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(Nature)   Our 3D universe could be the event horizon of a black hole from a 4D universe. Turtles all the way, indeed   (nature.com) divider line 72
    More: Interesting, black holes, Event Horizon, Big Bang theory, three-dimensional space, space observatory, uniformity, Planck, equilibrium  
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4012 clicks; posted to Geek » on 15 Sep 2013 at 12:41 PM (30 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



72 Comments   (+0 »)
   
View Voting Results: Smartest and Funniest
 
2013-09-15 10:23:57 AM
Sooo.... a 4D bulkystar explodes (superdupernova) then collapses and creates our 3D universe and somehow (waves hand around) this is not the bigbang you're looking for?

Sounds like an even bigger bang than the one the first theory talked about.

Did someone mention turtles? I like turtles
 
vpb [TotalFark]
2013-09-15 11:57:15 AM
The idea that black holes spawn new universes has been around for a while.  If you think about it black holes and the big bang are the only places you have singularities in nature so maybe they are the same thing seen from different view points.
 
2013-09-15 12:51:14 PM
The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

www.andyross.net
 
2013-09-15 12:51:22 PM
Would that mean that inside the black holes in our universe exist 2d universes? And if we could somehow travel to the 4d universe we could potentially find another black hole and travel to a different 3d universe, also does the 4d universe need to be a in a black hole of a 5d universe which is also in a black hole of a 6d universe and so on and such?
 
2013-09-15 12:57:25 PM

Anenu: Would that mean that inside the black holes in our universe exist 2d universes? And if we could somehow travel to the 4d universe we could potentially find another black hole and travel to a different 3d universe, also does the 4d universe need to be a in a black hole of a 5d universe which is also in a black hole of a 6d universe and so on and such?


yay, infinite recursion!
 
2013-09-15 01:00:52 PM
My brane hertz.
 
2013-09-15 01:05:36 PM
Travel in that 4th dimension of the higher universe would be our hyperdrive. Not that that is possible or anything.
 
2013-09-15 01:06:08 PM

Valiente: My brane hertz.


ARE YOU THE BRANE SPECIALIST?
 
2013-09-15 01:10:34 PM
4D goes in, 3D comes out

YOU CAN'T EXPLAIN THAT
 
2013-09-15 01:10:44 PM
Brane and Brane! What is Brane!
 
2013-09-15 01:13:32 PM
huh?
 
2013-09-15 01:15:07 PM
Just FYI - it is turtles all the way down.
The question is: how many turtles?
 
2013-09-15 01:16:55 PM
So if I dive into a black hole, am I 2D when I come out?
 
2013-09-15 01:17:55 PM
So basically the singularity in a black hole tears a hole through space-time.  The resulting rip becomes the big bang singularity of a brand new universe with the material being sucked out of ours seeding the new one.

Infinite recursion, infinite rebirth.  I think this just became my favorite theory of all time.
 
2013-09-15 01:19:33 PM

Hagbardr: Valiente: My brane hertz.

ARE YOU THE BRANE SPECIALIST?


More the string theorist, really.
 
2013-09-15 01:21:25 PM

AngryDragon: So basically the singularity in a black hole tears a hole through space-time.  The resulting rip becomes the big bang singularity of a brand new universe with the material being sucked out of ours seeding the new one.

Infinite recursion, infinite rebirth.  I think this just became my favorite theory of all time.


Also known as "disappearing up your own asshole only to emerge as an echo of the pop".

orangeshow.org
 
2013-09-15 01:28:33 PM

Gosling: So if I dive into a black hole, am I 2D when I come out?


yes, it is called spaghettification


/and thus the noodly one abides
//ramen
 
2013-09-15 01:30:16 PM
Can i buy some pot from you?
 
2013-09-15 01:32:16 PM
Also provides a convenient explanation for dark energy.
 
2013-09-15 01:45:45 PM
Meh, the concept is strikingly similar to quantum woo(as seen in the recent fark article about quantum consciousness).
 
2013-09-15 02:02:31 PM
Yay! 1st geenlight.

Brain hurts too. Been trying to explain this to the gf all day.. I think I understand it even less.

The point is this nearly fits the current observations but not 100%. It does provide an interesting alternative and maybe some day a challenge to the standard inflationary theory. Too early to tell.
 
