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(NPR)   Texas opens its first bookless library. Wait...what?   (npr.org) divider line 183
    More: Fail, Texas, Bexar County, audio books, library classification, library  
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8162 clicks; posted to Main » on 14 Sep 2013 at 3:33 PM (31 weeks ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2013-09-14 03:35:13 PM
No, its not fail

It is the natural evolution of technology
 
2013-09-14 03:36:46 PM
I love books but they are a legacy technology.  They will still remain around but it is more efficient to disseminate information digitally.
 
2013-09-14 03:37:20 PM
Apple advertisement is Apple advertisement
 
2013-09-14 03:37:29 PM
The animatronic engineers at Disney should make damn sure that their robotic JFK never goes near this place.
 
2013-09-14 03:38:00 PM
i.imgur.com
 
2013-09-14 03:38:52 PM
Who needs those smartass books? They think they're better than all of us.
 
2013-09-14 03:39:43 PM
You can take my The Complete Calvin and Hobbes when you pry the 27 pounds of glossy, full-colored paper from my cold, dead hands.
 
2013-09-14 03:41:17 PM
FTA:  And Reema reported that the idea of a bookless library has been tried before - perhaps a bit too early. That was in 2002, when Arizona's Santa Rosa Branch Library went digital-only.

"Years later, however, residents - fatigued by the electronics - requested that actual books be added to the collection, and today, enjoy a full-access library with computers," Reema said.


And the same thing will happen here. We look at computer and TV screens all day long. Physical books are a break from all of that. Not Kindles or Nooks. Those are fine for kids in school (saving the cost of books every year) and older adults with sight issues, but not for the rest of us.

Has someone who works in a library; I can tell you that just about every library is trying to head in this direction in some way, shape or form. But it's not the right direction. People want different options to find what they want and taking away physical books will not do any library any favors.
 
2013-09-14 03:46:28 PM

desertgeek: FTA:  And Reema reported that the idea of a bookless library has been tried before - perhaps a bit too early. That was in 2002, when Arizona's Santa Rosa Branch Library went digital-only.

"Years later, however, residents - fatigued by the electronics - requested that actual books be added to the collection, and today, enjoy a full-access library with computers," Reema said.

And the same thing will happen here. We look at computer and TV screens all day long. Physical books are a break from all of that. Not Kindles or Nooks. Those are fine for kids in school (saving the cost of books every year) and older adults with sight issues, but not for the rest of us.

Has someone who works in a library; I can tell you that just about every library is trying to head in this direction in some way, shape or form. But it's not the right direction. People want different options to find what they want and taking away physical books will not do any library any favors.



The interesting thing is it's not necessarily as cost effective to go to a digital collection as many people believe because many digital books are purchased under a license that requires the purchasing library to periodically pay to continue to have access to the book. Plus some agreements only allow one user at a time.
 
2013-09-14 03:48:45 PM

desertgeek: And the same thing will happen here. We look at computer and TV screens all day long. Physical books are a break from all of that. Not Kindles or Nooks. Those are fine for kids in school (saving the cost of books every year) and older adults with sight issues, but not for the rest of us.


Amen, sister.  Plus I have buyer's remorse now for all the Kindle titles I purchased.  I can't share my copies of Jim Butcher's Dresden Files series but once and only with one person.  Needless to say, Amazon no longer gets a dime for ebooks from me.  I just e-mail PDFs of what I want to read to my kindle gateway address; they do still have the best ebook reader for Android.
 
2013-09-14 03:49:07 PM
THE FUTURE IS NOW!!!11

i miss the smell of paper and ditto copies
 
2013-09-14 03:49:59 PM
Isn't that called a Kindle, IPad or numerous other names?
 
2013-09-14 03:50:07 PM
The great thing about books is that they don't require any special equipment or infrastructure to use.  The Library of Congress has already had to put out a call for several pieces of obselete technology so they can access everything in their collection.
 
2013-09-14 03:51:09 PM

desertgeek: FTA:  And Reema reported that the idea of a bookless library has been tried before - perhaps a bit too early. That was in 2002, when Arizona's Santa Rosa Branch Library went digital-only.

"Years later, however, residents - fatigued by the electronics - requested that actual books be added to the collection, and today, enjoy a full-access library with computers," Reema said.

And the same thing will happen here. We look at computer and TV screens all day long. Physical books are a break from all of that. Not Kindles or Nooks. Those are fine for kids in school (saving the cost of books every year) and older adults with sight issues, but not for the rest of us.

