remember the historic crushing they received in 2010 after ramming this thing down the country's throat w/o one single Republican vote.  Have Republicans voted in vain to repeal it 40 something times?  You bet.  And why?  Because they want the country to know - KNOW - that they had nothing to do with it, when this thing hits with full force.


Unions certainly aren't run by Republicans, and they hate it.  The employer mandate has already been (illegally) pushed back a year out of fear - and other elements have been changed or ignored (again, illegally) out of fear.  Wavers have been handed out all over the place out of fear.  Congress and other Washington elites have exempted themselves from it.  2/3rds of the states have refused to participate in it.

People are already losing their insurance, having their hours cut or losing their jobs entirely because of it.  It's contributing heavily to the REAL unemployment rate of 15%.  Just wait until millions of people start receiving demand letters from the IRS for their fines to be paid because they didn't understand that they have to buy insurance, or they refused to.  How will that help democrats?

And wait... just wait... until the first political candidate 'accidently' has her/his health history leaked to the press, right before election day...

[i44.tinypic.com image 660x371]


IOW, Derp.
 
2013-09-16 07:34:53 AM

HotWingConspiracy: Neighborhood Watch: Alright, having scanned that condensed novel, I can sense something from it's author:  FEAR

Are they afraid the GOP will fail to defeat it for the 47th time?


Did you see how long that article was?  Clearly the length of the article means something!
 
2013-09-16 07:35:43 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Alright, having scanned that condensed novel, I can sense something from it's author:  FEAR

It's not conservatives that are afraid of it, it's liberals who read that thing, 'New York'.  You don't have to spew out that much verbiage in an effort to sooth other liberals unless you, yourself, are terrified.

Democrats have got to remember the historic crushing they received in 2010 after ramming this thing down the country's throat w/o one single Republican vote.  Have Republicans voted in vain to repeal it 40 something times?  You bet.  And why?  Because they want the country to know - KNOW - that they had nothing to do with it, when this thing hits with full force.


No, that's not why they're voting to get rid of Obamacare.  If one five or six page article 'proves' that liberals are afraid that people won't like being able to afford insurance, then it's safe to say that 40+ odd votes to repeal proves that conservatives are afraid they will.
 
2013-09-16 07:38:13 AM

notto: HotWingConspiracy: Neighborhood Watch: Alright, having scanned that condensed novel, I can sense something from it's author:  FEAR

Are they afraid the GOP will fail to defeat it for the 47th time?

Did you see how long that article was?  Clearly the length of the article means something!


FEAR!
 
2013-09-16 07:40:54 AM
caveat - not a fan

there are several federal contract sites where the employees receive cash in lieu of benefits

as i understood it the money was for heath care and such
in two areas that i can reference, the cash payment has been assigned to a 401k plan

i have to wonder bout the intent
 
2013-09-16 07:40:54 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Democrats have got to remember the historic crushing they received in 2010 after ramming this thing down the country's throat w/o one single Republican vote.  Have Republicans voted in vain to repeal it 40 something times?  You bet.  And why?  Because they want the country to know - KNOW - that they had nothing to do with it, when this thing hits with full force.


uh, (clears throat)   Presidential election 2012.   -
 
2013-09-16 07:42:42 AM

Abacus9: hubiestubert: rucking fecockulous

I'm gonna have to use that.


yep. me too...
 
2013-09-16 07:42:51 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Alright, having scanned that condensed novel, I can sense something from it's author:  FEAR

It's not conservatives that are afraid of it, it's liberals who read that thing, 'New York'.  You don't have to spew out that much verbiage in an effort to sooth other liberals unless you, yourself, are terrified.

Democrats have got to remember the historic crushing they received in 2010 after ramming this thing down the country's throat w/o one single Republican vote.  Have Republicans voted in vain to repeal it 40 something times?  You bet.  And why?  Because they want the country to know - KNOW - that they had nothing to do with it, when this thing hits with full force.


Unions certainly aren't run by Republicans, and they hate it.  The employer mandate has already been (illegally) pushed back a year out of fear - and other elements have been changed or ignored (again, illegally) out of fear.  Wavers have been handed out all over the place out of fear.  Congress and other Washington elites have exempted themselves from it.  2/3rds of the states have refused to participate in it.

People are already losing their insurance, having their hours cut or losing their jobs entirely because of it.  It's contributing heavily to the REAL unemployment rate of 15%.  Just wait until millions of people start receiving demand letters from the IRS for their fines to be paid because they didn't understand that they have to buy insurance, or they refused to.  How will that help democrats?

And wait... just wait... until the first political candidate 'accidently' has her/his health history leaked to the press, right before election day...

[i44.tinypic.com image 660x371]


* yawn * Anyone catch the Buckeye's game?
 
2013-09-16 07:43:34 AM
I would like to see a additional analysis based on Neighborhood Watch's claims that determines the proportion of fear represented by misspelled signs and rounds of ammunition owned by an individual.  Maybe include bumper stickers as well.
 
2013-09-16 07:43:52 AM
There's always barber college.
 
2013-09-16 07:45:08 AM

Neighborhood Watch: Alright, having scanned that condensed novel, I can sense something from it's author:  FEAR


Monger says what?

The GOP are afraid that they'll end up looking like the dicks they are when the ACA starts being implemented.

They are right to fear this.
 
2013-09-16 07:47:04 AM
Neighborhood Watch, I award thee 4 strawmans out of 5.

www.uncommondescent.com www.uncommondescent.com
www.uncommondescent.com www.uncommondescent.com
 
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