2013-09-15 02:12:09 PM
If you have more than three space dimension a planet's orbit around a star or the star's around a galaxy center cannot be made stable.  Of course it would collapse into a 4-dimensional black hole. Everything would fall in, not orbit.
 
2013-09-15 02:19:59 PM
Leonard Suskind has farked physics for a generation.

An Event Horizon is not a physical construct!
 
2013-09-15 02:23:19 PM

HempHead: The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

[www.andyross.net image 600x450]


i105.photobucket.com
 
2013-09-15 02:29:04 PM
Of course the 4D universe comes from the event horizon of a black hole in a 5D universe.
 
2013-09-15 02:30:51 PM
Listen...

OUR UNIVERSE WAS CREATED BY A PREDESTINATION PARADOX THAT HAPPENED WHEN A TIME TRAVELING DOG FARTED IN THE MIDST OF HIS TIME TRAVELING

Can we please just admit the truth and move on?
 
2013-09-15 02:33:22 PM

SwiftFox: If you have more than three space dimension a planet's orbit around a star or the star's around a galaxy center cannot be made stable.  Of course it would collapse into a 4-dimensional black hole. Everything would fall in, not orbit.


Crazy. I did some googling on that and you're right. You learn something new every day.
 
2013-09-15 02:42:43 PM

Ursa Minor: Just FYI - it is turtles all the way down.
The question is: how many turtles?


All of them, obviously.
 
2013-09-15 02:46:02 PM
Question for all you scienticians: If this theory is correct, is matter still entering our universe from the 4D universe? Or does the 4D universe no longer exist, the black hole having absorbed all of the matter from the 4D universe and then causing our Big Bang?
 
2013-09-15 02:58:31 PM

FloydA: HempHead: The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

[www.andyross.net image 600x450]

[i105.photobucket.com image 144x144]


Hit by a Geneious ray.

/I'm having fun with the deliberate misspellings today.
 
2013-09-15 03:25:54 PM

valar_morghulis: 4D goes in, 3D comes out

YOU CAN'T EXPLAIN THAT


static.naamapalmu.com
 
2013-09-15 03:56:57 PM
This theory is utterly ridiculous. There aren't even stable orbits in 4D, so to expect star lifecycles and black holes to be the same is just stupid, lasy thinking.

This so-called "science" is almost as ridiculous as catastrophic anthropogenic climate change "theory".
 
2013-09-15 04:07:40 PM
 
2013-09-15 04:34:08 PM

HempHead: The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

[www.andyross.net image 600x450]


i.somethingawful.com

i.somethingawful.com

i.somethingawful.com
 
2013-09-15 04:51:13 PM
It's actually much less than 4D; closer to 22D/7, about the circumference of a turtle divided by its diameter.
 
ZAZ [TotalFark]
2013-09-15 04:56:41 PM
It's actually much less than 4D; closer to 22D/7, about the circumference of a turtle divided by its diameter.

One of the bizarre techniques in quantum field theory is working in fractional dimensions then taking the limit as dimensionality approaches 1+3. Some equations blow up when there are exactly 1+3 dimensions. They have a well defined limit as they approach that point.
 
2013-09-15 05:02:03 PM

ZAZ: It's actually much less than 4D; closer to 22D/7, about the circumference of a turtle divided by its diameter.

One of the bizarre techniques in quantum field theory is working in fractional dimensions then taking the limit as dimensionality approaches 1+3. Some equations blow up when there are exactly 1+3 dimensions. They have a well defined limit as they approach that point.


You idiot, there is nothing weird about that. The sinc functions (sinx/x) blows up at zero (as you so pop-scienceily put it) but has a well-defined limit approaching zero and that is used as the value in practice. Nothing weird at all when dealing with real numbers.

Maybe you should learn a little more before you go around shouting about what is "weird" on discussion forums such as this.
 
2013-09-15 05:20:30 PM

Spadababababababa Spadina Bus: Question for all you scienticians: If this theory is correct, is matter still entering our universe from the 4D universe? Or does the 4D universe no longer exist, the black hole having absorbed all of the matter from the 4D universe and then causing our Big Bang?


So it's the 'Big Crunch' theory for the 4D bulkyverse? That would imply we are also heading for a big crunch which will result in a 2D universe which in turn will crunch and create a 1D 'verse which will crunch and... then what? I would not expect to find the 'verse to be that linear
 
2013-09-15 05:21:17 PM

ZAZ: It's actually much less than 4D; closer to 22D/7, about the circumference of a turtle divided by its diameter.