Has someone who works in a library; I can tell you that just about every library is trying to head in this direction in some way, shape or form. But it's not the right direction. People want different options to find what they want and taking away physical books will not do any library any favors.


Yeah, something like 75% of public libraries offer e-books for borrowing*. But most people still really like books and are resistant to the idea of moving or reducing print collections in favor of digital collections. And public library usage has been increasing in the last 20 years or so, probably because they're so economically beneficial, especially to families on tight budgets.

*You should know that the whole library e-book lending system is a giant ripoff, and the technological hurdles are mostly artificial. Libraries get print books at a discount, but are charged three to five times the consumer price for e-books. They make libraries buy licenses instead of buying and hosting books outright, even though that business model has worked for hundreds of years. Publishers sell libraries e-books that are designed to be difficult to use, as well as books that self-destruct--solely so they can charge the library more than once. Libraries want to provide books in whatever format patrons want, and this is obviously a complicated issue, but some patron advocacy on this issue would be good for patrons, libraries and taxpayers.
 
2013-09-14 03:51:47 PM

desertgeek: FTA:  And Reema reported that the idea of a bookless library has been tried before - perhaps a bit too early. That was in 2002, when Arizona's Santa Rosa Branch Library went digital-only.

"Years later, however, residents - fatigued by the electronics - requested that actual books be added to the collection, and today, enjoy a full-access library with computers," Reema said.

And the same thing will happen here. We look at computer and TV screens all day long. Physical books are a break from all of that. Not Kindles or Nooks. Those are fine for kids in school (saving the cost of books every year) and older adults with sight issues, but not for the rest of us.

Has someone who works in a library; I can tell you that just about every library is trying to head in this direction in some way, shape or form. But it's not the right direction. People want different options to find what they want and taking away physical books will not do any library any favors.


My Kindle Paperwhite is actually an awesome replacement for printed books. Now that they have fixed the footnote problem with the new version, there's absolutely no reason to go back to paper for me for novels and other books that don't rely on color photos and illustrations. Aside from the smell of mold that comes from old books, there's really not a big advantage to paper for me. The Kindle is smaller, lighter, and easier to read in various lighting conditions (it is easier to read in bed with the lights off, there is less glare in the sun compared to white paper). Once you break the DRM, you even have full control of your files, and you can easily get books from elsewhere (it was no problem loading a bunch of Humble Bundle books I bought recently). If anything, buying a Kindle has made me more of a reader than I was before because it makes things so much simpler (and cheaper with the constant deals Amazon runs).
 
2013-09-14 03:52:48 PM

technofiend: desertgeek: And the same thing will happen here. We look at computer and TV screens all day long. Physical books are a break from all of that. Not Kindles or Nooks. Those are fine for kids in school (saving the cost of books every year) and older adults with sight issues, but not for the rest of us.

Amen, sister.  Plus I have buyer's remorse now for all the Kindle titles I purchased.  I can't share my copies of Jim Butcher's Dresden Files series but once and only with one person.  Needless to say, Amazon no longer gets a dime for ebooks from me.  I just e-mail PDFs of what I want to read to my kindle gateway address; they do still have the best ebook reader for Android.


Pretty sure you can direct them to any number of servers - plain text is small and easily transferable ;)
 
2013-09-14 03:53:01 PM

desertgeek: "Years later, however, residents - fatigued by the electronics - requested that actual books be added to the collection, and today, enjoy a full-access library with computers," Reema said.


My anecdotal experience tells me the vast majority of computer usage at libraries is for video games, youtube and Facebook.  I definitely understand why it might be good in theory but in actual practice, it's just a waste.
 
2013-09-14 03:54:27 PM
well, that's one way to keep them from burning em.
 
2013-09-14 03:56:14 PM
"BiblioTech library"

/biblotec is French for library
//so it's a library library?
 
2013-09-14 03:56:32 PM
www.biography.com
No more books to deposit....
 
2013-09-14 03:56:38 PM
Because bums need a place to masturbate to internet porn too.
 
2013-09-14 03:57:56 PM

lennavan: desertgeek: "Years later, however, residents - fatigued by the electronics - requested that actual books be added to the collection, and today, enjoy a full-access library with computers," Reema said.

My anecdotal experience tells me the vast majority of computer usage at libraries is for video games, youtube and Facebook.  I definitely understand why it might be good in theory but in actual practice, it's just a waste.


Yeap I rarely go to the library these days (I just buy my books). The amount of money they spend on electronic infrustructure leaves very little for the buying of books and no wonder the accountants in charge would prefer the later (it appears like they are getting more bang for their buck, but as you said it's mostly BANG! for our bucks.)

By now councils etc should have opened internet cafes and leave their libraries to being libraries (no computers for facebook or computer games, but access to research databases is ok.)
 
2013-09-14 03:59:50 PM
media.npr.org

C'mon guys, it was too easy.
 
2013-09-14 04:02:20 PM
Next up for Texas, corpse-free executions and a chili cook of that only features ribs.

Didn't rtfa.
 
2013-09-14 04:03:44 PM

lennavan: desertgeek: "Years later, however, residents - fatigued by the electronics - requested that actual books be added to the collection, and today, enjoy a full-access library with computers," Reema said.

My anecdotal experience tells me the vast majority of computer usage at libraries is for video games, youtube and Facebook.  I definitely understand why it might be good in theory but in actual practice, it's just a waste.


Certainly most, if not all of the street people sitting at the computers at my local library seem to be simply playing video games. A lot of the men also seem to frequent dating sites, which always gives me a laugh.
 
2013-09-14 04:05:24 PM
The picture they give in the  NPR story looks like the least-fun way to reed e-books. I'm assuming those are just terminals for you to do searches and make downloads from. I  still resist getting an e-reader.  I still prefer cheap paperbacks, with a few hard-bound copies for special favorites I'd like to keep on a shelf. I would always be worrying about my e-reader's safety and security, whereas my biggest worry with a paperback is keeping it elevated while I'm soaking in the tub.
 
2013-09-14 04:07:51 PM
So how do they do this exactly? Do they actually scan every page of every book ever written?
 
2013-09-14 04:08:51 PM
Kanye West would love this place.
 
2013-09-14 04:09:24 PM
Texas opens its first bookless library.

See, try reading it again submittard. Next time don't post till you understand the sentence you just wrote.

Either that or you just used the stupidest meme that died years ago.
 
2013-09-14 04:09:35 PM
You can't read a computer when the power goes out.
 
2013-09-14 04:09:37 PM

Mad_Radhu: there's absolutely no reason to go back to paper


Aside from the exorbitant price of e-books.  They sell them for more than half the cost of the printed version under the premise that you're buying the book, just digitally.  What most people don't seem to get is that what you're really doing is renting.  Amazon goes away?  No more Kindle books.  Amazon decides you've returned one too many things and cancels your account?  No more Kindle books.  They wipe your Kindle remotely and you're done.  Accordingly, the prices for e-books need to be much lower as long as they remain DRM-laden and subject to theft on someone else's whim.
 
2013-09-14 04:09:40 PM
It opened "today" and all we get from the article is an "artist's rendering", they couldn't get someone to run down and snap a few quick shots of the event? Or secure the rights to something that the dozens of people at the event would have snapped with their smartphones?

Fark it

scontent-b-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net

scontent-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net

scontent-b-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net

scontent-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net

// my post is now better than TFA, suck it Bill Chappell
 
2013-09-14 04:12:28 PM

cman: No, its not fail

It is the natural evolution of technology


Ok, then let's at least be honest and call it what it is. It's not a library, it's a municipal internet cafe.
 
2013-09-14 04:14:17 PM

lordargent: It opened "today" and all we get from the article is an "artist's rendering", they couldn't get someone to run down and snap a few quick shots of the event? Or secure the rights to something that the dozens of people at the event would have snapped with their smartphones?

Fark it

[scontent-b-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net image 640x480]

[scontent-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net image 640x480]

[scontent-b-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net image 640x480]

[scontent-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net image 640x480]

// my post is now better than TFA, suck it Bill Chappell


So it is an internet cafe, not a library at all.  How many computers linked to the same internet do I need before I can call my lounge room a 'library'?
 
2013-09-14 04:14:43 PM
Some libraries are renting out tools, or other items you just need for a day or two.  For example  http://www.berkeleypubliclibrary.org/about_the_library/neighborhood_b r anches/tool_lending_library/

And no, this is not just some Berkeley wackobirds.  They do this in other parts of the nation as well.  But, it's interesting.  I mean, if Home Depot is just a little too far away, and I need a saw NOW to cut my spouse up into bits and stuff them into the knothole in the tree in the backyard, then this makes my life way more convenient.  BONUS: I can return the saw later, to get ride of evidence, and then Neighbor Bob can check it out for when he's working with his son on their soapbox racer.