One of the bizarre techniques in quantum field theory is working in fractional dimensions then taking the limit as dimensionality approaches 1+3. Some equations blow up when there are exactly 1+3 dimensions. They have a well defined limit as they approach that point.


In that case, I'm going for 0D turtles based on the supposition that imperfect measurement in any dimension renders the term meaningless for any given sample. D only becomes meaningful over many samples and then it tends to converge to 3 in this universe for most turtles.
 
2013-09-15 05:21:56 PM

Because People in power are Stupid: HempHead: The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

[www.andyross.net image 600x450]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x353]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x361]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x515]


You just became my favorite person ever.  How did I not think of that first?
 
2013-09-15 05:22:30 PM
Obviously Carl Sagan wasn't the only weed smoking scientist.
 
2013-09-15 05:25:58 PM

Anenu: Would that mean that inside the black holes in our universe exist 2d universes? And if we could somehow travel to the 4d universe we could potentially find another black hole and travel to a different 3d universe, also does the 4d universe need to be a in a black hole of a 5d universe which is also in a black hole of a 6d universe and so on and such?


Sooo...  turtles all the way up?
 
2013-09-15 05:44:56 PM

Ursa Minor: Just FYI - it is turtles all the way down.
The question is: how many turtles?


Assloads.
 
2013-09-15 05:45:35 PM

divgradcurl: Gosling: So if I dive into a black hole, am I 2D when I come out?

yes, it is called spaghettification


/and thus the noodly one abides
//ramen


Is this the creation according to "the Gospel of FSM"?

upload.wikimedia.org
 
2013-09-15 06:08:33 PM

theorellior: SwiftFox: If you have more than three space dimension a planet's orbit around a star or the star's around a galaxy center cannot be made stable.  Of course it would collapse into a 4-dimensional black hole. Everything would fall in, not orbit.

Crazy. I did some googling on that and you're right. You learn something new every day.


Me too. Cool!
 
2013-09-15 06:15:24 PM
I know who did this...

i.imgur.com

/too buzzed for reading theoretical physics atm
//Where does heaven and hell fit into this equation anyways?  They must be up somewhere around the n'th dimensions right?
 
2013-09-15 06:27:44 PM
"It could be time to bid the Big Bang bye-bye."

blog.nj.com
 
2013-09-15 06:31:59 PM
All this does it push the question back a level: so where did the bulk universe come from? Also, it does NOT "avoid a singularity". You know where there are singularities, besides before the Big Bang? INSIDE BLACK HOLES.

Either this is one seriously stupid theory, or it's badly explained.

/of course, porque no los dos certainly applies....
 
2013-09-15 06:50:27 PM

AngryDragon: Because People in power are Stupid: HempHead: The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

[www.andyross.net image 600x450]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x353]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x361]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x515]

You just became my favorite person ever.  How did I not think of that first?


No, there is one greater.

cf.geekdo-images.com
 
2013-09-15 06:57:16 PM

Kittypie070: Ursa Minor: Just FYI - it is turtles all the way down.
The question is: how many turtles?

Assloads.


Metric assloads even!
 
2013-09-15 07:04:45 PM

Because People in power are Stupid: HempHead: The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

[www.andyross.net image 600x450]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x353]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x361]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x515]


Is it wrong that my heart actually aches with nostalgia upon viewing those pictures?
 
2013-09-15 07:10:17 PM

Spadababababababa Spadina Bus: Question for all you scienticians: If this theory is correct, is matter still entering our universe from the 4D universe? Or does the 4D universe no longer exist, the black hole having absorbed all of the matter from the 4D universe and then causing our Big Bang?


Even a supermassive ginormous black hole couldn't absorb all the things matter in our universe. Unless the rules of the 4D universe are somehow thought to be substantially different?
 
2013-09-15 07:16:58 PM

THE GREAT NAME: This theory is utterly ridiculous. There aren't even stable orbits in 4D, so to expect star lifecycles and black holes to be the same is just stupid, lasy thinking.

This so-called "science" is almost as ridiculous as catastrophic anthropogenic climate change "theory".


I'm thankful you're here to offer a poignant and insightful rebuttal to the theory in question. I almost thought there were some valid points and interesting implications within the paper, but once you told me it was stupid, lasy and utterly ridiculous I knew I was on the wrong track.