Circle of life.
 
2013-09-14 04:16:23 PM
desertgeek:

And the same thing will happen here. We look at computer and TV screens all day long. Physical books are a break from all of that. Not Kindles or Nooks. Those are fine for kids in school (saving the cost of books every year) and older adults with sight issues, but not for the rest of us.

Digital books won't save anything on cost for schoolbooks - you really think the printing is what costs so much? They'll still have to pay for licenses for all the kids. Probably even more, because they won't be able to keep using outdated versions to save money.

They could save kids' backs though - they've found that the weight of books is often way too much for the students carrying them, especially if they wear their bags on one shoulder, and is a major cause of scoliosis.
 
2013-09-14 04:19:56 PM

JasonOfOrillia: I love books but they are a legacy technology.  They will still remain around but it is more efficient to disseminate information digitally.


Nonsense. Digital is a good way to disseminate information linearly. Libraries with multiple books in categories has more depth and disseminates information laterally with multiple branching nodes with incidental referencing which can improve the original query.

Yeah I know deep thoughts jpg.

/we must move forward, not backward; upward, not forward; and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom!
 
2013-09-14 04:22:36 PM
The only reading material that I prefer in paper form are instruction manuals. Otherwise I much prefer reading on my ipod, kobo reader or computer. But it might be partly due to the fact I'm a big reader and that holding something that has the weight of a paper book for several hours causes me to develop acute pain in my left scapula region. A pain that can last weeks despite taking any type of pain reliever.
 
2013-09-14 04:23:36 PM

desertgeek: And the same thing will happen here. We look at computer and TV screens all day long. Physical books are a break from all of that. Not Kindles or Nooks.


My first generation e-Ink non-backlit Basic Nook is basically just like a physical book on my eyes, except I have control over the font size.    I agree with the sentiment though, which is why I'll keep using this thing until it disintegrates.
 
2013-09-14 04:24:10 PM
Texas? I would've thought Florida.
 
2013-09-14 04:24:21 PM

Rootus: Mad_Radhu: there's absolutely no reason to go back to paper

Aside from the exorbitant price of e-books.  They sell them for more than half the cost of the printed version under the premise that you're buying the book, just digitally.  What most people don't seem to get is that what you're really doing is renting.  Amazon goes away?  No more Kindle books.  Amazon decides you've returned one too many things and cancels your account?  No more Kindle books.  They wipe your Kindle remotely and you're done.  Accordingly, the prices for e-books need to be much lower as long as they remain DRM-laden and subject to theft on someone else's whim.


Not all eReaders are Kindles.  My Kobo books are not going anywhere.
 
2013-09-14 04:27:54 PM

Rootus: Mad_Radhu: there's absolutely no reason to go back to paper

Aside from the exorbitant price of e-books.  They sell them for more than half the cost of the printed version under the premise that you're buying the book, just digitally.  What most people don't seem to get is that what you're really doing is renting.  Amazon goes away?  No more Kindle books.  Amazon decides you've returned one too many things and cancels your account?  No more Kindle books.  They wipe your Kindle remotely and you're done.  Accordingly, the prices for e-books need to be much lower as long as they remain DRM-laden and subject to theft on someone else's whim.


Exactly how is Amazon going to remove the physical ePub files I have stored on  my external hard drive?
 
2013-09-14 04:28:40 PM

cman: No, its not fail

It is the natural evolution of technology


This.

But here is where the fail is:

The app includes a countdown of days a reader has to finish a book - starting with 14 days,

It's an electronic copy.  There's no need to limit you.    I suppose there's a whole shiatload fo legal bullshiat that requires that but it's always been possible to go to a library and read the latest bestseller and you can even still go into a bookstore and stay there all day long reading books.  Lots of bookstores even seemed to encourage that by setting up comfortable chairs and opening a Starbucks inside.

I guess it's tricky because authors should be compensated in some way.  I just think I would have a real LOLWUT moment if I went to the library and they told me I couldn't get an electronic copy of a book because it was already checked out.
 
2013-09-14 04:29:21 PM
desertgeek: "Years later, however, residents - fatigued by the electronics - requested that actual books be added to the collection, and today, enjoy a full-access library with computers," Reema said.