Would you mind linking to your published research articles so I can further understand your own correct and fully researched theory? Thanks a 106!

/Fun fact - lazy is spelled with an 's' in a 4-brane
 
2013-09-15 07:18:26 PM

Lady Indica: Spadababababababa Spadina Bus: Question for all you scienticians: If this theory is correct, is matter still entering our universe from the 4D universe? Or does the 4D universe no longer exist, the black hole having absorbed all of the matter from the 4D universe and then causing our Big Bang?

Even a supermassive ginormous black hole couldn't absorb all the things matter in our universe. Unless the rules of the 4D universe are somehow thought to be substantially different?


Watching MinutePhysics and lo...it's related! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uhS8K4gFu4s

So it seems a 4D universe would not only work quite differently but in such a way that...yeah seems like that could be possible. IS THERE A THEORETICAL PHYSICIST IN THE HOUSE?!
 
2013-09-15 07:26:11 PM

Because People in power are Stupid: AngryDragon: Because People in power are Stupid: HempHead: The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

[www.andyross.net image 600x450]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x353]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x361]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x515]

You just became my favorite person ever.  How did I not think of that first?

No, there is one greater.

[cf.geekdo-images.com image 326x500]


One of the guys who works for me worked for the original TSR and knew Gygax very well.  True story.
 
2013-09-15 07:59:59 PM
Yay, more not quite science made of math and dreams.
 
2013-09-15 08:43:25 PM
I thought it was from a White Hole.
 
2013-09-15 09:15:22 PM
Ever hear of Occam's razor???


/KISS
 
2013-09-15 10:33:38 PM

Because People in power are Stupid: Of course the 4D universe comes from the event horizon of a black hole in a 5D universe.


Did someone say The 5th Dimension?
www.blacktoptens.com
Is that Dom DeLuise?
media3.washingtonpost.com
 
2013-09-15 10:34:21 PM

Anenu: Would that mean that inside the black holes in our universe exist 2d universes? And if we could somehow travel to the 4d universe we could potentially find another black hole and travel to a different 3d universe, also does the 4d universe need to be a in a black hole of a 5d universe which is also in a black hole of a 6d universe and so on and such?


If 3d black holes make 2d universes and 2d black holes make 1d universes, does a 1d black hole have a 0d universe at its event horizon?
 
2013-09-15 10:36:28 PM

THE GREAT NAME:

This theory is utterly ridiculous. There aren't even stable orbits in 4D, so to expect star lifecycles and black holes to be the same is just stupid, lasy thinking.

This so-called "science" is almost as ridiculous as catastrophic anthropogenic climate change "theory".

Perhaps it's not...  Either the collapse was the immediate collapse of a 4D universe into a huge black hole, or it's not a 4D universe, but a 5D or 7D universe.  I'd say the theory works as well with an nD universe, for any n>3, where there can be stable orbits.

But, even if this theory IS ridiculous, not to worry -- science will discover that, just as science is busy falsifying the whole climate scam.

 
2013-09-15 11:05:56 PM
Go home physics. You are drunk.
 
2013-09-15 11:28:53 PM

Because People in power are Stupid: HempHead: The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

[www.andyross.net image 600x450]


The original Immortals set had the 4d thing down pat.
 
2013-09-16 12:43:02 AM
fringepedia.net
BRANES!
 
2013-09-16 07:02:16 AM

psychopathic tendencies: ... Would you mind linking to your published research articles so I can further understand your own correct and fully researched theory? Thanks a 106!

/Fun fact - lazy is spelled with an 's' in a 4-brane



You idiot, you barely have one "brane", let alone four.

By the way, the "brane" theory is like string theory - parameterised to heck. To quote von Neumann, "with 4 parameters I can fit an eliphant; with 5 I can make him wiggle his trunk". Its nothing more than stupid lazy pseudoscientists trying to ape Einsten by thinking up an unintuitive yet mathematically sound fit to known results. But Einstein's theory has been confirmed by experiment without needing 20+ parameters to "tweak" the predictions to such a degree they can never be falsified.

Just like those charlatens that call themselves "cliamtologists", in fact.
 
2013-09-16 07:08:52 AM

GeneralJim: THE GREAT NAME: This theory is utterly ridiculous. There aren't even stable orbits in 4D, so to expect star lifecycles and black holes to be the same is just stupid, lasy thinking.

This so-called "science" is almost as ridiculous as catastrophic anthropogenic climate change "theory".
Perhaps it's not...  Either the collapse was the immediate collapse of a 4D universe into a huge black hole, or it's not a 4D universe, but a 5D or 7D universe.  I'd say the theory works as well with an nD universe, for any n>3, where there can be stable orbits.
But, even if this theory IS ridiculous, not to worry -- science will discover that, just as science is busy falsifying the whole climate scam.


Let's hope so.

You and me, Jim, we walk a difficult path. We love science, and try to preserve its integrity, even as we are called anti-science and even likened to holocaust apologists by those who would seek to turn science into a religion they can worship mindlessly, in the process raping everything it used to stand for.

Let's stop giving succor to the idea that idiot "climatologists" and moronic "string theorists" deserve the same respect as a Gauss, Descartes or Einstein. Let them earn their respect by making falsifiable predictions that nonetheless are not falisified. Let them illuminate, not obfuscate. Let them stand on their merits, not hide behind manufactured "consensus".
 
2013-09-16 07:23:22 AM

Because People in power are Stupid: HempHead: The theory that time has more than one dimension is even more bizarre.

[www.andyross.net image 600x450]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x353]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x361]

[i.somethingawful.com image 550x515]


shrines.rpgclassics.com

/is not amused
 
2013-09-16 08:20:19 AM
31.media.tumblr.com
lolwat?
 
2013-09-16 09:06:02 AM

Kittypie070: Ursa Minor: Just FYI - it is turtles all the way down.
The question is: how many turtles?

Assloads.


I don't know why that is so funny, but any other term would not have had the same effect, i.e to make me chortle uncontrollably. It is good that I am on my lunch break!
 
2013-09-16 12:03:43 PM

THE GREAT NAME: GeneralJim: THE GREAT NAME: This theory is utterly ridiculous. There aren't even stable orbits in 4D, so to expect star lifecycles and black holes to be the same is just stupid, lasy thinking.

This so-called "science" is almost as ridiculous as catastrophic anthropogenic climate change "theory".
Perhaps it's not...  Either the collapse was the immediate collapse of a 4D universe into a huge black hole, or it's not a 4D universe, but a 5D or 7D universe.  I'd say the theory works as well with an nD universe, for any n>3, where there can be stable orbits.
But, even if this theory IS ridiculous, not to worry -- science will discover that, just as science is busy falsifying the whole climate scam.

Let's hope so.

You and me, Jim, we walk a difficult path. We love science, and try to preserve its integrity, even as we are called anti-science and even likened to holocaust apologists by those who would seek to turn science into a religion they can worship mindlessly, in the process raping everything it used to stand for.

Let's stop giving succor to the idea that idiot "climatologists" and moronic "string theorists" deserve the same respect as a Gauss, Descartes or Einstein. Let them earn their respect by making falsifiable predictions that nonetheless are not falisified. Let them illuminate, not obfuscate. Let them stand on their merits, not hide behind manufactured "consensus".


Popper has a lot to answer for when it comes to falsificationism...
 
2013-09-16 12:55:54 PM
What if the collapse of a higher-d universe is what happens when its energy decays to a low enough state? In other words, What if a collapse were the result of the "Heat Death"  of the previous 5 or 7-d universe?
 
2013-09-16 09:05:25 PM

THE GREAT NAME:

You and me, Jim, we walk a difficult path. We love science, and try to preserve its integrity, even as we are called anti-science and even likened to holocaust apologists by those who would seek to turn science into a religion they can worship mindlessly, in the process raping everything it used to stand for.

Let's stop giving succor to the idea that idiot "climatologists" and moronic "string theorists" deserve the same respect as a Gauss, Descartes or Einstein. Let them earn their respect by making falsifiable predictions that nonetheless are not falisified. Let them illuminate, not obfuscate. Let them stand on their merits, not hide behind manufactured "consensus".

I understand that what you say is happening -- EVERY climate thread is filled with incredibly ignorant posers who understand science as little or less than most evangelicals understand the Bible.  So, do you have ANY friggin' idea why these people, who literally don't understand the first thing about science, even WANT to worship it?   I can't wrap my head around that.    Sure -- understanding science, and not being trained in it, yeah, I could see that turning into an unhealthy theology-like approach, but for those who know so little of science that they think the "truth" is obtained by scientists voting on it, what warped, putrid image is in their heads, and why in the fark would they want to worship THAT, whatever it is?
 
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