My anecdotal experience tells me the vast majority of computer usage at libraries is for video games, youtube and Facebook.  I definitely understand why it might be good in theory but in actual practice, it's just a waste.


Yeah, and there's a huge fiction section at my library that should be filled with books about science and civics. There's even some romance novels in there, even though those are obscene. I mean, my God, some libraries have comic books. Like, with superheros. Even though everyone knows kids should be reading Serious Literature or nothing at all. What is this world coming to?

OK, no joke: It's true that a lot of people use public library computers to kill time on Facebook and YouTube. Unless you're committing an actual crime or bothering other patrons, the library is not really in the business of judging how you're using the Internet (or which books you borrow, for that matter). Privacy is paramount in public libraries. Libraries actually go out of their way to purge (or never collect) patron information so the government can't request it. So your librarian probably won't even know what you're doing unless you ask for help or another patron complains. It's frustrating, because it does mean that people don't use the resource in the best way, but the library isn't the patrons' mom. Within legal limits, libraries assume that patrons are adults and can make their own decisions about what information they access.

That said, there are also lots of people who use public library computers for job hunting, attending college, homework, casual research and accessing government services. A lot of government agencies have switched to 100% online filing and reporting. Many have let customer service staff & social workers go during that process, and librarians perform those services now (without any additional training or funding). Public library computers are used for all kinds of things. People aren't born knowing how to use computers, and Internet access is neither universal nor free. Until it is, the library will still have a role in providing information. They didn't shut down the libraries when the Encyclopedia Britannica was published. They put the encyclopedia in the library.

Also, just because someone is using Facebook or YouTube doesn't mean they're doing something worthless. College classes have Facebook groups. Tons of courses and study guides are available on YouTube. Digital and social media skills are increasingly important in the job market. Are you going to censor the "wrong" information out of YouTube? Would you like your city council to be in charge of that? I wish people would make better use of the limited time available on public library computers, but sometimes it's best not to worry so much about what other people are reading.
 
2013-09-14 04:33:42 PM

desertgeek: Has someone who works in a library; I can tell you that just about every library is trying to head in this direction in some way, shape or form. But it's not the right direction. People want different options to find what they want and taking away physical books will not do any library any favors.


You sound old.
 
2013-09-14 04:34:16 PM

ornithopter: desertgeek:

And the same thing will happen here. We look at computer and TV screens all day long. Physical books are a break from all of that. Not Kindles or Nooks. Those are fine for kids in school (saving the cost of books every year) and older adults with sight issues, but not for the rest of us.

Digital books won't save anything on cost for schoolbooks - you really think the printing is what costs so much? They'll still have to pay for licenses for all the kids. Probably even more, because they won't be able to keep using outdated versions to save money.

They could save kids' backs though - they've found that the weight of books is often way too much for the students carrying them, especially if they wear their bags on one shoulder, and is a major cause of scoliosis.


Our school district offers the e-book option for quite a few of the textbooks; if you choose not to use that, then the kids use the classroom set and they don't carry them around. Many of our kids don't even need lockers now since they mainly carry a trapper keeper or a few notebooks and e readers
 
2013-09-14 04:34:25 PM
Now they can censor whole chapters and insert rightwing propaganda with just a keystroke.
 
2013-09-14 04:35:32 PM
In 3 or 4 years of ebook ownership I've managed to turn up hundreds upon hundreds of old pulp, noir, out-of-print and genre paperback originals that I had never seen for sale before despite spending almost 40 years obsessively combing thru used book stores and libraries. That's not even counting the stuff that you could find but was prohibitively priced or in unreadable condition. So if you like stuff like that ebooks are farking amazing.
 
2013-09-14 04:37:15 PM
Oh, it's this thread again. Fine, I'll be that guy again:

www.caps-project.org
 
2013-09-14 04:39:02 PM

drewogatory: In 3 or 4 years of ebook ownership I've managed to turn up hundreds upon hundreds of old pulp, noir, out-of-print and genre paperback originals that I had never seen for sale before despite spending almost 40 years obsessively combing thru used book stores and libraries. That's not even counting the stuff that you could find but was prohibitively priced or in unreadable condition. So if you like stuff like that ebooks are farking amazing.


Still not the role of a library - maybe a community class on how to get the best out of your internet access (byo device.)
 
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